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Christian Believe Evolution

Is there any reason why a Christian should embrace Evolution in order to help explain Creation? If not, why do so many do it?

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 ---jerry6593 on 3/14/12
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Yes. The theory of evolution is accepted as fact by most civilized and educated people throughout the world. To not accept it, is evidence to many of an irrational person who puts mythology before science.

If your religion gives you comfort, keep it, but, let go of those parts that show you to be primitive and backward in thought. You don't stone people do you?
---atheist on 3/20/12


Yes, man LIVES by every word that comes out of the mouth of God. But salvation does not REQUIRE that you believe ALL of them. ---StrongAxe on 3/20/12

How do you live by them if you do not believe them?

I can admit that you do not have to know all scripture to be saved. But once you know them do you not have to believe them and live by them?

Hebrews 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
---francis on 3/20/12


francis:

Yes, man LIVES by every word that comes out of the mouth of God. But salvation does not REQUIRE that you believe ALL of them. Again, the scripture does not mention any kinds of requirement for salvation here.

Your body can live by every kind of food that is in a buffet too, but you don't die if you leave a buffet without sampling each one of them.

Surely all New Testament saints did perfectly fine, even though they did not yet have access to most of the New Testament. By your logic, anyone who did not read and believe every last epistle of Paul would be damned - surely horrible for those who died before they were written (especially Stephen!).
---StrongAxe on 3/20/12


Warwick, you are mistaken. Here is why. When a writer writes sometimes he writes as if looking through the eyes of God (as spokesmen for God, Particularly in moral matters, but in narrative sections they frequently describe things the way they appear from a human perspective (as reporter's speaking Phenomenologically). Distinguishing the authors intention to be understood as a direct spokesmen for God from his intentions to speak as a human reporter describing an event phenomenologically is important for an accurate understanding of his meaning. It is difficult to determine from the context whether the language in Genesis 6-9 was intented to be understood noumenologically (from God's perspective) or phenomenologically (from man's perspective).
---Mark_V. on 3/20/12


Warwick, cont: let me explain. If the phrases "all flesh died" and "all the high hills were covered" are understood noumenologically, a universal flood is implied. If these same phrases are understood phenomenologically, they could mean "all the animals that I could observe died" and "all the high hills that I could observe were covered." Of course the traditional interpretation of these verses has been understood from God's perspective. Milton Terry believes the flood description should be understood from man's perspective. He says it was probably a tradition handed down from Shem to the people. He says the narrative of the flood is probably the account of an eyewitness.
---Mark_V. on 3/20/12




I DO NOT say we DON'T HAVE TO believe these. I DO say the Bible DOES NOT SAY we MUST believe them.
---StrongAxe on 3/19/12
Would this be a preamble to the scriptures:

Deuteronomy 8:3 that he might make thee know that man doth not live by bread only, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of the LORD doth man live.
---francis on 3/19/12


MarkV: "That is exactly what you do."

Why must you resort to lying? I obey the Bible ONLY. The Bible clearly commands the keeping of the seventh day Sabbath as the only day ever made holy by God, and I comply. You, on the other hand, keep the first day of the week, a man-made counterfeit, and one never sanctified in Scripture. How then am I the one who ignores scripture while you are the one in compliance?

Do you also believe the man-made creation myth of Evolution?


---jerry6593 on 3/20/12


1st Cliff: "Jerry, You cite 2Tim.3.16"

Many of the CN contributors don't believe that the Old Testament is still valid for Christians - hence the NT quotes. Hence also the necessity of this blog.


---jerry6593 on 3/20/12


francis:

I DO NOT say we DON'T HAVE TO believe these. I DO say the Bible DOES NOT SAY we MUST believe them.

2 Ti 3:16: does not say all scriptures are NECESSARY. One won't profit from those one doesn't believe.

Ro 10:17: I heard many stories of people convicted by some passage, but none where someone read the whole Bible, and got saved after the last word on the last page.

Ep 2:8: Bible not mentioned

Lu 16:29: Moses and Prophets are mentioned, Apostles are not.

Is Christianity a game where you can lose your salvation the moment some apostle writes a new book, since you don't have the whole set? We would be forced to accept this ridiculous conclusion if belief in every word in every book was necessary.
---StrongAxe on 3/19/12


Jerry, You cite 2Tim.3.16 "all scripture..."
When Paul wrote this he's referring to the OT,do you imagine for 1 minute that he believed HE was writing scripture???
---1st_cliff on 3/19/12




Mark committed Christians reading the same scripture may understand it differently. That is human nature, limited understanding and cultural influences. However there are those who will not believe what Scripture plainly says because they are reinterpreting it through nonBiblical beliefs. The 6 days issue is a perfect example. Though God defines what a day is and repeatedly says He created in 6 days they will not believe it. Their extraBiblical beliefs will not allow them to take Scripture as written.

Whether Noah's flood was universal or local is another perfect example. Genesis says it covered the whole earth but the sceptics cannot accept this because of their long-ages/evolutionary beliefs.
---Warwick on 3/19/12


Though someone can be saved, having never had a Bible to read is not the issue here. We do have and read the Bible. Those saved without Scripture are saved by faith. Therefore what do we imagine is God's attitude to those who have the Bible but refuse to believe foundational portions of it because of their nonBiblical philosophies? Will he commend this lack of faith, this duplicity? Fat chance.

I can just hear the conversation between the sceptic and the Lord. Yes I want your gift of salvation but I am not prepared to accept all of your word as truth! Then you do not have the saving faith "the ancients were commended for" (Hebrews ch.11:2) to be saved.
---Warwick on 3/19/12


are you saying that we do not have to believe that:

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Luk 16:29 ... They have Moses and the prophets, let them hear them.
---francis on 3/19/12


jerry6593 and francis:

2 Ti 3:16 says profitable, not mandatory

Rom 10:17, Eph 2:8, Luke 16:29 say nothing about believing every word.

You said: If you insist on being the final athority as to which scriptures you are to accept, and which you may reject, then you have set yourself up as your own god, with a bible of your own creation.

No. I am not the final authority. The Bible is. I just quoted what the Bible REQUIRES for salvation. What more is required that the Bible does not say, I cannot say either. If you REQUIRE more, YOU are setting YOURSELF up to be your own god.
---StrongAxe on 3/19/12


Jerry you say,

"If you insist on being the final athority as to which scriptures you are to accept, and which you may reject, then you have set yourself up as your own god, with a bible of your own creation."

That is exactly what you do. Why don't you take your own advice? you set yourself as final authority. You build your own self as a god, with a bible of your own creation. Strongaxe would be your friend if he agreed with you on your Saturday Sabbath.
---Mark_V. on 3/19/12


The plain fact is, though, the Bible nowhere actually says that it is necessary to believe the entirety of the Bible in order to be saved.
---StrongAxe on 3/18/12

I would say that one does not have to know the entire bible to be saved.

Give me some excamples of things that people do not have to be believed and can still be saved?
---francis on 3/19/12


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Axey: "[not] necessary to believe the entirety of the Bible in order to be saved."

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Luk 16:29 ... They have Moses and the prophets, let them hear them.

If you insist on being the final athority as to which scriptures you are to accept, and which you may reject, then you have set yourself up as your own god, with a bible of your own creation.



---jerry6593 on 3/19/12


Warwick, I believe you are been unreasonable. Christians believe the Word of God is Truth because we believe the originals writtings are Truth. We do not understand all Scripture completely. That does not make a Christian bad and another good. For centuries many Christians have differed in area's, but that does not make them unbelievers. Some take a stand on one interpretation because maybe the Spirit has not reveal it to them yet, and they are using their own understanding. The flood is a good case. R.A. Torrey believes it was local, most others believe it was universal. The point is, there was a flood. There's area's in Scripture that we still do not understand, Yet believe the Bible is Truth. Biblical hermenuetics are needed many times.
---Mark_V. on 3/19/12


Strongaxe,

Here's your opportunity: Do you believe God created by evolution, some other method, or you don't know?

Furthermore, do you think Scripture HAS or HASN'T told us?
---Marc on 3/19/12


Jesus is the entirity of the Bible.
From Beginning to End, Alef to Tav, Alpha to Omega: It's all about Christ.
To believe only part of it gives you a false christ and a false god.
---micha9344 on 3/19/12


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StrongAxe, as I have said you are a debater more interested in debate than truth. I can imagine you debating Jesus when He tells you that you are wrong. Good luck!

I take God's word at face-value, as written, unless there is good reason not to do so. You cast doubt upon Scripture for no good reason.
---Warwick on 3/18/12


Warwick:

You said: Therefore when someone says they do not have to believe all the Bible to believe in Jesus I disagree.

You can disagree all you like. The plain fact is, though, the Bible nowhere actually says that it is necessary to believe the entirety of the Bible in order to be saved.
---StrongAxe on 3/18/12


Pat, the written word is harder to understand than the spoken for a number or reasons. We all get it wrong sometimes.
---Warwick on 3/18/12


Cliff ultimately most things are accepted by faith, but not blind faith.

If you study the NT you will see Jesus and the apostles constantly referred to or quoted from the OT. And that which they said or quoted conforms to the OT we have. Over time living in His kingdom I have found Him absolutely trustworthy. I suppose it can in a way be compared to long-standing friends who have proved themselves reliable time and time again.

Our salvation is not something we can demand God prove. We know we are sinners and reach out to accept his promise, in faith. See Hebrews ch. 11 regarding faith.

You were badly chewed up by the JW's but for your own sake don't "throw the baby out with the bath water."
---Warwick on 3/18/12


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Warwick, I often miss people's meaning. I'm not very smart.
---Pat.pat on 3/18/12


Warwick, **His bible** just which version is "His" bible?
There are no original mss. and no two are identical.
So you're saying the "gist" of it is His word? (or every sylable of a particular version?)
---1st_cliff on 3/18/12


Pat, you have totally missed my meaning. What I am saying it there is no disjunction between what Jesus has said, and the Bible. He is God and the Bible is what He has provided for us. Therefore when someone says they do not have to believe all the Bible to believe in Jesus I disagree. If we reject something He says or what His Bible says we are rejecting Him.
---Warwick on 3/18/12


Warwick, Jesus the Word of God is in Greek LOGOS. Scripture the word of God is in Greek RHEMA. They aren't the same and shouldn't be confused. Otherwise you will make scripture the fourth member of the Trinity.
---Pat.pat on 3/18/12


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StrongAxe, as a debater you are very cunning in the way you phrase things. You write of if's,could be's, and possibly's. But I have listened to people of like mind to you for so many decades that I know their tune off by heart.

Others, thought incorrect when judged by Scripture, are more honest, more clearly stating what they do and do not believe.

What "the Bible actually says" is that God created in 6 days, having defined what a day is. We all know what 6 days are but you say-possibly, maybe ,could be....
---Warwick on 3/18/12


Jerry I have dealt with Christians for decades who will not believe what Scripture says. They say-but it could mean this, or that, anything other than that plainly stated in Scripture. I have also met many who once held such rubbery views and changed their minds. To a man they told me their missinterpretations of Scripture were based upon their accepting long-ages/evolutionary beliefs. If you hold to such antiBiblical views you are forced to reinterpret Scripture to fit these man-made ever-changing stories. What will they say when they stand before Jesus in Judgement?

We also need to accept that we do not know whether some people who blog here are Christians at all or people wishing to sow doubt in God's word.
---Warwick on 3/18/12


StrongAxe I cannot imagine how any Christian can separate Jesus the Word from the word of God.\\

It's a separation that Jesus Himself made, and is seen in John I:!

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/18/12


Warwick:

The debates I tend to get involved with are the ones that deal with what the Bible actually says, vs. what it does not say. If there is a discrepancy between what is actually written and what is not written, but merely what is read between the lines, shouldn't what is actually written win out?

Can you point out any specific actual written words of God's that I have expressed doubts about here?
---StrongAxe on 3/18/12


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Warwick: I think we are beginning to see just why some of these "Christians" have so much trouble accepting the truth of the Bible over their own (or their professors') pet theories. I would say to those who think that salvation is unrelated to the Word:

Luk 8:12 Those by the way side are they that hear, then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

Perhaps the devil has come to them disguised as Charles Darwin or even an esteemed professor. The Bible is the ONLY common ground we Christians have in these discussions (debates). If some don't believe the Bible, then debating them is pointless.


---jerry6593 on 3/18/12


Warwick, I differ then you. I believe in the whole Soverignty of God. That includes that God does not have to find anything good in us to save us. We don't have to be smarter, wiser, or even able to read. Were all sinners before God. When He desires to bring one of the elect to salvation, He doesn't have to wait till you read the Bible. When God draws us to Himself, by making us alive through the new birth, at that very moment begins the process of our salvation. And no one whom God has made alive will be lost. He will come to faith, he will be convicted of his sin, he will repent, and he will embrace Christ. He will work out his own salvation with the Spirit guiding him, and he will receive the consumation of his salvation at the Second Coming.
---Mark_V. on 3/18/12


StrongAxe I cannot imagine how any Christian can separate Jesus the Word from the word of God. Do you imagine there is some disjunction between Jesus and God's word? Do you imagine you can believe in the totality of Jesus without believing in the totality of the word?

What we know of Jesus is revealed to us from the word, and from the Holy Spirit about whom we know through that same word.

You are a dogged debater. However for me the Truth is what matters while it appears to me you are more concerned with debate.

At judgement will you stand before the Lord Jesus and express your doubts in His word?
---Warwick on 3/17/12


Cluny, I don't know Spanish. But anyway, like you said and I said, you said you don't need to believe the bible to be saved. I never heard that said before.
---Pat.pat on 3/17/12


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Warwick:

I didn't say you SHOULDN'T believe the Bible. I didn't say the Bible was wrong. I just said that the Bible does not say anywhere in it that you must believe every word of it in order to be saved.

Faith in Jesus is a stated prerequisite of salvation. Faith in the Bible is not.
---StrongAxe on 3/17/12


\\Cluny, yeah I guess he did. So that means that devils who believe the bible are not saved but people who don't believe the bible are saved?
---Pat.pat on 3/16/12\\

Non sequitur.

Believing the Bible is not a prerequisite for salvation.

I heard of a rabbi who believed that the Gospels were true, and that Jesus was the savior of the Gentiles, but did NOT believe that Jesus was the Messiah of Israel, was he saved?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/17/12


Strongaxe, most of what you say I agree. Genesis does not give us every single detail, that is why man speculate about a lot of things. In fact we don't get every detail about everything written in Scripture. Believing the Truth of the gospel through faith, is necessary for salvation. God was happy to present the plan of salvation without having to give every single detail about everyone's life. And the requirement for salvation is faith. If people have not received faith through the grace of God, no matter how much they know and believe the stories in the Bible they are not saved. What makes a person save is God. And if a person believes through faith in God's only eternal begotten Son, he will be save.
---Mark_V. on 3/17/12


Cluny, yeah I guess he did. So that means that devils who believe the bible are not saved but people who don't believe the bible are saved?
---Pat.pat on 3/16/12


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Cliff I wrote "St Basil believed it was to show God is the originator of light, not the sun, which should not be worshipped." To show whom? To show anyone who reads His word. And to show the heavenly host.

"told us He did." Again His word has told anyone who has read it, including us, or those yet to read it, what He has done, what He was going to do and what is still to come.
---Warwick on 3/17/12


StrongAxe if you read Scripture you will see Jesus has referred to it over and over, hundreds of times, and always as fact. He believes it is the Truth. Should you agree with Him, yes or no?
---Warwick on 3/17/12


Cluny you believe Satan believes the Bible? Please explain!
---Warwick on 3/17/12


Marc:

1) I said what Evolution's purpose was. I didn't claim it was true - you read THAT between the lines.

2) Observed laboratory techniques can claim "This can happen because I saw it". They CANNOT say "This cannot happen because I didn't see it".

3) Creating life is a wonderful. Creating life that can reproduce itself is ever more wonderful. Creating rules that allow life to self-assemble and self-improve is even more wonderful. People who say God couldn't do that don't give him enough credit.

4) One can observe similar behavior in simpler systems. It's hard to design a robot. It's harder to design a factory that builds robots. It's even harder to design a robot that builds robot factories.
---StrongAxe on 3/17/12


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Pro_3:7 Be not wise in your own eyes, fear the LORD, and turn away from evil.

there are so many that are hurting out there. lord, let me reach out beyond my own "intellect" and ego.


Pro_16:2 All the ways of a man are pure in his own eyes, but the LORD weighs the spirit.

what does evolution have to do with how God weighs you?
---aka on 3/17/12


If anyone wants to know whether God used evolution they should study the order of appearance in evolutionary theory then study the order of creation as per Genesis. Even a casual read of both will show they are opposites.

Further to this why would an "Almighty God" use such a slow, mistake ridden violent process such as evolution?

Also God tells us that death came after, and because of of Adam's sin. This is the foundation of the Christian gospel. However evolution places death before Adam's sin which undermines the gospel.
---Warwick on 3/17/12


Axe: "Some believe most of it is made-up stories."

That is exactly what Evolution is - made-up stories. The Bible, on the other hand, has historical, archaeological and experiential authenticity to back it up. But what does Evolution have to back it up? HOAXES!


---jerry6593 on 3/17/12


Strongaxe,

Did you even read what I wrote? If you did, then you clearly have ignored it. You say evolution is true i.e. matter, left to itself, will produce not just life, but the DNA code and all the information. Evolutionists have yet to demonstrate HOW matter, left to itself, can do that. In fact, it cant because of some well-known laws of biochemistry.

Creationists, drawing upon common sense and observed laboratory techniques, argue that only programmed matter can bring about complexity that life entails. That is matter plus intelligence is able to produce life.

To say the most intelligent Being would set aside his intelligence and allow matter to work by slow chance is utter metaphysical and scientific nonsense.
---Marc on 3/16/12


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\\Cluny, I don't know if the devil believes in the bible or not. I don't know if he can even read.\\

He quoted it to Jesus, didn't he?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/16/12


Marc:

Genesis gives very little detail about how God created man (i.e. blowing on some earth). It gives even less detail about how he created animals and plants (i.e. it just says he created them, period.) It doesn't even mention bacteria at all. Do you have any more specific details?

This is the whole point of evolutionary theory - to try to explain HOW.
---StrongAxe on 3/16/12


Bible print look black and white to me, except Jesus words in red.
---Pat.pat on 3/16/12


Cluny, I don't know if the devil believes in the bible or not. I don't know if he can even read.
---Pat.pat on 3/16/12


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Strongaxe said ''Genesis says God created living creatures, but it doesn't go into details as to HOW he did it.''

Wrong! Genesis says God did it very quickly i.e. over a few days. This matches exactly with Proverbs 8 etc, John 1 and Colossians 1 where it says by His Wisdom (i.e. Christ) God created. Wise and intelligent beings always do things quickly, that's why they're smart. Only smart liars and dishonest cheats do it slowly in order to cover up their intelligent acts i.e. criminals. If God did it by evolution, he's cheating by trying to cover up his intelligence. Perish the thought!
---Marc on 3/16/12


Pat.pat:

1) Many Christians who believe in evolution. Genesis says God created living creatures, but it doesn't go into details as to HOW he did it. Biblical evolutionists believe evolution is one of the mechanisms God used to create life.

2) It's not just a matter of "believing the Bible" or "not believing the Bible". It's not all black and white. Some believe every word is literally true. Some believe most are literally true, but some are symbolic. Some believe much is symbolic. Some believe most of it is made-up stories. Some believe it's all myth.

3) As I pointed out in my last post, "belief in the Bible" is not one of the things ever mentioned as necessary for salvation. Faith in Jesus is.
---StrongAxe on 3/16/12


\\Strong ax, I pretty much agree with you but believing in evolution means you don't believe the bible so that means you aren't saved.
---Pat.pat on 3/16/12\\

Non sequitur.

Satan believes the Bible. Does that mean that he's saved?

Salvation depends on how you answer the questions: "What do you think of Christ? Whose Son is He? Who do people say I am--and who do YOU say I am?

Jesus never posed the question, "What think ye of Genesis?" as what our salvation depends upon.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/16/12


Strong ax, I pretty much agree with you but believing in evolution means you don't believe the bible so that means you aren't saved.
---Pat.pat on 3/16/12


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willie_c:

The reason the Big Bang didn't happen one second earlier than it did, is exactly the same reason God didn't say "Let there be light!" one second earlier than he did.

They happened when they happened. If they had happened earlier, we would be talking about it having happened earlier.
---StrongAxe on 3/16/12


If all were made by means of scientific principles that are predictable and consistent . . . how come these principles did not do what they do to big bang a universe at some earlier point . . . in all past eternity? They had all past eternity to do it. Why didn't they?

If atoms and molecules and physical energy produced the human body so highly complex and well-designed, how come atoms and energy principles did not make humans intelligent instead of dumb and destructive like we can be?
---willie_c: on 3/16/12


Rev & Atheist,

''You're playing semantics'' and ''Nonsense'' are not arguments but noises.

One test for your epistemology is whether it was able to detect a non-natural cause. For example, if the origin of life was NOT caused by natural causation, how would your project discern this?

You see, the problem is that yours automatically rules it out even if it were the case that the origin of life was NOT caused by natural processes. This is not an honest search for knowledge but a blinkered one. Hardly science.
---Marc on 3/16/12


Marc: Keep up the good work!


A theist: You make the implicit assumption that the evolutionary hypothesis is true science. It is not. It is more of a blind-faith religion than a science. Evolution is to geology as astrology is to astronomy. Evolution is founded not upon any science, but upon the twin pillars of conjecture and fraud. How many accepted scientific principles must an hypothesis violate before you would consider it invalid? Evolution has hundreds!


---jerry6593 on 3/16/12


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Pat.pat:

Salvation depends on faith in Jesus, not on disbelief in evolution or anything else:

Matthew 10:22 "he that endureth to the end shall be saved." (also 24:13, Mark 13:13)
Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved"
John 10:9 "I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved"
Acts 16:31 "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house"
Romans 10:9 "if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Romans 10:13 "For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved." (also Acts 2:21)
---StrongAxe on 3/16/12


God hates evolution and everyone who believes in evolution. You can't be saved and believe in evolution. So don't believe in it, and if you do, stop believing in it and get saved.
---Pat.pat on 3/15/12


Ive always wondered if the 6 days God took to make everything were 6 days OUR time or his.

Doesnt matter to me either way. I believe HE did it no matter how long it took so I see evolution as harmless. It doesnt affect my faith one bit.
---JackB on 3/15/12


Marc.

Nonsense. Gee. Everything makes sense but steps 1 and 17. So we'll just say something supernatural did it, and quit there?

That's your idea of science?
---atheist on 3/15/12


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You're playing semantics, Marc, which are irrelevant to the origins of our species or universe.

If you think there are supernatural creation myths and/or "theories" worth pursuing, I'm sure the evidence shown will find it's way into scientific research.

The beauty of science or ANY gathering of knowledge, is as we learn more, our theories and ideas evolve over time. Imagine if we still believed in talking snakes.

Imagine if we were stuck with the same technological or medicinal knowledge from thousands of years ago. Not unlike applying ancient myths and superstitions to 21st century society.
---Rev on 3/15/12


Atheist,

You say that explaining the ultimate origin of life and the universe by a supernatural (i.e. from outside of nature) cause is not science. As someone who has a degree in the Philosophy of Science it's obvious that you have had no training regarding the problems here. To say that only natural explanations can explain ultimate reality is not a scientific proposal but a metaphysical (i.e. religious) one.

An underlying axiom of evolution is that only naturalistic explanations will be considered. That isn't science but a philosophical bias.
---Marc on 3/15/12


Sciencetist's assumes there are no Supernatural elements in their Theories. But when the theories breadk down and do not work then those of us who believe see that it is possible for the assumption to be wrong.
---Samuel on 3/15/12


Jerry,

I have listened to about six hours of the Kansas school board's testimony on this. The "controversy" as presented was that it should be allowed to say for something not explainable in current science theory, that a supernatural force was responsible. That would be hardly science, and explaining why it is not would not be a difficult task. Science is looking for answers, not giving up and saying, "Oh, it was supernatural at that point."
---atheist on 3/15/12


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A theist: "Here you could at least 'teach the controversy'"

But are you ready to listen?

All I ask is that we subject Darwin's hypothesis to the same rigorous scruntiny as we do the Bible account. If Evolution is true science, it should stand the test on its own, without the necessity of belittling those who believe the Bible account.


---jerry6593 on 3/15/12


Warwick, The frustration comment was about the non posting!
**St Basil believed it was to show the originator of light**
To show who?? No one was there!
Light the earth for the first three days ,again why? no one was there?
**told us He did**
Told "who" how?? No one was there!
---1st_cliff on 3/15/12


Haz I am happy to hear that you escaped from the evolutionary lie. Happily yours is a common story. I was also conned into believing evolution. Sadly most people never get the chance to see the truth.
---Warwick on 3/14/12


Cliff I cannot imagine why you think I am frustrated.

Contradicting people such as yourself, StrongAxe/Lee isn't difficult. All that is necessary is to quote God's word and the BiblioSceptics are contradicted.
God has not told us why He created light to light the earth for the first three days, before He created the sun. But He has told us He did. St Basil believed it was to show God is the originator of light, not the sun, which should not be worshipped.

It is interesting how BiblioSceptics flock to any thread concerning Biblical creation for that is where the battle is. Many Christians have been duped into accepting long-ages/evolution and feel condemned when shown that Scripture contradicts them.
---Warwick on 3/14/12


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Why do some Christians embrace evolution?

Because they have been brainwashed by an education system and TV documentaries that repetitively push the doctrine of evolution upon society.

I came through this brainwashing process myself, believing evolution. Fortunately I eventually rejected this absurd belief.
---Haz27 on 3/14/12


Kevin I know the usual evolutionary story is that rivers form canyons but at Mt St Helens the opposite was observed occurring. Massive pyroclastic flows carved out a large canyon in a short time period. Then a river began to flow through the canyon. Speculation is one thing but observation is of a totally different order.
---Warwick on 3/14/12


Jerry,

You just want to keep that fight going between Strongeaxe and Warwick. Here you could at least "teach the controversy" even if you can't do it in public schools, rather than childishly mock others handles.
---atheist on 3/14/12


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