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Can God Hear Sinners

Does God hear sinners? Most everyone who answers, believe in free will, can they show passages where sinful man, in the sinful flesh, can come to God who is holy and pure? Show passages.

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1Jn5:1 [Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God:] and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

5Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

6This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ, not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

7For there are three that testify:the Spirit and the water and the blood, and these three agree.
---char on 3/30/12


You MUST be Born Again:

The same Spirit that raised Christ from the dead...Hebrews 13:20-21 is that SAME SPIRIT Romans 8:9-11 that dwells in your mortal flesh is what it is to be Born Again right here and now.

But THIS BORN AGAIN happens the moment we receive Jesus Christ into our lives, We are receiving His death and resurrection life. THIS is the Born Again you want to be, and the ONLY one that will raise you up in the last Day, making you a New creature in the New Creation.

So what ever "born again definition" calvinists use, NOT IN SCRIPTURE...it's more than likely a counterfeit spirit, who suffers from dyslexia.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/12


I really wouldn't let these calvinists bother you, seeing they do not base their Born Again experience ON SCRIPTURE, THE SPIRIT you receive AFTER you believe, not before, and to as many as receive Him..

We also have the Word of God to guide us in this truth and keep us in this truth SO THAT when false teachers come our way, hissing and cursing at us, calling us names, or telling us we are not saved..just stand on GOD'S WORD.. stand on the ROCK.

Sinful man in his sinful state cannot come into God's HOLY and PURE presence EXCEPT THROUGH JESUS CHRIST! Even in the OT picture..ONLY the High Priest(not the people) could enter the veil FOR the sins of ALL the People, not just a select few.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/12


Kathr, you cannot know Christ or have faith in His works on the Cross without the Spirit of God. You cannot come to Him and expect to later get faith and salvation because you were good enough to let Him into your life. Your salvation is false. It is the Holy Spirit who testifies of Christ and without the Spirit testifying to your heart that Jesus is Lord, you will remain lost. You need a spiritual awakening. You have the wrong view because you have the wrong Christ. You have a created son as to your own words. The real Christ is eternal. He was never created a Son.
---Mark_V. on 3/30/12


"So now you are playing God and know who going to heaven and not? Tell me Christian, why do you think you have a free ticket already? So while at it, who gave you authorithy over scripture?" Ruben

How am I playing God when Christ explicitly declared, "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." John 3:5 - I merely echoed what Christ declared, that you cannot go to heaven if you're not "born of the Spirit, period. Unless you want to call Christ a liar.

I have no authority over Scripture but my Savior and Lord Jesus Christ does. And I being His disciple have been asked to witness and testify this truth.
---christan on 3/29/12




We receive the Holy Spirit AT the moment we receive Jesus Christ.

Christan, you claim you SEE the Kingdom, but never told us what exactly you SEE!!

If faith is by SIGHT, and one must SEE first to believe, it is no Faith at all.

We also live by faith and not by SIGHT.

Jesus was simply telling Nicodemus, that Jesus Kingdom was not here on earth, that one could SEE.

So you claim YOU were translated out of this present evil world INTO the Kingdom of His Dear Son BEFORE ever having Faith in Christ. You claim yoy were already a NEW CREATURE in teh New Creation before ever having faith in Christ?

HOGWASH!!
---kathr4453 on 3/29/12


Worship in Spirit and in Truth-Gods Word is the only Truth-Y'shua-Jesus Christ

1Jn 4,5(all)Ysha-Jesus Christ come in the flesh

God confirms His Word- Holy Spirit 1Jn 5:6-1,1Cor 2, Is 45:23

Ysha-Word is Spirit and life Jn 4:22-26, Jn 14:4-6,Jn 6:63

1 JN 4:21 AND this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also.

1Jn5:1 1Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

Jn 8:12Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

Lk 6:34-40 35But love ye your enemies
---char on 3/29/12


O foolish 'free-willers', even the Jews, Muslims, RCs, Baptists, Methodists will tell you they all "worship God". Are they going to heaven? Most definitely NOT!

"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."

Now, try going to heaven without being born of the Spirit.
---christan on 3/29/12

So now you are playing God and know who going to heaven and not? Tell me Christian, why do you think you have a free ticket already? So while at it, who gave you authorithy over scripture?
---Ruben on 3/29/12


How about when Jesus commanded Lazurus to rise. Lazurus was dead. How did he obey while dead? The same holds true for all who are lost, spiritually dead to God. God commands and it is done. All the work of God. As you said Christ made possible what was impossible.
---Mark_V. on 3/29/12


MarkV when one is dead in sin, that doesn't mean he is physically deceased. God gave man lungs to breath. God doesn't breath for that person.

Christ made possible FAITH. It's up to us to OBEY or not. If God OBEYED and you can't, then WHY do you still sin. It is not God's WILL that you sin markv. You have no excuse since you say now you are ALIVE. SO who is sinning, YOU or God.

I believe your FREE WILL is sinning.
---kathr4453 on 3/29/12


O foolish 'free-willers', even the Jews, Muslims, RCs, Baptists, Methodists will tell you they all "worship God". Are they going to heaven? Most definitely NOT! So, your understanding that one who claims they "worship God" means they are going to heaven? FOOLS!

Here's why, Jesus declared, "God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth."

"Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God."

Now, try going to heaven without being born of the Spirit.
---christan on 3/29/12




//The ONLT remnant scripture speaks of is referring to Israel.
---kathr4453 on 3/29/12//
Mark thinks he is Israel
---m_ichael_e on 3/29/12


Kathr, your are twisting the Truth again and then turn around and give a clear picture of what God does first to fallen men when you said,

"Christ commanded, the man obeyed and God enabled! "Christ enabled him to do the impossible!"

You said it, your own very words. God enabled him to do the impossible. What is impossible for men all things are possible with God.
How about when Jesus commanded Lazurus to rise. Lazurus was dead. How did he obey while dead? The same holds true for all who are lost, spiritually dead to God. God commands and it is done. All the work of God. As you said Christ made possible what was impossible.
---Mark_V. on 3/29/12


You believe because of your own free will you deserve salvation for you wonderful works.----MarkV

I don't think anyone has claimed that. Everyone seems to agree that it is God grace that saves us. We dont deserve it. We still must believe in what Jesus Christ promised us to have access to that grace (Romans 5:2).

If you're angry that God requires us to believe, why not take it up with him. That might be a little foolish considering that Hes done everything else for us, but if you feel its unfair for God to require it....
---CraigA on 3/29/12


God's purpose to save a remnant according to the election of grace arose solely out of His His own free and sovereign will.
---Mark_V. on 3/29/12


A remnant of what MarkV?? The ONLT remnant scripture speaks of is referring to Israel.
---kathr4453 on 3/29/12


Nana, we know all too well the methods you guys use to present how wonderful you guys were when you, out of your own free will, decided that it was ok for Christ to come into your life. You believe because of your own free will you deserve salvation for you wonderful works. That some how God is obligated to save you because you did something other cannot or will not do, but you are wrong. You deserve death just like all of us. Certainly a sinner like you is entitled to nothing but judgment. God's purpose to save a remnant according to the election of grace arose solely out of His His own free and sovereign will.
---Mark_V. on 3/29/12


An example of total inability might be this:

((Mark 3:1-5)). Christ gave a command, "Stretch forth thine hand!" How could he do this if he suffered from paralysis? Christ commanded, the man obeyed and God enabled! Christ enabled him to do the impossible! So also the sinner is commanded to believe on Christ. If the sinner fails to obey this command then he is guilty of disobeying the gospel **2 Thess. 1:8. He will never be able to use this excuse: "Lord, the reason I did not believe on Christ was because I was totally depraved and unable to believe." No, if God commands, then man is responsible to obey. "But now God commandeth all men everywhere to repent" Acts 17:30.
---kathr4453 on 3/28/12


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What a sad bunch of loss souls.


---christan on 3/28/12
Wow , what arrogance..and PRIDE.


OK God OPENED her heart, but where does it say God opened her heart TO SALVATION or to the Gospel?? It doesn't. It says God opened her heart to ATTEND the Things of Paul. ((Lydia was ALREADY SAVED))....just like I'm sure God opened LUKE's heart to attend the things of Paul...like write for him.

What a sad display of mis-using scripture!
---kathr4453 on 3/28/12


"And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: WHOSE HEART THE LORD OPENED, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul." Acts 16:14

Did Lydia opened her heart by her 'free-will' or was it the Lord who "opened her heart".

Christan on 3/28/12

Christian, if she did not worship God, would he open her heart? And look what happen "she was baptized" and she even ask Paul "If you agree that I am a true believer in the Lord, she said, come and stay at my home. And she urged us until we agreed." v15
---Ruben on 3/28/12


14And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: whose heart the Lord opened, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul.

15And when she was baptized, and her household, she besought us, saying, If ye have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come into my house, and abide there. And she constrained us. Are you saying in a flash moment after she was baptized she already proved herself to be faithful???
---kathr4453 on 3/28/12


Who opened Cornelius's heart to Peter's impending visit? God did by means of one of his angels which on speaking to him said, "Thy prayers and thine alms are come up for a memorial before God."

And how the narrative described Cornelius prior to the angel coming? Simply as "A devout man, and one that feared God with all his house, which gave much alms to the people, and prayed to God alway."

Even Lydia was described as one who "worshipped God" from before hearing Paul.
---Nana on 3/28/12


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"And a certain woman named Lydia, a seller of purple, of the city of Thyatira, which worshipped God, heard us: WHOSE HEART THE LORD OPENED, that she attended unto the things which were spoken of Paul." Acts 16:14

Did Lydia opened her heart by her 'free-will' or was it the Lord who "opened her heart". You 'free-willers' have such a pathetic way of understanding Acts 10:1-4 and all the other Scriptures.

Now you know why the 'free-will' is man-centered? You are perfect prove of that when you use Acts 10:1-4 to declare that Cornelius believed in the Lord by his 'free-will' - which you CANNOT even provide Scripture that says what you are declaring.

What a sad bunch of loss souls.
---christan on 3/28/12


Nana has a quicker draw it seems :D
---Blogger9680 on 3/28/12


"Nana Great scripture! They will explain that away saying Cornelius was ALREADY SAVED meaning he was already Born again of the Spirit."
kathr4453 on 3/28/12

Well kathr4453, I know all too well their arguments. Here are twelve more who were convinced of a good thing, namely the ways of God. Fruit ripe for the picking as Jesus said, "The harvest truly is plenteous, but the labourers are few..."

Acts 19:1_8.
---Nana on 3/28/12


Christan,

Acts 10

(1)At Caesarea there was a man named Cornelius, a centurion in what was known as the Italian Regiment. (2)He and all his family were devout and God-fearing, he gave generously to those in need and prayed to God regularly

He was sent to retrieve Peter so that Peter could preach the gospel to him.

(34) Then Peter began to speak: I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism but accepts men from every nation who fear him and do what is right

The Spirit convicts, but man is responsible for his reaction to that conviction.
---Blogger9680 on 3/27/12


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Nana Great scripture! They will explain that away saying Cornelius was ALREADY SAVED meaning he was already Born again of the Spirit.

And LeeJ will insist you need to read the works of so and so to understand it.
Instead of Leej saying "I bear in my body the marks of the Lord Jesus", HE SAYS..."I bear in my library the Works of" ......as he rattles off names of those who defend HIS DOCTRINE we are all to be impressed by.(( remember, no ones works have yet to be judged at the judgement seat of Christ...yet they have placed their bet and faith on a horse THEY don't know if those works will be BURNED!

My faith is in Jesus Christ and His Word which statesCornelius was not already saved or born of the Spirit.
---kathr4453 on 3/28/12


"Blogger9680, are you saying that "a man come to fear God" is by his own 'free-will'?"
christan on 3/27/12

Atcs 10:1_4 "There was a certain man in Caesarea called Cornelius, a centurion of the band called the Italian band,
A devout man, and one that feared God with all his house, which gave much alms to the people, and prayed to God alway.
He saw in a vision evidently about the ninth hour of the day an angel of God coming in to him, and saying unto him, Cornelius.
And when he looked on him, he was afraid, and said, What is it, Lord? And he said unto him, Thy prayers and thine alms are come up for a memorial before God."
---Nana on 3/27/12


Blogger9680, are you saying that "a man come to fear God" is by his own 'free-will'? That the conviction is by his 'free-will'? Seriously? Is this even Scriptural? Definitely not, because Scriptures explicitly declares, "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. THERE IS NO FEAR OF GOD BEFORE THEIR EYES." Romans 3:3,10,18

Well, there goes your 'free-will' theology. Scripture declares, "NONE, NO NOT ONE", and it's definitely without exception or the Word of God wouldn't have declared "NONE". If you're a true Christian, He will tell how and why, it's in the Scriptures.
---christan on 3/27/12


"Are you saying God's MERCY is given to those THROUGH YOUR Mercy?" kathr

You sure are confused and you've the audacity to ask, "do you even understand this verse? DO YOU?

The "your", means that after God shows mercy to the sinner, Paul says "that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy." The sinner is in no position to show mercy because he's the one seeking for God's mercy. Comprehend?

The conclusion of Romans 11 then says that for God to show His mercy, He must and has "concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all."

Note, the "them all" IS WITHOUT EXCEPTION, ALL MANKIND, yes, you and I too!
---christan on 3/27/12


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Open your 'free-will' eyes, Romans 11:31,32, "Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all."

Christan, do you even understand this verse?

Who is THEY, THEM...ALL

Are you saying God's MERCY is given to those THROUGH YOUR Mercy?

Well then...show MERCY to all that through YOUR MERCY,others can receive God's Mercy.
---kathr4453 on 3/27/12


Romans does not say that any were created for the sole purpose of perishing-

[repentance required] [In Christ] Stand in righteousness.

Jews were set aside until the fullness of the Gentiles become in.Is 11:26
vs4For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
vs10For with the heart[ man believeth unto righteousness], and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
14How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
17So then faith cometh[by hearing], and
[ hearing]. by [the word of God.]

[hearing comes by the Word of God]
[faith comes by the hearing]
---char on 3/27/12


//---Blogger9680 on 3/27/12//--agree.//

[image of the invisible] Ecc1:9-10The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be, and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun. Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new? it hath been already of old time, which was before us.

cont'
Romans:
4But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
5Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.
---char on 3/27/12


God doesn't show mercy to every soul---Christan

Now that I would agree with, but to whom does He show mercy? As one other person here said to whom does God reveal his covenants? Those that fear him. (Psalm 25:14) How does a man come to fear God? Conviction

You're leaving out the Spirits role in this current world: to convict the WORLD of sin if they are unbelievers (John 16:8,9) The purpose for that is to turn men from their sins to the Lord Jesus Christ.
---Blogger9680 on 3/27/12


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//ONE mediator between God and man, the Man Christ Jesus!
---kathr4453 on 3/26/12
---kathr4453 on 3/24/12 //
I like the way you put it.
I add--- "the only perfect man."


Jn 8:24 "Unless you believe that I am, you will die in your sins."


//"Can God hear sinners?"
To answer the title/question, Yes, of course He can. He's omniscient.
---Chria9396 on 3/23/12// Amen.
//---micha9344 on 3/21/12//
Amen.
//---Blogger9680 on 3/25/12//---Amen.

God did not create any soul for the sole purpose of perishing them.
---char on 3/27/12


"the only problem is that nowhere in scripture will you find that God predestines men to UNbelief." Blogger9680

Open your 'free-will' eyes, Romans 11:31,32, "Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all."

What's Paul saying? For God to show mercy, He has "concluded them all in unbelief". Nowhere? If you still cannot believe what Paul wrote, you too have been "concluded". Remember, "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion." God doesn't show mercy to every soul.
---christan on 3/27/12


The Seg, very good points you gave concerning the passages in (John 12:36-42). Almost all that was said to Israel, was fulfilled by the Lord.

Josef, thank you for your questions. I respect anything you have to say brother. Those questions can only bring more light to God's Word.
---Mark_V. on 3/27/12


Interestingly, where MarkV places the Spirit, the Bible places the BLOOD. MarkV believes on must first be Justified by the Spirit in order to come to God, where the Bible tells us we can approach God by first being Justified by His Blood.

In the OT picture of types and shadows, no one could enter into the Holy of Holies except the High Priest, NOT WITHOUT BLOOD, and the High Priest had to first apply the Blood for his own sin first before entering through the second veil.

NOW JESUS, with His own blood entered once and for all who is now the High Priest who makes reconciliation for the sin of the people.

MarkV's, christan and leej's gospel is not based on scripture.

This is God's PICTURE of Salvation.
---kathr4453 on 3/27/12


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TODAY we enter through the veil a NEW AND LIVING WAY, that is to say HIS FLESH.

I really don't believe our calvinist believe and understand that we come directly to a Holy God THROUGH CHRIST. As christan scoffed at a post explaining this is evident.

Our BORN AGAIN experience comes WHEN we receive Jesus Christ. WE receive the Spirit of the LIFE of Christ, that is, the risen Christ. The Holy Spirit doesn't give you access to God, JESUS DOES. JESUS SAVES! The Holy Spirit POINTS the way, is our teacher, our conforter, but not our savior. The Holy Spirit did not shed His Blood and die and rise again FOR YOUR JUSTIFICATION. The Holy Spirit has no FLESH.
---kathr4453 on 3/27/12


Revelation 7:13-15
13And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

14And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

15Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.


Are YOU washed in the Blood of the Lamb?

From Genesis ((Adam and Eve being COVERED to by a SLAIN animal)) to teh Passover, to Revelation, being WASHED in the Blood is God's picture of Salvation.
---kathr4453 on 3/27/12


In the words of Jesus, after the self righteous Pharisee prayed to himself, "the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise [his] eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me a sinner!' "I tell you, this man went down to his house justified [rather] than the other, Luk 18:13,14 ---
---Josef on 3/25/12


Yes, and JESUS is that GOODNESS God gave the world that leads to salvation.

But here..did the Father hear, or did the Son hear??? Or did the Father give all power to the Son???

ONE mediator between God and man, the Man Christ Jesus!
---kathr4453 on 3/26/12


Joh 12:39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
Joh 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart, that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.

Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits, that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

A good question right about now would be, to try and understand why.
By the way, if he did it, it had to be done.
Still, the why?

Joh_12:38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled

Peace
---TheSeg on 3/25/12


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Josef, great point you gave in (Luke 18:13,14). He was heard by God for the tax collector's humility is notable in everything about his posture and behavior. Here was a man "who had been made to face the reality of his own sin," and his response was abject humility and repentance. Without the Spirit of God first convicting him of his sin, giving him faith to believe and know the Truth, he would have never repented, There would have been no difference in both.
"God may perhaps grant that they will repent and come to know the Truth, and they may escape from the snare of the devil, after having being captured by him to do his will." (2 Tim. 225,26).
---Mark_V. on 3/26/12


Christan, the only problem is that nowhere in scripture will you find that God predestines men to UNbelief.

Men are sent strong delusion by God BECAUSE they are in unbelief (2 Thes 2:10)(Romans 10,11)

It is evident from reading Eph 2:8,9 that salvation is the gift of God that is not of ourselves. It is not faith. Your faith is what God wants. For without that you cannot please him no matter how much good you try to do.

You must believe that God exists and that He is a "rewarder of those who diligently SEEK him". Yes God rewards those who answer the call of the Holy Spirit and seek him through Jesus Christ.
---Blogger9680 on 3/25/12


Blogger9680, many like to skip the most critical part when reading Ephesians. That happens to be Ephesians 1:1-12 as highlighted by TheSeg. There's a simple reason why Paul starts Ephesians that way and it did not happen "by chance".

Paul wants to make it very clear that one becomes a Christian is because God has chosen him before the foundations of the world. And he even went one up by saying this was predestined to happen.

Believers of the 'free-will' doctrine hate this fact that God has elected and predestined. But is it going to change His plans? "For I am the LORD, I change not, therefore ye sons of Jacob are not consumed." Malachi 3:6 - a faithful promise and who does Jacob represent? The elect.
---christan on 3/25/12


//When He makes you spiritually alive you receive the promise of the Holy Spirit. And at that moment of change, God grants you faith to believe in the One He just brought you alive to//MarkV

I just dont understand where you get this from. No change occurs in us until the Spirit comes into us. I agree with that. But nowhere in scripture does it say that a man must have the Holy Spirit to call upon the Lord. It clearly proclaims the opposite.

There are instances in the book of Acts where men had faith in Jesus Christ and were even baptized in his name but did not yet have the Spirit. Even the 12 followed Christ without the Spirit until He was risen and breathed on them.
---Blogger9680 on 3/25/12


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"At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.

Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight.

All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father, neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and He to whomsoever the Son will reveal him."
Matthew 11:25-27

Doesn't this speak against the wickedness of 'free-will' doctrine? The sinner does not know who God is till He decides to reveal Himself through Christ only. And 'free-willers' say they are not blind.
---christan on 3/25/12


In the words of Jesus, after the self righteous Pharisee prayed to himself, "the tax collector, standing afar off, would not so much as raise [his] eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me a sinner!' "I tell you, this man went down to his house justified [rather] than the other, Luk 18:13,14 Therefore he was not only heard, but justified. If the Father did not hear the sinner, no one would be saved. Jesus also said " I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance. Mat 9:13 However I do understand what you are saying Mark. It is"the goodness of God leads you to repentance. And "there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than ..." Luk 15:7
---Josef on 3/25/12


What many are doing is,

"What we're seeing today Blogger is what 2nd Timothy 3 warns of...They have a FORM of Godliness and deny the Power, from such turn away."

That is what we should turn away from, from those who deny the power of God. They keep insisting in their own power, their own free will. We should be aware of these people, but we should try to correct them first, and if they continue been disobedient, unthankful, unloving, unforgiving, slanderous without self-control, from such people we should turn away from. Why give them the gospel Truth if they are going to change the Truth to a lie?
---Mark_V. on 3/25/12


Blogger96, you said,

"Oh well of course God must draw the man to him. If God left us to the devil noone would believe."

That is the whole Truth of Scripture. God has to draw you first to Himself. Otherwise you continue to be separated from Him. When He makes you spiritually alive you receive the promise of the Holy Spirit. And at that moment of change, God grants you faith to believe in the One He just brought you alive to. The Spirit convicts you of your rebellion against God and you will repent, because you recognize your sin. Otherwise you will never recognize your sin against God and never repent.
You and others try to make sense of God's word with your believe in "Free will" just not possible.
---Mark_V. on 3/25/12


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Blogger9680
It IS biblical Christan. You are very mistaken.
Eph 1:13 says we do.

Im not trying to be funny, but doesnt Eph 1:1-12.
Say no we dont. in truth
Please just asking, look.

Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Peace
But keep reading
---TheSeg on 3/25/12


The importance of the blood seems to have dissipated in a lot of newer doctrines.
---Blogger9680 on 3/24/12

AMEN!!If one studied Leviticus and Hebrews one would see...THERE IS NO forgivness of sin without the shedding of Blood.

And it was THE BLOOD that was sprinkled...Abeloffered BLOOD and found GRACE in God's eyes.

What we're seeing today Blogger is what 2nd Timothy 3 warns of...They have a FORM of Godliness and deny the Power, from such turn away.

The POWER is in the Blood.
---kathr4453 on 3/25/12


Leviticus 17:11, 14 (cp. Deuteronomy 12:23) For the life of the flesh
is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. For it is the life of all flesh, the blood of it is for the life
thereof

Hebrews 9:22 Without the shedding of blood, there is
no remission of sins.


Exodus 12:13 and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you.
---kathr4453 on 3/25/12


--They believe they are given the Spirit after they believe in Christ, which is unbiblical.
---christan on 3/24/12--

It IS biblical Christan. You are very mistaken.
Eph 1:13 says we do.

Would you like a listing of all the occurences in scripture where men believed in Jesus Christ before the received the Holy Spirit? I would be happy to supply them.

Anger is sometimes a replacement for fear. Especially when ones doctrine is threatened by scripture they cannot deny.

There is forgiveness.
---Blogger9680 on 3/25/12


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Mat_27:51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom, and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent,

There is no opening and closing anymore.
But the way has been block by a big mountain.
Every day that goes by, this mountain seems to be growing on its own.

But if we can take the beam out of our eyes, you'll see for yourself, the way is clear!
I know this, it's just so hard to believe.

If Christ, really is your brother.
Then you should do on to your brother.
As you would have your brother, do on to you!

Maybe if you help me with my beam.
I could help you with yours.
Peace
---TheSeg on 3/24/12


Christian, why you so angry all the time? If I'm in heaven with you, will I have to put up with your anger for all eternity? Cool it, man.
---Pat.pat on 3/24/12


Blogger9680, do not mock what you do not understand nor believe. The "blood of Christ" did not make man savable as what your 'free-will' doctrine suggest. The "blood of Christ" saved only those whom the Father has given to His Son, according to the Scriptures.

Again and again, does the "ALL MAN" suggested by you meaning everyone of mankind? If it does, then no one should be going to hell, right? The "ALL MAN" has a clear and distinct reference, "ALL THAT THE FATHER GIVETH ME SHALL COME TO ME, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. And He said, Therefore said I unto you, that NO MAN CAN COME UNTO ME, EXCEPT IT WERE GIVEN UNTO HIM OF MY FATHER." John 6:37
---christan on 3/24/12


---Without the Spirit you can come to the throne of Christ boldly demanding your rights or complain to Him, but you will not be heard---MarkV

MarkV is it the Spirit that opens the second veil to the holy of holies or is it the blood of Jesus Christ that was shed for all men?

The importance of the blood seems to have dissipated in a lot of newer doctrines.
---Blogger9680 on 3/24/12


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Isaiah 59:1 Behold, the LORD'S hand is not shortened, that it cannot save, neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear: But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid [his] face from you, that he will not hear.

Proverbs 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.


Micah 3:4 Then shall they cry unto the LORD, but he will not hear them: he will even hide his face from them at that time, as they have behaved themselves ill in their doings.
---francis on 3/24/12


//As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable, there is none that doeth good, no, not one."

You should talk to Haz27, or Eloy about this as they claim they are not sinners but righteous. And Adventist seek with the help of God's Spirit to become perfect while in the flesh and thus merit eternal life.

While our theologians tell us that we can by our continual living in the Spirit that we can at least obtain some degree of sinlessness, completion will only come when we are with the Lord.
---lee1538 on 3/24/12


Romans 3:10-12 is very explicit with regards to the fallen man,

"As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable, there is none that doeth good, no, not one."

This condemns the doctrine of 'free-will', which says a man has the ability to seek for God in his fallen state outside of "Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

'Free-willers' say they don't need to be born of the Spirit to seek God. They believe they are given the Spirit after they believe in Christ, which is unbiblical.
---christan on 3/24/12


"Can God hear sinners?"
To answer the title/question, Yes, of course He can. He's omniscient.
---Chria9396 on 3/23/12


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See Blogger9680, because people dont believe God sent his son for the forgiveness of sin.
Because I hear people say, as I have or as I do!

What I like to know as if I dont!
Is, what make people believe, that it is they who have made themselves believe.
And not that God has given it, to them, to believe!
What is it that you have that was not given?
And if it was given, why do they glory, as if it was not given!

So, if it was given onto you to know the mystery of the kingdom of God.
And you know, to some, these things are done in parables!
I just wonder how someone, who knows these things, should speak.
Peace
---TheSeg on 3/23/12


Oh well of course God must draw the man to him. If God left us to the devil noone would believe.

So where do you draw the line between being drawn by the Spirit and the Spirit indwelling the believer?

At what point does God say "Ive given you enough proof to believe in me, now the decision is yours"?
---Blogger9680 on 3/23/12


Blogger89, the passage in Hebrew is speaking of believers who already have faith in the Lord who are mention as coming boldly to the throne of Christ to receive mercy and grace to help them in their time of need.
Don't you understand that the Holy Spirit testifies of Christ? Without the Spirit you can come to the throne of Christ boldly demanding your rights or complain to Him, but you will not be heard. This is not saying that God does not have ears to hear, what it means is that He will not hear your demands and do something for you, He only hears and listens and answers the voice of His sheep. No matter what argument you put up while lost, you will not be heard. He will say to you at the Day of the Lord, I never knew you.
---Mark_V. on 3/24/12


Did he talk with them? Or better said did they talk to him?
Maybe it comes down to, did God send Christ for the forgiveness of sin.
And maybe God doesnt hear sinners, but we know for sure Christ does!
Peace
---TheSeg on 3/21/12

TheSeg, I believe you have that correct. NO ONE can come to teh Father EXCEPT through His Son. GOD cannot hear sinners. That is why Jesus died for our sin..SO THAT man is reconciled BACK TO GOD. Jesus Is that mediator between God and man.

The veil that was rent(Jesus death and resurrection) is what OPENED the way for man to have fllowship with the Father.

Not only can Jesus hear, He also fellowshipped with SINNERS while on earth, sinners who turned away.
---kathr4453 on 3/24/12


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Blogger9680
If you want to understand what I said to Eloy:
"So before you can receive the Holy Spirit you must ask god"

Then read the next line!
Someone who cannot hear you and you cannot believe in, without it.

Unless you agree with some who say, a man can believe in God without God help.
More to the point is, without his spirit.

I see you say:
We do not belong to Christ before we receive the Holy Spirit (Romans 8:9).
I see you are agreeing with some of what Eloy said because you also said belong!

See Christ said, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth!
Rom_13:1 The powers that be are ordained of God.
That would be everything!
---TheSeg on 3/23/12


This are people who had already believed, but were still sinning...Read the rest of the context. ---Mark_V. on 3/23/12

ok. Jonah 1:2 "Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and call out against it, for their evil has come up before me." [There is no mention of the Ninevites being believers only evil.]...Jonah 3:4 Jonah...called out, "...!"
Jonah 3:5 And the people of Nineveh believed God.

they were not "believers". they believed what they were told. you should try truthful context.
---aka on 3/23/12


"So before you can receive the Holy Spirit you must ask god."---TheSeg

Confirmed in scripture in
Luke 11:13

If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?

We do not belong to Christ before we receive the Holy Spirit (Romans 8:9).

The blood of Christ made it possible for us to come boldly to the throne of grace to obtain mercy and grace in our time of need (Heb 4:16) When we do that we receive the Spirit of Christ and our stony heart is changed into a heart of flesh (Eze 36:26)(Eph 1:13)
---Blogger9680 on 3/23/12


It seems to me that Calvinism is a rather lazy version Christianity. One that also blasphemes the loving nature of our Creator.

-You dont have to do anything to get saved
-Whether or not you stay repentant has no effect on your salvation
-You can blame God for all your failures
-You can ease the guilt of not leading someone to Christ by believing thats where God wanted them to go anyway

Its the sit-back-and-let-everyone-else-be-the-hands-and-feet-of-Christ-and-save the-world version of "Christianity". I'm sorry but that doesnt remind me of Jesus Christ at all. He sacrificed his life. He was a servant. He wasnt a snob.
---LindaH on 3/23/12


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MarkV, that has to be the greatest contradiction you have made so far.

FIRST you say to those who believe...there is no more condemnation...you also say those in the OT were also IN CHRIST. ...somethign about everyone from day one being under a covenant of Grace. So now GRACE warns believers of being destroyed....and CITIES not individuals as well?
So now explain to us WHY they were under condemnation as believers but YOU as a sinning believer are never under condemnation...
---kathr4453 on 3/23/12


"So the people of Nineveh believed God, proclaimed a fast" This are people who had already believed, but were still sinning.
Only those with the truth admit their rebellion against God. When people turn from their evil ways, God takes away the condemnation they were in, so they don't perish. Read the rest of the context.
---Mark_V. on 3/23/12


Nineveh were not already believers. These were humans God placed ""a conscience"" in who believed the Reports and God of Israel....Word had passed from the STORM experience Jonah was involved in, that Israel's God was a God who had POWER to destroy!
---kathr4453 on 3/23/12


Aka, thanks for answering and not throwing stones. You gave (Johah 3:7-10) implying that unbelievers who sin can hear the Lord, but you forgot to put (v.5) Which states,
"So the people of Nineveh believed God, proclaimed a fast" This are people who had already believed, but were still sinning.
Only those with the truth admit their rebellion against God. When people turn from their evil ways, God takes away the condemnation they were in, so they don't perish. Read the rest of the context.
---Mark_V. on 3/23/12


Eloy, is the Holy Spirit God?
So before you can receive the Holy Spirit you must ask god.
Someone who cannot hear you and you cannot believe in, without it.

Never can it be said that a man loved God first.
And if not for God, no man would even know God.
So how is it we must!
Ask for his forgiveness, to seek his mercy and to be saved?

How is it, a man can ask, someone he does not believe in, for something he does not believe?

When you ask God to come in to your life, what make you think he was not there already?
Tell me the truth, did you go to God or did God come to you?
The truth!
---TheSeg on 3/22/12


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MarkV, in the question Sin And Our Standing, you said, "...(1 John 1:8) only those with the Truth admit sin....//

those who teach are teachers, those who audit are auditors, and, those who make pots are potters. Therefore, those who sin, saved or unsaved, are sinners. If God does not hear sinners in any form or fashion, then He does not even hear his own.

but, enough human logic, you asked for scripture: Jonah 3:7-10 ... and let [sinners of Ninevah] call out mightily to God. Let everyone turn from his evil way...Who knows? God may turn...and turn from his fierce anger, so that we may not perish." When God saw what they did, ...God relented of the disaster that he had said...and he did not do it.

(edit do to 125)
---aka on 3/22/12


If the sinner is coming to God to repent, to apologize, to ask for his forgiveness, to seek his mercy and to be saved, then YES: but if the sinner is calling up to God to feed their sin, and to have their sin overlooked, to get blessed without repenting, then NO.
---Eloy on 3/21/12


Yes, everything is determined beforehand. There's a causal chain going back to day one of creation. Interesting how God determined that at this time people here should be at odds with each other, e.g. Cluny and Eloy.
---Pat.pat on 3/21/12


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