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Will Israel Get Saved

I have a problem understanding whether all of Israel will one day be saved or not. What do you understand concerning Israel?

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 ---Sarah_M. on 4/5/12
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SarahH, there will be a time of 7 years called the great Tribulation. No it is not something we can spiritualize away. It is a literal FACT. Just read Zechariah 12-14 and tell me WHEN the Glorified RISEN Christ came back in the OT before He ever died rose again and was Glorified???

Zechariah 12-14 is a LITERAL time when ISRAEL will be saved...NOT ALL JEWS, which many people think that is what is being said. The NATION of Israel with about 1/3 of remaining Jews who come throught the tribulation will enter a literal 1000 year reign with the KING, GLORIFIED will sit on HIS throne. We His Church will return with Christ to reign and rule with Christ at that time.
---kathr4453 on 4/14/12


Christan, consider this.

While Christ was in the flesh (1 Titus 3:16) the Father (God) sent the Spirit (God) to draw men to him making Christs words valid (John 6:44).

Now that Christ has ascended and is once again restored to his previous glory as fully God (John 17:5) He now sends us the Holy Spirit (John 16:7-15) because all that the Father has is now his again (John 16:15) and that Holy Spirit is convicting the whole world of unbelief (John 16:9). Jesus just as He said is "drawing all men to himself" (John 12:32).

See how your way is not the ONLY way to interpret scripture? This also does not contradict other scripture and it in no way strips Jesus Christ of his deity.
---Blogger9680 on 4/14/12


Look at Adam, created sinless and yet was in "unbelief" of God's command to him. We who came after Adam, inherited from his loins the bondage of "unbelief", aka SIN. Is it humanly possible to remove this from within? "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
---christan on 4/13/12

true and no.

but, we cannot 'unbelieve' a direct command that we have definitely heard. we can disobey and rebel from commands.

we can 'not believe' the result. we can also believe something else.

the result from there depends on the gospel we accept given God's will as opposed to all other falsehoods. 2Co_11:4
---aka on 4/14/12


Quoting John 6:45-47 without even giving reverence to v37-39,44 is completely deceiving. Regardless of how one try spinning the 'free-will' machine, it will always end up sputtering and ultimately break down.

No Christian will deny what the Spirit of God will do when they are called, especially what Christ declared in 45-47. But here's the Truth that you completely choose to leave out of those verses of who God will teach. Sadly for you, "every man" mentioned by Christ refers to, "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me", verse 37. And not the whole world and humanity.

For if God taught "every man", then they will all die a Christian and go to heaven and no one will go to hell.
---christan on 4/14/12


Christan, what does the word "departing" mean?
---CraigA on 4/13/12

Christan?
---CraigA on 4/14/12




When believers give a passage it is the duty of the one who gives it to explain to whom the passage is speaking of, so that they don't change the meaning of the passage, The passage given,
"it is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught by God...." (John 6:45) Who are those who will be taught of God? No answer is given to make it look like everyone in the world. The passage before (v.44) tells us who "they" are,
"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him and I will raise him up at the last day" Those whom the Father draws are the "They" who are taught by God. It is dishonest to take a part of a passage and exclude who God was speaking of.
---Mark_V. on 4/14/12


Look at Adam, created sinless and yet was in "unbelief" of God's command to him. We who came after Adam, inherited from his loins the bondage of "unbelief", aka SIN. Is it humanly possible to remove this from within? "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
---christan on 4/13/12

Where does scripture teach Adam was in UNBELIEF of God's command?

EVE was deceived, and ADAM willfully with knowledge knew what he was doing. Adam CHOSE to die with Eve out of his own free will and LOVE FOR HER, not out of NO FAITH...the way Christ CHOSE TO die for Us out of His own free will.

Adam too is a TYPE of Christ who laid down his own live for his bride!
---kathr4453 on 4/14/12


John 6:45_47 "It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me."
Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life."

Heard:
John 17:20 "Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word,"
Romans 10:14 "How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?"

Luke 8:11, Luke 8:11, Luke 8:11.
---Nana on 4/13/12


"betray, departing, disobedience, unbelief", these are the credentials of man. Greatest of all is "unbelief" which is defined as, when Jesus clearly declares that going to Him is but His Father's will, "that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father." But horde of 'free-willers' insist it isn't so, calling God a liar.

Look at Adam, created sinless and yet was in "unbelief" of God's command to him. We who came after Adam, inherited from his loins the bondage of "unbelief", aka SIN. Is it humanly possible to remove this from within? "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
---christan on 4/13/12


Sarah M, many understand Armageddon as a physical war to be fought out, which is untrue. That already happened in the OT which was pointing to the present day of "spiritual warfare". You are witnessing God's work in the weeding out of the wheat and tares. Blessed are you, for you see. The writer of Hebrews says it best in chapter 4:12,13

"For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight: but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of Him with whom we have to do."
---christan on 4/13/12




Christan, what does the word "departing" mean?
---CraigA on 4/13/12


CHRISTAN, you conpliment yourself through SarahH. Sorry your poor grammar gave you away..AGAIN!

Christan you calvinists represent those who today WALK away, just as those who did in John 6. They walkied away when Jesus said EAT MY FLESH AND DRINK MY BLOOD!

meaning, I am cricified with Christ. You all deny salvation THROUGH the Cross. and they denied salvation THROUGH CALVARY, through Jesus death and resurrection. They wanted a feel good, Fun loving KING because they believed themselves already God's elect!
---kathr4453 on 4/13/12


betray

TRANSITIVE VERB:
betrayed, betraying, betrays

To give aid or information to an enemy of, commit treason against: "betray one's country."
To deliver into the hands of an enemy in violation of a trust or allegiance: "betrayed Christ to the Romans."

John 6:71 "He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should "betray" him, "being one" of the twelve.

Matthew 24:12 "And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold."
This last verse says "love". It does not say 'false love', 'pretend love' or enchiladas.

Matthew 24:13
John 6:27
---Nana on 4/13/12


Christan, I am so happy for your help. It really looks to me that when you explain the will of God, it brings a lot of hate from so many, as if they are on line so that nobody finds out about God. Do you know what I mean? Like forces of evil are working against the teachings of God. I never seen that before.
---Sarah_M. on 4/13/12


The champion of one verse doctrine strikes again. John 6:66, "From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with Him." Obviously these were "false disciples" John speaks about. And the reason they walked nor more with Christ is found in the verse prior to 66.

65 "And He said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father." And back track to verse 44, "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day."

Simply, they were never drawn by the Father. God knows how to weed out the tares from the wheat. Afterall, He made them!
---christan on 4/13/12


Isnt it amazing that the topic of John 6:66 is falling away?
---CraigA on 4/13/12


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WOW! I answer Sarah_M a question she asked and suddenly the whole load of garbage comes pouring out from the 'free-will' trucks.

Let's start with truck no.1 called CraigA. The "evil heart of unbelief" in Hebrews 3 refers to those who say they have the 'free-will' to go to Christ even though Christ says it's impossible and unless the Father draws them. There's nothing more evil than denying and calling Christ a liar, which your "evil heart" does naturally.

As usual, quoting Scriptures with no understanding is your specialty.
---christan on 4/13/12


On to truck no.2, Ruben. "an evil heart of unbelief" is when one says, "Agree 100% God's work, but we have to respond to his free gift of eternal life!" How can it be God's work 100% if God is dependent on the sinner to response? Then it becomes man's work 100% instead of God's. See the darkness behind your understanding of your false confession?

Your understanding of Matthew 19:17 is prove your heart is still unregenerated, that's because you're still seeking to establish your own righteousness. What is it Paul said in Romans 10:4 you cannot belief? "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."
---christan on 4/13/12


Sarah, Paul followed the guotes of the children Isaac and Esau, loving one over the other, that the purpose of God according to election might stand. To those who objected, "Is there unrighteousness with God?" He then says, "You will say to me then, "why do you find fault?". The objection is: How can God blame anyone for sin and unbelief when He has sovereignly determined that persons destiny? Many here have the same question. He answers "O man, who are to to reply against God" He then gives the anology of the Potter making two kinds of vessels from the same lump. Paul argues it is as inrrational, and far more arrogant, for men to question God's choice of certain sinners for salvation.
---Mark_V. on 4/13/12


To many is Israel represents the Jews only.
Paul explains:
Romans 9:6 ...For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
Spiritual Israel is made up of Jews and Gentiles.
The objects of God's love are the seed of Abraham just as Israel was the seed of Abraham (within his lineage).
Rom 4:16 ...to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed, not to that only which is of the law (Jews), but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham (Gentiles), who is the father of us all.
Conclusion:
Ro11:26 And so all Israel (made up of Jews and Gentiles) shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion (Heaven) the Deliverer (Jesus Christ), and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob (God's beloved - Rom 9:13):
---trey on 4/13/12


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John 6:66_67 "From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.
Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away?"
---Nana on 4/12/12


Whereas I believe, "Faithful is He that calleth you, who also will do it." You see, salvation is 100% God's work.
---christan on 4/11/12

Agree 100% God's work, but we have to respond to his free gift of eternal life!

"But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments." ( MT 19:17)

"If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered,"( Jhn 15:6-7)


Yes Christian -"and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand."

But we can walk away- IF
---Ruben on 4/12/12


Christian* God only loved Peter and never Judas, though both are sinners.

Not so, love both!

"He who ate my bread has lifted his heel against me."( Jhn 13:18)

"Even my close friend in whom I trusted,
who ate my bread, has lifted his heel against me." ( Pslam 41:9)


Christian* His repentance is evidence of salvation.

Yes I agree, But you can choose to deny him, even after being told you will:

"Jesus said to him, Truly, I tell you, this very night, before the rooster crows, you will deny me three times.( Mt 26:34)

"Right away a rooster crowed. Then Peter remembered what Jesus had said." ( Mt 26:75)
---Ruben on 4/12/12


christan* Obviously you do not believe in the promises of Christ and the Father when you say "But we can walk out of his hand." That's why 'free-willers' like you do not depend on God for salvation but yourselves only. That's why you end up saying things like you say above.

That scripture verse that you love to quote, does not say once in his hand you can not walk away. I give you a scripture verse that shows that you can be in his hand and ask out and he will allow you to walk away.BTW which you did not deal with (Luke 15=Podigal Son)
---Ruben on 4/12/12


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christan* Peter's denial of Christ was to simply demonstrate God's grace that was on him.

Peter must had miss that memo:

"Peter answered him, Though they all fall away because of you, I will never fall away. (Mt 26:33)

christan* "As it is written, Jacob have I loved and Esau have I hated"?

"See to it that no one is godless like Esau" ( Heb 12:16)- Warning to Christians!

Besides James 1:13-14 tell us:

"When you are tempted, you shouldn't say, "God is tempting me." God can't be tempted by evil. And he doesn't tempt anyone.

" But your own evil longings tempt you But your own evil longings tempt you. They lead you on and drag you away"
---Ruben on 4/12/12


Christan, you're my hero! Jesus who?
---Sarah_M. on 4/12/12


Christan,

Hebrews 3

Take heed, brethren (who are the brethren?), lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in DEPARTING (draw away,refrain,leave) from the living God.

But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day, lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.

For we are made partakers of Christ,IF we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end
---CraigA on 4/12/12


Sarah_M, you asked "Do you believe two groups are going into heaven?" Honestly, according to the Scriptures, there's no such a thing as "two groups going to heaven".

What is true is God did create only "two kinds of vessels", according to Paul in Romans 9. One, a vessel of honor whom He demonstrates His love in electing them unconditionally and the other a vessel of dishonor, whom He has rejected also unconditionally. And He brought forth the lives of twins in Jacob and Esau to make His point of Sovereign Election very clear.

So, only those whom He loved from eternity will be going to heaven by His sheer grace, period.
---christan on 4/12/12


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Brother Christan, I really appricate the passages you provide all the time, and the explanations you give. They really bring the light of truth so clear, it is almost impossible to miss. Do you believe two groups are going into heaven? Israelites and the Church being the two different groups? Or just one group, the Church?
---Sarah_M. on 4/12/12


"But we can walk out of his hand." Ruben

worded a little differently, until there is fruition, we can die spiritually speaking. parable of the sower.

jesus said to the 12 tribes that they must be 'born again'. so, let's keep the comparison to "birthing".

are we born when we are conceived or when we are fully delivered?

selah.
---aka on 4/11/12


"But we can walk out of his hand." Ruben

Really? Even after Christ, who's God declares, "and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, IS GREATER THAN ALL, and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand."

Obviously you do not believe in the promises of Christ and the Father when you say "But we can walk out of his hand." That's why 'free-willers' like you do not depend on God for salvation but yourselves only. That's why you end up saying things like you say above.

Whereas I believe, "Faithful is He that calleth you, who also will do it." You see, salvation is 100% God's work.
---christan on 4/11/12


Ruben, again and again your foolishness doesn't surprise me one iota. Peter's denial of Christ was to simply demonstrate God's grace that was on him. Judas denied Christ once and is in eternal fire. Now do you see what it means when God declared, "As it is written, Jacob have I loved and Esau have I hated"? God only loved Peter and never Judas, though both are sinners.

Peter was not converted after His denial, shame on you! His repentance is evidence of salvation. After all, he confessed in Matthew 16 "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God." No unconverted soul will ever say such words. That was ten chapters prior to 26.
---christan on 4/11/12


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"And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand."

---christan on 4/11/12

But we can walk out of his hand.

Luke 15:2 "Father(God), give me my share of the estate."

" So he divided his property between them"

The Father will let you leave his hand!

Luke 15:28 "The older brother became angry and refused to go in. So his Father(God) went out and pleaded with him"

You can be in his hand and still show some resentment.
---Ruben on 4/11/12


//You oppose the will of God,//
The Bible says if we don.t understand Gods will we are unwise. Eph. 5:17

Eph. 1:9 Having made known unto us the mystery of HIS WILL...

Gods will is in Jesus Christ,
1 Tim. 2:4 Who(GOD) WILL have ALL men to be saved..

If you have trusted the gospel(1Cor 15:1-4) you have done half of Gods will. The other half includes study, prayer, and fellowship! (2 Tim 2:15)

2 Cor. 5:15 And that he died for ALL, that they which live should not henceforth live unto themselves, but unto him which died for them, and rose again.
Maybe God is telling us about the way we seek his will:
Phil 2:21 For all seek their own, not the things which are Jesus Christs.
---michael_e on 4/11/12


christan* Ruben, there's no wriggling out of anything.

Yea you did!

Ok,in Matthew 26:33-34 we read where Jesus tells Peter he will deny Jesus three times but Jesus prayed that Peter would have the grace to repent afterwards and be converted( LK 22:31-32). This is very clear example on losing Salvation and gaining your life again, because denying Jesus is the worst sin a person can commit ."but whoever denies me before men, I also will deny before my Father who is in heaven."(Mt 10:33) But wait a minute it must had been another Peter :)
---Ruben on 4/11/12


Michael e, you did not have to use the words "free will" You oppose the will of God, and there is only one other will, man's.
Not all Israel will be saved. Only those who are called, from the promise Seed. The name Israel not only belonged to the one victorious man, Jacob, but also to his descendants, who became Israel. The same principle is revealed in the New Testament. Right after calling Jesus the "Seed" paul told his Gentile converts, "And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed: (Gal. 3:29). Thus the New Testament, the name Israel not only applies to the one Victorious Man, the True Seed, Jesus Christ, but also to those who belong to Christ. True Christians are part of God's Spiritual Israel.
---Mark_V. on 4/11/12


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Ruben, there's no wriggling out of anything. Do you really think that there's only one Saul or one Demas in the Holy Bible? Is the Herod mentioned in Matthew 2:1 the same as the Herod in Matthew 14:3 or Acts 12:1?

How shallow and foolish your mind works, always assuming. And all in the name of justifying that you have a "free-will". What is it you do not belief about eternal security that Christ declared,

"And I give unto them eternal life, and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all, and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand."

Demas in Timothy obviously was not given to Christ by the Father, period.
---christan on 4/11/12


Try reading again
Acts 9:20And straightway he preached Christ in the SYNAGOGUES, ...
I wonder how many gentiles were in these synagogues?
//n Acts 28, he was already bound in prison making a plea to Ceasar and only did He realise that his mission was to the Gentiles//
Like I said he went to the Jew first as you just said.
---michael_e on 4/10/12


Nice but not good enough.

---christan on 4/10/12

Christan,

We read in Colossians 4:14

"Luke the beloved physician greets you, as does Demas ."

Also, in Philemon 1:24

"and so do Mark, Aristarchus, Demas Demas, and Luke, my fellow workers ."

But then Paul writes in 2 Timothy 4:10

" For Demas , in love with this present world, has deserted me , , and gone to Thessalonica. "

Lets see how you wiggle out of this!




---Ruben on 4/10/12


Mark, again, Where did I use the words free will?
Where did I say All Israel will be saved, although that is Biblical?
//All through history Jews died rejecting God.//
You mean they had a choice?
Where were the gentiles?
---michael_e on 4/10/12


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michael_e, blindly you quote verses from the Scriptures without even reading the whole context of it, just so you can show either the word Israel or Jews in the verses to make a point that has holes in them.

In Acts 9:15, Paul's mission was clear from the get go, starting with "the Gentiles, kings and the children of Israel. Guess what, it was the Jews who threw him in prison, not the Gentiles.

In Acts 28, he was already bound in prison making a plea to Ceasar and only did He realise that his mission was to the Gentiles (verse 28). How can anyone resist God's will?
---christan on 4/10/12


//God's will for Paul from eternity was to preach to the gentiles//
He first went to Israel
Acts 9:15 But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of ISRAEL:
20And straightway he preached Christ in the SYNAGOGUES, ...

Acts 28: 20For this cause therefore have I called for you, to see you, and to speak with you: because that for the hope of Israel...
24And some believed the things which were spoken, and some believed not.
28Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles, and that they will hear it. 29And when he had said these words, the Jews departed,...

---michael_e on 4/10/12


"Hymenaeus and Philetus are two of those teachers. They have wandered away from the truth." Two of his 'elect' had wander away!" Ruben

Did Scripture specifically say that "Hymenaeus and Philetus" were elects? So just because Paul says "they have wandered away" you ASSUME they were elect to justify 'free-will'? Nice but not good enough.

"And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice. I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine."

Of course they wandered away, they were not Christ's sheep to begin with, only pretending to be His sheep. Like false christians.
---christan on 4/10/12


Sarah, After Jesus healed some people He "warned them not to make Him known, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet, saying, " Behold My Servant, whom I have chosen, My Beloved in whom My soul is well pleased. I will put My Spirit upon Him, and He will declare justice to the Gentiles...." (Matthew 12:16-20). Matthew is quoting Isaiah 42:1-3. Which, in its original context, referred to God's "servant which was Israel..My Servant" (Isaiah 41:8). Again under the inspiration from the Holy Spirit Matthew said (Isaiah 42:1-3) was being 'fulfilled" by God's Servant, Jesus Christ. Everything spoken of Israel is fulfilled by His Servant Jesus Christ. Matt. 2:14 was fulfilling Hosea 11:1.
---Mark_V. on 4/10/12


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"When our Apostle Paul is called out he deals with Israel until they deny him as they did their messiah" michael_e

DEAD WRONG AGAIN!

"For He that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles" Galatians 2:8

God's will for Paul from eternity was to preach to the Gentiles. You will notice that from his epistles titles. That was his ministry from God. And because was raised a Pharisee, he had the knowledge of the law at the back of his hands and he used the nation of Israel as examples to reveal the concealment of God's will and purposes. That's why we have the epistles.
---christan on 4/9/12


//willie_c & michael_e, do you really think that the Word of God speaks only specifically to Israel and no one outside of Israel?//
No, but the OT, Matt-Jn and early Acts is mainly to the nation Of Israel.

When our Apostle Paul is called out he deals with Israel until they deny him as they did their messiah, then he goes to us(gentiles) with the gospel of the grace of God(1Cor 15:1-4)
---michael_e on 4/9/12


Mark, Where did I use the words free will?
Where did I say All Israel will be saved, although that is Biblical?
//All through history Jews died rejecting God.//
You mean they had a choice?
Where were the gentiles?
---michael_e on 4/9/12


J. U S A
You prob even think the devil will be saved also. For he believes in God.
---Lawrence on 4/9/12


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willie_c & michael_e, do you really think that the Word of God speaks only specifically to Israel and no one outside of Israel? Because that's what you are really saying with your blogs. And if you are both right, which most definitely you're not at all, anyone who's not a Jew shouldn't even bother reading the Holy Bible, since it doesn't have any reference to us as we are not Jews.

Here's why the both of you are DEAD WRONG! This was Christ's words to His disciples before He ascended to be with the Father, "Go therefore and make disciples of ALL THE NATIONS", He didn't say "stay where you are and make disciples of Israel", did He?
---christan on 4/9/12


christan* 1 Timothy 2:4, however if you bother to continue reading Paul's epistle in Timothy, you will come across this verse:

"Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are His. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." 2 Timothy 2:19

And if you had read the verse before it reads " Hymenaeus and Philetus are two of those teachers. They have wandered away from the truth."

Two of his 'elect' had wander away! Also the verse you use says "every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity":)
---Ruben on 4/9/12


Michael e, I believe it because God said it. If what I say and write down was not in the Bible I would not write it down and give you the passages which are very clear that God does the calling. What you say and write most of the time is not in the Bible but you believe it, like "Free will". That is you trying to reconcile Scripture by adding something to the Truth.
All of Israel will never be saved. All through history Jews died rejecting God. None will be saved without Christ. Even today many still reject Him and will die rejecting Him, they too will not be saved. The same holds true for any individual from every country. They die without Christ they are not saved. Only one Way to heaven, through Christ.
---Mark_V. on 4/9/12


//Sarah, as you can see Mark, believes Christ died for some, but not all.

There are and has been many who will never hear the Gospel and it is God who has sent it where He wished. So not all will be or can be saved, only those who are destined to respond to the gift of salvation.

It is really not a matter of what we WANT TO BELIEVE, but what the Word of God says. And that is why Kathyrn has her problem, she challenges the sovereignity of God that He can do whatever He wishes with His creation.
---lee1538 on 4/9/12


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Sarah, as you can see Mark, believes Christ died for some, but not all. That He picks and chooses who can believe in Him. Use your own mind.
---michael_e on 4/9/12


Sarah, willi is correct, there is many idea's but only one Truth. As I already told Michael, I will post again,
"God has to give them eyes to see, ears to hear and a heart that perceives the truth, are they remain lost. You gave (Deut. 30:19) to proof free will, and it is not mentioned anywhere. But go to the chapter before (Deut. 29:2-5)
(v.4) "Yet the Lord has not given you a heart to perceive and eyes to see and ears to hear, to this very day"
How can the free will of man help him choose the Lord if God has not given them a heart to perceive, and eyes to see and ears to hear the gospel Truth?
No amount of "free will" can make you see, hear or perceive the Truth."
---Mark_V. on 4/9/12


Hi, Sarah (c: As you can see below, there are different ideas about this. Understanding includes understanding > "Pursue peace with all people, and holiness, without which no one will see the Lord:" (Hebrews 12:14) And, "'Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.'" (Matthew 11:28-29) This is included in our choice of salvation. God bless you, too (c:
---willie_c: on 4/8/12


Study Romans 9, 10 and 11 and you'll get a good idea of Israel's past, present and future.
---michael_e on 4/8/12


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Sarah, don't worry so much. Remember, only those who have faith in the Lords works, will be saved. No matter from where they are from. Here is just one of so many simple passages that really speaks against John usa's Universal salvation, and those who believe they have free will,
"The preaching of the Cross is to them that perish foolishness, but unto us which are saved it is the power of God"
Read it a couple of times. Those that are perishing "the lost" "the condemned already," when they hear the preaching of the cross, to them it is foolishness. They will never believe it. The one's who believe the preaching of the Cross, are those who are saved by the grace of God, for God has given them faith.
---Mark_V. on 4/8/12


Jesus was talking to Jews of the nation of Israel, when He said, "you will die in your sins," in John 8:24. And He said that after the rich man did not help Lazarus, the rich man was conscious in hell, and ones with faithful Abraham could not go to help the rich man. Luke 16:19-31. And if anyone worships and receives the mark of the beast, "He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb." (in Revelation 14:10) < this does not sound very saved to me . . . or unconscious. And without holiness "no one will see the Lord" (in Hebrews 12:14).

To me, Romans 2:28-29 means the Israel to be saved is anyone who has obeyed Jesus (Galatians 3:28-29).
---willie_c: on 4/8/12


"what you are telling me is that Paul has contradicted himself. Interesting." John.usa

My, you are so full of it, aren't you, saying what you have said about Paul contradicting himself? No, no, no, far be from it. Scriptures NEVER contradict Scriptures at all. Which means Paul doesn't contradict himself.

It's Scripture that contradicts your understanding of the Word, period. And yes, very, very interesting indeed how you came to your understanding, even when Scripture is complete.
---christan on 4/7/12


Salvation is an individual choice. Not all Israelis accept God, just as not all Americans accept Christ. In Israel, just as in America or any other nation, you will have individuals that are saved, and you will also have individuals that are condemned. Do all Israelis serving God? No.
---Eloy on 4/6/12
END OF DISCUSION!!!!!
---francis on 4/7/12


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Christian, what you are telling me is that Paul has contradicted himself. Interesting.
---John.usa on 4/7/12


"What do you understand concerning Israel?"
"Israel shall be saved by the LORD With an everlasting salvation, You shall not be ashamed or disgraced Forever and ever." Isa 45:17 "All Israel will be saved,* as it is written: "The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob, Rom 11:26
However "they are not all Israel who are of Israel, For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel, That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as the seed."Rom 9:6
---Josef on 4/6/12


John.usa, great of you to use 1 Timothy 2:4, however if you bother to continue reading Paul's epistle in Timothy, you will come across this verse:

"Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are His. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity." 2 Timothy 2:19

How does "God knoweth them that are His"? By looking into His crystal ball? NO! He elected them! Btw,does your "everyone" call on the name of Christ? I hope your answer isn't a yes. See how erroneous your understanding is of Scriptures? Scripture MUST confirm Scripture.
---christan on 4/6/12


God doesn't want anyone to perish, but most people will not follow the Christ. It is evident that in today's world, love has almost evaporated from the face of the Earth. Sure, the word of God will be preached among all nations, but few will follow. Even today, there is a great falling away from the faith.

Rest assured that God is very merciful. There will be two resurrections: one, at Christ's second return when the dead in Christ shall rise and the living shall be caught up and, two, at the end of the 1,000 reign of Christ when all the other dead shall rise and be judged form the book of life - according to their work.
---Steveng on 4/6/12


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Christian, 1 Timothy 2:4 should answer your question. God wills everyone's salvation, so rejoice in that!
---John.usa on 4/6/12


Salvation is an individual choice. Not all Israelis accept God, just as not all Americans accept Christ. In Israel, just as in America or any other nation, you will have individuals that are saved, and you will also have individuals that are condemned. Do all Israelis serving God? No.
---Eloy on 4/6/12


No every jew / hebrew will be saved.

But all of them who are saved, will be saved in this manner: Romans 11:26 : as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Romans 9:6 For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel:
---francis on 4/6/12


"The Bible says that God wills everybody to be saved." John.usa

Please, do show us this verse that it says it the way you did. If "God wills everybody", no one should be in Hades, right? Is Pharaoh, those who perished in the flood, Judas, Pilate, Esau in heaven?

"Jesus said he would draw everybody to himself."

Did He? Christ did say, "All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day."

You sure the Father gave "everybody" to His Son as you claim? Scriptures says otherwise.
---christan on 4/6/12


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Throughout the OT it says a remanent of Israel will be saved. In the OT context it was those in exile but in NT context it is those that follow Christ.
---Scott1 on 4/6/12


The Bible says that God wills everybody to be saved.

I completely agree but not everyone will be saved because some will choose not to be. Wide is the road to destruction.
---Scott1 on 4/6/12


SarahM, this is Paul's prophesy,

"For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits, that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob."
Romans 11:25,26

A time in God's plan and purpose will come when the last Gentile elected by God will be called. After that, a great multitude of Jews will God turn His mercy on for salvation, but only to the elect according to God's purpose and will.
---christan on 4/5/12


Sure, I will elaborate. The Bible says that God wills everybody to be saved. Jesus said he would draw everybody to himself. Paul says that God will be all in all, and is reconciling the world to himself. God bless you.
---John.usa on 4/5/12


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"Yes, Israel will be saved because eventually everyone will be saved." John.usa

Would you like to kindly elaborate "everyone will be saved" in the proper context of salvation according to the Scriptures? It seems when the word "everyone" is used, it becomes a little wishy-washy. That's because there's some who even call themselves Christian, believe those who do not even belief in Christ will be saved. That's why I would like you to elaborate "everyone will be saved".
---christan on 4/5/12


Yes, Israel will be saved because eventually everyone will be saved.
---John.usa on 4/5/12


There is some Jewish people being saved today according to Acts 2 v 38. Aft the door closes to us gentiles, God Will return back to His First chosen. There will be 144 thousand that Will be saved. And it Will be according to The Salvation of God Acts 2 v 38, God gave to Apostle Peter to be delivered to the Jewish people First on the day of Pentecost, The Very Same as The Early Church. There is No other Salvation of God outside from Acts 2 v 38.
---Lawrence on 4/5/12


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