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It Is Finished Meaning

According to what is written in John 19:30, Jesus said "IT IS FINISHED". As an individual, what does this mean to you?

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 ---Rob on 4/25/12
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I ISSUE A CHALLENGE

Read Ellen G Ghite steps to Christ online

Gaurantee that it will change your life and walk with Jesus
---francis on 5/2/12


\\This gaurantes us that Jesus would speak through his prophets in the last days\\

And the fruit of EGW's failed prophecies and plagairism, to say nothing about her false doctrine, proves that God never spoke through her.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/2/12


Mark V - thank you for your respectful disagreement. I believe that the words spoken by Jesus Christ in John 3:5 were indeed literal. I believe that John baptized Jesus - the only man without sin - to give us the manner which it should be done. It's refreshing to have someone disagree in a way that isn't offensive - I appreciate that.

Haz - Faith and Repentance are principles...baptism and the laying on of hands for the gift of the Holy Ghost are ordinances. Again, I do not agree with your interpretation of the scriptures. 1 Corinthians 15:21,22 tells us that through Christ we will ALL be made alive. I see no way to interpret Rev 20:12 other than the what it says - that we will be judged according to our works.
---HappyLDS on 5/2/12


Acts 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

This gaurantes us that Jesus would speak through his prophets in the last days
---francis on 5/2/12


CraigA said: "Stop looking towards men or women for divine inspiration. Jesus is all we need."

AMEN !!

EGW has nothing good to offer.
---Haz27 on 5/2/12




Well you did not search very hard Rob. In fact please tell me honestly did you search at all?

I give you an easy one. EGW stated the Protestant churches would reach out to the restablised Roman Cathoic churches.

Now do not forget that in the early 20th century all protestant churches taught the Pope was the antichrist for murdering millions of Protestants.
---Samuel on 5/2/12


When Jesus came on the scene what did John the Baptists disciples do? They left John to follow Jesus. They didnt hang out with Jesus talking about how awesome John was and how we should all listen to his teachings.

Stop looking towards men or women for divine inspiration. Jesus is all we need.
---CraigA on 5/2/12


Yeah.... where do you come up with this idea that ALL of her prophecies have come true?
---Blogger9680 on 5/2/12


Francis, I searched for propecies of Ellen G. White, which came true, but I have not found any.

So what type of Prophet does this make Ellen G. White?
---Rob on 5/2/12


But the real God did not call EGW, ---Cluny on 5/2/12

Sure he did. You can tell by all her prophecies coming true.

You can tell by the life that she lived

You can tell by the spirit which was in her making her confess Jesus as messiah and teaching the law and the testimony of Jesus
---francis on 5/2/12




\\. The Bible closed. There is no more new revelation that is not already written in God's Word. ---Mark_V. on 5/2/12 \\

It could not have meant this, Mark-V, as the New Testament had not been written yet.

**The word of God is not limited to what is writen in the bible. God can and will at his please call another prophet
---francis on 5/2/12**

But the real God did not call EGW, as she was possessed by a walk-in spirit of divination when she was hit by a rock and was unconscious for 3 weeks--just like Edgar Cayce was hit by a baseball and was unconscious for 3 weeks.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/2/12


. The Bible closed. There is no more new revelation that is not already written in God's Word. ---Mark_V. on 5/2/12


Joel 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, [that] I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

Acts 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

The word of God is not limited to what is writen in the bible. God can and will at his please call another prophet
---francis on 5/2/12


Rob, the answer that Trey gave to me is correct in detail for "It is finished."
Also concerning prophets, not one of them can authenticate what they prophecy is coming from God, unless it is already written in the Word of God. If it is already written, then it is not prophecy. The Bible closed. There is no more new revelation that is not already written in God's Word. They can say it is coming from God, but can never authenticate it is from God. Talk is cheap, many prophets claim so many things, Charles Russell claimed to be a prophet, so did Muhammad, so did E.G.White and so did Eloy, and many more, they are all fake.
---Mark_V. on 5/2/12


I just think its silly that we turn to men (or women) to teach us when we have the Spirit of our God living in us.
---LindaH on 5/1/12
Joel 2:28 And it shall come to pass afterward, [that] I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh, and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

Acts 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

This is very biblical
---francis on 5/1/12


\\You cannot be against her for speaking the law and the testimony, and say she does not speak according to the bible.\\

But she did NOT speak the law and testimony, any more than she spoke according to the Bible!

EGW had a walk-in spirit of divination, and was a medium and peeped and muttered.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/1/12


I just think its silly that we turn to men (or women) to teach us when we have the Spirit of our God living in us.

If she is hailed as a prophet and has missed a few prophecies then she is obviously not a prophet of God (according to scripture). I just dont understand why we would waste the energy defending a false prophet when we have Jesus Christs words and his Spirit to live by.
---LindaH on 5/1/12


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--LindaH on 4/30/12
All I can ask, is that you take time to read all my post carefully.

If someone makes a post that I do not understand, i will ask for clearification.

It does help to read all of a persons post in a blog, that usually saves time and confusion

so I urge you to read all my post on ellen G white and prophecies
---francis on 5/1/12


This gift ( of prophecy) is a mark of God's true church:---francis on 4/30/12

That's why.

Are you claiming that EGW hasnt had a failed prophecy yet?
---LindaH on 4/30/12


"It is finished", I believe to mean that:
Heb9:12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
The key phrase here being "having obtained eternal redemption for us."

Rom4:25 Who was delivered for (because of) our offences, and was raised again for (because of)our justification.

In other words, when Christ cried out with a loud voice "It is finished!" he declared that he had finished the work of eternal redemption and his resurrection declared that his people are justified before God!

Praise be to God!!! Without Christ we would all suffer the wrath of God that is meaded out on the wicked.
---trey on 4/30/12


Francis, that I would have to DISagree with. Love is far more important than prophecy or the strength of a mans faith and IT alone defines Gods true church
---LindaH on 4/30/12

I do not recall saying otherwise, so I am not sure why you used my name.

You may have been better off posting your comment without my name since I said no such thing
---francis on 4/30/12


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I always thought of "it is finished" as Christ saying "I have finished all that you've asked of me" speaking to the Father.
---CraigA on 4/30/12


Francis, that I would have to DISagree with. Love is far more important than prophecy or the strength of a mans faith and IT alone defines Gods true church

(John 13:35)
By THIS shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another

(1 Cor 13:2)
And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing
---LindaH on 4/30/12


EGW does NOT speak according to the Bible, as I have demonstrated.
---Cluny on 4/30/12

You cannot have it both ways.
You cannot be against her for speaking the law and the testimony, and say she does not speak according to the bible.

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
---francis on 4/30/12


\\I urge everyone to use it with bible in hand
---francis on 4/30/12\\

I have.

EGW does NOT speak according to the Bible, as I have demonstrated.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 4/30/12


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---Rob on 4/30/12
everyone has access to ellen G white writings on ellen G white estate online

I urge everyone to use it with bible in hand
---francis on 4/30/12


HappyLDS: What are these "principles and ordinances of the gospel"?

Rom 11:6 says we're either under grace OR works (of the law). It CAN'T be both like you suggested.
Regarding Rev 20,12, note there are 2 different books.
Either we are judged by the law of righteousness (aka law of sin and death) OR our name is in the book of life.

The works we do to get into the book of life is described in John 6:29 "believe on the one He hath sent" (Jesus).
This is righteousness by faith.

BUT if your not in the book of life, then you'll be judged by the law of sin and death and found guilty of all of it.

It seems LDS are mixing grace and works of the law which contradicts scripture.
---Haz27 on 4/30/12


"It is finished.." (Jhn.19:30)

Rob, this is just how i understand it.

Even before Jesus Christ's coming, things were already written of him in the volume of the book (Heb.10:7) From his birth, to his death, and his resurrection. He came to do the will of the Father.

(Luk.24:44) "...all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me." All things written in the law of Moses, in the prophets, and psalms concerning our Lord Jesus Christ must be fulfilled.

So, in Jhn.19:30, when he said "it is finished", all things concerning him, all things which the Father asked Him to do, at that time, have been fulfilled.
---jonweckl on 4/30/12


LDS, I agree with you concerning sin. I disagree with Haz who claims believers do not sin.
I disagree with your interpretations of (John 3:5: 1 Peter 46).
In John, Jesus referred not to literal water, but to the need for "cleansing." (Ez. 36:24-27) When water is used figuratively in the O.T., it habitually refers to renewal or spiritual cleansing, especially when used in conjuntion with "Spirit."
And in (1 Peter 4:6) is not referring to preaching to the dead, "to those who are dead" Peter had in mind believers who had heard and accepted the gospel of Christ (was preached) when they were still alive, but who had died by the time Peter wrote this letter. Some had been martyred for their faith.
---Mark_V. on 4/30/12


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---Cluny on 4/29/12
Not a prophecy. But have you read the bible? God's call is more urgent today than every before. I will give you a few days to find it. Then I will shwo it to you
Hebrews 10:25 .. and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.


---LindaH on 4/29/12
It does not matter whether it is Ellen White or another person, or just the ability to understand peophecy. This gift ( of prophecy) is a mark of God's true church:
Revelation 1:2 testimony of Jesus Christ,
Revelation 1:9 the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Revelation 12:17 the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Revelation 19:10 the testimony of Jesus:.. the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.







---francis on 4/30/12


Francis, have you forgotten I do have access to EGW's writtens and have post book, volume and page numbers of some of the things she herself wrote and prophesied.
---Rob on 4/30/12


HappyLDS: Thanks for sharing on the LDS doctrine. It does however confirm that LDS mix grace and works of the law.
How do you reconcile this doctrine with the following scriptures?

Rom 11:6 "if by grace, then it is no more works...if it be of works then it is no more grace".

Gal 3:10,11 "as many as are under the works of the law are under the curse...no man is justified by the law in the sight of God"

Gal 5:4 "Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law, ye are fallen from grace".
---Haz27 on 4/30/12


---Cluny on 4/29/12
That one is MUCH too easy

In many of her writings, Ellen white spoke of " the work"/ The Gospel to all nations being done in their lifetime. If this was completed in that lifetime, then it is beieved that God would have come Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come

But the work is years behind. While men have slept, Satan has stolen a march upon us-- Ellen white

So this appears to be a conditional prophecy. Conditioned on Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations, and then shall the end come
---francis on 4/29/12


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Will this do, francis?

>>"In ancient times God spoke to men by the mouth of prophets and apostles. In these days He speaks to them by the testimonies of His Spirit. There was never a time when God instructed His people more earnestly than He instructs them now concerning His will and the course that He would have them pursue."-- Testimonies, vol. 4, pp. 147-148. (1876)<<

Here EGW claims that God instructs people more earnestly in her own ravings than in the pages of the Bible.

Is this not a false prophecy (in the sense of a reputed message from God)?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 4/29/12


I gotta ask... why do you need Ellen G Whites "prophecies" if we have the Spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ living IN us?

Is it more important to know of future events or to spend our time loving people the way Jesus did?

Upon his return, do we want Christ to find us bickering over our differences in doctrine or busy doing his work?
---LindaH on 4/29/12


Didn't E. G. White prophesy that the earth would end several times, and it's still here?
---StrongAxe on 4/29/12
You would have first to show that she did make those prophecies. Not that someone said or wrote that ellen white said.....
A first hand acount ( even from one of her own books) is what is needed.
agreed?
---francis on 4/29/12


Haz-
I'm sorry - I mentioned that we are to do our best to stop committing the sin did I not? I believe that the atonement Christ made for us will cover anyone with a sincere desire to repent. There are some commandments that are hard for some people to overcome and maybe not so hard for others. They may make a sincere effort to avoid that sin many times before it's conquered. I believe that a sincere heart will make the difference. I don't think these are the dead works spoken of. As far as grace vs. works - I believe we will all be resurrected (biblical) and that we will all be judged according to our works (also biblical). I don't believe that it's either/or ...the Bible says it's both. I've already posted the specific scriptures.
---HappyLDS on 4/29/12


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Haz -

I do want to clarify that I believe by grace all men are saved from the bonds of death. This is the free gift given to us by Jesus Christ. I also believe that where we spend eternity will be decided by our obedience to the principles and ordinances of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. I am curious as to how you can make the claim that our works mean nothing when the Bible clearly states otherwise? (Rev 20:12)
---HappyLDS on 4/29/12


\\Now it is up to you to prove that Ellen White was a false prophet\\

OK, francis. Here is a false prophecy of EGW from 1856:

I was shown the company present at the conference. Said the angel, Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.

How many who were at this conference are still alive?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 4/29/12


Francis, I notice you continue to avoid answering my question about what type of Prophet a person is.
---Rob on 4/29/12
Deuteronomy 18:22 When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that [is] the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, [but] the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.

Now it is up to you to prove that Ellen White was a false prophet

Do not tell me what other people say. You prove it.
---francis on 4/29/12


francis:

I agree about Matthew 12:36 and 2 Corinthians 5:10. But how about Deuteronomy 18:20-22:

"But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken?

When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him."

Didn't E. G. White prophesy that the earth would end several times, and it's still here?
---StrongAxe on 4/29/12


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HappyLDS: Your correct, it's not my position to judge you about transgressing the law of sin and death.

But then why do the LDS teach that being under this law is part of salvation? It's either grace OR works of the law, it CAN'T be both,Rom 11:6.

Also, to 'repent' means to turn away from the offence and stop doing it. But if your continually repenting for the same types of offences then you never really repented to start with.
However Heb 6:1, Heb 9:14 shows it's repentance from "DEAD WORKS". This is self-righteousness through works of the law, which is not submitting to the righteousness of God (Rom 10:3).

Christians are not under the law, Rom 8:2, Gal 5:18, 1Tim 1:9. Our righteousness is by faith, Gal 5:5.
---Haz27 on 4/29/12


\\So if someone else can point out ONE THING a prophet predicted that was not true, it doesn't matter if the prophet did evrything else right.
---StrongAxe on 4/29/12\\

I've pointed out several false prophecies by that medium and false prophet that peeped and muttered, EGW.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 4/29/12


"Every man's work passes in review before God...every wrong word, every selfish act, every unfulfilled duty, and every secret sin...
It's not much fun being an Adventist and being watched constantly by that recording angel with his "terrible exactness". Prepare to become very uptight.
--From what SDA won't tell you

BIBLE:
Matthew 12:36 every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

2 Corinthians 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men

STRONGAXE your thoughts
---francis on 4/29/12


francis:

Yes, I agree that quoting the Bible and saying "this is what the Bible says about XYZ - judge for yourself" is reasonable. However, one thing that is common among many groups is they will do ABC, DEF, and GHI, and say "The Bible says do ABC and DEF", and omit to say anything about GHI if it is not in accord with the Bible - i.e. propaganda.

On the other hand, the Bible gives specific direction about false prophets - i.e. anyone who makes a prophecy that is not true should not be followed. It has a "one strike and you're out" policy. So if someone else can point out ONE THING a prophet predicted that was not true, it doesn't matter if the prophet did evrything else right.
---StrongAxe on 4/29/12


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---Rob on 4/29/12
Is this what you read:

One of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and was manifested in the ministry of Ellen G. White. As the Lord's messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested.Fundamental Beliefs, 17

Why did you not quote it as it wa writen?
---francis on 4/29/12


Haz -
Repentance is done after any sin....part of repentance is to ask the Lord for forgiveness and to do our best not commit the sin again. We are not perfect and yes, we continue to commit sin. We do our best not to. As for your accusal of the LDS (and other Christian faiths) not keeping the right day holy - I don't know, I guess we'll see. Perhaps the day itself doesn't matter as much as how we honor it. As far as those who work on the Sabbath, I suppose that is between them and God - it certainly isn't your position to judge.
---HappyLDS on 4/29/12


Francis, I notice you continue to avoid answering my question about what type of Prophet a person is.

Don't you have access to EGW's writings. Are you saying what I shared is not found in her very own writings?

You wrote EGW did not become SDA until much later than William Millers FALSE PROPHECY. Why in the world would someone join a group who has a FALSE PROPHET, unless they are a FALSE PROPHET themselves, Romans 1:32.

Concerning the fundamental beliefs, #17. EDW's writings are authorative, and the Bible is the standard to be followed. EGW is the authority and GOD is the standard. This alone is contradictive and should through up a red flag.
---Rob on 4/29/12


---StrongAxe on 4/29/12

TRUE!!
Example, from " what SDA won't tell you:"
They won't tell you that they consider themselves to be the only, true, remnant Church.

Now have you ever gone to a church who did not believe that it was the true church of God?

If you are in a church that does not teach that it is the true church of God what are you doing there!!

The 27 funderment beliefs does not says " SDA church is the remnemt church"

It does what the bible does: It gives characterists of the remnant church which points to the SDA church as the true and remnant church of God:
Revelation 12:17 the remnant..which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ
---francis on 4/29/12


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They won't tell you that they consider themselves to be the only, true, remnant Church.
from ' What SDA wont tell you."

FROM Joe Crews: Search for the true church. available online, CHapter 9:

The only church fulfilling the prophetic description of the true remnant is the Seventh-day Adventist church.

So you can see that these people are just liars, and who can believe a liar?

so I agree with strongaxe:
I didn't say to TRUST third-party accounts THEMSELVES. Instead, their claims should be scrutinized and verified, which can often be easily done. ---StrongAxe on 4/29/12
---francis on 4/29/12


francis:

Remember, I didn't say to TRUST third-party accounts THEMSELVES. Instead, their claims should be scrutinized and verified, which can often be easily done. However, when multiple third-party accounts cite historical sources, such sources can often paint a broader and more accurate account (multiple witnesses) than having a single witness, which may be just as self-serving and just as much propaganda - but without other witnesses to show it for what it is.
---StrongAxe on 4/29/12


If you want to know what SDA teach and believe. Here are a few resources available online

Why make up lies when the SDA teaching are readily available?

1: 27 fundermental beliefs
2: Steps to christ
3: Amazing facts study guides
4: It is written study guides
5: SSNET
6: Uriah Smith Daniel and the Revelation
7: Ellen White estate
8: SDA church manual
---francis on 4/28/12


HappyLDS: You say repentance is of "sin". What "sin" do you refer to?

As you claim keeping the commandments is part of salvation, do Mormons still sometimes sin (transgression of the law, 1John3:4)?

We see LDS transgress the Sabbath commandment, as you yourself admitted to a change over to Sunday for Christians to differentiate themselves from Jews.
And regarding keeping this Sunday Sabbath holy, do LDS do any work on this day?
---Haz27 on 4/28/12


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---StrongAxe on 4/28/12
Third party account is propaganda. I gave several books which stated what SDA believe. If you go to the sight " what SDA wont tell you" and resd :27 fundermental beliefs, SDA church manual, STeps to christ, Uriah smith Daniel and revealtion, Amazing facts study guide, it is written study guides, you will see that SDA do tell you everything they believe. We (SDA) cannot be responsible for what people say we believe, when we infact do not believe it.


---Rob on 4/28/12
Christ coming back in 1844 is not a prophecy of Ellen White, that was william Miller,. Ellem white did not become a SDA until MUCH later

Please publish this from early writings. Be sure that this is not a false accusation.
---francis on 4/28/12


Rob:

One could plausibly claim that the Civil War WAS to preserve slavery. The north abolished it, but the south disagreed - hence, the war. If everyone had agreed to abolish slavery, there would have been no Civil War.

(Then again, I'm not saying this to defend EGW, whose prophetic record speaks for itself, as you point out. I'm just pointing out that one could plausibly claim this one point.)
---StrongAxe on 4/28/12


francis:

There is a reason going to third parties is often more illuminating that going to the source. If you ask someone about himself, he will tell you only the good and omit the bad. However, third parties who know the bad stuff have no self-interest in hiding it. Of course, one should not merely take a single person's word for it, but more often than not, such information can be independently corroborated and verified.
---StrongAxe on 4/28/12


Francis, many times I asked you if a person claims to be a Prophet of God, but their prophecy did not come to pass, what type of Prophet are they?

You wrote you are not aware of any Ellen White prophecies of Jesus return.

Here are a few from EGW's very own writings.

The world would end in 1843, 1844, 1845, then 1851, Early writings page 57.

When this prophecy failed, EGW blamed it on the SDA Church, select writings book 1, page 299.

At the 1856 General Conference held in Battle Creek, MI, EGW said some of the attendees would still be alive at Christ's second coming, Vol 1, Page 121.

At the very same conference EGW said the Civil War was not to abolish slavery, but to preserve it, Vol. 1, Pages 254, 258.
---Rob on 4/28/12


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Haz27 -

1.Repentance from sin.

2.Since God is both consistant and just - those who die without being baptized are given the opportunity through the living. Jesus told us that we CANNOT enter the kingdom of God without being baptized (John 3:5) We learn in the scriptures that the gospel is preached to the dead (I Peter 4:6). We also know that baptism for the dead was practiced by the early Christians (I Cor 15:29). Please note while reading this scripture that Paul does not tell the Corinthians they are wrong - he questions why they do it since they no longer believe in the resurrection. CONT.
---HappyLDS on 4/28/12


CONT TO Haz -
As LDS we are able to enter the waters of baptism on behalf of the dead. While we are baptized for them - they are given the freedom to accept or reject that baptism...the dead are not forced to become Mormon as our critics would have you believe.
As for the Sabbath - there are scriptures that seem to indicate that early Christians decided to differentiate themselves from the Jews. They made the first day of the week the Lords Day (because he was resurrected on Sunday). There are references to this in Acts as well as I Cor 16: 1-2 and Rev 1:10.
---HappyLDS on 4/28/12


NonChristians pretending that they are one of us, lie, saying, "My father Abraham was good and a friend of God, therefore I am too: My Father is a preacher, and Jesus is righteous, therefore I am too." That is a delusion. For God says, Abraham I know, and Jesus I know, but not you I know: for you blaspheme, and you bear no good fruit for me, says the Lord God. For Abraham it is finished, and Jesus finished: but you, you are far from the kingdom of God. Says the Lord, How will you o' sinner, how will you finish?
---Eloy on 4/27/12


---Rob on 4/27/12
1: Not aware of any Ellen white prophecies of Jesus return

2: Great Controvery is about the battle for the mind and hearts between Jesus and satan ( SEE the book of JOB and Revelation 12:4)

3: Great disappointment: prediction by William Miller that jesus would return 1843/44.

4: Investogatve judgment: Daniel 7:10 the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

4: Hebrews 1:1-5 jesus is not a created being, but is CHIEF / ARCH ( higher than) the created being called angels

5: Not sure what you asked about prophets
---francis on 4/27/12


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1. Does God "foreknow" because He looked into the future and saw what was going to happen and then predicted it?

2. Or does "foreknow" means He was instrumental in deciding and bringing forth what He has written to happen from eternity?

A clear indication that it's not point 1 is Scripture declares: "the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass, I have purposed it, I will also do it." Isaiah 46:12. "both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done." Acts 4:27,28
---christan on 4/27/12


Okay Francis, why don't you share why Christ did not return when Ellen G. White said He would?

Why don't you share what "THE GREAT CONTOVERSY" is about?

Why don't you share what "THE GREAT DISSAPOINTMENT" is about?

Why don't you share what "THE INVESTIGATIVE JUDGEMENT" is about?

Why don't you share what Hebrews 1:1-5 is about.

Why do you still avoid answering the question I have asked you many times about Prophets?
---Rob on 4/27/12


Rob on 4/26/12

Again blind

If I wanted to know about SDA, I would not go to a third party. I go to the source.

More proof that you were never a SDA is you have to go to other sources to know what SDA believe.

Available online for all to read is:
1: 27 fundermental beliefs
2: Steps to christ from Ellen G White
3: Seventh day adventist church manual
4: Amazing facts study guide
5: Uriah smith daniel and the revelation
...and much more directly from SDAs

So any person who wanted to know what SDA believed would seek out SDA sources and not third party sources ( hearsay and gosip)

The fact that you choose hearsay and gosip over facts tells me you are not yet born again
---francis on 4/27/12


Rob, I also have to agree with Christan's answer concerning salvation, for "it is finished" to me gives the idea of fulfilling one's task. Which in the case of the context, Jesus fulfilled the entire work of redemption and brought it to completion at the cross.
What was ordained before the foundation of the world, when it was foreknown that He would be a sacrifice for sin.
---Tom on 4/27/12


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When he says it is finished, He is talking about what God sent him to do. He foreknew that ge would have to send Jesus to die.
The sacrifice for sin spoken of in Gen.3:15 To Adam and Eve.
The veil that was errected to seperate man from God because of the sin of Adam and Eve for their disobedience, was removed by the sacrifice and obedience of Christ.
He did God's will and not his own will. (This tells us we have our own will, by the way.)
Christ was the one time sacrifice for the entire world. THIS IS SCRIPTURE for those who wish to refute it, Christ says it himself, argue with him about it.
Election and predestination are not what Christan, MarkV and RICHARD are trying to teach here.
---ginger on 4/27/12


"It is finished." means:

- "for He shall save His people from their sins." Matthew 1:21

- "For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of Him that sent me. And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which He hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day." John 6:38,39

- "those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost"

Only those elected by the Father, given to the Son will be saved. This was Jesus Christ mission from the Father to Him. So how can any of His elect loose their salvation, if they were elected by the Father?
---christan on 4/26/12


HappyLDS said: "The Gospel of Jesus Christ is that we may all return to our Father through faith, repentance, baptism and obeying the commandments."

I'd just like to ask the following to see where LDS is coming from.
1:Repentance from what?
2:What of those who die without water baptism such as the thief on the cross?
3:You said obeying the commandments is part of salvation. Do Mormons keep the Saturday Sabbath then? Do Mormons keep the commandments perfectly or are they guilty of all of them as described in James 2:10?
---Haz27 on 4/26/12


Francis, are you opposed to people researching the history of the SDA's and what they really believe and teach?

Are you opposed to people googling and researching "WHAT SDA's WON'T TELL YOU?

If you are against these things, I ask why. Would it be because you don't want people to know the truth about SDA's and what they believe and teach?

Also, why won't you answer the question I have asked you many, many times.

If a person claims to be a Prophet of God, but what they prophesied did not come to pass, what type of Prophet are they?
---Rob on 4/26/12


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Rob -
I apologize for intruding on this blog but you asked me four questions that I would like to answer. First, Jesus is the only begotten Son of God in the flesh. He is our Savior - the only path to salvation is through him. 2. The Gospel of Jesus Christ is that we may all return to our Father through faith, repentance, baptism and obeying the commandments. CONT.
---HappyLDS on 4/26/12


Francis, the scriptures you shared are true, but SDA's reject them and teach something completely different.
---Rob on 4/26/12
How blind can you be.

I, a SDA, am the first one to correctly give the answer and you say SDA reject it.

If SDA rejected it, why would a SDA be the first to give the correct answer?

Open youe eyes: instread of saying that SDA are still under the law, try saying this:
SDA STILL KEEP ALL TEN COMMANDMENTS while other keep 8 or 9/10
---francis on 4/26/12


Francis, the scriptures you shared are true, but SDA's reject them and teach something completely different.

SDA's teach we are still under the OLD COVENANT (the law), and it is not finished

SDA's teach that in 1844 Jesus entered the second apartment of the sanctuary to see who is worthy to be saved.
---Rob on 4/26/12


Luke 23:45 And the sun was darkened, and the veil of the temple was rent in the midst.

Luke 23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice,..he gave up the ghost.

Mark 15:37 And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost. And the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom.

Matthew 27:50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain

John 19:30.. he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

3/4 of the gospels tell us that when jesus said " it is finshed" that the veil in the temple was torn. Which brough to an end ( FINISH) the old covenant
---francis on 4/26/12


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Christ finished His mission, and now it is the Christian's turn to likewise take up their own cross and follow after Jesus in order to finish their mission.
---Eloy on 4/26/12


I need to be one with my brothers and sisters so I am not an isolated individual > "and He died for all, that those who live should live no longer for themselves, but for Him who died for them and rose again." (2 Corinthians 5:15) Jesus on the cross got me reconciled with God (2 Corinthians 5:17-21) so I can be joined to Him (1 Corinthians 6:17) and this also has me joined to my brothers and sisters so we are "members of one another" (Romans 12:5, Ephesians 4:25). By dying right in the way pleasing to our Father, Jesus finished what was needed to get me started in this. Jesus was "a sweet-smelling aroma" (Ephesians 5:2). So, His death was sweet enough to please and satisfy our Father so once was enough for all sins.
---willie_c: on 4/26/12


The Greek words for "it is finished" is a business term usually used in the completion of a debt payment. Thus Jesus is saying that his payment for the sins of the world was completed.
---Scott1 on 4/26/12


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