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Sabbath Instruction For Christians

Where in the New Testament does it instruct us as Christians to keep the Sabbath?

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 ---trey on 5/28/12
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francis:

As I have mentioned before, if we love God, we don't blaspheme, worship false gods, swear falsely by him, etc. If we love our neighbor, we won't kill, steal, commit adultery and perjury, etc.
---StrongAxe on 6/6/12


The heated Sabbath debate roars on among christians. But isn't it better to be safe than sorry to obey the least of the ten commandments? Your eternal life depends upon your decision. It is told to Remember the Sabbath, to keep it holy.
---Steveng on 6/6/12


Where in the New Testament does it instruct us as Christians to keep the Sabbath?
---trey on 5/28/12
Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest,..although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh [day] on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.

Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.

Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God [did] from his.
---francis on 6/6/12


---StrongAxe on 6/6/12

I know that you are not saying that because of Jesus' death we are free to kill, steal, worship false gods, dishouner parents, commit adultery and so on.

We are free from the penalty of breaking the law, which is death. But Jesus death does not make us free to break the law. So while we accept His death of our sins and His death in our place, (righteousness by faith) we cannot be found to be trangressors of the law. Which means we will be found to be hearers and doers of the law

Galatians 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
---francis on 6/6/12


\\According to the New testement, it still carried a death penalty:\\

Wrong again, as in everything you say.

If this were true, then EVERY SDA who ever rode a horse drawn vehicle on Saturday should have been executed, because the Sabbath commandment required that work animals be allowed to rest that day.

And those SDAs who drive cars on the Sabbath to your synagogue..... excuse me, CHURCH should be executed for violating the commandment as well, because one is explicitly forbidden to light fires on the Sabbath.

But again, why do SDAs pick and choose which of God's sabbaths they observe?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/6/12




>According to the New testement, it still carried a death penalty

Yep, the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23).
---David_J._Conklin on 6/6/12


francis:

Yes, that is EXACTLY THE POINT! Jesus died to FREE us from the death penalty under the law - not just parts of death sentences from certain parts of the law, but ALL of it.
---StrongAxe on 6/6/12


the old testament laws carried the death penalty for idolatry, blasphemy, sabbath breaking, dishonoring parents, murder, and adultery.
---StrongAxe on 6/4/12

According to the New testement, it still carried a death penalty:


Hebrews 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Hebrews 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

Hebrews 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

Hebrews 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God,
---francis on 6/5/12


--StrongAxe on 6/4/12
I think you strengthen my point here. Death only comes by DISOBEDIENCE to the law of God.

Genesis 2:17 in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.


Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death

O.K. so lets break down a few commandments.

IS DEATH MORE OR LESS LIKELY OF WE:
Honour, or dishonour parents?
Murder or do not murder?
Commit adultery or not commit adultery?
Steal or do not steal?
Bare false witness or tell the truth?
Cover or do not covet?

I am standing on the bible and say: Proverbs 7:2 Keep my commandments, and live, and my law as the apple of thine eye.

Any reasonable person will say LESS LIKELY is we do not...
---francis on 6/5/12


Francis 6/2/12 > "this to God and christians is a strange and diverse doctrine."

"And upon THE FIRST DAY OF THE WEEK, when the disciples came together to break bread,..." (Acts20:7) -- wow! Paul and the disciples did something "strange" there.

"see how the beast thinks of changing God's laws?"

"For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity A CHANGE ALSO OF THE LAW." (Heb.7:12) -- So, Francis, is this the beast that changed the law?!

Your logic is so stupid. You insist that the 10Cs is still enforced but when questioned you jump into the commandments of Christ which is not the 10Cs.
---jonweckl on 6/4/12




francis:

The commandment "Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land" carries with it the implicit "If you DON'T honor your father and mother, you will die young".

THIS is the threat of death.

Also, the old testament laws carried the death penalty for idolatry, blasphemy, sabbath breaking, dishonoring parents, murder, and adultery. The only ones of the Ten Commandments that DIDN'T carry the death penalty were coveting (not penalized), theft (penalty is double what was stolen), perjury (double the penalty of the accused - which would be death if accusing someone of blasphemy, idolatry, murder, adultery, etc.)
---StrongAxe on 6/4/12


if the ministry of DEATH, written and engraved on stones (10c),.
---Haz27 on 6/4/12
I must hold you respsible for this total lack of intellegence

One of the commandments writen and engraved in stone was this:
Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.

Paul calls it: Ephesians 6:2 the first commandment with promise,
The promise here is LONG LIFE

If you see long life and death as being the same, then you are far less intellegent that I give you credit for

Other bible passages say: Proverbs 7:2 Keep my commandments, and live, and my law as the apple of thine eye.

and you see keeping them as death?
---francis on 6/4/12


Francis. 2Cor 3:7-11 for you to consider
"if the ministry of DEATH, written and engraved on stones (10c),...., which glory was PASSING AWAY, how will the ministry of the Spirit not be MORE glorious?
For if the ministry of CONDEMNATION (10c) had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds MUCH MORE in glory. For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. For if what (10C) is PASSING AWAY was glorious, what remains is MUCH MORE glorious."

Christ is the END of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes, Rom 10:4

You can stop judging people now Francis.
It's by grace we are saved, NOT of works.
---Haz27 on 6/4/12


>do you perfectly keep the 10c?

If you are in Christ, yes. If you are not in Christ, then you never can.
---David_J._Conklin on 6/4/12


\\LADIES AND GENTLEMEN: Presenting the wisdom of Haz27 who believes that if he does these things:\\

The Pharisee of Our Lord's parable did all these things, and more besides.

Did they do him any good?

So did the Rich Young Ruler--but he refused to obey and follow the Savior.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/4/12


Francis: Your under the ministry of death/condemnation, which has PASSED AWAY.
---Haz27 on 6/4/12

LADIES AND GENTLEMEN: Presenting the wisdom of Haz27 who believes that if he does these things:

Exodus 20:3 have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 not make unto thee any graven image,
Exodus 20:7 not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,
Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother
Exodus 20:13 not kill.
Exodus 20:14 not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 not steal.
Exodus 20:16 not bear false witness
Exodus 20:17 not covet

Then he is under the ministry of death/condemnationis
---francis on 6/4/12


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Francis: Your under the ministry of death/condemnation, which has PASSED AWAY.

But Christians are under the ministry of the Spirit/righteousness which is much more glorious.2Cor 3:7-11

Even Paul rejected his former righteousness under the law your under, as "dung", choosing instead the righteousness which is of God by faith, which is through the faith of Christ, Phil 3:6-10

By the way, a Christian's righteousness is not judged by the law, so why ask me how perfectly I keep the law.
Christ is the END of the law for righteousness to everyone who BELIEVES, Rom 10:4
---Haz27 on 6/4/12


Jerry6593 and other SDA "Lawless Ones: Do you realize that you have placed yourselves on the side of the enemy of God" because you have "NOT attained to the law of righteousness.Why? Because they did NOT seek it by FAITH, but...,by the WORKS of the law" Rom 9:31
Thus, in "seeking to establish their own righteousness, have NOT submitted to the righteousness of God" Rom 10:3

Believe on Jesus and walk after the Spirit instead "That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in" you, Rom 8:4
---Haz27 on 6/3/12


Haz27, do you perfectly keep the 10c?
"whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in ONE point, he is GUILTY of ALL" James 2:10
Here's YOUR FATE for being GUILTY of ALL, Haz27:
I would pour out my fury upon them...Eze20:13
---francis on 6/3/12


Francis, do you perfectly keep the 10c?
"whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in ONE point, he is GUILTY of ALL" James 2:10
Here's YOUR FATE for being GUILTY of ALL, Francis:
I would pour out my fury upon them...Eze20:13

Francis don't be like Israel.
Rom 9:31 "has NOT attained to the law of righteousness.Why? Because they did NOT seek it by FAITH, but...,by the WORKS of the law"
Rom 10:3"seeking to establish their own righteousness, have NOT submitted to the righteousness of God"

Hence,"they could NOT enter in because of UNBELIEF", Heb 3:19.
---Haz27 on 6/3/12


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Francis wrongly claims Sabbath neglect kept Israel from promised land.
---Haz27 on 6/3/12

your lack of intellence is scary!

Ezekiel 20:11 And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which [if] a man do, he shall even live in them.

Ezekiel 20:12 MOREOVER also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I [am] the LORD that sanctify them.

Ezekiel 20:13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which [if] a man do, he shall even live in them, and my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.
---francis on 6/3/12


Francis wrongly claims Sabbath neglect kept Israel from promised land.
INSTEAD "they could not enter in because of UNBELIEF", Heb 3:19

Israel was an EXAMPLE of establishing righteousness under law.
"The man who does them shall live by them" Gal 3:12(Eze20:11)
"whoever shall keep the whole law, and yet stumble in one point, he is guilty of all" James 2:10
Through the law "all the world may become guilty before God" Rom 3:19
The law brings about wrath, Rom 4:15.

So whats the purpose of the law?
"our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith"Gal 3:24
Now we're NO LONGER under a tutor. Christ is the END of the law, Rom 10:4.
---Haz27 on 6/3/12


dowanor:

You asked: Can anyone show me anywhere in the new testament where we are commanded to STOP keeping the Sabbath

No. But can you find anywhere on these blogs where anyone has commanded anyone to stop keeping the sabbath either? All people are saying is that we are not longer COMPELLED to keep the sabbath. COMPELLING one to NOT keep the sabbath is a very different thing.


jerry6593:

You asked: Where in the New Testament does it instruct us as Christians to keep Sunday?

In the same verses in the New Testament where it instructs us as Christians to keep Saturday (i.e. none of them).
---StrongAxe on 6/3/12


Lawless Ones: Do you realize that you have placed yourselves on the side of the enemy of God by advocating the abolition of God's Ten Commandment Law? From Gen. to Rev, the Bible teaches obedience to the Law and the overcoming of the sin which it defines. Your misunderstanding of Paul's writings places you in opposition to Jesus Himself, who said in Mat 5:18,19

For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
---jerry6593 on 6/3/12


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\\Why is it a curse to keep the fourth commandment, and not a curse to keep the other nine?\\
---francis on 5/30/12

IT IS a curse to keep the other nine.

The Law was but a tutor to bring us to Christ

But you and the other SDAs are:


Galatians 2:4-5
...the false brethren secretly brought in to spy out our liberty which we have in Christ Jesus, in order to bring us into bondage.

BUT WE DID NOT YIELD in subjection to them for even one hour, so that the truth of the gospel would remain with you.


Don't let flimsy reasoning persuade you back under the Law.

The Law is a ministry of death
---James_L on 6/2/12


Can anyone show me anywhere in the new testament where we are commanded to STOP keeping the Sabbath
---dowanor on 6/2/12


---micha9344 on 6/2/12
Consider this prophecy:

Daniel 7:23 The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth,.. and he shall think to change times and laws:

Revelation 13:2 And the beast.. the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

That is why the 4th beast ( ROME) commands this: Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lords Day, and, if they can, resting then as Christians--Canon 29, Synod of Laodicea, 364AD

God's laws says:

Exodus 20:10 the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work

See how the beast thinks of changing God's lawa?
---francis on 6/2/12


micha9344 Hebrews 4:4 God did rest the seventh day...they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

OT REFERENCE:
Ezekiel 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths,.. But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness..my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

They did not make it into the promise land, because they did not keep the sabbath

Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.
---francis on 6/2/12


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Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lords Day, and, if they can, resting then as Christians--Canon 29, Synod of Laodicea, 364AD
"...kept exclusively by Jesus and ALL His disciples long after the cross."-jerry6593 on 6/2/12
--That is a belief only held by devout judaizers to support their claim that everyone in the past 1500 years has got it all wrong...
The false phrophetess is still alive and well...
I would ask you the same:
Where in the New Testament does it instruct us as Christians to keep Saturday?
Separation from the world meant unbeleiving Jews as well, for they were not honoring God by believing in His Son.
---micha9344 on 6/2/12


It is my belief that by example we are to celebrate a risen Saviour on the first day of the week rather than rest from our works on the last day. Christ finished the work!
---trey on 6/2/12

That is most peoples beliefs also

Psalms 118:8 It is better to trust in the LORD than to put confidence in man.

The lord commanded: Exodus 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.

and the word of the lord said: Hebrews 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.
Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines

These is no command to keep sunday, this to God and christians is a strange and diverse doctrine.
---francis on 6/2/12


micha: "the false sabbath doctrine"

Sunday sacredness and the calling of it "the lord's day" is a FALSE SABBATH DOCTRINE. It is a man-made counterfeit, supported nowhere in Scripture, originated in the pagan sun worship of Mithraism, and unheard of by Christ and His disciples.

The seventh day Sabbath, on the other hand, was instituted at Creation, spoken and written by God as a Commandment, and kept exclusively by Jesus and ALL His disciples long after the cross.

Let me ask you:

Where in the New Testament does it instruct us as Christians to keep Sunday?


---jerry6593 on 6/2/12


francis ignores any and all grammar in this verse to support his false doctrine and try to secure his sandy foundation.
In Isa 66:22, the word "as" is a comparison. The new h & e is compared with Israel's seed and name, the remnant, both will remain.
H & e is not the main focus of the sentence.
V23 "and it shall come to pass".. focus shifts from "remaining" to "worshiping".
"chodesh" back to back means monthly.Same as "shabbath" back to back means weekly, not just a specific day of the week or month-continually.
We can continue this but it has been proclaimed repeatedly to no avail of those with deaf ears.
---micha9344 on 6/2/12


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If one will study the following accounts:
Matt 28:1 Christ's resurrection.
Pentacost - meaning day 50 from the Sabbath day before Christ arose.
Acts 20:7 - Paul preaches.
1 Cor 16:2 - Laying asside (meaning: giving) to the church.
NOTE: All these occurred on Sunday, the first day of the week.
It is my belief that by example we are to celebrate a risen Saviour on the first day of the week rather than rest from our works on the last day. Christ finished the work!
---trey on 6/2/12


Isaiah 66 is often quoted by francis to support the false sabbath doctrine and discount what Colossians 2:16 obviously says.
---micha9344 on 6/1/12
Do not forget Colossians 2:17 that these sabbaths, feast days, holy days, meets and drinks were a SHADOW of things to come.

read isaiah 66 22-23 and see that in the new earth we will come before God every new moon ( new month) and every sabbath, if you are sinsere, you will see that the 7th day sabbath, unlike the feasts sabbath could not be a shadow.
Read Genesis 2 you will also see that the sabbath came BEFORE SIN. Shadows started AFTER sin to be a visual representation of the gospel.

See the posts "Old Covenant Feasts" and "SDA explain colosians 2:16"
---francis on 6/1/12


Isaiah 66 is often quoted by francis to support the false sabbath doctrine and discount what Colossians 2:16 obviously says.
It has been brought to his attention many times about his misinterpretation and misrepresentation of Isaiah 66, even on a grammatical level, to no avail.
He is either blinded to or willfully ignorant of the Truth.
Be wary and mark such as false teachers even as the founder of their "church" was a false prophet.
---micha9344 on 6/1/12


Hebrews 4:4 God did rest the seventh day...they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:

OT REFERENCE:
Ezekiel 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths,.. But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness..my sabbaths they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them in the wilderness, to consume them.

They did not make it into the promise land, because they did not keep the sabbath

Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God. For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

---francis on 6/1/12


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---jonweckl on 5/31/12
Your hermeneutics skills are poor:

Revelation 14:7 worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Romans 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever.

Jonah 1:9 I fear the LORD, the God of heaven, which hath made the sea and the dry land.

Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth

Exodus 31:16 .. keep the sabbath,.. a perpetual covenant... for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.
---francis on 6/1/12


LindaH on 6/1/12

You need to read the blog called "SDA Explain Colossians 2:16"

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
Colossians 2:17 Which are a shadow of things to come,

Once ou read issaih 66 and see that even in heaven theer will also be sabbath, you know it is NOT A SHADOW

Also see a blog called Old Covenant Feasts

In those two blogs you will find DETAILS as what Colossians 2: 16-17 mean, including what sabbath dayS are spoken of
---francis on 6/1/12


francis and james, we Christians on here will overcome you by the Blood of the Lamb and the words of our testimony.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/1/12


It cannot be more clear...

"And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses, Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross, And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the SABBATH days" (Colossians 2:14-16)

Anyone who does so is not being led by the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit led Paul to write these words.
---LindaH on 6/1/12


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Francis on 5/31/12

Rev.14:7 was IN NO WAY talking about sabbath.

"Fear God, and give glory to Him for the hour of his judgment is come:..."

Very clearly, in this particular verse, the angel was saying give glory to God because HIS JUDGMENT IS COME. -- not because it's the sabbath law.

Just because you see "give worship" or "worshippinng God", it DOES NOT ALWAYS mean the sabbath. Worshipping God is not done ONLY during sabbath.

"...present your bodies a living and holy sacrifice, acceptable to God, WHICH IS YOUR SPIRITUAL SERVICE OF WORSHIP." (Rom.12:1) -- Keeping ourselves a holy and living sacrifice, unstained by the world, IS WORSHIPPING GOD.
---jonweckl on 5/31/12


Where in the Bible does it say that the Sabbath is a day of worship? My Bible says its a day of rest
---LindaH on 5/31/12
Leviticus 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation,

Ezekiel 46:3 Likewise the people of the land shall worship at the door of this gate before the LORD in the sabbaths and in the new moons.

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass, [that] from one... sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

125 word limit prevents me from posting more
---francis on 5/31/12


I have a question for Francis.


Where in the Bible does it say that the Sabbath is a day of worship? My Bible says its a day of rest
---LindaH on 5/31/12


\\FIRST: "Circumcion" is used as a metaphor in the Bible for the whole corpus of Jewish practices.
---Cluny on 5/31/12

Really circumcision is a metophor for all jewish practices LOL LOL
---francis on 5/31/12\\

Yep. Look up the use of the word "circumcision" and the contexts in Acts and the Epistles.

You will see that it's very seldom used to refer merely to a male urological procedure.

Glory to Jesus Christ
---Cluny on 5/31/12


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I remeber reading how when the Lutherns first threw out the statues in their churches and wrote the Ten Commandments on the walls of their churches.

I also remebere when Methodist preaches about keeping the commandments of GOD as part of their duty to GOD. Look up Wesley's sermons about how the Ten Commandments are for Christians. Or look up how Calvin wrote about the Ten Commandments being for Christians.

Galations teaches not to try to save ourselves by works. It does not say GOD does not have laws.
---Samuel on 5/31/12


Francis quotes James 2:10 "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all."

He condemns himself as he offends in MORE than one point. He can't even observe the Sabbath correctly. Being under the law he makes himself a transgressor/sinner, Gal 2:18

Francis is under the old ministration of death/condemnation engraved on stones (10c) which was done away with.

But Christians are under the much more glorious ministration of the Spirit/righteousness.
2Cor 3:7-11
Hence we enter into God's rest (Heb 4:11) because we believed on Jesus.
---Haz27 on 5/31/12


Francis, you have what my sister calls, "stickin' thinkin'". You need to renew your mind in Christ, and start abiding by Christ's New Testament Commandments, and not follow the abolished old testament commandments.
---Eloy on 5/31/12


FIRST: "Circumcion" is used as a metaphor in the Bible for the whole corpus of Jewish practices.
---Cluny on 5/31/12

Really circumcision is a metophor for all jewish practices LOL LOL
---francis on 5/31/12


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\\Apparently you guys have not studie galations. Galations deals with the issue of CIRCUMCISION,\\

Wrong again, as in everything you say, francis.

FIRST: "Circumcion" is used as a metaphor in the Bible for the whole corpus of Jewish practices.

SECOND: The word is spelled "GalatiAns," and you misspelled it twice. If you can't spell a word properly, it's a good sign you don't understand it.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 5/31/12


---Eloy on 5/30/12
---Cluny on 5/31/12

Apparently you guys have not studie galations. Galations deals with the issue of CIRCUMCISION, It NEVER says we are not to keep all ten commandments. In fact Galation encourages us to keep the ten commandments

Galatians 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law:... But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found transgressors of the law. is therefore Christ the minister of
transgression of the law? God forbid.

1 John 3:4 sin is the transgression of the law.
---francis on 5/31/12


---Eloy on 5/30/12
1 John 3:4 sin is the transgression of the law.

Romans 7:7 I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

the law that says Thou shalt not covet is the ten commandments.

Speaking of adultery and murder from the law:
James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

I think Eloy is right.

those who do not keep the whole law, For their choice of sin, God will give them strong delusion that they will believe the lie, and will all likewise perish
---francis on 5/31/12


\\Francis has become a Galatian, ---Eloy on 5/30/12\\

When was he not?

ALL SDAs are neo-Galatians.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 5/31/12


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Where in the New Testament does it instruct us as Christians to keep the Sabbath?

Revelation 14:7 Fear God, and give glory to him,.. and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.

Most people in ignorance choose to make sunday " the lord's day" because of the resurrection of Jesus.

BUt the NT calls us all back to the creator, and ask us to worship him as such:


Exodus 20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is], and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
---francis on 5/31/12


Francis has become a Galatian, ---Eloy on 5/30/12

Sadly this may be true as Francis judges and teaches righteousness by works of the law.

Gal 3:3 "Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh?"

Matt 16:11-13 Jesus said: "How is it you do not understand that I did not speak to you concerning bread?but to beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Then they understood that He did not tell them to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees."

Likewise now, beware the leaven of the SDAs
---Haz27 on 5/31/12


Francis on 5/30/12

Let's do basic english (LOL)

What is stated in Isa.66:23 is "FROM one sabbath TO another" -- which is not the same as saying EVERY sabbath.

When you say EVERY sabbath, it means ONLY during sabbath (or during the 7th day). That is, the 1st day, 2nd, 3rd, up to 6th are not included.

But when you say FROM one sabbath TO another, you're denoting a range. That is, FROM the 7th day (of the previous week), TO the 7th day of the week, meaning the 1st, 2nd, up to 6th day are included.

So Isa.66:23 would mean "from the 7th day of the previous week, to the 1st, to the 2nd, up to the 7th day of the week, all flesh worship before the LORD" -- meaning, EVERYDAY -- not every sabbath.
---jonweckl on 5/31/12


Francis, The Galatians became Christians through Paul's preaching, but then afterward they listened to the NonChristian Jews who persuaded them that their Christianity was nonsufficient and that they also needed to follow the old testament laws to be acceptable and pleasing to God. Paul corrects them saying that they are fallen from grace back and gone back under the curse whomever substitutes their new life from Christ for the dead old testament. Sabbath-keeping saves no one, not one soul can obtain salvation because of not working one day out per week.
---Eloy on 5/31/12


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Francis >"Why is it a curse to keep the fourth commandment, and not a curse to keep the other nine?"

"God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, Hath in these last days SPOKEN UNTO US BY HIS HIS SON..." (Heb.1:1-2)

So in these last days, who do we listen to?

... This is my beloved Son,... hear ye him." (Mat.17:5)

So, christians obey their parents not because it is stated in the 10Cs... but because Christ commanded so. "Children, obey your parents in all things..." (Col.3:20).
---jonweckl on 5/31/12


Francis has become a Galatian, ---Eloy on 5/30/12

where in Galtions does it talk about the sabbath?

You honour your father and mother, which is the first commandment with promise, are you then cursed by the law?

How then is one who honourd God as creator by keeping the forth commandment cursed?

Why is it a curse to keep the fourth commandment, and not a curse to keep the other nine?
---francis on 5/30/12


//the new moon as we have seen in the bible is the time when the tree of life gives it's fruit. It is the time when all flesh come to eat of the fruit.

This view is not in the Bible.

---lee1538 on 5/30/12
Revelation 22:2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, [was there] the tree of life, which bare twelve [manner of] fruits, [and] yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree [were] for the healing of the nations.
---francis on 5/30/12


jonweckl, Francis has become a Galatian, and has become ruined by the leaven of the pharisees. For a little leaven leavens the whole soul. As long as a soul embraces the o.t. leaven, they are fallen from grace into the bondage and are cursed by the law.
---Eloy on 5/30/12


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//the new moon as we have seen in the bible is the time when the tree of life gives it's fruit. It is the time when all flesh come to eat of the fruit.

This view is not in the Bible.

From the rantings of olde Ellen White?

Question! will the ministry in the new earth be the ministry of condemnation & death craved on letters of stone (2 Cor. 3:7,9) or will it be one of the ministry of the Spirit?

As you do not have the indwelling Holy Spirit, I can only guess what your answer will be.
---lee1538 on 5/30/12


francis Since there is really no consensus on just how the Sabbath is to be kept,---lee1538 on 5/29/12

---
You forgot Exodus 35:3 thous shalt NOT NOT NOT NOT kindle a fire in your home on the Sababth. Also there is a restriction about travel so you may have to stay in your home on the Sabbath.
---lee1538 on 5/30/12
LOL LOL LOL
Now even you are correcting your lies LOL LOL

hi five |O/\O/
---francis on 5/30/12


from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another"
---jonweckl on 5/30/12

In the new earth, there are TWO occasions when all flesh mst come to the New Jerusalem.

As stated in isaiah 66:23 every sabbath, and every new moon.

The sabbath as we have seen throughout the bible, is a time for holy convocation

the new moon as we have seen in the bible is the time when the tree of life gives it's fruit. It is the time when all flesh come to eat of the fruit

Revelation 22:2 the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month (NEW MOON):
---francis on 5/30/12


francis Since there is really no consensus on just how the Sabbath is to be kept,---lee1538 on 5/29/12

Says you
Exodus 23:12: Stop servile work
Numbers 28:9 the work of the priest continues
Leviticus 23:3 Get together fro worship
Isaiah 58:13 enjoy the day by doing godly deeds, enjoy creation
Matthew 12:12 Continue to do good deed, relieve pain and suffering
---
You forgot Exodus 35:3 thous shalt NOT NOT NOT NOT kindle a fire in your home on the Sababth. Also there is a restriction about travel so you may have to stay in your home on the Sabbath.
---lee1538 on 5/30/12


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Francis, again you use Isa.66:22-23 to try to prove that in the new earth the OT sabbath is still present.

Again, let's analyze:
v.22 -- what shall remain is "your seed and your name" No mention of sabbath as also remaining.
v.23 -- "from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another" -- You interpret this to mean that all flesh will still worship the lord every sabbath. If that is so, then the verse would also say that all flesh will worship God EVERY NEW MOON.

The phrase "FROM one new moon TO another, and FROM one sabbath TO another.." was simply to show a "time frame" : month to month, week to week.
---jonweckl on 5/30/12


On the contrary, Jesus said: "The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath." When Jesus worked on the sabbath, he said, "My Father works up to here, and I work." Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God." When Jesus worked on the sabbath, he said, "I must work the works of him that sent me." The Pharisees said of Jesus, "This man is not of God, because he keeps not the sabbath day." Mk.2:27+ Jn.5:17,18+ Jn.9:4,16.
---Eloy on 5/30/12


Hebrews 4:

There are only TWO examples of rest
1: Hebrews 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest,

This is a refeerence to joshua giving rest, but not the sabbath to isarel: Joshua 22:4 And now the LORD your God hath given rest unto your brethren,

2: The rest of the sabbath day: Hebrews 4:3 For "we which have believed do enter into rest," as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

The command in Hebrews 4 is not rest in christ but this: Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

The command is to rest from work AS GOD DID
---francis on 5/30/12


Scott1 > "Jesus kept the OT sabbath." -- No.

Let's examine:"...thou shalt NOT DO ANY WORK,..." (Deut.5:14-15)
That was the law on sabbath as written in the 10Cs -- don't do ANY WORK. Remember the man in Numbers15:32-36? He was doing something good... he wanted to keep his family warm. Yet he was stoned to death according to the LORD's command. Can we now tell that man "you should not have been stoned to death because Jesus said it is well to do good on sabbath days?"

My point is, that was the law on sabbath in the 10Cs... so now when Christ said "it is well to do good on sabbath days" is he preaching about the 10C sabbath, or is he in fact preaching about a change in the law?
---jonweckl on 5/29/12


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Since there is really no consensus on just how the Sabbath is to be kept,---lee1538 on 5/29/12

Says you

Exodus 23:12: Stop servile work

Numbers 28:9 the work of the priest continues

Leviticus 23:3 Get together fro worship

Isaiah 58:13 enjoy the day by doing godly deeds, enjoy creation

Matthew 12:12 Continue to do good deed, relieve pain and suffering
---francis on 5/29/12


Isaiah 66:22-23 The new heaven and earth that I am about to make will continue in my presence, declares the LORD. So your descendants and your name will also continue in my presence. From one month to the next and from one week to the next all people will come to worship me, declares the LORD.

and we see that even in the new earth we continue to honour God as creator. Even in the very presence of jesus our rest will be in Him.

So why would God give the sabbath, stop it,and then give it again? The obvious answer is that He will not as like much else in the OT, it was fulfilled by Christ.

James 1:8 A double minded man [is] unstable in all his ways.

BUT AS YOU CAN SEE NOTHING IN THE NT THAT COMMANDS THE SABBATH.
---lee1538 on 5/29/12


Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

Isaiah 66:23 And it shall come to pass, [that] from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD


and we see that even in the new earth we continue to honour God as creator by keeping the sabbath. Even in the very presence of jesus we keep the sabbath.

So why would god give the sabbath, stop it,and then give it again?

James 1:8 A double minded man [is] unstable in all his ways. BUT AS YOU CAN SEE WITH SABBATH IN THE NEW, JESUS IS UNCHANGING
---francis on 5/29/12


Since there is really no consensus on just how the Sabbath is to be kept, even as among the Pharisees of Christ day, how then do Adventists determined at the end of the day if they have observed the Sabbath or merely broke it?

If we view this issue, correctly, Adventists have simply made the OT sabbath into a day they have communal worship.
---lee1538 on 5/29/12


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---jonweckl on 5/29/12
Jesus kept the OT sabbath. Jesus did not keep the Phariseeical sabbath of only taking x number of steps or you can only do this so many times etc. Currently the Phariseeical Jews do not allow there members to ride elevators on the sabbath due to the conduction of electricity when the button is pressed. The term home is where you hang your hat is from these Jews. They would walk to where they needed to be then hang there cloak on a pole and thus able to do work because they were x number of steps from home. They also worked on the sabbath to try and trick Jesus
---Scott1 on 5/29/12


Matthew 12:12 How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.

Meaning wgile keeping the sabbath do not neglect to do what is good

Matthew 24:20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

expectations that christians will keep the sabbath after His death

Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time hath in every city them that preach him, being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

command that gentiles be at sanagogue every sabbath
---francis on 5/29/12


to keep the Sabbath the way God means . . . not doing just copy-cat stuff which any psychopath can imitate . . . not calling more attention to a day in the week, than we call attention to Jesus and His sacrifice in His love for us

Everything in the New Testament is about how it is to truly keep God's Sabbath, including > "he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His." (in Hebrews 4:10) So, we do not keep the Sabbath if we have not ceased from all our own works.

And ones are worshiping a day, by giving more attention to a day than they do to God. This is not keeping the Sabbath.
---willie_c: on 5/29/12


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