ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

Surrogate Mother Contract

I hope to be a surrogate but am struggling with one issue. They say that I have to agree to abort the baby if the parents want it based on if it has Down Syndrome or some other "defect". Is this just something you have to come to peace with, knowing that God already knows if that will happen?

Join Our Free Chat and Take The Parenting Bible Quiz
 ---Heili on 10/18/12
     Helpful Blog Vote (7)

Post a New Blog



The case in this blog involves a man spilling his seed (sperm) and so God, in his wonderful ability to see the future, has already got us prepared to not fall for this new sin. The surrogate mother is a partaker of his sin. If women who are rich want babies, they should have them instead of putting careers before family. The days of slavery, even voluntary slavery, are legally over.
---Mary3 on 10/31/12


Francis, as I said before everything you say is untrue, like a record going backwards. It is a fact that God does overlook some sins, especially breaking of laws when it is for a good reason. God even orders Israelites to murder men, women and children who broke God's law against idolatry. That verse you are so hung up on is referring 'her' back to the wife. He must treat the old wife just like the new one, or THAT is a sin. And because men cannot do that, polygamy was dropped and divorce became the new law for cases of adultery.
---Mary3 on 10/31/12


---pat on 10/31/12
God has NEVER tolerated sin from Israel because they had his Laws!!
Deuteronomy 17:17 Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away: neither shall he greatly multiply to himself silver and gold.

God NEVER said that the kings cannot have more than one wife, it says that they cannot have more than one wife that would turn thier hearts from God as happened to Solomon. It also said they should not multiple silver and gold and GOD made Solomon wealthy with silver and gold

2 Samuel 12:8 And ( GOD) I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom,

If they could not have more than one wife why does God give more than one wife to David?
---francis on 10/31/12


God tolerated a lot from those saints in the Old Testament. Does not mean He approved. Still true of today. Here it is in black and white: "He shall not multiply wives for himself" [condensed] Deut. 18:4.] He's a great God. In Matthew 19:4, Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female. In Mark 10: 4,5,6,and 7. Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment, read v. 4. And v. 6 But from the beginning of creation, God made them male and female.
---pat on 10/31/12


Deuteronomy 25:5 If brethren dwell together, and one of them die, and have no child, the wife of the dead shall not marry without unto a stranger: her husband's brother shall go in unto her, and take her to him to wife, and perform the duty of an husband's brother unto her.

Deuteronomy 25:6 And it shall be, that the firstborn which she beareth shall succeed in the name of his brother which is dead, that his name be not put out of Israel.

Whether the brother which is alive is married or not makes no difference, He has to performhis duty.

That is one of the reason why so many people had two wives. Their original wife, and the wife of the dead brother


Ruth 4:5-6
---francis on 10/31/12




God never in any place in the bible says that having more than one wife is a sin.
Never ever chastens anyone for having more than one wife. All God does is put in place judgments that protect each wife, and thier children

Deuteronomy 21:15 If a man have two wives, one beloved, and another hated, and they have born him children, both the beloved and the hated, and if the firstborn son be hers that was hated: Then it shall be, when he maketh his sons to inherit that which he hath, that he may not make the son of the beloved firstborn before the son of the hated, which is indeed the firstborn:

Exodus 21:10 If he take him another wife, her food, her raiment, and her duty of marriage, shall he not diminish.
---francis on 10/31/12


Carla, you are confusing me with Francis. I think men should have one wife only. I don't agree with one child, two child or fifteen child policies which various countries encourage. I believe in the natural ways. Unfortunately eugenics is being practiced on us by the PTB. If we were truly holy we would not take vaccinations, and would have average sized families like before (four or five children). Some might die of childhood diseases, but we would not be destroying our DNA the way we are now.
---Mary3 on 10/30/12


Mary3...Exactly Where did god overlook Certain thing's, according to my bible he is the I AM. Differently you overlooked that a God who created the universe, has the power to do as he will, that does not mean, we have the right to not only question him but to use the sinful example to do the same.

Are the scriptures not there for you to choose right from wrong, or sin regardless and use them to justify wrong doing. Scribes and Pharisees did that.
---Carla on 10/31/12


---Mary3 on 10/30/12
God NEVER overlooks sin, or wrong. When Nathan said to David that God approved of david to build a house, did not god immedately correct that?

Think about it, God himself is commanding these thing through Moses, so how does God allow to be writing n his laws a law that allows sin.
If it was wrong for a man to have another wife it should read like this: If he takes another wife IT IS SIN.

And "IF" means that it is an option and not manditory. But look at what it says after If he takles another wife:
Exodus 21:10 If he take him another wife, her food, her raiment, and her duty of marriage, shall he not diminish.
---francis on 10/31/12


Francis, I looked up the very first quote and found three verses before verse 10 all refering to wife as singular. Then it says 'IF' you take another wife. This does not show God approves. God may have overlooked it, as he overlooks many things, but it does not mean they have no evil consequences. In the New Testament which is what a Christian lives under, we are ordered to keep the law of the land. So you are in error. II am just correcting you before you start a new cult.
---Mary3 on 10/30/12




My view is this: A surrogate is a concubine. If you are a christian, then you MUST abide by biblical rules concerning concubibes. If you are not a christian then....

You shoudl NOT agree to an abortion if you are opposed to abortions
---francis on 10/30/12


James L, I'll answer your question here,

"\No rapist, murderers, slanders etc will enter heaven.\\
---Mark_V. on 10/28/12

Where does scripture say that?
---James_L on 10/28/12"


"But the cowardly, unbelieving, abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, socerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the Lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death" God's word says they don't go to heaven, but to the lake of fire. (Rev. 21:8) you know why? Because they are unrigheous.
"Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God?"... (1 Cor. 6:9)
Only the righteous enter the kingdom of God. I have more passages.
---Mark_V. on 10/30/12


Francis, I think you are doing all this tongue in cheek.
---Mary3 on 10/29

Well Mary3, I gave at least 6 text so they are not my words, I keep telling you they are the laws of God. If they were my words they would not be in the bible.

Psalms 128:3 Thy wife [shall be] as a fruitful vine by the sides of thine house: thy children like olive plants round about thy table.

nothing here says one wife in enough

So jacob was tricked, was he tricked also into sleeping with their handmaids?
Was abraham tricked into sleeping with Hagar?

Was Elkanah tricked when he served as priest AND slept with Hannah?
---francis on 10/30/12


Mary, what is it about different time scales produce different circumstances. In those times people were not living as God intended, must you gloryfiy the sin and pray that we continue in it?

Exactly He was cheated not blessed, they were commissioned to multiply and fill the earth, now society is following in the steps of China and recommending that you have no more than two children by imposing sanctions on benefits for the first two children only.

God help the rest of them. Now are you telling me it's okay that my husband go out find another wife and have some more children?
---Carla on 10/30/12


Francis, I think you are doing all this tongue in cheek. I don't think you really believe your own words. Maybe it is just a job with you, to create division. David the psalmist himself said that one wife was normal (Psalm 128.3). Jacob had the intention of only marrying Rachel but he was cheated and ended up with two wives. The wives took maids to bear children for THEM. So you are all confused.
---Mary3 on 10/29/12


If you struggle with the issue why go ahead with the child?

If God knows then how did you not know God knew she could not have either her own or her husbands child.

If there is the knowledge of God in terms of being all knowing, is it then not up to god to change this position?

or did you just place self there without understand who God is?
---Carla on 10/29/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Life Insurance


Because out of hundreds of thousands of verses in the Bible you have found one that supports your will.
---Mary3 on 10/28/12
Exodus 21:10, Deuteronomy 21:15, Deuteronomy 25:5, 1 Timothy 3:2, Titus 1:6 2 Samuel 12:8

You count one, I count 6 and there are more

But when it comes to the word of God, God only need to say it ONCE and those who love him follow

the number of times something is said is not a reflection of it's importance, rather a reflexion of the hardness of the heart of men
---francis on 10/29/12


Francis, you keep repeating your same verse. Why? Because out of hundreds of thousands of verses in the Bible you have found one that supports your will. But what if it means something different to what you think? Might it mean that those wives are not at the disposal of David to be given their freedom or kept on as slaves, or whatever else he wanted. Note, God leaves the choice to David. He does not say that he must take them on AS WIVES.
---Mary3 on 10/28/12


I am going to be quite different from those who believe a woman has the right to accept another man's sperm or both egg/sperm into her body for the gratification of not only playing God but ones-self or others.

Your body is the temple of the Holy spirit... If God wanted you to have another man's baby by what ever means you care to justify, there would be no such condition as fornication or adultery.

Your feeling the pinch now all I can say is, how long will you play God, the decision belong to who now, you, god, them?
---Carla on 10/28/12


Thus is the permissive will of God as given in Exodus 21:10, Deuteronomy 21:15, Deuteronomy 25:5, 1 Timothy 3:2, Titus 1:6 God allows a man to have more than one wife to ensure that the woman is cared for in her old age as illustrated in the book fo Ruth

Notice that it was GOD HIMSELF who gave to David all those wives:

2 Samuel 12:8 And I gave thee thy master's wives into thy bosom

Would God do anything that was in violation of his Laws?
---francis on 10/28/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Make Money


Mray3 I don't know who j Marc below is. Does he think that God gave us a law that says men should have more than one wife? Lol. HI i'm J Marc & i never blgged that! God (YA) only wants men to have 1 wife! Matt19:4-5 And He answered and said, have you not read that He who made them at the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh
---J_Marc on 10/28/12


The law of God allows us to have more than one wife.

which God? Believers understand the Lord Jesus, unbelievers don't and do what they wish

Ephesians 5:31
For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife(wife singular, not wives plural), and they two shall be one flesh.

Ephesians 5:33
Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife (wife singular, not wives plural)even as himself, and the wife (wife singular, not wives plural)see that she reverence her husband.

Matthew 5:28
But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
---Follower_of_Christ on 10/28/12


The law of the land (I am assuming that you mean USA) says that one man cannot have more than one wife. The law of God allows us to have more than one wife.

So I ask my American friends who are well informed as to what the Bible says about plural wives, does the law of America trump the law of God?

In other contries the law of the land allows for multiple wives just as the law of God, does that make christians in other lands where the law of the land and the law of God are the same void of salvation?

The law of USA also allows for eurrogates, the bible also allows for the same thing called concubines.

If Heili the blog presenter is going to be a concubine, should she not be aware of what the bible says about this?
---francis on 10/28/12


---Mary3 on 10/27/12
My arguements are not strange, they are biblical.
I stated coreectly that God's ideal before sin was one man one wife, that is how God made it is the begining. He also made man vegitarians in the begining, but sin has caused us not to walk in Gods perect will, one man one woman, but is nis permissive will, one man more than one woman FOR THE SOCIAL SECURITY of the woman and not to satisfy the lions of the man.

Thus is the permissive will of God as given in Exodus 21:10, Deuteronomy 21:15, Deuteronomy 25:5, 1 Timothy 3:2, Titus 1:6 God allows a man to have more than one wife to ensure that the woman is cared for in her old age as illustrated in the book fo Ruth
---francis on 10/27/12


Shop For Christian Loans


Francis, you argue in a strange way, you bring in different topics to muddy the water, and you ignore the facts when it comes to obeying the earthly rulers. The law of the land does not tell us all to be vegetarians. As Mark V points out, you become one flesh with the person you marry. Even Muslims frown on taking a second wife and prefer to divorce and marry one at a time, and it is not out of financial necessity, but man's inbuilt knowledge of right and wrong. Ever since Adam and Eve lost their innocence, they became aware of what was wrong, but you seem to belong to some cult that is without any such knowledge.
---Mary3 on 10/27/12


Mary3:

Yes, we should keep the Law of the Land (except where that law directly opposes the Law of God). However, such laws vary depending on which land you happen to live in at the time. For example, if you live in one of several middle eastern countries, which operate under Sharia (i.e. Muslim law), the Law of the Land specifically allows one to have up to four wives. If you live in most European countries (or ones that were at one times colonies of European laws), monogamy is legally enforced.

Note that this does not say that monogamy is necessarily the Universal Law of God (any more than alcohol abstinence is, even though it IS the Law of the Land if you happen to live in certain southern states).
---StrongAxe on 10/27/12


Mark 10:6 But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.

from the beginning of the creation God made them vegetarians also

When David committed adultery with Bathsheba God took away the child fo adultery

When David married Bathsheba God blessed the child of the marriage

If having more than one wife was adultery, the second pregnancy of Bathsheba wold have resulted as the first one did
---francis on 10/27/12


In His permissive will God also allows men ( male) to have more than one wife, not to satisfy his lions, but for for the " social security" of the woman.

true in the past God allowed, however it was never Gods purpose..Women carrying seed of another man, other than her husband, in her womb she has committed adultery. medical technology can pump that seed into her womb does not take away her sin of having another mans child.

Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at, but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

The Lord Jesus affirmed marriage is between one man and one women, and magnified adultery by stating looking at another women with lust committing adultery.
---Follower_of_Christ on 10/27/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Rehab Treatments


---Mary3 on 10/26/12
In the ideal world as created by God. man would be a vegetarian, and have ONE wife.

That is the way it was in Eden, the ideal of God

Seeing that sin has invaded our world we now live not in the ideal or perfect will of God but in God's permissive will.

God's permissive will allows His creation to eat each other. Man eat's beast, and beast eat beast, beast eats man.

In His permissive will God also allows men ( male) to have more than one wife, not to satisfy his lions, but for for the " social security" of the woman.

surrogates / concubines allow the wife to have a child ( hopefully a male) who will care for her needs in the future ( see the book of Ruth)
---francis on 10/27/12


Mary, you are correct in that God allowed one wife. The rules were set by God from the beginning, Here is what Jesus said concering marriage,

And He answered and said, have you not read that He who made them at the beginning made them male and female, and said, For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh

Spoken by Jesus in (Matt.19:4,5).
Not three, not four, but two.
---Mark_V. on 10/27/12


I don't know who j Marc below is. Does he think that God gave us a law that says men should have more than one wife? Lol. The government wickedly comes in and says 'No, keep God's law of being faithful to the wife of your youth' and if we do that it is against the law of God. Lol. Talk about fulfilling the prophecy of evil men spreading white is black and black is white, to completely confuse upright citizens who want to obey both God and the government.
---Mary3 on 10/26/12


II did not choose the whole bible, because the whole bible does not deal with the issue of multiple wives. The same way you choose Roamsn 13:
---francis on 10/26/12
That's right deliberately misunderstand me and put up straw men arguments. I don't expect the whole Bible, just a balance of the two different sides. I know that is difficult for you, especially since the scales weigh down heavily on one wife verses which if you were a true believer you would already have in your note book for such times as when polygamists invade the church.
---Mary3 on 10/26/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Stocks


Francios, Thanks for the reply! As in all issues, there is another side to the coin. Most definitely we must obey God (YA) rather than man when man's law goes against the law of God !
---J_Marc on 10/26/12


---J_Marc on 10/26/12

OK I have read it.
But what do you do when the ordinance of the Government is in contrast opposition, oppression to the law of God?


Daniel 3:17 If it be [so], our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver [us] out of thine hand, O king.

Daniel 3:18 But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

Acts 5:29 We ought to obey God rather than men.
---francis on 10/26/12


Francis, please read on past Romans 13:1 Here is Romans 13:2-5 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid, for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
---J_Marc on 10/26/12


I repeatedly showed you Romans 13.1 and you chose to ignore it each time. Second, you cherry pick 4 verses, You ignore the rest of the whole Bible,
---Mary3 on 10/26/12

Well let me help you out
Romans 13:1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

Acts 5:29 We ought to obey God rather than men.

So the laws of God trump the laws of the government.

I choose 4 verses (I should have chooen six) I did not choose the whole bible, because the whole bible does not deal with the issue of multiple wives. The same way you choose Roamsn 13: 1 and not the whole bible. because the whole bible does not deal with obedience to civil authority
---francis on 10/26/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Diabetes


I would scrap this deal! You can come to peace with yourself, not necessarily God's peace. Scrap it! You are right, God does know everything. But, so often, "What seems right to man, can lead to destruction".
---pat on 10/26/12


Francis, sir, you are so wrong, even a broken clock would be right twice a day, but you aren't even right by accident. I do not know where to begin with you. First, I repeatedly showed you Romans 13.1 and you chose to ignore it each time. Second, you cherry pick 4 verses, of which three contain the word 'if' which proves that it was not the norm. You ignore the rest of the whole Bible, to your shame. DO the research. One man, one wife is the normal way since Adam and Eve. God may have turned a blind eye, for purposes best known to Himself, but the Bible teaches us as far as it can, that one wife is preferable. Go and dust off your Bible. You spend too much time arguing for your own agenda.
---Mary3 on 10/26/12


---Mary3 on 10/25/12

The question this is: Does the LAW OF GOD allow for more than one wife?

Deuteronomy 21:15 If a man have two wives
Just this statement alone, without condemning a man having two wives, but rather regulating the behaviour is an endorsement

2 Samuel 12:8 And I gave thee.. thy master's wives into thy bosom,
another endorsement God giving David MORE wives

Exodus 21:10 If he take him another [wife], her food, her raiment, and her duty of marriage, shall he not diminish.

Deuteronomy 25:5 If brethren dwell together, and one of them die,...her husband's brother shall go in unto her, and take her to him to wife, a

God 4 Government 1
---francis on 10/25/12


Francis, who are you? Are you here to prepare the way for some kind of holocaust against Christians? Are you trying to stir up Christians to do illegal acts? Or are you trying to make us all state that we believe the government is always right no matter what?
I said deliberately that if it is not against God's law, then we are subject to the nation's laws. Governments are put there by God to protect us, when they stop doing that we can start to break even God's law. We are free spirits. God expects us to use our brains to survive. During the Jewish holocausts Christians sometimes lied to protect Jews from the authorities.
---Mary3 on 10/25/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Depression


Francis, I don't understand. You talk about God allowing and not allowing, but it clearly says that we have to keep the law of the land in Romans 13.1. It is illegal to have more than one wife at a time. Jesus never changes, but the governments he put in do make changes.
---Mary3 on 10/24/12

I am glad you mentioned that.
When the law of the land opposes or oppresses the law of God, who or whom do we obey?

keep in mind this post:
yes it is OK to have more than one wife today: As long as you are following the biblical laws for having more than one wife
---francis on 10/24/12
---francis on 10/25/12


Francis, I don't understand. You talk about God allowing and not allowing, but it clearly says that we have to keep the law of the land in Romans 13.1. It is illegal to have more than one wife at a time. Jesus never changes, but the governments he put in do make changes. If you see that the Bible does not condemn what they want you to do, then you have to do it. That is what God says through his human leaders.
---Mary3 on 10/24/12


Follower_of_Christ:

Prophets sometimes predicted the future, but more often were leaders or voices of God's judgment. Moses was the greatest and never predicted the future. We often jump to wrong conclusions from biblical examples - rather than seeing judgments also frequently mentioned elsewhere, we derive new and never before seen doctrines.

Abraham was NOT chastized for taking a surrogate or second wife, but for relying on his own devices rather than faith. Solomon was NOT chastized for 1000 women, but for allowing their faiths to sway his. Onan was NOT condemned for spilling seed, but for breaking a willingly-assumed obligation, etc.

Cluny:

Good or bad comes has nothing to do with whether something is permitted.
---StrongAxe on 10/24/12


Do you think it is okay (lawful) to have more than one wife today? Do you think it is okay to use woman for baby bearing?
---Mary3 on 10/23/12

yes it is OK to have more than one wife today: As long as you are following the biblical laws for having more than one wife


I do NOT think we should use women for child bearing only. If your wife is unable to bear you a child, you may choose her handmaid by which to have children. But it is wrong in my narrow opinion to use women just for child bearing.
Concubines have rights too
---francis on 10/24/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Bible Study


point. Do you think it is okay (lawful) to have more than one wife today? Do you think it is okay to use woman for baby bearing?
---Mary3 on 10/23/12
Yes it is OK to have mor ethan one wife even today. Jesus christ the same yesterdya today and forever.
There are still christians and jews in the world today with more than one wife.
If it was not a sin in the OT days, it cannot be a sin today
Most important is that Paul wrotes to the church saying that only those men who have one wife can be bishops, this exclused those in the church with more than one wife.

remember in most western nation it is the federal or state government thathas outlaws multiple wives for tax reasons, not God
---francis on 10/24/12


Francis, God acts in different ways in different circumstances. The part of the Bible you quote has been debated as meaning that David had completely power over these women, freedom or slavery (which was what concubines were). These days Romans 13.1 applies. It is illegal. Please answer this point. Do you think it is okay (lawful) to have more than one wife today? Do you think it is okay to use woman for baby bearing? I don't think it is, even when the woman suggests it.
---Mary3 on 10/23/12


en. Abraham was wrong to take a concubine because God had promised him a child with his wife.
---Mary3 on 10/22/12
2 Samuel 12:8 I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom,

Was God wrong to give to david all these concubines?



'In the name of the wife' not 'wives'. So there is one wife. Thanks very much for clearing that one up.
---Mary on 10/22/12
Concubines usually have children for one wife even though the man may have more than one wife, as is Rachel and leah.
---francis on 10/23/12


Francis, your own words go against you. 'In the name of the wife' not 'wives'. So there is one wife. Thanks very much for clearing that one up.
---Mary on 10/22/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Bible Verses


Looking up concubine in wikipedia it does mention that they were allowed to men who could afford them, or to men whose wife was unable to have children. Abraham was wrong to take a concubine because God had promised him a child with his wife. Even though Abraham, humanly speaking, seems to have a good excuse for his actions, spiritually, he was in the wrong. (I am a different Mary to the ones on other blogs and this is my third or fourth comment.)
---Mary3 on 10/22/12


It is interesting that Francis has completely distracted from the original question. Polygamy is not the topic.
---Mary on 10/22/12
Actually polygamy is the topic.
The biblical term for surrogate is concubine, CO-wife, one who bears children in the name of the wife.
---francis on 10/22/12


It is interesting that Francis has completely distracted from the original question. Polygamy is not the topic. However if you insist on bringing it up, it is illegal, and according to God we have to keep the laws of the land. Romans 13 verse 1.
---Mary on 10/22/12


But nothing good,.. came from such arrangements.
---Cluny on 10/21/12
Lets see Children by the second wife of Jacob:
Reuben
Simeon,
Levi
Judah
Gad
Asher.
Issachar
Zebulun

Who said nothing good ever comes from this

And let see again:
And the sons of Bilhah, Rachel's handmaid, Dan, and Naphtali:

And lets see Even further:
1 Samuel 1:1 Now there was a certain man and his name [was] Elkanah, And he had two wives, the name of the one [was] Hannah, and the name of the other Peninnah:

out of that we have Samuel

DEEPER YET? OK:
Judges 11:1 Now Jephthah was the son of an harlot:
Hebrews 11:32 And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Jephthae,
---francis on 10/21/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Arthritis


people did things that were against God's laws, and they were soundly chastized by prophets for doing so? Yet this never happened for either surrogacy nor polygamy

purpose of prophets was to foretell future aka prophecy, may explain why you're mixedup about surrogacy and polygamy!!!Sarah sending Abraham to their slave is all about faith and waiting on Gods promises one of the simplest lessons about faith in holy scripture, zero support to advocate surrogacy

nothing in holy scripture supports polygamy and the very simple plain lessons about polygamy are outlined. polygamy was always wrong, God allowed polygamy to illustrate lessons easily understood through teachings from the Lord Jesus on marriage.
---Follower_of_Christ on 10/21/12


\\However, note that Abraham's resorting to surrogacy is never criticized by anyone in the Bible on the grounds that doing so was against any law or custom. In fact, the fact that it is done several times without an criticism is fairly telling.\\

But nothing good, at least in the long run, came from such arrangements.

Even the birth of Ishmael turned out to be a source of domestic discord. Otherwise, Sarah would never have said, "Drive out the slave woman and her son."

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/21/12


StrongAxe, sometimes God allows stubborn people, who create their own rules, to do whatever they like. The results end up disastrous for the whole world. Abraham would have been a lot better off just waiting for God to fulfill the promises He made to him. The prophets cannot always address every single sin that has been done, and in fact God doesn't expect them too, and even tells them to let the people be deceived.
---Mary on 10/21/12


However, note that Abraham's resorting to surrogacy is never criticized by anyone in the Bible on the grounds that doing so was against any law or custom.
---StrongAxe on 10/20/12

I'll do you ONE better:
2 Samuel 12:8 And I (GOD) gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom ( NOT TO HOUSE AND FEED BUT UHM UHM), and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah, and if [that had been] too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things( IN CONTEXT MORE WIVES).
---francis on 10/20/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Asthma


Mary:

You are right. Just because something was done in the Bible doesn't necessarily mean that it was right. However, note that Abraham's resorting to surrogacy is never criticized by anyone in the Bible on the grounds that doing so was against any law or custom. In fact, the fact that it is done several times without an criticism is fairly telling. Note how often people did things that were against God's laws, and they were soundly chastized by prophets for doing so? Yet this never happened for either surrogacy nor polygamy. So if God didn't like the practice, he went to great lengths to keep his mouth shut about it.
---StrongAxe on 10/20/12


Bro.Cluny,you are correct, please accept ELENA apologies, I will cut back on her sweet potato pies this evening.thankyou, ha! ha! She is an excellant cook,she keep trying to make me fat ! So,thankyou ha! ha!
---ELENA on 10/20/12


medical science forever tinkering with God and his ways and attempting to be a god. agree to murder the baby in your womb because the seed (the father) has determined he does not want the baby then it is you who will have the blood of this babies murder on your hands. one of the nasty side effects of modern marvels is loose morals for both surrogate mother who would take the seed of another man in her womb under false pretenses and a father who could distance himself from his baby through surrogacy until it is born without defects
---Follower_of_Christ on 10/20/12


but was also "the biblical way", since it was recorded in the Bible, and totally legitimate at the time?

Note that God's criticisms of this was NOT about its legitimacy per se, but merely that God had promised the seed to Sarah.
---StrongAxe on 10/19/12

This was the way in which God made the nation of Israel: one man, two wives, two surrogates
---francis on 10/20/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Cholesterol


Heili,sure could not make out your name thank god,someone did. my mother try to kill. us twins,at 12 yrs.old.
She got real mad let me know, was not wanted.Thank god my grandmother,she said "your mom. tried everything,we hung on like a bad cold!" She laugh at my mom.I was always hungry,sick...ha!ha! Still am,God had done miracles for both of us,so you never know you could be carry the next great scientist discover cures for horrible diseases,or the next president bring prayer back in the schools,or a great minister of God! Think about it.... ELENA
---ELENA on 10/20/12


\\,Mozart famous for wrting composing music,such ...he was death could not hear.\\

ELENA, you're confusing Mozart with Beethoven.

Beethoven lost his hearing in the middle of his life. Mozart could hear just fine.

I was a music major, btw.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/20/12


StrongAxe, hello. I wish to express my disagreement with your idea that just because something is recorded in the Bible it is the Biblical way. God did not approve of everything that went on in the Old Testament and New Testament. So how can you say that? Did God also approve of people sacrificing their children to idols?
---Mary on 10/20/12


Cluny, What do you mean "if God wants them to have a baby"?
Children born from rape is God's doing??? conjoined twins, born without limbs etc... is God's doing??
God gave the mandate to man (via Adam) to have offspring He only had a hand in certain ones to accomplish His will! Whether or not people have children is up to them not God!He just provided the means!
---1st_cliff on 10/19/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Lasik Surgery


francis:

You said: .I prefer the biblical ways:

Perhaps you forgot that Abraham using Hagar when Sarah was infertile was, in fact, not only a means that was common in those days (i.e. "the cultural norm", especially since there are other examples of this), but was also "the biblical way", since it was recorded in the Bible, and totally legitimate at the time?

Note that God's criticisms of this was NOT about its legitimacy per se, but merely that God had promised the seed to Sarah.

Cluny:

Note that whether surrogacy is wise in any particular incident has no bearing on whether or not it is a legitimate practice (see above).
---StrongAxe on 10/19/12


.Bro.Cluny,in answer to your question,Mozart famous for wrting composing music,such ...he was death could not hear.Read about.it in the Spanish YouTube subtitles.
.I can not pronouce his first name, sorry.They have a book been some years ago, famous people talents we could not have done witbout yet,many had dissabilities,all.linda also,you look up famous talented people with handicaps online.
.they all listed. Thankyou, bro. Cluny much respect.ELENA
---ELENA on 10/20/12


I am not in favour of surrogates, especially if the condition fo death is contracted. I prefer the biblical ways:

2 Samuel 5:13 And David took him more concubines
---francis on 10/19/12


What handicap did Mozart have, Elena?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/19/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Bullion


Smile,bro.Cluny,hello,you are ok.in.my book! And well, you do once in a while, make us smile ...
Hey,for real,serious brother,I am so concerned over that baby she carrying,lord,I pray she will not.do that...we all agree,children are such a blessing,,it doesn't seem right...
we don't know her personal issue,but,I really. But, there are people, decent people who are not able to have a baby would love a baby even if it were handicapped.Many famous people born with handicap,Mozart,Socrates,ELENA ..(talent but, not famous).love of JESUS,
---ELENA on 10/19/12


\\my family have been pregnant\\

Including the men, ELENA?

Just kidding.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/19/12


I would not get into an agreement with people who are like that. If they can kill an unborn with whom they could learn real love, I'm not sure it would be good for a baby to be brought up by people who have the character so they can do that. So, you are considering not only the possibility of abortion, but if you would be loving a child by having him or her be with people who are ok with killing unborn people.
---willie_c: on 10/19/12


May I remind you that Abraham, Sarah, and Hagar and a "surrogate arrangement", and look at all the trouble it caused and is still causing in the Middle East?

Suspected birth defects in the unborn is NEVER an excuse to commit pre-natal infanticide. "Life unworthy of life" was a catch-phrase used by the Nazis.

I would advise AGAINST being a surrogate for anyone, but especially for this couple. If God wants for them to have a baby the natural way, they will. The fact they are willing to kill their child if she is imperfect is probably why God is NOT letting them have one.

By agreeing to have an abortion if they order it, YOU become a participant in their sin.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/19/12


Read These Insightful Articles About Menopause


---Heili on 10/18/12

My niece recently attempted surrogacy. At first mention, I was taken aback, thinking there has to be a mortal and ethical dilema here, as she is a believer.

I could not find any scriptures to negate her desire, so I relented of my bigotry.

After three failed attempts the matter was closed, and she did not get pregnant.
She has four of her own.

If it were possible for you to keep the infant should they not want "damaged goods", would you go that route?
---Phil on 10/19/12


My prayers,will be for baby. Let me give a little history,all my family have been pregnant and myself too pregnant when also,had cancer and my daughter life all else,and my twin sister, too had baby she learn rite away she had cancer in the blood they told her short,she refuse in short, both survived, she lived for nearly 18 years,baby healthy.my answer baby comes before anything if it were me...baby can not speak.or defender his or her self, baby depend on mother.Please fight for baby ...

ELENA
---ELENA on 10/19/12


You shouldn't go into becoming a surrogate knowing the child you carry could be aborted.
---Trish on 10/18/12


Copyright© 1996-2015 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.