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Sovereignity Of God Views

What are your views on the Sovereignity of God!

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 ---pat on 10/19/12
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Phil,

Yes, true, you are not your father but you and your father both belong to the class called Human. Thus, Jesus is not his Father but both Jesus and the Father belong to the class called God.

And again, you have purposely avoided answering how is it possible that Jesus contains ALL the fullness of God Almighty but yet, according to you, is not God Almighty.
---Marc on 11/11/12


How can Jesus contain the fullness of God and still not be God, as you believe?
---Warwick on 11/11/12

God is the English word used for the Greek "deity". It is not a name.

It is amazing to see the saints remain in unbelief when the clear declaration of Scripture are in front of their eyes. Jesus is a man, as the Bible says.

It seems the obvious and simple are too much so. Creeds and falsehood are at the root of this failure.
---Phil on 11/11/12


English:(Sovereign)
*one possessing or held to possess supreme political power or sovereignty

*an acknowledged leader: Arbiter

Hebraic:[Elohyim]

He Is(Exist) "Thee" "Strong' and "Powerful"------One.
---char on 11/11/12


Phil I notice you will not answer Marc's question. I also wonder how "..the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily,..." (Colossians 2:9) within Jesus but you say He is not God. How can Jesus contain the fullness of God and still not be God, as you believe?
---Warwick on 11/11/12


---Marc on 11/9/12

Jesus is a man. That a man is God is impossible.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

He shares deity with the One God, and was begotten of God.
He is God's Son.

I had a father. He begat me. I am not my father.

Jesus said "My God, and Father". Is that not clear to you?
You do not understand their relationship.

To be the image of something denies sameness. You cannot be the image of something and also be that something.

Jeus Christ is the Son of God, begotten of God, Firstborn of all creation, the Logos from the beginning, sitting at the hand of God.

He is not the One true God.
---Phil on 11/11/12




Half truths equals out to a lie!
---pat on 11/10/12


You might want to consider that God is a family consisting of a Father, Son and mother. We are created in their image therefore we form families with fathers, mothers and children here on earth.

All three, God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit are united as one and work together as one. That may be why Jesus prayed that we would become one with Himself and His Father and He gave us the Holy Spirit as a Comforter and Guide. John 17:20-21.
---barb on 11/10/12


Phil,

You still haven't answered my question: If Jesus is not God, how can ALL the Fullness of God dwell in him(Col. 2:9)? You avoid the ramifications of Paul's unambiguous words by quoting OTHER verses and not directly answering my question.

Furthermore, you omit an important word from Col 1:15, namely, Christ is the image of the INVISIBLE God. When you put ALL of Colossians 1 and 2 together, Paul declares Christ to be Creator (v. 16), has all power (v. 17) and has all knowledge (2:3).That is to say, Christ is God in VISIBLE form.

Jesus does declare himself to be God. Compare Rev 1:17, 22:13 and 1:8. How many First and Lasts, Alpha and Omegas are there? 1 or 2?
---Marc on 11/9/12


---Mark_V. on 11/9/12
"you are denying Jesus is God the Creator? And don't even feel shame"
---Mark_V. on 11/9/12

Phil said "Jesus, the Christ is God to us, but He is not God the Supreme One. He is begotten of God, God's Son. He created all things, He is the Firstborn, Alpha and Omega, the Logos of God."

You missed something. Derision is also out of place among saints.

Gen 1:1 uses Elohim. It is plural in form, not singular. The KJV use of God, instead of Elohim, is inaccurate and misleading.

It has mislead you, as intended.

Gn 1:26 And saying is the Elohim, "Make will We humanity in Our image,
---Phil on 11/10/12


Phil, you first give (Col. 1:15) to proof Jesus is not God, yet the passage also says'"For by Him all things were created that are in heaven, and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were create through Him and for Him. And He is before all things and in Him all things consist" you are denying Jesus is God the Creator? And don't even feel shame, you say what you say with a streight face.
Here let me help you:
"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (Gen. 1:1).
Can you understand that?
---Mark_V. on 11/9/12




Since you won't/can't answer my question, I'll answer it for you.---Marc on 11/8/12

Christ is the image of God, not God. Col 1:15 Hb 1:3

All that the Christ is, we will become. Ro 8:29 1C 15:49 2C 3:18 Col 3:10

Will we also become "God" when that day arrives? Will the so-called "godhead" fill us as well?

Jesus, the Christ is God to us, but He is not God the Supreme One. He is begotten of God, God's Son. He created all things, He is the Firstborn, Alpha and Omega, the Logos of God.

But He never said "I am God".

You may feel free to announce such unscriptural statements.

I cannot.
---Phil on 11/9/12


Phil, you are wrong, it is recorded in Scripture, that all Three Person have the same attributes. You just don't want to believe it. All Three are Divine.
Jesus Omnipotence, " All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me" (Matt. 28:18). Again in (1 Peter 3:22) Christ in heaven is declared to be at the right hand of God, "with angels, authorities, and powers subject to Him" Other passages bear out the same concept of absolute sovereignty (John 5:27: Acts 2:36: 1 Cor. 12:3: Phil 2:9,10: Col. 1:18). He is indeed, "King of Kings, and Lord of Lords" (Rev. 19:16). I have only given you a glimince of His sovereignty, not even His Omniscience or Omnipresence.
---Mark_V. on 11/9/12


Phil,

Since you won't/can't answer my question, I'll answer it for you.

If ALL the Godhead resides in Jesus, as Paul states in Colossians 1, then Jesus MUST be God.

By ignoring this, you are not only deceiving yourself but, worse, on this blog to try to "intellectually" rob others.
---Marc on 11/8/12


---Mark_V. on 11/6/12
"Phil 2: All through Scripture God has revealed Himself in three Persons."

That God has revealed this is not correct Mark. It is nowhere recorded in Scripture, that "God is three in one".

There are no Scriptures supporting this creedalist tenent. In fact, there are many to disprove this falsehood.

1C 8:4 there is no other God except one,

1C 8:6 yet to us is one God, the Father

Eph 4:6 one God and Father of all

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God,

In the face of these emphatic statements, will you fail to provide proof to the contrary, and divert the issue elswhere? Will you be honest?
---Phil on 11/8/12


Phil 2: All through Scripture God has revealed Himself in three Persons. All having the same attributes, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Omnipresent. It is that you do not believe it so you change the passages interpretations to suite your theology, someone who opposes the Trinity. Would you ever admit you are wrong? I don't think so. This has to be revealed to you by God. I love you my friend, know that, but this Truth you just don't understand, maybe not yet, but if God the Holy Spirit wills, you will understand it one day. If you open your heart to the Truth, (John 1:1-10) will give you a glimpse of our Lord.
---Mark_V. on 11/6/12


Phil, you now say,

"You are correct that orthodoxy holds to this tenet. It was formed out of contention and strife, not the revealed word of God. It is not found in the Scriptures, it is inferred by reasoning."

you are right, the tenet for the trinity was created for the sole purpose of keeping the Truth from the vipers who have been trying to corrupt the Truth to a lie since the Church was born. Hereries were entering the Church from all directions. People that believed like you, who didn't understand the Word of God. I mean the Word who became flesh. The Old Testament people already knew who the Word was. But those heretics have been trying to change the Truth for centuries, that was the contention.
---Mark_V. on 11/5/12


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---Mark_V. on 11/5/12

Thank you for the explantion. To know your mind is important to me.

You are correct that orthodoxy holds to this tenet. It was formed out of contention and strife, not the revealed word of God. It is not found in the Scriptures, it is inferred by reasoning.

It will not affect salvation to believe in a triune God. It does however, prevent the entrance of greater light and understanding of God's truth.

Proponents of it manipulate the Word in order to sustantiate it. I refuse to do so.

I believe God. If He has not spoken it, it is not truth. God has never revealed Himself as three-in-one. There is only One God.

This you know, but cannot believe.
---Phil on 11/5/12


Phil, after your sentencing concerning trinitarians you say,

"Each will give an account of himself, and no group or sect will commend itself to God at that time."

First of all believing in a Triune God is not a sect as you call it. It is the faith of all who are orthodox Christians. They are part of the essentials of the Christian faith. It was important for us to know if you were a trinitarian this way we would know how to answer you with respect to what you believe. It is not a badge of honor, it is a believe of faith. The Bible speaks of a trinitarian God. Working through three Persons in time through history. Though God in His Godhead is outside of time.
---Mark_V. on 11/5/12


Warwick, thank you for saying what you did. When I saw what you wrote, I knew that you might be right because you are good with the Word of God and trustworthy. I trust that you are not taking a subject for the sole purpose of bias. Though I do not agree with a few things, I feel in my heart your purpose is for the right reason, that is why I respect what you say.
---Mark_V. on 11/4/12


---Mark_V. on 11/3/12 We know he is not trinitarian that is for sure.

It is no badge of honor to be a trintitarian. And, by the including of oneself as part of a sect that approves of this unscriptural doctrine is a fulfillment of 1C 11:19

"For it must be that there are sects also among you, that those also who are qualified may be becoming apparent among you."

Those who cannot stand without support here and now, will fall alone before the throne of Grace, having failed to rely upon the living God, and seeking the approval of men.

Each will give an account of himself, and no group or sect will commend itself to God at that time.
---Phil on 11/4/12


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Mark, your willingness to listen, and accept you have erred is a very appealing thing, revealing your humility. It is an uncommon thing on these pages.
---Warwick on 11/3/12


Marc, your interpretion is not correct. Did you not read the "if" in God's statement? This are conditions in order to turn the people the way He wants them to turn and whatever turn they make, God already knows. If God said, I will distroy all your sons as was told to David, all the sons were distroyed. No "if's" or but's about it. The words of God some times have conditions. Nothing that happens is new to God, He never learns new things, He is all knowing, "if" He didn't know all things He would not be God. He does not live in time as man does. For God there is no time. What He ordained before the foundation of the world is complete before Him, for us it is unfolding. God is Spirit, He is not a man.
---Mark_V. on 11/4/12


Sure he did, God even altered His plan of destroying Nineveh in 40 days.

Proof man has free will to obey or disobey. And OBEDIENCE is for man to do.

Was ALL(every person) of Nineveh the Elect?

Is there any scripture they were ALL Born Again FIRST to be able to repent?
---kathr4453 on 11/4/12


MarkV,

No problem. Back to the issue.

The Bible is riddled with verses that show God altering his plans or being PREPARED to alter his plans. E.g. 'Says the Lord: "The instant I speak concerning a nation...if that nation turns from its evil, I will RELENT of the disaster that I thought to bring upon it."' (Jeremiah 18:7,8. Also see vv.9-11). The Jews thought differently and incorrectly. See for example the almost universally misunderstood Ezekiel 18. Here they had a PAGAN influenced idea of God's character. Also Isaiah 55:6-9.
---Marc on 11/3/12


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Marc, it seems by Warwicks answer that I miss what Phil said and only read what you wrote. Sorry for that. If Warwick saw it, then you are correct. Concerning Phil, I have tried to make out where he comes from only to be able to answer him. We know he is not trinitarian that is for sure. Many here on line are not either, they argue against the three Persons of the trinity especially against Jesus humanity opposing His divine nature. Thanks for the correction.
---Mark_V. on 11/3/12


MarkV,

It's obvious you don't even understand what Phil's case is, let alone my point against him. I think you need to go back and look at what Phil said. I can't explain it anymore, but you've missed the argument by a long shot.

Phil is some sort of Arian, most likely, while I'm a Trinitarian. Is that a help?
---Marc on 11/2/12


Mark, I think you need to go back and see what Marc wrote considering what Phil believes. I think you have misunderstood what Marc was saying.

Marc wrote the following to Phil "I asked you how ALL the fullness (i.e. infinite uncreatedness) of God can dwell in a supposedly (i.e. according to you) finite created being such as Jesus."
---Warwick on 11/2/12


Marc, I only answer to what you write down. You said,

"I asked you how ALL the fullness (i.e. infinite uncreatedness) of God can dwell in a supposedly (i.e. according to you) finite created being such as Jesus."

since you say he said it, and you want an answer from him, how the fullness of the Godhead can be in one finite creature, I answered you that it is not only possible but it's true, that in the finite human body of Jesus, all the fullnest does dwell Not only because He is also God, but because all the fullnest of God dwells in Him.
---Mark_V. on 11/1/12


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MarkV,

I'm rather bemused as to how you've concluded I don't believe that Jesus has all the fullness of the Godhead bodily. I'm bemused because it's the exact opposite of what I wrote, my initial and subsequent responses being unambiguously opposed to Phil's unequivocal belief Jesus does not hold all of God. I can only conclude that the Spirit of interpretation, whom you believe is residing and working in you and who gives you flawless understanding of all Scripture, is on strike.

If you can't understand little things like this, why should I believe you when you assert you know God better than I because you are certain God does not ever regret doing something, despite Scripture telling us God changed his mind on several occasions.
---Marc on 10/31/12


Phil, the good thing is that we are not going to the Great White Throne of Judgment. The bad thing is that we lose rewards for the bad things we do in life as a Christian at the Judgment Seat of Christ.

Ok. Your answers are off the wall. You make no sense at all when you speak about God. Not all gods are the Same. There is only One God. He is not made of stone wood gold, clay etc. Our God talks and does what He so desires,
To include this other gods with Almighty God just to proof an interpretation of a word is not very good Phil. My point was before answering know what you are implying. I do understand what you are saying and doing. That is why I answered you.
---Mark_V. on 10/31/12


---Mark_V. on 10/30/12 "Phil, your answers are off the wall."

Your slur is duly noted.

Mt 12:36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.

Be careful how you address others, Mark. Offending me is not an issue. But at the dais of Christ, where you and I are headed, it would be good to have as few offenses to account for as possible. It is a serious matter.

If you do not understand the point I was making, about theos and its meaning, then say so. It is not necessary to go over the top in your zeal for the Father and God of our Lord.
---Phil on 10/31/12


Marc, I sure do not want to persecute you, but your question suggest that Jesus Christ did not have the fullness of the Godhead, when Scripture says He did and still does.
"For in Him (Christ) dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily," (Col. 2:9).
And they asked Him "Where is Your Father?" (John 8:19)Jesus answered,
"Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins, for if you do not believe that I Am He, you will die in your sins" (John 8:24). The fullness of God the Father was Jesus Christ.
To the people who opposes the Truth, He answered with,
"You know neither Me nor My Father. If you had known Me you would have known My Father also" (v. 8:19).
---Mark_V. on 10/31/12


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God is the name most people use. God favored His people by revealing Himself by several names that offered special insight into His love and righteousness>>>Jehovah/Yahweh, Jehovah-Shalom. My favorite after the name God, which most people uses, would be Yahweh. Because, it's like your-way.
---pat on 10/30/12


Phil,

Nice answer...but to the wrong question.

I asked you how ALL the fullness (i.e. infinite uncreatedness) of God can dwell in a supposedly (i.e. according to you) finite created being such as Jesus. You responded by not responding. I'll take that as that you do not have an answer. Might be time you reviewed your theology as it seems to be unable to jump over a really basic point of who Jesus is.
---Marc on 10/30/12


Phil, your answers are off the wall. Are statues really gods? You imply because the word says 'god' satan is really God. Is he infinite? No. Is He Almighty? No. Is he omnipresent? No. Is he omnipotent? No. Is he omniscient? No.
He is a created being, just like the statues are created by man. He is the god of this age just like the statues were gods of that age. So to compare him with God is to put him equal to Our Lord Jesus Christ who created him. When you defend the Truth you better learn how to interpret correctly because what you are doing is bringing God to the level of Satan by your answers just to proof that Jesus Christ is not God. I'll give you the passages that speak about His Godly nature, character and attributes.
---Mark_V. on 10/30/12


---Marc on 10/29/12 "Care to answer how "ALL the fullness of God"

The English word "God" is not a name. It is a title.

Satan, in 2C 4:4 is called deity, the same word, theos, is used of the Father of our Lord.

This must be understood, or confusion will persist. The best rendering in English for the Greek word theos is deity.


God has no name. It is pointless, since names are used to identify, and when speaking of the One true Deity, there is a common conception, and all know Who is in mind.

All that the second Adam is, we will become. Ro 8:29 2C 3:18 Col 1:15 Col 3:10 The future fullness of deity in man is seen in the Son of mankind.
---Phil on 10/30/12


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---Mark_V. on 10/29/12

Thank you Mark, for your input. I always appreciate your graciousness.

I have spent countless hours scouring the Greek Writings to know exactly what God has said about Himself and His attributes. It took years to overcome what men had taught me, and to discard prejudices that had become built into my mind. Not unlike yourself, no doubt.

I have come to rely on Him, and not men or creeds to form my ideas now. It was not always that way, and I know the snares of orthodoxy from being bound to it in the past.

I pray the release of all the saints from its entrapments.
---Phil on 10/30/12


Phil, human beings wrote the Word in different times in history in different languages, who were inspired by the Holy Spirit. The word "theiotes," the attributes of God, His divine nature and properties: "Theotes" indicates the Divine essence of Godhood, the personality of God"- Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words. God is from the Greek "theios" which means "divine, deity" But you have to make a careful study of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and the Spirit will reveal the nature, properties, and characteristics which can only be found concerning God "Theios." The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are co-existent, co-eternal, and co-equal.
---Mark_V. on 10/29/12


Phil,

Care to answer how "ALL the fullness of God" (i.e. the infinite and uncreated) can exist in a being who, according to you, is merely finite and created (i.e. Jesus)?
---Marc on 10/29/12


---Mark_V. on 10/29/12

G2776 kephale KJV: head.
Used 79 times in KJV "head"

Ac 17:29 "the Godhead" [theou]
godhead is used for theou

Ro 1:20 "and Godhead" [theiotEs]
Godhead is used for theiotEs.

Col 2:9 "the Godhead" [theotEtos]
Godhead is used for theotEtos

Three different forms of the Greek word theos.
theou, theiotEs, theotEtos

Is it possible that Holy Spirit chose different words to say the same thing? Why not the same word?

Godhead in the preciseness of Greek would have to combine kephale + theos, to form "godhead".

It is not there.
---Phil on 10/29/12


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Phil, you have the interpretation of words all mixed-up. You say there is no Godhead in the bible, but there is. The word "Godhead" occures three times in the Scripture (Acts 17:29: Rom. 1:20: Col. 2:9). The word Godhead means (theiotes) which means "divinity, divine nature" The Godhead, then is divinity, divine nature, and the essence of God.
"God" the Creator is from the Greek "theios" which means "divine" deity.
I believe what has happen is that you are taking leasons from someone who has a perticular believe and that gives you their own meaning of words, as the Jehovah Witnesses do with the New World Translation. They interpret the words their own way.
---Mark_V. on 10/29/12


Phil, I believe that Christ (the anointed Messiah) Jesus (Yeshua) is fully God (Ya). John 10:30 "I and my Father are one." John 8:58 "Jesus said unto them, 'Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.'" KJV
I will never be convinced otherwise. The Bible says it, I believe it, that settles it.
---J_Marc on 10/28/12


---Marc on 10/27/12

I do not know what Arian is.

But, I do know when someone is using labels to promote their bias. Not being able to refute biblical evidence causes this. It is an avoidance tactic.

I cannot find "godhead" in any reliable Greek manuscripts. If God didn't use it, I cannot either, and be honest.

It is not a found in Scripture. Godhead is a false term.

How can I be honest and rational about a word that does not exist except in the Versions?

tEs theotEtos is "the Deity".

Col 2:9 is evidence of much that creedalists deny.
---Phil on 10/28/12


---J_Marc on 10/28/12

I believe that "there is no other God except One...."

And that this One is "God, the Father, out of Whom all is" (1 Cor.8:4-6).

The Father, the "Most High" (Luke 1:32) speaking relatively, rightly says to the Son, "Thy throne, O God [O Placer], is for the age of the age" (Heb.1:8).

Christ Himself is "the great God [Placer] and... Saviour" Whose advent we await (Titus 2:13).

However, Christ's Head is God (1 Cor.11:3), "the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory" (Eph.1:17).

The Father, ultimately speaking, is "the only God" (Jude 24,25, Rom.16:27, 1 Tim.1:17).
---Phil on 10/28/12


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MarkV,

You may be asking honestly, but you're not doing it intelligently. Go back and read what I've said to Phil. You obviously haven't understood the point I've made vis-a-vis Phil's theological view.
---Marc on 10/28/12


What are your views on the Sovereignity of God!
---pat on 10/19/12

Jeremiah 22:5 But if ye will not hear these words, I swear by myself, saith the LORD, that this house shall become a desolation.
---francis on 10/28/12


Phil, what do you do with these verses?Hebrews 1:8-9 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity, therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.1John 5:20-21 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life. Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
---J_Marc on 10/28/12


I believe the Sovereignty of God is in His Covanant promises and in His prophecies stated clearly in His Word. God has promised that whosoever believes in Jesus shall be saved.

5.Acts 15:11
But we believe that through the grace of the LORD Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Acts 16:31
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

1 Corinthians 1:21
For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
---kathr4453 on 10/28/12


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Marc, so we can conclude that by what you said,

"ALL the infinite uncreated, by logic, by definition, CANNOT reside in the finite creature.
---Marc on 10/27/12"


that you are not entering the kingdom of heaven and we might as well not listen to anything you have to say concerning the Word of God. Since you do not believe you are born of the Spirit. Because when a person is born of the Spirit, the Spirit of Christ lives in them. You are a finite creature, but you speak from a world point of view, your own logic. It has no spiritual significance. If you cannot understand how the Spirit of God was in the incarnated Jesus, how can you understand being in Christ? You never will. I'm speaking to you honestly.
---Mark_V. on 10/28/12


Phil,

This is one of those moments in your life where you have to be honest and rational.

Colossians 1 goes on to say that "In Jesus ALL the fullness of the Godhead dwells in him bodily." Now, you being an Arian, tell me how the INFINITE can exist in a FINITE creature...unless he is no creature but God.

ALL the infinite uncreated, by logic, by definition, CANNOT reside in the finite creature.
---Marc on 10/27/12


---J_Marc on 10/26/12 "WORD = GOD ! St. John 1:1"

The accuracy of this passage is hidden in creedal mists. The Greek manuscipts read as thus:

Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the word, and the word was toward God, and God was the word.
Jn 1:2 This was in the beginning toward God.

The Logos is the express visible image of the invisible God.
2C 4:4
Col 1:15

The Logos, or saying, of God is always pointing the way to the Father, the only True God. The Logos on earth, Jesus Christ, came to do only one Will, His Fathers'.

Never has the logos asserted Himself as the Deity.

He has a God, He has told us that. There is only One God, and Jesus, the Image of God, made that quite clear.
---Phil on 10/27/12


Bro. Christan, when it comes to hundreds of passages concerning the nature, character and attributes of God, so call Christians by-pass them everytime. If they believed them, it would change everything they were taught, for they have a theology that begins with man, and ends with God, instead of beginning with God and ending with man. Giving the glory to man before they give the glory to God. And they say we have a corrupt view. yet man is but sinful, and God is Holy, righteous and always reliable, man changes his mind like he changes his clothes. Yet they put their trust in man first, which is where people were before God saved them. Never surrendering to the will of God. Still holding on to their own control, their freedom from God.
---Mark_V. on 10/27/12


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WORD = GOD ! St. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

St. John 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
---J_Marc on 10/26/12


Any objections?
---christan on 10/25/12

None. If your intention was to magnify His word above His name, you have succeeded. Ps 138:2
---Phil on 10/26/12


Mark V, Thanks for the kind words, and peace to you as well! This blogging thing has been quite a blessing already, and boy does it ever make me study the Bible! I'm starting to dream about blogging! Very thankful for ChristaNet!
---J_Marc on 10/26/12


J Marc, thank you for putting that "J" in front of your name. The other Marc was here first. And welcome to CN. I hope that your experience will be a great one. One thing it will do for you, you will be digging for more of the word of God. It can only help you in your walk with the Lord. peace I leave you.
---Mark_V. on 10/26/12


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Sovereignty of God:

"But our God is in the heavens: He hath done whatsoever He hath pleased." Psalm 115:3

"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass, I have purposed it, I will also do it." Isaiah 45:7,46:11,12

"Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven."

Any objections?
---christan on 10/25/12


Good morning. Did you know Nebuchadnezzar had experienced some form of mental disorder [Dan. 4:34-37]. Often the most unlikely candidates for conversion are those upon whom God chooses to pour out the riches of His grace. Hallelujah.
---pat on 10/24/12


---Marc on 10/23/12 "Surely if man has no free will, how on earth can he then be held responsible for something he has no control over?"

You are correct.
Nowhere in Scripture does it say man is responsible for sin.

Each will give an account of the things done in the body.

He holds us accountable for our acts, but we are not held responsible for them. There is nothing man can do to clear himself of sin and evil.

It is failing to believe on the Son of God that condemns, not sin.

The problem of sin was dealt with entirely at Calvary.
---Phil on 10/24/12


Pat, when I think of God's sovereignty, I believe Daniel says it best!

Dan4:35 And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?
---trey on 10/23/12


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MarkV,

I was the original Marc. I have no need for numbers.
---Marc on 10/23/12


Mark V, Thanks for the advice, i will try J before marc from now on! sorry, please forgive, i'm new at this!
---J_Marc on 10/23/12


Marc, when you use someone's else name you are confusing, at least put a number after your name. You said,
"Confusing. If man caused the deaths of millions in camps, wasn't he freely doing it? Or are you saying man was not actually willing the deaths because he isn't free to do it?"
Hitler was free to kill Jews, no one had a gun to his head. But his will was enslave to sin, it was not free. He was doing the desires of his father the devil.
God hates sin, for He is holy and righteous. He does not will that man sin, they sin because they love it. Yet He ordained all that will come to pass. Even the death of Jesus. He didn't will that Judas betray Jesus, He knew that He would even before the foundation of the world.
---Mark_V. on 10/23/12


Mark V, A DIFFRENT Marc made THAT reply! i will be glad to study this subject And reply !!!
---Marc on 10/23/12


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"So,Phil, whose will was it that caused the millions to die in Nazi concentration camps: God's or men's?" Marc

The answer to this is simple. When God dealt severely with Israel, delivered them into bondage over and over, He declared this in Isaiah:

"Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass, I have purposed it, I will also do it."
Isaiah 46:10,11

Here lies the Sovereignty of God, now go figure.
---christan on 10/23/12


MarkV,
"It was not the will of God that those people die in the camps Marc, it was the evil will of man." And "Man has no free will."
Confusing. If man caused the deaths of millions in camps, wasn't he freely doing it? Or are you saying man was not actually willing the deaths because he isn't free to do it?

Surely if man has no free will, how on earth can he then be held responsible for something he has no control over? If he has control, then he has free will. Free will means responsibility. No free will, no responsibility. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
---Marc on 10/23/12


---Marc 10/22/12 "So,Phil, whose will was it that caused the millions to die in Nazi concentration camps: God's or men's?"

Your question is worthy of an answer, but, before I do, let me ask,

Whose will sent the most beautiful man ever to the Cross?

I venture to tell. It was His God and Father that willed He should suffer and die.

Ac 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain.

Mt 26:39 And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou [wilt].
---Phil on 10/23/12


So,Phil, whose will was it... God's or men's?
---Marc on 10/22/12

The Jews have always been, and always will be persecuted. They turned their backs on God. He chose them long ago as a demonstration to all nations. He is not finished with them yet, and none of the faithful Jews who were murdered will lose their allotment in the Land.

Death is for all. Sometimes with terror, sometimes with peaceful sleep. Do not forger the resurrection of all. Death is not the end of the plan of God to make mankind in His own image and likeness.

God's will and intention cannot be fully known. He has revealed what we need to know of His will.

As for the rest of His will, we remain ignorant.
---Phil on 10/23/12


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Marc, you asked Phil,

"So,Phil, whose will was it that caused the millions to die in Nazi concentration camps: God's or men's?"

It was not the will of God that those people die in the camps Marc, it was the evil will of man. That God allowed it to happen is a fact. He could have stopped it since He is God. All things serve a purpose in the plan of God. God allows sin to continue, and restrains it where He doesn't want it to continue. As with Pharaoh, God allowed his heart to hardened for a greater purpose. To proclaim the name of the Lord to all the world. God is the only One who is free to do what He so desires. He is autonomous. A law unto Himself. Man is not autonomous. he has no free will.
---Mark_V. on 10/22/12


Phil said, "There is but one free will in this universe, all other wills, human in particular, are subservient to His."

So,Phil, whose will was it that caused the millions to die in Nazi concentration camps: God's or men's?
---Marc on 10/22/12


That God possesses, [never let me forget where I came from] all power and is the ruler of all things. He rules in three areas Creation, human history, and Redemption. God works according to His eternal purposes, even through events that seem to contradict or oppose His rule. He is stll God. Like or lump it. Thank You Jesus.
---pat on 10/22/12


"What are your views on the Sovereignity of God!"
Pat, My view is that He is, sovereign.
"And when they heard it, they lifted their voices together to God and said, "Sovereign Lord, who didst make the heaven and the earth and the sea and everything in them,.. they cried out with a loud voice, "O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before thou wilt judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell upon the earth?" Act 4:24>Rev 6:10 RSV
---Josef on 10/21/12


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"Does not the potter have power over the clay, from the same lump to make one vessel for honor and another for dishonor?" (Romans 9:21) Going by this scripture, I see that God is my Potter who decides what He does with me. So, I need to totally submit to Him, and at every moment discover all He pleases to do with me > the potter is in personal contact with his clay, at every moment controlling what he does with the clay.

Because we are not God, we can not realize how much God is really in control. His control is more than we can believe and more than how much ones deny that He could be in control! (c:
---willie_c: on 10/20/12


What are your views on the Sovereignity of God!
---pat on 10/19/12
Exodus 20:11 For [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them [is],
---francis on 10/19/12


Isa 45:9 Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker!.. Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it, What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands?

Jer 18:3 Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold, he wrought a work on the wheels. And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make [it].

There is but one free will in this universe, all other wills, human in particular, are subservient to His.

Puny men believe the myth, that they are "free" with the exercise of their wills. They believe they are "sovereign" along with God.
---Phil on 10/19/12


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