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Where Do Babies Go

Where do babies go when they die?

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 ---Jed on 2/6/13
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Mark V, In ACTS 2:17 the Apostle Peter was quoting what was recorded in JOEL 2:28 as a response to some of the audience's reaction to them speaking in Tongues on Pentecost! In ACTS 2:17, Peter was saying, that which was taking place that day (the filling of the Holy Spirit: ACTS 2:1-4) and all that the people did WHILE filled with that Holy Spirit (speaking in Foreign Tongues, and later on, Visions, etc.) was a FULFILLMENT OF JOEL 2:28! MEANING, Mark, that the fulfillment of JOEL 2:28 BEGAN at Pentecost (ACTS 2:1-11) and WILL CONTINUE ON THROUGH until the Last Days (the darkened Sun and the blood-red Moon)! The fulfillment of JOEL 2:28 is over a LONG PERIOD OF TIME. NOT just in one short time-span in the Last Days. Re-read ACTS 2:1-17!
---Gordon on 2/13/13


Leon, If you're still attending this particular Blog, you are RIGHT. It does no good to cast Pearls to some. As YAHUSHUA says, in MATTHEW 15:14, "Let them alone: They be BLIND leaders OF THE BLIND. And, if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the Ditch." *sigh*
---Gordon on 2/13/13


"Gordon...[don't] ask Leon for help.[?] He speculates everything...[isn't] use to the Truth. His[?] taken authority to add to.... Because the word of God [isn't] good enough...The mysteries God didn't want us to know[?], he says he knows[?]...

You said I [didn't] understand...Acts 2:17...[it's] you who [doesn't] understand...[?}... [You're] way out of...context...Read the context & be convicted. Then [you'll] know the Truth & it will set you free."
---Mark_V. on 2/12/13


Wow! Did you notice how the delusional milky mouth rails against you & simultaneously spews scathing "ACCUSATIONS" at me? Incredible! :) Why would he think you'd believe him? I rest my case Gordon. :D
---Leon on 2/13/13


Mark, I cannot possibly answer for WHY God does the things He does. I can just hold him to his word when he declares something.

1. He has no pleasure in the death of the wicked but would rather they repent and live

2. He does not tempt men with sin

3. There are times of ignorance when he "winks" at a man's sins.

4. Repeatedly in scripture the age of 20 was used as a divider. Bible search "twenty years and over/under"

Numbers 32:11
"Surely none of the men that came up out of Egypt, from twenty years old and upward, shall see the land which I sware unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, because they have not wholly followed me"
---JackB on 2/13/13


Peter, HELLO? An infant is INCAPABLE of reasoning, so, of course they cannot repent. Neither are they capable of sinning. So, how do you see true justice that unborn and newborn infants are deemed guilty of sin, in action or deed?? And, their INVOLUNTARY BIRTH into sinful humanity makes them worthy of everlasting torments in Eternal Damnation?? As I said, the OSASers whose rear-ends are protected by GOD's "Predestinated Salvation" haven't a damn thing to worry about. So, ya know, "babies in Hell" is no skin of THEIR backs. But, if they were one of those "unsaved infants" dangled above the yawning jaws of Hell, they would be singin' a completely different tune about infants and Salvation. HYPOCRISY.
---Gordon on 2/13/13




All those that believe that because children can't reason like adults they are exempt from sin are saying that salvation is a matter of "merit" and not inheriting death from Adam!
Go back and study the scriptures and see that from the time we draw our first breath we are under the curse of death!
---1st_cliff on 2/13/13


Jack B, it does sound terrible that not all babies go to heaven. You give,
"Isaiah 7:14-16 (speaking of Jesus Christ) gives us a hint that there is an age that a child reaches before he knows to refuse evil and do good."
That passage is only speaking of Christ. It's not pointing to age of accountability of children. Let's say the age of accountability is true. That at some point in their age, they will be held accountable. Don't you think it would be better for them to die before they are held accountable? Because if they live they will be found guilty. Why have them live a life rebelling against God? Why not get rid of them while they are innocent? At some point, you would have no human beings left if you killed them all.
---Mark_V. on 2/13/13


I'm greatly saddened that so many could think our LORD could do such a thing as judging an infant. Speaks to me that many read about Him but do not KNOW Him by his Spirit!

Isaiah 7:14-16 (speaking of Jesus Christ) gives us a hint that there is an age that a child reaches before he knows to refuse evil and do good.

Children under the age of 20 weren't even counted in the census' of Israel, nor were they sent to war.

In times of ignorance God winks (Acts 17:30). An infant has no capacity to understand repentance from dead works and belief in Christ.

Some of these responses are nothing short of ludicrous.
---JackB on 2/13/13


Peter, that part where you say God is good, it depends on whom you mean He is good to. Lets see, He ordered the slaughter of the all the Canaanites, Amorites, Perizzites, Hivites, and the Jebusites, that includes women and children, even animals, for the purpose of helping Israel. He was good to Israel, but not very good to the others nations if we see with our eyes. So does God have mercy on whom He will have mercy? of course. He is God and as such is always right. He has compassion on whom He has compassion. He is obligated to no one, that is why He is God. Every decision He makes is right. Did all those babies have a chance to one day hear the gospel? I don't think so. Salvation is of the Lord. No one can bind God, no one.
---Mark_V. on 2/13/13


Gordon and Mark V: First for you, Gordon: We are told that we have to be accepted by God, and throughout the Bible the implication is that we have to ACCEPT God. I do NOT like what I say, but I can't find any other way to find a logical argument that finds it a different way.But I will say, it seems very sad. The only possible solution is if God forgives them because when the baby dies, it is not in a situation where it COULD make such a decision (to repent). But I DISLIKE taking big steps like that. I only accept what I see in the bible, and I don't see that

Mark V: You do accept it does not emotionally seem pleasant? We know that God is good, I do not dispute that. But in my heart, I feel I must not be understanding things right....
---Peter on 2/12/13




Trey, YOO-HOO! I'm right here! You do NOT, then, believe, despite what you said, that "all babies go to Heaven at death". Because, you cannot possibly convince anyone functioning with even 1/16th of their brain that "every single baby that dies is a predestinated-for-Heaven baby. And, that "no baby that dies was of an unsaved spiritual condition". So, YOU KNOW FOR A FACT that every baby that has died and will die is of a Born-Again status??
---Gordon on 2/12/13


Gordon, whatever you do, do not ask Leon for help. He speculates everything, he is not use to the Truth. His taken authority to add to the word of God. Because the word of God is not good enough, it needs his help. The mysteries God didn't want us to know, he says he knows. Another prophet.
You said I did not understand the passages in Acts 2:17) but it is you who does not understand the context. Has the Sun turned into darkness (v.20) Has the moon turned into blood? Has the coming of the great awesome "Day of the Lord Come?" You are way out of the context Gordon. And none has babies written in them.
Read the context and be convicted. Then you will know the Truth and it will set you free.
---Mark_V. on 2/12/13


Mark V, I'm afraid you misunderstand the full Context of ACTS 2:17. The Apostle Peter said that JOEL 2:28 just BEGAN to be fulfilled at that first Pentecost from ACTS 2:17. And, this JOEL 2:28 will continue to fulfill itself throughout the entire Church Age! It's not ONLY for those very last days preceeding YAHUSHUA's Return to Earth. And, do you know that by your own words of vehemently denying that babies go to Heaven, you are as some of the Disciples who cold-heartedly tried to hinder little children from approaching JESUS? Thus were they rebuked, Mark, by YAHUSHUA Himself. He said "Suffer little children to come unto Me and forbid them not, for of such is the Kingdom of GOD." LUKE 18:16.
---Gordon on 2/12/13


Gordon, I am now fully convinced that you cannot read english.

If someone is near Gordon who can read english, would you please tell him that I believe that all infants that die are going to heaven?

Yes, I believe in election and predestination and grace. I do not believe that the non-elect die in infancy or childhood. The non-elect are the wicked. Please read the Job 21:7. The wicked live a long wicked life. They do not suffer as God's children suffer.

Again, anyone near Gordon would you please interpret this for him seeing he cannot understand what I'm writing. :D
---trey on 2/12/13


"...did you ever hear me say...all babies go to hell?...Why [don't] you understand my speech? [?!] Those chosen before the foundation of the world will be saved. The rest...is condemned already...Everyone has to be born of God in order to enter [His]. Babies aren't born of God, they're born of the flesh, the reason they'll die. [?!] The same [is] true for ALL who are mentally sick. [?!] Only the elect will be saved. The rest will die in their sins..."
---Mark_V. on 2/11/13


Gordon: You can't reason with this type of deranged, egotistical pontification & hodgepodge mixing of truth with error. It's best to shake the dust off your feet & let them/him alone as I have. :)
---Leon on 2/12/13


"...GOD has taken some people to Heaven & back who testify that they saw the babies in Heaven & the LORD HIMSELF explained the mystery of what happens to all babies when they die. JOEL 2:28 & ACTS 2:17 are your Scriptures! These acts of GOD giving Visions of Heaven to HIS servants are no different...than what GOD did with the Apostle John at Patmos in REVELATION!...John wasn't a super-man. GOD gives Visions of Heaven to anyone whom HE pleases. HE's no respecter of persons! These Heavenly Visions are A PART of the fulfillment of GOD's Word in JOEL 2:28...GOD's revelation GIVEN to a man!"
---Gordon on 2/12/13


Gordon: The blog milky mouthes can't possibly understand the deep things of God. (Job 11:7-8)
---Leon on 2/12/13


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Trey, WHAT does JOB 21:7 have to do at all with babies going to Heaven?? That Verse addresses nothing about this, in any way. GOD's Grace COVERS the unborn and infants who have done NO WRONG, e'en though they are born into the race of sinful humanity. You people who preach OSAS are so very hypocritical. WHY? Because, you're damn sure that GOD is going to cover your butts with ample amounts of Grace, e'en when you KEEP ON A-SINNIN' (and *WHEW!* Thank the LORD for HIS Grace to cover MY SINS!" "And, I'M going to Heaven! WHEEEEEEE!LOL!" But, TO YOU? those little, tiny infants?? You say that GOD is sending them straight to HELL. You can't grasp that GOD's Mercy and Grace automatically covers the unborn and new-born.
---Gordon on 2/12/13


Gordon, you finally posted two passages that speak of the same thing. Not one mentions babies in heaven. Not one mentions this is happening now. Not one went to heaven and came back to tell us what God showed them about babies. Do you not understand the passages? This is speaking about the Day of the Lord see (Joel 2:29) and (2:31). That day has not come. You are talking about some future event that hasn't happen and that says nothing about babies. Please read the context. I will wait for other passages you might think of. But make sure they speak about the topic of babies. This way we or I can check the context. Thanks for answering.
---Mark_V. on 2/12/13


Gordon, **God has taken some people to heaven and back**
I would believe they were abducted by aliens before I believed that statement!
Somehow Gordon you don't seem to live in the real world!
Do you know the difference between a vision and hallucinations?
---1st_cliff on 2/12/13


Mark V, GOD has taken some people to Heaven and back who testify that they saw the babies in Heaven and that the LORD HIMSELF explained the mystery of what happens to all babies when they die. JOEL 2:28 and ACTS 2:17 are your Scriptures! These acts of GOD giving Visions of Heaven to HIS servants are no different, Mark, than what GOD did with the Apostle John at Patmos in REVELATION! The Apostle John was not a super-man. GOD gives Visions of Heaven to anyone whom HE pleases. HE's no respecter of persons! These Heavenly Visions are A PART of the fulfillment of GOD's Word in JOEL 2:28, Mark. Oh, I know your doubts on this. How you say that "Those're just the words of man." No, it's GOD's revelation GIVEN to a man!
---Gordon on 2/12/13


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Gordon, you posted 13 post, gave two passages that had nothing to do with babies. All you gave was an opinion. How you think things should be. Who you think should be saved or not. I know you have an opinion, but an opinion is not Truth, its an opinion. Most everyone who answered you gave you Scripture, even wrote it down for you. Mark E, answered with Scripture, and so did Trey and others. But you act as if you do not have to. You do not need to show anything, because you are right.
I said, concerning Scripture, those who believe by faith in Jesus Christ are born of God, and go to heaven, those that don't, go to the Great White Throne of Judgment where the books will be open. I do have an opinion after that. But only an opinion like you.
---Mark_V. on 2/11/13


We are ALL guilty before God, says God in Eph. 2:1. Hallelujah! Because of Adam and Eve we are All inheritors of corrupt nature....Because of Adam sin, God counted us guilty as well as Adam.
---pat on 2/11/13


Gordon, "shaking my head in disbelief of your ability to read and comprehend my statements or the scriptures I referenced". I emphatically do not believe that all babies that die go to hell. I believe that is what you wanted me to say.

If you understand the scripture verses that I quoted you would understand that Rachael symbolically represents the Jewish mothers who's baby boys were killed by the Romans at the time of Christ. The scriptures give them comfort in assuring them that they may have died but they will be resurrected on the resurrection morning.

If you would like to know of the wicked read: Job 21:7

Now, your welcome for the bible lesson!!!
---trey on 2/11/13


Gordon, Keeping people alive to suffer torment serves what other purpose than to "watch them"?
To teach them a lesson? for what purpose?
To say "I told you so?"
You know and I know that type of punishment far exceeds the crime
Depriving them of everlasting life is punishment enough and certainly more "just"!
The wages of sin is death!
---1st_cliff on 2/11/13


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Gordon, did you ever hear me say that all babies go to hell? I don't think so. Only the elect will be saved. Why do you not understand my speech? Those chosen before the foundation of the world will be saved. The rest of mankind is condemned already, heading to the Great White Throne of Judgment.
Jesus Christ is the way, the Truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father but through Him. "There is no one righteous, no, not one"
Everyone has to be born of God in order to enter the Kingdom of God. Babies are not born of God, they are born of the flesh, the reason they will die. The same holds true for all who are mentally sick. Only the elect will be saved. The rest will die in their sins. All humans die because of sin.
---Mark_V. on 2/11/13


1st Cliff, You said, on 2/9/13, "Gordon, You....tell us that He (GOD) burns humans in a fire for 'no other reason' but to hear them scream, forever yet!" Cliff, that is a LIE, and a complete misrepresentation of all that I've said on the subject of GOD and Eternal Damnation. You misqouted me out of your own clouded understanding of the Truths of GOD and Eternal Damnation. I never, ever said that GOD only damns people because He enjoys watching people suffer. GOD has people cast into Hell because they refuse to repent of their sin, and 'cause they reject Salvation through HIS Son YAHUSHUA (JESUS). GOD GRIEVES that people reject HIS Salvation, but, HE must stay true to HIS Word and execute Judgment!
---Gordon on 2/11/13


"Leon, God has proven much to me, enough to be a believer!
You'll have to admit that your so-called proof is pretty lame huh?...There's nothing in scripture about the "age of accountability" now is there , be honest Leon!
You know sometimes even you can actually be wrong,right?"
---1st_cliff on 2/10/13


Gee Cliffie, what a tirade! What, you didn't get to take your nap?! :)

You do know I haven't said anything about the "age of accountability" since this blog is specifically about babies (INFANTS). That was a very feeble (LAME) attempt, on your part, to make a point (win an argument). You're grasping at straws & you know it! Huh? :)
---Leon on 2/11/13


So, Mark V, tell us all plainly....You believe, then, that ALL BABIES go to Hell when they die? If they do not go to Heaven, they must end up in Hell, there'd be no other place for them to go. GOD only prepared two Options. So, again, tell us plainly and directly, that you believe that "all babies, when they die, go straight to Hell." At least, to Eternal Damnation. You keep saying that babies do not go to Heaven, at death. But, you won't verbalize that they end up in Hell. So, clarify it ALL for us, Cliff. So that we know completely where you stand on this. You have nothing to worry about. YOU'RE one of GOD's predestinated special elect. If all babies go to Hell....Oh, well. That's GOD's decision, RIGHT?
---Gordon on 2/11/13


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Mark V, You believe that Predestination means that ONLY certain people were chosen by GOD to be Saved, and that the rest of mankind were created as 'vessels of Wrath' created ONLY for Eternal Damnation. NOW, are you gonna turn right around and DENY that's what you've believed?? And, because "only certain people, AS YOU BELIEVE, were predestined for Heaven, that means many babies were NOT predestined for Heaven, but for Hell". And, you sit there and LIED, Mark, by saying that I "always talk alot WITH NO SCRIPTURE." What a LIE. I have brought up and quoted LOTS of Scripture! But, YOU reject that Scripture for the sake of the false doctrine of OSAS and for that false interpretation of Predestination.
---Gordon on 2/11/13


Gordon, before God, everyone is guilty of sin. No one deserves salvation. No one. While babies are very innocent in the fact that they have not acted out on their sinful nature, they also are condemned before God. Sin passed to all men including babies. I love babies just the same as anyone, and they are very cute but they are also sinful in nature, because as soon as they are born their flesh begins to die because of sin. When Jesus said,
"No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day" it meant all human beings.
---Mark_V. on 2/11/13


Gordon, you always talked alot with no Scripture. The only Scripture you gave was so wrong. You didn't even know what was "common" in that passage. Then you turn around and talk about predestination and OSAS, which has nothing whatsoever to do with babies, but you cannot find anything to support your views so you have to change the subject concerning this topic to sort of try to cut me down. You do not have to resort to other things, all you have to do is show Scripture. Talk is cheap. Since I started answering you, you have been wrong and do not like someone telling you that you are. I even had to answer you in spanish because it seemed to me you did not understand my answer in English. What else can a latino brother do?
---Mark_V. on 2/11/13


Leon, God has proven much to me, enough to be a believer!
You'll have to admit that your so-called proof is pretty lame huh?
Of course His ways are greater than ours,else He would not be God!
There's nothing in scripture about the "age of accountability" now is there , be honest Leon!
You know sometimes even you can actually be wrong,right?
---1st_cliff on 2/10/13


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"Leon, So that's your "proof" **God is just**
From a person who believes (like Gordon) that God tortures humans in a literal fire without end, n'"ed not talk about 'justice"
---1st_cliff on 2/10/13


I learned long ago, I (not even God, so far) CAN'T prove anything to you Cliff. So be it!

Here's a little food for thought: Isaiah 55:8-9 (KJV)

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
---Leon on 2/10/13
---Leon on 2/10/13


This has been a debate for the past..... many centuries. The oldest I remember was from St.Augustine, who agreed with Cluny that unbaptised babies would not be saved - I have not opinion as to whether Augustine LIKED what he believed would happen

But this is something that has divided the church, even between people within the same denomination

We here have no hope of sorting it out

I cannot put a personal view
---Peter on 2/10/13


1st Cliff, Would it be just to not convict child molesters, rapists, cold-blooded murderers, terrorists and wife-beaters if they were caught? If you were working in the authority of the law, would you let these people go, because you feel it would be "unjust" to convict and punish them? You, Cliff, do not see sin the way that the Almighty and Holy GOD sees sin. You do not even TRY to see sin as HE does. It shows by what you say on these Blogs! Some others, and I, DO try to see and go along with how GOD sees Sin. Your view of "justice" is WIMPY and FRAUDULENT. It just screams out for Sin to always get a pass for fear of Eternal Damnation. Oh, wait.....you believe in "annihilation".....
---Gordon on 2/10/13


"Leon, So that's your "proof" **God is just**
From a person who believes (like Gordon) that God tortures humans in a literal fire without end, n'"ed not talk about 'justice"
---1st_cliff on 2/10/13


I learned long ago, I (not even God, so far) can prove anything to you Cliff. So be it!

Here's a little food for thought: Isaiah 55:8-9 (KJV)

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
---Leon on 2/10/13


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Leon, So that's your "proof" **God is just**
From a person who believes (like Gordon) that God tortures humans in a literal fire without end, need not talk about "justice"
---1st_cliff on 2/10/13


Mark V, Please don't do WHAT, Mark? Tell the TRUTH? You filter the Scriptures, which deal with Salvation and Damnation, through your skewed version of "Predestination" and the false doctrine of OSAS. So, you're too blinded to SEE what the Scriptures are really saying. Read the Context that surrounds HEBREWS 10:29. Read the whole Chapter 10 of HEBREWS. It's talking about Christians. The word "sanctified" refers to a Christian, Mark. Because YAHUSHUA was ALREADY Sanctified before the Foundation of the World. He was NOT "Sanctified" by His own Blood. His Blood was Sanctified by Who He WAS (and IS) already! Your doctrinal blindness is what keeps you from seeing the Truth about where infants and the unborn go at Death.
---Gordon on 2/10/13


TREY, {{shaking head in disbelief}} So, you really believe that all babies and little infants ALL end up in Hell and in the Lake of Fire where they will suffer horrific torments throughout all Eternity?? You really believe that?? If babies don't go to Heaven, (as you are insinuating), then, they have to end up in Eternal Damnation. There is NO "annihilation", like some on here are believing!) and there is NO third alternative place to go to, aside from Heaven and Hell. I'm so grateful that the Almighty GOD of the Holy Bible has more Grace than YOU'RE willing to believe HE does!
---Gordon on 2/10/13


1st Cliff, Your way of believing is very enigmatic. You refuse to believe that GOD damns people in Eternal Torments, because, as you reason, "GOD is not a cruel tyrant". BUT, yet, you are damned determined, and are willing to believe, with ARMS WIDE OPEN, that GOD would refuse little infants and unborn babies entrance into HIS Heavenly Kingdom! *ugh*
---Gordon on 2/10/13


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"Cluny, "Unbaptized" babies?? What in the world is THAT all about? So, only baptized babies have a chance at Heaven? Foolishness in putting more faith in "Orthodoxy" of one religious teaching of a certain "Denomination" as opposed to that of another Denomination. Almighty GOD's Truths are not confined by the teachings and doctrines of religious men. GOD's Grace is that ALL INFANTS go to Heaven at death. If they do not go to Heaven at death, Cluny, then, Where DO they go? To HELL, maybe?"
---Gordon on 2/7/13


Ditto, nice try Gordon, but your words fell on deaf ears there.
---Leon on 2/10/13


"Thank you for all the answers! As I was reading through all your answers there was one that really made me think.

"Babies do not know accountability or right from wrong. they're innocent in Gods eyes & will be received by him. Why would he destroy the baby like he does the wicked when they do not know anything? He won't. Again at the ressurection babies will go to be with God."
---Candice on 2/7/13

...What about severely mentally retarded adults who have the functioning of an infant, without the ability to fully understand right and wrong? Will they be held accountable?"
---Jed on 2/9/13


God is just Jed! :)
---Leon on 2/10/13


Gordon, The blog is about babies and where they go. As to your statement,
"How about you denying that HEBREWS 10:29 declares that a "sanctified' (Saved) person CAN lose their Salvation?"
Gordon, Jesus Christ was sanctified.
"will he (person) be thought worthy who has trampled the Son of God (Jesus) underfoot, counted the blood of the covenant by which he (Jesus Christ) was sanctified a common thing,.." These people trampled the Son of God, count the blood of the covenant by which he (Christ was sanctified a common thing). The passage is not speaking about people who were saved and lost salvation. It's speaking of those who know the truth and trampled the Son of God. So please don't do that.
---Mark_V. on 2/10/13


As for you, go back home. When you set foot in your city, the boy will die. All Israel will mourn for him and bury him. He is the only one belonging to Jeroboam who will be buried, because he is the only one in the house of Jeroboam in whom the Lord, the God of Israel, has found anything good.

1 Kings 14:12-13
---aaron on 2/10/13


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My I just echo 1st Cliff's statements!

Ps51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me.

King David was stating that he is a sinner formed in iniquity because his mother and father were sinners. By the way they were born sinners because their parents were sinners and so on all the way back to Adam.

Rom5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

The all men include infants.

With sin there is no reverse age discrimination!
---trey on 2/10/13


There's nothing in scripture about the "age of accountability"
We are born sinful,inherited from Adam.We have death on us from day 1,No one yes ,no one is born "innocent" .
This "age of accountabbility " is just emotional nonsense!
---1st_cliff on 2/9/13


If, as St. Paul says, the children of at least one Christian parent are clean, then there is NO reason why these little ones should not be baptized! Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/9/13


"...What does "unclean" children mean?"
---1st_cliff on 2/9/13


Unclean means FOUL, EVIL. Paul tells the Church to treat unsaved (unruly, wild & otherwise wayward) children ( & spouses) as an integal part of the born again believer (the one who has the mandate to win them to Christ in the home). The Church is to help the believer in their home ministry. It's much like God the Father sees formerly UNCLEAN born-again believers thru His Son Jesus' blood sacrifice. In the eyes of the Church, the children...are covered while the believer lives. Afterwards, they're on their own!

ThE blog is about "babies" who are ignorant of their sin condition. God is just Cliff! :)
---Leon on 2/9/13


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Thank you for all the answers! As I was reading through all your answers there was one that really made me think.

"Babies do not know accountability or right from wrong. they're innocent in Gods eyes & will be received by him. Why would he destroy the baby like he does the wicked when they do not know anything? He won't. Again at the ressurection babies will go to be with God."
---Candice on 2/7/13


I'm not saying this is right or wrong. But this comment led me to another very thought provoking question.

What about severely mentally retarded adults who have the functioning of an infant, without the ability to fully understand right and wrong? Will they be held accountable?
---Jed on 2/9/13


Leon, **The passage hasn't a thing to do with the death of children**
What does "unclean" children mean?
---1st_cliff on 2/9/13


That is a hot question among the church today! Scripture does not elaborate. However, I have read, that God certainly knows the life of each human-being down the road, in pertaining to whether or not babies goes to hell or not. I am not going to speculate. I am glad I am saved. That's it!
---pat on 2/9/13


Gordon, You go to great lengths to describe God's mercy but turn aroud and tell us that He burns humans in a fire for no other reason but to hear them scream, forever yet!
You can't have it both ways!
---1st_cliff on 2/9/13


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"...1Cor.7.14: '...the unbelieving husband... sanctified through his wife & the unbelieving wife... sanctified through the believing husband OTHERWISE YOUR CHILDREN WOULD be UNCLEAN'"
---1st_cliff on 2/8/13


Wow Cliff, I'm amazed you'd actually stand on the God-Inspired words of St. Paul! :)

First Cor. is about family in regards to married life. Meaning: If there's a believing (born again) husband or wife, their unbelieving spouse & children should be seen by the Church as dedicated to the Lord "works in progress". They're not to be stink eyed (disrespected). Why not? "BECAUSE" they're in the household of a Believer. The passage hasn't a thing to do with the death of children.
---Leon on 2/9/13


OSAS???
1Pet1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

Php1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ:

Ps37:28 For the LORD loveth judgment, and forsaketh not his saints, they are preserved for ever: but the seed of the wicked shall be cut off.

Rom8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?

Who mean you!!!
OSAS - sounds correct to me.
---trey on 2/9/13


Mark V, There's not one Verse in the Holy Bible that DIRECTLY denies that unborn babies go to Heaven. YAHUSHUA is the only Way to Heaven, and He Himself calls all unborn and newborn infants to Heaven, by HIS Grace and Mercy. Me throw away the Bible?? How about you denying that HEBREWS 10:29 declares that a "sanctified' (Saved) person CAN lose their Salvation? Also, JOHN 15:6 warns against backsliding into unrepentant sin that leads to Damnation. But, you yourself deny those Words of GOD. So, I'll get rid of my Bible if you turn away from the false doctrine of OSAS and the false interpretation of "Predestination".
---Gordon on 2/9/13


Mark V, The fact that babies are in Heaven is not my "opinion". It's a fact. But, it's not my job to convince you. I'm only to report the Truth. And I have. What you do with it is your choice (free-will!) You believe that GOD has Mercy on you daily (esp. when you sin daily, as you've mentioned before. YOU call yourself a "Sinner" not a "Saint".) And, GOD does show you Mercy daily. Yet, you believe that GOD shows NO Mercy to billions of aborted and unborn babies. So, to you, GOD's Mercy is ONLY for those who are "predestined" to receive HIS Mercy, like....YOU. But, the unborn babies? They can all go to Hell, as far as you're concerned, right? Just as long as YOU'RE "predestined" for Heaven....
---Gordon on 2/9/13


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Gordon, it is nice of you to put your opinion down, and you do, lots of them over and over, but it is only your opinions on how you think things should be done. Not how God wants things to be done but how you want things to be done. You have a better way. But none of what you say is found in Scripture. You overlook what God says because you do not want to accept it. In your mind, it cannot be true. If you do not believe it, just throw the Bible away and follow your own mind. You are missing your spiritual discernment.
---Mark_V. on 2/9/13


Leon, Since you asked .!Cor.7.14 "for the unbelieving husband has been sanctified through his wife and the unbelieving wife has been sanctified through the believing husband OTHERWISE YOUR CHILDREN WOULD be UNCLEAN"
---1st_cliff on 2/8/13


These scriptures speak of the male children slain by Herrod at the time of Christ:

Jer31:15 Thus saith the LORD, A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation, and bitter weeping, Rahel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children, because they were not.
Jer31:16 Thus saith the LORD, Refrain thy voice from weeping, and thine eyes from tears: for thy work shall be rewarded, saith the LORD, and they shall come again from the land of the enemy.
Jer31:17 And there is hope in thine end, saith the LORD, that thy children shall come again to their own border.

i.e. They shall rise again at the resurrection!
---trey on 2/8/13


If we understand:
Rom5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Then we know that all men, women and children are sinners in need of a saviour.

If we understand: 1Tim1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, ...

Because we are sinners Christ came.

If we understand that he is the same yesterday, today and forever, then we can understand that babies, teenagers, and adults all through time that go to heaven go there by the grace of God and the finished work of Christ!!!
---trey on 2/8/13


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Mark Eaton, I will tell you plainly, There are MILLIONS of babies and infants and children in Heaven. You and some of the others here do not have to believe it. It is, nonetheless, TRUE. If you make it to Heaven, yourself, you will find this to be so.
---Gordon on 2/8/13


"...the bible says babies go the way of their parents.
When God destroyed groups, their children went with them!
There is no heavenly nursery!"
---1st_cliff on 2/7/13


Bible passage(s) please Cliff.
---Leon on 2/8/13


That "OF SUCH" MEANS that GOD's Kingdom has SUCH ONES AS THEY (the little children) there!
---Gordon on 2/8/13

You really should look up the definition of the word "such" in the dictionary before you shoot your mouth off.

"Such" means "Of the type previously mentioned or of the type about to be mentioned, or of a kind or character indicated or suggested"

As you can see, it is an adjective describing something having the same characteristics as the item being mentioned, yet definitely not identical to the item being mentioned.
---Mark_Eaton on 2/8/13


Cluny, You just have to know GOD, know what HE does and understand HIS Written Word.
---Gordon on 2/8/13


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Mark V, YAHUSHUA said not to keep little children from approaching Him, for "OF SUCH" is the Kingdom of Heaven. That "OF SUCH" MEANS that GOD's Kingdom has SUCH ONES AS THEY (the little children) there! So, HOW on GOD's Green Earth can you claim that YOU, YOURSELF are "one of GOD's chosen Elect" that HE alone "chose YOU to be one of HIS 'Chosen'", and yet adamantly believe that hundreds upon thousands of little unborn babies who've died or were aborted are cast into Eternal Damnation to suffer for all Eternity???? 'Cause, AS I SAID, Mark, if the babies don't eventually go to Heaven someday, they WILL end up in HELL, for there's no third alternative! Your thinking is TWISTED on this matter, Mark. PERIOD.
---Gordon on 2/8/13


Mt 18:3
I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

Ezekiel 16:20
And you took your sons and daughters whom you bore to me and sacrificed them. Was your prostitution not enough?"

Ezekiel 23:37 they even sacrificed their children, whom they bore to me.

Mt 19:14 Let the children come to me and do not try to prevent them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.

Is 49:15
Can a mother forget the baby at her breast and have no compassion on the child she has borne? Though she may forget, I will not forget you!

Lk 13:34
how often I have longed to gather your children as a hen gathers her chicks."
---bike on 2/8/13


Gordon, we all have much to learn about heaven. You said,
" YAHUSHUA specifically stated that the Kingdom of Heaven consists of little children!"

Gordon, Jesus never said such a thing. (Matt. 18:3) says,
"unless you are converted and become "as" little children.." speaking about humbleness in the context.
(Matt. 19:14) says,
"Let the little children come to me and do not forbid them, for (of such) is the kingdom of heaven" The passage does not say heaven consist of little children. Neither does Luke (18:17)
"Whoever does not receive the kingdom of God "as a little child" will by no means enter it"
---Mark_V. on 2/8/13


Gordon,One doesn't need to go to heaven to know what goes on there, IE Many scriptures like "the meek shall inherit the earth" show that the earth is man's home not up in the sky!
Jesus promised to take some there to be
"Kings and Priests"(and they're all adults) so everyone jumped on the heavenly bandwagon.
No, the dead are resurrected to life here on old Terra firma!
Adam was mandated to "fill the earth" not the heavens.
He already had a hundred million angels there ,why would he need earthlings?
---1st_cliff on 2/8/13


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\\GOD's Grace is that ALL INFANTS go to Heaven at death\\

I'll bet you cannot give a SINGLE Biblical verse to prove your point.

That's why Orthodoxy lets God sort it out.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/7/13


1st Cliff, Have you ever been to Heaven?? How do you KNOW FOR CERTAIN that there are "no heavenly nurseries"?? (lol) You have so much to learn about Heaven! YAHUSHUA specifically stated that the Kingdom of Heaven consists of little children! So, I'll ask you AGAIN. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TO HEAVEN where you can get on here and tell us all that FOR CERTAIN there are "no nurseries for babies and children in Heaven"?? And, PLEASE don't answer back with "the Bible does not say anything about nurseries", 'cause you don't believe a few other crucial things that ARE in the Bible. Namely, the reality of Eternal Damnation (which is completely different than "eternal annihilation").
---Gordon on 2/7/13


Candice, Your post is like the more typical emotional ones who like the warm and fuzzies,but the bible says babies go the way of their parents.
When God destroyed groups ,their children went with them!
There is no heavenly nursery!
---1st_cliff on 2/7/13


GOD's Grace is that ALL INFANTS go to Heaven at death. If they do not go to Heaven at death, where DO they go?
---Gordon on 2/7/13

Let's let Scripture teach us:

Rom 3:23 "for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God"

Rom 5:12 "Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned."

Where is the exception? Who is exempted from the word "all" in these verses? Perhaps here:

1 Cor 7:14 "For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband, otherwise your children would be unclean, but now they are holy"
---Mark_Eaton on 2/7/13


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Gordon, you talk alot but nothing from the word of God. You say,

"GOD's Grace is that ALL INFANTS go to Heaven at death."

Show one passage, where God tells us all babies go to heaven? There is not one. Tell God about your "age of accountability" see what that does for God. Maybe God forgot to mention something you thought about.
God said,
"He who believes in Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." Did you read, except babies until their age of accountability? All of the Elect are going to be saved, and they only. Those chosen from before the foundation of the world by God.
---Mark_V. on 2/7/13


Babies donot know accountability or right from wrong. they're innocent in Gods eyes & will be recieved by him. Why would he destroy the baby like he does the wicked when they donot know anything? He won't. Again at the ressurection babies will go to be with God.
---Candice on 2/7/13


Cluny, "Unbaptized" babies?? What in the world is THAT all about? So, only baptized babies have a chance at Heaven? Foolishness in putting more faith in "Orthodoxy" of one religious teaching of a certain "Denomination" as opposed to that of another Denomination. Almighty GOD's Truths are not confined by the teachings and doctrines of religious men. GOD's Grace is that ALL INFANTS go to Heaven at death. If they do not go to Heaven at death, Cluny, then, Where DO they go? To HELL, maybe?
---Gordon on 2/7/13


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