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Saved By The Blood

Are we saved by the ENTIRE Christ, or merely His blood in isolation from His physical human body?

If the former, were not the few drops shed at His circumcision sufficient, as they were shed in obedience to the Father.

Talk amongst yourselves.

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 ---Cluny on 4/22/13
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The seg are you mentally ill?
Read Daniel 12:1-4
---francis on 5/17/13


Heretic francis, you keep going in circles as the Seg said. No matter how many Scriptures you try to twist to say Jesus is Michael, you remain with Michael and not Jesus Christ. Samuel seems to think it is not important. Of course it is not important to him. He is also an SDA like you. He is comfortable with Michael also. When you realize Jesus is God, then your eyes will be open. Angels can save no one from the wrath of God who is Jesus Christ the Creator of all things.
---Mark_V. on 5/18/13


So what happen to (like)
Resembling something is never that something.

You foolish man:
Gen_1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:
Would you also have them believe, Man is God?

You have twisted the word of God so must so that you, yourself.
Cannot see what you have made. You have blinded yourself.
And you say see what God has done!

But above all remember this, when your time comes.
And you're tired of calling out to Michael!
Try the name Jesus Christ, don't forget that. Jesus Christ!

Now see if you can understand THIS!
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is (None Other Name) under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
---TheSeg on 5/17/13


To me this is a pointless question. It is just about arguing for the sake of arguing. It really does not matter any more then how many angels can fit on the head of a pin.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/17/13


Num 13:13 Michael-Who is God--This is Not Jesus
1Chr 5:13,14, 6:40, 7:3, 8:16, 12:20, 27:18 Michael-Who is God--Again, Not Jesus
2Chr 21:2 Michael-Who is God--Nope
Jude 1:9 Michael-Who is God--Jesus?
---micha9344 on 5/17/13




Even Michael would point him to God.
---TheSeg on 5/17/13
Is that not what Jesus came to do:
Michael means who is God

Who is God but Jesus?

John 14:9 he that hath seen me hath seen the Father,

Colossians 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Philippians 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Why do you pretend that words have no meaning?
---francis on 5/17/13


Mark
I really believe, if francis was really looking at Michael the archangel.
Even Michael would point him to God. So it can't be Michael the archangel he's looking at. He is just really really confused!

You ever see a dog chasing it own tale. This is the same way he looks at the bible, just going around in circles. He also tries to make people follow him, like he going someplace.

But he keeps taking you right back to the same place you started walking with him, just going in circles!
Then he says EXPAND! But what he really means is he wants you to walk him in an ever bigger circle.

Thank God! People get tired of walking in circles.
Even bigger ones!
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/17/13


---TheSeg on 5/16/13
EXPAND

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? [Is] the law sin? God forbid.

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Romans 9:14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid

Galatians 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
---francis on 5/17/13


You mean 1Jn_2:3?
And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

Now read 1Jn_2:4,5,6. Dont skip them read them!
Now you come to 1Jn_2:7, did you read it? But you dont understand it?
He doesnt write a new one, but repeats the old one, you had from the beginning. The one you think youre keeping!

Now you come to 1Jn_2:8
Here, he says a new commandment I write unto you!
Giving you what Christ himself said to you in Joh_13:34!
Now read 9,10and11.
Yea I know you cant understand!

But in 2Jn_1:5 he says it again, that we love one another!
Because of Christs sayings in Mat_22:40!

But see, Christ knowing your foolish heart.
Made it clear before you, Joh_15:12!
---TheSeg on 5/17/13


Francis, even though I do not see your heart to know if you are saved or not, by what comes out of your mouth I know you are not. Then you give more evidence of your apostasy when you say Jesus Christ is Michael the archangel. You are no different then the Jehovah Witnesses and Mormons.
You also suggest you keep the commandments, you don't say you keep a few, and that is saying you do not sin, and (1 John 1:8) states that if you claim you do not sin the Truth is not in you. No Truth, no salvation. You are not a child of God. Jesus who is Lord and Creator of all things is not your God. Michael the archangel is, which gives you the title of heretic.
---Mark_V. on 5/17/13




The Seg so is John mistaken whrn he says that we know we God when we keep his commandents? Is Jesus wrong when he srays if you love me keep my commandments?

Is john crazy when he says uhat the saints are those who keep the commandments and have faith in Jesus m

What then shall we sin because we are under law and not grace?
---francis on 5/16/13


If you are not able to claim these, then you are not saved
francis on 5/16/13

But, you are saved by these!
Rom_8:24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
Eph_2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

And these you are not able to claim!
Because they are a gift from God!
Good thing they are your also!
But you dont understand this neither!
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/16/13


---shira4368 on 5/16/13
1 John 2:28 And now, little children, abide in him, that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming.

1 John 3:7 shira4368 , let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
---francis on 5/16/13


francis, your blogs sound so self righteous, it is sickening. God hates pride...mark 7:22. 1 timothy 3:6....1 john 2:16.
---shira4368 on 5/16/13


I am one of the Saints?
I keep the commandments of God?
---TheSeg on 5/16/13
If you are not able to claim these, then you are not saved

1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

1 John 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
---francis on 5/16/13


It would be boasting to claim your own righteousness!
I agree!

Then I should be sorry, SF!
I must have misunderstood you!
But let's see, did you say:

I am one of the Saints?
I keep the commandments of God?
I have no sin?
I don't sin?

You also believe Michael the Archangel is the name of God.
And that you should worship him!

Is It just Michael the Archangel, you should worship and not the others?
Not sure, get back to me on that.

And this to you is not claiming your own righteousness?
Nor in your mind is this boasting?

You also call other people names, thereby showing the lack of love in your heart. But you can't understand these things, can you?
---TheSeg on 5/16/13


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By Father, By The Word, and by The Holy Spirit.
Even in being called a Saint by the ones around you.
But it is boasting to call yourself a saint.
---TheSeg on 5/16/13
No it's not. It is never boasting to identify yourself with God,


It would be boasting to claim your own righteousness, but to call yourself, or be called a son or God, a daughter of God, one of the siants of God, the righteousness of God, an heir with Christ is not boasting, this is who we are in christ.


so you now resort to saying you are a saint and I am a sinner. ---Mark_V. on 5/15/13

IDIOT!! when did I do such
---francis on 5/16/13


You and seg seem to think that it is boasting to be called a saint.
There is no boasting in being called a saint.

By Father, By The Word, and by The Holy Spirit.
Even in being called a Saint by the ones around you.
But it is boasting to call yourself a saint.
Yes, I know you dont understand this.
If ye had known Christ, ye should have known his Father also.
You know neither, sorry.

Luk_18:9 And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others:
Luk_18:14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other:
Read why!
Gal_6:3 For if a man think himself to be something,

Peace
---TheSeg on 5/16/13


francis, you did not have an answer to,

""where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith..." (Rom. 3:27,28).

so you now resort to saying you are a saint and I am a sinner. Now that is boasting, and self-righteous of you. We might all be saints but we are sinners saved by the Grace of God. For if you claim you have no sin, you deceive yourself and the Truth is not in you,
"If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His Word is not in us" (1 John 1:8,10). You can boast all you want of not been a sinner, that gives proof the truth is not in you, and you call God a liar. So go for it, tell God you are not a sinner.
---Mark_V. on 5/15/13


how can anyone eat meat and still suck a bottle? ---shira4368 on 5/12/13

My point exactly!
---Nikki on 5/12/13


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---Mark_V. on 5/12/13
You and seg seem to think that it is boasting to be called a saint.

The saints are the people of God both dead and alive. This is the preferred word used throughout the bible to refer to those people of God

It seems that you prefer a non biblical term "sinner saved by grace."

I prefer to be called what God calls me:
Daniel 7:18 the saints of the most High
1 John 3:1 the sons (and daughters) of God:
Romans 8:17 heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ,

Mark_V let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. 1 John 3:7 CLAIM IN IN JESUS NAME TODAY!!!!!!

Philippians 3:9 the righteousness which is of God by faith:
---francis on 5/12/13


how can anyone eat meat and still suck a bottle? some here only know about 1 thing and that is driven in the ground.
---shira4368 on 5/12/13


Francis, Francis, why are you feeding them meat?
They can't chew yet. They are happy with their milk.

1 Corinthians 3:1-2
---Nikki on 5/12/13


francis, of course the Truth is garbish to you. How could it possibly be Truth to you? Just not possible.
You can carry on with the letter of the law, but your fruits show no evidence of the Spirit of God.
"But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed being witnessed by the Law and the prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ to all and on all who believe." (Rom. 4:21,22).

"where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that man is justified by faith, apart from the deeds of the law" (Rom. 3:27,28).
---Mark_V. on 5/12/13


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You believe your righteous,... and a Saint!
---TheSeg on 5/9/13

I used to be disappointed in your post, you use up all 125 words and say nothing. I am no longer disappointed, I have come to expect garbage from your post. Because you do not use the bible when you post, not in context nor in doctrine, you post foolishness

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous

Psalms 34:9 O fear the LORD, ye his saints:

Romans 15:25 But now I go unto Jerusalem to minister unto the saints.

2 Corinthians 13:13 All the saints salute you.

Rev 14:12 the saints: they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
---francis on 5/11/13


Mark_V read in the bible is the letter of the law about circumcision, and tried to apply it to the ten commandments, thus his post, like yours, and the seg's are garbage

Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly, neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly, and CIRCUMCISION IS THAT OF THE HEART, in the spirit, and not in the letter,

God wants the heart to be circumcised, that is the spirit, or intent of circumcision

Deuteronomy 10:13 To keep the commandments of the LORD, and his statutes, which I command thee this day for thy good?

Deuteronomy 10:16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.
---francis on 5/11/13


markv, please ingnore francis, I honestly believe he is trying to stir up strife. he has no clue what he is talking about. all he can say is the law, law, law. I am going to honestly try to not ever read anything he says ever ever.
---shira4368 on 5/11/13


Brother Mark_V. Really!
This man says he keeps the law and has convinced himself of it!
I'm not saying give up on him.

But, so long as he believes he is righteous before God.
Which is what, he really, really believes!
It's always in his words.
There is no walking with him.

He does not see the need for Christ in the flesh.
That's why he can believe an angel can be Christ the lord.
Or god, or anything else he wishes to believe.

He denies Christ only came in the flesh.
You can't help him, really it's up to God!

All we can really do is hope and pray for him.
And love him as a brother in the spirit!
God bless you
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/11/13


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Every time you bring the letter of the law, you are thinking in the flesh, not in the Spirit.
---Mark_V. on 5/11/13
Garbage like all your post

Ephesians 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more:
Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother,
Romans 7:7 Thou shalt not covet.
James 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill.

See how the apostles bring up the letter of the law?
Lets drop it because you are full of garbage
---francis on 5/11/13


francis, why are you not listening? I gave you the answer and you keep bringing it up over and over just to make a point. You say again,
"So how do you keep the spirit,and not the letter of thou shall not commit adultery?"
Because we live by faith in Christ. We do not live our lives in the flesh but in the Spirit. We walk in the Spirit. Do you not know anything of the Spirit of God? You are living in the flesh trying to keep the law hoping that will get you into the kingdom of God. Your works mean nothing without faith in Jesus Christ, they are as filthy rag's. Anything without faith is sin. Every time you bring the letter of the law, you are thinking in the flesh, not in the Spirit.
---Mark_V. on 5/11/13


you are the only one who can't shut up about the law. we get it, really we do.
---shira4368 on 5/10/13
LOL

So you are not able to explain to me how you keep the spirit fo the law when the law says do not commit adultery, and yet nto keep the letter of the law. No one can that is my point

P S every single NT writer except for Jude writs about the law of God. Maybe being baptist has blinded you to the law of God

Proverbs 28:9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer [shall be] abomination.
---francis on 5/11/13


Samuel, you say,

". We disagree is that you seem to think if you kill a person in the flesh that would not be breaking the spirit of the law. Is that what you are saying?" I sure don't think like you think. You know why? Because the Spirit of God convicts my spirit what's right and what's wrong.
Second, I do not lose my salvation because I sin, since there is no more condemnation to those in Christ. I am given every spiritual gift to help me through this life
"so that you are not lacking in any spiritual gift, as you wait for the revealing of our Lord Jesus Christ, who will sustain you to the end, guiltless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.." (1 Cor. 1:7-9).
---Mark_V. on 5/11/13


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francis, please don't try to explain about the law. I know about the law. please just try to explain to someone else who don't get it. I have heard enough about the law. do you honestly think you are the only one who knows the law? you are the only one who can't shut up about the law. we get it, really we do.
---shira4368 on 5/10/13


--shira4368 on 5/10/13

OK, now explain to me using thou shall not commit adultery, which is the letter of the law, how you keep the spirit of the law, and not the letter?

I say that the spirit of the law when it comes ot thou shallnot commit adulterty is not to even think about it, not to even lust.

So how do you keep the spirit,and not the letter of thou shall not commit adultery?

That is my question which neither yo nor Mark_V has attempted to answer
---francis on 5/10/13


sfrancis, I don't know if you commit adultery or not and I don't care but I have never committed adultery. I think its wrong to do such but there is forgiveness in any sin we do. there is a sin unto death and it could very well be aids. who knows? Jesus said....matthew 22:37 is the greatest commandment and that is to love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. this is the first and greatest commandment.
---shira4368 on 5/10/13


Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

I'm sure no one here has ever made any graven image or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

Just as much, as I am sure, no one would willfully make an image of God in their heads either!
Mat_5:28!

Yet, God has said all have sinned.
There is none righteous, no not even one!
Rom_3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/10/13


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shira4368 on 5/10/13
This is my questionto mark_V:
THE LETTER OF THE LAW:
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.

THE SPIRIT OF THE LAW
Job 31:1 I made a covenant with mine eyes, why then should I think upon a maid?
Matthew 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his hear

The SPIRIT of the law is that we do not even consider adultery in our hearts, yet at the same time we are not to perform it with our bodies.

Using the same commandment that I use, explain to me how you keep the spirit, but not the letter

Have you seen him answer this at all?
---francis on 5/10/13


Dear shira4368

Rom 3:30 Seeing [it is] one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.


Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

The law is established by faith to tell us what is sin. Christians are not supposed to live in sin. Do you believe that breaking of nine of the Ten Commandments is okay or is it wrong to not only murder someone but to hate someone.

Read Matthew 5
---Samuelbb7 on 5/10/13


Samuelbb7
How can a person keep nine of the ten.
When, if you are guilty of one, you are guilty of all.

Its hard to except you are guilty before God without him.
Even if you think you keep the law.

You said to Mark:
We disagree is that you seem to think if you kill a person in the flesh that would not be breaking the spirit of the law.

If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself
Youre not killing him because of the law. Youre not killing him because you love him.
If you say you love him, and youre not killing him only because of the law.
Then you never loved him.
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/10/13


francis, markv did answer you about faith and law. the fact is you can't see because all you see is the law. you are blinded by the law and have no clue what faith and Holy Spirit.
---shira4368 on 5/10/13


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I keep the Spirit of the Law by faith in Jesus Christ. Can you keep it without faith in Christ? Mark

No I cannot. The only way to keep the law is through faith in JESUS. The Spirit goes above and beyond the letter. Matthew 5

Those who keep the letter of the law are dead in the flesh. For the law saves no one. It was given to make us aware of sin. Rom7:5,6. Mark_V.

Yes you are partially correct. Those who are dead in the flesh cannot keep the letter. Yes the law tells us what sin is. We disagree is that you seem to think if you kill a person in the flesh that would not be breaking the spirit of the law. Is that what you are saying?

In fact I think you probably keep the letter of nine of the Ten Commandments. Do you?
---Samuelbb7 on 5/10/13


I have read the seg's answer.
francis

But you didnt understand.
You believe your righteous, a keeper of the law, sinless, two God and a Saint!

And art confident that thou thyself art a guide of the blind, a light of them which are in darkness, An instructor of the foolish, a teacher of babes, which hast the form of knowledge and of the truth in the law.

See I know your answers are NO to these.
Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself?
thou that preachest a man should not steal, dost thou steal?
Thou that sayest a man should not commit adultery, dost thou commit adultery?
thou that abhorrest idols, dost thou commit sacrilege?

Because you dont understand!
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/9/13


francis, you say,

"using Paul's passage, how does mark_V keep the spirit of the law without keeping the letter of the law?"

I keep the Spirit of the Law by faith in Jesus Christ. Can you keep it without faith in Christ? those who keep the letter of the law are dead in the flesh. For the law saves no one. It was given to make us aware of sin. Let me help you,
"For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death.
"But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, "so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter"
Rom. 7:5,6.
---Mark_V. on 5/9/13


The Pharisees said they did right but actually did wrong. Which is why they were hypocrites.

Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier [matters] of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

Notice JESUS says the law is also about Mercy and Faith.

Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

So let us hear your answer to Francis's question. Remember Matthew 5
---Samuelbb7 on 5/9/13


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---Mark_V. on 5/8/13
I have read Samuels answer
I have read jerry's answer
I have read the seg's answer

why have O not read your answer?

It is you who started this line that you are abel to keep the spiritfo the law, but not the letter.

Everyone else has given an explanation, but not you
---francis on 5/8/13


---Mark_V. on 5/8/13
I read Samuels answer it is the same as Paul's answer:

Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Now I want MArk_V's answer.

using Paul's passage, how does mark_V keep the spirit of the law without keeping the letter of the law?

how do you love yoru neighbour without keeping these: Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet,
---francis on 5/8/13


francis, read Samuels answer, maybe that will help you. I cannot make you understand anything spiritual. How can I, when I do not have that power, only God has that power. You will understand or you will not, it is all up to God, and not by how smart you are. The Pharisees were smart and cleanse on the outside, but inside their hearts they were full of extortion and self-indulgence, Jesus called them serpents, brood of vipers. They like you kept bringing the law out, yet they were hypocrites. God had not changed their hearts by changing their hearts of stone and given them the Spirit of God.
---Mark_V. on 5/8/13


MARK_V, I have answered you question about the letter fo the law, now I dare you to answer mine:

Using the same commandment that I use, explain to me how you keep the spirit, but not the letter

You are posting this " spirit of the law" but not the letter all over CN and you are impotent when asked to explain how it would with the ten commandments.
---francis on 5/7/13


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Mark_V. on 5/7/13
THE LETTER OF THE LAW:
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.

THE SPIRIT OF THE LAW
Job 31:1 I made a covenant with mine eyes, why then should I think upon a maid?
Matthew 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his hear

The SPIRIT of the law is that we do not even consider adultery in our hearts, yet at the same time we are not to perform it with our bodies. When it comes to the ten commandments you cannot keep the spirit and forsake the letter

---francis on 5/4/13

Now can you tell me how you keep the spirit without keeping the letter of the ten commandments?
---francis on 5/7/13


The Spirit of the Law is love. Love of GOD and love of others. That love comes from the New Birth. We are all sinners who are saved by Grace alone through faith alone.

Our New Covenant realtionshilp whith GOD leads us to follow from the heart. Not just with words and outside actions. The Law of GOD is written on our hearts.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/7/13


francis, you never answer the questions and you want others to. You keep posting laws but never speak of the Spirit of the Law. Why is that? All I can come out with is that you know nothing about the Spirit of God that endwells all believers. We are told that the natural man being spiritually dead would never seek God, he would always seek to hide from His presence. The reason is because he is spiritually dead. The message of the Gospel is that God seeks after us and finds us. The Lord Jesus is come "to seek and to save that which is lost".
He is not seeking those who are smart or keep the law, for no one can keep the letter of the law.
---Mark_V. on 5/7/13


---Mark_V. on 5/6/13
You had one good post, you should have quit while you were ahead. Now you are back to posting idiotic posts
---francis on 5/6/13


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francis, I did not forget anything. Two promises are given to new believers under the New Covenant, the pomise of knowledge of God and sanctification of the spirit. That is done by the Spirit of God. The Spirit is the Holy Spirit or Holy Ghost.
But if you know this, why do you insist on people been under the Letter of the law? No one can keep the letter of law. No SDA's or anyone else can keep the whole law. Yet you insist on them doing what you do. Under the New Covenant, Christ has kept the law on our behalf if we have faith in Jesus Christ works on the Cross and resurrection. And the Spirit of God will change your inner man day by day, that is sanctification.
---Mark_V. on 5/6/13


Mark_V. on 5/5/13
Not bad at all

except the new covenant promises the Holy Spirit, which was not promises of requested under the old

Ezekiel 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
---francis on 5/5/13


Under the New Covenant which was made with Israel and Judah and later included the Gentiles was a covenant different from the Old Covenant. The blood of Christ made it an everlasting Covenant. The difference between the law written on tables of stone, as in the Mosaic Covenant, the New Covenant is written in our hearts. The Old Covenant commanded obedience, but gave men no power to do or not to do. The law never gives the power to obey.
The New Covenant is the Law written in the heart of man, and there will naturally follow a heart of obedience. A man will do under grace what he never will do under the law. The New Covenant promised two things, promise of sanctification, and knowledge of God.
---Mark_V. on 5/5/13


cluny's question is in reference to this:

Is circumcision of males one of the Ten Commandments? And, is circumcision a requirement to be saved?
---Gordon on 3/14/13



Galatians 5:3...

The "Whole Law" includes the 10 commandments.
---e.lee7537 on 3/14/13

"Whole law" in the CONTEXT refers to the whole Law of Moses, all blood sacrifices which circumcision is a blood sacrifice.
---francis on 3/15/13

Circumcision is a blood covenant, a sign given because of lose of faith, which came to and end on the cross, Jesus being the Son of blessing to the whole world who accept the blessing of Abraham: Righteousness by faith
---francis on 3/16/13
---francis on 5/4/13


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Cluny, neither. We are saved by Jesus' death on the cross, which paid the penalty for our sins. The blood is often referenced because the life is in the blood. The term "shedding of blood" or "spilled blood" literally means killing. It was the act of sacrificing His own life (not his body or blood per se) for the payment of our sin debt that is what saves us.
---Jed on 5/3/13


Cluny, no one can be saved without the grace of God through faith.
"For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast." (Eph. 2:8).
The blood which Jesus shed, is the substitutional death of Jesus on our behalf to atone for our sins against God. By His death we were also reconciled to God.
---Mark_V. on 5/3/13


The circumcision was a sign of covenant with God, carried out at the hand of an official, without Jesus' consent. He was born a Jew, he gets circumcised. No option.

The crucifixion was in Jesus' willing obedience to carry out God's perfect will, to show God's tremendous love, provide grace, and thus please the Father. To provide an option to sinners who otherwise have no option.
---jan4378 on 4/29/13


Are we saved by the ENTIRE Christ, or merely His blood in isolation from His physical human body?
---Cluny on 4/22/13
For the sins which we have commit, we had a death sentence placed on us. But Christ took that death sentence for us, that we should not die

The blood shed at his circumcision would not be enough, as only death can satisfy the wages of sin
---francis on 4/29/13


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//You refer to is as a blood sacrifice,//
Circumcision isn't a blood sacrifice, a lot of male babies are circumcised today.

Heb 9:21-23 is very clear

In whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace (Eph. 1:7).
---michael_e on 4/29/13


Michael e, very good point you made to francis. Josef gave the right reason and passage.
I was also thinking of a person been bloody and an actual sacrifice. Now if that husband was cut wrong on purpose so that he could bleed to death, then it was a sacrifice of circumcision. Which would be stupid in the first place because no death of a person was required. I wouldn't doubt some crazy people doing that. I heard a person in South American poured gas and lighted himself up for a soccer game. So it is possible.
---Mark_V. on 4/29/13


---michael_e on 4/28/13

Notice that Moses did not perform the circumcision, but his wife did. But it is Moses who is referred to as a bloody husband/ Let us back up a little.

Exodus 4:24 And it came to pass by the way in the inn, that the LORD met him, and sought to kill him.

It is not Moses that was in need of circumcision, but hi son. Yet Moses was at fault for not keeping the blood covenant of circumcision

Upon the circumcision of the son, Moses now becomes a blood covenant keeping husband ( a bloody husband), although Moses does not perform the act himself his wife does it.

You refer to is as a blood sacrifice, OK, but it is a blood covenant
---francis on 4/29/13


//Have you seen any scripture to back these "comments"?//
Where is the blood sacrifice in Ex. 4:25,26? You don't think a bloody husband is a blood sacrifice do you?
---michael_e on 4/28/13


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// I've seen comments here talking about circumcision as a "blood sacrifice."//

Have you seen any scripture to back these "comments"?
---michael_e on 4/28/13

Exodus 4:25 Then Zipporah took a sharp stone, and cut off the foreskin of her son, and cast [it] at his feet, and said, Surely a bloody husband [art] thou to me.

Exodus 4:26 So he let him go: then she said, A bloody husband [thou art], because of the circumcision.

Notice who performed the circumcision in question

Notice who is the " bloody husband."
---francis on 4/28/13


// I've seen comments here talking about circumcision as a "blood sacrifice."//

Have you seen any scripture to back these "comments"?
---michael_e on 4/28/13


there is a difference from bleeding from an incision to giving up your life from a total loss of blood.

in the OT, total animal sacrifice of life was required. and not just a pin prick and sprinkling.

God requires it all.
---aka on 4/28/13


Not only was His blood required, it was required as a sacrifice and a sacrifice had to die. In the case of Christ, not only was His blood shed, His death by Crucifixtion was also a curse and required as a method of sacrifice.

Galatians 3:13 (ASV)
Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us, for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
---wivv on 4/27/13


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Why would this not apply to Christ's own circumcision as an infant?
Simple Cluny, scripturally circumcision has never been considered by the Father as a " blood sacrifice", but rather as a sign of an established covenant between Himself, Abraham, "and his seed/[posterity] in their generations for an everlasting covenant". Gen 17:7-13
His word concerning circumcision and it's meaning is stated clearly in verses 10 & 11
---Josef on 4/26/13


Josef, I've seen comments here talking about circumcision as a "blood sacrifice."

Why would this not apply to Christ's own circumcision as an infant?

Glory to Jesus Christ
---Cluny on 4/26/13


Cluny, we are saved by the atoning sacrifice of Jesus. Which is what the term "saved by His blood" means. However without shedding of His blood [there would have been] no permanent remission [of sin]. Therefore His blood had to be shed in the process.
---Josef on 4/26/13


I believe Scripture tells us that we are saved, justified (declared righteous) by His blood shed as a sacrifice on the Cross.

Romans 5:9 Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.

Like the lambs that were sacrificed for sin in Old Testament times, Jesus became the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. John 1:29b "Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!"
---e.lee7537 on 4/23/13


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Thank God I am free, free, free from this world of sin
Washed in the blood of Jesus
Been born again

Can you truly sing this little chorus???
---KarenD on 4/23/13


No, for the wages of sin is death.
---Scott1 on 4/23/13


No.

Jesus shedding His blood on the cross was the obedient act of sacrifice. And the whole Jesus did that, "for a sweet-smelling aroma." (in Ephesians 5:2) He shed His blood, and He died. His dying was what the whole Jesus did.

And this is not only a theological issue or beliefs thing, but Jesus giving Himself also is our example > "And walk in love, as Christ also has loved us and given Himself for us, an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweet-smelling aroma." (Ephesians 5:2)

So, there is always more for us to learn, how to love like this.
---willie_c: on 4/23/13


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