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Original Ten Commandments

What are the actual, original Ten Commandments, according to GOD's Written Word?

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 ---Gordon on 4/24/13
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Nikki and all others who didn't give the correct First Commandment. This is the right one, Deuteronomy 6:4 Hear, O Israel, The Lord our God is one Lord. Again Jesus speaking,Mark 12:29 And Jesus answered him.The first of all commandments is, Hear O Israel,The Lord our God is one Lord.
---Darlene_1 on 5/7/13


---Mark_V. on 5/7/13
I understand what you are saying. thanks.

But if you have a text with the phrase " spirtual death" I woudl still like to see it other wise, spear me the explainations.


---jerry6593 on 5/7/13
Funny


---TheSeg on 5/6/13
too much useless babble, neither poste din conext nor with doctrine

---Joseph_ROY on 5/6/13
Interesting.
How does your version translate this:
Isaiah 28:10 For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept, line upon line, line upon line, here a little, and there a little:

regardless of what version you use, if you follow this principle, it all comes out the same
---francis on 5/7/13


Samuel, you say,

" But many who believe once saved always saved do in fact teach that you can break every one of the Ten Commandments and still go to heaven."

who are those you talk about? I know of not one believer who believes in the assurance of Christ that teaches, you can sin all you want. If He is teaching you can sin all you want, doesn't that tell you he is not saved? If he is not saved how can his words mean anything? That is shear nonsense. Made up by those who teach the letter of the law, SDA's Catholics who believe in the free will of man. They are the only ones who come out with that stuff. No genuine believer will ever teach to sin all you want. So don't compare a true Christian with a none Christian.
---Mark_V. on 5/7/13


If a person is a genuine believer in Christ,... We are under a New Covenant, where the law is written in our hearts and thereby naturally follow the law of obedience...
Mark_V. on 5/5/13

Mark your point about if they are genuine is I believe correct. But many who believe once saved always saved do in fact teach that you can break every one of the Ten Commandments and still go to heaven.

But a true believer does want to disobey GOD. They are indeed in the New Covenant where the Ten Commandemts become part of their lives. For they are based on love of GOD and others. Those who follow in Spirit will not break the letter. So I agree with some of your statment.

Why do you not actaully follow what you just said?
---Samuelbb7 on 5/7/13


Francis, death means "separation" regardless of the type of death involved. Death is never cessation of existence. "The body without the spirit is dead" here the spirit is separated from the body. The death Adam brought into the world brought physical death and spiritual death (separation from God). When fear entered on the scene Adam and Eve hid themselves from the presence of God (Gen. 3:8). There are three kinds of death mentioned in Scripture. Spiritual death, physical death, and eternal death. When a person sins, it brings all three with them. One reason Jesus said, you must be born of the Spirit, is so that we can have eternal life by been drawn to God (John 5:44). This is an act of God, not an act of man.
---Mark_V. on 5/7/13




joe roy: "you may find difficulty in accepting my version"

Yup! We don't accept the koran.




---jerry6593 on 5/7/13


Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again,
He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart, that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.

Nevertheless among the chief rulers also many believed on him, but because of the Pharisees they did not confess him, lest they should be put out of the synagogue:
For they loved the praise of men more than the praise of God.

And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.
Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils:

freely ye have received, freely give!
---TheSeg on 5/6/13


Gordon, Francis, you may find difficulty in accepting my version.All of us do depend up on translations. The original does not exactly word it as "thou shall not commit adultery. It reads" the woman is holy, violation is equal to the curse of the mother. Besides the text is rich andso it has more contents such as "desire of the reproductive organ is a curse"
---Joseph_ROY on 5/6/13


Seems the blind lead can lead the blind after all.
---TheSeg on 5/6/13

yes I often wonder who is leading whom, are you leading mark_V, or is he leading you

While none of the apostle taught circumcision after the death of Jesus, they all taught:

James 2:11 Do not commit adultery,
2 Peter 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery,
Romans 13:9 Thou shalt not commit adultery,

So how do you keep the " spirit of the law" when it comes to not commiting adultery, and not the letter?

refer to jerry6593 on 5/3/13
---francis on 5/6/13


Seems the blind lead can lead the blind after all.

And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.


Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, (subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:)

(For it seemed good to the Holy Ghost,) and to us, to lay upon you no greater burden than these necessary things,
---TheSeg on 5/6/13




francis, you want me to explain the Spirit of the law,
---Mark_V. on 5/6/13
You are full of you know what
that is why you cannot explain it,

because no one can keep the " spirit of thou shall not commit adultery" and not keep the letter itself
---francis on 5/6/13


Gordon, I could upload an imitation of the original 10 commandments written on an ancient terracotta plaque. It is a secret. I do not know how to do it.
---Joseph_ROY on 5/6/13


..When it comes to the ten commandments you cannot keep the spirit and forsake the letter---francis on 5/4/13

AMEN, AMEN!
All your blogs on this topic as been said sweet, short and to the point!

James 2:14-26
What good is it, brothers, if someone says he has faith(Spirit) but does not have works?(Law)
Can that faith save him?
If a brother or sister has nothing to wear and has no food for the day, and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, keep warm, and eat well,"but you do not give them the necessities of the body, what good is it? So also faith of itself, if it does not have works, is dead.

V26 For just as a body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.
---Nikki on 5/6/13


francis, you want me to explain the Spirit of the law, when you are in bondage to the letter of the law, it's not possible. You will forever quote the letter of the law, because you have no understanding what things are spiritual and what things are carnal.
The reason Israel doesn't believe in Jesus Christ is because they are in bondage to the letter of the law. Under the law, it's obedience or death. And God does not provide you with help to keep the letter of the law, that's why it can never save anyone. Under the Spirit of the law, God Himself makes it possible for you to keep the law, because Christ kept it for you.
But you insist on keeping the letter of the law all by yourself and it's not possible no matter how many Laws you post.
---Mark_V. on 5/6/13


---Mark_V. on 5/5/13

I am interested in this theory of yours, whereby you keep " the spirit of the law" and not the letter. So here are a few commandments, I would like to know how to keep the " Spirit " of any one of these laws without keeping the letter of these laws. I need you to explain that to me

Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, ... Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them:
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain
---francis on 5/5/13


Rom_13:10!

If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

Owe no one anything (Rom_13:8)
For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely,Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself!

Peace
---TheSeg on 5/5/13


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markv, the truth is a Christian can sin but God punishes sin. there is a sin unto death. I hope no one thinks they can be a Christian and sin but it has punishment that goes with it. look what happens when you eat too much, fornication, smoke, drink.
---shira4368 on 5/5/13


Samuel, you say,
"But today many think that being a Christian means you have a right to steal, murder, commit adultery bow down to idols in otherwords not act in love toward GOD and others and still go to heaven.".
If a person is a genuine believer in Christ, he will never say what you just said. Not in a million years. That idea comes from those who insist for people to be under the law as they are, and if not, they are saying what you said they say. Those words come from you and those who follow the letter of the law. We are under a New Covenant, where the law is written in our hearts and thereby naturally follow the law of obedience. For a man will do under grace what he never will do under the law.
---Mark_V. on 5/5/13


---TheSeg on 5/4/13

Yeah more junk from you, as expected. No suprise at all

Look at how jerry6593 on 5/3/13 and on 5/4/13 clearly expressed what is not meant, and what is meant by spirit of the law,

look at how I clearly expressed it on 5/4/13

Look at the maturity shown in those post,look at the proper use of both context and doctrine, then look at your post on the very same question. your post is lacking in content and maturity, not to mention in scripture and doctrine.

But sadly I have come to expect that from you
---francis on 5/5/13


Oh francis, I could never fill in for mark!
I am a sad substitute for mark!

I told you, you wouldnt understand!
For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

From Christ to you!
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

But see, you cant understand.
Because:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

But you cant understand that either.
But, what the heck, I love you anyway.

Sorry, but Ive been down that road with you before.
You go by yourself this time or take someone else with you!
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/4/13


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---TheSeg on 5/4/13
If you want to fill in for Mark_V, it i s O.K. here is the issue:

As believers in Christ we are following the Spirit of the law, not the letter of the Law.
---Mark_V. on 5/2/13

here are six of the ten commandments, pick any two, show me how you keep the spirit of these laws, but not the letter:

Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, ... Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them:
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain
---francis on 5/4/13


Well Mark_V make me to understand. here are six of the ten commandments, pick any two, show me how you keep the spirit of these laws, but not the letter:
francis on 5/3/13

I am not Mark, and even know I cant make you understand.
I will not only pick two, but all the law and the prophets.

On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.

But see you cant understand.
Because:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Now I will ask you one thing.
francis, do you have any sins.
For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

Peace
---TheSeg on 5/4/13


---shira4368 on 5/2/13

You cannot teach the gospel ( good news that Jesus has come to save us from our sin ) without speaking about the law

1 Corinthians 15:3 Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures,


The reason Jesus died was because we sinned: sin is the transgression of the law. 1 John 3:4

Jesus died for our sin, and God gives to us His righteousness to strengthen our inner man that we should not live in sin ( transgression of the law) any more

1 John 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not.

In other word, he is writing all these things so that we whoa re saved by Grace, we who obey the gospel, would no longer trangress the Law
---francis on 5/4/13


You can't judge people as
"unrepentant" simply because they struggle with certain sins. God knows them that are his. Let him worry about who is his and who is not. Your job is to love.

I think scripture is pretty clear that no murderer has eternal life abiding within him.

It is not so clear however that those who dont go to church on Saturday also do not have eternal life abiding in them.
---LindaH on 5/4/13


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---micha9344 on 5/3/13
You cannot explain something which you claim to believe, so let do it for you

THE LETTER OF THE LAW:
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.

THE SPIRIT OF THE LAW
Job 31:1 I made a covenant with mine eyes, why then should I think upon a maid?
Matthew 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his hear

The SPIRIT of the law is that we do not even consider adultery in our hearts, yet at the same time we are not to perform it with our bodies. When it comes to the ten commandments you cannot keep the spirit and forsake the letter

see --jerry6593 on 5/3/13 for further clarification
---francis on 5/4/13


The spirit of the Law is additive rather than subtractive. That is, it establishes a higher level of obedience to the Law rather than a lower one - or even the retraction of the Law. Jesus did not say that adultery was now OK, but rather that even to look on a woman to lust was adultery - and was forbidden. Similarly, He did not say that murder was now OK, but rather that anger against your brother without cause is murder - and thus forbidden.

It is strange how some Christians (followers of Jesus) can believe that the Ten Commandments were destroyed by Jesus when He stated that He didn't come to destroy them.


---jerry6593 on 5/4/13


Heb 7:15-16 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest, Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Rom 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Gal 4:29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him [that was born] after the Spirit, even so [it is] now.
--apples and oranges. Until the Spirit show you the difference, you will be blind.
---micha9344 on 5/3/13


---shira4368 on 5/2/13
Look atthe blog question. What should we be posting about?


You do not understand.. ---Mark_V. on 5/3/13
Well Mark_V make me to understand. here are six of the ten commandments, pick any two, show me how you keep the spirit of these laws, but not the letter:

Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.
Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, ... Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them:
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain
---francis on 5/3/13


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Dear Linda you write about the laws that Moses wrote and say not shaving my beard which I do shave and say that is the same as murdering someone. The Ten Commandments are rules of love on how to treat others and act toward GOD.

Yes Francis often talks about law. But today many think that being a Christian means you have a right to steal, murder, commit adultery bow down to idols in otherwords not act in love toward GOD and others and still go to heaven.

Is that what you really believe. That serial killers who are unrepentant will be accepted into heaven just because they say they are a Christian? Rember JESUS spoke of hypocrites who say they love GOD but show by their actions they do not.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/3/13


francis, I wish you knew something else to talk about besides what you have worn dead. law, law, law is all you know. I feel sorry for you.
---shira4368 on 5/2/13


I love how people think that by perfecting 10 laws they can gain access into Gods kingdom as though there are ONLY 10 that matter.

Shave your beard lately, Francis? Do anything other than eat on Saturdays? Eat any meat that had blood in it? (youd be surprised how many meats have it in there) Maybe wear clothes made of two different fabrics? (polyester/cotton)

Go ahead and dig that hole a little deeper.
---LindaH on 5/3/13


francis, its an idiotic idea to you because you are under the law. Those under the law, do not have the Spirit of the law. Who you might say is the Spirit? The Holy Spirit which all believers have.
You do not understand because you do not have Him, and again if you notice all those who resort to name calling are mostly those who are lost anyway. The Truth hurts them, it convicts their hearts, so they respond like you do all the time, angry, frustrated. Every time you call me names, you continue to proof you are under the law but cannot keep it, it continues to keep you dead.
---Mark_V. on 5/3/13


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Micha & MarkV: re: "Spirit of the Law"

The examples shown refer in context to circumcision - a ritual "law" - not to the Moral LAW of the Ten Commandments.

Please explain how it is possible to keep the "spirit" of the Ten Commandment LAW while breaking the "letter" of it. How does one keep the "spirit" of "thou shalt not kill" while commiting murder? Such thinking is pure nonsense!



---jerry6593 on 5/3/13


As believers in Christ we are following the Spirit of the law, not the letter of the Law.
---Mark_V. on 5/2/13
The idiotic idea which you have that you follow the spirit of the law and not the letter fo the law is pure garbage

Explain with three examples

Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
Exodus 20:14 Thou shalt not commit adultery.
Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.

How you follow the spirit of the law and not the letter
---francis on 5/2/13


micha9344 on 5/2/13
Love thatyou jumped on that statement

Show me how you keep the spirit of the law, but not the letter of the law when It comes to these three commanements:


Exodus 20:3 Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, ... Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them:
Exodus 20:7 Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain
---francis on 5/2/13


\As believers in Christ we are following the Spirit of the law, not the letter of the Law.-Mark_V. on 5/2/13 That is pure garbage ...\-francis on 5/2/13
Rom 2:29 But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly, and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter, whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.
Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held, that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not [in] the oldness of the letter.
2Cor 3:6b-7a ... not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life. But if the ministration of death, written [and] engraven in stones ...
---micha9344 on 5/2/13


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francis, been "in Christ" is pure garbish to you. Why? because you rather be pursuing the Law of righteousness. And never really accomplishing what you seek, always stumbling because like the Israelites "pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness. Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by works of the law. For they stumble at that stumbling stone." (Rom. 9:31,32). And that is what you and all the workers of the law are at.
---Mark_V. on 5/2/13


Mark V, I wasn't trying to say "something new" as if I were trying to impress and "wow people", or, present some "new revelation" that no one has ever heard of before to play like I'm a mister-know-it-all. But, because that was your response, you showed me how those Scriptures that I quoted totally got ignored by you, or they went right over your head!

Christan was stating that "GOD does not expect us to obey Commands, but, instead, we're only to love". And, those Scripture Verses I posted indicate that the way we show GOD that we love HIM is by obeying HIS Commandments! The Scriptures are clear about that! And, this proved that what Christan was believing was untrue and totally unscriptural!
---Gordon on 5/2/13


As believers in Christ we are following the Spirit of the law, not the letter of the Law.
---Mark_V. on 5/2/
That is pure garbage

Show the difference?
---francis on 5/2/13


Following the Spirit of the law means we go above and beyond the letter. If you break the letter you break the Spirit of the law.

Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Mat 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 5:22 ... but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/2/13


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Gordon, you explained nothing new. All the things you mentioned come from God. Those who are children of God cannot get worse then children of God. How can they? Once children of God, always children of God. We love because He first loved us. The faith we have is from Him, we obey because He lives in us. We feel repentance because the Spirit convicts us of sin. We learn because the Holy Spirit teaches us. Everything we have belongs to the Lord, the reason that without Christ we can do nothing.
As believers in Christ we are following the Spirit of the law, not the letter of the Law. For we are not under condemnation of the law, that is the written letter of the law. The Spirit of God is sanctifying us, not de-sanctifying.
---Mark_V. on 5/2/13


" If a person is a child of God, he cannot get better then a child of God."
---Mark_V. on 5/1/13

Not better, but worse is possible:
Hebrews 10:29 "Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?"
Man's agency is evident in, Ephesians 4:30 "And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption."
And, John 15:2 "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit."
---Nana on 5/1/13


Christan and Mark V, Francis is right.
YAHUSHUA says in JOHN 14:15, "If ye love Me, keep My Commands."

He says in JOHN 15:10, "If ye keep My Commandments, ye shall abide in My Love, Even as I have kept My Father's Commandments..."

In I JOHN 5:2, "By this we know that we love the Children of GOD, when we love GOD, and keep HIS Commandments."

GOD does not change. GOD says in MALACHI 3:6a, "For I AM the LORD, I change not..."

HIS Son does not change either, as in HEBREWS 13:8, "Yahushua ha Maschiach (Jesus Christ), the same Yesterday, and Today, and Forever."

Their expectations of Love, OBEDIENCE, Holiness, Truth, Forgiveness and Mercy do not change.

---Gordon on 5/1/13


Christan, Gordon and francis speak of the same thing only in a different way. But both mean the same thing. Old Testament people were under the law of obedience. We are not under the law of obedience. The new covenant is, "you shall"
Old Covenant is, "Obey or you shall die" In the Old Testament God says, "if you obey I will do this or that, if you disobey, then the curses come."
What Gordon does not want to get away from is the free will of man. In other words putting salvation in the hands of man and not God. If a person is a child of God, he cannot get better then a child of God.
---Mark_V. on 5/1/13


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expand you bible reading

Leviticus 19:18 thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD

Deuteronomy 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Love does not stop people from obeying at all

Deuteronomy 30:20 That thou mayest love the LORD thy God, [and] that thou mayest obey his voice,

John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Love facilitates obedience
---francis on 4/30/13


"I am of the belief that it is the two Greatest Commands that we are to obey, and that upon those Two Great Commands hang the "Law" (the Ten Commandments)." Gordon

Sly, very sly (remember Genesis 3:4?) - "that we are to obey"? Is that what Christ really said? Let's see,

"Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." Matthew 22:37-40

Obey? All I see is "thou shalt love".
---christan on 4/30/13


Scott1, Why are you addressing me with your statement?? I am not the one saying that the 613 Mosaic Laws are still in affect. I have been saying that the 613 Laws are NO LONGER in effect. I am of the belief that it is the two Greatest Commands that we are to obey, and that upon those Two Great Commands hang the "Law" (the Ten Commandments). If one follows the Two Great Commands, MARK 12:29-31, they will automatically be living out and obeying the Ten Commandments!
---Gordon on 4/30/13


Gordon and Christian
Even the Pharisees who did follow the 613 OT laws were not righteous enough to obtain righteousness (matthew 5:20). As Paul says in Galatians the Law never saved anyone (Galatians 3:10,11)including the Jews in the OT and NT but only the offspring of Eve (Gen 3:15). For salvation is only by Deut. 6:5 "You shall love the Lord your God with all your soul and with all your might."
---Scott1 on 4/30/13


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Christan, You say that the moral AND ceremonial laws were "....written in stone", yada, yada.... Firstly, it was only the 10 Commandments that were written in Stone, not the 613 Ceremonial laws, EXODUS 24:12 and 31:18. Secondly, it was the Laws of Righteousness by Sacrifice that the Lord fulfilled for He became the ultimate Sacrificial Lamb of GOD. His Blood Sacrifice replaced all other animal sacrifices and the relative laws of sacrifice which were among the 613 Ceremonial Laws of Moses. YAHUSHUA lived out the Ten Commandments as our prime Example. And, His Sacrifice BOTH "fulfilled" the laws of (animal) sacrifice, and also replaced those sacrificial laws. For only His Sacrifice is now needed.
---Gordon on 4/30/13


Christan, that's okay. I had done the same thing to another person. I am reading to fast and answer too quick. We all make mistakes. I am sure I will need you to forgive me in the future.
God bless
---Nikki on 4/30/13


Gordon, now I understand Paul when he wrote Romans 10. It's specifically for the likes of you and some here. This is what was written:

"For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God."

See the similarity between you have with the Jews? What would it take for you to believe and understand verse 4 which declares, "For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."

And to add on to your woes, "For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them." Go live by the law then.
---christan on 4/29/13


We are talking about Laws that apply to the CHURCH, Christan. Not for those who are Orthodox Jews! So, is the CHURCH supposed to be following the 613 Mosaic Laws, also? And, "if so", are YOU, then, following those same 613 Laws?
---Gordon on 4/29/13


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Christan, If someone is of Jewish blood, it doesn't matter, they can only be redeemed through YAHUSHUA, John 14:6. In YAHUSHUA there is "neither Jew nor Gentile", GALATIANS 3:28. GOD is not going to give the 613 to the Jews to observe, for the only way to Salvation is through YAHUSHUA, and when one receives YAHUSHUA, they are no longer "Jew" nor "Greek" (Gentile). In YAHUSHUA, both Jews and Gentiles observe the same Commandments, the Ten Commandments, and above all, the two Greatest Commands of loving GOD first, and one's neighbour as oneself. So, the 613 Laws have been abolished. But, the Ten Commandments, Laws of Love are still in effect for the Church.
---Gordon on 4/29/13


It's the Law of the Ten Commandments that YAHUSHUA came to fulfill and expects His Followers to live out also, by His Spirit's Power and Strength. But, those 613 are not for the Church. Only the Ten pertain to the Church. YAHUSHUA's Blood sacrifice did away with the animal sacrifices and all the things pertaining within the 613 Laws of Moses.
---Gordon on 4/29/13


Nikki, my apologies for misreading as you have embedded Gordon's remarks together in your reply to him. Forgive me.
---christan on 4/28/13


matthew 5:17...Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: Iam not come to destroy, but to fulfill.
---shira4368 on 4/28/13


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Christan, I don't understand you.
You asked me to take note of something I didn't say, but quoted Scriptures in Jesus fulfilling the law.
So you argue with me by using the same Scripture I used???

Matthew 5:17
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill.
---Nikki on 4/26/13

See the difference between "your abolishing" to Christ fulfilling the law? And the "greatest" law that was fulfilled was when He paid with His life in "the wages of sin is death" that we may live.
"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."---christan on 4/27/13

Are you confused, or am I?
---Nikki on 4/28/13


Nikki, You follow a religion that makes Mary, the earthly mother of YAHUSHUA, into "the queen of Heaven", and teaches that this Mary was "sinless", and that the Church was not built on the Divine Man YAHUSHUA the Rock, but, instead, teach that the sin-born man, Peter, is the "foundation rock of the whole Church", and you warn ME against twisting up what the LORD saith in the Holy Scriptures?? Btw, Since (as you believe) that the 613 Mosaic Laws are still in effect, ARE YOU FOLLOWING ALL 613 yourself, then?? I'm debating YOU, Nikki, 'cause it ain't the LORD that's saying the 613 are in effect!
---Gordon on 4/28/13


\\Nikki, take note that God never abolished any of His laws He gave to Israel, be it the moral or ceremonial. The law is written in stone.\\

Does this apply to not wearing blended fabrics?

How about a married couple sleeping in separate beds during the wife's menstruation?

May a person still sell his daughter into slavery?

Are these laws still in force, christan?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/28/13


Nikki, take note that God never abolished any of His laws He gave to Israel, be it the moral or ceremonial. The law is written in stone. Instead, the law found it's fulfillment in His Son Jesus Christ who tells us, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." And fulfilled He did.

See the difference between "your abolishing" to Christ fulfilling the law? And the "greatest" law that was fulfilled was when He paid with His life in "the wages of sin is death" that we may live.

"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth."
---christan on 4/27/13


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What are the actual, original Ten Commandments, according to GOD's Written Word?

According to God's written word:

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.

These precede the 10 commandments. Notice Mat 22:40.

Mat 22:37 Jesus said to him, You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second is like it, You shall love your neighbor as yourself.

Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang ALL the Law and the Prophets.
---aka on 4/28/13


Nikki, You believe that the 613 Mosaic laws are in effect for the CHURCH today?--Gordon on 4/27/13

Don't argue with me.
Argue with Jesus.
HE used the same word you used - Abolish.

Jesus said NO HE DIDN'T, but fulfill.

Why would you try to use Paul's letters to go against Jesus' Words?
I don't think Paul appreciates you spinning his letter against his Lord and Savior.

Careful
---Nikki on 4/27/13


Nikki, You believe that the 613 Mosaic laws are in effect for the CHURCH today? So, the Church is to obey the 613 Laws, including Laws nos. 611-613, "Always remember what Amalek did.", "That the evil done to us shall not be forgotten.", "To destroy the seed of Amalek."? And the Church is to take the Nazarite Vow from Laws nos. 588-597? The Church must have all male Believers circumcised in the flesh, as in Law no. 17? They're good Laws, but, do they apply to us as the Church? Or, instead, were these 613 Laws nailed to Cross, as in COLOSSIANS 2:14? "Blotting out the handwriting of Ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us,and took it out of the way, nailing it to His Cross."
---Gordon on 4/27/13


\\Scott1, The Ten Commandments are not the same as the 613 Mosaic laws. The 613 were abolished by GOD, pertaining to the Church, while the Ten are still effective.\\

Actually the Decalogue is part of the 613.

And the NT speaks of only one law, called The Law. The Bible itself does not distinguish among moral, ceremonial, agricultural, and other laws.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/27/13


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Scott1, The Ten Commandments are not the same as the 613 Mosaic laws. The 613 were abolished by GOD, pertaining to the Church, while the Ten are still effective.---Gordon on 4/26/13

I agree with everything you wrote except the part of God abolishing the Mosaic laws.

Matthew 5:17
"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill.
---Nikki on 4/26/13


Scott1, The Ten Commandments are not the same as the 613 Mosaic laws. The 613 were abolished by GOD, pertaining to the Church, while the Ten are still effective. The 1st Four Commands deal WITH "Loving GOD firstly". The last Six Commands deal with "Loving thy neighbour as thyself." And, what did YAHUSHUA say were the two Greatest Commands, in MATTHEW 22:36-40? Love GOD, first and then, your neighbour as yourself. The Ten Commandments hang on these two Greatest Commands. So, yeah, it is a big deal.
---Gordon on 4/26/13


Gordon, Nikki who cares just do Deut. 6:5. The point is the number 10 is the number of challenge or testing. These 10 commandments were selected and made separate to show that we could not complete even 10 of these simple commandments much less all 600 or so written in the OT. However Jesus summarized the OT laws which were summarized by the 10 commandments which are completely described by one commandment Deut. 6:5.
---Scott1 on 4/26/13


And how would it help the sinner if they even knew or have the original Ten Commandments? Isn't the Holy Bible (regardless of it's many versions) written according to the Word of God as it is already? Where's your faith if you are questioning that the Holy Bible is not originally from God?

"For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled." Matthew 5:18

And more importantly for the sake of one's soul, it's better you believe that "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in His sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin." Romans 3:20
---christan on 4/26/13


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Nikki, EXODUS 20, 1) Thou shalt not have no other gods before ME. 2) Thou shalt not make unto thee any GRAVEN IMAGE...Thou shalt not BOW THYSELF TO THEM... 3) Thou shalt not take the Name of the LORD thy GOD in vain... 4) Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it Holy...the Seventh Day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy GOD... 5) Honour thy father and thy mother... 6) Thou shalt not kill. 7) Thou shalt not commit Adultery. 8) Thou shalt not steal. 9) Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. 10) Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house...thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor anything that is thy neighbour's...
---Gordon on 4/26/13


RCC didn't break the commandments. Protestant did.
Go to CCC online. Pages 496 and 497 it has both
Exodus 20:2-17, Deuteronomy 5:6-21
and a Traditional Catechetical Formula: from both Scriptures

1. I am the Lord your God. You shall not have strange gods before me.

2. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain.

3. Remember to keep holy the Lord's Day.

4. Honor your father and your mother.

5. You shall not kill.

6. You shall not commit adultery.

7. You shall not steal.

8. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

9. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife.

10. You shall not covet your neighbor's goods.
---Nikki on 4/26/13


Gordon on 4/25/13
the arguement has been stated that what we are more familiar with comes from exodus 20, while the RCC version is from deuteronomy.

But i cannot make a disctinction

So if someone can please help me understand the difference
---francis on 4/25/13


The RCC has a version in their Catachism but Protestants and Jewish version is the same. Exodus 20:2-17. Which most people have never really read.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/25/13


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Francis, Yes. The people who make it out that the Biblical Versical numbering system makes a mess of everything pose a very lame argument. All anyone has to do is know where a sentence or paragraph starts and ends, according to it's context. Going to EXODUS 20 shows us the Ten Commandments, in black and white. There is no excuse for confusion. Nikki claims there's a diff between "coveting a maid-servant and an animal", but, you know what, Nikki? GOD's Point is that we are not to be coveting ANYTHING. Lumping the maidens with the animals and MEN-SERVANTS in the same Commandment is GOD's Way of saying that ALL coveting is sin, and is to be avoided. Division of the 10th Command to justify the abolition of the 2nd Command is a SIN.
---Gordon on 4/25/13


This is a good question.
Am I to imaging that it has something to do with the RCC splitting the 10 commandment into two: Covettng Gods,and covetting people, while joinging the first twointo one?
---francis on 4/25/13


Good question, as there are no chapter and verse divisions in the Greek or Hebrew texts until the Middle Ages.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/24/13


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