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Genealogy Question

According to the Davidic / Messianic Genealogies, we know that Jacob was Mary's husband Joseph's father, as in MATTHEW 1:1-16. So, as per LUKE 3:23-38, is Heli not Joseph's father-in-law and Mary's father? Making both Joseph and Mary from the lineage of king David?

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 ---Gordon on 5/3/13
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Francis, doing fine. Thanks..

After Those who walked away , Jesus said..."will you betray me too " to his disciples, and that is
EXACTLY WHAT judas did, BETRAY Jesus.

Judas wanted the KING, not the SAVIOR. Judas betrayed Jesus because Jesus wasn't going to overthrow Rome as OT prophesied the Son of Man , Son of David who was to come would do. BUT,That couldn't happen until, the cross, resurrection, this period called the dispensation of the CHURCH, that was actually KEPT SECRET in the OT and THEN Jesus will return in all His Glory to overthrow all gentile world power.

IT'S "WHY "..He went to the other side of the lake after feeding the multitude. He said...lets go over before they make me KING.
---kathr4453 on 5/22/13


#2
When Jesus preached to the multitude, They believed they were already in the Kingdom enjoying what the earthly Kingdom will be like WHEN Jesus does reign on earth. But when they came to Him AGAIN, Jesus challenged them, ...asking do you want ME or just food for your bellies...(instant gratification, just like Esau). Jesus was really telling them that to REALLY BELIEVE, they needed to believe in the SAVIOR, the one that would die and rise again. Paul clearly tells us that communion is to REMEMBER HIS DEATH UNTIL HE COME. The Messiah was prophesied to die..Isaiah 53, but they all missed it......until His resurrection....now listen to Peter at Penticost. What is he saying to those who crucified and betrayed Jesus... REPENT AND BELIEVE.
---kathr4453 on 5/22/13


kathr4453 on 5/21/13

How are you?
Have not seen you around lately. Is all well?
---francis on 5/21/13


ead ALL of John 6 to totally grasp what is being said.
Your verse points to Judas and those who walked away. Walked away after Jesus said what...???---kathr4453 on 5/21/13

His Gloried Body and Blood as Food and Drink.

Kathr, you really need to read John chapter 6. I don't know what you are saying or trying to say. But, Judas did not walk away.

John 6:66-67
As a result of this, many of His disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.
V67 Jesus than said to the TWELVE,(Judas is part of the 12) do you also want to leave?

John 6 only states Jesus KNOWS who will betray Him, Judas.
But Judas DID NOT WALK AWAY IN CHAPTER 6

PLEASE READ JOHN CHAPTER 6

---Nikki on 5/21/13


read ALL of John 6 to totally grasp what is being said.

Your verse points to Judas and those who walked away. Walked away after Jesus said what...??? ..that is the heart of the whole chapter. BETRAY, here is again, more than just not believing. Those who have no faith in Jesus aren't referred to as those who betray Jesus.

To eat my flesh and drink my blood.....HERE is the heart and core of John 6....to those who don't just cherry pick ONE verse and build THEIR own doctrine around.

When they walked away, then Jesus asked his disciples...will you BETRAY me too. All those followed Jesus, saw His miracles of feeding the multitude...and when asked to. Be brought into a deeper commitment....THEN they walked away.
---kathr4453 on 5/21/13




"According to the Davidic / Messianic Genealogies, we know that Jacob was Mary's husband Joseph's father, as in MATTHEW 1:1-16. So, as per LUKE 3:23-38, is Heli not Joseph's father-in-law & Mary's father? Making both Joseph & Mary from the lineage of king David?"

Gordon: Joe & Mary were both descended from King David. Mary came thru Nathan, a son of David. Joseph came thru Solomon (obviously a more prominent son of David). Yes, Heli (Mary's father) was Joe's father in-law.

Lk. 3:23 says Joe was the son of Heli. Mt. 1:16 says Joe was the son of Jacob. Which is correct? BOTH! Lk. 3:23 implies Heli is Joe's "father in-law". Mt. 1:16 identifies Joe's father as Jacob.
---Leon on 5/21/13


Mark_V.,

You think you have a trump card with verse 6:44 of John. Jesus shows your error in that he explains the reason why he said what he said in that verse.
It was said for the sole purpose of stirring them:

John 6:64_65 "But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.
And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father."


Furthermore, God and Jesus both say "learn" but you as always love to add to the word of God.
---Nana on 5/21/13


Nana, to argue that man has to be educated to receive salvation you say,

"Who said this: "It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me" (John 6:45)

You did not mention the verse before the one you gave, Jesus says:

No one can come to Me unless the Father draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day" (John 6:44).
When God draws you to Himself, you belong to God. Then the Father teaches those He draws. Verse 45 that you gave says,
"everyone who has heard and learned from the Father.." Not the way you wrote the passage down.
---Mark_V. on 5/21/13


"All men are converted by the education they take to heart."
... is non-sense.
Mark_V. on 5/20/13

Who said this: "It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me."
"Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me, for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls."
"Wash you, make you clean, put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes, cease to do evil,
Learn to do well, seek judgment, relieve the oppressed, judge the fatherless, plead for the widow."


Oh, I forgot that you only believe in commentaries..., and the Vatican?
---Nana on 5/20/13


Agree with Francis.

"Making both Joseph and Mary from the lineage of king David?
---Gordon on 5/3/13

Yes one from Nathan, and one from Solomon, two sons of David"
---Jasheradan on 5/20/13




Nana, what you said,

"All men are converted by the education they take to heart."

is non-sense. No one is converted because of their education. That would mean that if you are smarter then someone else, you can be saved and the other not. Why don't you listen to Nikki. She is correct. You know why? because it is in Vatican II, Catechesis and the grace of God #22. If you had looked you would know even though you claim you are not a Catholic. That it is God who saves sinners by first giving them faith.
---Mark_V. on 5/20/13


Interesting fact: Hebrew Language doesn't use numbers symbols. They are written out. ---Nikki on 5/17/13


Again Nikki is making ignorant statements she doesn't understand. NUMBERS in scripture are not what Jews said but what God teaches through those numbers.
---kathr4453 on 5/17/13

What in the world are you talking about?
Because you are confused about my statement.

The Hebrew language DOESN'T use numbers AS WE DO.

We can write '7 people' or seven people.

They only can write SEVEN.
NO SUCH THING AS 7.
---Nikki on 5/20/13


Proverbs 23:13_14 "Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.
Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell."

Proverbs 29:15 "The rod and reproof give wisdom: but a child left to himself bringeth his mother to shame."

1 Samuel 3:13 "For I have told him that I will judge his house for ever for the iniquity which he knoweth, because his sons made themselves vile, and he restrained them not."

Why the beatings and restrains if no conversion or change of heart could be effected?
All men are converted by the education they take to heart.
---Nana on 5/17/13


Interesting fact: Hebrew Language doesn't use numbers symbols. They are written out.

---Nikki on 5/17/13


Again Nikki is making ignorant statements she doesn't understand. NUMBERS in scripture are not what Jews said but what God teaches through those numbers.

7 means complete, perfect REST etc. GOD used numbers to teach us things. David said the NUMBER OF MAN IS 6. Why because man was created on the 6th day. Those in Christ are a NEW CREATURE no longer a 6, but a 7, perfect IN CHRIST, Complete IN HIM.
---kathr4453 on 5/17/13


Revelation 13:16-18
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man, and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

Nikki, Are you saying this is not a direct warning from GOD?
---kathr4453 on 5/17/13


James_L, did you know that the 1st edition of the inspired and perfect King James' Bible had 73 books as the Catholic Bible?

After the 2nd edition the Bible was shorten to 66 books

Jews use numbers as a teaching tool.
6 to the Jews means doubt, evil, failure. Unfinished. Man against God. Creation of man on the 6th day. Serpent appeared on the 6th day.

7 to the Jews means Spiritual perfection, Seven is the number regulates period of gestation, 7 days in a week,7 colors in spectrum,7 eternal in Hebrew, 7 saying of Jesus from the cross.

(1/6,1/9,6/2,9/12,9/14,9/15,13/20,7 (number spiritual perfection) NO CLUE WHAT IT MEANS.

Interesting fact: Hebrew Language doesn't use numbers symbols. They are written out.
---Nikki on 5/17/13


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Nikki said anything RCC found on websites are in fact lies, ...and everything Nikki has said is in fact in these RCC web sites. So by her own admitting , everything Nikki is posting is a lie.

Thanks Nikki for that clarification.

But the fact is Nikki, anyone can look it up and decide for themselves apart from YOU saying it doesn't exist. We see many things DO EXIST you just may never have heard of.
---kathr4453 on 5/17/13


Nana, the verses you gave us is giving examples. We assist if someone asks questions about Jesus. Yes, but converting someone is God's job.

We are not to hinder anyone's conversion.
Ghana said he would have been a Christian, but looked at the Christians around him and declined. He remained a Hindu.
---Nikki on 5/16/13


james, just one more thing. just because someone uses the other versions, that does not mean they aren't Christian. I have dear friends who use the niv. just letting you know the king james is just like God intended it to be. I would be afraid to change anything in the king james. that is the bible I prefer.
---shira4368 on 5/16/13


"The notion that I am trying to convert people..."
Nikki on 5/16/13

Yes, but a christian-disciple should:
Matthew 5:16 "Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven."
Matthew 28:19_20 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen."

He should hope for his fellow man's conversion, else Paul would not have said: "I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain."
---Nana on 5/16/13


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\\the bible....that is what determines what I believe.\\
---shira4368 on 5/15/13

Since one of your core beliefs is that the King James translation is inspired and perfect, and that every other translation is corrupt...

can you show us where we can find that in the bible ???

Any version will do, even yours

Thanks in advance
---James_L on 5/16/13


Ladies, women are also known for gossiping.

People think all kinds of strange things. If I believed the way I was brought up, I won't be a practicing Catholic.
My family is are culture Catholics. Like culture Jews.

Catholics believe Faith comes from God. I can't convince, beg, pleased or wish you to be SAVED.
The notion that I am trying to convert people is LAUGHABLE TO ME.

I Hear people saying 'I lead or brought 245 people is Christ' is wrong to me.
God comes you. You can't go to God without God coming to you first? IMPOSSIBLE.

Kathr, please stop spreading your lie on different topics.
As I said in the 'Captain of Host' section.
There isn't a CATECHISM OF TRENT.
Please do your research first.
---Nikki on 5/16/13


The Catechism of the Council of Trent states these words:
"It is lawful to have images in the Church, and to give honor and worship unto them..."
Is it lawful to honor and worship images? Not according to God's word. Exodus 20:4-5 says, "Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them-----." Image worship is forbiddenand will end with the eternal damnation of those who practice it (Rev. 14:11).


Yet they keep a straight face and tell you it is ok. Shira, "we" believe in EXPLICIT instructions from God.
---kathr4453 on 5/16/13


kathr, most people believe the way they were raised. everyone thinks they are right and nikki feels the same way as I do when someone tries to convert me to their faiths. no matter what faith we are, the bible tells the truth and we all should believe every word the bible says. that is what determines what I believe.
---shira4368 on 5/15/13


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I agree Shira, you told us about the burying of a statue of St. Joseph, and they are too embarrassed to deal with that truth of witchcraft, and want to make it a joke avoiding the comment. HOW Nikki deals with these questions and comments is becoming more and more obvious with the way in which she avoids them, then turning it back on you.

This is how an immature 14-17 year old child talks and acts, who has horrible social skills.

Then after I share scripture, the same immature comments..."oh, I bet you really want to be a Nun". Seriously? No the problem is, she's not serious at all. Just another juvenile delinquent here on line. A real waste of time.
---kathr4453 on 5/15/13


And you know thats the way he took it.
And always will. I love you all!

Nikki I was looking in the garden this morning.
I saw something that looked like a head.
But it was only the root of a big old tree!---TheSeg on 5/14/13

Was your house on the market?
Naturally you wouldn't see a head.

God Bless
---Nikki on 5/15/13


And you know thats the way he took it.
And always will. I love you all!

Nikki I was looking in the garden this morning.
I saw something that looked like a head.
But it was only the root of a big old tree!
I know God has blessed each and every one of you.
Peace
---TheSeg on 5/14/13


Shira, what is wrong with you?
I was having fun with Seg.
The comment was towards Seg, not you.
Seg teased me about not bring up burying statues of Joseph to sell home. It was a joke between us.

You are too touchy.
No one is saying you lied.
If you remember, I verified your story. You mentioned the story in your past postings.
---Nikki on 5/14/13


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nikki,please don't tell me not to speak of st joseph statue buried for sale of house. seg can have a field day if he wants I just spake what happened to me. Its not that I speak a lie, but what I said really happened to me.
---shira4368 on 5/14/13


Yes, Shira, Lets call it truce!

Please don't bring up the 'burying the statue of Joesph' up again.
TheSeg is going to have a fields day with me again.
---Nikki on 5/14/13


nikki, we are nickpicking here. I have a friend who is ex-catholic. she is the one who told me to bury st. joseph in my front yard and my house would sell. I just told her I would trust God to help me do anything I need. God has never let me down yet. He will answer in His time. nikki, you get so defensive about everything. you call it standing up for your faith and I call it loud mouth. you say I am loudmouth, (paraphrase) and I say I am just defending my faith. actually I am defending Jesus Christ. He seems the one who everyone argues over. lets call a truce and you can believe what you wish and I know I will believe what I want...or what God wants me to believe.
---shira4368 on 5/13/13


You tell me you are sorry, but go and LIE ON ME???
YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOURSELF.
Then you attack me by saying I am reading some odd type of Bible?
NOW THAT'S HUTSPA!
---Nikki on 5/10/13

Ok, but the way you should have used it to say, Gee Shira, you really have chutzpah to say that to me. Yes, Shira has chutzpah alright, and that is a compliment. It takes chutzpah to defend what you believe. It means to be bold. Bold is a good thing.---kathr4453 on 5/13/13

Okay, if that's how you want to take you, and better if Shira agrees with you.
---Nikki on 5/13/13


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Sorry, I said Hutzpa to Shira because she accused me of attacking other's faith, but has the nerve to attack me.

Like 'audacity'
or better:
Chutzpah is -nerve-. It is -guts-. There really isn't a good English word for it. The traditional definition is: If you kill your father and mother, and then at your trial you beg for mercy on the ground that you're an orphan, that's chutzpah.-Yahoo
---Nikki on 5/13/13


Ok, but the way you should have used it to say, Gee Shira, you really have chutzpah to say that to me. Yes, Shira has chutzpah alright, and that is a compliment. It takes chutzpah to defend what you believe. It means to be bold. Bold is a good thing.
---kathr4453 on 5/13/13


I still wonder.....are you using it as a cheer, a salutation, an expression of some sort. I have seen you use it before, and wondered then what you meant by it.
---kathr4453 on 5/13/13


Sorry, I said Hutzpa to Shira because she accused me of attacking other's faith, but has the nerve to attack me.

Like 'audacity'
or better:
Chutzpah is -nerve-. It is -guts-. There really isn't a good English word for it. The traditional definition is: If you kill your father and mother, and then at your trial you beg for mercy on the ground that you're an orphan, that's chutzpah.-Yahoo
---Nikki on 5/13/13


Nikki, I wasn't concerned with the spelling, I knew what word you meant, and I don't correct anyone spelling as I am the chief of sinners when it comes to spelling....
but wondered in what sense you were using it???

I still wonder.....are you using it as a cheer, a salutation, an expression of some sort. I have seen you use it before, and wondered then what you meant by it.
---kathr4453 on 5/13/13


Hutspa ---Nikki on 5/12/13
So what does this mean...Oh I know what the word means, but can't figure out what it means in Nikki's context....
It's not like saying Sincerely, or bite me...and it's not some name to call someone. It's a noun.---kathr4453 on 5/13/13

No, no, no, Grandma corrected me on it's spelling. Didn't you read it?
It's Hutzpa or the other options she gave me.

But, Kathr, we ladies have been are known to be COLD, MEAN AND HEARTLESS.
Let's not prove it, okay?

God bless, PEACE.
---Nikki on 5/13/13


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Hutspa

---Nikki on 5/12/13



So what does this mean...Oh I know what the word means, but can't figure out what it means in Nikki's context....

It's not like saying Sincerely, or bite me...and it's not some name to call someone. It's a noun.

---kathr4453 on 5/13/13


Nikki: Sorry. It appears two different dictionaries have two different rules. Live and learn. My bad.
---Grandma on 5/13/13


chutzpah, chutzpa, hutzpah, or hutzpa are the correct spellings. None of them has the letter 's.'---Grandma on 5/12/13

Grandma! Are you talking to me now?

You have forgiven me huh?
Good

Anyway, my dictionary gave me a 's' in hutzpah. But since spelling and grammar isn't best subjects as math, I shall not dare to argue with you on the matter.

Thanks for telling me. I shall spell it as you taught me.

God bless and late Happy Mother's day.
---Nikki on 5/13/13


chutzpah, chutzpa, hutzpah, or hutzpa are the correct spellings. None of them has the letter 's.'
---Grandma on 5/12/13


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Nikki, You've been given enough of the Word, yet reject in favor of your man made religion the Holy Spirit is not empowering. Now you have heard others testify, that you scoff at. So be it. That's your free will and choice. God did not make you believe lies, you have chosen to believe them all by yourself.

But YOU didn't come on CN to defend your faith...you came to push it on others. If you didn't, why are you here? You first throw it in everyone's face, and then claim...oh I'm just defending my faith.

Believe what you choose to Nikki. Now that you have heard both sides, YOU chose life or death. We can't chose for you. Salvation is a personal individual matter where your faith is in Jesus Christ....NOT A DENOMINATION.
---kathr4453 on 5/13/13


Nikki I didn't say u attack everyone but you do attack others who don't agree with u.---shira4368 on 5/12/13

Let me refresh your memory:

nikki, I am sorry to say but you have argued with everyone about the catholic faith. go back and read what you said. you condemn all who do not believe in Catholicism.---shira4368 on 5/10/13

Please copy and paste as I did proving I attacked someone for not agreeing with me, instead of me defending my faith after you all ATTACK IT.

Hutspa
---Nikki on 5/12/13


So God is going through a Woman to restore Mankind by Jesus.
---Nikki on 5/12/13

I like ya


1 Corinthians 11:12 For as the woman [is] of the man, even so [is] the man also by the woman, but all things of God.
---francis on 5/12/13


Kathr, you are mad about me not believing your truth over the Truth taught to me.
You are the one who is sarcastic, mean and calling names.
I returned the sarcastic part back at you. You are upset when you get a taste of your own medicine.

I not trying to convert any one of you all, but you are trying to convert me.
My beliefs, not yours, Jed, Gordon, or Grandma.

Cluny and I don't except to convince each other in who's Church is first. Is Cluny upset? No.

It was I do said Cluny and I were having fun, NOT CLUNY.

But, do you see how you accused Cluny, and he DIDN'T even say he was having fun.
You even said he had a sick humor. Why? He didn't laugh. I didn't.

You need to re-examine yourself.
---Nikki on 5/12/13


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Nikki I didn't say u attack everyone but you do attack others who don't agree with u. I am just as proud of my church and I am not jealous of ur church, as a matter of fact my beliefs are totally opposite of urs.
---shira4368 on 5/12/13


\\Well obviously Nikki others here disagree with your attitude.\\
---kathr4453 on 5/12/13

You know, I've really got to take issue with that. I've had probably a couple dozen exchanges with Nikki - some agreements and some disagreements

In my estimation, IF you approach her with verifiable info, facts, logic, and scripture, she is a fun blogger to spar with

But I have seen her unduly LAMBASTED with ridicule and judgment, accusations against her motives and honesty, untruthful accusations against her beliefs practices - mostly based on presumption

GOOD GRIEF ! ! ! !

There are a good many of you who need to be scourged for your "pious" behavior

You wonder why she lashes back ??
---James_L on 5/12/13


Well obviously Nikki others here disagree with your attitude. You don't want to discuss or learn, but make sarcastic remarks to all, calling it ...." defending my faith and the RCC".

Don't we defend with the Word of Truth? I've given you truth and you are still making sarcastic remarks, as though it is a joke to you.

I'm glad you and Cluny are having FUN, but you have a sick sense of humor. I honestly do not believe your kind of FUN is pleasing to God.
---kathr4453 on 5/12/13


Nikki, did you get thrown out, or did you quit? And you think your attitude represents the RCC because.---kathr4453 on 5/12/13

Kathr, as I told Shira, SHOW PROOF of me attacking anyone? I defended myself and of course my beloved Church.

I think you all are mad because I love my Church so much. TOO BAD!
I AM PROUD TO BE CATHOLIC.

As for me being a Nun, I don't have to answer such private matters as I don't see you asking anyone else.
But since those were the happiest days of my life, I shall tell you.

Sisters of Dominican Hawthorne of St. Rose of Lima.

I LEFT before my FINAL VOWS due to illness.

NOW DON'T HARASSES THOSE GOOD SISTERS!
---Nikki on 5/12/13


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Neither Ruth, Bathsheba, nor Rehab Had anything to do with the birth or blood line of Jesus. Mary, as His Mother, di---Joseph on 5/12/13

The blood went through the Man.
The promise was given to Abraham, then through David.

The promise to the snake in Gen 3:15 explained Mary's rule in that satan went through a Woman to destroy Mankind.

So God is going through a Woman to restore Mankind by Jesus.
---Nikki on 5/12/13


you always knew who the mother was. Hebrew Geologies always followed the female blood line.
---Blogger9211 on 5/4/13

If we trace the lineage of Jesus back through Mary, then should we not trace it back and consider all the other females in his lineage?

Tamar a Canaanite, Rehab from Jericho, Ruth a Moabite, Bathsheba a Hittite
---francis on 5/4/13

Neither Ruth, Bathsheba, nor Rehab Had anything to do with the birth or blood line of Jesus. Mary, as His Mother, did.
---joseph on 5/12/13

If Mary was an Ethiopian, we can still trace his blood line back to David, because all the men in his line were Hebrews. If we consider the female blood line, then the four would take us away from Judah.
---francis on 5/12/13


"If you wentthrough mary, you would have to also go through Ruth, Bathsheba, and Rehab which would all take you away from Aarom and Levi" ---francis on 5/8/13
Why? Neither Ruth, Bathsheba, nor Rehab Had anything to do with the birth or blood line of Jesus. Mary, as His Mother, did.
---joseph on 5/12/13


First of all, if Nikki is/ was a nun, I would like to know what Order? What I see is anything BUT a Nun, but a smart mouth who exhibits the opposite of what Nuns are to be.....not someone online attacking others regardless of feeling put on the spot. I've had conversations with RCC here before, Emcee for one, who was a delight to converse with.

Nikki, did you get thrown out, or did you quit? And you think your attitude represents the RCC because..................
---kathr4453 on 5/12/13


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you have argued with everyone about the catholic faith.. you condemn all who do not believe in Catholicism. you have bad mouthed every faith that is mentioned here.--shira4368


Correction, I have defended the Catholic Faith with almost everyone.

You just LIED!
I NEVER TOLD ANYONE TO BELIEVE in the Catholicism. I said the use the Catholicism to states the RCC's beliefs.

I NEVER bad mouth ANY faith, not to mention every faith that is mentioned here on this website.

NAME ONE FAITH! I am too busy defending my own Church.

You tell me you are sorry, but go and LIE ON ME???
YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOURSELF.

Then you attack me by saying I am reading some odd type of Bible?

NOW THAT'S HUTSPA!
---Nikki on 5/10/13


nikki, I am sorry to say but you have argued with everyone about the catholic faith. go back and read what you said. you condemn all who do not believe in Catholicism. you have bad mouthed every faith that is mentioned here. I don't know what bible you use but mine says to call no one father except our Father in heaven.
---shira4368 on 5/10/13


The RCC doesn't argue with the Bible.

//Mat 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph..Luk 3:23 And Jesus..(as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was [the son] of Heli,
\... Saint Joachim, was the father of the Blessed Virgin Mary ...\
How do Roman Catholics explain 3 grandfathers?---micha9344 on 5/9/13

I guess they(RCC) assume Jacob and Heli are the same person with 2 names. (I am not speaking for the RCC, I am guessing)

But how can you give 2 different names for Joseph's father from the Bible and question the RCC?
Are you saying the RCC is responsible for the Bible?

Joachim is MARY'S father.

What does the naming of Joseph's father have to do with Mary's father?
He isn't even named in the Bible.
---Nikki on 5/10/13


Mat 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
Luk 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was [the son] of Heli,
\... Saint Joachim (whose name means Yahweh prepares), was the father of the Blessed Virgin Mary ...\
How do Roman Catholics explain 3 grandfathers?
---micha9344 on 5/9/13


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So, as per LUKE 3:23-38, is Heli not Joseph's father-in-law and Mary's father?---Gordon on 5/3/13

No, Saint Joachim (whose name means Yahweh prepares), was the father of the Blessed Virgin Mary. Anne (Hebrew, Hannah, grace, also spelled Ann, Anne, Anna) is the traditional name of the mother of the Blessed Virgin Mary. St. Anne and St. Joachim were parents of the Blessed Virgin Mary and grandparents of Jesus. - Catholic Fire
---Nikki on 5/9/13


There are two lineages given , BOTH lead back to David. One by Nathan David's son, the other by Solomon David's son.

Luke 3:31 which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David,

Matthew 1:6 and David the king begat Solomon


Then the bible assures us that Jesus did not come from the line of Levi


Hebrews 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and NOT be called after the order of Aaron?

Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
---francis on 5/8/13


Thus 'I' believe the human lineage of Jesus to be of both the tribe of Judah, (the king line), through David, and Levi, (the priest line), through Mary.
---joseph on 5/4/13//
No
beIf you wentthrough mary, you would have to also go through Ruth, Bathsheba, and Rehab which would all take you away from Aarom and Levi
---francis on 5/8/13


//1. Elisabeth was of the daughters of Aaron. Luke 1:5
2. Mary was her cousin. Luke 1:36
3. Aaron was a Levite. Exd. 4:14
Thus 'I' believe the human lineage of Jesus to be of both the tribe of Judah, (the king line), through David, and Levi, (the priest line), through Mary.
After all, Jesus, the man, is said to be "a priest forever according to the order or fashion of Melchisedec", who was both king and priest.Heb. 7:17,1
---joseph on 5/4/13//

Agree.
God bless you brother.

Nothing stopped this plan.
King of king-Lord of lords.

Shalom
---char on 5/8/13


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---Joseph_ROY on 5/7/13
I do not remember quoting from the book of Ruth at all
---francis on 5/8/13


Francis, while accepting all that is said about the genealogy of Jesus and its importance, we must remember that the Book of Ruth is not a chronicle. It is a small novel. So we must not drag the question too far through that.
---Joseph_ROY on 5/7/13


Jesus was born a thousand years after David. As the prophecies revealed, he was from the root of Jesse and David's son. He was born of Mary a virgin. As per Jewish custom a woman has to be married and so, though she was carrying and yet got married to Joseph who was introduced as a carpenter which is a coded term for "Mauryan".
---Joseph_ROY on 5/6/13


This is truly sad

Only two people here this far have realized that both lineages point back to David by two different sons of David.

No other explanation is needed
Luke 3:31 which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David,

Matthew 1:6 and David the king begat Solomon

Jesus did not come from the line of Levi at all, he was not a priest after the Levitical priesthood

Hebrews 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and NOT be called after the order of Aaron?

Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
---francis on 5/5/13


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\\the most plausible explanation that I have read concerning this, is the one offered by Eusebius, a 3rd century Roman historian...\\
---joseph on 5/4/13

I agree. This is the best explanation I've ever seen.

This view came to Eusebius from the writings of Julius Africanus, a historian who lived from about 160-240ad
---James_L on 5/5/13


Joseph, good answer!
---Love.wins on 5/5/13


Gordon to directly address your question, the most plausible explanation that I have read concerning this, is the one offered by Eusebius, a 3rd century Roman historian. According to him, "Matthan, of Solomon's descent, marries Estha and gives birth to Jacob. (Mat 1:15) Matthan dies. Matthat, of Nathan's descent, marries Estha and gives birth to Heli. [Therefore] Jacob and Heli are uterine brothers. Heli marries a wife but dies childless. In keeping the Jewish law, Jacob marries his brother's wife to raise up seed for him, and Joseph is born. (Luk 3:23) [Therefore] Joseph is naturally Jacob's son, but is according to law, Heli's son".
---joseph on 5/4/13


Luk 3:31 the son of Melea, the son of Menna, the son of Mattatha, the son of Nathan, the son of David,
Luk 3:32 the son of Jesse,

Mat 1:6 and Jesse the father of David the king. And David was the father of Solomon by the wife of Uriah,
Mat 1:7 and Solomon the father of Rehoboam, and Rehoboam the father of Abijah, and Abijah the father of Asaph,

what's most interesting to me is one lineage takes the lineage through Jonathan and the other takes it through Solomon.
---aka on 5/5/13


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If we trace the lineage of Jesus back through Mary, then should we not trace it back and consider all the other females in his lineage?

Tamar a Canaanite
Rehab from Jericho
Ruth a Moabite
Bathsheba a Hittite
---francis on 5/4/13


The practice of Jews to determine the Jewishness of a child through the mother is relativly recent. It was not the practice in Bible times. Ruth was not Jewish and her husband was, but there is no evidence that her children were not accepted as Jewish from birth.
---Love.wins on 5/4/13


I notice how the Luke genealogy is backwards . . . all the way back to Adam. And this genealogy is mentioned when Jesus is in ministry. The Matthew genealogy shows before reporting the birth of Jesus. By age thirty, Jesus' father Joseph could have died, and now He could have a step-father named Joseph, whom people "supposed" was his dad, in which case His genealogy could be "supposed" to be of the second Joseph.

In any case, the presentations of these genealogies agree that Jesus came to earth in the flesh.

Also, Jesus was "supposed" by many to be just a human, so His genealogy would go back to Adam, when really Jesus is the "only begotten Son" of our Father, and He was before Adam.
---willie_c: on 5/4/13


Patrilineal gemology may be common in other cultures but not in Judaism because the Jews were very practical as you can never be sure who the father was but you always knew who the mother was. Hebrew Geologies always followed the female blood line.

0f course this is all negated in modern times by in vitro fertilization.
---Blogger9211 on 5/4/13


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Gordon 'I' believe that Mary was of the tribe of Levi for the following reasons.
1. Elisabeth was of the daughters of Aaron. Luke 1:5
2. Mary was her cousin. Luke 1:36
3. Aaron was a Levite. Exd. 4:14
Thus 'I' believe the human lineage of Jesus to be of both the tribe of Judah, (the king line), through David, and Levi, (the priest line), through Mary.
After all, Jesus, the man, is said to be "a priest forever according to the order or fashion of Melchisedec", who was both king and priest.Heb. 7:17,1
---joseph on 5/4/13


Making both Joseph and Mary from the lineage of king David?
---Gordon on 5/3/13

Yes one from Nathan, and one from Solomon, two sons of David

Luke 3:31 which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David,

Matthew 1:6 and David the king begat Solomon
---francis on 5/4/13


Joachim was Mary's father. Both genealogies are Joseph's. All genealogies in the Bible are patrilineal.
---Love.wins on 5/3/13


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