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Who Is Saved

Many here seem to believe that God does not know who is going to be saved. Do you believe that? Give passages.

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 ---Mark_V. on 5/24/13
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Christian is correct, Jesus chose His twelve apostles and ordained them to go out and bring forth fruit. John 15:16. Does that mean the disciples had no choice but to be chosen and ordained? Apparently not. Jesus asks His twelve in John 6:67 "will you also go away?" Peter answers..."who else would we go to? You have the Words of eternal life". Peter chose to follow Jesus.

John 6:44 is not teaching predestination. Jesus is teaching that if you seek His Father, learn of His Father and obey Him then you will know the Son. John 6:45 "Everyone that has learned and heard of the Father, comes to me". Why? Because the Son speaks, teaches and agrees with the Words of God given thru the Law and the Prophets.
---barb on 5/29/13


Mark_V., we are judged by our FRUITS.
All GOOD works comes from the Graces of God used by us.

James 2:14-19 What is it, by brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister has nothing to wear and has no food for the day, and one of you says to him, "Go in peace, keep warm and eat well," but you do not give them the necessisties of the body, what good is it? So aslos faith of itself, if does not have works, is dead. Indeed someone might say, you have faith and I have works. Demonstrate your faith to me without works, and I will demonstrate MY FAITH TO YOU FROM MY WORKS. You believe that God is one. You do well. Even the DEMONS BELIEVE THAT AND TREMBLE.
---Nikki on 5/29/13


christan * Jesus told the apostles, "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you", so if God has chosen the apostles, what's there then for them to choose God? That's why free-will makes no sense whatsoever according to the Holy Bible.

Judas was one of the chosen and he use his free-will to leave!

christan * Read carefully - "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." Whose will is it that brings the sinner to Christ?

Read carefully: the next verse "Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me" V 45
---Ruben on 5/29/13


shira4368, how is someone who's "predestined" by God to be conformed "to the image of His Son Jesus" even have a "choice"? As I have told some people here, predestination cannot go hand in hand with the doctrine of free-will.

Jesus told the apostles, "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you", so if God has chosen the apostles, what's there then for them to choose God? That's why free-will makes no sense whatsoever according to the Holy Bible.

Read carefully - "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day." Whose will is it that brings the sinner to Christ?
---christan on 5/29/13


Marks, why do you think the I saved are part of the elect? If all the unsaved will never get saved, why do you call them elect? We are all predestined to be saved, not a few. I know many will not be saved because they reject Christ.
---shira4368 on 5/29/13




Nikki, now to defend what you said that people without Christ do go to heaven you say,
"MarkV, I said if you do good, and have not heard the Gospel you are Saved." Do you not know what is written concerning those without Christ?
"There is none righteous, no, not one"
There is none who understands
there is none who seeks after God. They have all turned aside. They have together become unprofitable, "There is no one who does good, no, not one"
(Rom. 3:10-12). You say there is. God says that anything without faith is sin. That means anything you do without faith in Jesus Christ is sin. What you see as good, is sin. Good works do not save you.

---Mark_V. on 5/29/13


---jerry6593 on 5/29/13

\\James 2:19 indicates that mere belief - mental assent - is not sufficient for salvation, there must be action in the life to back it up.\\

WRONG ! ! br>
James TWICE mentioned a believer's judgment (2:12, 3:1), which puts it SQUARELY in the context of rewards, not authenticity of faith. See 1Cor 3:12-15

"mental assent" is another perversion of yours.

Faith is FULL ASSURANCE (Rom 4:21-24), not assent

\\..."Love thy neighbor" \\

study the use of neighbor, and compare it to enemy, brother, stranger and friend

The OT uses neighbor where the NT uses brother. It means another believer, not those of you who follow a few outward commandments
---James_L on 5/29/13


\\ How can unsaved man truly believe in his Heart , Unless God has made him a New creature? \\
---RICHARDC on 5/28/13

First, developing doctrine from a philosophical question has led to all sorts of heresies, ya know.


Second, were Ezekiel and Jeremiah pawning off regeneration as part of a future covenant, when it was happening all along ?? - Jer 31:31-33, Ezek 36:25-27 - Wow, they went out on a limb, huh ?


Third, Romans 4:5 says VERY PLAINLY that God justifies the UNGODLY
Your philosophy is at odds with scripture. Who's report shall we believe ??


Fourth, You don't understand the context of Romans 10:9-10
---James_L on 5/29/13


MarkV, I said if you do good, and have not heard the Gospel you are Saved. God is all Merciful, not partial merciful, or selected in being merciful.

You left out the part of being good, when you quoted me.

What's so confusing?

Do you see how the one above is good, but not Saved because he didn't not HEAR the Gospel?

If you reject the Gospel, it means HEARD THE GOSPEL FIRST.
---Nikki on 5/29/13


James L: You indicate that I should be ashamed for quoting scripture. I never will be. James 2:19 indicates that mere belief - mental assent - is not sufficient for salvation, there must be action in the life to back it up.

I'll bet you are one of those "believers" that think "Love thy neighbor" is the only Law you must keep. Thanks for the love. I can almost feel it.



---jerry6593 on 5/29/13




Jerry, you say,
"What's the difference? And no, the Bible does not teach that we are all guilty of Adam's sin. We all have Adam's sinful nature - the propensity to sin -"
the difference is that no one is saved before been born. They are elected to be saved after they are born. A very big difference. For all descendants Adam are guilty and are already condemned especially those under the Law.
For, "He who believes in Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God" (John 3:18). That is why the elect need to be saved while they are still physically alive.
---Mark_V. on 5/29/13


"Markie: "No one saved before they are born. It's Election unto salvation"

What's the difference? And no, the Bible does not teach that we are all guilty of Adam's sin. We all have Adam's sinful nature - the propensity to sin - but we make the FREE WILL ELECTION CHOICE to sin on our own. Jesus inherited this same nature through His mother, else He could not have been tempted, but He did not sin! If I am guilty of Adam's sin, then so was Jesus.

You have so much to learn, but you have a heart of stone."
---jerry6593 on 5/27/13


I must agree with the truth & this time you hit the nail squarely on the head Jerry. I'm impressed! :)
---Leon on 5/28/13


JamesL on 5/28/13 -

Romans 10:10 - For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness and with the mouth confession is made to salvation,

( Once again James , How can unsaved man truly believe in his Heart , Unless God has made him a New creature? Now some men can understand the Gospel ,and say they believe in God, And are not Saved, - Wheats and Tares - The ones that Truly believe and do the will of God and are regenerate, Gods - elect - chosen - If it is man will, or if man gets to chooses ,then why are there Tares ? What do the Tares do that was wrong ? Didn't confess with there mouth right ? could God not of corrected them ? - 2 Peter 2:9 - Could God not Chasten Them ? - Hebrews 12:7 }
---RICHARDC on 5/28/13


Christian, you are saying the same thing I have always said. we are all predestine. man has had choice since genesis. adam had a choice and eve had a choice.
---shira4368 on 5/28/13


"Predestination is NOT unto conversion, but GLORY." JamesL

You should read what constitutes to predestinating a soul to it's final destination of glorification. Paul expounded it clearly in Romans 8:29,30

1. "For whom he did foreknow"
2. "He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son"
3. "Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called"
4. "and whom he called, them he also justified"
5. "and whom he justified, them he also glorified"

Your "concept" of predestination is erroneous, to say the least. Your god does not know who he's going to save, not mine.
---christan on 5/28/13


---RICHARDC on 5/28/13

\\Roman 10:9 - ..confess with mouth... BELIEVE IN THINE HEART...thou shalt be saved.\\

WRONG context, WRONG salvation, WRONG application


\\Jeremiah 17:9 - The HEART is deceitful above all things...\\

HEART is used in many ways in scripture - emotion, will, the very fiber of one's bein, the inner man, etc.


\\How can a Unsaved man Truly believe in his heart, if it is Wicked ? Unless God First has Change That person HEART, So Then, that man can truly Believe\\

So the word of God takes a back seat to your ability to reason? Nice, man. Very nice


\\Psalm 51:10 - Create in me a clean heart...\\

a SAVED man said that, you know ??
---James_L on 5/28/13


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\\If you believe, THEN you will be saved.\\
---Jasheradan

\\Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God, thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.\\
---jerry6593


Jerry, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

WHERE does that verse say the devil BELIEVES IN God ??? NOWHERE

WHERE does it say the devil BELIEVES THE GOSPEL ??? NOWHERE

Believing that God exists does NOT constitute believing IN Him or believing His promises.

Besides that, YOU don't even understand the context that James was writing in.

Shame on you
---James_L on 5/28/13


Many here seem to believe that God does not know who is going to be saved. Do you believe that? Give passages.
---Mark_V. on 5/24/13

What needs to be done here if for this idiot to post from the blogs where people have said that god does not know who will be saved
---francis on 5/28/13


JASHERADAN - ON 5/27/13 ---- If you Believe - then you will be Saved ,

Roman 10:9 - That if thou shall confess with mouth the Lord Jesus, and Shalt BELIEVE IN THINE HEART that God raised him from the dead thou shalt be saved.

Jeremiah 17:9 - The HEART is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked, who can Know It,

{ How can a Unsaved man Truly believe in his heart, if it is Wicked ? Unless God First has Change That person HEART, So Then, that man can truly Believe,}

Refer - Romans 2:28-29

Psalm 51:10 - Create in me a clean heart, O God ,and renew a right spirit within me,
---RICHARDC on 5/28/13


Whosoever means anyone can come.

Mat 10:32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 12:50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.
Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

You forget this verse:
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness, but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/28/13


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---christan on 5/27

Predestination is NOT unto conversion, but GLORY

Rom 8:29-30
...that JESUS would be the firstborn among many SONS...Those He PREDESTINED...He CALLED...He also GLORIFIED

1Pet 1:21
God raised JESUS from the dead and gave Him GLORY

1Pet 5:10
the God of all grace, who CALLED you to His eternal GLORY in Christ...

1Pet 2:20-21
When you SUFFER...you have been CALLED for this very purpose

Mark 10:35-40
Grant that we may sin on your left and right...in your GLORY...This is not Mine to give, but it is for those for whom it has been prepared

YOU need to leave your "theologians", and study
---James_L on 5/28/13


"Yes, because God LOVES and is MERCIFUL to EVERYONE He created!" Nikki

Really? Let's see what the Bible has to say about your claim.

"For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward." Deuteronomy 10:17

"And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing" Daniel 4:35, "Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do." John 8:44, "As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated." Romans 9:13

"MERCIFUL to EVERYONE"? Not according to the Holy Bible.
---christan on 5/28/13


//
If you believe, THEN you will be saved.

---Jasheradan on 5/27/13 //


Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God, thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.



---jerry6593 on 5/28/13


The doctrine of Predestination comes from God's Word. Its mentioned all through Scripture. The doctrine of 'free will' is not mentioned anywhere, only in the minds of individuals. Know why? Because all descendants of Adam are condemned. Dead in sin. In bondage to their father satan, and don't even realize it.
Concerning the chosen ones,
"But God, who is rich in mercy, "because of His great love with which He loved us" He loves those who are been save by Him. His chosen ones. "even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved)" (Eph. 2:4,5). God did not mention those whom He didn't love. If they were included they too would be saved by grace.
---Mark_V. on 5/28/13


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Nikki, first you say about God,
"Yes, because God LOVES and is MERCIFUL to EVERYONE He created!
No one is more special than anyone else."

If you are correct that He "is merciful to everyone," and no one is more special than another, why do you say,
"You have to reject Him, not to go to Heaven."
you first say no one is special over another, then you say those who receive Christ are special because they chose Christ.
On the other blog, you say that if someone does not hear the gospel they are saved. In other words there is another way into heaven without Christ. So it is better not to teach the gospel this way they are saved. This is not even Catholic theology.
---Mark_V. on 5/28/13


to think that one, who doesn't believe in the doctrine of predestination as Calvinists teach, believes in the doctrine free will is faulty.
---aka on 5/27/13


Therefore being justified BY FAITH

By whom also we have access BY FAITH into this grace wherein we stand

You don't believe Jesus Christ is God in the flesh? God's grace is not extended towards you. Period! God's spirit speaks the truth to men. That doesn't mean he forces them to believe it!

The faith required is not something we must seek (according to scripture).

Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? Or, Who shall descend into the deep? But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach

.
If you believe, THEN you will be saved.
---Jasheradan on 5/27/13


"JamesL, go ask any theologians or pastors about the doctrine of predestination"--Christan

There is your problem, sir. You're relying upon the understanding of men or angels rather than letting the Spirit of Truth teach you. Scripture warns against this very thing. It leads to deception. Men cannot be trusted. Our Savior can!

Why do you need men to teach you the meaning of scripture when you as a believer have the Spirit of God living within you? Listen to Him, not men.
---LindaH on 5/27/13


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Unless God demonstrates His mercy on you, you're not going to receive His gift of faith (Ephesians 2:8). Basically God has to first love you which is why He elects you - not because you chose Him! That's because God's love in election is unconditional (Romans 9:11).
Does this sound like free-will to you?---christan on 5/27/13

Yes, because God LOVES and is MERCIFUL to EVERYONE He created!
No one is more special than anyone else.

You have to reject Him, not to go to Heaven.
---Nikki on 5/27/13


Does GOD not foreknow everyone? Does He not know who everyone in the world is and everyone who has ever been born?

To foreknow does not mean GOD forces people to believe.

1Jo 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world.


1Jo 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.


1Jo 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/27/13


JamesL, go ask any theologians or pastors about the doctrine of predestination (and I'm talking about the absolute predestination of God and not the hodge-podge predestination that you belief in, which isn't even predestination) and they'll tell you that it doesn't go hand in hand with free-will.

What you really are is nothing but a free-willer pretending to believe that it's God who chooses. And yet you deny that He predestine souls to be in heaven and in hell. Bottomline, a hypocrite.

Best said by Christ, "This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me."
---christan on 5/27/13


Nobody has "access to FAITH in Christ" through their free-will. "FAITH" is the sole property of God which He dispenses only through His good pleasure. Unless God demonstrates His mercy on you, you're not going to receive His gift of faith (Ephesians 2:8). Basically God has to first love you which is why He elects you - not because you chose Him! That's because God's love in election is unconditional (Romans 9:11).

Does this sound like free-will to you?

Quoting Romans 5:2 without verse 1 is gross misconduct in preaching the Gospel of Jesus Christ. One has "access by faith into this grace" is simply because the sinner has been "justified by faith", so says verse 1.
---christan on 5/27/13


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Markie: "No one saved before they are born. It's Election unto salvation"

What's the difference? And no, the Bible does not teach that we are all guilty of Adam's sin. We all have Adam's sinful nature - the propensity to sin - but we make the FREE WILL ELECTION CHOICE to sin on our own. Jesus inherited this same nature through His mother, else He could not have been tempted, but He did not sin! If I am guilty of Adam's sin, then so was Jesus.

You have so much to learn, but you have a heart of stone.


---jerry6593 on 5/27/13


\\Jasheradan, you're just as confused and deluded as JamesL.\\
---Christan

Says the one who doesn't understand context. You're funny. You can't choose God by hoping in Predestination.

Give up your free will, Christan. God knows who are His, and doesn't need you telling Him that you're stronger than Him, and that you've chosen yourself




\\We have access into Gods grace BY faith (Romans 5:2), not access to faith by Gods grace (as Calvinists believe)\\
---Jasheradan on 5/26/13


GOOD STUFF ! ! !
bears repeating
---James_L on 5/27/13


..Predestination to salvation is not truth. Predestination to being conformed to the image of Christ IS truth... jasheradan

I like that.
---aka on 5/26/13


Jasheradan, you're just as confused and deluded as JamesL. What's true is Bible did say "he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son". But why did you leave out the words prior to this which says explicitly, "For whom He did foreknow", that is, there's a subject or in this case a person that's predestined.

Paul explicitly completes the picture of predestination in the following chapter of Romans 9:13, "As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated." Yes, only those whom God has loved "before the foundations of the world" will He save. Needless then to say what happens to those whom He hates.
---christan on 5/26/13


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Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity, but toward thee, goodness, IF thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off - Romans 11:22

Take heed, BRETHREN, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God - Heb 3:12

Predestination to salvation is not truth. Predestination to being conformed to the image of Christ IS truth.

We have access into Gods grace BY faith (Romans 5:2), not access to faith by Gods grace (as Calvinists believe)

God does not force people to believe in him.
---Jasheradan on 5/26/13


There are saints and there are the elect. Ever notice how scripture separates the two?

If God didn't elect some to belief, then there would have been noone to spread the gospel. If He had left Israel alone they would have ALL become like Sodom and Gomorrah.

Paul was one of the chosen ones - "it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks" meaning, resisting the LORD's will is pointless.

Some are elected. Not ALL. If you read scripture in that context it makes perfect sense.
---LindaH on 5/26/13


JamesL, here's a couple of verses from the Word of God that calls your understanding of "Predestination has NOTHING to do with who is saved from hell..." erroneous.

To those who believe, ie saved - "And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed." Acts 13:48

To those who are in unbelief, ie condemned - "And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed."

Both these verses explicitly speaks of predestination to eternal life and death. So much for your understanding.
---christan on 5/26/13


If someone ws elected to salvation before they were born, they woudl not need to be born again, nor obey the gospel. they would never have to confess that Jesus came in the flesh. they woudl not even have to accept Jesus as saviour before they were choosen / elected to be saved even before birth
---francis on 5/26/13


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Jerry, you say,

"..But if one were "saved" before he was born, then he couldn't be saved because he wasn't lost"

No one saved before they are born. It's Election unto salvation. All descendants of Adam are born in sin and considered condemned.
(1 Thess. 5:9)
"For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ." We should know our election,
"Knowing, beloved brethren, your election by God. For our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Spirit and in much assurance,.." (1 Thess. 1:4,5). To the others,it came in word only, but with no power or the Holy Spirit, for only the elect belief.
---Mark_V. on 5/26/13


"Predestination has NOTHING to do with who is saved from hell, who goes to heaven, who is converted, who believes the gospel, who is redeemed, or however you want to word it." JamesL

"For whom He did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified." Romans 8:29,30

"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me, and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out."

Does this sound like God doesn't know who He is going to saved?
---christan on 5/25/13


Childish tit-for-tat, that's all. ---James_L on 5/25/13

that is funny. i have been accused of that too.

there is only one will that matters - God's will. there is freedom in that. there is no freedom in any other kind of will.
---aka on 5/26/13


The Bible says that Jesus came to save the lost. But if one were "saved" before he was born, then he couldn't be saved because he wasn't lost.

To imply one's current salvational status is to usurp God's authority of final judgement. That seems like blasphemy to me.



---jerry6593 on 5/26/13


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Salvation is a free gift without any work whatsoever. (Eph. 2:8-9) Salvation is not dependent upon walking the aisle, joining the church, being baptized, turning over a new leaf, repenting of your sins, turning from your sins, forsaking your sins, confessing your sins, asking for forgiveness of your sins or inviting Christ into your heart.

Forgiveness is available to all who believe that Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again and that God forgave us for Christs sake. (I Cor. 15:1-4) Salvation is trusting completely in what Christ did in our behalf at Calvary. (Eph. 1:13) this truth has been hidden from the world by the religious system of this world that has substituted the traditions of men for the truth.
---michael_e on 5/26/13


James, no comparison,
"The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, and if children, then heirs-heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if we indeed suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together" (Rom. 8:16,17). The passages is not talking about predestination, it's about believers already with the Holy Spirit.
all believers are been made an heir of God our Father (Matt. 25:34: Gal. 3:29:) we will inherit eternal salvation, (Titus 3:7). God Himself (Psa. 73:25: Rev. 21:3). Every adopted child receives by divine grace the full inheritance Christ receives. Suffering comes as mockery, ridicule, physical suffering, or persecution because of the Lord. (Matt. 5:10-12: John 15:18-21).
---Mark_V. on 5/26/13


"Give up your free will belief, Christan. The bible never supports it, so you have no business teaching others to choose Christ." JamesL

Where does any of my blogs teach that you have to choose Christ? Go ahead, I challenge you to find it. You can even ask the moderator to provide you with my blogs since the very first day I set foot in CN.

Want to know my "favourite" verse? "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father."

Would a freewiller quote this? Would you?
---christan on 5/25/13


\\is the sun the moon, and the moon the sun, now?\\
---aka on 5/25/13

Not quite yet. I just figured since Christan has a habit of falsely accusing me of espousing Free Will, I would take the first jab and get in my false accusation against him before he has a chance.

Childish tit-for-tat, that's all.
---James_L on 5/25/13


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\\Some think that predestination is God determine before hand...

Predestination is that God has ordained ahead of time that all who believe will be saved\\
---francis on 5/25/13


You guys are arguing whether a bicycle has three wheels or four.

Predestination has NOTHING to do with who is saved from hell, who goes to heaven, who is converted, who believes the gospel, who is redeemed, or however you want to word it.

"Predestined" to be conformed to the image of Christ - thru suffering - and thereby become a joint-heir with Him.

Some will be in heaven and NOT share in His inheritance, because they did not pick up their cross daily
---James_L on 5/25/13


james l, how dare you say I think I am greater than God. that is the most stupid thing anyone has ever said to me. God GAVE me free will to accept Him or reject Him. the night I was saved, I could have willfully walked out the church door. God does not make anyone love Him, not even you.
---shira4368 on 5/25/13


did you know God didn't even like His creation and He repented that He even made man, but He chose His Son to redeem man. I think God can change His mind if He sees fit.
---shira4368 on 5/25/13


Please just read the verses I posted. They show that all mankind will be saved. It's pretty simple.
---Love.wins on 5/25/13


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---Nikki on 5/25/13
---barb on 5/25/13
---shira4368 on 5/25/13
Very good posts
_______________________

Some think that predestination is God determine before hand that some will be saved and some will be lost

Surely God knows who will be saved and who will be lost. But God did not create or cause anyone to be lost

Predestination is that God has ordained ahead of time that all who believe will be saved

Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved,
John 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
---francis on 5/25/13


l - wins

No doubt that you think the devil 2nd.Cor. 11 v 14 the enemy of God will be saved also.
---Lawrence on 5/25/13


Everyone knows that God knows who is going to be saved.

There are some here on CN who thinks they are Saved, and others or not Saved.
---Nikki on 5/25/13


God knows the end from the beginning so of course He knows who is going to choose to follow Him. Does He let His knowlege interfere with His plan of salvation? I don't believe so.

"But he that shall endure until the end, the same shall be saved." Matt 24:13. Doesn't this mean that we are saved if we endure until the end of our life or to the end of the age, whichever comes first? Is God saying that we are saved before we have crossed the finish line or after we have run the race? Matt 25:31-34.
---barb on 5/25/13


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//Give up your free will belief, Christan. //

What..?

is the sun the moon, and the moon the sun, now?
---aka on 5/25/13


\\JamesL: don't fool yourself that the Holy Bible is filled with coded messages. Ephesians 2:4-6 says what it says\\
---christan on 5/24/13

Not codes, just proper context.

Give up your free will belief, Christan. The bible never supports it, so you have no business teaching others to choose Christ.

You're a "free will" monger, thinking you're more powerful than God, that you can choose Him or reject Him.

He knows who are his, He doesn't need you telling Him that you chose Him
---James_L on 5/25/13


markv, I told you this was deep for me. I understand it yet I don't understand it. God has predestined everyone for salvation and sent His Son to die for us. we can accept Christ or reject Christ.
---shira4368 on 5/25/13


Of course everyone will be saved. The Bible says so. Read the verses for yourself.
---Love.wins on 5/25/13


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l - wins.
Not all will be saved. Matt.7 v 13, broad is way that leads to destruction ( hell & the lake of fire ) & be many to go in thereat. Which Is, the author 2nd.Cor. 11 v 14 of the Man - made trinity in Rev. 17 v's 4 - 6, even those that worship the Man - made gods of buddha, allah, hindu, baha'i etc, j - witness, agnostics, atheist etc.
---Lawrence on 5/25/13


Everyone will be saved. 1 Timothy 2:4, 1 Timothy 4:10, John 12:32
---Love.wins on 5/25/13


Shira, how can you be predestine unto salvation by God before the foundation of the world, and you still have a choice? If you have a choice, you cannot possibly be predestine to salvation. The word "pre" means "before" the word "destine" means "where your going." With God this was done before the foundation of the world.
Ruben your right about the consumation of our salvation. Those with faith in Jesus Christ right now, are spiritually baptized into the body of Christ, but our physical bodies have not been redeemed yet. The consumation will happen at the Second Coming of Christ. The New Covenant assures us that we are saved now, and the Holy Spirit gives us assurance of our salvation (1 Thess. 1:4,5).
---Mark_V. on 5/25/13


Ruben, why would you say,

"
No Mark, God know who is and who is not! But there are two here who know for a fact that they are the elect and are saved and do not know why God chose them to be the elect thus they are not going to hell like some of us who were not chosen!!!"


How do you know you were not chosen? You say you are going to hell, that tells me you have no faith in Christ at all. If you don't, how do you know if later on in life you will have faith and be saved? How do you know anyone outside yourself is save or not? If you had faith in the Lord works on the cross, you would be glad God had mercy on you. Instead, you would be thanking Him for saving you, not complaining.
---Mark_V. on 5/25/13


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Love ,wins on 5/24/13 Every one is Saved ??????????????

MATTHEW 7:13 - Because strait is the Gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and FEW there find it,

MATTHEW 25:46 - AND these shall go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into life eternal,

2 THESSALONIANS 1:8 In flaming fire taking on them that know not the God and that obey not the gospel of our Lord jesus Christ,
2 THESSALONIANS 1:9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power,

REVELATION 20:15 - And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire,
---RICHARDC on 5/25/13


God Knows ALL, & He Has that number, which will be few that will inter through - into the strait gate. Mark 16 v 16, ( Acts 2 v 38 which Fulfills Matt. 28 v 19 ), Matt. 24 v 13.

There is NO other salvation from God outside of Acts 2 v 38.
---Lawrence on 5/25/13


Everyone is saved. 1 Timothy 4:10
---Love.wins on 5/24/13


JamesL: don't fool yourself that the Holy Bible is filled with coded messages. Ephesians 2:4-6 says what it says, nothing more or nothing less. For God declared, "I have not spoken in secret, in a dark place of the earth... I the Lord speak righteousness, I declare things that are right."

shira4368: maybe you would like to prove the Scripture wrong and show us where it says in the Bible, "but only a few accept. we still have free choice", and I mean explicit verses that say so. Jesus even confirmed Ephesians 1:4-6 when He declared, "Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father." So much for your "free choice".
---christan on 5/24/13


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\\Having predestinated us...\\
---christan on 5/24/13


Oh, how much you could know if you only understood the context of the scriptures you quote.
---James_L on 5/24/13


"For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren." (Romans 8:29)

So, our Father knew He will change us into the image of Jesus. And we can know we are saved if "we first trusted in Christ" (Ephesians 2:12).

Also >

"Love has been perfected among us in this: that we may have boldness in the day of judgment, because as He is, so are we in this world." (1 John 4:17)

So, our Biblical assurance comes with how His love makes us "as He is" "in this world" . . . getting us "conformed to the image of His Son" like the Bible guarantees His love does in us. Romans 5:5, Jude 20-21
---willie_c: on 5/24/13


Christian, I've read these verses many times and I still know we are all predestined but only a few accept. we still have free choice.
---shira4368 on 5/24/13


ruben, I know I am saved but I didn't get that way because God knew me from the foundations of the world.

---shira4368 on 5/24


Shira,

Salvation is a process not a one-time event: ie

Rom. 8:24 - "for in this hope we were saved"-Past

2 Cor. 2:15 - "for we are the aroma of Christ to God among those who are being saved"-Present

Rom. 13:11 -" salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed"-Future

Jesus taught that we must endure to the very end to be saved-(MT 24:13)
---Ruben on 5/24/13


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"And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed." Acts 13:48

"According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love:

Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, To the praise of the glory of His grace, wherein He hath made us accepted in the beloved."
Ephesians 1:4-6
---christan on 5/24/13


ruben, I know I am saved but I didn't get that way because God knew me from the foundations of the world. I am saved because I was in my sin and heard an ol time preacher preach the Word of God and I accepted Christ as my savior. actually God did know all things that were, that are and things not yet come. that is deep for me because I know we still have a choice. I'm not even saying I understand all that. our thoughts are not God's thoughts and our ways are not God's ways. God knows and me as a lowly human don't know.
---shira4368 on 5/24/13


Many here seem to believe that God does not know who is going to be saved.
---Mark_V. on 5/24/13

where did you get that from?
---francis on 5/24/13


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