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Where Did Evil Come From

Where did evil come from?

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 ---Gordon on 6/16/13
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I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost,
That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.
For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh:

(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth,)

What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
---TheSeg on 6/21/13


Where Did Evil Come From
---Gordon on 6/16/13

not from GOD
but from GOP
---francis on 6/21/13


Seg you almost make sense, note the word "almost"

You see evil is not a created thing as others have already pointed out and therefore it could not have been breathed out in God's original creation.

Unbreakable logic SHOWS that it's not God's work because it will have it's end (Ecl 3:14) It shows that he did not create it because he called "every thing" he created "very good," and God condemns calling evil good. (Is 5:20)

If you ideas about God cannot be reconciled to the whole council of scripture they need to trashcanned, but I'm sure you'll keep ramming that square peg into the round hole because the KJV says God "creates evil."
---Pharisee on 6/21/13


The Seg,

I will reply to earlier posts later, but the error in your statements lies in believing that evil is an essence or a force. Evil is once again the ABSCENCE of the love of God. If evil were a force, then you could blame your sins on evil, from a power beyond your own. NO ONE can make you sin, the responsibility lies on your own shoulders. Satan could not even make Eve sin, he merely tempted her and presented her with the same situation he was cast from heaven for (wanting to be like God, omniscient, omnipresent, and all-knowing), but in the end the choice was made by herself. Looking at evil like it's a force is trying to come up with some excuse beyond the cowardice and greed of humanity to blame sin on.
---A_servant on 6/21/13


This is a very deep question Gordon. It's most difficult (though not impossible) for us mere humans to understand & answer. In my heart I believe "we" know the answer from what overall Scripture says about Creator God & His relationship to His creation.

It's a very profound question with perhaps a very simple explanation that's right in our face if only we will see it. I'm yet struggling to fashion it into words that will ring truth.
---Leon on 6/21/13




Regarding your other post on Jude 1:10. Here are two "dumbed down" translations:

1: But these people blaspheme all that they do not understand, and they are destroyed by all that they, like unreasoning animals, understand instinctively.

2: Yet these people slander whatever they do not understand, and the very things they do understand by instinct--as irrational animals do--will destroy them.

So basically these say that as a result of our sinful nature passed down from the CHOICE OF MAN, is our instinctive nature and that it naturally rebels against God. REBELS. This again does not contribute to the statement that evil was God-breathed.
---A_servant on 6/21/13


One last comment before I leave for a time, regarding Mark and Pharisee,

This is the closest thing I could find in earlier posts regarding your argument:

"didn't Christ say:
Either make the tree good, and his fruit good, or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.

What kind of a tree would you say this is a good tree or a corrupt tree!"

I showed this to you because whether or not one of you stands on firmer ground than the other philosophically, it doesn't permit strife between you. Have a discussion on differing points of view if you must, but we are brothers here! Would you readily throw away a diamond if it pricked you?
---A_servant on 6/21/13


Mark your fake and so is your faith. My impression is that you don't know God in spirit. (ya know the way that counts)

Why do i say that? Because you believe in a god that shot himself in the foot destroying his own creation with evil, when that's the very thing he'll be doing in the end is removing it. If he's going to remove it then it stands to reason that he never intended it, but that doesn't jibe with your ideas about God so you cannot accept that. Your god is the god of the antfarm where creation is some experiment to which he has very little emotion tied up in it. YOU DON'T KNOW THE TRUE AND LIVING GOD, that's obvious from the beliefs you hold about him. I'd prefer that we no longer speak.
---Pharisee on 6/21/13


Most of you are saying God did not create evil!
And it seems you're almost at the point of denying the very existence of evil.
And yet you do not deny its existence.

The truth is either evil exist or evil does not exist.
If it doesn't exist then you have no worries because there is no evil.
Now if it exists and God is not it's creator, you have another creator!

To say somebody created evil is also saying another creator!
I know you see one thing clearly evil did not create itself, it had a creator!

I'll pray you see only one creator.
Try to remember this also God called everything working together Very Good.
He called nothing by its self!
God's Peace
---TheSeg on 6/21/13


Pharisee, what's wrong with the answers I give you? You do not answer my response but say,
"Where was your concern when Seg called the tree of Good and evil a false prophet? (Mat 7) You have no credibility sir." Sir, I know of nowhere, where the Seg said that the Tree of knowledge of good and evil was a false prophet. I have been answering you discussing the topic of evil. If you cannot have a normal discussion on the Word of God, why even answer? First you want to run away, then get upset, for what reason? All I did was give you Scripture. I never called you anything bad. You cannot discuss Scripture without getting upset at those who answer. You don't have to discussion the Word of God with me. You are free to leave.
---Mark_V. on 6/21/13




"Doesn't these words you gave best sum up the very word that's called evil?"

Actually NO, not when it's from the hand of God. For God to recompense evil is not evil it's better stated as Divine Justice. In fact if I had to pick a word Evil would be at the bottom of my list. This is just another perfect example of how the KJV uses oversimplified terminology to express a complex reality. You can't really think evil is the best word to use in this instance, I mean I'm sure you know how to use strong's numbers.

I wasn't going to say anything when I saw servant's post but I would have to say that was a perfect and succinct exposition of the verse. When someone says it all there's nothing to add.
---Pharisee on 6/21/13


A_servant
So the next time you see some suffering from H7451, you be sure to tell them!

Now all that's left is to change the other 612 times.

But start with these!
Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:

And since God never said you do evil!
You have no worry!
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/20/13


"The word translated "evil" is the word ra. It also means sorrow, calamity, disaster, afflictions, and adversity." A servant

Doesn't these words you gave best sum up the very word that's called evil? Is there anything good that comes from these words you gave?

Let's see, who brought the flood in the days of Noah? Or who raised the Red Sea that Israel could walk through on dry land and then closed the sea destroying Pharaoh's army? "Mother nature?"

"And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven, and every thing that is in the earth shall die." Genesis 6:17
---christan on 6/21/13


The Seg, Did God Create Evil? One passage of Scripture seems to teach that God created evil. In the King James Bible Isaiah 45:7 reads the following. I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. However this is not what the original Hebrew says. The word translated "evil" is the word ra. It also means sorrow, calamity, disaster, afflictions, and adversity. Modern translations have correctly translated the passage with a different English word such as the following example. I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster, I, the LORD, do all these things (Isaiah 45:7). Therefore the Scriptures do not teach that God was the originator of evil.
---A_servant on 6/20/13


Im sorry Pharisee
You see this, as God judgments in relation to mankind's choice?
There is no way I can explain to you these are not Gods judgments.
I will say this. These are your own judgments!

Christ said of the father:
For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
So there is no judgment by the father.
Because everyone is condemned ready!

Christ said of himself:
Ye judge after the flesh, I judge no man.
And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me.

If I judge! But:
Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father:
You have one who accuses you ready!
---TheSeg on 6/20/13


Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?

Evil and good in judgement in relation to mankind's choice, that is what is being expressed in Lamentations 3:37 Not God Breathing out evil in the beginning as you so glibly suppose. Context isn't interchangeable unless it's hemeutically correct. What your doing is called Isegesis, it's not sound doctrine where the context is not applicable as in this case where you try to apply a verse about God's active judgement in response to Man's works (Gal 6:7) to the work of creation. Yet another irresponsible mishandling of God's word.
---Pharisee on 6/20/13


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God bless you servant
You know this is about the creation of evil, not freewill.
Open a blog on freewill, something like "Where did God say I give you freewill?"


You said you agree with:
God did not directly create evil.
Evil has dominion in the earth.
All I'm saying is find it in the word of God.
Not I think or I feel or I believe.
Show me it in scripture is that asking too much?

Here it's like this, see. I believe everybody saved because of Christ.
Why do I say, I believe? Because it not in scripture!
So I can't tell anyone, the bible is saying this.

It's the same thing with freewill.
You can just take a line and change it.
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/20/13


"Our own opinions or what is right and what is wrong means nothing, if not found in Scripture."

Wow Mark, what a fabulously disingenuous statement of false humility. You sit Idly by while your buddy Seg smashes that idea to smithereens, raping context while your ignoring it only because he shares your opinion and then pretend that you care about what truth is.

Where was your concern when Seg called the tree of Good and evil a false prophet? (Mat 7) You have no credibility sir.
---Pharisee on 6/20/13


You are mistaken in assuming that I said something could happen on it's own. I merely know that because God wanted true worship and loved us incredibly, He gave us free will. Do you not believe you have free will? God Himself stated that we are given choices, and that those choices do not always edify the men and women we are called to be in God. This is evil, when in free will we defy God's love and purpose.
---A_servant on 6/20/13


May I say that we do agree on the question of whether or not evil is God-breathed

You agree with someone who is changing the word of God?
You know in saying something or anything can happen on its own, you are one also?

Lam_3:37 Who is he that saith, and it cometh to pass, when the Lord commandeth it not?

Lam_ 3:38 Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good?
I am not trying to interpret God word for anyone. Because I know it must come from God, himself!
But, here you clearly hear for yourselves it does, evil and good!

And why?
Lam_3:39 Wherefore doth a living man complain, a man for the punishment of his sins?
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/20/13


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A servent, thank you for answering Pharisee. Our own opinions or what is right and what is wrong means nothing, if not found in Scripture.
(Gen 1:11-13) explains what God said about the earth, bringing forth grass, the herb that yields seed, and the fruit trees that yields fruit according to its kind. We also know the Tree of knowledge of good and evil came forth on the Third day. No one had eaten of it. It was there, for nothing was without purpose. God saw what He created was good. Man had not disobeyed yet and the tree of knowledge of good and evil already existed. Man ate out of the tree that already existed. Yet Jesus was foreknown as a sacrifice for sin before the foundation of the world (1 Peter 1:20).
---Mark_V. on 6/20/13


Pharisee,

May I say that we do agree on the question of whether or not evil is God-breathed, my remark was in no way against you, but we need to remember to show the way in love, and to stand together against hate, not to fall in it's ranks (though my patience has been tried also, and I am in no way above other men).

Now, regarding evil.
God is everything that is good and right, this by definition shows that evil is the absence of God. His will always brings glory and love, but when we defy His plan, evil is brought about. Evil was not introduced by God, but was introduced when man tried to assert a will of his own.
---A_servant on 6/19/13


The elders which are among you I exhort,
(Read Mat_23, Christ paid them a very high complement too.)


I simply asked you if the knowledge of evil can make God a sinner.
(Sorry, I just thought it was stupid!)

You of course choose not to answer but further mock my attempt to get you to admit the truth that evil did not get breathed out by God in the beginning.
(Again just stupid! What have we been talking about for the last week?)

I think if you'll finally ever respond honestly
(How many times and you still don't hear!)

Either evil was created by God or evil came into existence by itself.
You be the judge of that. I'll go by what is written!
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/19/13


Before Adam and Eve ate from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, they knew nothing of Evil themselves. They were as innocent babes. Created anew, and they did not know evil personally. Evil had never been a part of their lives. Once they ate from that Tree, and then experienced Sin for the first time, by the mere act of disobedience, they THEN knew of Evil in a personal way. They were, then, aware of the existence of both Good and Evil, as opposed to only just the Good they knew before that. That act of sin and obedience brought them Shame for the first time, and their nakedness became a shame to them, seeing they were sullied in their very souls.
---Gordon on 6/19/13


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Elder, The 1st weekday and the 7th day of the week are however they are displayed on YOUR calendar at wherever place on the Globe you live at. GOD only holds you accountable for what you know. If your calendar has each Sunday marked as the first weekday, then live by that! If Saturday is your 7th day according to YOUR calendar, then that's your 7th day! You will have to make a decision sometime. There'll be no vague, wishy-washiness when you stand before GOD and answer to HIM about this on Judgment Day! There'll be no worming out of this!
---Gordon on 6/19/13


Well servant we disagree on one point, that I put myself above another. These three have heaped mockery upon me for more than a week now and for the most part I've endured it patiently, it's the assigning of evil to God's creation I'm taking issue with. if someone is to come on here and speak in an authoritarian manner and use this platform to make something of themselves using the word of God, my conscience is clean in rebuking that. This is not a competition for me, I'm entirely secure in who I am in Christ. I was wrong to call them stooges, I admit that. But I am not wrong in calling out the compromised double minded agents of disruption that these men are here on this forum and for that I will never apologize.
---Pharisee on 6/19/13


"Does the fact that you're trying to judge God make you a sinner?"

I'm not judging God, God has revealed himself that we may know him and YES make the judgement based on the truth that he is indeed altogether righteous. I simply asked you if the knowledge of evil can make God a sinner. You of course choose not to answer but further mock my attempt to get you to admit the truth that evil did not get breathed out by God in the beginning. I think if you'll finally ever respond honestly you'd have to say that the knowledge of evil is not in itself evil, that's the point and yet you try to make it into something else with Phony piety pretending that you actually respect him. You vindicate me in rebuking you Seg. Thank you.
---Pharisee on 6/19/13


"Understanding God's complete holiness and sinlessness we realize If God created evil His holiness must be flawed." Elder

What's flawed is the heart of the fallen man. He cannot believe that God is Holy and in His Holiness, He cannot and does not sin. He creating evil and the wicked does not make Him "flawed" whatsoever but rather an awesome God, one to be feared, glorified and praised. And if you have a problem with this truth, simply put - He's not your God nor Father.

Amos 3:6, "shall there be evil in a city, and the Lord hath not done it?"
---christan on 6/19/13


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"Pharisee a very proper name!"
TheSeg
Seg, you have just paid Peter/Pharisee a very high complement. ("Pharisee a very proper name!")
Peter chose this name because, as he says, "We are all just one step away from being a Pharisee."
That includes both you and me!
Everytime he signs on with this title/penname I am reminded of my walk with the Lord. I have to examine myself and what Lord expects from me each time.
---Elder on 6/19/13


"GOD did not, nor does HE ever, create evil like the kind of evil that Satan and his demons are involved with! HE allows it, but, HE does not author it!" Gordon

"Allows it"? Really? Is that what the Bible says?

"The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil." Proverbs 16:4, "Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass, I have purposed it, I will also do it." Isaiah 46:11

Thank God for His Word that what you said is nothing but lies.
---christan on 6/19/13


was there evil before the fall? what about the tree of knowledge of good & evil? so that mean there was evil before genesis creation...
---mulligan on 6/19/13


GOD did not, nor does HE ever, create evil like the kind of evil that Satan and his demons are involved with! HE allows it, but, HE does not author it! Otherwise GOD would have no justification for punishing Satan, his fallen angels, nor any of mankind in the Lake of Fire! How can GOD punish someone for doing evil if HE was the true author of that evil in the first place?? That would make GOD into a kind of Tyrant who enjoys punishing and tormenting others!! And, GOD SAYS, in EZEKIEL 33:11a, "...As I live, saith the LORD GOD, 'I have NO PLEASURE in the death of the wicked...!'"
---Gordon on 6/19/13


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//I make peace, and create evil: //

yes evil can mean evil, but it can also mean calamity.

Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

juxtaposition:

light-dark...peace-evil?

or

perhaps in context, does peace go better with calamity...because evil really is juxtaposed with good.

light-dark
peace-calamity

with the rest of isaiah, calamity makes more sense.

good-evil.
---aka on 6/18/13


I shoot an arrow into the air, where it lands I do not care: I get my arrows wholesale! Nyuk Nyuk Nyuk!

Pharisee a very proper name!
Does the knowledge of evil make God a sinner yes or no?
Does the fact that you're trying to judge God make you a sinner?

If I'm going to judge, I will judge a man or an angel!
And here is my judgment, any man having knowledge of evil is a sinner!
Mat_15:19, Mar_7:21-23!
1Th_5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

Rom_9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God?
Isa_55:8-9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

Peace
---TheSeg on 6/18/13


Pharisee

Regardless of your intentions and his "irreverence," you yourself show irreverence to the love of God the moment your mind places labels on your fellow men. How dare you assume that only men such as you are worthy of the sacred name of God and only men such as you are entitled to handling His word. The love of God is to the Jew first and ALSO to the Greek. His chosen people are supposed to be educating the Gentiles, not putting them in their place. You sir with every breath spit in the face of God declaring yourself above another man and yet claiming to be his child. You sir, are the Pharisees Jesus cried for, but revealed as hypocrites all the same.
---A_servant on 6/18/13


Pharisee, you now say,
"The knowledge of something is not the substance. God possessing the knowledge of evil, will it make him evil? He needs it to judge righteously don't you? It's stupidity to say the tree is Evil"
I never said the tree was evil. How can I? The tree does nothing but grow right where it's at. God put it there. It doesn't go around causing evil things. The very existence of evil, had to come from someone, it came from God. Before Adam sinned he did not know evil. The second he sinned, at that moment they were like God knowing good and evil. Then God put the curse on them. With the curse man fell, and the knowledge of evil became a reality, not just the knowledge, on all mankind.
---Mark_V. on 6/19/13


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This is the irreverence of the sacred name of God and the scriptures which testify of him that has cause me to label you stooges and give up on you, Seg check your spirit. Using the word of God to make you feel like your something has made you less than nothing. pathetic.

And once again your interpretation of the scripture is an epic fail. Who was Paul talking about that by the knowledge of evil came sin? What's the context? He was talking about man. The exact thing I said to you. Does the knowledge of evil make God a sinner yes or no? If no then the knowledge of evil is clean and not evil itself. If your not going to devote your life to knowing God and studying his word you don't have any business handling his word.
---Pharisee on 6/18/13


The answer is very easy then, take you pens. Open your bibles to:

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Draw a line thought "and create evil"
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse:

Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Now faith is the substance!
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/18/13


"Do you want to discuss the Word of God?"

No not with you.

"That is what we are giving you."

That is not all, your also giving me your imbecilic interpretations as well.

"clearly God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil."

The knowledge of something is not the substance. God possessing the knowledge of evil, will it make him evil? He needs it to judge righteously don't you? It's stupidity to say the tree is Evil. God instead called it and "every thing" not -everything- (as you suppose collectively evil included) Very good. It was evil for the man to have the knowledge, for God to have it it's not evil, therefore the knowledge of Evil IS NOT EVIL!
---Pharisee on 6/18/13


Pharisee 2: Then you get upset at us who give you the Word of God and call us three stooges. On one blog you wanted to leave, because of the way others were answering you, and here you resort to the same things you complain about. Why not make up your mind? Do you want to discuss the Word of God? That is what we are giving you. You said God did not create evil, and clearly God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil. It could have been the tree of knowledge of only good, but it wasn't. And eating the fruit is not the reason Adam fell, he fail because he disobeyed God. I hope you can see this truths.
Even if you don't, don't get upset at those who give you the Word of God.
---Mark_V. on 6/18/13


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Understanding God's complete holiness and sinlessness we realize If God created evil His holiness must be flawed.
Because I make a fire doesn't mean I created smoke. The smoke is a result of the fire.
Isa 45:7, and other places, state God "made" light. Because of that activity we see darkness.
God said He made peace. Peace reveals evil.
Without love we couldn't understand hate. Did God "create" hate? Of course not.
God is truth and cannot lie. If something is not true it's a lie. God tells truth. That didn't make Him create lies.
A person cannot understand these concepts unless they have knowledge of God's character and holiness.
People must also understand God's words of explainantion.
---Elder on 6/18/13


Evil cannot exist without a personality predisposed to it in which it can be fostered, Evil CANNOT exist without this.
For evil to come directly of God's person denies his holiness! "HOLY HOLY HOLY is the Lord God Almighty." It's so perfect and without blemish it has to be stated Three times to properly express it!
For evil to come out of the breath of God is to divide his nature (a kingdom divided cannot stand) and sacrifice the attribute belonging to him alone. God is not a duplicitous being his nature is singularly holy, therefore every doctrine must be reconciled to this irreversible truth. God cannot divide his Kingdom with evil and make it stand, his sovereignty is absolute because it hangs on his attribute, holiness.
---MACHOGREASY on 6/18/13


Evil is not a created thing. You cannot see, touch, feel, smell or hear evil! It is not among the forces of physics, nor does it consist of matter, energy, or the spatial dimensions of the universe. Everything else in creation can be defined thereby. Skeptics like to claim that God created evil and cite the Bible to "prove" their point. The Bible is quite clear that God is not the author of evil and insists that He is incapable of doing so, (Deu 32:4, Job 34:10, Psa 5,4, Psa 92:15) You cannot create something that exists by embodiment alone because there is no basis for it to exist within the framework of creation. God created evil, the Bible says, the logical question to follow is "How?"
---Jay_Rooms on 6/18/13


Pharisee, what's happen is that you have formed a concept in your mind that you believe in and even when Scripture speaks to you, you refuse to believe, because it's hard to admit your concept has always been wrong.
Begin your studies with God, find the definition of the word God. In regard to those who are perishing Paul says,
"God sendeth them a working of error, that they should believe a lie" (2 Thess. 2:11). Here God sends them a working of error, for what reason? so that they will believe a lie.
Concerning those who are perishing Paul says,
"God gave them up unto a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not fitting" (Rom. 1:28). God did this Pharisee, even if you say no, not possible.
---Mark_V. on 6/18/13


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I want to be Curly!
Oh, a wise guy, eh? Nyuk Nyuk Nyuk!
Soitenly!

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.

Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

Christan, Mark_V. why is it they always resort to name calling?
Yes I know Pharisee calling someone a stooge, mean nothing to you.

Remember this line:
Rom_8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

Say it over and over again
Until you wake up!
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/17/13


"You guys are amazing, you attribute evil to God." Pharisee

Wow! You're a perfect definition of the word hypocrisy. You say you read the Bible and yet in the Scriptures we are explicitly told by God that He created evil and everything in this world. So why don't you believe?

But there's a perfect answer to that - Jesus said, "He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God."

And that's because God declared in Isaiah 45:7, "I form the light, and create darkness: I MAKE PEACE, and CREATE EVIL: I the Lord do all these things." and "ye therfore hear them not, because ye are not of God."
---christan on 6/17/13


Maybe evil came from disobedience. Satan wanted to exalt his throne above God's throne and when he was told NO, he rebelled and convinced one third of the angels to follow him, got himself kicked out of Heaven and took up residence here on earth.

There was war in Heaven and satan was expelled. Good vs evil is what caused the war in Heaven. Did evil exist in Heaven...apparently not until satan disobeyed. Where did evil come from? I would have to say it came from satan's disobedience.

Right now there is a war going on for this world. God will win but satan will use every trick in the book to take multitiudes with him on the road to destruction.
---barb on 6/17/13


You guys are amazing, you attribute evil to God. John doesn't believe what you believe he said "in him is no darkness." Somehow you still want to assert that holiness created evil intentionally.

He created Satan & choice and Satan's choice birthed evil. Satan rebelled against God or we say that God planned Satan's rebellion and it was somehow pleasing to him. God created Rebellion and it was "Very Good" shakes head

Oh Please, I'm not going to argue with you guys anymore, I'm going to warn you instead and ignore the 3 stooges from now on, what you believe blasphemes the most high and you better repent. Thus speaketh His Spirit, you guys don't know him if you think darkness came from him directly.
---Pharisee on 6/17/13


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Pharisee, your not thinking clearly. Who put the tree of good and evil in the garden? God. Did He not? Then give the parable of the tares and say:
"In the parable of the wheat and tares who planted the tares God or an enemy? "an enemy did this." he created the one who chose to be his enemy and he created the choice to do so, thus he created evil."
Wrong, satan did not create his children. He planted his children in the field. They are his children by virtue of the curse God put on mankind. The field is the Church, mixed with the wheat and the children of satan, the tares. All who are not of God are children of satan, they do the desires of their father the devil (John 8:44).
---Mark_V. on 6/17/13


Pharisee, you keep going round and still end up where you were before, not believing the Word of God, which you so hypocritically say you do. You explicitly declared, "God did not directly create evil." O, was God creating good and suddenly out popped evil out of nowhere?

You accuse us of not believing the Word when all we do is show you the verses of where evil came from? Here, one more time for your sake, "The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil."

You see, evil is an act against a Holy God and in the act of evil, the wicked is the perpetrator. Who then brought forth the wicked? Doesn't Proverbs 16:4 provides you with an explicit answer?
---christan on 6/17/13


Evil has dominion in the earth.
Pharisee

Where is this written?
God gave or let evil have dominion?

This is written and here it is:
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Now show me your!
Where did God say it to evil?
---TheSeg on 6/17/13


Pharisee
Stop trying to twist words. God has ever called evil, good!

Isa_45:7 I make peace, and create evil:
At its creation God called it evil!

Gen 2:9 the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
At its creation God called it good and evil!

Neither of this were called just good or even very good by themselves!
These things are only a part of the creation.

Now in Gen_1:31 he calls everything all of creation together!
I can see how hard it is for you to understand this.

Understand this too, it is you! Who are calling evil, good! Not God!
Nor anyone who understands it was all of creation!
No matter how you try to spin it, it will not stand.
Isa_5:20, Peace
---TheSeg on 6/17/13


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God did not directly create evil.
Evil has dominion in the earth. God will put an end to this, it's the entire point of sending the messiah. We know he will "make all things new."

I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it.. Ecclesiastes 3:14

Evil will lose it's place on the face of the earth, if God did it, it would never end and dominion couldn't be "taken from it." You gentlemen fail to rightly divide the word because you do it in your own strength. Think critically for a minute, if God is going to expel evil from creation why would he put it there? If he put it there ge won't remove it. His works are forever!!!
---Pharisee on 6/17/13


"the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience" (Ephesians 2:2)

Our battle against evil is not against people who do it (Ephesians 6:12) but against the evil spiritual being who "works in" people.

Satanic emotions work very hard to destroy people from loving.

"For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal but mighty in God" (in 2 Corinthians 10:4). And because He is almighty, we succeed with Him > "Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good." (Romans 12:21)

But the word "evil" has other meanings, for example the troubles which God brought upon the disobedient Jews. That was circumstantial "evil", in order to resist the Jews' evil.
---willie_c on 6/17/13


Evil came from the transgressions of man. Evil is the absence of God and the ignorance of his will. Evil is upon us, and is the cause of our condition, not the diagnosis attributed to God.
---A_servant on 6/17/13


Seg please think, If I have knowledge of evil and use it to not commit evil and instead prevent it is the knowledge of evil an evil thing?

OMG If I have knowledge of evil and use it to not commit evil.
It is not the knowledge of evil that does this! It's the knowledge of good!
Evil cannot produces good, what wrong with you?

You want to twist things around to make a false statement.
To defend what evil! My God, you are saying evil can produces good!

And you're telling me to think!
What do you think? I just got off the banana boat!
Come Mister Tallyman tally me bananas!
Try speaking the truth it works better!
You don't even have to try!
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/17/13


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GOD is the author of Evil?

The "evil" that the LORD does is not the same kind of evil that Satan, the demons and mankind are all caught up in.

Did GOD cause Lucifer to rebel against HIM??

The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil was set up as Test for mankind. To see whether man loved and would obey GOD or not.
---Gordon on 6/17/13


Where did evil come from?
---Gordon on 6/16/13

free will
---francis on 6/17/13


Woe Unto God seg? (Is 5:20)

He created evil and called it "very good," (?)... NO buddy it's gotta match, all of it's gotta fall in line. God CANNOT call evil GOOD if he condemns others for doing so, that's hypocrisy. God is Holy!

Creating something indirectly is still creating it, God created choice and a choice introduced evil, God IS NOT the Father of hypocracy, or lies, that's blasphemy, this is sound doctrine.

In the parable of the wheat and tares who planted the tares God or an enemy? "an enemy did this." he created the one who chose to be his enemy and he created the choice to do so, thus he created evil. Simple language is defeating you. "God is light and in him is no darkness at all."
---Pharisee on 6/17/13


Pharisee
The blog question asks, where did evil come from.
Answer: God created it.
But you have a problem with that. Although you say you don't:

For the record I believe the Phrase "God created Evil"
Then say:
Nothing God made was evil when he made it.

Now you're saying God called the tree, good!
No, he didn't! He called everything together very good, not just the tree!
Rom_8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

Trees with evil cannot be called good!

Again God created evil so everything made will know the deference between the two!
And please forgive me, but many still don't know!
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/17/13


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Pharisee, be patient with us. I believe you are looking at the scene in Genesis wrong. You say,
"Why don't you believe that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is "very Good???" What God creates is always good. God wanted that tree there for a purpose. Then say,
"The tree was not intended for man's consumption." Why would God created it in the first place and restrict Adam from eating from it? The tree did not make Adam fall, he fell because he disobeyed. God could have said, "don't eat from the bannana tree" and if he disobeyed he would sin. Disobedience made Adam fall not the fruit. When we walk where we are not permitted it is sin. Adam was not permitted to eat or touch it.
---Mark_V. on 6/17/13


Seg please think, If I have knowledge of evil and use it to not commit evil and instead prevent it is the knowledge of evil an evil thing? Of course Not. We don't know the purpose of the tree or how God uses it.

He created the tree in the garden and called it VERY GOOD and now your calling it a corrupt tree. Do a word study on "tree" in the OT it almost always refers to a man, so did Jesus' teaching about a tree and it's fruit in context so you don't get to apply it to an actual tree.

Why don't you believe the word of God that the tree of the knowledge of good and evil is "very Good???" That's what God called it! You've misapplied scripture to contradict God, The tree was not intended for man's consumption.
---Pharisee on 6/17/13


Will you people stop and take a look at what your doing?

Not even arguing the issue. seg wants to take a text about false prophets and call trees evil, christian wants to argue about fallen man when that's not even what I was talking about, my comments refer to creation, not man after the fall.

If you fellas get it in your head to not oppose people for the sake of making an enemy out of them this discussion might be able to take an intelligent turn. Behavior like this is why I left Christianet in the past. It amounts to nothing and edifies nobody. Is that the basis of your ministry on Christianet? Make an enemy out of someone and oppose them at all cost? Is that ministry? Who does it serve?
---Pharisee on 6/17/13


It was a good tree within the purpose that God made for it, it wasn't for man. He called it VERY GOOD, why do you not believe God???
Pharisee

It wasn't for man!
Gen_2:8 And the LORD God planted a garden eastward in Eden, and there he put the man whom he had formed.

Then who do you believe it was for?
Gen_3:24 to keep the way of the tree of life.

Here's what kill me about some people. They take a word like good or very good, even extremely good.
But let's take it exactly as God intended, Gen 1:31. The best good that has ever existed!

Now putting this very good at .00001 and perfect at 10,000, where would you put Very Good?
---TheSeg on 6/17/13


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Pharisee, I don't see your explanation
"Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day." has anything to do with anything. As far as God was concerned as to what He made, including the tree of good and evil, to Him everything was good. That is what He wanted, if He didn't want the tree of good and evil, He would never have created it. It had a purpose. And what do you think was the purpose, to show man he could not obey. So who put the curse? God. He could have easily forgiven Adam, but didn't. Don't you realize that Jesus Christ was foreknown as a sacrifice for sin before the foundation of the world?
---Mark_V. on 6/17/13


"Where did evil come from?"
The arrogant malignant attitude Satan displayed towards his Creator.
---Josef on 6/17/13


"Man is one of the most delightful elements in creation..." Pharisee

And yet Scripture declares, "All nations before Him are as nothing, and they are counted to Him less than nothing, and vanity." Isaiah 40:17. What could be "less than nothing"?

Paul even declared, "Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful, but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools." Romans 1:21,22

"Delightful" you say? In whose eyes? Yours or God? Definitely not God's eyes! You keep dreaming...
---christan on 6/16/13


(The knowledge of evil is not evil in and of itself seg.)
Really didnt Christ say:
Either make the tree good, and his fruit good, or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.

What kind of a tree would you say this is a good tree or a corrupt tree!
Evil is not evil in and of itself.
Yea! I would agree with that, and so would evil!
Just in case. Mat_7:17-19!

(That knowledge belongs to God and the angels)
Clearly God ready has this knowledge, he created it.
The angels live and are in heaven not the garden!
Jud_1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation,
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/16/13


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The knowledge of evil is not evil in and of itself seg. That knowledge belongs to God and the angels, we don't know why god put that tree in the creation, but hey where else will a tree grow?

It was a good tree within the purpose that God made for it, it wasn't for man. He called it VERY GOOD, why do you not believe God???
---Pharisee on 6/16/13


God owes no one any explanation to what He does and why He does it. ---christan on 6/16/13

In reality he kind of does but it's according to his promise within the parameters of the relationship he gifted, the Bible says he'll give one to anybody and not hold back.

Just be mindful that He's God and we're just the creature He made from dust.
---christan on 6/16/13

Man is one of the most delightful elements in creation, expressing spiritually the very potent life of God locked within, were not just a base element but an expression of his glory created to know him.

For the record I believe the Phrase "God created Evil" I don't talk back to God, I try to explain what I've been shown.
---Pharisee on 6/16/13


Isa_5:20 Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil, that put darkness for light, and light for darkness, that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
Isa_5:21 Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!

Gen_2:9 And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food, the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

Nothing God made was evil when he made it.
Pharisee

So it was the tree of knowledge of good.
And became evil is that what it says in your bible?
Mine doesnt have that.
Peace
---TheSeg on 6/16/13


It is like the question, Did Dunkin Donuts create the donut hole or is it a result of creating the donut?
If there is good then doing something else must be evil. There is no understanding of light unless you can see the result of not having light Not having light would simply be darkness.
Evil is just the result of not having/doing good.
---Elder on 6/16/13


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"Adam Where are you?"

God Breathed Glory unimaginable, a world where sin had effort not potential. God reigning in sovereignty and dominion. Man was formed there. Man Was given dominion (immediate rule)(Gen 1:28) and thereby an imputed sovereignty (Satan is prince NOW -Jesus) and being cast down in alienated faculties and full rebellion is paving a highway to hell. Without ability to make a self willed choice nothing makes any sense, Not even the fall. Satan gained dominion over the creation by conquering the creature containing it's ordinance. Fall of Man = Product of the Devil's volitional rebellion using the freedom afforded him in the power it wielded. He made a choice while not having one. Thereby God created Evil.
---Pharisee on 6/16/13


"The Scriptures conclude that God created evil, but never concisely explain how." Pharisee

That's precisely what separates a believer from an unbeliever. The missing "ingredient" is what Paul calls, "the gift of faith from Him".

Does God to explain anything to His creatures? He explicitly declared that He "created evil", is that not good enough for you? "Who are you to talk back to God?" Doesn't He demonstrate what evil is when He brings forth the wicked? "O ye of little faith"?

God owes no one any explanation to what He does and why He does it. Just be mindful that He's God and we're just the creature He made from dust.
---christan on 6/16/13


The Scriptures conclude that God created evil, but never concisely explain how.

People with little understanding take that to mean that God desired it with the rest of creation, that it's integrally built into it by design with good purpose, But the Bible says "woe unto them that call good evil and evil good." Is 5:20 Nothing God made was evil when he made it.

Genesis 1:31 And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.
---Pharisee on 6/16/13


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