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Life, Death, Blessings & Cursings

What does this Verse mean, of DEUTERONOMY 30:19?

(And, this is GOD Himself speaking)

"I call Heaven and Earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you Life and Death, Blessing and Cursing:

Therefore, CHOOSE Life, that both thou and thy seed may live!"

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Continued'
Deut 30
"shall return[...]obey His voice"

2 "And shalt return unto the Lord thy God, and shalt obey His voice according to all that I command thee this day, thou and thy children, with all thine heart, and with all thy soul,"

3 "(That then) the Lord thy God (will turn thy captivity), and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the Lord thy God hath scattered thee."

In time - God scattered them around the world into many nations. When formed/settled these laws and statutes were to be remembered. (Gen26:4)

Day of the Lord -all nations will gather - both- house of Israel and house of Judah shall return - One stick.
---char on 8/5/13


Continued

Deut 30:6 "And the Lord thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heart of thy seed, to love the Lord thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live."

*circumcision is of the heart (Hebraism for mind)

7 "And the Lord thy God will put all these curses upon thine enemies, and on them that hate thee, which persecuted thee."

*Record keeping: duty assigned to the scribes of the tribe of Levite and offsprings of Aaron - taken over by the descendents of Cain Kenites- allowed to sit in the seat of Moses teaching tradition instead of the Word of God. Jn8:39 -44

*Repentance is required
---char on 8/5/13


Deut. 29:
"Now Moses called all Israel and said to them: "You have seen all that the Lord did before your eyes in the land of Egypt, to Pharaoh and to all his servants and to all his land-the great trials which your eyes have seen, the signs, and those great wonders. Yet the Lord has not given you a heart to perceive and eyes to see and ears to hear, to this very day"
Those people saw many things, but God had not given them the heart to perceive what they saw for they did not understand the spiritual things of God, for they had no spiritual eyes to see or spiritual ears to hear.
---Mark_V. on 8/5/13


*Israel: Elohyim's Firstborn (Ex 4:22-23) was appointed the Word/Stone - First: became disobedient/stumbling of that very Stone/Word
(whereunto also they were appointed)

Joshua 4:8[...]and took up twelve stones out of the midst of Jordan[...]according to the number of the tribes of the children of Israel

9 "Joshua set up twelve stones in the midst of Jordan [...]they are there unto this day."

Deut 30:17 "But if thine heart turn away, so that thou wilt not hear, but shalt be drawn away, and worship other gods, and serve them,"

I Peter 2:8 "And a Stone of stumbling, and a Rock of offence, even to them which (stumble at the word), being disobedient: (whereunto also they were appointed.")
---char on 8/5/13


Deuteronomy 30:Spoken to Israelites

[...]"have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations"[...]

The purpose for Scattering: identity lost/hidden

Restriction on the Scattering: Choose -path/ways of their journey "Life or death"

Elohyim chose Israel as His witness of His love to the whole earth/world so that whosoever believes in Him may have timeless existence with/in Him.

The Breath of Elohyim is in All- mankind, it is His breath - Not Ours.
What words are going to be declared/confessed, with that breath - His Word, or an- others?

Upon repentance: Promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are witnessed and may be shared to all mankind.(Gen26:4, Lk24:47)
---char on 8/4/13




Continued'

Deuteronomy 30: Spoken to the Israelites
The purpose of the Scattering: identity lost/hidden
Restriction on the Scattering: Choose - path/ways of their journey Life or death.

Moses delivers the message in a language plain enough to be understood-by the layman.
Ceremonial blood ritual dropped - they were the duties of the (chosen)Levitical priests not the - layman. (Christ has replaced all blood sacrifices and ritual by shedding of His Blood Matt5:17-19)

Deut30:1 "And it shall come to pass, when all these things are come upon thee, the blessing and the curse, which (I have set before thee), and thou shalt (call them to mind) among (all the nations), whither (the Lord thy God hath driven thee,")
---char on 8/4/13


---Mark_V. on 8/4/13
LOL No that is not why, the flesh cannot ever take glory for keeping the law of God

the flesh is the mindset which is contrary to the law of God

The flesh does as it pleases, and boasts that Christ ended the law, or the flesh says that it does not know which day is the 7th, and excuse not to keep the sabbath'

Romans 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the motions of sins, which were by the law, did work in our members to bring forth fruit unto death

Romans 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin
---francis on 8/4/13


francis, that is correct, those in the flesh cannot please God. So no matter how many works you do in the flesh, they do not please God. You know why? Because you take the glory. And no one can keep the whole law.
Here again,
"francis, you are no different then Jerry, you build a whole lot of laws so that in the end you can bring out your Saturday Sabbath. All the talk about the law (smoke screen) is for that purpose.

Here is what the Word of God says to all those who believe,
"Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone that believeth"
(Rom. 10:3). Do you believe?
---Mark_V. on 8/4/13


Great Francis. Now we need to go back to Romans 6 in order to fully understand Romans 8.

Shall we continue to sin, that Grace may abound...God forbid, for don't you know you were baptized into His death. Our old flesh man, I call Adam 1 DIED WITH CHRIST, died to sin. SO THAT, being raised up together WITH HIM, you are a NEW CREATURE IN CHRIST, no longer seen after the flesh. This is why you are no longer in the FLESH but in the Spirit IF the Spirit OF GOD dwells in you. We have been set FREE from the law of sin and death. Our death with Christ is the ONLY way to be set free. Now we surrender our NEW MAN to God..Romans 6 and Romans 12:1-2, in order to grow up INTO HIM, having our minds transformed/renewed by the Word of God.
---kathr4453 on 8/4/13


In your flesh, you are a sinner,
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13
Thank you

Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Romans 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Romans 8:9 But I AM not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in ME.
---francis on 8/3/13




All the laws are a smoke screen to accuse others of sinning
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13
Is paul putting us a smoke screen?
Romans 3:20 by the law is the knowledge of sin.

1 John 3:4 sin is the transgression of the law

Romans 2:12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law,
---francis on 8/3/13


francis, for your information, only Jesus Christ was and still is without sin. He is pure and perfect. In your flesh, you are a sinner, for your flesh will die because of sin, and when it does die, you will not preach the law anymore since we are told,
"And as it is appointed for men to die once and then the judgment" (Heb. 9:27).
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13


Asking me if I am sinless , is asking me to take credit for the work of God in me. I cannot take credit, it is God which works in me both to will and to do of his good pleasure.

The ONLY righteousness available to any human, including me is righteousness by faith. I claim it ALL OF IT, I refuse to let a single drop if it go to waste

I want ALL the righteousness that God has to offer

Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live, yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
---francis on 8/3/13


Samuel, you say concerning francis that the reason you agree with him,
"But I see many today particularly those who are dispensationalist attacking the law of GOD as if all the ten commandments do not apply and the church should not oppose sin."
That's not the issue. All the laws are a smoke screen to accuse others of sinning for not doing Saturday Sabbath when they themselves are sinners. They are hypocrites accusing others of sin when they are sinners themselves. Every time you answer you don't try to shove the Sabbath at anyone. We are not under the covenant of works of the law, we are under the New Covenant of grace. We don't have a yoke on our necks anymore, trying to keep the law perfect. Only Christ is perfect.
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13


I look at Jesus as my example:
1 John 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

I should walk as Jesus did. I take God at his word that he will strengthen me to walk as Jesus did

Look at Job
Job 1:1 There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job, and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

God actually begged Satan to tempt Job, knowing that Job was strengthened by Him and Job trusted him

Job was a man just like me
James 5:17 Elias was a man subject to like passions

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
---francis on 8/2/13


---Mark_V. on 8/2/13
Lev 25:4 But in the seventh year shall be a sabbath of rest unto the land, a sabbath for the LORD:

Isaiah 58:13 my holy day, and call the sabbath a DELIGHT, the HOLY of the LORD, HONOURABLE, and shalt honour him,

1 John 5:3 his commandments are not grievous.

A day of REST, a day of delight, a holy and honourable day, that God says is not grevious, and you say that itis a YOKE?

when did God ever place a YOKE on any man?


You reject Gods law because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
---francis on 8/2/13


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Dear Mark V

I do not always agree with the way Francis says things. But I see many today particularly those who are dispensationalist attacking the law of GOD as if all the ten commandments do not apply and the church should not oppose sin.

I appreciate the zeal which Francis shows. For looking at the Major Protestant churches I see a lack of teaching of repentance and turning from sin being preached.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/2/13


francis, at the Jerusalem council the discussion arose concerning whether the gentiles were to be circumcized by the law. The Apostles and elders got together and Peter spoke concerning the gentiles how God had brought the word of God (the gospel to them) by giving them the Holy Spirit. He said,
"Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they" (Acts 15:11-17). That is what you are doing, putting a yoke on all Christians concerning the law with your Saturday preaching. You test God like they did.
---Mark_V. on 8/2/13


The problem is that francis throws the law in every blog to show us how we are sinners for not keeping Saturday Sabbath,
---Mark_V. on 8/2/13
You say that as if
1: It is francis who commanded that we keep the sabbath on Saturday the 7 day of the week
2: As if Christiasn have a choie in obeying God's sabbath commandments
3: All the NT writers except Jude writes about the commandments of God

So your problem is not with francis, it is your carnal mind that is at war against the commandments of God

Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind [is] enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
---francis on 8/2/13


Samuel, you said,
"No I do not live a sinless life. Neither do I indulge in sin or like to sin. For sin is wrong and anti love. JESUS died so I am declared sinless in JESUS. So each day I strive to live sin free. But not sinning does not pay for any single sin I already committed. Why would I want to sin and not seek to avoid sinning in love for my savior? So that is my goal to live as sin free as possible by the Grace of GOD alone."
What you said is true of all believers. That is not the problem we have here. The problem is that francis throws the law in every blog to show us how we are sinners for not keeping Saturday Sabbath, when he is a sinner himself. He needs to take the log out of his eye before he judges others.
---Mark_V. on 8/2/13


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No one can keep the letter of the Law. Not even you. Everyone breaks it. "All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." That is why I wanted you to answer the question, are you sinless? are you without sin? Mark_V.

No I do not live a sinless life. Neither do I indulge in sin or like to sin. For sin is wrong and anti love. JESUS died so I am declared sinless in JESUS. So each day I strive to live sin free. But not sinning does not pay for any single sin I already committed. Why would I want to sin and not seek to avoid sinning in love for my savior? So that is my goal to live as sin free as possible by the Grace of GOD alone.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/1/13


6th commandments: Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.
This is the written law

Here is the spirit fo the law:
Proverbs 3:30 Strive not with a man without cause, if he have done thee no harm.

Lamentations 3:52 Mine enemies chased me sore, like a bird, without cause.

Lamentations 3:53 They have cut off my life in the dungeon, and cast a stone upon me.

Matthew 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother,

Spirit of the law: Do not have without cause
---francis on 8/1/13


It simply means not too complicated...if you do you get to live, if you don't you get to die [the second death, HELL]. Obedience, born-again, brings about obedience to the Lord thy God. When God was saving me, I knew Satan had never done anything for me. So there was no problem, when God came to me and offered me a way to escape hell.
---catherine on 8/1/13


Exodus 20:12 Honour thy father and thy mother:
Mark 7:10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother, and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:

this is the written law

Here is the ultimate act of the spirit of the law

John 19:27 Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.

Care for yuor parents, love them, obey them in the Lord, respect them in all things
---francis on 8/1/13


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the third states that Thou shalt not take the name of the LORD thy God in vain,

this means more than just using the name on God as for vain reasons, like swearing

Here is the spirit fo the law
1 Timothy 6:1 the name of God and his doctrine be not blasphemed.

this means that when we call ourselves " christian" or children of God, our behaviour must reflect that.

We cannot be living in sin and call ourselves christren of God

Example: David when he took Bathsheba
2 Samuel 12:14 Howbeit, because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme,

To keep the " spirit of this commandments" mean to keep all the laws of God
---francis on 8/1/13


francis, again I remind you, you have not answered my question. Please answer it, so that you can correct what you write. Here you say,
"The spirit of the law, is that we place Jehovah above all else in our lives yet that does not exempt us from keeping the letter of the law"
No one can keep the letter of the Law. Not even you. Everyone breaks it. "All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." That is why I wanted you to answer the question, are you sinless? are you without sin? because if you are, (which of course no one is) you are equal to Jesus Christ, for he is perfect.
---Mark_V. on 8/1/13


The first commandment in the law as written tells us not to have any other gods before besides God.

But the spirit fo the law is more than just about other gods like baal, and dagon, It is about anything that we place before Jehovah

Mark 10:29 not house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,

Anything that comes between or before God in any way. Now becomes your god. Even you can be your own god when you choose not to obey God

The spirit of the law, is that we place Jehovah above all else in our lives yet that doe snot exempt us from keeping the letter of the law
---francis on 7/31/13


Francis, again you did not answer my question but made more remarks. Are you saying you are without sin? Are you sinless? Have you kept all of the laws perfect? A simple yes or no will do.
---Mark_V. on 7/31/13


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Spirit of the law" is the deeper intent or spiritual meaning behind the law

The commandment to keep the Sabbath says that we must work on the 6 working days, and rest on the Sabbath along with everyone in our household.

Sabath is not just a day off from work.

Here is the spirit of the Sabbath commandment:

Isaiah 66:23 from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me,

Isaiah 58:13 call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable, and shalt honour him,

Matthew 12:12 do well on the sabbath days.

Matthew 12:5 Do the work of priest or pastor, spiritual ministries on sabbath

So Mark_V is deveived, he does not keep the spirit of the law
---francis on 7/31/13


"from now on my answer to you will be, that the written law given to Israel is fulfilled in Christ for me. I now follow the Spirit of the Law. So go ahead and put down the written law, as you always do, it will remind you what you have to do."
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


I now follow the Spirit of the Law. ---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


I assure you, that any spirit, that leads you contrary to the written law, or contrary to ANY LAW of God is not the spirit of God

2 Corinthians 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
And no marvel, for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their works.

1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
---francis on 7/30/13


francis, here is my answer again to you when you put the law down,

"from now on my answer to you will be, that the written law given to Israel is fulfilled in Christ for me. I now follow the Spirit of the Law. So go ahead and put down the written law, as you always do, it will remind you what you have to do."
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


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I assure you, that any spirit, that leads you contrary to the written law, or contrary to ANY LAW of God is not the spirit of God

2 Corinthians 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
And no marvel, for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness, whose end shall be according to their works.

1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
---francis on 7/29/13


I now follow the Spirit of the Law. ---Mark_V. on 7/29/13
laughable at best.
kinda like Jom Baker and Jessica, yu know he was followingthe spirit of the law.
like eddie long and ....
---francis on 7/29/13


Francis, from now on my answer to you will be, that the written law given to Israel is fulfilled in Christ for me. I now follow the Spirit of the Law. So go ahead and put down the written law, as you always do, it will remind you what you have to do.
---Mark_V. on 7/29/13


When saved by the grace of God, you are no longer under the written law. ---Mark_V. on 7/28/13
Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid.

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid:

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid.
---francis on 7/27/13
---francis on 7/28/13


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Nikki, you now say,
"Do you think God gave us the Law for the fun of it?"
God gave us the law so that we could know what sin is. Once we know what sin is, there is no longer any excuse.
When saved by the grace of God, you are no longer under the written law. But salvation is "by Grace through faith, and that not of yourself, it is a gift of God, lest anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" (Eph. 2:8-10).
---Mark_V. on 7/28/13


We are not saved by keeping the Sabbath, or following the laws, we are saved by the Grace of God.
---Mark_V. on 7/27/13
Romans 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid.

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid:

Romans 6:15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

Romans 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good. What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid.
---francis on 7/27/13


While we were yet sinners Christ died for us. God made us alive when we were in traspasses and sins. We are not saved by keeping the Sabbath, or following the laws, we are saved by the Grace of God.---Mark_V. on 7/27/13

Do you think God gave us the Law for the fun of it?

SOMEONE has to keep the Law!
God became Man so HE can KEEP the Law and shed His blood for us who can't keep the law.

But, just because He kept the law it doesn't mean we can WASTE HIS shed blood.
---Nikki on 7/27/13


Nikki, you now say,
"As I said:
Jesus kept the Law so we can use His blood to wash away our sins.
Only Perfect BLOOD can SAVE.---Nikki on 7/25/13"
A person is saved by the grace of God. Through faith in Christ Jesus works.
Then say,
You still have to keep the Sabbath, Keep God as #1 and no other, and don't steal, kill, dishonor your parents, lie, or take your neighbor's wife and goods."
While we were yet sinners Christ died for us. God made us alive when we were in traspasses and sins. We are not saved by keeping the Sabbath, or following the laws, we are saved by the Grace of God.
---Mark_V. on 7/27/13


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If you paid for your child's speeding ticket, you have fulfilled the requirements of the law. The law demands that you pay a fine, you pay a dept your child could not pay.

Does your fulfilling the requirements of the law for your child, mean that now he is free to get as many speeding tickets as he wants, or does he now show an appreciation for what you have done, and follow the traffic laws hence forth?
---francis on 7/27/13


He did not abolish the law, but to fulfill it. For who? For us who are saved. Without Him fulfilling the law for us, we would remain the same, condemned. He came to save that which was lost. It is the lost for which He became incarnated.---Mark_V. on 7/26/13

As I said:
Jesus kept the Law so we can use His blood to wash away our sins.
Only Perfect BLOOD can SAVE.---Nikki on 7/25/13

You still have to keep the Sabbath, Keep God as #1 and no other, and don't steal, kill, dishonor your parents, lie, or take your neighbor's wife and goods.

If you paid your child's credit card off because he couldn't, does this mean he can to go back into debt?
---Nikki on 7/27/13


Nikki, you are wrong. Jesus came with one purpose, to die for our sins. He was the only One who could keep the law perfectly for us who believe. And since all descendants of Adam are condemned for breaking the law, only through Jesus works could one condemned be justified before God. He did not abolish the law, but to fulfill it. For who? For us who are saved. Without Him fulfilling the law for us, we would remain the same, condemned. He came to save that which was lost. It is the lost for which He became incarnated. That is the awful condition in which God's elect are by nature.
---Mark_V. on 7/26/13


Nikki: Great post! It always amazes me how so many who claim to be followers of Christ think that He came to save them from THE LAW rather than from SIN (the transgression thereof). It is as if they view Christianity as a statement of "I believe", a quick dip in a small pool, and thereafter they are granted a license to sin and a "get-into-heaven-free" card. Worse yet, no amount of scripture to the contrary will convince them of their error. But we keep trying so that others may see the truth.



---jerry6593 on 7/26/13


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francis, you also said,
"The Covenant of works is
a covenant or agreement that God made with Adam, that is a covenant of works. Obey and live disobey and die.
---Mark_V. on 7/24/13
OOPS there goes your predestination theology"

Not true at all, Jesus came to save that which was lost. Actually save them. His sheep, His people the elect chosen before the foundation of the world. If you belong to the sheep of Christ, you must be saved, even if right now you are unconscious of your lost condition. Only those who obey God are His sheep, they follow Him.
---Mark_V. on 7/26/13


Not true at all. He kept the law perfectly because we could not keep the law perfectly on our own.---Mark_V. on 7/25/13

Not true at all.
Jesus kept the law perfectly to fulfill the Law not to allow us to dismiss the law.
Jesus said He isn't abolishing the law.
For us not to kept the law means Jesus abolished the law.
Which He didn't.

According to your logical, since Jesus kept the law perfectly, you can kill, steal, dishonor your parents, curse God, not keep the Sabbath, take your neighbor's wife and goods?
After all you are no longer under the law.

Jesus kept the Law so we can use His blood to wash away our sins.
Only Perfect BLOOD can SAVE.
---Nikki on 7/25/13


He kept the law perfectly because we could not keep the law perfectly on our own.
---Mark_V. on 7/25/13
I gave you the scriptures
Romans 8:3 God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us,

Hebrews 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to give aid to them that are tempted.
Not true at all.

but since when did scripture matter to you?
but I will add another Ezekiel 36:27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them].
---francis on 7/25/13


francis, you now say,

"Jesus kept the law perfectly, not so we do not have to keep it ourselves.But so that we can keep it."

Not true at all. He kept the law perfectly because we could not keep the law perfectly on our own.
---Mark_V. on 7/25/13


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Jesus kept the law perfectly, not so we do not have to keep it ourselves.But so that we can keep it.

There is a reason why Jesus came, and came as a man and not as an angel.
Romans 8:3 God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us,
Hebrews 2:18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to give aid to them that are tempted.

God grants to us everything that Jesus attained while on earth as a man, he imputes us with Christ's righteousness, and succours us when we are tempted to over come sin
---francis on 7/25/13


Colossians 1:27 Christ in you, the hope of glory:

Ephesians 3:17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith, that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,

2 Peter 1:4 that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature,

Christ is no longer on the cross, Christ dwells inour hearts BY FAITH, and it is his presence in us, that keeps us from sin
---francis on 7/24/13


h. francis, no one other then Jesus Christ could or can keep the written law perfect. So go ahead and pretend that you can keep all the written law perfect all you want. Just not possible. You are under the bondage of condemnation or you are under Christ perfect works on the Cross and His resurrection.
---Mark_V. on 7/24/13


The Covenant of works is
a covenant or agreement that God made with Adam, that is a covenant of works. Obey and live disobey and die.
---Mark_V. on 7/24/13
OOPS there goes your predestination theology
---francis on 7/24/13


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Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here [are] they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Christians still obey God.
We keep his commandments and it is not a covenant of works

Acts 5:32 And we are his witnesses of these things, and [so is] also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him,


John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love, even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
---francis on 7/24/13


h. francis, the reason you do not know what salvation means is because you are still under the law, because you do not have the Jesus that is suppose to save you as your Redeemer. So you now say,
"There is nothing in the entire bible about covenant of works" The Trinity name is not in the Bible but it is also true. The Covenant of works is
a covenant or agreement that God made with Adam, that is a covenant of works. Obey and live disobey and die. You are now condemned because of Adam. He disobeyed by his unrighteous works. And the curse came to all mankind.
---Mark_V. on 7/24/13


--Nana on 7/23/13
Amen

When God was finished speaking with Moses, the plan of redemption was revealed in it's entirety, and was preached with the earthly tabernacle better than it is preached today. There was a visual and spiritual understanding as every one who sinned came to the earthly tabernacle and confessed their sin, and made their sacrifice in faith. As every sinner came to make his sacrifice he would encounter others just like him, and abundance of sinners coming to Christ for grace. No matter how many sinners came to confess their sin and seek grace there was always enough grace.
Every one of them knew that the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound: Romans 5:20
---francis on 7/23/13


francis,
Isaiah 42:6_7 "I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles,
To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house."
Isaiah 42:21 "The LORD is well pleased for his righteousness' sake, he will magnify the law, and make it honourable."
Matthew 5:17, Matthew 23:3
---Nana on 7/23/13


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God gave to the children of ISrale hsi love, his maery and showed them his grace in many ways.

He gave them Hsi laws that they should obey them with a great promise:
Exodus 19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine: And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation

Then he gave them his ordinances showing them the plan of redeemption, complete with the destruction of the wicked, all they had to do was choose life
---francis on 7/23/13


There is nothing in the entire bible about covenant of works

They all had to exercise FAITH
every sacrifice was an act of FAITH that some day the lamb of God would come and take away their sins

No different today, we obey God's laws because we love God, not to earn salvation, and IF we sin, we have FAITH in the blood of Jesus that we shall be forgiven
AMEN

the saints who lives before Christ, did not earn heaven by covenant fo works, the recieved the gift of salvation based on the grace of God, they looked forward in FAITH to the cross

SEE HEBREWS 11
---francis on 7/23/13


The blessings and curses are the conditions of the covenant of works. Obey and receive blessings from God, disobey and receive the curses that come with the disobedience. It was a covenant of works that saved no one. For no one could keep the whole law perfect.
---Mark_V. on 7/23/13


Thanks to both Christan and Samuel for their comments. Both answers were great. Salvation in the Old Testament and the New is the same way, by Grace through faith.
---Mark_V. on 7/23/13


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Luke 16:27_31: "Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: For I have five brethren, that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets, let them hear them. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."

Francis, according to those verses one who has ears for Moses and the prophets will have enough to ward off hell.
---Nana on 7/22/13


True Grace came through JESUS. As predicted and shown by Moses. For all who are saved are saved by Grace alone. Moses had to be saved by Grace for he was a murderer. Grace was forecast in the lambs and blood sacrifice.

As many a commentator has written. The Old Testament is the gospel is pictures and ceremonies. In the new it is the reality. For the Old points to the new. Remember the Apostles used the Old Testament as proof of their teachings and Paul says it is for doctrine. 2 tim 3,16
---Samuelbb7 on 7/22/13


"...Moses was enough for the salvation of the world" francis

Funny you should say that. But did grace come through Moses? Didn't Moses represent the law? Does the law save? Hmmm.... let's see what Scriptures has to say to your confession.

"For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ." John 1:17, "For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." Ephesians 2:8,9.

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work." Romans 11:6
---christan on 7/22/13


Here we go with the verbatim pink-eye again!
google: /Life_of_Faith/faith_01
---Nana on 7/22/13


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Gordon, I never denied mankind didn't make choices. I deny that the lost make a choice for Christ while in the lost condition. Only the elect are saved. Jesus calls them His sheep. Christ came to carry into effect God's sovereign purpose of election, to save a people already His: (Matt. 1:21) by covenant settlement. They are a people whom God hath "from the beginning" chosen unto salvation" (2 Thess. 2:13), redemption was in order to the accomplishing of that decree by God. He did not come to seek and save all the lost, nor did He come to see if people would seek Him, (Rom. 3:11) says no one seeks after God. Christ is the seeker of the lost sheep. "..the good Shepherd giveth His life for the sheep" (John 10:10)
---Mark_V. on 7/22/13


"....only that he (mankind) has a choice." -Mark V, 7/19/13.

That's right, Mark V. Mankind "has a choice". A choice between Salvation and Damnation.

This Choice was given to all human souls before the Foundation of the World. When our souls were created and existed in Heaven, before being sent, one-by-one, to the Earth.

Prophetic revelation from GOD.

(Hard to accept by those who lean on their own understanding, PROVERBS 3:5b.)

The choice CAN be changed, but, most stick with their initial choice they made in Heaven.

"...as in Heaven, so in Earth..." LUKE 11:2b.
---Gordon on 7/22/13


"I call Heaven and Earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you Life and Death, Blessing and Cursing: Therefore, CHOOSE Life, that both thou and thy seed may live!"
---Gordon on 7/17/13
This is a very important passages. First it tells us that God has given us free will, and the ability choose to live or die, and that God wishes that we choose to live.
Notice that many did not live, they used their free will and choose death, and cursing, such persons was Achan, Nadab and Abihu, Korah,

Second,very important, it tells us in this century, that what was revealed through Moses was enough for the salvation of the world
---francis on 7/21/13


Sorry again for address this here. To Kathr,

Nikki, Francis is correct. What do you mean by work and yelling?---kathr4453 on 7/21/13

I was saying the Israelites did a lot of work and yelling to bring down the walls of Jericho.
The promise land was inside the walls of Jericho, not outside the walls of Jericho.

Francis and you seems to believe the promise land was achieved once they crossed the Jordan river.
To me you must conquer something before claiming it as your own.

But, I see what Francis is saying because some believe they are Saved before they are in Heaven. So I can see both of your points even if I disagree.
---Nikki on 7/21/13


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The lost don't understand, and do not seek God, they have "all" turned aside, none who does good, not one" (Rom. 3:10-12). Why nothing good? Because what they do does not give glory to God, or give thanks to God. For anything without faith is sin. Free willers insist they are doing something good, choosing Christ, but they don't seek after God. Why insist they do? Why insist they do something good without faith? They make a lot of choices but never for the glory of God. The wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodlyness and unrighteousness of men. They have no excuse, "because although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful but became futile in their thoughts"
---Mark_V. on 7/21/13


josef, God commanded, "ye shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and ye shall be holy, for I am holy..."

In context of freewill, tell us how a sinner is able to "sanctify and be holy" by his own? The fact you admit you're a sinner is proof you're already broken and defiled, beyond "repair".

You quote Joshua 24:15 to justify freewill, but why didn't you show verse 19? Joshua also declared, "Ye cannot serve the Lord: for He is an Holy God, He is a jealous God, He will not forgive your transgressions nor your sins."

If you ever want to quote Scriptures, be sure you read it in the true and proper context, therefore v15 doesn't teach freewill.
---christan on 7/20/13


Gordon, Deut. 30:19 does not teach a person has free will, only that he has a choice. This are the words of Moses speaking to the people. He forces the decision on the plains of Moab before God. To make a choice, the passage is not saying they had free will. In fact they were in bondage to sin. How could they choose the Lord? Impossible, only those who were in bondage to God made a righteous choice. The reason the others rejected that calling is because "God had not given them a heart to perceive and eyes to see and ears to hear" (Deut. 29:2-4).
---Mark_V. on 7/19/13


"What does this Verse mean, of DEUTERONOMY 30:19?"
It means exactly what it says.
The word translated choose in this verse is the word "bachar," which means "to choose, elect, or decide for". "Bachar" is translated or defined "choose" or "chosen" 154 times. Choose as defined by Webster, means "to select from a number of possibilities, pick by preference: to prefer or decide, or to want, or desire".
"And if it seems evil to you to serve the LORD, choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve." Jos 24:15 Same word, same meaning. Choices are ultimately determined by the influence we yield to. Rom 6:16
---Josef on 7/19/13


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willie, you have a good point but the truth is some on this site are peddling a false religion. some of us try to expose the truths in God's Word.
---shira4368 on 7/18/13


It does not mean for us to choose to argue about doctrines and compare groups.

It means our attention to God, choosing how He in us has us choosing > "for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure." (Philippians 2:13)

Jesus spoke to the raging sea and wind > "Be still!" Then God made it happen, doing what His word meant. So, yes God has spoken to choose life, and His word then in us has us choosing in union with Him in His grace in love full of His life.
---willie_c: on 7/18/13


Most definitely it doesn't teach you have the freewill to "choose life" (Christ) if that's where you're heading, which I'm sure that's your destination.

The man Adam fell in Genesis 3 and we're explicitly told, "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned". It's IMPOSSIBLE for the sinner to "choose life". Christ confirmed when asked, "Who then can be saved? But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible..."

Paul confirms, "And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins." Spiritual regeneration must first happen (John 3:1-12).
---christan on 7/17/13


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