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Explain Matthew 25

What judgment is mentioned in Matthew 25:31-46? Give Scripture.

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 ---Mark_V. on 7/26/13
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Mark
In (Genesis 6:1-2), who do you believe the Sons of God are in the passage?
And who do you believe the men are, whose daughters they married?
---David on 8/8/13


Isaiah 22:22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder, so he shall open, and none shall shut, and he shall shut, and none shall open.

Matthew 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.


This is a constant theme in the writings of the new testament book, quotes from the OT books
---francis on 8/7/13


David, the passage you gave (2 Tim. 2:19) is a great passage. When God says, He doesn't know you, it does not mean He doesn't know you exist, for He knows every single person born even you. So it cannot mean that. What it means is,
"For whom He foreknew" He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son.." (Rom. 8:29) Only those of the elect are foreknown by God before the foundation of the world. The others He does not know as His elect. Remember the passage in (Matt. 7:23)?
"And then I will declare to them, I never knew you, depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness"
---Mark_V. on 8/7/13


(2 Timothy 2:19)
Nevertheless, Gods solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: The Lord knows those who are his, and, Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness.

Mark
Noah called God, "Lord". Doesn't someone who calls him Lord, have to do what God commands them to do? Because God was his Lord, God knew Noah would do what He told him to do.

(Luke 6:46) Why do you call me, Lord, Lord, and do not do what I say?

Didn't God flood the Earth because of mans wickedness?
---David on 8/7/13


Matthew 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Matthew 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

It too FAITH in JESUS, and belief in the power of Jesus to perform miracles, andc ast out devils. In the end thou they were rejected because they were workers of iniquity.

Meaning: they had faith, but they were in bondage of sin, they were lawless.

why did god not know them? because they never knew God:
1 John 2:3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
---francis on 8/6/13




David, you are using the logic of man to judge the actions of God. God did not ask Noah if he wanted to build the Ark, He told him to build it. Would God ask him if he wanted to build it knowing full well he was going to say no? God is omniscience, knowing all things. God says
"For I know the things that come into your mind, everyone of them" (Ezk. 11:5). He also says,
"Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, Thou understandest my thoughts afar off. Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquanited with all my ways, For there is not a word in my tongues but lo, O Lord, Thou knowest it altogether" (Psa. 139:2-4).
---Mark_V. on 8/6/13


Who are in bondage of sin, those who keep the law of God, or those who forsake the law of God"
---Mark_V. on 8/6/13

BIBLE ANSWER:
Psalms 119:44 So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever. And I will walk at liberty:

WHENEVER THERE IS A BIBLE ANSWER USE IT

---francis on 8/6/13


Now I ask you this, do you really believe that God would ask Noah to do something if he was going to reject Him? ---Mark_V. on 8/5/13

Mark
God asks us to repent and to believe in his Son Jesus Christ.
Do you believe God would ask us to do these things if he was going to reject us?
---David on 8/6/13


francis, after all I gave you, you still ask,
"Who is free in any nation, those that are law abiding or those who break the law?" I gave you the answer, here it is again,
"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone that believes" (Rom. 10:4) Those that believe only, and not because of their works, but because of their faith.
Then ask,
"Who are in bondage of sin, those who keep the law of God, or those who forsake the law of God" Simple, those without faith, all that do not believe. The very reason they are already condemned (John 3:18,19).
---Mark_V. on 8/6/13


What do you want to do, you are free from the bondage of sin.
---Mark_V. on 8/5/13
Who is free in any nation, those that are law abiding or those who break the law?

Who are in bondage of sin, those who keep the law of God, or those who forsake the law of God

BIBLE ANSWER:
Psalms 119:44 So shall I keep thy law continually for ever and ever. And I will walk at liberty:

That is why James calls it THE LAW OF LIBERTY
---francis on 8/5/13




francis, I gave you the word of God, wrote it down for you what Jesus has done for us, and the condition we are now in with Christ, and you answered me with all you could muster,
"I am sorry but your theology that teaches if you take the 7th day off from work and rest or if you honour your parents, or do not kill, or do not covet places you in bondage of is the very same one satan used to get Eve to sin:"
I knew you would not fail me, your rejected the Truth of God, and took Satan out of your heart, wrote him down to defend your stance. It is your nature, you cannot help yourself francis. Throwing the devil at me is nothing new. Have a happy day with the law.
---Mark_V. on 8/5/13


---Mark_V. on 8/5/13
Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid.

So your understanding of this passage is flawed

here from the NT writings of Paul: Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother,

If you honour your parents are you in bondage of sin?

I am sorry but your theology that teaches if you take the 7th day off from work and rest or if you honour your parents, or do not kill, or do not covet places you in bondage of is the very same one satan used to get Eve to sin:

Genesis 3:5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
---francis on 8/5/13


francis,
"For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone that believes" (Rom. 10:4). What do you want to do, you are free from the bondage of sin.
"For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit" (Rom. 8:3,4).
"Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free.." (Gal. 5:1).
---Mark_V. on 8/5/13


---Mark_V. on 8/5/13

There are questions acked by Paul not be me:

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith?

Romans 6:1 Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

Romans 6:15 shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace?

Romans 7:7 Is the law sin?
---francis on 8/5/13


David, you now ask,
"I will ask you this, If Noah had not built the Ark as God commanded, do you think God would have saved Noah? Yes or No?"
Now I ask you this, do you really believe that God would ask Noah to do something if he was going to reject Him? God knows all things, why would He ask in the first place? Come on David, there was no question in the mind of God that Noah was going to say no. What you are doing is judging God's competence of making the right choice telling Noah what to do. Because what you are really saying is that God's plan for the flood, the building of the ark was in Noah's hands not God's.
---Mark_V. on 8/5/13


francis, I am tired of answering your questions, I already told you what I needed to tell you about the law, so many times. I am just repeating myself over and over. "In the Lord I have righteousness"
You cannot stand before God with the laws in your hands, you need the Lord Jesus Christ to stand before God.
---Mark_V. on 8/5/13


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I can never keep all of the laws of God. I also confess,
---Mark_V. on 8/4/13

what you must now ask yourself are these:

Romans 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith?

Romans 6:1 Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

Romans 6:15 shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace?

Romans 7:7 Is the law sin?

These are the questions that you need to answer then we can move forward into talking about whether or not you even have the desire to keep all the laws

It is very possible that like the rich young ruler you are only willing to go so far

what is your heart my friend mark_V?
---francis on 8/4/13


Christan
You used Noah as an example of someone who was saved by Grace, and his works had nothing to do with this.

I will ask you this, If Noah had not built the Ark as God commanded, do you think God would have saved Noah? Yes or No?

If your answer is no, do you think this could possibly be reason the writer of Hebrews, used the building of the Ark, as an example of faith in (Hebrews 11:7)?
---David on 8/4/13


Neither Paul nor James is advocating like you, doing the laws of God.
---christan on 8/3/13
Pure garbage on your part, here's why:
from Paul: Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother, (which is the first commandment with promise,)

Romans 13:9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet,

James 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one [point], he is guilty of all.

James 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
---francis on 8/4/13


francis, I confess I am a sinner saved by the grace of God. I also confess that while I am saved, I can never keep all of the laws of God. I also confess,
"In the Lord have I righteousness" (Isa 45:24).
"For He made Him who knew no sin to be sin for us, that we might become the righteousness of God in Him" (2 Cor. 5:21).
---Mark_V. on 8/4/13


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Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

We are not saved by the law. That is not it's purpose and never has been.

You quote Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law [is] the knowledge of sin.

Read the last line. The law is to tell us what sin is. Not to save us. We are not to live in sin.

Jam 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
1Jo 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

So we are saved by Grace to be in CHRIST JESUS.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/4/13


Didn't the same apostle who wrote Romans 2:13 also write Romans 3:20?-- christan

Christan
To what Law was Paul speaking of when he wrote (Romans 3:20) & (Romans 2:5-16)?
Obviously Paul could not have been speaking of the same Law in both, for in one,(Romans 2:13) he says we are justified by our works, and in the other,(Romans 3:20) he says we are not justified by our works.

In (Romans 2:13) he is referring to the Law of Christ, and in (Romans 3:20) he is referring to the Law of Moses.

Paul taught both Jew and Gentile believers and had to address both Laws in his letters. This is why Peter said Paul's letters were hard to understand.

DO you believe you are under the Law of Christ?
---David on 8/4/13


David, didn't the same apostle who wrote Romans 2:13 also wrote, "Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in His sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin." Romans 3:20, "That no flesh should glory in his presence." 1 Corinthians 1:29?

So obviously your understanding of "doers of the law" is erroneous to say the least with regards to Romans 2:13 and James 2:24. Neither Paul nor James is advocating like you, doing the laws of God. And here's why, Paul confirmed what it is, "Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the LAW OF FAITH."

You and your cohorts forgot "FAITH"!
---christan on 8/3/13


Are you pure? Are you perfect? because pure is perfect.
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13
Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

Mark_V. if you are not pure, what do you then hope to inherit?
---francis on 8/3/13


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Are you pure? Are you perfect? because pure is perfect.
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13
Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

I have that hope in me
Can't speak for anyone else,
---francis on 8/3/13


---Mark_V. on 8/3/13
John 8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Do you wish to know if i am free?

Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

1 Timothy 5:22 keep thyself pure.

1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

The truth is: the 7th day Saturday is the sabbath, and I obey the truth by the power of God

and you?
---francis on 8/3/13


francis, you gave the passages again so my question again is, are you without sin? Are you pure? Are you perfect? because pure is perfect. A simple yes or no will do.
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13


Christ in us gives us the strength to obey the truth/ laws of God and make ourselvee pure by abstaining from sin
---francis on 8/2/13
From your statement, you're a "worker of iniquity". How do you even "make yourself pure by abstaining from sin"? ---christan on 8/3/13

I need someone, maybe -kathr4453, Gordon, RICHARDC, or david to explain to christan what I just posed. You do not have to agree with me, just explain to him what I am saying PLEASE

---Mark_V. on 8/3/13
Explain this to mark also
use one of these verse 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Acts 15:9
---francis on 8/3/13


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John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.


1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit ... by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

God strengthens us to obey his word, his truth whereby we are sanctified and made pure

God / Jesus does not obey for us, we obey as strengthened by God
---francis on 8/3/13


Christan
Where are your witnesses? One doesn't make a witness, and if Paul is your one witness why did he say this?
(Romans 2:13)
For it is not the hearers of the law who are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

Why did James say this?
(James 2:24)
You see how by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Here are two of my witnesses, show me yours.
---David on 8/3/13


"Christ in us gives us the strength to obey the truth/ laws of God and make ourselvee pure by abstaining from sin" francis

From your statement, you're a "worker of iniquity". How do you even "make yourself pure by abstaining from sin"? Didn't Christ come to die for the sins of His people? Obviously you're not His people. That's because you're trying to make yourself pure. You're nothing but a Buddhist!

Your doctrine of salvation mocks and spits at the death of Christ at Calvary, explicitly denying that His death couldn't and didn't pay for the sins of His people 100%. Even after Christ declared "It is finished." You cling on to the law just like a Pharisee. How sad.
---christan on 8/3/13


francis, you now say,
"Christ in us gives us the strength to obey the truth/ laws of God and make ourselvee pure by abstaining from sin"

So are you pure? Did you purify yourself this morning before posting? Are you sinless now? Are you saying you are without sin? because if you are the Truth is not in you (1 John 1:8). You have not answered the question.
---Mark_V. on 8/3/13


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1 Peter 1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit

1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Ephesians 3:16 That he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man,
That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith

Christ in us gives us the strength to obey the truth/ laws of God and make ourselvee pure by abstaining from sin
---francis on 8/2/13


"How does Peter say we purify ourselves?" David

Is Peter really implying that the man can "purify himself" by just obeying the Truth? Isn't that works and not grace? The Word of God does not teach the works of the law but only by grace!

Confirm what Paul wrote and you will have a better picture, "And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly... For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure." Paul's not contradicting Peter.

Is "sanctification/purification" the work of the man or God? If you say man, how does a sinner sanctify/purify himself to be Holy? You might as well call yourself a Buddhist or Hindu.
---christan on 8/2/13


David, the chastening of God comes in many ways. God only knows what why He will use on each perticular person. God could allow the consquence of your sins to be worse to you then to others just to humble you. Sin has consequences that hurt many people around us, but God has all that covered already. In fact He has every loup hole covered. Some He chastens terribly, where they lose everything to get them to a stronger faith. God knows where and how to work His power on each one of us. "A man's heart deviseth his way, but the Lord directeth his steps" ( Prov. 16:9). Not a hair in our heads can be touched without His permission.
---Mark_V. on 8/2/13


(Hebrews 12:5-6)
My son, do not make light of the Lords discipline,and do not lose heart when he rebukes you,because the Lord disciplines the one he loves,
and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son.


Mark
What criteria does God use to discipline his children, if it is not the Law of Christ?
---David on 8/2/13


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David, the context shows in (1 Cor. 9:21) Jews were under the Law, they had the oracles of God. Gentiles were not under the law because they never received the oracles of God given to Israel. The passages talk about two kinds of people, Jews and Gentiles. When Gentiles make a choice, Christ never gets the glory for they have no faith.
"To those who are without the law (is speaking of Gentiles)." Those people Paul talked about concerning the wrath of God in (Rom. 1:18-23). Jesus said many things that are not attainable by everyone. Believers do repent, they try not to sin, they love Christ, under the New Testament, believers, jews or Gentiles, they are forgiven, so not under the condemnation of the law.
---Mark_V. on 8/1/13


Mark
I asked you that question, because many believe when Paul said, "We are not under the Law", this meant that we are under no Law.
But is this really what Paul taught?

1 Corinthians 9:21
To those who are outside the law, as outside the law (though not outside the law of God, but under the law of Christ), that I might gain those who are outside the law.


As you can see, we are under the Law of Christ.
Isn't the Law of Christ, to Love God and to love your neighbor?

---David on 8/1/13


The answer is "NO". "We love God because He first loved us" There is no "must" anywhere.
---Mark_V. on 7/31/13

You say,
"In that case EVERY HUMAN being MUST be saved"
No. Only those who belong to God love Christ.
"Jesus said to them, If God were your Father you would love me," (John 8:42).
Only those who belong to God love Christ.
---Mark_V. on 7/31/13


The answer is "NO". "We love God because He first loved us" There is no "must" anywhere.
---Mark_V. on 7/31/13

In that case EVERY HUMAN being MUST be saved
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world

and with that FLUUUUSSSSHHH there goes your predestination doctrine
---francis on 7/31/13


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This is what the whole 25th chapter shows me: looking like a Child of God, acting like a Child of God, & actually BEING a Child of God are completely different things. No matter how good we are, we'll never measure up to God's requirements. Without Jesus' covering/sacrifice, we will not be allowed into heaven. Only by accepting Jesus will we be accepted.
---Reba on 7/31/13


David, you asked me,
"Mark One simple Question: Do you believe we must love God to be saved?
Yes or No?"


The answer is "NO". "We love God because He first loved us" There is no "must" anywhere.

Jesus said that if a person does not have a love for Christ he doesn't belong to the Father.
"Jesus said to them, "If God were your Father you would love Me,.." (John 8:42)
---Mark_V. on 7/31/13


Mark
One simple Question: Do you believe we must love God to be saved?
Yes or No?
---David on 7/31/13


francis, you have not answer the question. Are you sinless or not? are you without sin? That question you try to avoid answering why? Since you preach the Law to others, how about you? Are you perfect and keep all of the Laws of God? Simple yes or no will do.
---Mark_V. on 7/31/13


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Spirit of the law" is the deeper intent or spiritual meaning behind the law

The commandment to keep the Sabbath says that we must work on the 6 working days, and rest on the Sabbath along with everyone in our household.

Sabath is not just a day off from work.

Here is the spirit of the Sabbath commandment:

Isaiah 66:23 from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me,

Isaiah 58:13 call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable, and shalt honour him,

Matthew 12:12 do well on the sabbath days.

Matthew 12:5 Do the work of priest or pastor, spiritual ministries on sabbath

So Mark_V is deveived, he does not keep the spirit of the law
---francis on 7/31/13


Mark_V, I HAVE ANSWERED YOU ALREADY. If you do not accept the commandment of God to keep the Sabbath on the seventh day which is Saturday, what chance is there of you accepting my answer?
---francis on 7/31/13


francis, you have not answered the question, are you sinless? are you without sin? Answer the question.

You cannot, because if you do, the Truth is not in you, and you call God a liar.
You can do a little adultery here and a little there, go to church on Saturday, and you believe you are forgiven. Going to church on Saturday Sabbath makes you a very holy person in the eyes of the other Pharisees.
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


We are not asked to keep them perfect
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13
next time qualify or quanify that statement. How you ask?

like this:
"We are not asked to keep them perfect, a little adultery now and then keeps in in the spirit of the law."

"We are not asked to keep them perfect, a litle theft once and again is desireable."

" We are not asked to keep them perfect bowing to another god every now and again is expected."


---francis on 7/30/13


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David, there is nothing wrong with John 14:23, that contradicts anything we said. Only those that belong to God love Christ. Lets read what Jesus said literally to the those who claim they have one Father God,
"Jesus said to them, If God were you Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God, nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me." ( John 8:42). In order for a person to love Christ he has to belong to God the Father. He later says,
"He who is of God hears God's words, therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God"
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


francis, from now on my answer to you will be, that the written law given to Israel is fulfilled in Christ for me. I now follow the Spirit of the Law. So go ahead and put down the written law. as you always do. It will remind you what you have to do.
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


Mat 12:5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless?

The priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless!
The law itself (orders) the priests in the temple to profane the Sabbath.

And they are blameless!
---TheSeg on 7/30/13


---Mark_V. on 7/30/13
Where in all of the bible have you ever read that we are not to keep the commandments perfectly?

Youmay have read that ALL HAVE SINNED, meaning in times pastre we have not keep them perfectly

but not one bible verse allows for the transgression of a single law
---francis on 7/30/13


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"Are you saying that God is obligated to love us because we are obedient to Him?"--Christan

If God (in Christ) promises to love us and make himself manifest to us if we love him and keep his law then YES He is obligated.... by his own promise! God is holy! He does not lie.
---Jasheradan on 7/30/13


The Born Again Came First, Obey the truth is after the Fact, ---RICHARDC on 7/29/13

Richard
What did Jesus say comes first in (John 14:23)?

Anyone who loves me will keep my word. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them."
---David on 7/30/13


David, Richard is correct in that we are saved first, born of the Spirit, and when someone is born of the Spirit the works he does are because he was created in Christ for good works which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" (Eph. 2:10) and in (John 14:21) we are told that those who love Christ keep His commandments, meaning their conduct should be their evidence. We are not asked to keep them perfect because no one can keep all the commandments or laws perfect. The same thing in (1 Peter 1:22,23) "purifying ourselves" means how we conduct ourselves before others. This is done with the help of the Holy Spirit who is sanctifying us, but we cooperate with the Spirit/
---Mark_V. on 7/30/13


The saved in John 14?
They were still ignorant of some things which is why Jesus said, "Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake."
That is the same thing he said to some jews who acosted him in John 10:37_38 "If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him."

This round goes to David.
---Nana on 7/29/13


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David on 7/29/13 - Now that you have been purified yourselves by obeying the truth - For You have Been Born Again

( David , Is it not , They have been Born again - Grace has been Bestowed on them, So that they can Purified Them Selves, ? The Born Again Came First, Obey the truth is after the Fact, )
---RICHARDC on 7/29/13


Peter 1:22-23)
Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth so that you have sincere love for each other, love one another deeply, from the heart. For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.


Christan, Mark and Elder
How does Peter say we purify ourselves?
Now go back and read (John 14:21) again, and you will see Peter confirms what I say.
I have witnesses to what I say.
You say Paul says this and Paul says that, show us your witnesses that's what Paul was teaching.
I can even show you in Paul's very letters, that he did not teach what you say he taught.
One more witness..... please.
---David on 7/29/13


David, in the two passages Jesus was showing them that with man it is impossible so He tells them to do the impossible. In (Matthew 19:16) Jesus wanted to impress on the young man both the high standard required by God and the absolute futility of seeking salvation by his own merit. He didn't keep the law perfectly. In (Luke 10:25) Those people could not create a love for Christ in their hearts, since "We love Him because He first loved us" (1 john 4:19). if they could, they would inherit eternal life, something impossible. Then say:
"Give us some verses that clearly say what you say,"
"Jesus looked at them and said to them, "With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
---Mark_V. on 7/29/13


David, "gain favour of God"? Are you saying that God is obligated to love us because we are obedient to Him? Because that's what it sounds like coming from you. I thought it was the other way round contrary to your understanding. And no John 14:21 does not teach of such doctrine like yours and francis.

Did Noah "gain favour" from God that he and seven of his family members were saved? Instead, the Bible declared, "But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord."

No where in Scriptures are we taught God is obligated to the creatures He has created. No where! So your understanding of John 14:21 is erroneous.
---christan on 7/28/13


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(Like beating a dead mule....)
Let's ask who was Jesus speaking to in John 14?
He was speaking to those who were His. The saved. He was explaining Christian works to them. He said when we do works it is the Father who does it in us, v10.
Salvation is not received by works or the keeping of the law by anyone.
Christian works receive rewards and will be judged at the Bema.
There are two types, and three classes each of works.
1st type those that will abide, Gold, silver and precious stones. 2nd type those that won't abide, wood, hay and stubble. (I Cor 3:11-17)
Notice that this was also being explained to Christians, v16.
We are not Saved by works but we work because we are Saved.
---Elder on 7/28/13


Mark
If what you say is true, why didn't Jesus give your answer to the men in (Matthew 19:16) & (Luke 10:25),who asked the Son of God, "What must I do to gain Eternal life"?

I give you many writers in the New Testament who support what I teach.
I challenge you, show us one New Testament writer besides Paul, who taught what you believe.

Give us some verses that clearly say what you say, not verses you can mold to say what you what them to say.
---David on 7/28/13


David, you are advocating salvation by works of the law, good deeds where man gets the glory for been good. Sorry, but you can be as good as you want, but without Christ, it is all sin. For anything without faith is sin.
"because although they knew God, they did not worship Him as God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futilein their thoughts and their foolish hearts were darkened" (Rom. 1:21).

When a believer does good deeds, God gets the glory and we are thankful to Him.
---Mark_V. on 7/28/13


David, you're advocating salvation by works.---christan on 7/27/13

Christan
I am not advocating Salvation by works. What I am advocating, is we gain the favor of God through our obedience to the teachings of Jesus Christ.
And this is what Jesus taught.
(John 14:21)
He that hath My commandments and keeps them, he it is that loves Me, and he that loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will manifest Myself to him.


Do you believe what Jesus taught?
---David on 7/28/13


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David, you are advocating good works for salvation, that is not what the Bible teaches in those passages you gave. You gave,
"In (Romans 2:5-10), Paul taught those who live their lives doing good works, will be saved." Although Scripture everywhere teaches that salvation is not on the basis of works (Rom. 4:1-4: Eph. 2:8,9) it consistenly teaches that God's Judgment is always on the basis of man's deeds (Isa. 3:10,11: Jer. 17:10: John 5:28,29: 1 Cor. 3:8: 2 Cor. 5:10). Thats what is happening in (Matt. 25:31-46).
Yet in (Rom. 2:5-10) Paul describes the deeds of two distinct groups: the Redeemed (v.7,10) and the unredeemed (v.8,9). The deeds of the redeemed are not on the basis of their salvation but the evidenced of it.
---Mark_V. on 7/28/13


\\The great white throne judgement is the judgement of the living dead after the thousand years. Rev 20:10-15.\\

There is only ONE judgement, and there is NO literal earthly millennium.

Nor is there a pre-trib rapture.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 7/28/13


David, you're advocating salvation by works. Neither Matthew 25:31-46 nor Scriptures teaches anyone who's saved by the grace of God is because they have done good works. On the contrary, Paul explicitly wrote,

"For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them."

That is, the good works were a sign of their salvation "...which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." The attitude of the saved is highlighted in Matthew 25:37-39, unlike your boasting of doing good works.
---christan on 7/27/13


The judgement in Matt 25:31-46 is the post tribulation judgement. Did they feed, shelter, clothe, visit the sick and imprisoned brothers and sisters of Jesus who took His message to the world during the tribulation? If yes then they are a sheep, if no then they are a goat. John 13:34-35. Could this be the judgement of the Bride? Rev. 19:6-9. The judgement in Matt 25 is after the tribulation and before the binding of Satan for a thousand years. Rev. 20:2-3.

The great white throne judgement is the judgement of the living dead after the thousand years. Rev 20:10-15. They are only referred to as "the dead" "And they were judged every man according to their works. Rev. 20:13.





---barb on 7/27/13


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Mark
Notice in the passage, those who are saved, are the ones who showed they loved others through their good works.

In (Romans 2:5-10), Paul taught those who live their lives doing good works, will be saved.

In (James 2:17-18), James taught that faith without works is useless.

Paul also taught that We are saved by Grace through faith. And that faith by which we are saved, is shown by these three witnesses, to be through our good works.

If any of you disagree, give me your three witnesses to confirm your teaching, as Paul taught you to do in (2 Corinthians 13:1)
.
---David on 7/27/13


Mark, if there are a judgment for believers and one for unbelievers, Matthew 25:31-46 could be the Great Triage Judgment, where each person is sorted to that one's specialized judgment. But this could be metaphorical, except it clearly shows how Jesus communicates with people. If there is personal communication, then this could be not a metaphor, but the sorting-out.

But we do have how judgment begins with us "first" (1 Peter 4:17).

In any case, Matthew 25:31-46 to me means how Jesus takes everything personally, that we do or do not do. He is not just keeping records. Have we loved personally, as family, not just by distant handouts?
---willie_c: on 7/27/13


This chapter is an extension of the Day of the Lord that Peter prophesied in 2 Peter 3.

1. God created only two kinds of mankind He symbolically calls, "the sheep and goats"

2. To the "sheep" we are told, "inherit the kingdom PREPARED for you from the foundation of the world"

3. To the "goat", He says "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, PREPARED for the devil and his angels"

Both these verses reveals explicitly of God's sovereignty in His election and rejection of the sheep and goats. That's because we are told that heaven and hell have been "prepared" for the sheep and goat. Notice it's past tensed.
---christan on 7/26/13


There is ONE Judgement seat, but THREE Judgment phases

Phase one: THE CHURCH
1 Peter 4:17 judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it FIRST begin at us,

Daniel 7:10 the judgment was set, and the books were opened.


Phase two: JUDGMENT BY THE SAINTS
1 Corinthians 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world?

Revelation 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: ... and they lived and reigned (AS JUDGES)with Christ a thousand years.


Phase three: EXECUTIVE JUDGMENT OF THE LOST:
Revelation 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God, and the books were opened: and the dead were judged ...
---francis on 7/26/13


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\\Brother Willie, I was really asking what Judgment Seat was the one mentioned in Matt. 25:31-46? We have the Judgment Seat of Christ or what is called the Bema Seat which is for believers. And we also have the Great White Throne of Judgment which is for unbelievers only where they get sentence. \\

There only ONE Last Judgement, and ALL mentioned in the Bible are the same event.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 7/26/13


Brother Willie, I was really asking what Judgment Seat was the one mentioned in Matt. 25:31-46? We have the Judgment Seat of Christ or what is called the Bema Seat which is for believers. And we also have the Great White Throne of Judgment which is for unbelievers only where they get sentence. What I was asking is what Judgment Seat is Matthew talking about? Is it a literal place or is Jesus just giving a parable or a metaphor? I hear from one commenter it was the Judgment of the nations. thank you brother Willie.
---Mark_V. on 7/26/13


Well, Mark, the scripture is the scripture you have already given. What we do for the least of Jesus' brothers and sisters is what we do for Him.

And I consider that if you do something for Jesus, you not only give Him a handout by means of a program, while you are not even present but just sending money to get people off of your conscience.

Jesus came and personally spent time with people, desiring us to become His own brothers and sisters > "that He may be the firstborn among many brethren." (in Romans 8:29 > so, our destiny, even, includes how we minister to His least, in order to be in God's family love together)
---willie_c: on 7/26/13


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