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When Do Days Begin

According to scripture ,did the day begin at sunset or sun rise?

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 ---1st_cliff on 10/2/13
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No, the heavens He created at that time were immediately around the earth, called "firmament" where birds fly and clouds gather.
1st_cliff

Gen_1:1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
-This is heaven.
Gen_1:2And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
-From heaven.
Gen_1:6And God said, Let there be a (firmament in the midst of the waters),
Gen_1:8And God called the firmament Heaven.
-This is space?
Gen_1:9And God said, Let the waters (under the heaven) be gathered together unto one place,
-Where the atmosphere? Gen_2:4!
Gen_2:6But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
-Where birds fly and clouds gather.
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/13/13


Cliff,

It seems that Warwick has decided he no longer wants to debate with you the meaning of 'day' in Genesis 1. I think Warwick's reasonably clear on that.

Warwick has patiently debated with you for ages and I do not know why he bothered as you write speculative nonsense designed to overcomplicate the obvious.

I would be pleased to do a commercial transaction with you one day, Cliff. For example, you want to hand over 10 dollars for a $10-marked item, but in my shop I'll charge you $1,000 or even a million because, after all, a cardinal number next to a dollar sign doesn't necessarily mean you should take it literally, at least in Cliff's world.
---Marc on 10/13/13


Trav, the obvious does not evade you, but you are willingly ignorant (2 Peter 3:5). You "will not believe" because of your nonBiblical foundational beliefs.

As you believe Noah's flood was local, not global I will paraphrase Isaiah in line with your beliefs "This is like the days of Noah to me: as I swore the waters of Noah should no more go over any country or land area." But since then floods have inundated country sized land areas. The 1887 Henan flood (China) covered an area larger than countries such as Finland, Vietnam, Norway, Poland, Italy, New Zealand etc. Your nonBiblical belief makes God a liar, saying He would never again do this, but if you are correct He did! Is God a liar?
---Warwick on 10/13/13


... and Isaiah 54:9 shows it is not local. But they will not believe-willingly ignorant.
---Warwick on 10/11/13

Ha...this is rich. It is much more biblical you being the ignorant one. Shepherd without a hook. In arrogance you drown by sheer number of witnesses against you. The Hebrew word "erets" used over 1,600 times describing a country or land area. As in Isa. Noticed today 20,000 new species are being discovered yearly. Add these yearly, male/female + food to your fleet of Arks.
Psa_119:104 Through thy precepts I get understanding: therefore I hate every false way.
Psa_119:128 Therefore I esteem all thy precepts concerning all things to be right, and I hate every false way.
---Trav on 10/13/13


There's much about creation that is not mentioned, bible information is only for what concerns us! If you're talking about God being "outside" of time, then so is the universe!
---1st_cliff on 10/12/13

There is a Hebrew word"yom" used in Genesis from which "day" is translated. This word used in O.T. does not always mean 24hrs. It can be a segment of time from weeks to a year to an epoch.

Any change/correction/discovery of truth about an error to a doctrine throws problems to the doctrine that cannot be defended.
Precept upon precept...witness + witness is a matter found.
Isa_29:13 .... but have removed their heart far from me, and their fear toward me is taught by the precept of men:
---Trav on 10/13/13




StrongAxe, Biblical proof that all creation days are the same length, 24hr days, is there in Scripture for anyone to see, and has been quoted repeatedly. No contradicting Scripture has been given. But you will not see, you are a 'fence-sitter' holding to the view that nothing can be truly known, it could be this or it could be that-anything but what is written. Do you apply your sceptical fence-sitting rules to all Scripture or reserve it for Genesis alone?

Isaiah 54:9 says whatever Noah's flood was God will never do it again. If it was local then God has lied as countless local floods (large and small) have occurred since. As Noah's flood was global then God has not lied. Too simple for those who trust God and His word.
---Warwick on 10/13/13


Warwick, You admitted that you do not know when angels were created.
Consider this, When God said He made earth and heavens ,do you think it was "heaven" where He dwells and angels and Jesus?
No, the heavens He created at that time were immediately around the earth, called "firmament" where birds fly and clouds gather.

There's much about creation that is not mentioned, bible information is only for what concerns us! If you're talking about God being "outside" of time, then so is the universe!
---1st_cliff on 10/12/13


Warwick:

Isaiah 54:9 itself does not actually prove a global flood. English "earth" is Hebrew "eretz" which means "earth" or "land". As in English, it can mean earth as opposed to water or sky. It can me the whole planet. It can mean a the land of Israel.

(Again, I am not claiming the flood was not global - just saying this verse doesn't say one way or other.)

Genesis 1:3-5 doesn't say ANYTHING about "how" evenings or mornings were determined. And please show me, chapter and verse, where the Bible "spells out exactly" how long the creation days were. Not later days, just the first 3. And Holman is just an expert - NOT the Word of God.
---StrongAxe on 10/12/13


Cliff, I dont know why these people lived the ages they did because, as far as I know, God does not say. I trust Gods word and will leave you to think outside the box because God and His word are my authority but not yours, as you, the BiblioSceptic prefer the overheated-opinions of fallible sinful men.

I will not again descend to showing how God defines day as you have no interest in what He says. But you are wrong, have been shown to be wrong, multiple times, but prefer your own fables. .

Your question about one earths revolution is nonsense, but what is new?

I see no point in continuing this debate as debate requires honesty, you have none.
---Warwick on 10/12/13


Elder, TheSeg, thanks for clarifying about the blog closing.

Part of what I posted before:
TheSeg on 10/3/13
Interesting.
Note gen 1:1-3
God, in the beginning vs 1.
God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
Considering God is light, in Him there is no darkness. 1 Jn 1:5
Where did dark come from vs 2

and since God is light, what it means LET THERE BE LIGHT, in comparison to created light
Very interesting:
Gen1:4 God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
---chria9396 on 10/12/13




Warwick, **I have no idea why these people lived the years shown** Is an admission that you are unable to "think outside the box"
God did not have to separate creation into 6 divisions in order to make a Sabbath law, He could have just said "Work six rest one" but he didn't!
He was setting a "pattern".
The fact that he enumerated each period ,you assume, is sufficient evidence to call them 24 hr.periods.
Did he need one earth's revolution to complete a "work?" It took 24 hours to say "Let there be light"???
You're right ,you have no idea!
---1st_cliff on 10/12/13


Warwick, You are being just as dishonest as the NIV saying "when" you eat thereof when Gen 2 .17 says in the DAY (yom) Look it up in Strong's Concordance! Dishonesty is when you try to prove a point by contrivance!
---1st_cliff on 10/12/13


Cliff, you are dishonest because you keep bringing up the same points which have already been answered from Scripture, and reasoning from Scripture. Each time you only give your personal sceptical nonBiblical rationalizations, no real answers. But then as if it was not answered you bring it up again as though it were something new. Now if you were to tell me you suffer from short term memory problems I would understand but...

That 2 Peter 3:8 does not concern the length of an earth day is obvious "with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." This concerns God being outside of time, does not apportion length to any "day" therefore has nothing to do with a 24hr day.
---Warwick on 10/11/13


Cliff, I have no idea why these people lived the years shown. I cannot imagine how you think, 70,95 and 105 years is just short of 1000 years. That you should live so long!

I have already, from Scripture, shown your faulty reasoning regarding 'day.' This is the dishonesty I am speaking about. You have nothing Scriptural or from a Biblical dictionary to support your view, but none the less you plod on with your nonsense.

I gather you do not have the faintest idea what "let Scripture interpret Scripture" means.
---Warwick on 10/11/13


Warwick, Scripture,
Adam lived 930 years
Seth lived 912 "
Enosh " 905 "
Kenan " 910 "
Mahalalel " 895 "
Jared " 962 "
Methuselah " 969 '
Noah ' 950 "
so this is just coincidence that they all lived just short of the one thousand year (day) ???? You think?
Let scripture interpret scripture?????
---1st_cliff on 10/11/13


Mark, do you imagine all who blog here are honest seekers of truth? Or do you imagine some are pseudo-Christians who reject Scripture and are willingly ignorant. What do you say of someone who rejects what Scripture says on any subject, replying always with home-spun philosophies? Do we revere and follow God's word or popular, ever-changing human beliefs?

"For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions" 2 Timothy 4:3.

There is nothing in Scripture nor in reasoning from Scripture, which supports a local flood, and Isaiah 54:9 shows it is not local. But they will not believe-willingly ignorant.
---Warwick on 10/11/13


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Warwick, Do you imagine for one second that peter had no knowledge of Genesis when he made that remark about the thousand year day?
The context is too obvious to be coincidence!
I am not honest because I disagree with your theory???
The stove is calling the kettle black?
---1st_cliff on 10/11/13


Warwick, The fact that all of those pre flood "long lifers" lived just short of their thousandth year has no significance to you (ironic?) because it would mess up your theory ,right?
---1st_cliff on 10/11/13


Warwick, I know you are defending a point that is very important to know, but I disagree with what you say concerning those who do not agree with you. You said,
"You are right and to paraphrase Romans 1:20-the evidence from Scripture and the world around us is so conclusive that those who will not believe in a global flood "are without excuse." You are condemning those who do not agree with you by giving (Romans 1:20). We are not saved by believing in a universal flood, we are saved by Grace through faith in Jesus Christ. Not agreeing with one point in history or something not clearly expained does not send anyone to hell. In salvation, it is not by what we know or do, It is by God's grace.
---Mark_V. on 10/11/13


Cliff, profitable debate requires honesty. You have little.

Dictionaries show 'day' in this context means 'when." The Holman dictionary gives the third definition of day "a general expression for "time" without specific limits. This agrees with "when" as is not a 'day' of any length,ust as used in Genesis 2:4, and 17.

You misuse Scripture "do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day" 2 Peter 3:8 This does not define an earth day, but is about God who is eternal therefore outside days of any length, and has nothing to do with the days of creation.
---Warwick on 10/11/13


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Warwick, Why do you suppose that Adam's "day" was just 70 years short of a thousand?
You say that "scripture interprets scripture" , but this interpretation goes right over your head even though scripture says "a day is as a thousand years" (with God)
Methuselah 969 years,Seth,912,Enosh,905, Noah 950 etc. ALL "before" one thousand!
Notice it doesn't say it rained for 40 "evenings and mornings" , but 40 days and 40 nights (real time) and covered the earth for 150 "days"
So "Day and night" are 24 hours not evening and morning!
---1st_cliff on 10/10/13


Cluny, you have to be joking. "how were evenings and mornings determined before the sun and other bodies were created on the third day?" Now go to Genesis (that's the book at the start of the Bible) and read 1:3-5. You may need a dictionary for the big words.


BTW we can see you are not conversant with Scripture as the sun etc were created on the fourth day!

---Warwick on 10/10/13


I understand the question there was no sun on the first three days!
What I'm asking is, if one believes that the last three days were 24 hours.
I mean, because really! If someone doesn't believe the last three days were 24 hours, then there is really nothing to talk about, right!

God used the words evening and morning to describe the last three days.
God also used the same evening and morning to describe the first three days.
So the question about time is only because the sun is no sun there, right?

So we're not involving or using God to describe this, right. This is pure human reasoning. Because God used evening and morning the same way in each and every day!
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/10/13


TheSeg, if evenings and mornings are determined by the earth's rotation on its axis, which affects on which side of the planet sunlight falls, how were evenings and mornings determined before the sun and other bodies were created on the third day?

I believe that is the question being asked.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/10/13


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I'm curious!
Some of you say there's a difference between the first three days and the last three days. Only because God doesn't specifically say 24 hours!

So when God said in Gen_1:5 and the evening and the morning.
And in Gen_1:19 when he said and the evening and the morning!
These are two different phrases and they don't mean exactly the same thing?

What I find strange is someone saying Gen_1:9 mean 24 hours!
But, Gen_1:5 cannot or does not mean 24 hours, because the sun was not there! Even though God uses the exact same phrase for both.
Somehow you believe God is trying to convey two different messages here, using the exact same phrase?

How or why, would you believe this?
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/10/13


StrongAxe. au contraire the Bible does spell out exactly that the 24hr days of creation and every 24hr day since are just that. Further grammar and logic say the same. In all the languages I am conversant with the word for 'day' when accompanied by a number means 24hr day. If this was not so then language is meaningless and we would constantly have to ask what do you mean by-see you in 6 days. But the French don't, the Spanish don't, (ask MarkV), the Italians don't, the Germans don't and so on.
---Warwick on 10/9/13


Cliff, you misused the Holman Bible Dictionary to make a non-point. You therefore know what this dictionary says about 3 meanings of 'yom' 'day, p 396.

1) day as a "general expression for 'time' without specific limits",

2) 'Day' with a number, as Holman says means 24hrs, giving Genesis 1:5 as the first example of 24hr day.

Twenty four hour day obviously has a specific time limit.

3) 'daylight' which is from sunrise to sunset, again a specific time period.

We are therefore left with 'day' as used in Genesis 2:4,17 which means "when." If I wrote -in King David's day-I would not mean in his 'daylight' nor would I mean in his 24hr day. So just work at and you will see the obvious.
---Warwick on 10/9/13


Warwick:

I know how "morning" and "evening" are interpreted NOW, and for most of history - with respect to the sun. Even "evening twilight, dusk, the fading of the day" commonly mean this - yet they do not specifically reference the sun - and CANNOT have done so during the first three days. You ASSUME the night/day cycle during those days was the same as today, but that is pure conjecture. Certainly the separation of a discrete solar body out of a general shared luminous state was an event so cataclysmic that time cycles could have changed.

But I am NOT arguing how long the days WERE. I am just re-iterating that the Bible does not SPECIFICALLY SAY how long they were.
---StrongAxe on 10/9/13


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Seq, what a recommendation from you. Thanks.

You are right and to paraphrase Romans 1:20-the evidence from Scripture and the world around us is so conclusive that those who will not believe in a global flood "are without excuse."
---Warwick on 10/9/13


Warwick, In the bible version that you reverence, KJV, it says in the "day" (yom)
NIV has conveniently changed it to "when" even when does not mean "some other time" but "at that time" He did not die that day or "when" he disobeyed!
If he just died "spiritually" he would still be alive physically!
Regardless of how many times day with a number occurs, saying it always means 24 hrs. is still "rule of thumb" not fact!
Sheol (hell) is translated 31 times as "grave" and fundamentalists still don't believe it!
---1st_cliff on 10/9/13


Cliff, ironic! I have answered this question of yours twice before. I have also, many times, pointed out 'yom' (day) has 3 meanings. In Genesis 2:17 'yom' is not accompanied by a number so does not mean 24hr day, but means 'when'-"in my father's day" i.e. when he was alive.

The underlying Hebrew means "in dying you will surely die." Not you will drop dead. That Adam survived but eventually died supports this. However Adam's personal relationship with God surely 'died.' The curse including the certainty of death was instituted upon them and all Creation. They were banished from the Garden, (Genesis 3:23) so they could not continue to "take from the tree of life, eat, and live forever."
---Warwick on 10/9/13


What Warwick wrote on 10/8/13 is unmistakable! (Or forgive me but, infallible!)
If God was talking about a local or regional flood, and locals and regional floods have happened again and again.

Isa 54:9- for as I have sworn that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth,

Guys you can argue the point all you want!
But, I mean, here is God's word!
I don't see how anybody, can refute this!

Warwick, dude!
I personally want to thank you. For this incredible insight!
If this is not proof positive to a worldwide flood, I don't know what is!
Peace Bro thanks!

PS Cliff
It happened the moment he ate from the tree!
That very day, you're thinking physical instead of spiritual!
---TheSeg on 10/9/13


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Warwick, If you have it all "in a nutshell" then why don't you answer specific questions? IE
Scripture says Adam was told "the day (yom) you eat thereof you will surely die" then says he LIVED 930 years THEN he died!
It says nothing about a "spiritual" death (as Adam would not have known what that was anyway) So Explain!
---1st_cliff on 10/9/13


Warwick, I believe the flood was universal. Though many theologians believe it was local. Melton Terry says it was local. He says,
"The narrative of the flood is probably the account of an eyewitness. It's vividness of description and minuteness of details contain the strongest evidence that it is such. It was probably a tradition handed down from Shem to his descendants until it was finally in corporated in the Books of Moses"
I don't believe for one second it was local. I came out with the conclusion it was universal.
Not what the writer of Scripture could physically see (phenomenologically). The traditional interpretation of these verses has been (noumenological). All evidence proofs it was universal.
---Mark_V. on 10/9/13


Cliff, Scripture is always relevant.

Your imagination provides questions you believe challenge the veracity of Scripture-they don't as it is easy to see your error. Remember Scripture interprets Scripture "A correct interpretation of the Bible will always be consistent with the rest of the Scriptures", not human opinion. I have studied Scripture long enough, cover to cover, to see its integrity. This makes it easy for me (no expert) to see your reasoning flaws.

Dealing with error is slow here-no quick back and forth. But on 'talk back' radio it is much easier as anyone can instantly be held to account for their error-no time or place to hide.
---Warwick on 10/8/13


Mark, the point is Flood-local or global?

Isaiah 54:9 "This is like the days of Noah to me: as I swore that the waters of Noah should no more go over the earth,...."If, as Scripture says, the Flood was global then God is right. If the flood was local God is in error as localities vast and small have been inundated countless times since.

See Gill on Psalm 104:6 "....for they did turn again and cover the earth, at the time of the flood, but never shall more. Some think there is no need to make this exception, since this was written after the flood, and when God had swore that the waters should no more go over the earth, Isaiah 54:9." Note Gill gives Isaiah 54:9 as a supporting reference.
---Warwick on 10/8/13


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Warwick, 2Tim.4.3 was fulfilled a long time ago.
What you have today is a "religion" called "Christian" that is far removed from scripture (except the twisted ones).
Reason and logic has no place in your religion.
If it suits you, so be it I just refuse to believe foolishness!
---1st_cliff on 10/8/13


Hi Warwick, I was only answering to (Psa. 104) not (Isa. 54:). You mentioned that in Gill's commentary he said (Psa. 104) was of the flood, and I could not believe he would say that, so I read the exposition and he clearly mention's that (Psa. 104) is about creation. And that the same power Jesus used in creation is the same power He used at the flood.
(Isaiah 54) is not talking about the flood but of God forgiving Israel whom the Lord had forsaken and with His wrath hid His face from them, but because of His kindness, He would have mercy on them, "for this is like the waters of Noah to Me, For I have sworn that the waters of Noah would no longer cover the earth, That I would not be angry with you, nor rebuke you"
---Mark_V. on 10/8/13


To the Moderators, Staff and ChristiaNet Ministry!
I do realize it is quite impossible to keep track of everything all the time.
Also understand I am not blaming the monitors, the staff or the ChristiaNet Ministry in general.
And I personally would like to apologize to anyone who was offended, Save One!
But also everyone must understand my point of view!
If that comment was never posted, which I found very offensive about me!
This whole conversation would be mute!
In the future, I will find other ways of addressing a similar issue. If they should occur!
Hopefully everyone including myself has learned a valuable lesson.
About humanity! Respect should be the first thing in any blog reply!
Bless you all!
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/8/13


ChristiaNet is a far-reaching ministry that we believe belongs to God.
We have made it clear that not all types of language is allowed.
Most statements that contain slang, off color words, cursing and euphuisms that lead to or are vulgar and offensive are stopped and deleted by our automatic monitoring system.
The Staff must, personally remove any words or statements not picked up by the system. When we see these posts we remove them.
We have in the past and will in the future remove any poster or member that continues in non-approved speech.
We do forgive for errors and realize the passions involved in posting on some blogs.
We will not allow members or statements to tarnish the ChristiaNet ministry.

---Moderator on 10/7/13


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Elder, I honor and respect you for this post, too!
And I also feel everyone is entitled to their opinions.
That is, on the way they see things!

//We all get caught up sometimes and fail.//
I am not Christ, you hit me. I will hit you back!
If that failure on my part, so be it!
But understand something, I dont need anyone help in my failures.
I think, I do a pretty good job by myself!

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God!
Including you and everyone else in this world!
I hope this is clear to you!

As I already told Chria, I am glad it was deleted.
So as for me, the subject is close!
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/7/13


Cliff, in the way you constantly reject what Scripture says you are a living example of 2 Timothy 4:3 "For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions,"
---Warwick on 10/7/13


"chria9396, No, you did nothing!
Me and someone else did!
I'm glad to see it go! And not just me, amen!"
TheSeg

Seg, I honor and respect you for this post. We all get caught up sometimes and fail.
God Bless you in your efforts for Him!
---Elder on 10/7/13


Mark, your quote says the power Christ used at creation was again used by Him post-Flood. The Psalm continues vs.9 "You set a boundary that they may not pass, so that they might not again cover the earth." If this concerns creation then God is in error as the waters did cover the earth again in Noah's Flood.

Note "deluge" in your quote-(Hebrew 'mabbul' Greek 'kataklusmos'). Deluge is used (OT and NT) 13 times, always referring to the Flood. Therefore the Psalm is referring to the Flood.

You avoid mentioning Isaiah 54:9 which is without any doubt about the Flood.
---Warwick on 10/7/13


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I must say I tire of this nonsense masquerading as Christianity:
Up until 7 thousand years ago there was absolutely nothing! Then Whammo universe ,earth ,flora and fauna and humans. add to this dead people under the ground screaming in pain in a fire and dead people walking on streets paved with gold up in the sky. bears no resemblance to bible Christianity!
---1st_cliff on 10/7/13


chria9396 you said, "It appears I posted in the wrong blog,... since that blog was closed. If I did something to cause its closing, I apologize."
chria9396
Chria, trust me, you did nothing to close that blog. It was closed because of the language that some others were using that was unChrist-like and improper.
Thank for caring. God Bless you!
---Elder on 10/7/13


Wawick, I hate to cut in here but you had mentioned that Gill's exposition of (Psa. 104:6-9) was referring to the flood. I just finished reading it and what it does say is that it was talking about the time of creation. It says the same power Jesus used in creation was the same power He used for the flood.
"At the voice of thy thunder they hasted away, ran off with great precipitancy, just as a servant, when his master puts on a stern countenance, and speaks to him in a thundering, menacing manner, hastes away from him to do his will and work. This is an instance of the mighty power of Christ, and by the same power he removed the waters of the deluge, when they covered the earth, and the tops of the highest hills,
---Mark_V. on 10/7/13


Cliff, Holman's Bible Dictionary says Yom, 'day' has a variety of meanings"

1) Time of daylight-sunrise to sunset Genesis 1:14, 3:8,8:22,Amos 5:8

2) 24hr period Genesis 1:5

3) General expression for 'time' without specific limits Genesis 2:4, Psalm 102:3, Isaiah 7:23.

Relevant to our disagreement Holman confirms I am correct, that Genesis 1:5 defines 24hr day-"And there was evening and there was morning-the first day. As Genesis 1:5 means 24hr day this also means the following 5 creation days are likewise 24hr days.

As I have pointed out to you for ages 'yom' (day) with a number means 24hrs throughout Genesis 1 and in hundreds of other instances throughout Scripture.
---Warwick on 10/7/13


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chria9396, No, you did nothing!
Me and someone else did!
I'm glad to see it go! And not just me, amen!

I can only tell you what I do see.
Gen_1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Since there is no darkness in God, you can see where the darkness came from. God did make anything with darkness.

Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

No one can understand God.
Because to understand God without him. You would have had to be there before him!

Let there be light, is still saying:
Joh_1:5 And the light shineth in darkness, and the darkness comprehended it not.
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/6/13


Warwick, Holman's bible dictionary says:
Day-Chronological period of varying lengths of time.
Daylight from sunrise to sunset.
24 hour period.
General expression of time without limits Gen2.4 Psl.102.3,Isa.7.17
Period of special event Ez.1.28,Zech.14.7,Isa 9.3.
Even points to a time when all time is daylight, night with it's darkness, having vanished!
You see it's not "always" 24 hours!
---1st_cliff on 10/6/13


It appears I posted in the wrong blog, Im not sure, but think that a response to TheSeg on 10/3/13 ended up in the one about instructions for posting in bold, italics etc, possibly because I opened a tab to look up those instructions.

I see TheSeg responded, but only part of the response, since that blog was closed. If I did something to cause its closing, I apologize.
---chria9396 on 10/6/13


In certain parts of Finland the sun does not set for as much as 60 days at a time.
In certain parts of Norway there is no sunset from about Apr. 19th to about Aug.23rd.
At certain parts of the polar circle the sun doesnt set for as much as 6 months. That is the sun only rises and sets once each year.
So how long is a day unless we can understand the language used in scripture to explain it?
A 24 hour period is one day according to the words used in the Bible.
---Elder on 10/6/13


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James the hundreds of examples I gave are the rule. There are usually exceptions to any rule, but in this case only a very very few. And the reason for their exception is given. They are obviously not 24hr days and we are told why.
---Warwick on 10/6/13


StrongAxe, you speak English and you don't know what evening and morning mean? Are you joking?

Evening in English is a translation of the Hebrew 'ereb2' which means, evening twilight, dusk, the fading of the day. Morning is the English translation of the Hebrew 'Boqer2 which means, wait for it 'morning', and nothing else.

A day is measured as the time the earth takes to complete one rotation in relation to a fixed light source. You would have us believe God cannot light the earth without the sun. Where do you get that from?
---Warwick on 10/6/13


Warwick: 'and always indicating an ordinary day'

What about the one or two days in the Old Testament that were NOT 24 hours? The one in the battle in Joshua 10 (clearly stated) and the shadow going back 10 steps in Isaiah 38 - God changed the position of the sun, and so logically the length of the day.

So not ALL days are what you call 'standard days'
---James on 10/5/13


Warwick:

In relation to the SUN, not just ANY light. 500 years ago, it was apparent movement of sun around earth.

God certainly has some way of measuring a day in the first 3 days ...

I DO believe it. He said evening and morning - but didn't say what those words MEAN. NOW they mean sunrise and sunset but COULD NOT POSSIBLY have meant that on days 1-3 because there was no sun to rise and set.

If one looks as increase and decrease of a light source, one measures days if it's the sun, and months if it's the moon. Before either existed, how can you know if the light changed in 24 hour chunks, or 720 hour chunks?

ordinary day.

Days AS WE KNOW THEM NOW, after day 3. But we did not see days 1-3.
---StrongAxe on 10/5/13


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Warwick, My, but you are dense!
God told Adam " In the DAY (yom) that you eat there of you will surely die" Then it says Adam lived 930 years then he died"
If we follow your logic,Adam died "that" day and walked around for 930 years dead!But that's not what scripture says! He died within the yom(period of time designated by God) not within hours of his creation! Good enough for real Christians!
---1st_cliff on 10/5/13


StrongAxe days are measured by 1 rotation of the earth in relation to a fixed light source.

God certainly has some way of measuring a day in the first 3 days and He told us how. You just won't believe it.

Note 'day' is used with a number in Genesis 1. It is used as a singular or plural with a number 410 times outside of Genesis always meaning an ordinary day.

'Evening' and 'morning' are used together without 'day' 38 times outside Genesis 1 always indicating an ordinary day.

'Evening' or 'morning' are used 23 times each with 'day' outside Genesis 1 always meaning an ordinary day.

And 'night' is used with 'day' 52 times
and always indicating an ordinary day.
---Warwick on 10/5/13


Warwick, Faced with this dilemma, (Adam dieing within the 24 hour day) the evangelical fundamentalists "fix" it by saying "Oh well let's say he died spiritually and in that way we can still hang on to our 24 hour day (yom)
This is a classic example of how imagination ,conjecture and wistful thinking becomes "truth" and preached as such with no scriptural backing!
---1st_cliff on 10/5/13


Warwick:

You said:

Cliff, how is the earth lit? By light or course, as since the first ever day.

Yes, but that doesn't help to tell time. Since day 4, we have had the sun, moon, and stars. We measure days by the sun, and months by the moon. However, before day 4, there were neither sun, moon, nor stars - just light. How can you measure days by light? Would you count days, or months?

It's clear that God had some way of measuring days during the first 3 days, but the sun wasn't it.

While the first 3 days MAY have been 24 hours, there is no basis by which one can categorically claim that this was necessarily so.
---StrongAxe on 10/4/13


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Cliff, you are in error. God never has said "periods of time" but defined what 1 day is and used that specific definition for 'day' for all following 5 creation days. Just as man has used day ever since. It is in direct opposition to Gods word to claim there can be no evening or morning without the sun. God says there was and that is enough for real Christians.

As you should know, but apparently it has missed your notice, Genesis 1:14-19 concerns the world post the creation of the sun and moon, and indeed after day four the sun and the moon would indeed light the earth. Therefore your comments are irrelevant.
---Warwick on 10/4/13


Warwick, Again, where was the "fixed" light source on days 1,2 & 3? God is not a "fixed" light source but an "Omni" light! (does not shine in just one area)He stated that the sun was made to count the days (vs 16) !
You err!
There's no possible way to set a 24 hour limit on these days!
As I said before, the 6 yoms of creation was a model used by God to illustrate the 6 of our 24 hour days of work!
What's your problem?
---1st_cliff on 10/4/13


Warwick, Again, where was the "fixed" light source on days 1,2 & 3? God is not a "fixed" light source but an "Omni" light! (does not shine in just one area)He stated that the sun was made to count the days (vs 16) !
You err!
There's no possible way to set a 24 hour limit on these days!
As I said before, the 6 yoms of creation was a model used by God to illustrate the 6 of our 24 hour days of work!
What's your problem?
---1st_cliff on 10/4/13


This is ridiculous, but I'll put in my two cents.

Day, as opposed by night, begins at sunrise or morning. There are actually two definitions: one, the 24 hour period (as in there are thirty one days in March) or, two, daylight or as in daylight hours (let's work on the garden during the day).
---Steveng on 10/4/13


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Cliff, how is the earth lit? By light or course, as since the first ever day.

One day is the time any spot upon the earth returns to the same position in relation to a fixed light source after one rotation. If you fly fast enough you can keep up with the earth's rotation therefore remaining in the light or dark for much longer than if you are in a fixed position. And there was evening and there was morning-the first day refers to a person/s in any position upon the earth.

But of course as you will not agree that one day is one 24hr day I suppose one rotation does not mean one rotation? Gotta be consistent Cliff!
---Warwick on 10/4/13


Warwick, You say ,looking at earth from space, that it is part darkness and part light.
How is the light part lighted?
Problem is that this stays the same while the earth rotates so when/where is it evening and morning? (at any given moment it's always evening and morning) No way to measure the "day" without a fixed point! IE the sun!
Sorry, your argument is not valid!
---1st_cliff on 10/4/13


Without the sun, there's no "evening" or "morning"!
1st_cliff on 10/4/13

What about with Gods word?
Is there an "evening" or "morning"!

Like:
Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Was there one now?
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/4/13


Warwick, I have no issue with the six 24 hr. days that God made law with the Jews.
Using His six creation yoms (periods of time) as a model.
Certainly they could have all been of equal length (as are our days are) but their length has no relevance to the Sabbath law since it was only used as a "model"
:In six days (yoms) God made heaven and earth and all things there in!"
With this interpretation (mine only) there is no controversy!
Without the sun, there's no "evening" or "morning"!
---1st_cliff on 10/4/13


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Warwick, Read Gen.14-19 the fixing of the two "lights".
It says "They" ,the sun and moon, were to "give light on the earth, (not His person!(vs15)
And (vs.16) to mark seasons and DAYS.
They did not mark the 1st 3 days , so the 1st 3 days were "not" normal days of 24 hrs.
---1st_cliff on 10/4/13


Genesis tells us that days begin at sunset. One day is from sunset to sunset.
Jed

No this is what Genesis actually says!
Gen_1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
Gen_1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Gen_1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

There is no sun and there is no sunset!
How can you have a sunset without the sun?

Yet he called the light day, and the darkness he called night.
And the evening and the morning were the first day.
This is what Genesis actually says
Peace
---TheSeg on 10/3/13


Genesis tells us that days begin at sunset. One day is from sunset to sunset. That is why all of the holy days in the new testament were commanded by God to be observed from sunset to sunset, not from morning to morning, or from midnight to midnight. But from sunset to sunset.
---Jed on 10/3/13


Cliff, in Genesis 1:3-5 God created "light" which brought the earth into part darkness, part light (just as we see from space today) "And there was evening, and there was morning the first day."

Put your grey cells to work on what He has written. He says the evening and the morning (evening-darkness begins, leading to morning which leads to the next evening), the day cycle. And He uses this same "and there was evening and there was morning.... for all the next 5 days. Where in this account or in the whole of the Bible does it say they were not all days of the same length i.e. evening and morning 24hr days? I will answer for you "day" with a number is 24hrs throughout the Bible and of course today.
---Warwick on 10/3/13


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Cliff, in defining day in Genesis 1:3-5 God says day begins at "evening" as it still does in the Middle East today. He does not use the "sunset." You have tried to set up a trick question, but failed.

It may be a revelation for you to actually read Genesis 1 rather than get your information from sceptic sites.
---Warwick on 10/3/13


Jesus says He is "the Beginning of the creation of God", in Revelation 3:14. When He rose from the dead, this was at sunrise, it seems to me. So, His day began when He rose from the dead, at sunrise or maybe a little bit earlier.

But there are people whose days start with darkness. And they base their days on where the sun is in relation to the earth. This can be a form of sun worship, to have your timing be decided by where the sun is shining . . . physically.

If we have awakened in Jesus and His light . . . there is no darkness, all is day (c:
---willie_c: on 10/3/13


Warwick, Where did God say He made a "fixed" light source before He made the sun?
God said "Let there be light" and was not talking about a "fixed" light source because He made the "fixed" light sources (sun and moon) on the third day!
God is an "Omni" light not fixed like the sun!
---1st_cliff on 10/2/13


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