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Perfect Sacrifice For Angels

There was a post about the angels not being redeemed because there is a price. Jesus paid the price for humanity. I would pay the price for the fallen angels, if God so chose...

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 ---Ken on 11/2/13
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Markv, I see no where Peter rubbed his hands together with glee making any such statement as Christan, your cohort in your crimes against humanity.

Even God Himself said he did not delight in the destruction of the wicked. So you both say you SPEAK "FOR GOD", yet have not even the same heart of God.

Where did God ask you or Christan to speak such evil in the first place. THAT is what is taking God's name in vain means. YOU are and have broken one of the most important commandments there is. Speaking vanity and lies in the name of God.

Jubilee followed Passover as being an event that only came once every 50 years that the very same people who were at Passover were at Jubilee.
---kathr4453 on 11/14/13


Markv, were you there? the "reason" all were still in Jerusalem was it was still the Jewish Passover that also included Jubilee, a Jewish day also celebrated under Jewish Law. it was the 7x7+1=50 that believe it or not coincidently coincided with WALLAHA! ....no coincidence at all MarkV.

The VERY same people at Passover were STILL in Jerusalem on that 50th day after Passover...The Jews came from ALL OVER.

There are no "coincidences" with God or Pentecost. It was a time in Jewish law where ALL debts were forgiven called Jubilee. Funny, how that very day fell on the very same day as Pentecost exactly 50 days after Jesus resurrection!

You know NOTHING about Jewish Law anyway.
---kathr4453 on 11/14/13


Markv learn something someone else has to share without a viper tongue lashing, but a mere thank you would suffice.

PENTECOST signifies fiftieth, and was used amongst the Jews as the name of one of their most important feasts or religious celebrations. As their fiftieth "Jubilee" year followed a cycle of seven times seven years, so Pentecost, as a jubilee day, followed a cycle of seven times seven days, from the time of the gathering of the sheaf of first-fruits, which was presented before the Lord as a "wave-offering." This sheaf of the first-fruits evidently typified our Lord in his resurrection on the sixteenth of Nisan--he having been slain as the Passover Lamb on the fourteenth of Nisan.-- Lev. 33:5,6,15,16.
---kathr4453 on 11/14/13


Kathr, when you give a passage at least interpret correctly. When Peter accused those there at Pentecost, he was not accusing the very same people who crucified Christ, but he was referring to the men of Israel, Jews, that crucified Christ read (Acts 2:22). Get it correct. Second, those who crucified Christ were not present at Pentecost. Those present came from every nation. Yet it states "Him being delivered by the determined purpose and knowledge of God." It was going to occur, at the moment it did by the determined purpose of God, yet God did not cause men to sin and kill Him.
---Mark_V. on 11/14/13


But here's the kicker, everyone at the crucifixion will be held accountable for that wicked act! Awesome isn't it?

---christan on 11/14/13


Just that comment alone is steeped with HATE, for christan fails to see CHRISTAN's OWN SIN that put Jesus on that cross to begin with. If perhaps he saw that, he would not be so gleeful rubbing his hands together with murder in his beady little evil eyes.

For God SO LOVED the World He GAVE Jesus to die on a Cross for all our sin. Christan shows over and over what a self righteous half wit he really is and how totally ignorant he is of any truth, then wants to give GOD all the GLORY for his lies and self-righteous hate.
---kathr4453 on 11/14/13




But here's the kicker, everyone at the crucifixion will be held accountable for that wicked act! Awesome isn't it?

---christan on 11/14/13


not necessarily christen, Jesus said FORGIVE them for they know not what they are doing, AND we see at the day of Pentecost, Peter accusing those very ones who crucified the Lord. They asked,, WHAT must we do to be saved... REPENT was Peter's answer. and there were THOUSANDS who repented and were saved who will not have to account at all, since they are FORGIVEN and their sin is washed away never to come up before them again! PRAISE GOD!
---kathr4453 on 11/14/13


The Bible explicitly declares to us that the death and crucifixion of Christ was God's will... "For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done."

God moved "the players" to crucify His Son, think what He can do with any of us? You think satan and the sabeans acted out of their own will? Then you must be as blind as a bat even after Scripture says otherwise!

But here's the kicker, everyone at the crucifixion will be held accountable for that wicked act! Awesome isn't it?
---christan on 11/14/13


WE( those saves) have been translated out of this PRESENT evil world into the Kingdom of Jesus Christ, who's kingdom IS NOT of this world.

Those who are not DEAD to this world, that is , "Hidden with God in Christ, and keeping their mind on things ABOVE and not Below," ( meaning here on earth,) are actual enemies of the cross, who mind earthly things.

Calvinism and Calvinists are enemy of the cross.

Just reading the 7 letters in Revelation should be enough warning that satan is alive and well, who will, along with those still part of this world system be the recipients of God's wrath. ( COME out from among them)...is what Christan's scoffing at proving he is one of Satan's half-wits.
---kathr4453 on 11/14/13


And the Lord said unto Satan, "Behold, all that he [Job] hath is in thy power,.."

Who influenced the Sabeans to slay the servants?

Who created the great wind that killed Job's sons and daughters?

Who smote Job with sore boils from the sole of his foot unto his crown?

Now Satan, being an angel, can cause things to happen like all angels.

Who shut up the mouths of the lions while Daniel was in the lion's pit?

Who were the angels that possessed the man in the graveyard?

Who spike through a mules mouth?
---Steveng on 11/13/13


Ken, Do you not have a better way of wasting time than posing meaningless questions such as this?

Do you think GOD will change HIS Mind because you feel the way you do about the fallen angels??

Sympathy For The Devil
---Gordon on 11/13/13




Dear Christian. My GOD is so loving and so caring that He seeks to save all the lost. He does not anyone to be destroyed in hell. He is so good that He does not make people commit terrible sins. He is so merciful that he destroys the wicked instead of torturing them for all eternity.

He says what He means in scripture and we do not have to twist His words to get them to fit our doctrine.

Agape.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/13/13


What a sad god you worship! Your god entertains the whims and fancy of a creature which my God declares was created for destruction. Your god is like you - weak, useless and beggarly (he hopes sinners will choose him to be saved), how pathetic.

My God's awesome. He does as He pleases. In His eyes mankind is "reputed as nothing", not to mention satan and his cohorts.

In Luke 20:30-32, you've demonstrated as usual erroneous understanding of the Word. Was Christ really going to give up His elect to satan? Impossible! When Christ prayed, He was praying as the man Christ, not as God. Just as He did in John 17 to the Father before His crucifixion. That's why we pray! God does not pray to Himself. Duuhhhh.......
---christan on 11/13/13


Jesus gave Satan permission to sift Peter as wheat. SIFT again is testing. Jesus told Peter, "I will pray for you"
kathr
AND JUST WHERE IS THAT WRITTEN?

And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, I have given Satan permission to sift you as wheat.
Stop it!

Isnt this (what is written!)
Luk_22:31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, (Satan hath desired) to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

Stop dreaming!
Write the truth, and not what in your heart!
Peace
---TheSeg on 11/13/13


Jesus gave Satan permission to sift Peter as wheat. SIFT again is testing. Jesus told Peter, "I will pray for you".


Why would Jesus need to PRAY FOR Peter if Peter is a puppet?

Jesus was tempted in all ways LIKE WE ARE so that Jesus could be that perfect example we follow when we are being tempted/tested.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


here it is , look up the word sift in strongs.

So, unless YOU TOO have been sifted Christan, on what authority do you have to go around to try to strengthen anyone?
Luke 22:30-32

30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

31 And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


"God gave Satan permission to do whatever it takes to to have Job curse God." steveng

To say that God gave satan "permission" is to say satan asked God if he could inflict Job with sufferings. You'll find it real impossible to find a verse in Job 1 where satan did such a thing in asking God "permission".

All satan did was to "tempt" God (verses 10,11) like he did with Christ in the temptation episode in Matthew 4. Test Job's faith satan did, but he couldn't take Job's life as commanded (verse 12) by God.

"Ye shall not tempt the Lord your God..." Deuteronomy 6:16, and satan did precisely that, many time over.
---christan on 11/13/13


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James clearly says, when you are tempted, it is NOT GOD. So what Christan is actually accusing God of is not only lying here, but duplicity in dealing with His creation.

Christan and the whole of Calvinism is accusing God of duplicity in every single thing done. That's the most evil thing that one can say about God. It completely twists and distorts EVERYTHING God's word teaches and tells is, making the WORD one big joke.

Look up the definition Christan.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


christan: "Satan in Matthew 4 was doing precisely what God had "purpose determined before to be done."

Read the book of Job. God gave Satan permission to do whatever it takes to to have Job curse God. Satan did whatever it took to have Job curse God. Satan did it. And if you look around you Satan is doing everything he could to destroy God's creation and have christians curse God even the elect, if that were possible. God will intervene just before Satan destroys everything.
---Steveng on 11/12/13


steveng, if anyone's out of context, it's you and your cohorts. Heard that half truth is no Truth?

The account of Matthew 4 hinges on verse 1! Mind you, that applies to what happened in Genesis 3.

You're so hung up on the devil's work that you forget it's God who's behind everything making Him an awesome God.

Is it fact the Pilate and the Jews murdered Christ? Of course! But is that the whole story? NO! It happened because, they "were gathered together to do whatever Your hand and Your purpose determined before to be done." That's 100% Truth!

Satan in Matthew 4 was doing precisely what God had "purpose determined before to be done."
---christan on 11/12/13


The Holy Spirit drove Jesus into the wilderness, BUT Satan in the wilderness brought Jesus to the very top of a mountain and told Jesus if Jesus would worship him, Satan, that him, Satan, would give Him, Jesus all the Kingdoms of this world. Jesus refused.

One day Satan will make this same offer to anti-Christ who will accept. Then out of all the kingdoms of the earth, people will take the mark of the Beast who is over all these earthly Kingdoms. One of those kingdoms is called "Calvinism".Then we see in Rev 11, the Kingdoms of this would HAVE NOW...((that moment has not come yet, it won't come until the 2nd half of the 7 year tribulation, when the Kingdom"S" of this world)) become the Kingdom of our Lord and Christ.
---kathr4453 on 11/11/13


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christan and Mark V: "Get your facts right before you try to witness the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Otherwise your christ is nothing but a false christ you're witnessing."

Christan, you are taking the verses I gave out of context. Read Matthew chapter 4, verses 1-10. Pay close attention to verses 8 and 9.
---Steveng on 11/11/13


"The devil took Jesus to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor." steveng

Really? The devil?

"Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil." Matthew 4:1

Get your facts right before you try to witness the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Otherwise your christ is nothing but a false christ you're witnessing.
---christan on 11/11/13


Ephesians 6:12
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.


Steveng, even with scripture after scripture, these guys are so engrained in their brainwashing of Calvinism, that the pat answer to ALL statements. "God is sovereign who controls even every move his puppet Satan makes."

That's as far and as deep as their shallow understanding will ever go.
---kathr4453 on 11/11/13


Steven, you keep saying the same thing over and over. You say that God has ultimate control and in the same breath you say Satan is ruling. If Satan is ruling God does not have ultimate control. You had said before that Satan had complete control of those on earth when the Bible says about God,
"..For His dominion is an everlasting dominion, And His kingdom is from generation to generation. All inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing. He does according to His will in the army of heaven and among the inhabitants of the earth, and none can stay His hand" (Dan. 4:34,35).
Either God rules or Satan rules. And I take God over Satan.
---Mark_V. on 11/11/13


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Mark_V.: "Steven, like Eve, you believed the devil and not God. Here you give to proof that satan has a lot of authority,"

Again, you have taken my posts out of context. I have always written that God has complete and ultimate authority, But, for now, Satan has authority here on earth. Then, in the end, God will intervene in human affairs and put an end to Satan's madness - as written in the bible.

I have provided you with plenty of verses yet you still don't believe what I post or don't you believe the words of God?
---Steveng on 11/10/13


Steven, like Eve, you believed the devil and not God. Here you give to proof that satan has a lot of authority,
"The devil took Jesus to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. Satan said: All this I will give you if you will bow down and worship me."
You believe Satan in that passage didn't you? You believe his words. Don't you realize he is a liar, and the master of lies? That he said those words is true, that those words were true in not true. Did you forget that Jesus Christ is God? The whole creation belongs to Him.
Jesus is the same yesterday, today and forever.
---Mark_V. on 11/10/13


Markv, ALL Christians are partakers of the sufferings of Christ, and as He was tested, leaving us an example to follow.

The fact that you are asking this question YOU personally have never experienced, let's me know you are not saved Markv.

Our trials and testings are a TOKEN from God that we are saved of which ALL His children are partakers? THOSE WHO suffer with Him, you will also be Glorified together with him.

Where is YOUR Token?

Like Christan, you only ask questions you use to set someone up to try to destroy. You've never asked one sincere question with an honest and humble heart TO LEARN from others.

Don't take the bait Samuel.
---kathr4453 on 11/10/13


christan: "Satan chooses? Really? Where does it say in the Bible that satan has the power to choose anything?"

Satan surely had the power to do a number to Job and his family, eh?

The devil took Jesus to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. Satan said: All this I will give you if you will bow down and worship me.

Be alert and of sober mind. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.

So, Satan cannot choose, eh? You really need to read the bible to know the real power of Satan.
---Steveng on 11/9/13


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Samuel, I went back and checked to what you had to say and you said,
"When we are tempted we are being tested to see if we will follow GOD or own will. To see if we will follow in the footsteps of JESUS crucifying ourselves or giving in to temptation and sin."
By who are we being tested? And for what reason? Is this test given to everyone that is tempted? I know you have an answer are you would not have said what you did.
You see if you say God is testing us, why would God have to test us, since He knows all things already? He is Omniscient.
---Mark_V. on 11/10/13


It's interesting you use the verse, having a form of Godliness, but deny the power.

Yes, I do need to TURN away from you Christan. Also after two or three admonition so REJECT. Sounds cold right. WRONG!

You have denied the POWER OF HIS RESURRECTION, that only comes to those who are crucified with Christ and THEN raised a NEW creature, called being BORN from above or Born Again.

And since you have climbed
Over some other way, cursing the saints over and over and over, and truth over and over and over, ..I reject you, totally reject you and your false doctrine.

Yep, THAT is how God gives you up....after knowing the truth, you trampled it, as many like yourself have ....and GOD gave you up.
---kathr4453 on 11/10/13


The sad part about some of you Calvinists here on Line here is this childish display of CURSING your imaginary enemy, and laughably take scripture out of context to use to chant your witch-craft.

But even as satan also used scripture against Jesus, satan LOST big time.

The reason I totally reject you Christan is 1) it's a command from God to do so,

And 2) anyone who uses the Word of God as a weapon against ANYONE to hurt and destroy is the devil.

You have totally abused the WORD of God, who is God. ONLY a devil would do that.
---kathr4453 on 11/10/13


9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death,

THIS, the very heart of our faith Christan rejects completely, in word, deed, and truth. If obeyed, and known, and realized daily, is the opposite of those described in 2 Timothy 3....arrogant, boastful, disrespectful, full of PRIDE..read it...it ALL describes Christan's character in detail.

Thank you Christan for exposing yourself through scripture.
---kathr454 on 11/10/13


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I just simply love these verses, "Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith. But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as their's also was."
2 Timothy 3

How true...
---christan on 11/10/13


Christan, because you totally changed the subject here to who knows what , it's clear you have no understanding of this conversation, unless of coarse you are just throwing up a smoke screen also like Markv does showing you are clueless, yet want to look like you know something.
---kathr4453 on 11/9/13


"Please study to show yourself approved..." Really? Approved to who? You?

Paul warns, "This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come... For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away. Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.

But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as their's also was."
2 Timothy 3
---christan on 11/9/13


Christan, the verse in Acts that God said to Paul is cross referenced to this verse in Hebrews.

Please study to show yourself approved, and for once, listen to what others have to share. THROUGH Christ the power of death SATAN holds is broken.


Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same, that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil,

15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels, but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
---kathr4453 on 11/9/13


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Having "power" equates to one having the ability to do as they will or please? That's how much you understand and know the Truth.

Did Pilate have "power" on earth? Sure he did. But when he came up against Christ, he tried boasting but was put in his place when Christ simply declared, "Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above...".

Was Christ referring to this "above" as satan or His Father? Numerous verses have been presented of how erroneous your thoughts are and you continue to act like Pharaoh with a hardened heart.

And guess whose hands is in this hardening process? Exodus 4:21 will enlighten you on this Truth of the Gospel.
---christan on 11/8/13


To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me. ---kathr4453 on 11/6/13

Is this the verse that you are thumbing your arrogant nose against God's TRUTH?

Satan is also called the prince "and power" of the air, this world or this age.

But in the "ages to come", he will not be.

Your arrogance shows you have no personal testimony at all. Just brainwashed programmed replies you all learned from your master.

If you have a problem with the WORD OF GOD, discuss it with Him in private, and stop showing your ignorance in public.
---kathr4453 on 11/8/13


Satan chooses? Really? Where does it say in the Bible that satan has the power to choose anything?

Jesus told Pilate, "Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above..." John 19:11 - even the act of crucifying His Son was of God's will and purpose, confirmed by Peter in Acts 4:27,28

"For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done."

Did Peter say it was satan or God who gathered the wicked?
---christan on 11/8/13


Steven, your claimed Satan was doing all sorts of things to individuals, when he doesn't have to do anything but watch his children do all the work. Jesus told those who claimed they were Abraham's children and had one Father God, "If God were your Father you would love Me," then he told them they were not able to listen to His Words, because their father was the devil and the desires of their father they wanted to do. They didn't know Satan was their father, yet they were doing his desires.
Satan is not God, only God can change the children of Satan to godly children. None of the unsaved can change their own nature no matter how much free will they believe they have. They are children of wrath until God says they are not.
---Mark_V. on 11/8/13


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Satan does not need to be everywhere at once. All he needs to do is to choose leaders that have control of a large group of people. And many times most people will follow an evil person not knowing that person is evil. Look at Stalin, Lenin, Hitler, Amin, al-Bashir, Berdymuhammedov, Mugabe, Gaddafi, Mussolini, Pol Pot, Hussein, Jong il, Mao, Shwe, Abdullah, Jintao, Khamenei, Afewerki, etc. And there are more to come.
---Steveng on 11/7/13


Christan, as you too do, so does Markv! twisting and accusing someone of saying something they never said. No one ever said satan tests everyone. James certainly didn't either.

You guys are too much.

Things on earth are NOT as it is in heaven. That prayer I's for the millennial Kingdom reign, when satan will be bound for 1000 years, THEN and only then will things on earth be as it is in heaven.

There is no evil in heaven, yet we see evil TODAY on earth.
---kathr4453 on 11/7/13


Brother MarkV, you said this to a particular blogger "You are declaring that Satan test everyone", who's been a constant torn to you.

Many forget that the Lord's prayer is to the Father and no one else. In that prayer, we are taught,

"And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen."

Question here is, who's in control 100% of the man's will? The man himself or God Almighty? Definitely not satan.
---christan on 11/7/13


Paul's commission from God....I love these verses :

Acts 26:16-20

16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee,

17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,

18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


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---Samuelbb7 on 11/6/13

Exactly Samuelbb7.

MarkV, please stay on the subject you first argued against. You look Schizophrenic when you jump from one thought to another subject.

no one was interested in your opinion of those who believe in free will, or who you consider saved or lost based on free will.

again, stay on the subject and don't AGAIN try to hijack the blog to go play in your tulip garden. I'm very sorry Calvin never knew this side of Christianity so he could at least have informed you. BUT you only know what you have been taught by man, and not God.
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


2 Corinthians 4:4
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.


This time though I must correct you, the god.. that is little god of this world is SATAN.

there is no typo in that verse, and no version of scripture CAPITALIZES the G..I mean g in god of this world. WE ALL know the god of this world is SATAN.

God blinded ISRAEL's Eyes for a reason.

I just needed to CORRECT YOU!
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


Kathr, it's not your question that is stupid. We know Satan is not Omnipresent, everywhere at one time, he would have to go to each individual to blind them, and millions are born each second. Here's why people did not believe Jesus, it is written:
.
Lord, who had believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed? Therefore they could not believe because Isaiah said again:
"He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, lest they should see with their eyes, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them"
(John 12:37-40)

We're told it was God who blinded the eyes of men. I know God is Omnipresent, every place at one time. Seems you believe in Satan?
---Mark_V. on 11/6/13


No Kathr, you are the danger to others who want to know who saved them. You want them to believe it was by their own doing, their own free will. Many who believe in what you say, are already blinded as you are. Those who are going to be save by God, will not listen to you. Calvinism is not in question, your false doctrines and heretical views of Jesus Christ are. But you do not believe the Truth,
"He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, Lest they should see with their eyes, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them"
God has blinded your eyes and hardened your heart.
---Mark_V. on 11/6/13


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I must apologize MarkV. I did not make myself clear To me tempting is testing. A number of Biblical Scholars agree to this.

When we are tempted we are being tested to see if we will follow GOD or own will. To see if we will follow in the footsteps of JESUS crucifying ourselves or giving in to temptation and sin.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/6/13


MarkV, SATAN asked to sift Peter as wheat. The Word SIFT is in Strongs with its meaning G4617 . It means to TRY also known as TEST ones FAITH. So you need to continue to study to show yourself approved, or else download this into your Calvin WATSON mainframe.
Unbelievers have no faith to be TESTED and tried Markv. And James is not talking to unbelievers, but to BELIEVERS. And Peter also was a believer when Satan asked Jesus if he could sift him as wheat..

MarkV, it appears you are missing out on one of the most important parts of our Christian experiences leading to MATURITY.
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


Samuel, if you had read my answer to Kathr, you would have found out that I was not speaking about a person been tempted. She said Satan test you, not tempts you.
But lets speak of temptation, So what you are saying concerning temptation is that every time you are tempted to sin, it's the devil, am I correct? Really? Every human being is tempted to sin, and Satan cannot be at all places at one time. So temptation does not come from Satan, but from within your sinful nature.
Now concerning testing, Satan does not Test anyone. What for? What is the purpose of testing people? And how many does he test? Really? before you answer back at me read the context.
About Spurgeon, he was awesome. Great wonderful godly man.
---Mark_V. on 11/6/13


so Markv, are you also disagreeing with God that SATAN has blinded peoples eyes. Busy guy that Satan huh?? going around to billion and billions individually one at a time blinding their eyes.

Ask a stupid question, you get a stupid answer!
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


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Samuel is correct. and I did not misunderstand markv either. He actually believes he is so special that he is exempt form testings, because in Markv's mind God created robots and know exactly what they are going to do, because they are programmed to do exactly as programmed. they even believe they are programmed TO sin, if God so wants them to, having and taking NO PERSONAL responsibility for their own actions.

That's the danger of Calvinism.
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


So Markv you are never tempted to sin. For that is what you are saying. Now I like to read Spurgeon and get a daily devotional from him. He talks about how Christians are tested when they are tempted to sin. He a Calvinist says you are wrong.

Now you say you cannot be lost and Spurgeon agrees with you. But he speaks of the destruction that the Devil can cause in your life by us failing the tests.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/6/13


Kathr, for your information Satan is one individual. His not Omnipresent like God. you say,
"Now my understanding with Markv is Calvinists are "exempt " from this testing. I guess they just miss out on that Crown promised to those who have endured."
You are declaring that Satan test everyone. You are indicating the billions of individuals in the world. What test does he do to them? Does he talk to them? Does he make them do what he wants?
Why would he have to do anything? The lost are doing the will of their father the devil without even knowing they are doing it. Why test them? The believers are doing the desires of their Father God. They are protected by God. What would be the purpose of testing them?
---Mark_V. on 11/6/13


1 Peter 5:10
But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle you.


Correction, Peter said this. James said something similar at the end of James .

But it is funny, that all these apostles, Paul! James! Peter , Hebrews, even Jesus etc tell us the exact thing...that the EVIDENCE of being called into His Eternal Glory leads you on the road to suffering.

That's how we also know the gospel of prosperity is a lie from hell. Or someone saying WE the Elect are EXEMPT...another lie from hell.
---kathr4453 on 11/6/13


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RICHARDC: "Steveng - luckily in this country we don't have bow down to any President,..."

Soon, RichardC, soon.
---Steveng on 11/5/13


Jesus told Peter that satan had requested to sift Peter.

Satan tested Jesus 40 days in the wilderness . Jesus went through that FOR US leaving us and example of suffering, also stated in James chapter 1, again saying in the end, that God is not the tempter of evil.

Those who are OVERCOMERS are those who have OVERCOME satan and all his temptations of and in this world.

Now my understanding with Markv is Calvinists are "exempt " from this testing. I guess they just miss out on that Crown promised to those who have endured.

James also states after WE suffer, as Job, God then will establish, strengthen and settle us.

To be strengthened by might in the inner man comes through testing and trials.
---kathr4453 on 11/5/13


Ken, your question makes no sense. without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sin. Is your blood spotless? and how would your blood do them any good? Not even Jesus blood can redeem an angel.

Why would anyone want to pay the price for the rebellion of angels, who were created by God and lived and served God for who knows how long before they chose "with eyes wide open" "individual self willed rebellion". Satan's rebellion did not impute sin to other angels. EACH stand condemned of it's own individual rebellion. How would you choose which one to pay the price for? Even if possible, Your price would not pay for ALL the Angels.

In Adam all sin. Not the same with Angels.
---kathr4453 on 11/5/13


RICHARDDC, "God gave permission to satan"? To say God gave satan permission is to say that satan asked God if he could inflict Job. Is that the context of Job 1:12?

Let's see - "And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power, only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord." Nope, it doesn't say God gave satan permission.

Rather, God restricted satan and said "all that he hath is in thy power, only upon himself put not forth thine hand". Meaning, satan couldn't take the life of Job even if he wanted to.

Sounds more like a command rather than God giving "permission".
---christan on 11/5/13


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Steveng - luckily in this country we don't have bow down to any President, Laws of the land are to be follow, Unless they Go against the laws of God:

Romans 13:1 - Every person is to be subject to the governing authorities, For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. ( NASB )
---RICHARDC on 11/4/13


RICHARDC: "1 Peter 2:13 - Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, wether it be to king, as supreme,.."

You surely are taking this out of context. Would you submit to man's law to bow down to an image of the president? (and it's getting to that point now as almost every law being proposed by the federal and state governments is a law to outlaw christianity)

As I have said before that God has ultimate control, but is giving full reign to Satan to do his work on earth for his time is short.
---Steveng on 11/4/13


Hi, Shira (c: Where I say "his humans", below, I mean, not Christians, but humans who along with the fallen angels are with Satan > they are so conceited that they feel they are too good for Jesus.

And I think I understand what you mean > that it is conceited for people to decide they are chosen while others are not.

After all, Jesus died with hope for all > "the whole world," we have in 1 John 2:2.

And Jesus calls to "all" > "'Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.'" (Matthew 11:28)

But there are both "free will" and "predestined" people who do not obey Jesus in His "rest for your souls." (Matthew 11:29)
---willie_c: on 11/4/13


Bryan, here again is another incorrect answer you gave. I find that what you do is preach by making comments that are not biblical. You say,
"God gave it to man, and man gave it to satan. How could this be? Adam believe God until he believe satan and that is when he sinned."
Man gave Satan authority? Where did you hear that?
Then you said, Adam believed God then he believed Satan. But He did not believe Satan, Eve did. Adam was not deceived, Eve was. Mankind was cursed by God because Adam disobeyed Him. Adam blamed God for giving him the woman (v.12)
"Then the man said, "The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I ate"
---Mark_V. on 11/4/13


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The answers to the Question who gave man authority on the earth is in Genesis, And the answer to who gave satan authority on the earth is in Genesis to. God gave it to man, and man gave it to satan. How could this be? Adam believe God until he believe satan and that is when he sinned. And satan still deceiving people to this very day about what God has given them. As for Job Look what God called Him, Not what he called himself. Cause when he understood what God called him that is when he got every thing back. Job chapter 42, 1,2,3,4,5,6
---Bryan on 11/3/13


Steveng - What satan did to Job

Job 1:12 - And the Lord said unto satan behold all that he hath is in thy power, only upon himself put not forth thine hand, so satan went forth from the presence of the Lord,

( God gave permission to satan )

Bryan - Who gave man authority on Earth ?

1 Peter 2:13 - Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, wether it be to king, as supreme,
2:14 - Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers , and for the praise of them that do well,
---RICHARDC on 11/3/13


Who gave man authority on the earth? Who gave satan authority on the earth? How did Jesus have authority on the earth? John 3:5. Born through water and born of spirit. The first of many brethren Romans 8:29. Yes you are born again so give your spirit the tools to stop the works of satan on the earth. That is your right as a believer in Christ Jesus.
---Bryan on 11/3/13


Steven, when will you understand that Satan is not dividing anything. He is making you believe all that rubbish. Do you understand that it is sinful humans who do the dividing? They are doing the desires of their father the devil. Satan is only setting there watching them do stuff for him.
He doesn't push or shove anyone to do anything. In fact he is a ghost, and invisible spirit. Who is not even omnipresent. In the minds of the lost, he is their god and they don't even know it. Stop giving him credit for all sorts of things. God is in control of all things, even the tempting satan does.
There is no redemption for angels, those saved are always saved, those lost are always lost. Jesus redemption is for the sins of human beings.
---Mark_V. on 11/3/13


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Bryan: "Jesus kicked them off the earth cause they don't have the right to be here either... To be on this earth legally you have to be born on it,.."

The "right" to be here? Take a look at the world around you, Bryon. Satan is still here wreaking havoc. Satan has had over 2,000 years to infiltrate the church and divide it into tens of thousands of denominations each having their own rituals, traditions, ways of living and interpretations of God's word. All the prophesies concerning the end days are here today and Satan has only a short time left before Jesus' return. What Satan did to Job you see a million times worse as in the days of Noah.
---Steveng on 11/3/13


willie, I appreciate your post but satan knows God is the only God. after all, God kicked him out of heaven. I don't know what conceit you means as far as Christianity is concerned. true Christ-like behavior is not conceit but those who think they were chosen by God while others go to hell saddens me. that is not a humble heart
---shira4368 on 11/2/13


\\ If anyone loves what the saints loved before, the Latin Mass, Catholic truth and real morals, he will suffer and be shunned by most Catholics and the world.\\

I don't know where this came from. My apologies to one and all for the confusion.
---Cluny on 11/2/13


As it is written:

"For since the beginning of the world men have not heard, nor perceived by the ear, neither hath the eye seen, O God, beside thee, what he hath prepared for him that waiteth for him.

...behold, thou art wroth, for we have sinned: in those is continuance, and we shall be saved.

But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags, and we all do fade as a leaf, and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

And there is none that calleth upon thy name, that stirreth up himself to take hold of thee: for thou hast hid thy face from us, and hast consumed us, because of our iniquities."
Isaiah 64:4-7

O how noble thou maketh thyself sound.
---christan on 11/2/13


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Angels don't have the right of choose. They are created to serve God only. That is why they were kicked out of heaven down to the earth and the reason Jesus kicked them off the earth cause they don't have the right to be here either. They do not get here though water. John 3:5. To be on this earth legally you have to be born on it, just like it will be in heaven you will have to be born again to enter heaven. Gods' rule.
---Bryan on 11/2/13


if God so chose . . . yes, amen

But Satan and his angels feel they are too good for Jesus. This is quite a conceit problem, not what will make them able to share in the loving which we have in Heaven. So, not only would they need to be redeemed, but they would need to get over their conceit. And they have not done this.

Jesus, for us humans, "is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but for the whole world." (in 1 John 2:2) But ones are so deeply ruined in Satan's conceit, that they feel they are too good for Jesus. So, his humans, also, are refusing the redemption which is available > to "all", with even "rest for your souls." (Matthew 11:28-30)
---willie_c: on 11/2/13


\\ If anyone loves what the saints loved before, the Latin Mass, Catholic truth and real morals, he will suffer and be shunned by most Catholics and the world.\\

There is a story about a demon who appeared to a holy man and asked him how he could be saved.

The hermit was surprised at this question but prayed about it. God told him that all the demon had to do was bow down three times and say, "Lord, forgive me and have mercy on me for Christ's sake."

The demon replied, "I REFUSE to do that," and disappeared in a puff of brimstone.

I suppose that's the essence of being a demon: refusal to humble oneself before God.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/2/13


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