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What To Do For Salvation

When someone asks you, "What must I do to be saved", how do you answer their question?

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 ---David on 11/9/13
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Matthew, Markv doesn't believe those verses you put, (by the way are excellent) because to him they are saving yourself by your own FREE WILL.

Calvin's doctrine to him is far superior to Jesus words.

I'm sure you'll hear his wrath on the verses posted as he rips them apart with foam coming out of his mouth.
---kathr4453 on 11/20/13


John 3: 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Luke 9: 23 And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.

Acts 2: 38 And Peter said to them, Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Romans 10: 9 Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
---Matthew on 11/20/13


Samuel, good story. But no where in Scripture does it say He gave us the right to choose Him. The will of fallen men is not for Christ. They are free to do everything except come to Christ. Their heart does not want to.
Example: Jerry hates to hear me speak about God sovereignty. Nothing can change his will to think otherwise, yet he is free to do so many things, but his will, will not change against God's soverignty. why? because he cannot change his own heart concerning the will of God. "God has to change his heart before he can agree that God is Sovereign and does what He wills to do with His creation." So he is free, but his heart is in bondage to his own ideas and so opposes the will of God on His creation.
---Mark_V. on 11/20/13


Dear MarkV

The almighty GOD came as a baby in a manger grew up with people trying to murder him. He live the live of a poor man in a town not known for being followers of GOD.

He walked in our shoes for over thirty years and then choose the death of the worst kind of criminal. He choose to take our sins and died in our place naked on a cross. Which caused many then and now to look at him as weak and worthless.

His death does not make him weak and allowing us to choose does not make HIM weak.


1Cr 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures,
---Samuelbb7 on 11/20/13


MarkV: I see you have hijacked yet another blog with your stupid anti-free-will rant. You are a cancer on the CN website. Get a clue. Your beef is with your Freewill Baptist brothers - not with the rest of us. What do you call yourselves anyway? The slave-will Baptists or the robot-will Baptists? Give it a rest. We don't care!





---jerry6593 on 11/20/13




Markv, Your are a silly little woman in Need of attention, who will try to get it anyway they can.

If you could read, and understand what people are saying, rather than making up lies, I wouldn't mind having a conversation with you, but you are a mentally challenged person in need of a specialist who can work with mentally challenged people.

I will not answer or validate your lying tongue. You do this solely for an evil purpose.

If you can show where I said I saved myself by my own free will, then that will be the only way you can be excused...otherwise, I'll see YOU at the great white throne judgement, where you will have to stand before all the saints and acknowledge your lying, and why YOU never made it .
---kathr4453 on 11/20/13


Kathr, you now say,
"
well, I guess markv just doesn't listen. our will FREE or not does not save us. So again markv is accusing people of believing something no one believes anyway."


You and many more believe that. You said, your own words, you came to Christ out of your own free will. You believe that because you said it. And so has everyone else. If you are denying that, you are lying again as always.
Your own free will is your will. Not by God's will.
All of you have made it very clear, that God cannot force His will on you, He has to get your permission. which is nonsense. Garbish, I call that, an Almighty God who needs the permission of sinful man.
---Mark_V. on 11/19/13


Kathr, you stated:
"Starters, Calvin believed at the judgement seat of Christ he would have to stand before a TRIBUNAL." and you called him a liar. That we don't understand. I explain to you that all believer will appear at the Judgment Seat of Christ and you called Calvin a liar. then you say I do not understand what others say. you said it, now you say it is true.
Why did you not cut an paste exactly what he said? Instead of accusing him and other of not understanding.
I know little about Calvin, but you know even less about him. Study his teachings, then you can have something to say.
---Mark_V. on 11/19/13


All believers stand at the Judgment Seat of Christ. You don't know because you do not understand the Truth. Only believer go there not for the sin, but for rewards or losing rewards, not for judgment since their sins have been taken care of at the Cross. Unbelievers stand at the Great White Throne of Judgment for sentencing.

---Mark_V. on 11/18/13


EXACTLY Markv, and it seems CALVIN didn't see that truth.

If perhaps you read what I stated you would see I also stated the Believer would NOT have to account for forgiven sin. Therefore NO TRIBUNAL is necessary.

and IF perhaps you investigated more of Calvin's nonsense, you may find more nonsense than that one, and CUT HIM LOOSE!
---kathr4453 on 11/19/13


Markv, what is the gift of God and how do we get it? You still haven't answered my question how one is saved. What I'm Trying to understand is it just handed to the few elect? Did you stumble upon it? Were you forced? How did you know you were of the "elect"? Were you ever a sinner? I know we are saved by faith but is salvation forced on the "elect"?
I'm really trying to understand your reasoning behind your elect theory.
---shira4368 on 11/19/13




Ya know Markv, I believe 99% of arguing here with you is due to your lack of comprehending what people are writing. You find a "word" here and there, not reading the post thoroughly and PRAYING ABOUT it, somehow process a word here or there through your own twisted mind making up something never said.

SLOW DOWN and learn to read markv, and believe me, you won't have so many enemies based on your false attacks.

You use these false attacks and then call everyone heretics based on your unsanctified twisted mind.
---kathr4453 on 11/19/13


Kathr, you are correct, our will has nothing to do with faith. Markv said people who feel free to accept salvation or reject it are bragging. I always brag on God. He gave me the opportunity to believe in Him just as He has given everyone.
---shira4368 on 11/19/13


Many of you are boasting it was by your own free will.
---Mark_V. on 11/19/13


well, I guess markv just doesn't listen. our will FREE or not does not save us.

So again markv is accusing people of believing something no one believes anyway.

Faith has NOTHING to do will our will.

Try again markv.
---kathr4453 on 11/19/13


Shira, you asked again "how do sinners get saved?"
We are saved by Grace through faith. The Grace of God. (Eph. 2:8,9).
"For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast" Salvation is all of God. Grace through faith, a gift of God, Why? so that no one can boast when it comes to salvation. Many of you are boasting it was by your own free will.
Now how did that happened?
"But God who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ, by grace you have been saved.." (Eph. 2:4,5).
---Mark_V. on 11/19/13


The gospel message is talking exclusively TO sinners. When Paul went to Rome, his instruction from God was to preach the gospel so that it would turn people from Satan to God Paul didn't TURN them, the gospel message did.the GOSPEL opened their eyes.

If they already belonged to God, that verse would make no sense.

Markv constantly uses sanctification scripture to prove his argument. BUT Markv does not understand justification comes BEFORE sanctification.

God JUSTIFIES the ungodly, right there in their ungodliness. No scripture says God Justifies a preselected re-birthed regenerated person.

THAT is at the heart of Markv 's false teaching. A "regenerated" person is NOT an ungodly person.
---kathr4453 on 11/19/13


Trav,

A single word rarely gives context but the words AROUND that single word.

So, Trav, cite a single verse that unequivocally proves the Flood was local.
---Marc on 11/18/13

Research usage of word over 1,476 times, as land for context, yourself. One should never use a "single" verse. Scriptural witness should be in multiple....freeing one from poser preachers, false doctrine opinion.
Gen 4:4 for example. Was Cain driven from the erets,"planet" or land?
Did locust/frogs cover the entire planet?
Will it take over 40 boats to handle all the "Known" animals/food, etc.
The flood was real and did what it was intended to do....to Noah's un-perfect generations.
---Trav on 11/19/13


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markv, how do sinners get saved? first one has to know he's a sinner so actually God is speaking to the heart of an individual. once being in my sin, I knew God was speaking to me. Ive told you this a humpteen times. I could have rejected the pricking of my heart but I chose to go to altar and repent and be saved. no matter how you say it or believe it, God talks to sinners.
---shira4368 on 11/18/13


David, there is no reason for me not to believe your testimony. I myself do not question what happen to you. When the Spirit brings us to spiritual life, the light of Christ comes on. We see ourselves for who we really are, sinners in great need of Christ. The unsaved do not see any of that. They have no need for Christ nor do the seek after Him. So I have no right to question what you say concerning what happen to you. I don't even question Steven G, salvation, only what he teaches concerning the devil as creator and in complete control of all the earth.
Peace I leave you.
---Mark_V. on 11/18/13


Blogger: Wow! I hadn't heard that God had put you in charge of judging everyone's salvation. Give me a break. Infant baptism as a precursor to salvation? I'll bet you can't find that in the Bible.






---jerry6593 on 11/18/13


markv, yes I have posted things about my family but you go out on a limb with your beliefs and you are just begging someone to contradict you then you tell them why you are right. most people on chritianet knows Christ died for every single person so you set yourself up for ridicule. one thing that stands out is I told you I would pray for you and you quickly came back with don't pray to "your" for me. G was not capitoled. I wasn't making fun, I was serious in praing for you. God bless
---shira4368 on 11/18/13


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kathr, you have no clue what you are talking about. Here you say,
"Starters, Calvin believed at the judgement seat of Christ he would have to stand before a TRIBUNAL." then say: He had no understanding that his sin was done away in Christ, and NEVER to be brought up again."
You have no understanding what he was talking about, because your looking for trash, not the Truth.
All believers stand at the Judgment Seat of Christ. You don't know because you do not understand the Truth. Only believer go there not for the sin, but for rewards or losing rewards, not for judgment since their sins have been taken care of at the Cross. Unbelievers stand at the Great White Throne of Judgment for sentencing.
---Mark_V. on 11/18/13


God had to pick you to be a member of his family billions of years before he created the universe. Salvation is by YHWH's invitation only. Saying the sinner prayer will not help. If you don't believe in infant baptism you have been damned any way.
---Blogger9211 on 11/17/13


David, in light of your last post here, you asked Markv a question, how does he know he is saved. You said then you would look int Calvinism for that answer.

Starters, Calvin believed at the judgement seat of Christ he would have to stand before a TRIBUNAL. He had no understanding that his sin was done away in Christ, and NEVER to be brought up again. AND on his deathbed, was under so much conviction of his teaching, that he said Jesus died for the sin of the whole world! and asked forgiveness.

Did Calvin have a death bed salvation? He claimed he was regenerated at his infant baptism, and held to that RCC teaching to his death. He murdered Anabaptists who believed in BELIEVERS baptism...go figure.
---kathr4453 on 11/17/13


Mark
The sign given to me is found in (1 John 3:9-10)KJV.
That's how I know.

It happened in an instant 6 months after my 41st birthday.
I don't expect anyone to believe me because there are very few who experience it. I wouldn't believe it either, if I had not experienced it for myself.

I had battled with a particular sin since I receiving the Gift of the Holy Spirit at 24 years old, and on the day I was born of God that sin was removed from my heart and my battle with sin ended on that day.

The reason many say they are saved, but really don't know if they are saved, is because they have put their trust in the word of men, and not in the word of God.

---David on 11/17/13


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You said: Hebrews 9:15-17 shows we must give testamony of what we were before our death and after we were born - spiritually.

We are saved by Jesus, not by our knowledge about Jesus, and not by our testimony of how he saved us.

Look at the Final Judgment in Matthew 25. Jesus is concerned with our compassion, not our theological knowledge, or our great works done in his name (and that would include testimonials). Not that these are bad things in themselves, but they aren't what save us. He is.
---StrongAxe on 11/16/13


Mark_V.: "...I rather stay out of the personal stuff if I can. I do answer some personal questions but not many."

You attack most people personally on a daily basis.

As for your post on 11/16/13: give it a break for six months, take a sabbatical.
---Steveng on 11/16/13


Cluny: "As I frequently say, our faith should be in Christ Jesus, and NOT in a theory about how He saves us.

The two are NOT the same."

How he saved us is biblical:

Hebrews 9:15-17 shows we must give testamony of what we were before our death and after we were born - spiritually.
---Steveng on 11/16/13


Mark_V.:

The David on here who appears to be a Jehovah's Witness evangelist signs his name as David followed by four digits (which I can't recall at present), and his posts are quite easy to identify, as he injects an extremely strong anti-trinitarian bias into almost every post.
---StrongAxe on 11/16/13


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David, I was not throwing dirt at you if even if you were the David that use to be on line who was a Jehovah Witness. And since you are not that guy, so be it. You say you heard about me, of course you have, from many. So let me ask you that very simple question. "How do you know you are saved?" Can you explain how you know? Thanks

Shira, I know you have posted many thing about your personal life, I never saw anyone attack your family, and what you do and where you go. You are not me. When I give personal information out as you can see some picks something to criticize, so I rather stay out of the personal stuff if I can. I do answer some personal questions but not many.
---Mark_V. on 11/16/13


Mark
Aren't you throwing dirt on me by continuously calling me a JW?
I have had numerous discussions with you and when you do not want to answer a simple question, you call me a JW. And I have told you on those numerous occasions, I am not a JW.

I asked you the simple question, "How do you know you are saved, if as you say, God only knows who is saved?
I was just curious as to your answer, since I am ignorant of the answer.
I just thought you might have an answer, since you follow the teachings of John Calvin.

I'll look it up to see if Calvin has an answer.
---David on 11/15/13


PART 1

MarkV, elsewhere, typically omits important contexts.

1. Omits John 1:12 i.e. "as many as received him, to them he gave the right to become children of God". If it were God's capricious will, this verse would be nonsense, unless you're an insanely cruel Calvinist.
2. Omits John 3:36 "He who believes in the Son has everlasting life, who does not believe shall not see life". Without choice, this is nonsense, unless you're an irrationally sadistic Calvinist.
3. He reduces Romans, the greatest philosophical work EVER written (I ought to know I have a degree in this discipline), to a mere, what?, single sentence.
---Marc on 11/15/13


PART 2

MarkV misrepresents Ephesians 2:8, as Calvinists are pleased to do. If both faith and salvation were the gift, no one could actually "physically" boast. It's the gift and plan of salvation which is what people can wrongly boast about by believing it can be gained by works. See verse 15. Paul goes on to write in ch. 3 that there is no more mystery. Mark's Gnosticism, as Kath rightly pointed out, wants to return the gullible to that mystery.

You're a fool MarkV. If that were all, no problem, but you're a danger to the young in Christ who can "be cheated through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the traditions of [Calvin]."(Colossians 2:8)
---Marc on 11/15/13


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markv, I have given as much personal info here also. I named my church here, my daughters name and my sons name. I shared with christianet how my daughter passed away with brain cancer and that I'm a cancer survivor. people even know where I live and some know I am visiting texas.
---shira4368 on 11/16/13


David, I would answer you but I have given enough personal answers about me. To much information about me causes the wolves to lick their chops. I answered where I go to church, and the confessions of faith the church teaches, and it did not take 24hrs for someone to find dirt on what I said. I gave a personal answer about one of my sons, and another person pick up dirt on what I said.
Why don't you ask a Scriptural question concerning God and His Word and I will answer you. I don't want to know how you believe you are saved, or your personal life, it is not important to me.
If you are the same David who is a Jehovah Witness, that is fine with me.
---Mark_V. on 11/15/13


Mark
How do you know God has saved "you"?
---David on 11/15/13


As I frequently say, our faith should be in Christ Jesus, and NOT in a theory about how He saves us.

The two are NOT the same.

Glory to jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/14/13


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kathr believes in free will. God gave us that will and He will never force us to accept Him. there aren't many calvanist on christianet. I know of only 2. markv, and Christian. I believe they are the same people. one chose the other to back him up with this "elect" stuff.
---shira4368 on 11/14/13


Mark_V.: "the unsaved do the will of their father the devil."

Two questions:

Do you believe that the unsaved can be saves?

Do you think christians can save others?
---Steveng on 11/14/13


David, you asked,
"I noticed in your comments to Kathr you said, "I was saved by God"," That is correct, God saved me.
But then asked, "but in your answer to me you said, "Nobody knows who was chosen by God."" That's correct. I don't know for sure who is saved and who isn't. All I can do is judge others by their fruits. Many claim they chose Christ, which is impossible without God making them able. People go to the alter because of pressure from others. Husbands because the wife tells them, later to see there was no change in his life. Some are in the process of being saved by God and don't even know it. Genuine believers have a true love for Christ. Not a love that fades away.
---Mark_V. on 11/14/13


The problem that everyone has is that they don't want God to have the right to choose whom He wants to save. Mark_V. on 11/13/13

Mark
I agree with this statement, many believe they were saved when they were baptized or said a sinner's prayer.

I have heard the testimonies of many believers who claim they were saved the day of their baptism or when they said the sinner's prayer.
If this was so, they were saved by what they did, and not because they were chosen by God.

I noticed in your comments to Kathr you said, "I was saved by God", but in your answer to me you said, "Nobody knows who was chosen by God."
If nobody knows, how do you know God saved you?
---David on 11/14/13


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Steven, here is a lesson for you, Jesus Christ is God. The Father is God, the Holy Spirit is also God.
Look it up on line. Jesus said "I and the Father are One" Jesus also said, "If you have seen Me you have seen the Father"
Before you criticize me read the Bible.
---Mark_V. on 11/14/13


Elder, (John 3:18) does not ask anyone to make a choice. Those who believe are not condemned. Those who do not believe are condemned already.
You say:
"If God forced salvation there would be no repentance." God doesn't force salvation, He bestows repentance. Grants it to all who are made spiritually alive. "God may perhaps grant that they will repent and come to know the Truth, and they may escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will" (2 Tim. 2:25,26). the unsaved do the will of their father the devil. "Then God has also granted to the Gentiles repentance to life" (Act 11:18). It is needed. Man will only repent if the Holy Spirit convicts him of sin.
---Mark_V. on 11/14/13


John 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotton Son of God.

This believing is a choice action or lack there of. There is a choice to believe or not.

If God forced salvation there would be no repentance. This is MarkV's position. He is claiming salvation apart from repentance.

Matt 9:13, Rom 2:4, Mark 1:4 and others show us that repentance is needed.

Faith comes by hearing the Word of God, Rom 10:17, not because God forced something on us.
---Elder on 11/13/13


Mark_V.: " got saved by God, I did not exercise my free will because I did not have one, my will was dead in trespasses and sins."

God did not save you, Mark V. God the Father and Jesus are saviours. Jesus came to earth to save people, to preach about the Kingdom of God and how to get there. If God saved you there would be no purpose for Jesus to come to earth. He doesn't choose who to save or who not to save. He came to earth to preach the Word of God and it's your choice to accept it or not.

God and Jesus aren't the only saviours, each christian is a saviour to help populate the Kingdom of God. When you preach and that person chooses to follow Jesus and worship God then you have "saved" that person from hell.
---Steveng on 11/13/13


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To Kathr from MarkV, "You did it all by your own. Did Satan make you speak evil? No he didn't. you do it all on your own. Did you hear that? Satan is not making you, you do it all on your own."

Here again is a guy who says one thing one time and another later to suit his dribble.

Now, all of a sudden, Kathr has a freewill, "she does it all on her own." So MarkV how do you reconcile these statements of yours. Or are you just confused because.... sniff, sniff.... ugh, because... sniff... everyone, sniff, sniff.... attacks you, the lil' confused whiner.

Hey Mark, how can you blame her for doing this if she doesn't have a freewill?
Read your own flip flop words, Mr John Kerry.
---Elder on 11/13/13


Markv, what you said has nothing to do with free will vs no free will. You claim you had no will at all. Do you have one now? A conscience, personality, intellect, emotions? So you say now and then you are/were not allowed to use these at all? or they just didn't exist? Are you now given "a will" to use? that is intellect, emotions, personality conscience?

Free or not free has NOTHING to do with what the WILL in a man is.

It's all this nonsense you add to words that makes your comments hilarious.

Now some may say even today MarkV you have "NO WILL" at all even today.

That would be a personal opinion though.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13



1. John 1:13
Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God..
OK first, even if Adam had never sinned, Adams still could not of himself be BORN OF GOD. So there is no such thing as a will becoming extinct at the fall rendering man then with no free will to rebirth himself. But without any sin was capable of rebirthing himself???? . Your argument Markv is nuts. But many will buy it, because they dont even know what the will of man is to begin with
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


my will was dead in trespasses and sins.
---Mark_V. on 11/13/13

Please back that up with scripture. please show through scripture that your WILL, that is your conscience, personality , and intellect totally was extinquished at your physical birth. Were you a vegetable? Dog crap? a maggot?
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


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Kathr, I got saved by God, I did not exercise my free will because I did not have one, my will was dead in trespasses and sins. I was heading to hell and God, who is rich in mercy and because of His great love with which He loved us, made me alive together with Christ. He gave me faith to believe, granted me repentance, and I was now able to see, hear and believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. We are explicitly told that by the grace of God we are saved,
"For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is a gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast" read (Eph. 2:4-10).
What you guys do is boast all the time, even get angry. You want to take the glory that only belongs to God.
---Mark_V. on 11/13/13


David, was said
"One is not saved by working, but one works BECAUSE they are saved." you asked:
"According to Jesus in (John 14:23), what comes first?" You asked what comes first. Here is what comes first. "If anyone Loves Me" Only those who believe by faith love Jesus, "We love Him because He first loved us" Continues with, if you love Him you will keep His word and the Father will love him, and both Jesus and the Father will come to him and make their home with him. Because He says,
"He who does not love Me, does not keep my words, and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me." Those who don't love Him don't keep His word.
---Mark_V. on 11/13/13


Markv, sounds like you stiffed your face with "TWINKIES" this morning. Sugar overload causes "diminished capacity" in one's ability to act normal.

We'll all be praying for you MarkV.

Please get help before it's too late.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


Kathr you say,
"Satan wants to wear out the saints, and has used someone, or two online here to try to do just that. Know who,they are, and what Satan's purpose is in them." Satan has nothing on the Saints.
Satan did not put you on line. You did it all by your own. Did Satan make you speak evil? No he didn't. you do it all on your own. Read what Jesus said
"Why do you not understand My speech? ( here is the answer) because you are not able to listen to My Word" Not able, Jesus said, No ability to listen. Then He says"You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do" Did you hear that? Satan is not making you, you do it all on your own.
---Mark_V. on 11/13/13


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david, marks believes in a fairy spirit that regenerates/ born agains only the elect so they won't go to hell.

Calvinism even goes as far as saying people will end up in heaven surprised they were one of the elect.

For all we know Hitler could be there now, having never placed his own personal faith in the Finished works of Christ to be saved, that is SET FREE from sin and death. The evidence would actually be the transformation in Hitler's life. But Calvin murdered too, so there ya go. NO CHANGE is necessary...just keep your fingers crossed. Good Luck!

It's a crazy doctrine and a cult.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/13


David, let me say first that the problem that everyone has is that they don't want God to have the right to choose whom He wants to save. They want themselves to have that right.
As to your question, no one knows who is chosen by God. How can they know what God chose from before the foundation of the world? All descendants of Adam are born dead in sins even the chosen one's. Spiritually dead to God. They have been condemned already, heading to hell. Nothing they can do can stop their journey to hell. Only a supernatural act of God can stop anyone from going to hell.
---Mark_V. on 11/13/13


Mark v
I have never quite understood what you believe about salvation. Perhaps you can help me gain a better understanding.

If someone was chosen by God while they are still in the womb, how do they know they were chosen? What sign are they given so they will know?
---David on 11/13/13


The question is answered exactly how Peter answered it, being filled with the Holy Spirit on the day of pentecost, "REPENT and believe on The Lord Jesus Christ " is what God requires.

And the Holy Spirit was given to those who OBEYED those words.


Satan wants to wear out the saints, and has used someone, or two online here to try to do just that. Know who,they are, and what Satan's purpose is in them.

Try picturing Jesus on the cross cursing everyone who said anything bad about Him. It just didn't happen.
Now look at the actions of someone who provokes, then uses it to curse others. TOTALLY opposite of Jesus Christ.
---kathr4453 on 11/12/13


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You miserable, ignorant man MarkV. You rip verses from context, then distort them to your cruelly heretical notion of God.
Paul's talking about men's inability, Jew and non-Jew, to save themselves through LAW and that God's salvation is demonstrated apart from LAW. This salvation plan is through "faith in Jesus Christ to ALL who believe". (Romans 3:22) It'd be tautological to say God gives faith so those whom he caused to believe can believe.

Ephesians 2:8,9, again context. You're saved by God's grace i.e. his salvation plan (also see verse 5). You have faith in his gift of salvation, that Christ can redeem us from death and works.

Again, your false God, could save all but won't. MarkV, it's you who doesn't know God.
---Marc on 11/12/13


Actually Marc makes and excellent point that has not escaped the minds of those who's minds have been renewed and have the Mind of Christ, and not the mind of Calvin.

What is interesting and most revealing about markv is how markv curses anyone who points out how illogical the Calvin doctrine is, showing cultish behavior rather than christian behavior which would RESPOND,..."well Gee Marc, let me meditate on that and I'll get back with you after praying and asking the Lord for wisdom in this area...(and not looking up a smart aleck answer from the great come-backs of Calvin. )



---kathr4453 on 11/12/13


Marc, you know nothing about spiritual matters, you say,
"..it obviously escaped Mark's attention - is that God rewards "those who diligently seek him".
Only believers seek God. The unsaved (Rom. 3:11)
"There is none who understands. There is none who seek after God" You forgot the Word of God. Dead people do not seek after God, they are dead, spiritually dead to God in trespasses and sins. They cannot breath walk talk or hear. They need for God to make them spiritually alive together with Christ for them to have faith. Faith is a gift of God.
"For we are saved by Grace through faith, and that not of yourselves, not of works, lest anyone should boast" #Eph. 2:8,9#.
---Mark_V. on 11/12/13


steveng, you said it like no other. many people try to work for salvation. boy are they in for a rude awakening. just knocks holes in some denominations.
---shira4368 on 11/12/13


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One is not saved by working, but one works BECAUSE they are saved.

Steveng
According to Jesus in (John 14:23), what comes first?
---David on 11/12/13


MarkV writes: "God has to give you faith in order for you to call on the name of the Lord." He then quotes Hebrews 11:6, which mentions nothing about God having to give faith to someone. Oddly, from that verse - because it obviously escaped Mark's attention - is that God rewards "those who diligently seek him". Does it make sense that God would reward those whom God has caused to seek him in order that they be rewarded? Only if they freely seek him, as the verse states, does reward make any sense.

The logic of my argument will, quite naturally, escape Mark, but now it's not about Mark but protecting the naive and gullible who will swallow Mark's corrupt and pagan theology.
---Marc on 11/12/13


David, you said,
"I asked this question because there are a great many folks in our churches today who believe they are not saved by what they do. And to them, Paul's teaching means they don't have to do anything to be saved."
Steveng is correct. We work for God because we are saved. Remember (Eph. 2:10). once we are saved, Paul tells us,

"For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" This was all prepared by God. As believers we believe that God saved us for that purpose. And since all believers are spiritually baptized into the body of Christ, God the Spirit gets the glory for what we do.
---Mark_V. on 11/12/13


David: "I asked this question because there are a great many folks in our churches today who believe they are not saved by what they do."

One is not saved by working, but one works BECAUSE they are saved. Meditate on James 2:14-26
---Steveng on 11/11/13


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David, I believe the disciples let Jesus' words speak for themselves.

I would encourage someone seeking salvation to read Matt 19 and John 3 where Jesus teaches the rich young ruler and Nicodemus the answer to this very question. I would also have them study the book of Revelation so that they might see that those born of the Holy Spirit have followed Jesus and done exactly as He instructed, giving us proof that nothing has changed since He spoke those words.

All one can do is point them to the Truth and the rest is up to the Holy Spirit and their willingness to study, hear and see for themselves.



---barb on 11/11/13


David - this is where context matters and an understanding of how Paul wrote his letters. Paul always in some form led with the gospel and the freedom from works righteousness for example Romans 1-7, Gal 1-4 to show grace righteousness. Then only then did he move to works from (key word) righteousness to Romans 12 "Living sacrifice", friuts of the Spirit (Gala 6) etc. This is the same message that Jesus gave in the gospels "I forgive (salvation) ... go sin no more".
---Scott1 on 11/11/13


Hi, David (c: That question sounds a little bit different than your first posted blog question (c:

I can't speak for those people, what they mean.

I'll just offer > there is what we must do > repent of our sins and trust in Jesus. We need to be turned "from the power of Satan to God" (in Acts 16:28).

But I understand God in us changes us and works in us so we succeed in doing this > "for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure." (Philippians 2:14)

We do what we do . . . like how a glove does what the hand in it has it doing (c: Without the hand inside, the glove is helpless and dead.
---willie_c: on 11/11/13


I asked this question because there are a great many folks in our churches today who believe they are not saved by what they do. And to them, Paul's teaching means they don't have to do anything to be saved.

If their interpretation of Paul's letters, on this matter were true, why did the Lords disciples tell people what to do, when they were asked this question?

Your thoughts on the matter????
---David on 11/11/13


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Shira, you claim you do not have to be one of the elect to be saved, and claim that with God all things are possible. You forgot to mention that with men salvation is impossible. So how can you call on the name of the Lord without faith? It's impossible. God has to give you faith in order for you to call on the name of the Lord.
"But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him" (Heb. 11:6)
concerning the unsaved, "there is none who seeks after God" (Rom. 3:11).
In order for the unsaved to seek after God He needs for God to give him faith. That is why with God all things are possible.
---Mark_V. on 11/11/13


christianet, with God all things are possible. Call upon the name of The Lord and thou shalt be saved. So for once you are right saying with God all things are possibles scripture does not say. ....elect will call on whoever because we are already saved. See how stupid that sounds?
---Shira4368 on 11/10/13


After hearing the gospel, one must believe, repent of one's sins, be baptised with water and of the Spirit - this is the foundation. One must continue to grow in Christ, mature in Christ, minister in Christ which is the growing of the vine. For every soul one saves from death would cover a multitude of one's sins.

Over all, Love, genuine love, is your ticket to heaven - the love of God and the love of others.

Be careful, though, for some verses say only believe, some say one must be baptised, and some say both. But it is not a matter of only believing because even Satan believes that Jesus exists and is the son of God.
---Steveng on 11/10/13


"What must I do to be saved"
David I would simply reiterate what the disciples said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household. Act 16:31 While offering what I personally believe the word "believe" to mean in the contexts of salvation.
---Josef on 11/9/13


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Believe in Jesus Christ, The rest of of the word come after the salvation. Not before, but after they are saved. Then I ask them, do you want to know more about Jesus? Some say yes some walk away. Content knowing Jesus just saved them.
---Bryan on 11/10/13


I pray and trust our Father to have me say what He wants. He may want me to only give a part of what He will have people telling the person.

Basically . . . I ask what the person already understands about being saved.

I may talk about how the Bible says we "first trusted in Christ", in Ephesians 1:12. And talk about how one needs to trust Jesus and how He died on the cross for our sins and in order to reconcile us to God.

And then I might talk about what the person is to seek and expect as a new Christian, including how the person can learn from Jesus "and you will find rest for your souls." (Matthew 11:29)

And say to be always open to learning and growing more, "as a child".
---willie_c: on 11/9/13


Simple, tell them the Truth - "When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?

But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.!"
Matthew 19:25,26
---christan on 11/9/13


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