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Every Person Is Precious

Recently I adopted "Every person is precious" as my daily outlook, and it has brought amazing peace. If all lived by it, I believe world peace could come, because we would not use putting down others to lift ourselves. Would God agree?

Moderator - Cool way of looking at people.

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Eternal life in hell?... The Scripture clearly says, yes - eternal death in the Lake of Fire.
christan

First we did not teach that rich go to heaven and the poor are lost. That was taught by the Sadducees and some churches today.

Well I am glad you agree that sinners die in the lake of fire. It seemed that you taught they were alive and being tortured in the lake of fire.


(the "fire is not quenched".

How wrong you are! A Christian never ever forgets about Christ resurrection...
christan

Quenched means cannot be put out. Does not mean it does not go out from lack of something to burn.Mal 4:3 Yes you remember the resurrection of Christ. You ignore our resurrection.
---Samuelbb7 on 12/23/13


"We do believe in hell or the Lake of fire. The same kind as burned up Sodom." Samuelbb7

"Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched." Mark 9:44 - I have news for you, the fire that destroyed Sodom isn't going to be the same "fire" prepared for the reprobates in hell. The fire at Sodom was quenched whereas the one in hell, the "fire is not quenched". One's earthly the other eternal.

"I also pointed out JESUS spoke more on the resurrection which you ignore."

How wrong you are! A Christian never ever forgets about Christ resurrection and that's because his hope lies in the faith God has given him to remember Christ conquered death.
---christan on 12/22/13


"I did not state that the Bible teach the rich go to heaven and the poor do not. I said this is taught." Samuelbb7

Since you admitted it's not taught in the Bible, why then do you teach this outside of what is not taught in the Bible? Isn't that the definition of heresy?

"What we do not believe in is eternal life in Hell. We believe in eternal death in hell."

Eternal life in hell??? Goodness, is that what your SDA tells their followers that such a thing is even being taught? The Scripture clearly says, yes - eternal death in the Lake of Fire.
---christan on 12/22/13


And the SDA are not heretics? Ya right. christan

It is right we are not heretics. We do believe in hell or the Lake of fire. The same kind as burned up Sodom.

Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner,..., are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

What we do not believe in is eternal life in Hell. We believe in eternal death in hell.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death...

I did not state that the Bible teach the rich go to heaven and the poor do not. I said this is taught.

I also pointed out JESUS spoke more on the resurrection which you ignore. I even proved it by pointing out which word is used more often.
---Samuelbb7 on 12/22/13


Marc, honesty means to be honest, and you are not honest. You want to change the subject for your own personal reasons. Jesus spoke more about hell then anyone else did in the Bible. You try to turn that around. But it does not change the Truth in anyway. It is you who is not honest.
But you have a reason, that has nothing to do with the subject. You reason is that you are dishonest is because you keep bringing Calvinism into the subject that has nothing whatsoever to do with Jesus speaking about Hell. And since you could not prove anything, your resort to more name calling. You need to check where you stand with God not with me, it is God who saves souls, and it is God who spoke more about hell then anyone else.
---Mark_V. on 12/22/13




MarkV wrote: "And you could never proof anyone else talked more about hell then Jesus."

Yes, Mark, I agree: I could never "proof" this - but I could PROVE it. Just read your Bible and count the verses. But of course, for a deluded Calvinist, that would be too much to expect. It's called honesty.
---Marc on 12/21/13


Family,may your hearts be open: neighbor "Patty" ( not real name) Recently last 3 summers we talked re: the Lord.
she had a bad habit beg anyone for nickles,dimes..
I got to know her .She' like" a little girl everybody threw away!" emotionally challenged,she often was thrown out the stores!
She talk re: her childhood, foster homes, no love!
She was deprived of just things, we women need on a daily basis.

if she saw me. I call her doctor for her.She couldn't handle a fon..

She was often beaten by men,too! Now found dead. it really struck me! Please pray for her daughter - very wayward,evil!
She beat her mother.

Mom is gone. NOW I pray she seek the Lord give her life to Christ..
---Lidia4796 on 12/21/13


Marc, you talk a lot and make many things up just to accuse me of something. Talk is cheap. Here you said:
" Second, several were against the sanctimonious leaders i.e. people, like MarkV, who, as in Jesus' day, prided themselves as part of the elect, separate from the unsaved majority."
Don't just talk, give proof of what you say. No matter how many times hell is mentioned, it is still mention. And you could never proof anyone else talked more about hell then Jesus. Since you did not have an answer, you resort to more slandering as many others do when you have no answers to the Truth.
---Mark_V. on 12/21/13


Marc, both you and Samuelbb7 claim to "believe" in the Word of God and yet you tear it apart with your foolish questions.

The Word of God is One, meaning both the OT and NT are One. And we know that the One person both the OT and NT speaks and reveals is the Lord Jesus Christ.

So does it really matter if Solomon spoke more about hell according to you than Jesus? The fact that it's the Holy Bible that speaks about hell is more than enough for me to believe that there's a hell to come.

Move on!
---christan on 12/20/13


To JMarc, I left a post did not
on the December'2013
concerns me you still beg forgiveness,it
my post polite,
wondering you were mistreated?

So sorry! christmas,etc.
You get depressed!
Me,too long ago.
some had died, moved,etc.

I'm ok. can't cry always.
I apologize, maybe misunderstood.. with all respect ... why?

the word "abomination"??
people are rude to kids at Christmas

wounds do not heal instantly.
Don't be so,hard on yourself.

I respect your difference of opinion, just the word abomination.."harsh "not getting the point.
God bless you.Lidia4796
---Lidia4796 on 12/20/13




The Synoptic Gospels REPEAT the same hell verses. You don't include them twice. Second, several were against the sanctimonious leaders i.e. people, like MarkV, who, as in Jesus' day, prided themselves as part of the elect, separate from the unsaved majority.

Therefore, Solomon talked more about hell.

Usually, a story's point's at its end. Luke 16:31 is the story's point i.e. Jesus' resurrection with Jesus' ironic twist.

Re eternal punishment, John 16:8,9 says, according to Calvinism, God created these people for unbelief, God caused them to sin, therefore God sent them to eternal torment because God wanted them to suffer this eternal torment. This is MarkV's theology. Praise be to God for men like Mark V who speak for God.
---Marc on 12/20/13


samuelbb7, you're so fixated with how many times hell is mentioned that you have failed to prove your point that it doesn't exist nor it was spoken of in the Bible. Even if it was mentioned once, truth be told, there's a place call hell.

No Christian doubt or ignore the resurrection of Christ at all. In fact, that's where our hope lies.

You said, "That is ignored because of the teaching of GOD torturing people for all eternity which is not in the Bible."

Really? "Then shall He say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." Matthew 25:41

And the SDA are not heretics? Ya right...
---christan on 12/20/13


\\The word hell is mentioned 15 times in the King James Gospels. In the NASB that is reduced to 11 times.\\

And in the missing 4 times in the NASB, is "hades," "sheol," or other words used in these places?

Don't forget that the KJV translated several different Greek and Hebrew words with different meanings all by the one word "hell".

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/20/13


The word hell is mentioned 15 times in the King James Gospels. In the NASB that is reduced to 11 times.

The Word resurrection is mentioned 43 times in 41 verses in the NASB and 41 times in the KJV.
Mar 12:18 Some Sadducees (who say that there is no resurrection) *came to Jesus, and began questioning Him, saying,

Yet many people speak of Hell but not the resurrection. That is ignored because of the teaching of GOD torturing people for all eternity which is not in the Bible.

So if how often speaking on a topic is important. Why are so many concentrating on punishment?
---Samuelbb7 on 12/20/13


Trav,
Here we agree.
We disagree on much, but I pray that we both keep searching for the pearls and the morsels found in His Word.
---micha9344 on 12/19/13

Ah...love your attitude. Even the Apostles disagreed as men are prone to do. We agree that YAHshua is Lord. So we agree on the foundation "stone" of the house. The brick and mortar the Prophets.

It was a man I really didn't like to much that provoked me to look deeper. (Lord please bless him without measure)

Provocations. May those sheep provoked and found by truth grant me forgiveness for the same.
Rom 11:14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.
---Trav on 12/20/13


Marc, you say,
"Perfect! The number of verses which mention hell are very small. The number of verses mentioning love are almost innumerable," In the Bible the number of verses that mention hell are small compared to the passages that speak of Love.
That was not what we were talking about. We were talking about how many times Jesus spoke of hell, and Jesus spoke more times about hell then anyone else in the Bible. Get it right.
---Mark_V. on 12/20/13


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"The parable has two main points. One rich are not automatically saved and the poor are not automatically lost." samuelbb7

When in Scriptures does it even teach in that salvation is even dependent on whether you're a rich or poor person? Is that how God saves?


"That latter when the real Lazarus would be raised from the dead even then those who claimed to believe the scripture still would not believe."

Where in Christ's account of Luke 16:19-31 teaches what you have claimed it to be? SInce when believing in the Gospel of Christ has anything to do with us believing in Lazarus rising from the dead? Shouldn't it be in the resurrection of Christ?
---christan on 12/19/13


Parables are basically about God and His creation, here being man. It refers to all mankind of how fallen short they are before the glory of God Almighty.

Notice in parables, it always speaks about only two kinds of vessels, honour (the faithful) and dishonour (the unfaithful) toward the master, who's God.

Luke 16:19-31 is definitely not about the future but about one who dies immediately and what would possibly happen to you:
- after death, the soul does not wonder around but is either taken to Hades or Paradise immediately.
- that hell is real regardless of how little it's mentioned in the Bible as compared to love.
- it demonstrates God does love and HATE or there would be no hell.
---christan on 12/19/13


Trav,
Here we agree. The blind will only see the story. Those that have been given sight can see the true depth.
We disagree on much, but I pray that we both keep searching for the pearls and the morsels found in His Word.
---micha9344 on 12/19/13


Many here seem to be under the impression that parables are not true accounts...
---micha9344 on 12/19/13

You said it just right.
I'd be surprised if there is not one parable that is not about actual characters....past, present or future.
The names of these participants are not necessary except in the future tense of Abraham and Lazarus.
The understanding participants are who is being spoken too. They recognize the story.... about them and others.
Mat 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
Mat 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not, .....
---Trav on 12/19/13


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The Parable of the Rich man and Lazarus is listed by many scholars as exactly that.

Soul are not bodies but in the parable the rich man has a body in torment and wants water and Lazarus has a body to give him water.

The parable has two main points. One rich are not automatically saved and the poor are not automatically lost.

That latter when the real Lazarus would be raised from the dead even then those who claimed to believe the scripture still would not believe.

Lastly Abrahams bosom was a phrase used then and is found in other stories not told by JESUS.

What is wrong in using a story to prove a point. Nathan did it with David?
---Samhuelbb7 on 12/19/13


Many here seem to be under the impression that parables are not true accounts to begin with and are just being used for a deeper meaning.
Jesus, knowing the accounts of all who have lived, or will live, has a vast wealth from which to pull. He doesn't have to make things up, although he could.
---micha9344 on 12/19/13


Micha,

Perfect! The number of verses which mention hell are very small. The number of verses mentioning love are almost innumerable, yet the Bah Humbug Calvinists want us to believe that Jesus was going around preaching about hell at every opportunity.
---Marc on 12/19/13


Verses 1 to 12 in Luke 16 was about the parabale of the dishonest steward being reprimanded by his master for cheating (notice no names were mentioned - but parables are always about the master and servant - just like God and the sinner).

The bottom-line of verses 1-12 is anchored by verse 13. To which Christ likened the Pharisees to be lovers of mammon and pretending to serve God, which is impossible as verse 13 says.

Verses 15 to 18 speaks of "unfaithfulness" (also still related to v1-14) which is summed up in 18. Symbolically, marriage is pointing to the final perfect marriage between Christ and His bride (His people).

Verses 19-31 is no more a parable as particular people with names are mentioned.
---christan on 12/18/13


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..... you say it's a parable but you still can't answer what that "parable" is teaching.
---christan on 12/18/13

A parable with historical/language reference. At the time and now for those who call their father Abraham. Judah/Benjamin.
Judah/Benjamin retained the married name Israel and are the rich man. Lazarus represents the divorced North House of Israel. The preceding verses 16,17,18 set the marriage context. Pharisee's should realize by Moses and the prophets the release from the first marriage but, won't even though one rose from the dead.
Even to this day.
Lazarus...hebrew name:
#8219, #770,zar
El-aw-zar'
A primitive root, to surround, that is, protect or aid: - help, succour.
---Trav on 12/18/13


Marc, you classifying the existence of the soul and spirit of the man is a delusion doesn't even make sense. For throughout the Bible, God the Spirit speaks about the soul and spirit - so how is it even a delusion.

This is a delusion: that the soul and spirit ceases to exist after the man dies in the flesh even though it's testified of by Christ in Luke 16:19-31 explicitly that it isn't so.

Granted to you for the sake of discussion, that you say it's a parable but you still can't answer what that "parable" is teaching. Because if you were right, than the dead rich man had no right to have a conversation with Abraham. Meaning, you're calling Christ a liar to even bring this subject up.
---christan on 12/18/13


Hell references (KJV) minus obvious repeats.
Moses 1 (Deu)
David 8 (2Sa,Psa)
Job 2
Solomon 7 (Pro)
Isaiah 6
Ezekiel 4
Amos 1
Jonah 1
Habbakuk 1
Jesus 10 (Mat,Luk)
Peter 1 (2Pe)
Verses where Jesus addresses the "religious holier-than-thou types" 2 of 10.
Do not sensationalize to support your view, especially if your are right. It only degrades the Truth.
---micha9344 on 12/17/13


Asking Christan to unpack his position I received the following response: "Explaining to you would be a waste of time, for Scripture says, "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned."

It must be great to know that one is blessed with a super-duper spirituality. Ever considered the possibility that you are deluded, in need of some assistance of the psychological variety, and even deceived by a spirit? Probably not: super disciples would never have that problem because they are specially anointed by God...just like all the cults like to tell us.
---Marc on 12/17/13


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Why does heaven and hell need to be spoken in parable?
---christan on 12/16/13

Joh 10:6 This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.
Mat 13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not, and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
1Sa 28:13 And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth.
1Sa 28:14 And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up, and he is covered with a mantle.....
1Sa 28:15 And Samuel said to Saul, Why hast thou disquieted me, to bring me up?
---Trav on 12/17/13


Marc, finally you admitted yourself, be it sarcasm or truth, you spoke correctly saying "Can you clarify all of this for us unbelievers".

What you're really admitting is God isn't real to you and that's because none of us can see Him or hear Him, right? So when Christ spoke about the souls of the rich man, Lazarus and Abraham - they are to you simply fables, unreal, untrue and basically unbelief.

Explaining to you would be a waste of time, for Scripture says, "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." 1 Corinthians 2:14
---christan on 12/16/13


Christan,

Let me get this straight. You believe that the rich man's soul actually spoke from hell and even saw Abraham's soul who was in heaven. You believe that, literally, Abraham's soul then spoke from heaven and had a lengthy conversation with the rich man's soul in hell. You also believe that this is not a parable, just on the basis that a Lazarus (which Lazarus?) was mentioned by name. Can you clarify all of this for us unbelievers, we who clearly aren't as spiritually gifted and closer to God as you seem to regard yourself as being?
---Marc on 12/16/13


"He was telling this story to the Pharisees (v.14)." Marc

Goodness! Verse 14 was in context of verses 1 to 14 with regards to the parable of the dishonest steward. Christ was rebuking the Pharisees about being covetous. "Open your heart" when reading!

As for verse 31, the rich man in Hades was pleading with Abraham to allow him to return and warn his family about where he went after he died on earth (see verse 27,28). To which Abraham replied, "If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."

And this account is a parable? Ya right.
---christan on 12/16/13


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therese, you say:
"Christan, Re Luke 16. If this is to be taken to be truth," Don't you believe Jesus was telling the Truth? You say you have faith in Jesus. And here you are suggesting He was making a story up that was not True" Jesus is God, after all the whole plan is His, He sees the beginning the end, how can He not know what is in heaven or not? it does not contradict any Scripture, it was a parable. Jesus Christ employs this parable in the same fashion He does all of His parable, to teach a lesson, in this case for the benefit of the Pharisees.
---Mark_V. on 12/16/13


therese, "for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return". Is the soul and spirit also made of dust? Both you and Marc seems to think so. If that's the case, Jesus was telling us a fairy tale.

What amuses me is both you and Marc seems to think Jesus was speaking in parable when He specifically mentioned the names of Lazarus and Abraham. No where in the other parables are specific names mentioned at all.

Bear in mind at this point of Christ's teaching, Abraham, Lazarus and the rich man had already passed on from this world. So, why would the account even be a parable? You forget, Jesus is God and He knows where they are by this point.

Why does heaven and hell need to be spoken in parable?
---christan on 12/16/13


MarkV to me: "Your parabolic questions lack any kind of faith in Jesus Words".
Forgive me, you who speak FOR God, forgive me.

Christan: "[Luke 16:19ff] simply tells me that after death in the flesh, our souls will not go wandering but straight to either paradise or hades, period."
You sure that this is the point of the lesson? You sure? I would have thought that the point was verse 31. He was telling this story to the Pharisees (v.14).
But as I am not a prophet of God, like you two, I guess I am totally bereft of understanding. So, people, just ignore my PATHETIC hermeneutic.
---Marc on 12/16/13


Christan, Re Luke 16. If this is to be taken to be truth, then new bodies are given at death of the old. The parable mentions tongue and fingers.

This contradicts scriptures that says we are given new bodies when Jesus returns.
---therese on 12/16/13


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Marc, I too will let Jesus answer your faithless question,
"The rich man died and was buried. And being in torments in Hades, "he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham" afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom"
You can see what Jesus said about the rich man and Lazarus. Was Jesus lying? Did He make up a tale that was not true?
The beggar was the only character in any of Jesus parables ever given a name. This was no imaginary tale, but an actual incident that really good place.
And you asked if the beggar really saw Abraham, you have your answer. Right from the Words of Jesus. Your parabolic questions lack any kind of faith in Jesus Words.
---Mark_V. on 12/16/13


Marc, I'll let Jesus answer your faithless question -

"And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried, And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom." Luke 16:22,23

You can be rest assured that the angels didn't carry the dead body of Lazarus that's made of dust but his soul. Is the soul made of dust? This account simply tells me that after death in the flesh, our souls will not go wandering but straight to either paradise or hades, period.

So you can save your pathetic parabolic theory to yourself.
---christan on 12/15/13


Christan,

I'll tell you about the parabolic element in Luke 16 if you answer the question I first posed. To repeat, re Luke 16, can the rich man really see heaven and Abraham from hell?
---Marc on 12/15/13


Marc, you like most others here get upset when your theology is questioned. We support what we say with the Word of God. You either believe it or you don't. It is not up to me to determine where you are heading, it is up to God. I am not God.
I am called to speak for His Word. And I try my best to learn His Word for the glory of God, not for my glory. You also can call me what you want. You can hide behind a computer, but you still show what is in your heart by your own words.
---Mark_V. on 12/15/13


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"you've claimed you speak FOR God, clearly indicating you're special, better than all of us..." Marc

You see, for someone who prides himself as a "professional mental health worker" - it's you who accuse me of saying I'm "special". Where in any of my blogs do I even make such claims? It's in your own mind, which is a mental thing for you.

When I "speak for God", I quote verses from the Bible to point out your erroneous understandings to what the Bible is saying contrary to what you are saying, that's all. It doesn't make me a "special" person when I put Scriptures before you.

And if you have a problem, I assure it's not with me but with what the Bible is saying.
---christan on 12/15/13


Geraldine, that is a very nice sentiment. My mother sees things the same way. I am happy that you have not been exposed to some of the people in this world who I can only describe as pure evil.

Lord bless you.
---trey on 12/15/13


Marc, for someone who proudly claims they are a "professional mental health worker", your mental faculty is in question.

1. Show us where Christ mentioned in Luke 16:19-31 that it was parabolic. What's there to even talk about in parable as far as heaven and hell is concerned?

2. Even if Christ didn't speak about hell in John, that means in Matthew, Mark and Luke counts for nothing? They are the Gospel and in harmony of each other.

3. No one's interested in how short, tall or fat you are.

4 & 5 I don't expect you to know the spiritual things of God from the comments you have made.
---christan on 12/14/13


Poor Christan and MarkV, not knowing the difference between the literal and parabolic.

1. Re Luke 16, so the rich man could see heaven and Abraham from hell?
2. Christan misquotes my words. I said, "Jesus didn't speak about hell IN JOHN."
3. Mark and I are the same height. But my little man comment wasn't to be taken literally but obviously as a metaphor.
4. Mark claims he isn't God but, Mark, you've claimed you speak FOR God, clearly indicating you're special, better than all of us because we don't speak for God. Delusions of grandeur, pal.
5. Removing verses which are repeated, Jesus mentions hell about 5 times but love a whole lot more. Do you think Jesus was onto something there, Mark who speaks for God?
---Marc on 12/14/13


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Marc, wow! So you're more than "adequate" to enter the kingdom of heaven because you're a "professional mental health worker"? Hmmm... sounds rather like you're contradicting yourself accusing others of "projecting their own in adequacies onto someone else". And you're not "inadequate"? So, you're better than everyone? Even Christ?

Maybe you should look at the mirror and counsel yourself about your own "inadequacies" before passing your judgement about "people's inadequacies".

"Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again." Matthew 7:2
---christan on 12/14/13


Marc, I know you don't like me, the reason you call me a little man. You must be a big man among everyone else for you to call me little at 6 foot 3 in tall. But all that aside, there is are least 70 references attributed to Jesus through the gospel. You really don't have to believe that at all, and as I can see you don't. I am not here to convince you of anything. I am not God. Only He can bring light to you. Micha was not supporting me, but was supporting the Truth. Isn't that what we are all here for?
---Mark_V. on 12/14/13


"When you check his "fact", you find it false. Jesus didn't speak about hell" Marc

Does the Bible dedicating thirteen verses about Hades in Luke 16 count as "fact" for you? Or are you just about numbers on the word "hell"?

"Hell" is mentioned 54 times in the KJV of which 23 are in the NT. That is fact. But no one, not even Solomon gave us a graphic account of what happens to the man after he passes on from this world but that of Christ detailed account in Luke 16.

So yes, Christ spoke about hell - in graphic detail, basically telling us that it's real! That is Truth!

What's the point of having "fact" when there's no Truth in you?
---christan on 12/13/13


In fact Jesus speak of hell more than anyone else ?

The whole Bible is the word of God, Genesis ------> To Revelation - All Scripture is given by inspiration of God - 2 Timothy 3:16

If I Got this right - hell used in OT - 31 Times - New 23 - The Hebrew word Sheol 65 Times - The grave - pit
---RICHARDC on 12/13/13


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Micha,

What you did was poorly actioned. You should have read more closely what I had written. In your haste to stand with angry little men like MarkV you should have noticed that I wrote that Matthew and Mark REPEAT the same incident. This reduces Jesus' use. Plus, several of his are aimed at the religious holier-than-thou types of his day.

As a professional mental health worker I hold that people commonly project their own inadequacies onto someone else. MarkV et al exaggerate Jesus' mentioning 'hell' and ALWAYS omit his far more numerous use of 'love'.
---Marc on 12/13/13


"Lesson: Check your facts when MarkV opens his mouth!"-Marc on 12/13/13
Hell references (KJV)
Moses 1 (Deu)
David 10 (2Sa,Psa,Act)
Job 2
Solomon 7 (Pro)
Isaiah 6
Ezekiel 4
Amos 1
Jonah 1
Habbakuk 1
Jesus 15 (Mat,Mar,Luk)
Peter 1 (2Pe)
--I did what you said
---micha9344 on 12/13/13


MarkV writes, "In fact Jesus speaks of hell more then anyone else."

When you check his "fact", you find it false. Jesus didn't speak about hell in John, once in Luke and on'y a couple of times in Matthew (repeated in Mark). Half were against the religious hypocrites (i.e. the MarkVs and Christans of the day) and the other half were poetic hyperbolic devices.

In fact, Solomon talked about hell more.

Apart from having a completely whacky (i.e. insane) theology, MarkV can't even count. He just shoots off his mouth, saying anything to support his unbiblical, I'm-a-tough-guy Calvinism.

Lesson: Check your facts when MarkV opens his mouth!
---Marc on 12/13/13


g, let me quote this from the Bible -

"And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?" Daniel 4:35

Does this mean that I quote this verse because I hate people? Or do I quote this verse because I'm telling you what God thinks about mankind?

The last thing as a Christian I want to do is compromise God's Word and worse still, corrupt it with your idea of what you think God is saying and thinking.

I know where I stand. What about you?
---christan on 12/13/13


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Christan & Trav
Why do I get the idea you hate people?
Just read your posts.
---g on 12/12/13


It appears our Bible witnesses do not align with your perceptions of the ideal christian, like yourself.

Mat_24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.

Luk_6:22 Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company, and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake.

Luk_14:26 If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.
---Trav on 12/13/13


MarkV, Christan & Trav

Why do I get the idea you hate people?

Just read your posts.

Again Galatians 5 is the measure of a TRUE child of God and I don't see any of that in your posts.

We are commanded to Love no matter what.
If you can't line up with the WHOLE word of God then you are not his child plain and simple. The bible tells us this truth, like or leave but it is truth.

And thanks moderator for not posting my previous answer.
---g on 12/12/13


trav, christen & markv are wrong.
LOVE no matter what.
---g on 12/9/13

Well, tis a grand doctrinally misunderstood, ideal. In the mean time I'll deal with it as King David and our Lord did....
Psa_139:21 Do not I hate them, O LORD, that hate thee? and am not I grieved with those that rise up against thee?
Psa_18:40 Thou hast also given me the necks of mine enemies, that I might destroy them that hate me.
Psa_21:8 Thine hand shall find out all thine enemies: thy right hand shall find out those that hate thee.
Luk_1:71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us,
---Trav on 12/12/13


g, you like all freewillers contradict yourself and here's prove, you first said:

"If one who calls themselves a child of God does not LOVE unconditionally, then they are not of GOD" and then you proceeded to step on your own tongue by saying, "As far as I am concerned, if you don't do what God says, then you are not his." - isn't this CONDITIONAL? You're confused, very very confused between what's the meaning of unconditional and conditional!

"Obedience is BETTER than sacrifice", -- that's not what Christ said. This is what He said, "I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." - what a difference!
---christan on 12/11/13


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g, where do you get the idea we hate people? What have we said that shows we hate anyone? What proof do you have? Do you have a post where we or I said I hated anyone? Don't just talk and put down a lot of passages concerning what we should be. I am not judging you what kind of Christian you are, I have no right to judge if you are a good Christian or not, or whether you hate anyone, I do not know you. Why do you judge us? The question was about the difference between the God from the Old Testament been different then the God of the New Testament we said He is the same God. I ask if you knew something different to post it. And you didn't. Are you just another angry person who doesn't like to hear that it is God who saves? What's up with that?
---Mark_V. on 12/11/13


Wille c - If you could give your explanation of John 17:9 - Thank's

John 17:9 - I pray for them, I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me, for they are thine,
---RICHARDC on 12/10/13


Blogger & MarkV

Gave scripture. That is the WORD of God, it should be enough.
It says we shall know who belongs to God by how they act, what they say...HOW THEY LOVE.
FRUITS - Gal 5
If one who calls themselves a child of God does not LOVE unconditionally, then they are not of GOD & did not come from him nor do they have Christ in them. That's what God says. PERIOD.
Very cut & dry I would.
As far as I am concerned, if you don't do what God says, then you are not his.
From the witness I have seen, I see not fruits of Christ's spirit there.
Not judging just using God's word as the measuring stick like I am told to do. Obedience is BETTER than sacrifice, That's what the Word of God says.
---g on 12/10/13


"Regarding God's seeming difference in Old and New Testaments" Geraldine

Don't fool yourself!

"For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness" Romans 1:18 - this was written by the NT apostle called Paul. You think what happened in 9/11, the great tsunami, katrina, the genocide of the Jews in WW2 wasn't God's wrath to the world? You had better think again.

For we are explicitly told, "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever." Hebrews 13:8, "For I am the Lord, I change not" Malachi 3:6

You have a god of your own imagination.
---christan on 12/10/13


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There is one God, who can be angry. And there still is judgment coming. But our Apostle Paul says our Father "is the Savior of all men, especially of those who believe." (in 1 Timothy 4:10) "God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son" (in John 3:16) > so, He loves "the world" . . . all. And Jesus "Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but for the whole world." (1 John 2:2) But this is good "especially for those who believe." There are ones who refused even Jesus Himself, while He was right there with them. Because "With men this is impossible" (in Matthew 19:26). But God alone is good to will and do with us what is good (Philippians 2:13).
---willie_c: on 12/10/13


Regarding God's seeming difference in Old and New Testaments: I know that there is One God, but even though children have Free Will, they can't use it until years develop their brains, so they suffer. Innocent suffering in God's plans is very sad.
---Geraldine on 12/10/13


g, are you saying that the God of the Old Testament is a different God then the One in the new? You disagree with me, and that was my answer to the last post Geraldine posted. She said she was confused. If you have another answer please give it. Posting a lot of passages with no context proofs nothing. anyone can do that.
---Mark_V. on 12/10/13


"g", Christ only died for those the Father YHWH gave him you need to reed John Chapter 17 again. Christ was not concerned about every one in the world but only God's Elect that were given to Christ by YHWH God.
---Blogger9211 on 12/10/13


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trav, christen & markv are wrong.

Scripture witnesses
Proverbs 10:12, 17:9
1 Corinthians 13:4,
James 5:20
1 Peter ch 1, & 4
Galatians 5 gives acts of Christ's spirit who is in us says to LOVE no matter what. It is proof that Christ is in us. It is how we can tell who truly belongs to God.
1 Peter 4:8 Love covers multitude of sin.
The Word of God is CLEAR that those who have hatred in their hearts are NOT of HIM- GOD. And Christ does not dwell in them.
You all can choose to hate people, But those who have Christ in them choose to love.
If Christ is in you, you will produce the fruits of Christ's spirit who dwells in you one of which is LOVE. Christ said it and Paul and the other disciples back it up.
---g on 12/9/13


"I face confusion of "which" God, the God of anger in the Old Testament or the God of love in the New Testament. How do I discern which?
---Geraldine on 12/8/13"

Look for the witnessing words...love/loved/friend, for instance.

Deu_5:10 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me and keep my commandments.
Deu_7:7 The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people, for ye were the fewest of all people:
1Jn_2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
---Trav on 12/9/13


Geraldine, you say:
"I face confusion of "which" God, the God of anger in the Old Testament or the God of love in the New Testament. How do I discern which?
---Geraldine on 12/8/13"

There is no confusion, the God of the Old Testament is the same God in the New Testament. He has always been gracious. He just had to deal with Israel as a nation much different, and Jesus had not come yet, but was promise He would. God deals with man the very same way. Those who believe are not condemned, those who do not believe are condemned already.
In fact Jesus speaks of hell more then anyone else. We like the New Testament because we are believers in Christ already. And so there is joy for us.
---Mark_V. on 12/9/13


Cluny, regarding asking God myself about all people being precious, I face confusion of "which" God, the God of anger in the Old Testament or the God of love in the New Testament. How do I discern which?
---Geraldine on 12/8/13


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That is it. Jesus die for use all. Not just a few but all. God gave to all, not just a few, but all. Knowing this fear is gone, his word drives it out. Make sharing the Good news "Gospel" so much fun.
---BRYAN on 12/8/13


Nice concept but not at all Biblical. YHWH loves some people and others he hated.
---Blogger9211 on 12/8/13


"Would God agree?" Yes.
"Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory, but in lowliness of mind let each esteem others [as] better than themselves." Phl 2:3 KJV
"Dont be selfish, dont try to impress others. Be humble, thinking of others as better than yourselves." NLT
"Be kindly affectionate to one another with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to one another." Rom 12:10 NKJV
"Be devoted to one another in love. Honor one another above yourselves." NIV
---josef on 12/7/13


Wonderfull Attitude! I have adapt to kindness,Keep it simple for me.. kindness goes a long way! Wow! listen first.If they disagree with me,example
I try to explain on a blogg, my grand father was not a christian, he kept religion.However,my grandmother always taught & lived for Christ. I was only point out my people here inh this region have NOT received Christ, they most Cubans here are in the dark.

However,does NOT mean...they can not change! So, that clears up.the confussion.
---Lidia4796 on 12/8/13


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2 Timothy 3:1 - This know also, in the last days perilous times shall come,
3:2 - for men shall be loves of their own selves, covetous, boasters' proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy.
----------------------------------------->
---RICHARDC on 12/8/13


It's not how the fallen man looks at one another that really matters. It's how God looks at mankind that you should be more concerned about.

"And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?" Daniel 4:35

"Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." Matthew 10:34
---christan on 12/7/13


Why don't you ask Him for yourself, Geraldine?

You're just as capable of hearing from God as anyone else here--maybe more than some.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/7/13


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