//True Luke. But many men here in the United States still get away with it.//
You are correct, many men get away with their abusive behavior. One reason is the person abused does not speak against the person for fear of her being abused again or even killed.
Some time back a man stopped his car in front of my house, he took his girl friend out and started kicking her while she was on the ground. I went out to help her and so did my neighbor. He had a shotgun and told the guy to leave. He got on his car and left her there. We called the police and when they came she did not want to sign the report for fear of him. Some days later we heard God took his life when he died in a car accident. He will not beat anyone anymore.
---Luke on 7/3/14|
A good leader will lead in ways that make people want to follow his lead. It's plain to see that isn't happening.
---Shira4358 on 6/29/14|
True Luke. But many men here in the United States still get away with it.
---Samuelbb7 on 6/27/14|
the woman you mentioned was forced to marry. That alone is wrong. Second, even if her husband was not a Christian, she was still under the obedience of God to submit to her husband, only if she did not break a law of God. And she was if she married to be a third wife. And since she did, she obeyed God by going away and not being in that relationship.
Abusive behavior from husbands has always being wrong. We know it happens in many countries. Those countries laws find woman guilty for just about anything they wear or what they do. Man are hardly ever found responsible for being abusive. But not here in this country. Here man is responsible for being abusive. Agape
---Luke on 6/27/14|
Yes Luke you are correct. The women who was a Christian should obey GOD above a husband.
As in all cases GOD first.
---Samuelbb7 on 6/26/14|
//A woman in Africa was forced to marry a Muslim man. He told her she had to obey him and would be his third wife. She ran away and was able to make it to safety. Was she wrong?//
Samuel, you are talking about someone who is forced to marry someone. And you did not mention if she was a Christian already. Second, by her making it to safety, she was obeying God if she was a Christian, by not being a part of a third wife. She knew what God thought about marriage and did the right thing. Obedience to God was her first choice if she was born of the Spirit. Second was her well being. Agape
---Luke on 6/20/14|
A woman in Africa was forced to marry a Muslim man. He told her she had to obey him and would be his third wife.
She ran away and was able to make it to safety. Was she wrong?
Another women was told by her husband who claimed to be a Christians that she needed to be a prostitute to make extra money. She got help from here family and got away.
A Godly women will not submit blindly and will not choose to live against the law of GOD. No matter what her husband says.
The two instances above were taken from true events.
---Samuelbb7 on 6/19/14|
//If he does not do this the wife cannot safely submit.//
What do you mean "the wife cannot safely submit?"
So what you are saying is that if one is not saved, the other is not obligated to obey God's standards? That a godly Christian wife can live as she wants and not follow her husband?
We know the system works best when both Christians obey God. But nowhere in the standards are we told that if one is not a Christian all bets are off. I would think that you as an SDA who follows the laws would know that. Of course the wife does not have to be submissive if she doesn't want to. She has a choice, be the godly wife God made her, are be who she was before she was saved. No one is making anyone do anything. Agape
---Luke on 6/19/14|
Sorry, Luke, I think I misunderstood your usage of the words 'you' and 'yours' in "If 'you' are not obedient to God, how can 'you' expect God to answer 'your' prayers to change 'your' husband?
Emphasis mine here of course.
---Rita_H on 6/19/14|
Hello,all respect to our Bro.Samuelbb7 - Certainly,do agree with your post!
Concerns if the husband loves the wife even like Christ
He loved the church.
wife yes! ..Safety issues for sure.
God bless you and your family.
Love of Jesus!
---Elena9555 on 6/19/14|
//I'm bowing out of this now because you seem to think I'm discussing my home life (which I don't do here)//
I in no way thought you were discussing your life. You read too much into my answer. My response was for the simple reason that if you are a Christian, and I thought you were when I first answered you, that I did not have to explain to you that you had to be obedient to God, that you would already know. That's why I did not put the word "unless" in my statement.
Every Christian woman knows, whether they like it or not, that God set the standards.
Sure we know many do not follow the standards. But as individuals, we are responsible for our own actions, that's why I answered you in the first place. Agape
---Luke on 6/19/14|
rita, you can discuss things here without bring personal things to the post. I have revealed some things on here but I know when and what not to tell.
---shira4368 on 6/18/14|
The Submission only works if the husband.
Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it,
If he does not do this the wife cannot safely submit.
---Samuelbb7 on 6/18/14|
Luke. I simply answered your words "Even if the husband is not a Christian, the wife should still be submissive to the husband." You then said "The same holds true for the husband, if he is a Christian, he should know God put him in control. He is responsible for himself and also his family". True but sadly it is not that way in many Christian families. Many men REALLY LIKE the words about submission (it seems to give them power) yet they totally forget about their responsibilities.
I know some families in that situation and have attended churches where some families are like that.
I'm bowing out of this now because you seem to think I'm discussing my home life (which I don't do here).
---Rita_H on 6/18/14|
//Your words:- "Even if the husband is not a Christian, the wife should still be submissive to the husband" should have carried an 'unless he orders her to do something illegal, something which would harm her, or embarrass her' and quite a few other examples. You made a blanket statement.//
there was no need to mention "unless" in my statement. You should have understood the meaning since you are a Christian. When a wife is submissive to her husband, she is being obedient to God. If you are not obedient to God, how can you expect God to answer your prayers to change your husband? Would a Christian wife shoot her kids because her unchristian husband told her? That would be disobedient to God. Agape.
---Luke on 6/18/14|
Luke I am pleased that my extreme example shocked you. Your words:- "Even if the husband is not a Christian, the wife should still be submissive to the husband" should have carried an 'unless he orders her to do something illegal, something which would harm her, or embarrass her' and quite a few other examples. You made a blanket statement.
A marriage which is unequally yoked will not operate in the same way as the marriage of two Christians will operate. God knows that and we need to know it. Some men might be saved through their wives submissiveness but some wives might be killed through following horrendous orders of a wicked man. All cases are individual.
---Rita_H on 6/17/14|
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// if a non-Christian husband ordered his wife to steal something in the supermarket would you say that she must obey him BECAUSE HE IS A MAN? If not, why not if she is meant to be SUBMISSIVE?//
I never thought you would even think such a thing. Please, take the advice in context of what a Christian really is. Would a Christian wife jump off a building because her husband tells her? Come on.
My answer is that everyone is responsible for his own actions. To excuse a wife from being submissive to her husband because he is not a Christian, does not suggest that she does nothing.
Using your point the wife is excuse from following her husband because he is not saved. Nothing excuses her from her obligation to God. Agape
---Luke on 6/17/14|
Everyone who is a Christian is being change by God. Wives and husbands. If God has changed a wife, she will do everything possible to be submissive to her husband within reason. God wants us to be submissive to our government officials, because He put them there, it does not mean we do everything they tell us, it has to be within reason to what God has taught us.
We are without excuse. Wives are responsible for their families just as husband are. When we stand before God we will not have an excuse that we didn't obey God because our husbands were not Christian. You cannot blame them, it is God who saves by grace through faith. If a husband is not saved, it is because God has not saved him yet. God holds the key to salvation. Agape
---Luke on 6/17/14|
Luke I said nothing to indicate that the other (meaning woman) should live as they please.
I disagree with you 100%. If the man is not a Christian, but the wife is, God does not want the children to learn from the non-Christian. You seem to imply that the children should miss out on Christian teachings and be brought up as heathens until such a time as the man 'might' be saved.
He (the husband) will learn far more about Christianity by observing how his wife teaches his children the things of God.
Luke, if a non-Christian husband ordered his wife to steal something in the supermarket would you say that she must obey him BECAUSE HE IS A MAN? If not, why not if she is meant to be SUBMISSIVE?
---Rita_H on 6/16/14|
I believe the relationship we have with Christ is between the person and Christ. Even if the husband is not a Christian, the wife should still be submissive to the husband. The same holds true for the husband, if he is a Christian, he should know God put him in control. He is responsible for himself and also his family.
We cannot take the attitude that because one is not a Christian the other should live as they please. Although the system God put in works best when both follow the system. As individuals, we are responsible for what we do, not what our spouse does. He will have to answer to God on his own. Agape
---Luke on 6/16/14|
Rita, I agree with what you said. I've said it before if a husband would love his wife as Christ loved the church , the wife would have no worry about obeying her husband. That does not even suggest a man should. boss his family around. If course it does not.
---shira4368 on 6/15/14|
It must be extremely problematic for a Christian woman to see her husband as head of her and the whole household if he is not also a Christian OR if he claims to be a Christian but is not conducting his own life as a Christian.
Children need guidance and Christian teaching and, if they don't get that from Dad, Mum must step in and act as though she is head.
Many authoritarian male Christians will disagree with me I believe but so be it.
God knows the heart and knows what goes on in individual homes.
---Rita_H on 6/14/14|
"What is God's model for leadership in the home?" Headship denotes leadership
I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is the man, and the head of Christ is God. 1Co 11:3
For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. Eph 5:23
Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. Eph 5:22
Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing. Eph 5:24
For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands: 1Pe 3:5,6
---josef on 6/13/14|
KarenD://But, if we cannot come to a decision on any matter, my husband has the final say.//
God bless you more. This is not because I am a man but because it is God's prescription.
---Adetunji on 6/13/14|
My husband and I are a team, whether in the Lord's work or at home. Rarely do we disagree on much. But, if we cannot come to a decision on any matter, my husband has the final say. When God puts two people together (like He did us) it works pretty good. Thank you Lord for a Godly husband.
---KarenD on 6/8/14|
//And as a follower of Jesus that means the very things he could do we should be doing the same. But he even said, "We should do greater things than him".//
1. Can you go through doors that are closed? Jesus could.
2. Can you bring back the dead? Jesus could.
3. Are you without sin? Jesus is.
4. are you Omniscience? Jesus is.
5. Are you omnipotent? Jesus is.
6. Can you calm the seas? Jesus did.
9. Can you bring spiritual life to anyone? Jesus does.
10. Can you go back and forth to heaven? Jesus does.
These are but a few of things you cannot do. And there are hundreds more. Agape
---Luke on 6/6/14|
Jesus is first of many. So that makes him the leader. And as a follower of Jesus that means the very things he could do we should be doing the same. But he even said, "We should do greater things than him".
---Bryan on 6/5/14|
Jesus should be the model whether the head of the household is a man or a woman.
---love.jesus on 6/4/14|
That the parents are born-again Christians and bring up their children in a truly Christian environment (home and church). That the husband is the provider and is capable of making tough decisions and that the wife is strong in different ways, able to give support to him and discipline to the children, when due, and make a good home for all of them.
Sadly many Christian wives have ineffectual husbands who leave all decisions to her when at home but wish her to look as if he is her 'master' when in public.
Wives don't have a switch programmed to 'family life' or 'church life' but some husbands seem to expect them to behave as if they had one.
---Rita_H on 6/4/14|
Hopefully, husband and wife are on the same page and in agreement, but the Bible makes clear that the father has the last word.
Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/4/14|
Specifically love, what is God's model for "headship" in the home?
---Leon on 6/4/14|
Leon, I think that Jesus would be the best model to emulate for leadership in the home.
---love.jesus on 6/3/14|