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Are You Alive In Heaven

Are the dead really dead?

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 ---jerry6593 on 10/3/14
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Cluny

If I quote Selected Messages page 20. That is not a URL.

So if from the website you give me book and page that is okay.

For instance in Testimonies Volume 5 chapter on Scripture which page number I do not remember now.

That would tell me and since I have about half of her books and more are online than I can read it.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/16/15


\\That is odd Cluny. Since you never seem to able to give book and page. \\

I can't, because the rules here forbid giving URLs. Remember?

And I mentioned EGW, because someone accused StrongAxe of quoting from anti-White sites.

I don't.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 4/16/15


That is odd Cluny. Since you never seem to able to give book and page.

Also the EGW estate publishes long answers and shows where these charges are false. But you do not seem to know any of that. Are you just reading the accusations and never looking up the rebuttals?

I did not start this discussion of E.G. White. I prefer to stick as she directed to the Bible only. Why then did you intorduce this to take away from the discussion on the Bible?

The Way of the cross leads home.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/15/15


I get my information about EGW from the White Estate site, SDA literature, and her own writings.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 4/15/15


Should I believe them just because they say so?

I do my research.
Do you?
---Samuelbb7 on 4/15/15

Strange, and notable, it that you've never given one reason for anyone here to place any faith or value in anything shes written or you about her.
But, then what could she possibly give or say?
You are her defender, promoter and apostle.
Illogical, unscriptural but, one who chooses and promotes the false over the proven...who can help them.

Luk_6:39 he spake a parable unto them, Can the blind lead the blind? shall they not both fall into the ditch?

I thank my GOD that Sheep...have the Prophets of GOD, Christ and his Apostles.

---Trav on 4/15/15




StrongAx been there doing that.

I have been to many of the Anti web sites. It gets boring seeing the same lie. The same quotes taken out of context.

In the last 20 years I have not seen a new charge made. I have her attacker's books. I have had youtube discussions with these liars.

I get a free magazine where she is attacked and our church is lied about by ex-sda.

Have you asked me a direct question where I can show the lie? Have you only looked at one side and disregarded the answers.

There are websites that say the Bible is false and full of lies. They attack the Bible as giving false prophecies. Should I believe them just because they say so?

I do my research.
Do you?

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/15/15


Samuelbb7:

To see just what kind of a prophet E. G. White was (true or false), Google: eg white false prophecies
---StrongAxe on 4/15/15


"It is not scripturally logical to honor a proven by history false prophet or any "writer" in ahead of all Biblical Prophets, Christ and the Apostles." Trav

Agreed. The Bible is above all including Sister White. Testimonies Volume 5 Page 24 She writes of the Bible "As an educating power the Bible is without rival" She speaks of its importance to be the center of all Study particularly in the Colleges. She speaks of it as being the final authority. She restates this many times, in many places.

You have not shown her to be false. You have only made the accusation. You did not cite sources but since I already knew them I did not need them. You are simply parroting without true knowledge.
agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/13/15


Trav: Are you off your meds again?
How can the dead be alive if the millennium has not yet happened?
---jerry6593 on 4/12/15

Well you could say I've burned the denom doc - trends you put your faith in. No scriptural cures in their prescriptions.
Seek help.
Found my cure in Christ, approved seal of GOD. Recommended by all the prophets and 11 Apostles.
Luk_8:52 all wept, and bewailed her: but he said, Weep not, she is not dead, but sleepeth.
Luk_8:53 And they laughed him to scorn, knowing that she was dead.
Luk_20:38 For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto him.
Luk_9:60 Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God.
---Trav on 4/13/15


Trav: Are you off your meds again? Have you never read:

Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.

How can the dead be alive if the millennium has not yet happened?



---jerry6593 on 4/12/15




...Insulting me will not make you correct.
Correct they repented but Jonah did not qualify his statment.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/10/15

Ellen is not Jonah. Jonah being upset...qualifies Jonah. God qualified repentance. Is was not Jonah's to give.
You expect no less. Repentance delivering, from a forewarned doom.
Sam, I'm glad to know you are a senior "male" with children. The question was sincere by your ongoing deference to egwhite.
It is not scripturally logical to honor a proven by history false prophet or any "writer" in ahead of all Biblical Prophets, Christ and the Apostles.
Rev_2:20 Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, ...
---Trav on 4/11/15


I am a 63 year old Male married 41 years with three Children. Born and raised in Houston Texas.

Insulting me will not make you correct.

She never predicted the date of the Second coming and fought against date setting. You are reading lies and not checking to see if they are true. I have checked and have the history to prove I am being truthful. I uphold all of the Ten Commandments.

Correct they repented but Jonah did not qualify his statment. In fact he was upset GOD was not destroying them. Read the Bible.

I can give books and chapters and history for I have them online and in my house.

You qve false accusations. No proof.

I belogn to the Lord Jesus Christ under the infilling of the Holy Spirit.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/10/15


Jonah prophesied the city would be destroyed it was not.
She is not a witch.
You lied. She did not prophesy any of those dates.
Why should I believe you?
---Samuelbb7 on 4/10/15

What dates did she use then? Her prophecys, and stupidity's are on record. Any date she used... the end of the world did not happen.
She is much worse than a witch to me. She controls you from the her grave.

Idgit...the people of Nineveh repented after Jonah prophecied their doom.

Jon 3:10 And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way, and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them, and he did it not.

How old are you and don't lie? Are you a girl using Samuel as a blog name?
---Trav on 4/10/15


Jonah prophesied the city would be destroyed it was not.

She is not a witch.

You lied. She did not prophesy any of those dates.
Like most who attack her you use lies.


Yes she quoted history books. I have read the White lie and found it underwhelming. She followed the quoting system of her day. Where are your quotes to show me where this is from"

Again another lie. Scripture is above the writings of Ellen G. White. See the 28 Fundamentals of the Seventh day Adventist church on our official web site.

So all lies and one mistake. Why should I believe you? When all you do is lie and give no proof?

The way of the cross leads home.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/10/15


Trav.
Jonah failed. First prove a single lie. Accusations are not proof.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/10/15

Ellen g witch, is not Jonah.
Jonah failed? Where? Nineveh was turned.
Proof?? Ellen own prophecy's prove her... a False Prophet. E.G. White prophesied the world would end in 1843, 1844, 1845 and 1851. She failed 4 times, once a year +. Your own church tested her writings for Plagery and discovered 30 to 90% depending on book.
When you honor her in front of scripture, that is a mark for us about you. Being false, being a woman, leading you from the grave 165yrs later, testifys of your mindset.
You testify lukewarm for truth, passionate for false.
---Trav on 4/10/15


Deuternomy 13:1-3

If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder,And the sign or the wonder come to pass, whereof he spake unto thee, saying, Let us go after other gods, which thou hast not known, and let us serve them: Thou shalt not hearken unto the words of that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams: for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.
Trav.
Interesting never been accused of begin efim and lukewarm.

You however seem to be ignorant of many women in Scripture who were leaders.

Jonah failed. First prove a single lie. Accusations are not proof.

The Way of the Cross leads home.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/10/15


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Every one of Peter's epistles claimed he was an Apostle.
Some of Paul's did not....
---micha9344 on 4/9/15

One way to filter all Apostles is to filter them through Christ, the Red Letter statements. Then align with the Prophets statements.
Who doesn't totally believe Christ as a Christian? Who doesn't totally believe the Prophets as a Christian?

Paul is not like the original 12 Apostles. While most of his writing align with Christ and the Prophets...some have to be micro screened in the original languages used...then tested by the prophets.
There is no hiding of GOD's intents regardless.
Just more clearly and easily seen looking through Christ's words...instead of Pauls wordy explainations.
---Trav on 4/9/15


/Would an apostle or prophet of Jesus have to constantly remind us that he/she is an apostle or prophet of His?\-barb on 4/9/15
Every one of Peter's epistles claimed he was an Apostle.
Some of Paul's did not.
While your throwing mud at Paul, make sure you don't hit Peter.
The answer to your question is -- not have to but want to.
Jhn 21:24 This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.
---micha9344 on 4/9/15


If the words of a prophet or an apostle do not agree with the Law and the Prophets or the testimony of Jesus there is no truth in them.
We are to follow Him not preachers taught by denominations, not self claimed prophets or self appointed apostles... John 18:37.
---barb on 4/9/15

Amen, woman with my blessed, mothers name. Exactly.

Luk_24:25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:

Act 17:11 ...received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

2Pe_3:2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets,
---Trav on 4/9/15


Would an apostle or prophet of Jesus have to constantly remind us that he/she is an apostle or prophet of His? Wouldn't the fruit he/she produces prove that to us one way or the other. Matt 7:19-27.

Jesus leaves it up to us to determine whether a prophet or disciple is from God. Matt 24:4. He gives us clues but we need to use integrity to see and hear them. John 5:43, John 10:1-5, Rev 2:2, Rev 2:18-29. If the words of a prophet or an apostle do not agree with the Law and the Prophets or the testimony of Jesus there is no truth in them. We are to follow Him not preachers taught by denominations, not self claimed prophets or self appointed apostles but the Son who God sent into this world to testify to the Truth. John 18:37.
---barb on 4/9/15


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The Bible has a rule about false prophets giving true prophecies.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/9/15

You didn't post the rule.
A false prophet being false, cannot give a true prophecy.
GOD controls men's futures, GOD's prophets never fail once. They cannot.
Unlike your plagiarizing false prophetess who failed multiple times. You place e.g. white in higher position than the scriptural prophets and Christ.
What award do expect being a faithful defender of lies.
There no help for those that follow false prophets or out of position efem/men led of women.
Disgusting.
Rev_3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
---Trav on 4/9/15


Trav it was not much of a prophecy. Saul without the help of GOD was going to fight a superior force which had better weapons. Guessing he would lose and die would be the bet of the majority of gamblers.

Yes Strongax the prophet Balaam sold himself but GOD spoke the blessings through him anyway is true. And a prophecy of the Messiah is also given. Which is very different then a inferior army is going to be defeated by a superior army.

The Bible has a rule about false prophets giving true prophecies.

The way of the cross leads home.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/9/15


Samuelbb7:

You said: But I cannot believe that GOD spoke through an agent of Satan.

That is not the only case. Balaam was a corrupt false who accepted money for prophecying, but God had other plans and forced him to bless Israel, against the instructions he was given by his client.
---StrongAxe on 4/8/15


But I cannot believe that GOD spoke through an agent of Satan.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/8/15

You are calling Samuel an agent of Satan, not realizing it.
Is not the witches prophecy that comes true, it is Samuels.
Consider.
Saul represents darkness being in the dark. Desperately going to the witch, who also is in darkness.
GOD through Samuel the prophet shines light. Darkness cannot generate "Light".

Actually this story is you. You've testify proudly of a false "witch" prophet, e.g. white instead of GOD's chosen prophets. You've put her in front of scripture for understanding of GOD. A hard truth, but stands as fact in your defense of a false "witch" prophet.
---Trav on 4/8/15


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Yes Trav I have no problem with the donkey. I do have a problem with giving power and ability to the servants of Satan.

Yes Strongax I can see your point. But Satan is tricky and a liar. True he can tell the truth sometime.

But I cannot believe that GOD spoke through an agent of Satan.

The Way of the Cross leads home.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/8/15


Samuelbb7:

You said: So you both think GOD had to listen to the demands of Satan.

No. It was more like God saying "You want a word from me, even though I have consistently refused to give you one? OK. I will give you one, but you are NOT going to like it!"

Be careful what you ask for, lest you get what you are asking for (and Saul was REALLY asking for it!).
---StrongAxe on 4/7/15


Saul was fooled into thinking it was Samuel just as your are being fooled into thinking it was him.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/7/15

Sam...
Saul and his sons were killed. Fulfilling "Samuel's" prophecy...asked for by Saul. Saul believed it was Samuel. It was and him and his sons died proving it was. 1Sa 31:6
Saul could not get an answer through the priest, prophet or Urim. 1Sa 28:6.
He chose another way to get his answer and got an answer he regrets still.
This is about "Saul"...his mistakes, his Sin and his price.
His death leading to King David's rule.

GOD's angel spoke through an Ass / Donkey to Balaam. You don't have a problem with that, right? See Num_22:28
---Trav on 4/7/15


Samuel had already prophsied to Saul and GOD would not give a message to Saul until Satan through a witch demanded it.

So you both think GOD had to listen to the demands of Satan.


1Samuel 28:14

And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up, and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself

Did GOD say it was Samuel? I do not see that in the scripture. Saul was fooled into thinking it was Samuel just as your are being fooled into thinking it was him.

As Christians you should believe GOD and pay attention to His word.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/7/15


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The truth does reveal itself in all scripture. God, the keeper of souls, brought Samuel back to set Saul straight and prophesy against him.
Satan is a liar, he cannot prophesy and be found true.
---micha9344 on 4/6/15

Amen ...in that, all that was prophesied happened to Saul.

Amo_3:7 Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.
---Trav on 4/6/15


jerry6593:

The Bible says it was Samuel, NOT the "image of Samuel". Samuel was annoyed at Saul for disturbing his rest (so he may well have been asleep). Samuel pronounced divine judgment against Saul, predicting his death - exactly as a prophet would do, and NOT as a demon would do.

You can't discount an entire chapter just because you think it disagrees with your favorite verse.


micha9344:

The witch "called" for Samuel, but didn't expect him to appear. She was genuinely surprise and terrified when he actually did, at God's bidding.
---StrongAxe on 4/6/15


It is false to believe the witch brought Samuel up. It is also false to believe God did not bring Samuel up.
1st-the woman was shocked by Samuel's arrival. Strange being this should be normal for her. 1Sam 28:12
2nd-the Bible called him Samuel. 1Sa 28:15,16,20
3rd-Samuel prophesied and it came true. 1Sa 28:19, 1Sa 31:6
According to some, Saul and his sons went to be with Satan instead of in the grave with Samuel. (1Sa 28:19) This also goes against their corrupt view of the after life.
The truth does reveal itself in all scripture. God, the keeper of souls, brought Samuel back to set Saul straight and prophesy against him.
Satan is a liar, he cannot prophesy and be found true.
---micha9344 on 4/6/15


Strongax
So a false witch actually succeeded in demanding a prophet of GOD obey her command ...
This was a servant of Satan tricking Saul. That is the truth.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/6/15

No more a servant than you appear to be.
Your truth, is you not ready or able to eat scriptural truth.

Saul the King of Israel set this in motion.
Saul called Samuel the prophet through the witch. Note the language.
1Sa 28:14 ....therefore I have called thee, that thou mayest make known unto me what I shall do.
1Sa 28:16 Then said Samuel, Wherefore then dost thou ask of me, seeing the LORD is departed from thee, and is become thine enemy?
---Trav on 4/6/15


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StrongAxe:It was a demon impersonating Samuel.
But, most importantly, the correct interpretation MUST align with the rest of Scripture.
---jerry6593 on 4/6/15

Your opinion is not alignment with scripture.
If Samuel was a demon, scripture would declare it.
Words of Samuel the prophet came true.
Demons don't prophecy.
Whoever this witch seen...seemed like GOD's to her. It is her description...not Samuels or even Sauls.

Joh_10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
Joh_10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken,

Psa 82:6 I have said, Ye are gods, and all of you are children of the most High.
---Trav on 4/6/15


StrongAxe: "conjure up the real thing"

But it was not the real thing! It was a demon impersonating Samuel.

... Saul perceived that it was Samuel - 1Sa 28:14

The witch said that she saw "gods ascending out of the earth". - 1Sa 28:13 Do you believe that they really were "gods"?

But, most importantly, the correct interpretation MUST align with the rest of Scripture.

Ecc 9:5-6 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, ..... neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.


---jerry6593 on 4/6/15


Strange Trav that you believe the word of a witch over the Word of God.
---jerry6593 on 4/4/15

I'm only disappointed that a Christian, with scientific training didn't sift the context before replying. Recap:
GOD cut his communication off with Saul. Saul went to the "forbidden witch" cursing his self,(Lev_20:6)
Saul promised her no penalty.
Samuel came up...witch then knew who Saul was.
Samuel states what will happen and it comes to pass.
GOD through a prophet, verifies again that GOD has future control over all parties involved here. GOD also used pharaoh, and his wizards showing the power of GOD through his prophet and pharaoh.
Rom_9:17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh,...
---Trav on 4/6/15


Strongax

So a false witch actually succeeded in demanding a prophet of GOD obey her command and the prophet of GOD had to do what she told him to do.

Wow so Satan is more powerful then GOD. So the other gods that came out of the ground what gods were they?


1Samuel 28:13

And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth.

StrongAx the more you try to justify this was a summoning the more problems result. This was a servant of Satan tricking Saul. That is the truth.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/6/15


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Samuelbb7:

The witch was ...was just reporting what she saw, as by this point, lying would have been superfluous (and likely dangerous, as she would not want to anger a prophet of God.)
---StrongAxe on 4/5/15

Exactly. She had Saul, king of Israel on one hand...Samuel a Prophet of GOD on the other side of her. She relayed Samuels truth, GOD's truth. Truth because the events happened as Samuel through her stated they would.
Samuel the prophet did not choose the witch...Saul did. The Sin is on Saul. He knew the rules and even enforced them until communication was cut off from GOD...
A lesson: Be careful who you entrust with your future. Denominations are not the safe witches.
---Trav on 4/6/15


Samuelbb7:

The witch was likely a charlatan (like most mediums) who was totally shocked when she happened to, for the first time in her life, conjure up the real thing. She was just reporting what she saw, as by this point, lying would have been superfluous (and likely dangerous, as she would not want to anger a prophet of God.)
---StrongAxe on 4/5/15


The witch repeated the words of the Prophet Samuel from a previous times. Just like the devil quoated portions of the Bible to Jesus.

I am a member of the Seventh day Adventist church and I am a local church leader.

Our church agrees with the Bible the dead are asleep until the first or second resurrection.
Jesus is risen.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/5/15


At God's appointed time (God the Father knowing this time, but not the Son, Jesus)the dead in Christ shall rise and the living shall be caught up with the dead. Their bodies shall be transformed. This is the first resurrection.

All the other dead shall rise at the end of the thousand year reign of Chirst and be judged from the Book of Life according to their works. This is the second resurrection.

Blessed are those that rise in the first resurrection.
---Steveng on 4/5/15


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Strange Trav that you believe the word of a witch over the Word of God.



---jerry6593 on 4/4/15


The witch said it was Samuel. She wouldn't lie now would she?
---Samuelbb7 on 4/2/15

She didn't lie.
Something scriptural here Sam...only a lie/false if it didn't come true. Samuel said:
1. kingdom rended from Saul...it is given to David. Done
2. Saul and his sons die. Israel is delivered to the Philistines. 1Sa 31:1 . Done.
You know, even when a buried, authorized prophet gives you proof Sam, you still doubt.
But didn't i recently see you post proudly honoring a scripturally unauthorized woman to preach/teach to you?

Own your birthright as a man, Sam. Seek the company/witness of the "men" that GOD authorized in scripture. Authority's in your church are obviously not authority's or men.
---Trav on 4/3/15


Michael: One can be spiritually dead while being physically alive (just look around you). But, one cannot be spiritually alive while being physically dead.

Ecc 9:4 For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.
Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished, neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.


---jerry6593 on 4/3/15


I am of the understanding that Jesus says to let the spiritually dead bury the physically dead. Any other interpretation would seem illogical.
To answer to blog question,
Yes the dead are really dead, physically, spiritually or both.
---micha9344

I agree.

So Trav you believe that a witch can summon a Prophet of GOD and make him do her wishes?


1Samuel 28:13

And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth.

The witch said it was Samuel. She wouldn't lie now would she?

Jesus is risen.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/2/15


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Are the dead really dead?
---jerry6593 on 10/3/14

Some never rise again.
Amo_8:14 They that swear by the sin of Samaria, and say, Thy god, O Dan, liveth, and, The manner of Beersheba liveth, even they shall fall, and never rise up again.
(Dan is not found in Revelations)

Some have, do rise again:
Eze 37:5 Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones, Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:

1Sa 28:11 Then said the woman, Whom shall I bring up unto thee? he said, Bring me up Samuel.
1Sa 28:13...the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth.
1Sa 28:15 Samuel said to Saul, Why hast thou disquieted me, to bring me up? Saul answered, I am sore distressed, ...
---Trav on 4/2/15


correct, Samuel. Acts 2 does talk about the physical death of David. It also talks about the physical ascension of David, just as Jesus ascended, but David's did not happen yet, so the scriptures must be talking about Christ, not David, as some of the Jews believed. Peter points them to Christ, the one that had physically ascended and physically resurrected.
Now, if you could, let me know what your interpretation is of "Let the dead bury their dead." if you please.
I am of the understanding that Jesus says to let the spiritually dead bury the physically dead. Any other interpretation would seem illogical.
To answer to blog question,
Yes the dead are really dead, physically, spiritually or both.
---micha9344 on 4/2/15


Yes Micha you are correct many do that. For instance David is dead.


Acts 2:29

Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.

This is physically dead. So David is asleep with his Fathers awaiting the Resurrection from the dead.

The verse you gave is about the Spiritually dead.

2Samuel12:23 is about the Baby who died. David will die and they will sleep in the grave.


2Samuel 7:12

And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/2/15


/So dead people cannot be alive until re-created in the resurrection at Jesus' second coming.\-jerry6593 on 4/1/15
Many here confuse spiritual death and physical death.
Mat 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me, and let the dead bury their dead.
---micha9344 on 4/1/15


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A little logic:

Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

This appears to be an "either-or" proposition, not an "and" one. That is, one cannot harmonize "death" with "eternal life", as sin is intrinsically paired with death, and the gift of God (in contradistinction to death), with eternal life. Life and death cannot co-exist simultaneously. So dead people cannot be alive until re-created in the resurrection at Jesus' second coming.



---jerry6593 on 4/1/15


Micha I believe all those verses. I just do not agree with your interpretation of them since you ignore the context of the statements.

For Example.

Mark 12:23-27
....And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?....And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.

This is about the Resurrection of the Dead.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 3/31/15


Yes as of now no one is in heaven because Jesus has not returned for the resurrection as of yet so only Jesus ascended to heaven. it is scriptual.
---candice on 3/29/15


Luke 9:59 And he said unto another, Follow me. But he said, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father. Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God.
2Sa 12:23 But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me.
Mark 12:27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
Luke 15:24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again, he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.
John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
Do you live and believe?
---micha9344 on 10/9/14


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Andy, If you read the whole Bible you will not find that God made a place called Limbo. It is a Roman Catholic invention.
---helen4633 on 10/7/14


"Are the dead really dead?" Yes.
"The living know they will die, but the dead know nothing at all." Why? There is no consciousness in death. There is no life in death. Death defined, is a cessation of life, dead defined, is an absence of life, whether in reference the spiritual or the natural.
---joseph on 10/7/14


Hello Andy

In the Seventh day Adventist church we teach that the dead are asleep and do not know what is going on in their families and no one is in Heaven or Hell yet.

This is a minority view among Christians called Conditionalism.

We also teach that Hell is a short term event and the wicked are punished exactly what they deserve then die.

As for the questions. No the dead are not really dead yet. They are asleep and do not know what is going on. There will be two resurrections when the dead come back to life. One of the Righteous and one of the wicked.

Revelation 20:5
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
---Samuelbb7 on 10/6/14


Andy Stout, welcome to Christianet. You will not find many people here who believe in Limbo. You have, obviously, formed your own opinion of what a Christian believes. I think that you are confusing us with 'church-goers'. Christians are church-goers but many church-goers are not Christians.

Please come here regularly and give us your views on all we say. We disagree amongst ourselves also but you'll learn by staying and participating.
---Rita_H on 10/5/14


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Instead of quoting from a book written by Bronze Age shepherds, try to THINK for a moment.

If you are still YOU in some place called heaven, then think of all the "people" there whose loved ones did not make it there! Their unbaptized babies are in Limbo, or a sister went to Hell, or someone you had an affair with makes it to heaven, which entails some "explaining" to the one you cheated on.

The only way heaven could work is if you are NOT you. The pain of being without your loved ones for eternity would be hell!

Heaven is such nonsense.


---Andy_Stout on 10/5/14


"But she who lives in pleasure is dead while she lives." (1 Timothy 5:6)

Is she really dead while she lives in pleasure? Yes!!

But we have how we are alive, in Jesus > "Now hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit who was given to us." (Romans 5:5) So, in the Holy Spirit, we already are alive in Heaven's own love, as much and maturely as we live in this all-loving love.

But those dead in pleasures could "reap" so much more "corruption", than what they sowed in this life > Galatians 6:7-8. They have their "corruption" of "lust" (2 Peter 1:4), now, and they could reap so much more love-dead stuff.
---com7fy8 on 10/4/14


It also depends on what you define as " dead". We died with Christ, right now as we speak. Yet we LIVE.
---kathr4453 on 10/3/14


Are the dead really dead?

1. YES! I see physically alive yet spiritually dead people all the time, everywhere, every day. Many for real zombies are dead & choose to remain as such. The only way they can live again is to be spiritually regenerated (BORN AGAIN)...

2. NO! We humans are, like our God, a trinity in composition. We are spirit man, soul (will, emotions, intellect: mind) & physical body beings. Jesus Christ has made it possible for all believers, while living on earth, to be BORN AGAIN (regenerated) in our spirit man. When our physical bodies die, our yet alive spirit & soul goes one of two places, i.e., BORN AGAIN to live with the LORD ~ not born again to live in hell...
---Leon on 10/3/14


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Currently no. I am in tn. If i get to go...I will be looking for my wife, children, and a few from here.

Nobody will precede another because the day of judgment has not passed.
---aka on 10/3/14


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