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Are you Sanctified

Jesus said Be you holy as I am holy. Do most Christians come anywhere near being holy like Jesus and how does Jesus holy behave?

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 ---Darlene_1 on 10/12/14
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Luke, you are the one putting down your FEELINGS and not fact.

You are also suggesting Jesus who is the author and finisher of "our faith" relied on His FEELINGS and not fact. You disparage Him by calling His anguish nothing more than FEELINGS. So when He Finished and also said IT IS FINISHED, was that just a feeling too, or did Jesus have complete and full control of Himself KNOWING in fact it was finished.

What makes your FEELINGS about this superior to thousands upon thousands of grounded teachers and preachers? Jesus experienced that separation as OUR Judgment....it was OUR sin, not His that brought about that momentary separation.

If Jesus feelings were not FACT then Jesus LIED right there on the Cross.
---kathr4453 on 10/29/14


Let me also re-iterate Luke the story of Job. The Feelings VS Facts of the friends of Job. God had a lot to say about those FEELINGS, that it was SIN, and in the end rebuked them because they did not speak right about God, telling Job to pray and make sacrifice for them and their sin.

To speak ANYTHING against the truth of God is SIN. it's called taking His name in Vain, accusing Him of something not true. Now YOU accuse Jesus, who is GOD, of doing the same thing, breaking one of the 10 commandments right there on the cross. If that were a fact, then you are still in your sin, for Jesus could not have died for yours or anyone else's. Remember SIN is what comes from our FEELINGS. FAITH is not nor will ever come from FEELINGS!
---kathr453 on 10/29/14


Will He forsake us too?
---Mark_Eaton on 10/28/14

Mark_Eaton, hopefully one day you will have a deeper understanding of the end of Romans 8...the very summary of Romans 6-8 promises to those IN Christ where NOW neither life, nor death, nor powers nor principalities, nor things to come etc etc etc, will ever SEPARATE US FROM THE LOVE OF GOD THAT IS IN CHRIST JESUS, belonging to those who have first been baptized into His DEATH freeing us from SIN and the consequences of sin including separation , taking OUR wrath and Judgement and punishment has forever secured our life, through His resurrection. And through 'His Risen life in us,we can know He will never leave us or forsake us. WHY, ..because Jesus paid it ALL. .
---kathr4453 on 10/29/14


//Believe what you will, but "Grace to You" is also a Calvinist web site. So even Calvinists believe as I posted. If perhaps you just don't GET IT, maybe someday you will. Obviously not today.//

Kathr, I also watch "grace to you" and have the sermons taped. What anyone says happen at the cross is only man's opinion. He is a commentator like all the others. When Jesus spoke those words, He was showing how He was feeling at the moment, it does not mean the Father was forsaken Him. He had feeling just like any of us who are human. He was speaking from His human heart. He cried like a human for Lazarus. But that doesn't mean that the Father forsake Him. Get it right
---Luke on 10/29/14


By the incarnation itself there already had been a partial separation. Because Jesus had been separated from His divine glory and from face-to-face communication with the Father, refusing to hold on to those divine privileges for His own sake (Phil 2:6), He prayed to the Father in the presence of His disciples, Glorify Thou Me together with Thyself, Father, with the glory which I had with Thee before the world was (John 17:5). At the cross His separation from the Father became immeasurably more profound than the humbling incarnation during the thirty-three years of His earthly life.

2 Corinthians 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin, that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
---kathr4453 on 10/28/14




Samuel, no I actually believe a LITERAL separation took place the moment our sin was placed on Jesus Christ. Faith does not go by FEELINGS but fact, and Jesus our perfect example of FAITH would not mislead anyone by saying what He was FEELING overrode fact. After all He is God. He LITERALLY experienced a separation at that moment. Those words are in Scripture spoken by God and cannot be brushed aside as a moment of confusion. WE all need to understand that the most horrible SUFFERING Jesus experienced for US was the suffering of being separated from the Father for that moment in time.
---kathr4453 on 10/28/14


If God could look upon sin...
---kathr4453 on 10/24/14

Sorry to take so long responding, I have been ill.

I respect the knowledge you have about God.

However, what you are saying is that The Father turned His back and forsook Jesus on the cross.

I cannot believe this.

The Father and Son have been in relationship since time eternal. There has never been a time that they were not in relationship, including the cross.

Have we forgotten that Jesus is the same as the Father? Jesus can see sin, why not the Father? Jesus said He would never forsake us, why not the Father?

And what does this say about us, about our relationship to the Father? Will He forsake us too?
---Mark_Eaton on 10/28/14


God could not look on His Son because it was impossible for God to look at sin. Jesus bore our sin on a cross.
---shira4368 on 10/27/14

If God cannot look at sin, who wrote this?

Jer. 17:9-10 "The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? I the Lord search the heart, I try the reins,even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings"

God (F/S/S) sees our hearts and the sin in our hearts.

What you doing is separating the Trinity and saying "The Father cannot do this but the Son and Holy Spirit Can".
---Mark_Eaton on 10/28/14


Luke, we all know you are MarkV so please stop with the foolishness.

Believe what you will, but "Grace to You" is also a Calvinist web site. So even Calvinists believe as I posted. If perhaps you just don't GET IT, maybe someday you will. Obviously not today.

In the OT God spoke to man through Angels and prophets and TODAY has spoken to us through His Son, just may give you some insight...maybe. But for you to say God is in Hell, that He will also co-exist in outer darkness for all eternity (where God is Light and in Him is no darkness) also shows you are a little off balance here in truth.
---kathr4453 on 10/28/14


I believe Kathr is using the term metaphorically. JESUS could not feel the presence of GOD because he had become sin.


2Co 5:21

For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin, that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

All sin and sinners in the end will be destroyed from existence since there is no place in the universe for sin to continue to exist after JESUS comes.
---Samuelbb7 on 10/28/14




// Because the Son had taken sin upon Himself, the Father turned His back.//

Kathr, I don't know who Mark V is, he must be a student of the word, because you mentioned him. You say the Father turned His back on Jesus. God does not have a back. He is Spirit. He sees all things, because He is Omnipotent, Omniscient, and Omnipresent. He is everywhere. How do you think the Holy Spirit saves sinful man? They are sinful when God makes them spiritually alive, and He makes them righteous granting them faith and repentance. Remember, Salvation is of the Lord, by the Lord. Only God can clean sinful man of his sin. If He doesn't see sin, how can He clean them of something He doesn't see? How can Jesus be separated from the Father who is also divine?
---Luke on 10/28/14


jesus never said, "Be you holy as I am holy." and holy and perfect(ed) are related but not the same.
---aka on 10/27/14


From "Grace to You"
In this unique and strange miracle, Jesus was crying out in anguish because of the separation He now experienced from His heavenly Father for the first and only time in all of eternity. It is the only time of which we have record that Jesus did not address God as Father. Because the Son had taken sin upon Himself, the Father turned His back. That mystery is so great and imponderable.. . In some way and by some means, in the secrets of divine sovereignty and omnipotence, the God-Man was separated from God for a brief time at Calvary, as the furious wrath of the Father was poured out on the sinless Son, who in matchless grace became sin for those who believe in Him.
---kathr4453 on 10/27/14


Luke,God could not look on His Son because it was impossible for God to look at sin. Jesus bore our sin on a cross.
---shira4368 on 10/27/14


Luke I use the KJV and would prefer that version.

Are you saying Jesus was relying on "FEELINGS "and not fact? And that His FEELINGS deceived Him? I think not!

Markv, or Luke, no one asked you to be the referee of Truth here, deciding who is right and wrong. remember you too are only human and not God. Therefore your comments are only OPINION. You are entitled to your "opinion".

This is what I and many many others believe regardless of your opinion.
---kathr4453 on 10/27/14


//To suggest Jesus was LYING when He said My God My God why have you forsaken me, why are you so far from me is something you need to ponder.//

Kathr, that Jesus said those words is very true. He did say them. He was not lying when He mentioned how He felt at that moment. What Mark E stated from Heb. 1:13 is a better interpretation of the passage,
"Heb. 1:13 (NASB) "Your eyes are too pure to approve evil, And You can not look on wickedness with favor"

In the NASB we see a better interpretation of the verse. "The Father can look on sin but not with approval or favor." The cry of Jesus in Matt. 27:46 is in fulfillment of (Ps. 22:1)
---Luke on 10/27/14


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Luke, You are free to believe what you wish, as well as I am. There is only ONE time in History Our sin was placed on Jesus Christ, who DIED for OUR sin. He was made flesh for the purpose of DYING, and at that DYING moment a separation took place. Whether God could look upon a sinful world is not the issue of what happened ONLY at the cross.

To suggest Jesus was LYING when He said My God My God why have you forsaken me, why are you so far from me is something you need to ponder.

When You have experienced Romans 6 and your identification with Jesus in death and resurrection life, you will understand something that only comes by personal experience leading to personal revelation of truths.
---kathr4453 on 10/26/14


This is correct and give clarity the references I gave in the post on 10/21 concerning Holiness.
1Pet.1:16>Lev.20:26>Lev.11:44,45>Deut.14:2> Deut.18:13>Deut.28:9>Zec 4:6>Eze.36:27-29
---joseph on 10/26/14


//It was the flesh of Christ where our sin and sin from beginning to end was placed God could not look at.//

Kathr, this statement cannot be correct for the simple reason that God is Omniscient, He knows all things, because He sees all things. He is every where even in Hell itself. He has been looking at sinful man from the beginning.
But I understand what you are referring to. That sinful man cannot come before God, they need a Mediator, Jesus Christ. God does not hear the prayers of sinful man, I mean the lost, not because He cannot, but because He choses not to. The reason sinful man need Jesus Christ. Is that what you are talking about?
---Luke on 10/26/14


Thank you chria9396. Nice of you to say so. Giving all praise to the Father.
---joseph on 10/25/14


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Luke also remember we are sanctified THROUGH the Body of Christ once and for all, making us acceptable to enter the Holy of Holies, through the veil, that is to say His Flesh, having our sin done away in Christ. "Sin" separated God from Man. SIN will always separate God from man. And it is only through Jesus Christ we are no longer separated. Does God hear the prayers of the wicked? Scripture says NO.

Hab 1:13 clearly say a Holy God cannot look upon sin. I believe like many that at that moment our sin was placed on Jesus Christ in the FLESH, God looked away from Jesus in the flesh, yet never in the Spirit. It was the flesh of Christ where our sin and sin from beginning to end was placed God could not look at.
---kathr4453 on 10/25/14


Kathr, I believe you are correct when you are speaking of the Temple in the Old Testament and when Jesus died and the veil came down. But I believe you are wrong concerning God not seeing sin, or be aware of sin. Mark E is correct concerning Heb. :13 concerning Jesus. The NASB is the correct understanding of the passage.
Concerning the Temple, now that we are born of God we can enter the Holy of Holies because we have a Great High Priest. In the Old Testament only the high priest could enter once a year, and he had to be sanctified, otherwise God would kill him.
---Luke on 10/25/14


joseph,

Your replies are blessings.

Thank you.
---chria9396 on 10/25/14


It is also important to remember when Jesus cried out on the cross, "IT IS FINISHED" the Veil in the temple was rent meaning torn from TOP to bottom, showing no man could have done this. The rent veil, ..the same pattern and picture of the tabernacle in the wilderness showed the way into the Holy of Holies had been opened.

So all your websites who don't bring these facts into it, are not truly real teachers of the truth to begin with, or ones who just have a very shallow superficial understanding of the Gospel in the first place.
---kathr4453 on 10/24/14


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Mark_Eaton, whatever you believe, you can find a plethora of very gifted Christian teachers and pastors who believe just as I stated. The picture of the Tabernacle in the wilderness, patterned after Heaven itself teaches that in the Holy of Holies where God abides, no one could enter in but the High priest alone, but he first had to make sacrifice for sin and sprinkling of blood. If God could look upon sin, this picture of the Holy of Holies, the veil, etc would not be not only not necessary but the very truth that no one can come to the Father EXCEPT THROUGH His Son would be a lie. Jesus opened the way TO the Father.

Thank you for taking the bait.
---kathr4453 on 10/24/14


Some here like to cause a fuss when there is none.
---kathr4453 on 10/24/14

You baited me and I will answer you.

The only verse remotely connected to the Father being "unable" to look at sin is:

Hab 1:13 (NASB) "Your eyes are too pure to approve evil, And You can not look on wickedness with favor"

In the NASB we see the correct understating of the verse. The Father can look on sin but not with approval or favor.

Did not God see the sin of Adam? God saw the sin of mankind and sent the flood. In Job, we see God talking with Satan, who is the embodiment of sin.

Over and over we see examples of God looking on sin.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/24/14


Gayla, you are correct... Jesus saying My God My God why has thou forsaken me. We all knew what you meant. Some here like to cause a fuss when there is none.

Jesus became SIN for us, and at that moment when OUR SIN was placed on Jesus, God who cannot look upon sin turned away...but only for that moment in time. The most aweful of Jesus sufferings was when our sin was placed on Him and there was that moment of separation because of it.

IF others don't know this, don't believe this or even don't understand this, it is their problem, not yours.
God bless!
---kathr4453 on 10/24/14


||Father, why have thou forsaken me? He was without Gods presence at that time.
---Gayla on 10/19/14 ||

You misquoted the verse.

Look it up again in the Passion according to St. Matthew--27th chapter, I think.

Then compare what you read with Psalm 22 (21LXX).

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/23/14


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Father, why have thou forsaken me? He was without Gods presence at that time.
---Gayla on 10/19/14

As a man suffering he felt as we would feel. He felt what pre King David felt, or Gayla or any would have. As fulfilling scripture with these words he did that also.

Psa 71:10 For mine enemies speak against me, and they that lay wait for my soul take counsel together,
Psa 71:11 Saying, God hath forsaken him: persecute and take him, for there is none to deliver him.
Isa_54:7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee, but with great mercies will I gather thee.
Job_5:8 I would seek unto God, and unto God would I commit my cause:
---Trav on 10/23/14


I agree that we are supposed to be Holy. For as disciples of Christ we have become the Children of GOD and we are to be like our Father in Heaven.


Mat 5:16
Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

So Amen and Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 10/22/14


Therefore, I see Holiness as an aspect of who I am in Him."For if the firstfruit [be] Holy the lump is also Holy: and if the Root be Holy, so are the branches."
---joseph on 10/21/14

AMEN!
---kathr4453 on 10/22/14


Samuel what saying are you referring to? Aka, that was a quote from the question. My statement "that was a declaration" was a reference to "be you holy as I am holy", and how that is possible. 1Pet.1:16>Lev.20:26>11:14>11:45>Deut.14:2>18:2>28:9>Eze.36:27-29
I have no argument with those who seek holiness. However, for me, I simply receive Father's word "I will put My Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my principles, and you will keep my judgments and do them." Therefore, I see Holiness as an aspect of who I am in Him."For if the firstfruit [be] Holy the lump is also Holy: and if the Root be Holy, so are the branches."
---joseph on 10/21/14


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Karen4453 ha ha,thank you and the feeling is shared. I'm praying for you and your husband in your new ministry,may God bless and use y'all greatly. Be looking forward to future when maybe you'll share some of yours and Gods victories. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 10/21/14


Karen 4453 opps

Opps again. This is too funny.

Darlene1, no matter what names you use disguising yours or mine HA! .... Love ya anyway!!
---kathr4453 on 10/21/14


Karen 4453 opps I messed up again in my last post to you put a 5 and not a 3 but thanks for the welcome,it always good to see someone who cares enough to welcome new people. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 10/20/14


Father, why have thou forsaken me? He was without Gods presence at that time.
---Gayla on 10/19/14

Really? I cannot believe that.

How many times in your life has sin creep in and you questioned "where are you God"?

Sin interrupts our connection to God, but does God really go someplace else? No, God sees us thru the despair, and agony of sin's emptiness.

Having known no sin, Jesus on the cross finally knows sin and says the same thing we have said hundreds of times. But God The Father was still right there with Jesus.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/20/14


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Kathr4455 ha ha the thing messed up or I did when entering my Email address and Name and came out Df but its just the same 'ole Darlene 1 .God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 10/20/14


Welcome to CN DF. It's good to,see so many here are grounded in who we are in Christ. Df, along the lines of what you just said, i agree. What comes to mind is when Jesus was tested for 40 days, Satan tempting Jesus to sin, even using scripture, yet Jesus without sin overcame Satan. And it is only Christ in us that we overcome. As humans, we do fail, but the truth is, we get up, learn from our weaknesses, and grow even stronger, maturing in the Lord.

God Bless.
---kathr4453 on 10/19/14


Kathr4453 Thank you for all those verses. When we commit our all to God through Jesus we will have the desire to serve Him and in so doing we will cleanse all parts of our being no longer to be a slave to the flesh but walking in the Spirit. Do God's people understand the strength of God's hand and what He does to make us holy. Some think bad thoughts are sin,if we have them,rebuke them in Jesus Name and don't let Satan take hold of our thoughts then it isn't sin. It's only when people entertain bad thoughts do they become sin. Satan comes to steal,kill,and destroy but God has given us power over all the power of the enemy in Jesus Name. Our power is the power of God,the Spirit giving us Holy Boldness to fight. God Bless
---Df on 10/19/14


Hebrews 13:20-21

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.


And these verses sum it all up. All we have, all we are all we will ever be is only THROUGH Jesus Christ to whom alone belongs Glory forever and ever.
---kathr4453 on 10/19/14


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Actually Joseph I cannot find that saying in the King James. Is it in another translation?

JESUS did say.


Jhn 17:19

And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

Through the truth of the word of GOD we are changed from living in sin. To loving and living and walking in righteousness. Because we love we die to self daily to live for JESUS.


1Co 15:31

I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.
---Samuelbbb7 on 10/19/14


//"Jesus said Be you holy as I am holy." joseph// where?
//Holiness means perfect.// kathr

they are related, but they are neither synonyms nor interchangeable. perfection seems to have to do with the maturation process where completeness is the end. and, then, one can be considered holy or blameless or sanctified.

but, jesus never said, "Be you holy as I am holy."

Do most Christians come anywhere near being[perfected]? a few..mostly not in this lifetime. Do most Christians come anywhere near being holy? Yes. when they are sanctified by the only perfected one..Jesus Christ.

how does Jesus holy behave? by keeping the will of the Father perfectly. Can any of us claim that in this lifetime?
---aka on 10/19/14


Mark Eden~ I disagree that the Father cannot look away from sin, He did so when His Son was on the cross. Jesus was in complete agony when this happened, His very words were : Father, why have thou forsaken me? He was without Gods presence at that time.
---Gayla on 10/19/14


"Jesus said Be you holy as I am holy." That was a declaration, not a request, command, or admonishment. In Him believers are Holy, because He is Holy. We are to recognized, acknowledge, and embrace that fact. Knowing that as believers, Father has set us apart for His purpose, and it is He who empowers us for that purpose. "For it is [He] who works in [us] both to will and to do for His good pleasure".
---joseph on 10/19/14


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Thanks Kathr. Your posts gave lots of good scriptures confirming our position of holiness, in Christ.

Satan cannot charge us with sin any longer.
Rom 8:33 Who shall lay ANY THING to the charge of God's elect?

Confirmed also in 1 Peter 1:4 you quoted.
Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh (crucified) arm yourselves likewise with the same mind(our old man crucified with him, Rom 6:6) for he that hath suffered in the flesh (Rom 6:6) hath CEASED from sin
2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men (unbelief) but to the will of God
(believe on Jesus, John 6:40).

The sin the world is convicted of is unbelief in Jesus, John 16:9.
---Haz27 on 10/18/14


Mark_Eaton, Yes I agree here with you, but also must point out that not only had Peter known there was a solution to this area of sin, but as God's Apostle has also told us HOW God..."yes Praise the Lord," deals with sin. Paul also told us this too in Romans 6-8. God would never ask us to do anything He has not provided a way to do it.


1 Peter 1:4 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin,

2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

Praise the Lord for ALL HE HAS DONE!
---kathr4453 on 10/17/14


Amen Kathr and Mark-eaton

Great and beautiful points.

Let Us Praise the LORD.

Amen
---Samuelbb7 on 10/16/14


one might also see as true Holiness.
---kathr4453 on 10/16/14

I very much agree with this definition of holiness.

As you have said "Christ overcame the world/ separation from this world/ crucified to the world and the world to them". This I believe is true holiness, not holiness viewed as sinlessness.

We do need to be concerned with sin and never forget sin. But sin is not just the acts or the breaking of the rules. These are the symptoms. Sin is a disease that destroys both our humanity and the very existence God wants for us. It destroys more than just our relationship with God, it destroys our psyche (Soul & Spirit) to the point that we do not want a relationship with God.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/16/14


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Also in 1st John says "you KNOW you have passed from death to life when you love the brethren." This is a very important key verse...passing from death to life. It means here and now. Funny how some say the other apostles didn't preach the cross. This IS the CROSS, as only through the cross can one now pass from death to life, all explained in Romans 6-8. AND it's only the NEW creature now walking in NEW life that can KNOW the perfect will of God. Only the transformed mind, the mind of Christ, taking you to HIGHER GROUND, through powers and principalities, OVERCOMING the world, as Christ overcame the world/ separation from this world/ crucified to the world and the world to them( Galatians 6) ...one might also see as true Holiness.
---kathr4453 on 10/16/14


The transformation of your mind only comes as a result of obeying these verses.
kathr4453

Agreed. We turn from hate to love and love results in our obeying GOD and caring for others.


1Jo 2:9-10

He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.
---Samuelbb7 on 10/15/14


Devotion and worship are not about "BEHAVIOR", it is all about BEING ACCEPTABLE.

I don't kneel or bow to God, I curtsy to Him (a curtsy is a mideival expression of THE JOY of being acceptable to one's lord).

Keep the PRINCIPLES/precepts of the law.

It is impossible to be DIVINE holy, we can only be trusting enough that God accepts us even though were inferior and unable to be worthy of His gifts.

Rom 2:26 RSV So, if a man who is uncircumcised keeps the precepts of the law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision?

...(the old word for SANCTIFIED was "CIRCUMCISED").
---faithforfaith on 10/15/14


Romans 12:1..I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
Herein lies the secret of Holiness, because only those who have presented themselves a living sacrifice are truly "set apart". Paul calls this our "reasonable" service, not some extraordinary service. I recommend these verses to all who are saved. The transformation of your mind only comes as a result of obeying these verses.
---kathr4453 on 10/15/14


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Romans 12:1

12 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

If people believed they had to first achieve holiness to obey this verse, God have mercy on us all.
---kathr4453 on 10/14/14


ok Mark_Eaton, but only those IN Christ have access through Christ into the Holy of Holies into the very presence of God Himself. No one can come to the Father except through Jesus Christ. We are being changed from Glory to Glory by the Spirit of the Lord. We are hidden with Christ in God....colossians 3:1-4. Yes the very Triune God is in us and has sealed us. I in then and thou in me that we may be one.

We are Holy because Christ in us is Holy. We have no holiness of our own. Someone saved today who dies tomorrow is just as holy as someone who has been saved for 50 years.
---kathr4453 on 10/14/14


And remember we are sanctified through the body of Christ ONCE and for all. We are complete in Him, meaning perfect.

Those in Corinthians, carnal as they were were still SAINTS meaning Holy Sanctified. Just read the beginning of Paul's letter to them.


And NO darlene1, you can't loose your salvation...once saved, always saved.


You can loose your rewards, but never your salvation.
---kathr453 on 10/14/14


yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy...
---kathr453 on 10/14/14

Believe it or not, the Triune God and mankind are in union in the God-Man Jesus.

By and in and through Jesus all the cosmos was created. Jesus sustains and upholds the cosmos. He is the light and the life of the cosmos.

And now following His resurrection, Jesus is at the right hand of God bringing humanity into the innermost circle of the Trinity. We are brought in to share the Trinitarian life.

Jesus reconciled the entire world thru his death, not just Christians. It is only Christians who accept this gift.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/14/14


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Colossians 1:21-22
21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:


Again I cannot reiterate enough that THIS is the work of the Lord through our identification with Him in death and resurrection life.
---kathr453 on 10/14/14


Ephesians 1:4

According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Eph 5:27

Rev 22:11

He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

We are made Holy by the Blood of JESUS but by His indwelling Spirit we become Holy.
---Samuelbb7 on 10/14/14


Holiness is someone totally removed from sin He couldn't even look at it. It's not an attribute we can emulate because it is the very essence of God Himself
---kathr4453 on 10/14/14

Aha...

God the Father is Holy and cannot look at sin yet His Son became sin for us so that we might become the righteousness of God in His Son. Is that how you read this?

Yet, in the Trinity, with continual mutual indwelling, Jesus never leaves relationship with the Father, there is no separation while here on Earth.

Therefore, how exactly does the Father look away? He does not.

The attribute of God that is unique and cannot be emulated is the Trinity.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/14/14


Mark Eaton All one has to do is study the Old and New Testament and how God punished sinners because it says God hates sin,to see you think that one can be holy with blatant sin in their lives makes me heartsick. It says plainly in the NT if you fall back and sin God has no pleasure in you or anyone who does. It also says we will be cast out if we fall back. God loves all human kind so much He sent Jesus as the Lamb for sacrifice but the key is sinners do not have fellowship with God only sons of God who obey Him and His Word,and Love God with all of our heart,mind,soul,strength and our entire being. When we put God first in our lives we don't want to sin and fight any and all temptation. Get thee behind me Satan in Jesus name. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 10/14/14


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Mark_Eaton, COMMON SENSE is all one needs to know Holiness is someone totally removed from sin He couldn't even look at it. It's not an attribute we can emulate because it is the very essence of God Himself.

It's not even a fruit of the spirit.


We are PERFECT in Him ONLY, and as you said, Holiness means perfect.

The HOLY OF HOLIES is where God alone dwelt separating Himself from a sinful world. This is all spelled out when God told Moses to build the tabernacle in the wilderness exactly after a pattern of things in heaven. A Veil separated the Holy of Holies between God and man. Only the High priest could enter in.. today Jesus is that veil who's torn flesh opened the way between God and man.
---kathr4453 on 10/14/14


Seriously???
---kathr4453 on 10/14/14

Yes.

The entire Bible is a witness to the holiness of God but where did God say this meant sinlessness?

When your child has committed a wrong and you love them even when you know they have committed it, eventually the child will be compelled to confess the wrong. God is the embodiment of love, pure love, other-centered love. Coming face to face with this kind of love would definitely make us realize how sinful we are.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/14/14


I accept and agree with your definition of holy as being set apart. But the sinless aspect of holiness, where does that come from?///

Seriously???


Holy Holy Holy Lord God Almighty.

Isaiah was a firsthand witness of Gods holiness in his vision described in Isaiah 6. Even though Isaiah was a prophet of God and a righteous man, his reaction to the vision of Gods holiness was to be aware of his own sinfulness and to despair for his life (Isaiah 6:5). Even the angels in Gods presence, those who were crying, Holy, holy, holy is the LORD Almighty, covered their faces and feet
---kathr4453 on 10/14/14


And Holy also means absolute total perfection of being sinless...
---kathr4453 on 10/13/14

BCV please.

I accept and agree with your definition of holy as being set apart. But the sinless aspect of holiness, where does that come from?

We relate holiness to God but is holiness an attribute of God or is it the essence of God?

From time eternal God is Holy. But sin entered the world at a point in time. Therefore, holiness and sin cannot go together. If holiness is being sinless, then what is holiness without sin?

I submit that the holiness of God is the Trinity of God and the exclusivity of the Trinity.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/14/14


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//Can you or anyone here give me a definition of what holy means that comes from the Bible?//

let me give you the opposite of holy to explain holy.

The opposite of holy is common, not sinful. What Aaron's sons did was take common fire from the camp and put it in the place of holy fire in the tabernacle which is sinful, but the fire itself was not bad. Their is nothing special about Saturday to be sabbath except God choose it.
---Scott1 on 10/14/14


Jesus said Be you holy as I am holy.
---Darlene_1 on 10/12/14

Before any get miffed at these scriptures below...consider why you asked the question or answered and why you even search/care. Foundation language below. Eyes see, do the ears.....

Isa 51:1 Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged.
Isa 51:2 Look unto Abraham your father, unto Sarah that bare you: for I called him alone, blessed him, and increased him.
Hos_2:19 I will betroth thee unto me for ever, yea, I will betroth thee unto me in righteousness, in judgment, in lovingkindness, and in mercies.
---Trav on 10/14/14


Holy means to be set apart.

And Holy also means absolute total perfection of being sinless. No one can achieve this in practice in this lifetime.

Our Righteousness is the righteousness of Christ that is imputed not imparted.

Growing and being more and more conformed to His image does not make one person Holier than another. This idea breeds pride and self righteousness.
---kathr4453 on 10/13/14


Isn't it important to be holy while we make this journey with Christ since He gives the His strength to us to overcome evil?
---Darlene_1 on 10/13/14

Can you or anyone here give me a definition of what holy means that comes from the Bible?

I submit to you all that the current Evangelical definition of holy has been hijacked and turns the work of Jesus on its head.

If God is holy in a legalistic sense and cannot allow sin to go unpunished, then salvation moves God to not punish us and changes God's attitude towards us. But Scripture says that God never changes?

Scripture also says that God was in Jesus reconciling the world to Himself. We are the ones who do the moving. We are moved to be reconciled to God.
---Mark_Eaton on 10/13/14


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aka thanks for the verse. Lawrence I am an Acts 2:38 person too so I understand what you are saying. Cluny that is an interesting concept but I have never heard we keep growing even in heaven,are there any verses for that? Shira I agree that we are instantly saved and then grow in the Lord in knowledge but I would add wisdom,faith,trust,and many others to that. Learner2 yes our Christian life is a journey and it is a long way with much to learn in our Spiritual walk. What is the important difference in a process and an event? Thank you all. Isn't it important to be holy while we make this journey with Christ since He gives the His strength to us to overcome evil? God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 10/13/14


Hebrews 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Colossians 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

ALL Christians are Holy as He is Holy because it is HIS HOLINESS God sees in us.
---kathr4453 on 10/13/14


Darlene, this is the only verse that comes near to the paraphrase that you used.

Mat 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

it is from the Greek word teleios, which means complete.

As to the event or process...
it is a process, that will culminate to an event.
---aka on 10/13/14


Theosis--growing more and more into the full image and likeness of God--is something that starts in this life and is a continuing process, even in the next one.

And we never will reach the end, because God is infinite.

Instead, we grow from glory to glory.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/13/14


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It's All part of Acts 2 v 38 salvation of God.

Not any part of lying 2nd working of grace as like the 3 persons godhead peoples say.

Glory to God The Father which who Is Jesus Christ.
---Lawrence on 10/13/14


I can tell you salvation is an event. Being Born of the Spirit is not a long term gradual happening. When we accept Christ, we are instantly saved. Then we start to grow in the knowledge of the Lord. We finally are seasoned and no longer need milk.
---shira4368 on 10/12/14


Becoming a true Christian is a process, not an event. We all have a great deal to learn and a great distance to go yet.
---learner2 on 10/12/14


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