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Evolution Biblical Concept

Is evolution a Biblical concept?

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 ---Eno_Asuquo on 12/2/14
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Trav, you are all talk, and a wimp. You have debated many issues, ardently, for years but when challenged to do so publically, you fold!

Indeed you post much Scripture, much of it irrelevant to the point.
---Warwick on 12/23/14


Trav, if you have actually posted Scriptures which explain your position ...
---Warwick on 12/21/14

At most I've claimed to be a "sheep" dog. Not a horse.
My position?? Scriptures. Scriptures are GOD's position. I honor them. Your personal accusations are against scripture posted! Scripture witnessing Scripture. You've never addressed these scriptures posted! Ever. Sheep notably infuriate you!
Your lip is bloody and you're blinking like a Neon Sign..."Imposter, no scripture required".
I've never positionally posted what I don't know...and never will. Unlike ahhhh, yourself.
You idolizing yourself as a golden "roo" makes you your own false "yobbo" god.
---Trav on 12/22/14


Trav, Are you game to debate such as me?
---Warwick on 12/21/14

Difference between us? This is not a game. Truth never debates. You either see it or you are kept from it.
You sir sadly are kept from seeing or utilizing scripture.
Every scripture I've posted is in print for perpetuity vs your complete lack of.
It is not me you desire to silence...it is all scriptures you have no answer for. Foolish to think you can ever "silence" scripture or me.
GOD willing I'll visit OZ personally pointing sheep scripture to "Sheep" that your "dog-ma" avoids. I'll not be the draw to your radio sheep slaughterhouse. My scripture eradicates balaam's wolves, it doesn't partake with them.
---Trav on 12/22/14


Of course evolution is a man made concept.
---Jimbo on 12/22/14


Trav, I forgot to remind you that the opportunity for you and me to debate these issues, live, on radio and streamed world-wide, is still available to you. Are you game to debate such as me?
---Warwick on 12/21/14




Trav, if you have actually posted Scriptures which explain your position then your position should be clear but it isn't! Just step down from you angry high-horse position and make your belief clear by answering the question:

"Do you say that non-Jews, those people not descended from any of the Hebrew tribes, cannot be saved through Jesus atoning death and resurrection?"

For a self-proclaimed Scriptural expert this question should be easy to answer. But...
---Warwick on 12/21/14


In many veiled ways Trav has said that only the descendants of Israel and Judah are eligible for salvation.
He refuses to answer, probably knowing that this belief would be rejected by the vast majority here, if he plainly stated what he believes.
---Warwick on 12/20/14

But, preacherman this site respects no opinion. Anyone but a "poser" would address the hundreds of scriptures I've posted. You cannot because you are an imposter first and second there are no scriptures to refute what infuriates you.
You remind me daily of my Concrete walk. Thoroughly mixed up and firmly set.

Eze_37:28 the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
---Trav on 12/21/14


Aka, you wrote "Again and again, nobody said only Jews can be saved." I have to disagree. In many veiled ways Trav has said that only the descendants of Israel and Judah are eligible for salvation. I have given him many opportunities to say whether this is or isn't what he believes. He refuses to answer, probably knowing that this belief would be rejected by the vast majority here, if he plainly stated what he believes.

This is not to say that everyone will be saved but to say that no race of people are excluded from salvation.
---Warwick on 12/20/14


Warwick, I'm so glad that you posted "I never knew you, depart from me." Again and again, nobody said only Jews can be saved. Stated many times, Jews minus goats are only a fraction. Nevertheless, no matter how "miraculous" one's deeds in jesus' name are, jesus will not recognize them as his. Therefore, is is not wiser to stay away from the final answer than it is to state emphatically that everybody can be saved as is done in modern Christianity? The latter goes against what scripture that you just posted.
---aka on 12/20/14


Trav, that you will not admit your belief means your posted Scriptures are but evasion. It is heresy to tell non-Jews they cannot be saved by Jesus. Evil is as evil does. And that is but one of your heretical beliefs. The sheep say BAA to you and your prophets are false.

"Crucify" you? Never even thought as much. But a long walk off a short pier may do you some good!

"And then will I declare to them, I never knew you, depart from me, you workers of lawlessness" Matthew 7:23

"When once the master of the house has risen and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, open to us, then he will answer you, I do not know where you come from" Luke 13:25.
---Warwick on 12/20/14




I had written more to post then what was posted ( Chria9396 on 12/4/14), but do not have those notes with me. Will simply add, for now, that I do not believe in "evolution", as conceptualized by man. I also have never seen the words 'evolve' or 'evolution' in the bible.

Evolve, and therefore evolution are terms which may be used, simply depending on how those terms are defined and used. However, since "evolution" in the general population is used almost exclusively in one way, it may not be the best choice of words in some/other situations. I'd prefer to trace words back to the original, rather then find new ways of telling and describing an idea, concept, precept that may be found in the bible ...
---Chria9396 on 12/19/14


Trav,
No amount of truncated sentences and insults can change your heresy.
---Warwick on 12/18/14

When posted Scripture, is "Heresy"...to a preacherman, that tells any sheep searching all they need to know.
You attempt to crucify me to take light off scripture. You...thinking you are greater than GOD's witnesses. Amazing. Amazing times, wonderful GOD.
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach (proclaim) any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached (proclaimed), let him be accursed.
Hos 1:11 Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.
---Trav on 12/19/14


Cluny: "St. Paul says in 1 Cor 13 that at adulthood, we put away childish things."

And Jesus says:

Mat 18:2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
Mat 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 18:4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.

You could use a little child-like humility.

Glory to the six-day Creator Jesus Christ!


---jerry6593 on 12/19/14


\\If only people would read the bible through the eyes of a child and not through an overly educated person.
---Steveng on 12/16/14\\

Then you would simply have the immature understanding of a child.

St. Paul says in 1 Cor 13 that at adulthood, we put away childish things.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/18/14


Trav, I will leave you to your waffle, aware that you believe we (who are not the physical descendants of any Hebrew tribe) cannot be saved by Jesus sacrifice. No amount of truncated sentences and insults can change your heresy.
---Warwick on 12/18/14


... silly boy,
... we are about the only ones here who bother to blog with you.
---Warwick on 12/17/14

Ummmm, silly boy ate your guard dogs, now your barking?
You blog because my posted scripture infuriates you. This is your work,...to make visible what you'd hide. Ironic beauty of it is wonderful. Israels GOD is wonderful.
Luk_1:68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel, for he hath visited,redeemed his people,
Jer_23:2 ... saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people, Ye have scattered my flock, driven them away, have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD.
Isa_41:17 When poor and needy seek water, ...the God of Israel will not forsake them.
---Trav on 12/18/14


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If only people would read the bible through the eyes of a child and not through an overly educated person.
---Steveng on 12/16/14

Understand what you are saying.
Scripture doesn't say everyone will make it though. Jesus spoke in parables and division for those that could understand...those that can't never will. This site makes some of the "division" apparent. While I'm always hopeful when posting scripture that any may see it uniting and binding scripture front to back...the ones we'd expect to (boasting as preachers) are usually the blindest. Scripture infuriates these. A sign, or tell as in poker. They have no hand in the game, puff-bluffers.
Mat_7:14 ...few there be that find it.
Mat_22:14
---Trav on 12/18/14


Trav, amazingly,...you admit "Almost none take my posted scripture serious..."
BTW... resurrection?"
---Warwick on 12/17/14

But, you make my point continuously, being amazed as Balaam was. Scripture is posted for "sheep" that receive it. Christ rejoices for 1 lost sheep out of 99, I also. Luk_15:6 ... Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost.
Sheep quietly graze on scripture, chewing, considering that which edify's their bodies. Wolves snarl and howl when scripture hedges sheep.
Sheep don't attack or bite. Wolves do.
Resurrection: Howl at Eze 37. Mat 22:29-32 I am the God of Abraham, God of Isaac, the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
---Trav on 12/18/14


My New Year's resolution? To get "almost none" down to "none"!
---Marc on 12/17/14

Dearest Yobo.
Good call waiting a couple of weeks. Sounds like all prophets and 11 Apostles ruined this years resolutions for ya. This way your newest against any "sheep" resolution poofs early in new year, every new year. Scripture ate your dogs for barking, ur re-solution will make a teeth cleaning chew toy. Merry Christmas, New Year not looking pretty for ya.
Luk 13:27 But he shall say, I tell you, ...
Luk 13:28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
---Trav on 12/18/14


Trav, amazingly, taking the words out of my mouth you admit "Almost none take my posted scripture serious..." I didn't know that you had finally worked that out!

You know you are a silly boy, you are becoming increasingly rude to me, and Marc, and we are about the only ones here who bother to blog with you.

BTW you still haven't answered my question: "Do you say that non-Jews, those people not descended from any of the Hebrew tribes, cannot be saved through Jesus atoning death and resurrection?"


---Warwick on 12/17/14


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""This is why we have so many worldly denominational "churches."""

One of these is the worldly denominational "church" of Steveng.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/17/14


Trav: "Almost none take my posted scripture serious"

My New Year's resolution? To get "almost none" down to "none"!

On second thoughts, Trav, you better take the whole bottle of green pills. Your present daily one doesn't seem to be working too well.
---Marc on 12/17/14


Trav,
... biggest delusion you hold is that you daily tell yourself people actually take you seriously... a delusion of grandeur.
---Marc on 12/16/14

You do.
Dearest, yobbo. Which delusional scriptures infuriated you so ?? Almost none take my posted scripture serious...cept you and daddy.
You remind me totally of your daddy "wazza". You two "hang out on the beach" do ya?
Wazzadaddy needs scriptural help. Unfortunately you display to "all" you aren't capable. Instead we get to see you in a "fearful" public rage?? Hmmm. Understand completely.
Act_4:25 Who by the mouth of thy servant David hast said, Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things?
---Trav on 12/17/14


Trav, the question is: "Do you agree that non-Jews, those people not descended from any of the Hebrew tribes can be saved through Jesus atoning death and resurrection?"

That you refuse to answer this question speaks volumes. It is important that people know what bizarre nonChristian beliefs you hold.

In an obvious attempt to avoid answering the question you cunningly change the question writing "You cannot find anywhere where I've said "ethnos" divorced Israel cannot be saved." Cunning, but not cunning enough.

I think very few will be fooled by this trickery.
---Warwick on 12/16/14


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Trav, parables serve two purposes: one, God's people will understand the parable using spiritual knowledge and, two, the worldly person will try to understand the parable using worldly knowledge.

This is why we have so many worldly denominational "churches." A person and his small group breaks away from an establish denomination only to form another denomination based upon what he thinks are true rituals, traditions, ways of living and worldly interpretations of the bible.

If only people would read the bible through the eyes of a child and not through an overly educated person.
---Steveng on 12/16/14


You do realise, Trav, you have some pretty serious mental health issues, don't you?

But perhaps the biggest delusion you hold is that you daily tell yourself people actually take you seriously. That's called a delusion of grandeur. I guess you think you're some sort of prophet. You are just outright dumb and crazy trying to mislead and drag people into your own insanity. America - I lived there for many years - has potfuls of guys running around the 50 states all believing God speaks to them. Whether it be the Watchtower version of insanity, the Morons' manipulation or Trav's simpleton product, madness is madness is madness.
---Marc on 12/16/14


When God speaks (either by himself or through his prophets), he speaks so man can understand.
---Steveng on 12/15/14

If every man could understand there should only be one church.
On a basis of light and dark...men that understand light and men that don't, there should be two groups.

Mat 13:19 "When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not", then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
In the good crop there are tares. Poser weeds look similar to good seed(sheep)...but aren't. Scripturally marked.

Mat_13:25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat....
---Trav on 12/16/14


When God speaks (either by himself or through his prophets), he speaks so man can understand.
---Steveng on 12/15/14

Yes...but, GOD confuses many men. Example, warwick. Jesus only spoke in parables and tells why.
Mat_13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not, hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
Mat_13:34 ... and without a parable spake he not unto them:
Mat_13:35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.
1Co_1:19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.
---Trav on 12/16/14


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Trav,
It is a yes or no answer! But you won't do it as you don't want your heresy known.
---Warwick on 12/15/14

Heresy..here's your scripture lesson today, Pop Test later on "law and Prophets". Can't pass, if you don't learn to spell "Prophet", wickyesno.
Act_24:14 But this I confess unto thee, that after the way which they call heresy, so worship I the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the law and in the prophets:

For the third time, I'll post that I look for what the Lord looks for "sheep" and their witness. It is wrong to presume about anyone.
Even the 5 of the 10 virgins of Israel, who were foolish, wasting their light.
---Trav on 12/16/14


God is not a god of confusion. When God speaks (either by himself or through his prophets), he speaks so man can understand. If spiritual matters cannot be understood by man, he speaks in parables. When God says he created everyting in six days (morning and evening), that's exactly how he created the universe.

Take a look at the miracles Jesus did. How long did it take for the storm to calm down? How long would it take for the water to turn to wine? How long was the healing process to heal all the sick? How long did it take to gather food for 5,000? How long did it take to restore a severed ear? Last, but not least, how long would it take to bring the dead back to life?
---Steveng on 12/15/14


Trav, you can sort this all out immediately. Do you agree that non-Jews, those people not descended from any of the Hebrew tribes can be saved through Jesus atoning death and resurrection?

It is a yes or no answer! But you won't do it as you don't want your heresy known.
---Warwick on 12/15/14


Trav,
You say, (contrary to Scripture) that we Gentiles (as distinct from Jews) cannot be saved. Heresy!
---Warwick on 12/15/14

Evade? And you ducking my last request. Wow.
Gentile was not in any original.
Yes prophets roll you up, along with bullinger,gill etc. Can't be your prophets, ...you state you don't need them. Indeed as you've never once referenced them. Amazing.
You cannot find anywhere where I've said "ethnos" divorced Israel cannot be saved.
Judah does not equal all Israel. Ever. Always amazed that I must detail that for you.
John 7:35 where the Pharisees said, Will He go unto the dispersed among the Gentiles
BTW: Greek is a national term not Racial.
---Trav on 12/15/14


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Trav, you attempt to evade the point-"Gentiles" are not Jews. Jews today defined as those descended both from Judah, and Israel. Check a dictionary e.g. Bullinger says "all the inhabitants of Judeah, Palestine, and their descendants. A Jew in his national distinction from a Gentile."

But you set yourself above the Oxford Dictionary, or Bullinger or Gill. Private revelations indeed.

You say, (contrary to Scripture) that we Gentiles (as distinct from Jews) cannot be saved. Heresy!

BTW you wrote "So your "Greek" now?" You have used the wrong word. It should read 'so you are (or you're) "Greek" now?' The answer is yes I am a "Greek", i.e. Gentile.
---Warwick on 12/15/14


Trav, ... selecting verses, out of context, ...
---Warwick on 12/14/14

Show the "selected verses" out of context. Give context with Prophets.
Rom 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. ....
Rom 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not ... of Elijah?
Rom 4:16 ...to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed, ...who is the father of us all,
Rom 9:4 Who are Israelites, to whom pertaineth the adoption, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the service of God, the promises,
Rom 9:5 Whose are the fathers, of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came,...
Rom 9:25 As he saith also in Hosea,...
Rom 9:27 Esaias also crieth ...
---Trav on 12/15/14


Trav, your private revelations cause you to ignore what Scripture says, selecting verses, out of context, ... (Ellen)...the general name of all Greeks. "And later to mean" all who are not Jews.
---Warwick on 12/14/14

"Later" to mean... what you want it too. So your "Greek" now? Greek being specific itself.
King David posted.
Psa 147:19 He sheweth his word unto Jacob, his statutes and his judgments unto Israel.
Psa 147:20 He hath not dealt so with any nation: and as for his judgments, they have not known them. Praise ye the LORD.

All scripture to the contrary. You still dogmatically use 1/12th Judah as all Israel. It's your #1 "blinker",(blinder, see mules).
---Trav on 12/15/14


Trav, your private revelations cause you to ignore what Scripture says, selecting verses, out of context, to prove your strange doctrines. Contrary to Scripture you insist only Jews can be saved. You have, laughingly, even gone so far as to label gentiles as Jews! "For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek" Romans 1:16 "Greek" (Ellen) originally the proper name of Deucalion's son. Later applied to his descendants. Then became the general name of all Greeks. And later to mean all who are not Jews. Therefore the gospel is "for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek" i.e gentiles.
---Warwick on 12/14/14


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Trav, ...who will not submit to authority, preferring the hot-house product of their own private revelations.
---Warwick on 12/14/14

Your in spin control mode. Private revelations, posted of prophets? By the hundreds? Ha. Like Heb 8:8/Jer 31:31,
Amo 3:2 You only have I known of all the families of the earth: ...
Hos 1:11 Then shall the children of Judah and the children of Israel be gathered together, and appoint themselves one head, and they shall come up out of the land: for great shall be the day of Jezreel.

Anyone that can read should reject "blind men's self proclaimed authority" when found so, by multiple scriptures (hundreds) by which any discerning "sheep" will see you easily as a poser.
---Trav on 12/14/14


Marc, your intelligence and knowledge are lost upon those who are "willingly ignorant" rejecting the plain meaning of Scripture, solely because of their preference for ever-changing man-made stories of our origins. That six days means six 24hr days is evident from the common English term 'the six-day week.' No one asks how long are the days?

Scripturally speaking that the days of creation are likewise 24hr days is, for one example, made clear by Exodus 20:8-11. But only for those for whom God is the ultimate authority.
---Warwick on 12/13/14


Cluny, In response to something you wrote I asked you "please tell me where in Scripture I can find a definition of what constitutes "six divine days."

It seems you have no answer, not even one of human reasoning, so I feel confident to then say you give no answer because you are wrong.
---Warwick on 12/13/14


Trav, that you are a Scriptural lone-wolf has long been obvious to me. Your exotic stories e.g. only Jews can be saved, is typical of people who will not submit to authority, preferring the hot-house product of their own private revelations. Those who attend Bible-believing churches, conversely, have their private revelations continually challenged by their leaders, who are in turn under the testing of their leaders, all under the authority of God's word.

We non Jews were given the opportunity of being grafted into the Jewish 'olive-tree' after the gospel had been preached to the Jews. See Romans 1:16 and 11:17.
---Warwick on 12/14/14


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Cluny: "[Marc] begs the question Genesis 1 days were earthly 24 hour days."

I don't. The creative action's earth centred (birds, herbs, waters under the firmament, light TO the earth). Even a child understands God's revelation.

"An evening, a morning", "second day", aren't idioms but perspicuous time markers. "My day" "Day of the Lord" are idioms, understood by children as such. I tell my students, idioms aren't equal to the sum of their parts.

You still question beg the days aren't normal earth days as you have not offered any positive evidence. Cluny, that's the best intellectual argument you and your Orthodoxy can offer?

Evasive and still arguing with Jesus again!
---Marc on 12/13/14


Imagine I'm your philosophy professor.
---Marc on 12/12/14

Can see you as a lil dogmapup trying to play in a grownup's forum. You bark then you run fast. Your almost cute, in a mangy sort of way.
Your dogma-daddy, can't bring enough pups to eat the Shepherd's scriptures though.
Job_30:1 But now they that are younger than I have me in derision, whose fathers I would have disdained to have set with the dogs of my flock.

Amazingly applicable.
---Trav on 12/13/14


... how about telling which you attend.
---Warwick on 12/12/14

Almost laughed but, too sad, being you don't see or hear anything. You can't see/hear scripture you avoid, because it can't sync with your dogma. Your work? Is making opportunity's for me to post truth witnessed by scripture. I'm a member of no denom/dogma Church. The "ekklesia" is my Church. We see all scriptures, we understand and believe.
Zec_8:13 it shall come to pass, that as ye were a curse among the heathen, O house of Judah, and house of Israel, so will I save you, and ye shall be a blessing: fear not, ...
Eze_37:28 the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
---Trav on 12/13/14


Trav, JWs like you misquote. I wrote "BTW that the days of creation and the 7 day week are 24hr days is proveable from Scripture, to he who wants to know."See the difference?

A public debate would expose your exotic nonScriptural beliefs and you would have to speak in sentences! Alors!

You have controlled me the "blind infidel imposter" for six years? I didn't feel a thing?

My "telling rage" "gnashing anguish" and I had not even noticed I had it! In reality I dont hate you Trav. I think you strange, confused and odd but I hold no hate.

As I have openly revealed which church I attend, how about telling which you attend. That could be too revealing for you.
---Warwick on 12/12/14


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Cluny: "So you believe that something that involves God is self-refuting.

Do I understand you correctly?"


No Cluny, you don't. It is YOUR logic that is self-refuting. You claim that naturalistic processes can create. But those very processes (i.e., science) prove that they cannot. As Marc has shown, matter from nothing, life from non-life, and new, DNA-defined organisms from old different ones are not possible by naturalistic processes. Thus nature testifies that it can't perform supernatural feats - only God can.

Is that too deep for you?


---jerry6593 on 12/13/14


What is a green pill?
---shira4368 on 12/13/14


==You beg the question that God has used evolution.==

And you beg the question that the days of Genesis 1 were earthly 24 hour days.

When Jesus said, "Abraham rejoiced to see my day," was this just a 24 hour day?

When we talk about the "Day of the Lord," is this just 24 hours?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/13/14


Trav,
Maybe you SHOULD have taken the green pill AS WELL...and plenty of them!
---Marc on 12/12/14

Ha, heres your scriptural pills this morning "movie mark".
Luk_20:14 But when the husbandmen saw him, they reasoned among themselves, saying, This is the heir: come, let us kill him, that the inheritance may be ours.

Eze_34:3 Ye eat the fat, ye clothe you with the wool, ye kill them that are fed: but ye feed not the flock.

Hang on mark...(Movies are not real. Your Da Da just couldn't tell ya. I will. (Be a nice lil boy or Secret Santa won't come)
---Trav on 12/13/14


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Trav,

Maybe you SHOULD have taken the green pill AS WELL...and plenty of them!
---Marc on 12/12/14


Trav,
BTW that the days of creation and the 7 day week are 24hr days is proveable from Scripture,...

---Warwick on 12/11/14

BOTOH... you've never proved anything.
Argue on radio with a deaf and blind infidel imposter? Nah.
I've controlled you here six years with scripture will continue posting for sheep Australian or otherwise here.
One either believes the multiple witnesses or they don't. You don't per your own testimonies and telling rage. Marks. You have no scriptural directives to teach anything in Israels Book.
My scriptural witnesses have GOD's authority. To your gnashing anguish. It's not me you're mad at...its them. Per your admission, im-post-er.
Psa_120:3 What shall be...?
---Trav on 12/12/14


Cluny: "So you believe that [theistic evolution], something that involves God, is self-refuting."

Imagine I'm your philosophy professor. I'd fail you for that comment.

You beg the question that God has used evolution.

Yes, it is self-refuting if (i) it runs contrary to God's character (ii) opposes what the Bible says that God HAS done.

Cluny, the only type of evolution that is apparent here is that your rationality has DEVOLVED.
---Marc on 12/12/14


\\Thus, your theistic evolution paradigm is self-refuting.\\

So you believe that something that involves God is self-refuting.

Do I understand you correctly?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/12/14


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Trav, in my experience when churches demonstrate the theory of evolution is belief, not scientific fact, faith in God's word increases greatly. The Bible has nothing to fear from true science but evolution is not such, but an unproveable belief.

I suggest everyone get a copy of the new DVD "Evolution's Achilles Heels' which has 15 Ph.D scientists showing how evolution is a non-Scientific belief which does not fit with the available evidence.

BTW that the days of creation and the 7 day week are 24hr days is proveable from Scripture, to he who wants to know.

If you would like to debate me on these matters provide me with a phone number and we can do a 'talk-back' debate when I am next on air. How about it?
---Warwick on 12/11/14


Cluny: "And why do you have problems believing God works through natural processes [and God cannot] break His own laws."

Are you serious?

Creation, by definition, was a miracle (Romans 1). Furthermore, even scientific "law" cannot naturally produce something from nothing, life from non-life or mutate DNA information to make a fish transform to a philosopher.

God is not bound by natural law, which is only descriptive, not prescriptive. So, if God can't break his own natural law, are you saying Jesus didn't resurrect from the dead?

You don't have much faith in God's power, do you Cluny?
---Marc on 12/12/14


Cluny,

Your approach to the obvious in Scripture is to try and special plead your way out of it. This is a very common fallacy i.e. an error in reasoning. For example, you ask if the universe behaved differently after the Fall. The problem is that the creation occurred BEFORE the Fall and Jesus told Moses "That I, YHWH, created everything in 6 days." If the 6 days were not something that Moses understood, then Jesus either lied to Moses or he deceived him.

Furthermore, your what does 'actually' means is nothing but old fashioned casuistry. It, too, distracts from the bleedin' obvious.
---marc on 12/12/14


Cluny: "And why do you or jerry have problems with believing that God works through natural processes that He Himself established?

The alternative is to believe that God breaks His own laws."


This gets to the heart of the matter. While it is true that God created natural processes (science), the Bible reveals that He used His supernatural ability to instantaneously create matter and life. The atheist account relies on naturalistic processes to create life and matter. Such processes are impossible in terms of the science they claim to employ. Thus, your theistic evolution paradigm is self-refuting.


---jerry6593 on 12/12/14


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Cluny please tell me where in Scripture I can find a definition of what constitutes "six divine days."
---Warwick on 12/11/14


\\would argue with Jesus that "you, Lord, didn't create in 6 actual days."\\

I never said that.

But what does "actual" mean in this context?

Do you think it's possible that there was a shift in how the universe operates after the Fall of Adam?

And why do you or jerry have problems with believing that God works through natural processes that He Himself established?

The alternative is to believe that God breaks His own laws.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/11/14


Trav, In Exodus 20 God told His listeners that He created in six days and rested the seventh and that man was to likewise work six days and rest the seventh. However it appears you are saying that God said work six days... but didn't mean six days!!

If so, consider your view in the light in the witness of Exodus 31:14 which says to these same people that anyone who works upon the Sabbath must be put to death. In your story how would they have known when the Sabbath was and so evade execution for working upon it?
---Warwick on 12/11/14


We know it was six human days because GOD said so in Exodus 20.
---Samuelbb7 on 12/11/14


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Cluny,

You seem to be the type of person who, no matter what cogent argument is put in front of them, refuses to change his mind. In fact, you're the type of person who, even if Jesus himself were to speak directly to you, would argue with Jesus that "you, Lord, didn't create in 6 actual days."

Hang on! But Jesus DID speak directly to you, Cluny, and you, well, are still arguing with the Creator: 'YHWH said to Moses, "for in six days YHWH made the heavens and the earth."' When YHWH finished speaking to Moses he gave him the tablets of stone inscribed by the finger of God.' (Exodus 31)
---Marc on 12/11/14


\\No! Evolution is the atheist's explanation ...Creator who spoke everything into existence in just six literal days.
---jerry6593 on 12/11/14\\

Were they six fallen human earthly days, or six divine days, jerry?

How do you know?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/11/14


No! Evolution is the atheist's explanation ...Creator who spoke everything into existence in just six literal days.
---jerry6593 on 12/11/14

GOD and science are united...he being the creator of both.
Six "literal" days is not logical or provable. And why this blind doctrine is causing a loss of our kids and grandkids.
Is found by the seeker that these long six allegorical days mesh nicely with science.
For any age students seeker or doubters of scripture...but more especially those in high school or entering College who are about to be taught evolution as fact. Know both positions, it is your soul. Not your dads or non seeking/asking of GOD.
Mat_7:9 ...will he give him a stone?
---Trav on 12/11/14


No! Evolution is the atheist's explanation of how man and all other creatures on earth came into existence by natural processes over millions of years. The Bible teaches that God was the personal, supernatural Creator who spoke everything into existence in just six literal days.


---jerry6593 on 12/11/14


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NO.because in the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.God also made Man in his own image.
---Eno_Asuquo on 12/5/14


Chria, thank you for bringing that up.

God has created creatures with the genetic ability to change, within their kinds. This is often called natural selection or adaptation. There is great variety within the dog kind, for one example, but they are still dogs. Of course selective breeding has also effected considerable change.

When people talk about evolution they may include these 'within kind' changes however they usually also mean the belief that all life on earth originated with something like a bacteria. This means the ancestor of humans, dogs and cats was not a human a dog or a cat. This sort of change has never been seen nor does the fossil record prove it has ever happened.
---Warwick on 12/4/14


depends upon what is meant by evolution.
Consider definitions of evolve such as:

verb (used with object), evolved, evolving.
1.to develop gradually:
2.to give off or emit, as odors or vapors.

verb (used without object), evolved, evolving.
3. to come forth gradually into being, develop, undergo evolution .
4.Biology. to develop by a process of evolution to a different adaptive state or condition

Latin evolvere unroll, open, unfold
volvereto roll, turn
Also 1640s, "to unfold, open out, expand," from Latin evolvere "to unroll," especially of books, figuratively "to make clear, disclose, to produce, develop," from ex-"out"+ volvere "to roll"
---Chria9396 on 12/4/14


Not a problem Learner, glad I could help.
---Warwick on 12/4/14


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Warwick, I did misunderstand the question. Thanks for clearing it up for me.
---learner2 on 12/3/14


Learner how typical of you is this piece of evasion. Or did you misunderstand the question? The question means: is the theory of evolution compatible with Biblical creation?

The answer is no as Biblical creation and evolution conflict on almost every point.
---Warwick on 12/3/14


It doesn't need to be a biblical concept.
---learner2 on 12/3/14


No it is not.
---Rita_H on 12/3/14


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This definitely has been discussed before and the answer is no.
---Warwick on 12/2/14


Is quantum mechanics a biblical concept?
---learner2 on 12/2/14


This has been discussed several times already.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/2/14


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