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What Is Rigtheousness

If a unbeliever, asked you the meaning of the word "Righteousness", how would you define this word for them?

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 ---David on 2/2/15
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'that... makes the bible a liar and we all know the bible is all truth'- shira4368.

Shira- please explain why you Warwick, Marc et al... believe embracing the trinity is Gods way for our salvation? Leaders of all Christendoms churches teach: "you must believe the trinity to be saved"!

If you're so hung up about JW's believing they have the truth or are "Gods appointed organisation", then please show me where from the Bible I need to embrace the trinity? Where is trinity in the Bible anyway!? When did Jesus ever utter the word trinity?

Please also show me where Jesus or the Bible use the word "Hell". When you cannot explain your belief Biblically, then we will know who is lying!
---David8318 on 2/16/15


Trav
...you caused me to ponder on. Abraham chose God as his Lord, but the children of Abraham were literally "Grandfathered" into the covenant. They did not choose God, God chose them....
---David on 2/15/15

Good pondering David! If our pondering aligns with all the witnesses GOD provides...then it is fruitful pondering.
Yours above aligned for me many places, a few linked with "chose": Deu_10:15 Only the LORD had a delight in thy fathers to love them, he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day.Psa_78:70 He chose David also his servant,...
Eze_20:5 ...Thus saith the Lord GOD, In the day when I chose Israel, lifted up mine hand unto the seed of the house of Jacob...
---Trav on 2/16/15


What frees us according to this passage, a faith with, or a faith without works?
David

I know that some of my words are the same as those who do not believe that faith works. But I am a Seventh day Adventist and we do believe that faith works. In fact we are and I personally have been accused of trying to work our way to heaven.

Where we are though is in the position of being saved by Grace alone. But believing that we are to obey GOD otherwise we are not children of GOD.

I hope this explains my position. We believe I John.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 2/16/15


Shira: "I beg you don't face God with these lies concerning jw's."

I hope you mean the JWs are lying, Shira, and not I, because they do believe that they are God's only mouthpiece on earth (stated in their publications) and Scott and David have had multiple opportunities to explain their case but won't.

Case closed.
---Marc on 2/15/15


Scott, regarding Trav, and 'tebel' you wrote "Ok Warwick, we're all watching."

I hope so, and also thinking!

Genesis 1:1 'the earth' is 'ha-a-res' the same words used 46 times in Genesis 6-9, to describe the whole physical earth. And in 1 Samuel 2:8 "..For the pillars of the earth 'ha-a-res' are the LORDs, and on them he has set the world." World Hebrew 'tebel', Holman says is "a poetical term that speaks of the dwelling place of humans" see Job 18:18 , 34:13 , 37:12 , 1 Samuel 2:8 ,Ps. 9:8. That is, the world of human habitation is set upon the whole earth, not a region.
---Warwick on 2/16/15




"For I do not understand my own actions. For I do not do what I want, but I do the very thing I hate. Romans 7:15-17 -Warwick on 2/14/15

Warwick
If you do not do what you want to do (Righteousness), and do that which you hate (Sin), are you the servant of sin, or the servant of righteousness?

Samuel
(Romans 6:17-18) But God be thanked that though ye were the servants of sin, now ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you (Gospels of Christ). Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

What frees us according to this passage, a faith with, or a faith without works?
---David on 2/16/15


I am another who would like to know why the jw's are the only God's chosen. that actually makes the bible a liar and we all know the bible is all truth. God cannot lie. this is the kind of stuff that sends people to hell. I beg you don't face God with these lies concerning jw's. they are sinners just like the rest of us. if they get saved they will go to heaven but if they don't they will end up in hell.
---shira4368 on 2/15/15


Yes, Warwick, it's clear Scott and David have refused all requests to help us understand the basis by which they claim that JWs are God's only chosen organisation through whom he works. Their evasiveness is unequivocal evidence for JW dishonesty.

David may ridicule people who claim God assists them, accusing them of occultism, but JWs claim that God speaks to his Brooklyn leaders and then Brooklyn alone is God's voice to them. This "voice" orders every moment of their lives. Examples: (i) they mustn't save the life of their child by giving blood (ii) banning organ transplants (iii) they hypocritically and selfishly can defend their own family from attack but they refuse to help their neighbour from the same violence.
---Marc on 2/15/15


Scott, a few days ago you posed a challenge to me regarding "ha-a-res' and 'tebel.' I wrote a response and have tried to have it posted 4 times. The moderators have barred it every time, for no good reason. It would appear that the moderators have now taken sides.

Moderator/s you will know that what I have written here is true. Please explain why you refuse to print my reply.

Some have also noticed that you allow Scott and David to post after a blog has reached its 75 limit. Why do you do that?

Am I calling your honesty into question? Yes.
---Warwick on 2/15/15


David on 2/14/15

Correct Jesus loves those who keeps his commandments. But He also loves the Whole World. John 3:16. One witness.

#2
Luke 5:32

I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance

James said by works not by faith only. Which gets to the point we are saved by faith and then works show we are righteous.

We who are saved by faith seek to continue in well doing. We do not do well to earn salvation. Read Romans 3:20-31 especially 20. #3

#4 Ephesians 2:8
#5 Acts 16:31 I can give more.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/15/15




David, you write confused puerile trivia and cannot answer questions, as the record shows. You and Scott have been exposed as liars for all to see.

Have the integrity and courage to answer my questions and I will delight in further exposing your addled deceit.
---Warwick on 2/14/15


David, (nonJW), I just noticed my answer to you was never posted.

You asked for a direct answer, have I failed to answer you before?

You wrote: "If sin has died in you, why do you still sin?"

It is a good question, and I have puzzled over this and now understand Paul has said it all, long ago.

"For I do not understand my own actions. For I do not do what I want, but I do the very thing I hate. Now if I do what I do not want, I agree with the law, that it is good. So now it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me" Romans 7:15-17.
---Warwick on 2/14/15


Warwick, more from that report you claim you cannot find. More occultism from your Christian Missionary Alliance (C & MA).

C & MA pastor writes: "God can and does speak to us in multi-level methods as we open up all the vents of our soul to listen"- David Smith, Listening Prayer. Smith emulates his C & MA cult founder, A Simpson who taught the unscriptural belief Gods voice can be heard inside you.

This is part of the mystical doctrines being embraced by C & MA, that of Contemplative Prayer, known as soaking prayer and centering prayer- the unbiblical and mystical practice of emptying ones mind of conscious thought and turning to ones inner self to find (they think) the presence of "God".
---David8318 on 2/15/15


Romans, explains too both houses of Israel, note language.-Trav on 2/12/15

Travis
Here's something you caused me to ponder on. Abraham chose God as his Lord, but the children of Abraham were literally "Grandfathered" into the covenant. They did not choose God, God chose them, chosen by God to keep his promise to Abraham.

Abram was chosen, because through his faith, he came to love God. "Abraham was a friend of God." The children of Abraham did not have faith in God, and they did not love God, because it was by faith Abraham came to love God.

We are saved by Grace, through faith, because like Abraham, it will be through faith by which we will come to love God and God will come to love us.
---David on 2/15/15


'Awake 11/08/82... Awake 01/01/2014... Insight, Vol. I, pg. 526-541'- Warwick.

None of the source quotes Warwick provides above state JW's believe death came before sin. Warwick must still be under the influence of his occult C & MA 'dangerous mind altering mystic contemplative' practices to not understand what he is reading!

Warwick claims: '[JW's place] death of man and animal long before Adam appeared on the earth'. Warwick must be at the angel dust again to come up with that one. Warwick has forgotten Adam was the first man so how could the death of man come before the first man?

Warwick believes death was always part of Gods eternal purpose and that human life is just another way of populating heaven or hell!
---David8318 on 2/14/15


David, you are nothing but a serial liar. You ducked the question, for obvious reasons. If the"Pro veritate" report had in fact directed its comments to C & MA beliefs/behaviour you would have shown us where. That you evade doing this shows you again, and again lied.

But, if you are telling the truth show, with original quote, that I am wrong!

We are watching you David!
---Warwick on 2/14/15


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Trav, still you persist with the idea that God did not plan for the feeding of His creatures which came off the ark. Do you imagine it came as a surprise to God that He had to feed those who He took from Egypt, into the desert? Apparently.

Read Noahs Ark: A Feasibility Study ch.21 'Food Sources in the "barren" post flood world.' Consider also there were a few months between the ark landing and disembarkation.

Again I ask what animals, and how many were on the ark?

"You follow an antiquated doctrine." No I follow what Scripture says, you follow man!

Rather than just making up stories show me where I have argued with the prophets and Jesus.
---Warwick on 2/14/15


David and Scott,

On which basis do JWs claim that their group is God's only organisation on earth?

A simple question which we've asked a half dozen or so times but which you avoid answering.
---marc on 2/14/15


'Did God inspire the Bible for His own reading or was it done for man to read?'- Warwick.

Is God a man or an eternal spirit? Do the six creative "days" describe Gods activity or mans? If time was created for man (as Warwick admits), when was man created?

All Warwick needs to do to see the report about his occult C & MA movement is to cut and paste the quote I provide into a search engine & it will take him straight there. Everyone knows the rules about posting websites.

Nobody doubts God spoke to people in Bible times. But where is the scriptural basis for believing as Warwick's C & MA cult leader Simpson claims, that Christians will hear Gods 'small voice' if we 'hush every other sound'?
---David8318 on 2/14/15


David, you are c20 of my questions to you behind, catch up I will answer this easy question.

Your first question to answer:

David, you wrote of the "Veritate report", and I have (a few times) asked you to show where the writer of this "report" applies it to the Christian and Missionary Alliance.

Your second repeatedly unanswered question is:

Do you claim God does not speak to man audibly?
Do you also claim God does not speak to man through His Son Jesus?
Do you also claim God does not speak to us also via our consciences?
Do you claim God does not speak to us through his word?
Do you further claim the Holy Spirit does not speak to man?
---Warwick on 2/13/15


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Those who are saved work. If we do not serve Him then He is not our Lord.-Samuelbb7

Samuel
Was Jesus wrong in (John 14:21), when he said God loves those who keep his commandments? Doesn't God save those he loves? If God saves those he loves, and he loves those who keep his commandments, how can you be saved before you make him Lord?

In (Romans 2:6-7), didn't Paul teach salvation is a reward for our works?
Was James wrong in (James 2:24), when he said we are justified by our works?

Something to consider, from 3 witnesses. Can you give me three?
---David on 2/14/15


"If a unbeliever, asked you the meaning of the word "Righteousness", how would you define this word for them?"

I dont like to speculate on what ifs and rehearse answers to different scenarios, but what comes to mind is simply that Jesus Christ is righteous/righteousness.
---chria9396 on 2/14/15


Trav, you believe God could not feed His creatures post-Flood? Simply bizarre!
You have little trust in God and do not know His word.
---Warwick on 2/13/15

If GOD was going to feed them it would be in scripture. He told them to take the food. There is not enough room for all the logistical food during an after your flood.
There was Plenty of food and even Olive trees growing after mine.

What I don't trust is you. You are fearful. You argue with Prophets, even Christ himself. That's amazing beyond belief when one considers the ignorance by arrogance displayed in your fundamental unbelief. You follow an antiquated doctrine and will lie even to yourself to protect it.
You're seen by your marks.
---Trav on 2/14/15


Trav, you believe God could not feed His creatures post-Flood? Simply bizarre! Did God not feed and clothe His people for 40 years in the desert? And their clothing did not wear out. You have little trust in God and do not know His word.

What animals, and how many were on the ark?

Yes, you are correct I do not believe anyone walked through the Flood ( a nonBiblical concept) as it was world-wide and very deep as Scripture says. It also says everyone post-Flood was descended from Noah. So their under-Flood walking was fatal!

Ps 2 Timothy 4:4 fits you perfectly as you prefer fables (man-made stories) to Gods word.
---Warwick on 2/13/15


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But According to what Paul wrote above, isn't our obedience to Jesus Christ required, for him to become our Lord?

If obedience is required to make him Lord, can a man be saved by faith, a faith without works?
---David

Those who are saved work. If we do not serve Him then He is not our Lord. We work because we are saved and love him.

Rom 13:8,9
Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/13/15


rav,
You think God could not feed the animals which left the ark? What faith you have!
---Warwick on 2/12/15

Yours are eating sediments! Understand you have no place to run too. You can't grasp gravity or Civilizations marching through your "global" theory. You can't do math on water pressure at 5.5miles depth+ or saline water killing literally everything. Fossil or Ice layers, do not verify you.
Your Ark cannot contain all animals on a Global earth and 7 Clean. Requiring over 40+ Arks. You can't calculate amount of food logistics or types of food required, during flood and after. Truth is not your cup-o-tea. Nor your Ark.
2Ti_4:4 they shall turn away their ears from the truth, shall be turned unto fables.
---Trav on 2/13/15


Warwick, you stated: "God's describes 6-Days of creation in terms of a revolving earth in relation to a fixed light-source".

Where does God describe this!? In the Bible? Or those voices you hear? If in the Bible: chapter and verse please, or is this another A Simpson/C & MA lie!?

Can you shock us all with a straight answer? When you do I may answer yours. Although your question below is not exactly rocket science. Whatever the answer, it does not negate the truth that God is not in mans time (earth around sun) and he is eternal.
---David8318 on 2/13/15


Did God inspire the Bible for His own reading or was it done for man to read? Shock us all with a straight answer!-Warwick

Warwick
God gave us the his Holy Spirit to guide us, his Spirit, to reveal the mysteries of the Bible. The Bible is a witness, to what the Spirit teaches us.

Reading the Bible without his guidance, is like trying to learn Calculus from a math book, without a teacher.
This is why we have so many doctrines today.

There is only one truth, and these many doctrines which have separated the believers, is proof, many, are not using this valuable gift from God.

Now I ask you for a straight answer .
If sin has died in you, why do you still sin?
---David on 2/13/15


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Trav, you don't understand the gasses we breathe are gasses only because they have already past way beyond their boiling points (way below zero) to become gasses. These gasses cannot boil again.

As the waters rose sea-level air rose to whatever height the Flood waters reached, if 5.5 miles the sea-level air was way up there.

In world-wide sedimentary rocks you will indeed find masses of fossilized plants, and of course animals. This is all the result of the Flood. But the Flood was God's plan and He is well able to preserve anything He wishes. He does not need your help, only your faith!

You think God could not feed the animals which left the ark? What faith you have!
---Warwick on 2/12/15


Trav, finally you accept the obvious, that the atmosphere would of necessity rise up with the flood-waters.
Your knowledge of basic science is scant.
---Warwick on 2/9/15

Ha. Even "scant" understands gravity. You've obviously never flown any. Gravity is what holds our narrow band of atomosphere in place and keeps it from "boiling" off into outer space. Also makes rain fall.
Your 5.5 mile high flood raising our troposphere into the stratosphere and mesosphere etc, have eliminated even Noah and everything for Eternity. You've killed every grass, weed, plant, tree, bush, shrub for oxygen with your saline water. Including muddy sediment many feet deep.
---Trav on 2/12/15


David, I will ask you one question which will show the truth of the situation regarding the 'days' of Creation.

Did God inspire the Bible for His own reading or was it done for man to read?

Shock us all with a straight answer!
---Warwick on 2/12/15


"The words for 'the earth' in Genesis 1:1 'h-a-res' (according to Strongs)" Warwick

Sigh. Still not true.
---scott on 2/12/15


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Trav
...If Paul's analogy was being used to compare Gods divorce of Israel, why doesn't he mention Israel...
---David on 2/12/15

Good stuff Dave. Confirming, by Prophets and Christ is obedience. Paul is a poor communicator, evidenced by the misapplication, mistranlations of his writings. The Prophets everyone avoids...don't have the paul problems.
Romans, explains too both houses of Israel, note language.
Rom 1:2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)
Rom 2:15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also,...
Heb 8:10 ... covenant that I will make with the house of Israel... I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: ...
---Trav on 2/12/15


Trav, the words for 'the earth' in Genesis 1:1 'h-a-res' (according to Strongs) are exactly the same as used 46 times in the Flood epic. It is obvious by the context of Genesis 1:1 that the whole earth is meant.

The Flood epic uses 'h-a-res', 'the earth' not simply earth (a-res) 46 times and by context we see the writer means 'the whole earth', because there is nothing in the Flood epic to support a regional flood, only a global event.

'h-a-res' appears 79 times in the first 9 chapters of Genesis and only in 4 cases can it be translated as 'land' as in a region 2:11,12,13, 4:16.
---Warwick on 2/11/15


Trav
Nice to hear from you again.
Paul's analogy is meant as a comparison. If Paul's analogy was being used to compare Gods divorce of Israel, why doesn't he mention Israel in his teaching?

In (Romans 5 thru 8) Paul teaches about sin and death. Both are mentioned numerous times, and are being used as a comparison in his marriage analogy.

(Romans 6:16)
"Know ye not that to whomever ye yield yourselves as servants to obey, his servants ye become whom ye obey, whether of sin which leads unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?


Notice obedience doesn't make one righteous, it only leads us to righteousness.
---David on 2/12/15


Exodus 34:27 And the LORD said to Moses, "Write these words, in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel."

Act 7:39 Our fathers refused to obey him, but thrust him aside, and in their hearts they turned to Egypt,

Act 7:40 saying to Aaron, 'Make for us gods to go before us, as for this Moses who led us out from the land of Egypt, we do not know what has become of him.'

The Hebrews did not listen to Moses and they decided to follow the pagan gods and beliefs/practices that they learned from the Egyptians.

God divorced Israel and called them the "FAITHLESS ONES" (Israel is NOT who we were taught to believe).

Verses are from the RSV.
---faithforfaith on 2/11/15


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God sent Israel a "strong DELUSION" because the faithless wanted to believe untruth. So God explained to Ezekiel that he (Ezek.) should not rebuke or chastize the Israelites (God answered them HIMSELF).

Ezekiel 14:4
"I WILL ANSWER THEM MYSELF".

God didn't COMMIT a lie, He simply ALLOWED them to have a DELUSION (like our choice to believe in the tooth fairy or Santa Claus).

The "strong delusion" still continues with us because we choose to believe that THE BOOK/bible will save us )and the clergy and everyone else are the cheerleaders).
---faithforfaith on 2/11/15


Faith without Works ?

James 2:26 - For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
---RichardC on 2/11/15


Trav
Can you see the two husbands in this passage? Can you see the death of sin, and the required Adultery
---David on 2/8/15

I see your points. There is analogy around them. The analogy's should have witnesses and do. Israel. As pointed to, GOD was married to Israel... entire house of 12/13. He divorced them...because of their adulteries...sin.
Only free to remarry if GOD dies, the Husband. Impossible for GOD to die. Or lie.
Christ died.
What you are reading in Romans is Paul pointing to the law for the Nth House of Israel or Judah. Both should see that the "two Sticks" can now be rejoined.
Heb 8:8/Jer 31:31/ Eze 37, Ten Virgins, etc, etc.
---Trav on 2/11/15


Samuel
Thank you, but I don't believe you are understanding my point.
Paul wrote in (Romans 6:16) "Know ye not that to whomever ye yield yourselves as servants to obey, his servants ye become whom ye obey....."

We were born with a sinful nature, and this causes us to live in obedience to sin.
But According to what Paul wrote above, isn't our obedience to Jesus Christ required, for him to become our Lord?

If obedience is required to make him Lord, can a man be saved by faith, a faith without works?
---David on 2/11/15


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Heb 10:1
For since the law has but...... it can never, by the same sacrifices which are continually offered YEAR AFTER YEAR, make perfect those who draw near.

.."year after year" means TEMPORARY.

The Jews made many different sacrifices that include the "blood of bulls and goats".

They were given a specific list of 10 things that were forbidden (this is the 10 prohibitions against "SIN"ful activities. Now they no longer are what we should avoid.

The 10 commandments were given to MOSES AND THE ISRAELITES ONLY (they are not for us, the PERFECT law is (there is no text to the perfect, LIBERTY cannot be a "LAW", but it is NOT an OPTION for us, it is MANDATORY.

from RSV.
---faithforfaith on 2/10/15


Faithforfaith - Sacrifices - Temporary - Forgiveness - Eternal Forgiveness

Hebrews 10 :4 - For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and goats should take away sin,

It did not take away sin, just symbolic,

But Enoch was taken away by God - Genesis 5:24

Elijah - Whirlwind to heaven - 2 Kings 2:11

Matthew 22:32 - Iam the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the god of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living,

You also have Christ being in the prophets of OT

Peter 1:11 - Searching what , or what manner of time the spirit of Christ was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the suffering of Christ and glory that should follow,
---RichardC on 2/9/15


Faith the law was perfect but the sacrifices of the Old Testament were not.


Psalms 19:7

The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.


The law does no save us.

Hebrews 7:19

For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did, by the which we draw nigh unto God.


Romans 7:12

Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.


1Timothy 1:8

But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully,

We use the law to define sin. Not save us. Read First John.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/9/15


The IMPERFECT LAW was the one that ABOLISHED so that the enemy would be powerless and would be, in effect, DESTROYED for all who accept and live the SPIRIT of God (Spirit filled).

Heb 2:14 through death he might destroy him who has the power of death, that is, the devil,

Eph 2:15 by abolishing in his flesh the law of commandments and ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,

God was righteous in sending us a sacrificial lamb (the Jews made sacrifices, but those sacrifices were not sufficient for them to have ETERNAL forgiveness).

The sacrifices of the Jews made only TEMPORARY forgiveness and needed to be repeated year after year, but we have PERMANENT forgiveness.
---faithforfaith on 2/9/15


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Good point David we have to die to self and live to Jesus. We have to take up our cross and follow Jesus.

RichardC. Great Bible verses thank you.

We are saved by the righteousness of Jesus alone. But then we are washed and filled with the Holy Spirit so that we may live in following Jesus and his example. We are to live in righteousness and become each day more like Jesus.

Agape.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/9/15


Titus 3:5 - Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us , by washing of regeneration, and renewing of the holy ghost,

Romans 4:5 - But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that is jusifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness,

Romans 4:13 - For the promise, that he should be heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, though the law, but through the righteousness of faith

Philippians 3:9 - And being found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is God by faith,
---RichardC on 2/8/15


We are sinners because we break the law of GOD.-Samuelbb7

Samuel
But why do we break the Law? What causes us to be sinners? These are the questions which alludes many believers, questions to which many never seek an answer.

Paul did not want to sin, but he did. Paul discovered the reason for this, when he could not do the good he wanted to do, and did the evil he did not want to do. Paul realized he sinned because sin lived in him (Romans 7:14-17).

Paul knew if Christ was to be his master, that sin which lived in him, had to die. If people actually believed what Jesus said in (John 8:34), they would discover the same Truth Paul did.
---David on 2/9/15


David and Faith we seem in some ways close but I am not sure.

First the Ten Commandments are still in place. See Romans 13:8-10.

We are sinners because we break the law of GOD. The Ten Commandments.

JESUS died for our sins so we are now declared as sinless in CHRIST JESUS.

When we are filled with Love and the Holy Spirit we obey GOD because we love him and others. See First John.

Those who do not love others and GOD are not saved. They show that by living in unconfessed sin. Again read First John.

When we are Born again by the Holy Spirit we change from being lost to being in CHRIST JESUS. John 14:23-24
---Samuelbb7 on 2/8/15


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"Righteousness", how would you define this word for them?" ---David on 2/2/15. Righteousness defined, is the Father's decision to declare believer not guilty of sin based on the atoning sacrifice and finished work of Jesus, and to regard them as such. "And the work of righteousness shall be peace, and the effect of righteousness quietness and assurance for ever." Isa.32:17
I have heard it said that righteousness can be defined simply as "right standing with God," I find no fault in that. And I say "right standing," or a righteous relationship with the Father, is only possible through our unity with "Jesus Christ The righteous."
---josef on 2/7/15


(Romans 6:16-18)
Know ye not that to whomever ye yield yourselves as servants to obey, his servants ye become whom ye obey, whether of sin which leads unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

But God be thanked that though ye were the servants of sin, now ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you. Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.


Samuel & Trav
Can you see the two husbands in this passage? Can you see the death of sin, and the required Adultery (Obedience to God) which brings about the death of sin, so we can belong to God?
---David on 2/8/15


Jesus performed the deed on the cross that ended the ten commandments against against violating 'sin' (the ten laws against what God commanded the JEWS not to do). Those 10 laws were DESTROYED by Jesus (they were the IMPERFECT law). Now we SPIRIT FILLED worshipers are to observe the PERFECT LAW (the law of LIBERTY, James 1:25 and 2:12)....

How can LIBERTY be "LAW"? (because it is NOT AN OPTION).

The "living water" is what poured from Jesus's side at the cross along with BLOOD, but our THIRD WITNESS is the WATER (1 John 5:8, the Jews only had TWO witnesses in Revelation). Because we don't live the PERFECT LAW, God sees us as "lawless" (the modern church of Man/buildings are the "lawless ones".
---faithforfaith on 2/7/15


Jhn 6:63
It is the spirit that gives life,

What Jesus did ON THE CROSS has been DONE ("It is DONE").....finalized FOREVER for all humanity, BUT we should be seeking ETERNAL LIFE (complete sanctification).

..and COMPLETE sanctification only comes from BEING SPIRIT FILLED.

The divine Spirit (Holy Spirit) will become part of a person's SOUL and only agrees with a person's soul that has LIVING WATER (tears of sorrow in a "heart of flesh").


OUR righteousness will come only from a genuinely contrite and gentle heart that has LIVING WATER.
All verses are from the RSV.
---faithforfaith on 2/7/15


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Travis & Samuel
Consider this, A husband in those days was also called "Lord", which makes the Lords statement in (Luke 6:46), that much more profound.
"And why call ye Me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"

Those who can call him Lord are those who do what he tells them to do. But for those who sin, he says in (John 8:34)
"Verily, verily I say unto you, whosoever commits sin is the servant of sin."

In these two verses Jesus shows us the husband (Sin), we are born into, and the husband (Jesus), we desire to have.
In (Romans 7:7-25), we have Paul discussing this fight against the sinful husband. A fight all believers can relate.
---David on 2/7/15


The husband in (Romans 7:3-5) which needs to die, so the woman can be married to another,...

---David on 2/6/15

Consider:
GOD was married to Israel. He divorces Nth House of ten. GOD's marriage law, wife is not free until husband dies. Christ died. So ALL Israel...is free from the 1st Husband now. Tie the prophets, the story appears.
Jer 3:14 Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD, for I am married unto you:...
Jer_3:8 I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, given her a bill of divorce, yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not,
Hos_2:19...betroth thee unto me for ever, yea, I will betroth thee unto me...
Hos_2:20 ...betroth thee unto me...
---Trav on 2/6/15


David


Rom7:4
We die in Christ which seems to me to refer to Baptism. in the analogy the husband dies here it is we who die. The women might be the Church. I need to do more research.
Rom 7:6
But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held, that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.
So we could not be saved by the law and must be saved by GOD or as we often say it. By Grace.
Not keeping the Commandments is what causes us to die.
Rom 7:12,13
...Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good, that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/6/15


Righteousness is godliness.
---Jed on 2/6/15


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There is nothing in the passage about the woman wanting to commit adultery with GOD.-Samuelbb7

Samuel
My apologies, I got ahead of myself.

The husband in (Romans 7:3-5) which needs to die, so the woman can be married to another, is the sin which lives in us.
Do you agree?

If you do, wouldn't obedience to righteousness, be disobedience to sin (Husband)?
According to Paul, that obedience (marrying God), would be Adultery, if the Husband (sin) was not dead.

In (Romans 7:9-11), it appears as though Paul is saying, that Adultery (Keeping the commandments), is what causes the death of sin (Husband).

Understand?
---David on 2/6/15


Trav
I appreciate the input, but not quite sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing?
---David on 2/5/15

Well, I'm not either way. To address your question there needs to be specific references for your question. I can't find specific references. That does not mean there aren't any...so it was open for David or any to point.

The safest way to understand correctness / righteousness would be to visit Christ's comments which are a fulfilling the prophets statements. If Christ is looking for Sheep...then we should be on the look out as well. Sheep should be Sheeplike...right? Why does GOD call them Sheep? All other questions or answers fall into scriptural alignment along the focused search or finding.
---Trav on 2/5/15


David what Bible are you reading? There is nothing in the passage about the woman wanting to commit adultery with GOD. Read the Context of the passage.


Romans 7:4

Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ, that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

We are dead to the law for salvation sake. The law cannot and never has saved anyone. When we are baptized we become as new born Children by the infilling of the Holy Spirit. We are new creatures. We are now dedicated to JESUS. So that now by the Power of the Holy Spirit in us we turn to obey GOD because we love Him and all humans. Read Galatians 3 & 4
---Samuelbb7 on 2/5/15


I think the same word can have different meanings.

Jesus is our righteousness.

We become righteous by trusting in Jesus, but we still can be able to sin.

So, we need how our Father corrects us so then we share in His love's "peaceable fruit of righteousness" > Hebrews 12:6-11.

So, there is the status of being right, by joining with Jesus. But then we need how God cures our character in His love so our nature has His righteousness . . . how His love alone is truly right :)
---com7fy8 on 2/5/15


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Samuel & Scott
In (Romans 7:2-3), Paul gives us an analogy about a woman married to a man she does not want, but desires someone else.

The husband in the analogy represents the sinful master, the sin we are born into, that sin which lives in us, that which makes us slaves to Sin (John 8:34). And the husband the woman desires to have, the one with whom she commits adultery, is God.
Do you agree? If you do, how does the woman commit adultery against her husband?

FaithforFaith
Love the input.

Travis
I appreciate the input, but not quite sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing?
---David on 2/5/15


Trav
If someone did not share the Truth with us, would we have become believers?
---David on 2/4/15

Search original languages on "dogs".
On sharing/pointing: Who seeks. Who is sought? Who recognizes.
On your original question.
Here are a couple of 289 scriptures on righteousness.
Hos_2:19 I will betroth thee unto me for ever, yea, I will betroth thee unto me in righteousness, in judgment, in lovingkindness, in mercies.
Mat_5:6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.
Isa_51:1 Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged.
---Trav on 2/4/15


The righteousness that we are to do (get credit for) is what having a Godly spirit inspires us to do (having a a spirit of holiness will CAUSE "HOLINESS").

...a GODLY spirit/character is what God wants us to have, only then can we identify with Him.

We also need to RELATE to Him properly by...BEING who we really are (NOT a phony personality/"PERSON")

God has no regard for (is no respecter) of "PERSONS" (He only has regard for SOULS (who a person really is...

....(the KIND of a person is the "SOUL" of a person).

...do the right thing, be just and don't do what is unjust (that is RIGHTeousness/Spirit.
---faithforfaith on 2/4/15


//Adam was the seed for sinful man, and Jesus was the seed of righteousness. This is why he was called the 2nd Adam.//David
Yes I agree with this. Because of Adam we do not get a choice to be sinful or sinless. By birth we carry the image of Adam with us. However, Jesus was not born of Adam (virgin birth) thus he had the choice to sin or not to sin.
---Scott1 on 2/4/15


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Yes David we are to be servants or Righteousness.

John 14:23,24
Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 2/4/15


Trav
Who are the "Dogs"? Could it be the unbeliever, when we were all once unbelievers? If someone did not share the Truth with us, would we have become believers?

But your point about sin being the opposite is an excellent point. Thank you-Samuelbb7

Samuel
Your welcome, and I'm glad you saw my point. Open minded, I like that.

I have to remember that sin is what I do or have done, but righteousness is what I am.-Scott1

Scott
Adam was the seed for sinful man, and Jesus was the seed of righteousness. This is why he was called the 2nd Adam.
Sinful man is a slave unto sin, as the Righteous man is a slave unto righteousness (Romans 6:16).

Agree?
---David on 2/4/15


//I believe sin is the opposite of righteousness.//

I partially agree with you, maybe I am grasping at straws. I have to remember that sin is what I do or have done, but righteousness is what I am. I am not making lite of sin and the serious consequences that effect me daily. However, my identity is found solely in my righteousness declared to me by God through my faith in him.
---Scott1 on 2/3/15


David partially agree. The use of antonyms does help to define a word and it is a help. But it is not the only way or the best way.

But your point about sin being the opposite is an excellent point. Thank you.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/3/15


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David-(Colossians 4:5-6)
Walk in wisdom toward those who are (without kjv)(strange, strongs)outsiders, ...

Agree?
---David on 2/3/15

David, I like you, your careful studies and your answer above.
This answers a broad spectrum of dealing with (strongs,"strange"), or those without, but not specifically to your question defining "righteousness.
It is possible it includes the situation. By not being specific it is not definite.
Specific is:
Mat_7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.
Php_3:2 Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.
---Trav on 2/3/15


David. Where does scripture instruct you to explain?--Trav

Trav
(Colossians 4:5-6)
Walk in wisdom toward those who are outsiders, redeeming the time. Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man.

Samuel & Scott
I find the best way to understand the meanings of words, is to find their opposites.

I believe sin is the opposite of righteousness. For sin is an act of obedience to our sinful master, and doing what is righteous, is an act of obedience to God (Romans 6:13).

Agree?
---David on 2/3/15


//David. Where does scripture instuct you to explain.//
The great commission
---Scott1 on 2/2/15

Witnesses you didn't post, for this un found term in scripture.
We'll call these the Greatest avoided commission.
Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mar_4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
---Trav on 2/2/15


//David. Where does scripture instuct you to explain.//

The great commission
---Scott1 on 2/2/15


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Good point Faithforfaith.

There are two types of Righteousness spoken in the Bible.

Imputed GOD declares you without sin because JESUS assigns his sinless life to our record.

Imparted is where being filled with the Holy Spirit and love we do right and follow GOD.


Rom 13:8-10

Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
...therefore love is the fulfilling of the law
---Samuelbb7 on 2/2/15


If a unbeliever, asked you the meaning of the word "Righteousness", how would you define...
---David on 2/2/15

David. Where does scripture instuct you to explain.
Mat_13:58 And he did not many mighty works there because of their unbelief.
Mar_4:11 he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
Pro 2:7 He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous:...
Pro 2:8,
Pro 2:9 Then shalt thou understand righteousness,...
Isa_51:1 Hearken to me, ye that follow after righteousness, ye that seek the LORD: look unto the rock whence ye are hewn, and to the hole of the pit whence ye are digged.
---Trav on 2/2/15


"RIGHTeousness" means/refers to being and doing what is RIGHT.

As to SANCTIFICATION/eternal life, righteousness is about a person's GOOD DEEDS.

Many of the words we use in talking about Godliness have lost their true/accurate meaning over the last 2,000 years because of sloppy teaching.
---faithforfaith on 2/2/15


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