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Does God Have Faith

Does God have faith? Please give bible verses to support your belief.

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 ---trey on 9/21/15
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\\ But there are many who actually believe they are saved, just because they believe in Calvinism. \\

I've frequently said that our faith should be in Christ Himself, and not a theory about how He saves us.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/18/15


Hi Kathr,


1. Again, you do not know what Calvinists believe evident in your statements.
You cant cite a singgle source to provide factual statements.

2. Gen 2,3, and 4 God speaks man knows right and wrong "Regeneration." not opposite.

3. Rom 3 address the fact Jew and gentile are effected by the same law vs 10-18 shows the effect the law has left mankind.

4. Eph 1:1-12 2:1-9 establishes "Regeneration."

regeneration established
---john9346 on 10/18/15


Kathr:


I asked you to address verses in context so I am going to ask you a third time??

Let me help you so you know what I mean.

1. In Jn 6:35-45 all the Father gave Jesus would do what??

2. In jn 6:35-45 What did Jesus say about all the Father would give to him he would do what?

3. In eph 2 verses 1 and 5 what is the state of man????

4. In rom 3:10-19 what is the state of man?

In rom 8:7-8 what can man not do??


Please address these questions in context do not ignore as you have done 2 times all ready.

I am holding you to answers...
---john on 10/18/15


Paul did say whosoever calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved but Jesus taught otherwise. "Not everyone who says to me Lord, Lord will enter into the Kingdom of Heaven but he who does the will of my Father who is in Heaven." Matt 7:21-27.
---barb on 10/18/15


Yes, is calvinism a type of Christianity?
---santimoy.kumar on 10/18/15




There's NO POWER, in preaching Calvinism. No one can be saved just because they believe in the Calvin doctrine. But there are many who actually believe they are saved, just because they believe in Calvinism. And that somehow believing in the Calvin doctrine has assured them THEY ARE the Elect. But, according to Richardc, he may very well be a Tare and not even know he is one. Are you absolutely sure Richardc you are not a Tare? Does a Tare KNOW he is a Tare? Or does believing in Calvinism assure you you are not a Tare?

They tell you that WHO SO EVER, really means the ELECT, where we see in Romans 10:11-12 that WHO SO EVER is clearly defined as both Jew and Gentile. Romans 5 says in due time Jesus died for the UNGODLY, not the elect.
---kathr4453 on 10/18/15


Here's the problem with Calvinism, ...Calvin himself did not show ANY EVIDENCE, that he was saved. He followed Gnostic teachers, was a legalist, murdered, believed in infant baptism, and the list goes on and on. We see also an ugly screen out of history of the elect calling other elect witches, and murdering them as well. History has shown this was nothing more than a land grab of widows and daughters who inherited their husbands/ fathers land. And they murdered anyone who disagreed with their DOCTRINE. They followed the mindset and actions of Calvin. But NOWHERE did any of the Apostles behave in this manner or even preach this kind of behavior, notr did Jesus who we are being conformed to His image. THAT IS NOT THE IMAGE OF JESUS CHRIST.
---kathr4453 on 10/18/15


Romans 161 Corinthians 2

1 Corinthians 1:18-21

18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness, but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.<

21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

WHAT you believe is key here. THERE ARE OVER 1000 false gospels out there...ONLY ONE SAVES. AND the REAL GOSPEL will have evidence of one's salvation. #JAMES.

Richards, it all may seem very foolish to you, but not to God.
---kathr4453 on 10/18/15


Whosoever call upon his name : So does every body that call on his name are saved No or there would be no tares in the church , And the people being saved is it them, by there good works ? or God who is conforming ? Faith Gift of God To All ? Not all men have faith 2 Thessalonians 3:2 Read 2 Thessalonians 3:3
---RichardC on 10/16/15


john 6 is about those who acknowledged the deity of Christ while Jesus was on earth. Just as Jesus said to Peter, who do you say that I am, Peter answered, you are the Son of God. Jesus then said he could not know that unless the Father revealed it to him. But Our faith TODAY, is something different. Belief in Jesus death and resurrection. And as Jesus said to Thomas AFTER Jesus rose from the dead, Blessed are those who don't see but believe. Our faith is in the death and resurrection. Of Jesus Christ. Romans 10:9-10. The Apostles preached and testified to His resurrection we see beginning in Acts. Since you were not alive when Jesus rose, your faith is actually in the testimony and witness of those testifying of Jesus resurrection.
---kathr4453 on 10/16/15




Romans 10:12

12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
---kathr4453 on 10/16/15


Men to call upon the Lord

Roman 3:11 There is none that understandeth there is none that seeketh after God ,


John 6:44 - No man can can come to me , except the father which has sent me draw him up and I will raise him, up on the last day,
---RichardC on 10/15/15


John, before you came on here, we had Markv for close to 7plus years discussing Calvinism. Please don't assume YOU KNOW what I know.

I raised the issue of Seth that YOU have failed to address. What makes you feel you can demand from me anything. Thanks to MarkV we ALL know what Calvinism is and isn't.

Now I have already addressed Romans 3, and I have addressed Ephesians. The problem John is YOU cannot think outside your select few verses. We ALL know what those select few verses are and have been over them more than 100 times here on line. Just because a newbe comes on won't change those answers.

Now YOU address Seth.
---kathr4453 on 10/14/15


John, we all know too that all the points of the TULIP are established in the first...Total depravity, or Total inability. There is no reason to discuss any of the other until this one is proved or disproved. Without the first, none of the other have a foundation and fall apart. Now Total inability has to be proven or rejected right there in Genesis, backed up by Romans 1-2., and Hebrews 11. So stay focused if you can and answer the question of proving total inability through Genesis and Romans 1-2. I have already stated what scripture says. I believe the reason you want to jump around is because you CAN'T refute the points made here.

Calvin was a murderer and LEGALISTS who followed the teachings of a known GNOSTIC, Augustine.
---kathr453 on 10/14/15


Hi Kath,


1. Ephesians is written to the church (ekklesia) vs 4 ch 1 establishes regeneration.

2. vs 8 in ch 2 establishes regeneration

3. Rom 3 address the fact Jew and gentile are effected by the same law vs 10-18 shows the effect the law has left mankind.

I asked you to address verses in context so I am going to ask you a second time to do so??

To establish a fact you don't know what Calvinists believe and you cant cite a singgle source.

Again,address the verses I raised to you in there context??
They say nothing about Seth.
---john9346 on 10/14/15


To understand Ephesians one MUST understands the MYSTERY. The Mystery is Christ in you, the hope of GLORY. GLORY here means that of being GLORIFIED with Christ. This is to the CHURCH, not to Earthly Israel. Paul is making a distinction between the Nation Israel, and THE CHURCH, A Mystery that was kept secret, now revealed, was predestined before the foundation of the world. And ANYONE, TODAY, during this dispensation of GRACE, both Jew and Gentile, who put their faith in Jesus Christ ARE members of the CHURCH, HIS BODY, Not Israel. And as members of His Body, God has predestined THE CHURCH to be conformed to HIS Image.

Calvinism does not believe in the MYSTERY, therefore has misinterpreted all of Ephesians.
---kathr4453 on 10/14/15


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When Paul laid the foundation, and tells us to be careful how we build upon that foundation, that foundation is built on the MYSTERY. CALVINISM's foundation is built on a bogus doctrine called covenant Calvinism, or Covenant theology, where they say the church replaced Israel. The Church is not built upon Israel, but on Jesus Christ ALONE. We are members of HIS BODY, not members of Israel.

Do be careful how you build upon the foundation Paul laid. And understand the MYSTERY first , and THEN build upon that.
---kathr453 on 10/14/15


Genesis 4:26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son, and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the Lord..

Maybe you never saw this verse John. The idea of total inability for man to call upon God of their own FREE WILL, is simply not in scripture. Hopefully YOU SEE, it does NOT say, " THEN GOD began to call upon man". As I said before in my posts, the righteous line of Seth was corrupted through inner marriage with the Line of Cain, leading to corruption and moral decline of the line of Seth, ( STILL SINNERS) where God THEN brought judgement upon all but Noah and family. Romans 1-2 will explain if you really care to listen.

And Romans 3.......please read the WHOLE chapter.
---kathr4453 on 10/13/15


Kathr said, "John, I posted over 6 posts concerning this bogus Calvinist doctrine of Total Depravity and how it doesn't measure up to scripture."


Kathr said, "
John, depravity is NOT in scripture OR its bogus definition."

Again, Rom 3:10-18, Eph 2:1-9, Eph 1:1-13

Please address these verses in their context and not go around them??

Also, please provide me the Calvinist Definition of total depravity as "You." understand it along with the source??
---john9346 on 10/13/15


Our New Birth is also our Baptism into Christ. You can't get anymore sealed than that. This is our eternal security.


John, I posted over 6 posts concerning this bogus Calvinist doctrine of Total Depravity and how it doesn't measure up to scripture. You see, even though the line of Seth were also sinners, the Line of Seth believed and had faith until it had become corrupted as we see in scripture. Only Noah and family remained faithful in the line of Seth. Faith has always come by HEARING, and I'm sure, before the scriptures were written, ORAL tradition and truth were passed down from generation to generation. From Adam and Eve to Abel and Cain, to Seth and so on. Cain's line corrupted the Line of Seth.
---kathr4453 on 10/13/15


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The Holy Spirit is given to believers as a first installment,that our full inheritance as children of God will be delivered. The Holy Spirit is given to us to confirm to us that we belong to God. Only the NEW CREATURE who has been crucified with Christ and raised a New Creature is this given, RE our NEW BIRTH. God grants to us His Holy Spirit as the certain pledge that we are His forever and shall be saved in the last day. This is the guarantee of our New Birth, our Adoption. The Circumcision made without hands. After Abraham believed he too was given a seal, that is circumcision, .....BUT look at Abraham, it was given AFTER HE BELIEVED, not before.

John, depravity is NOT in scripture OR its bogus definition.
---kathr4453 on 10/12/15


Kathr,
Ephesians 1:13. The sealing that Paul is speaking of is not the new birth.

If we follow what Paul is teaching, beginning in verse 3 Paul tells us how we were blessed in Christ Jesus being chosen by God before the foundation of the world and predestinated to be adopted, and how we've been redeemed, and how our salvation was made known unto us and last of all how Christ will gather us all together at the end of time. (i.e. the gospel of our salvation.)

Verse 12 The end of all this (the salvation of the Jews) is to the praise of the grace of God.
---trey on 10/12/15


Kathr states, "And this is what many Calvinists believe, that they preexisted before they were born."

Wrong, please read Eph 1:1-11

Kathr states, "Calvinists say the GOSPEL is God picking and choosing."

Wrong again, see Eph 2:1-9.

Kathr states, "there is no such thing as being born totally depraved."

Wrong again, total depravity means every part of man is effected by sin see Rom 3:10-18.

Kathr said, "Trey and John, I don't want to get the Calvin argument going again."

In reading your statements, you do not know what Calvinists believe my friend...

Ma'am, it would help you to have knowledge of what you speak of...
---john9346 on 10/12/15


Kathr said, "Ephesians CLEARLY SAYS....AFTER you believed THEN you were sealed with the Holy Spirit. Our sealing IS our New Birth. It doesn't get any clearer than that."

And did you read the 12 verses before verse 13 my friend...
---john on 10/12/15


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What is funny is that you use 6 posts to argue against me, then now said my posts agree with you.
Do you even read posts before you go off and show your foolish self?
BTW Isa 42:1 shows that Christ will judge the Gentiles. If that is in agreement with your view, why the 6-7 post rebuttal?
---micha9344 on 10/11/15


This matter is settled in me heart. Nothing you say or argue will ever change that.\
Pro 1:7, 12:15
---micha9344 on 10/9/15

Ok Micha, first you misquote me by omitting where I said Romans 1-2 Prove, and you just put PROVE and then use Romans 2, AGREEING WITH WHAT I SAID. Too funny.

Then Isaiah 42:1 ....which has NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SUBJECT MATTER. I was still confused as to what your point was......but THEN you totally mishandle the Word of God to CURSE me with scripture calling me a fool, because I am established strengthened and settled in my faith.

This is normally HOW those who don't know scripture attack others rather than the subject.

No cursing was here UNTIL YOU came on here Micha.
---kathr4453 on 10/11/15


Wow, 6 consecutive posts from kathr that time.
Must be a record.
Granted they were all contradicting each other, but, nonetheless, she said what she needed to say.
Even ad-hominem attacks and false accusations, as if she knew peoples hearts.
/Please know what you are posting first before posting Micha. You all see the word ELECT, and walla, you think it's all about YOU...WRONG!\
I would think anyone familiar with prophecy would recognize that references Christ.
Your accusation is clear...and false.
---micha9344 on 10/10/15


mAtthew 12:16and warned them not to tell who He was. 17This was to fulfill what was spoken through Isaiah the prophet: 18"BEHOLD, MY SERVANT WHOM I HAVE CHOSEN, MY BELOVED IN WHOM MY SOUL is WELL-PLEASED, I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT UPON HIM, AND HE SHALL PROCLAIM JUSTICE TO THE GENTILES.

Isaiah 42:1 Micha is that which was spoken through Isaiah....and the verse is about Jesus Christ.....NOT YOU,

Please know what you are posting first before posting Micha. You all see the word ELECT, and walla, you think it's all about YOU...WRONG!
---kathr453 on 10/10/15


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Romans 1:21. when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful, but BECAME vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Ok Let's reiterate Romans 1:21 ...THEY BECAME VAIN in their imagination. Is this saying this is what happened to Adam and Eve the instant the very moment they ate the fruit? Hardly. Can this be proved through Abel? No. Does it clearly say ALL MEN became vain in their imagination the moment sin entered the world? No. Now if they were already GIVEN UP, then God didn't need to GIVE THEM UP did He? And WHEN did God give them up, "THEM " AS IN those before the flood? Here God is explaining WHY He gave THEM UP AFTER they were born, not before.
---kathr4453 on 10/10/15


How can God give anyone up before they are even born, unless you are Mormon and believe you pre existed before you were born? And this is what many Calvinists believe, that they preexisted before they were born. I may know something in advance, but my knowing it did not author it.
Joseph Smith took much of his doctrine from Calvinism. And one is the preexistance of our souls. They want you to believe that God pre arranged a vicious RAPE to bring about a soul that preexisted. Yet we see God condemns RAPE along with many forbidden unions, including Adultry. In the OT Adulterers were stoned to death, even a pregnant woman. Yet TODAY there are many SAVED, in spite of how their life came into existence.
---kathr453 on 10/10/15


Romans 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful, but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

The Lord made no such accusation upon Adam after he sinned.
---kathr4453 on 10/10/15


We know that before the flood there were men of faith. Abel, Enoch, and more than likely multitudes of those through the line of Seth who knew the Gospel just as men today know the Gospel. They will be judged BY THE GOSPEL, so says scripture, just as man TODAY will also be judged by the Gospel. And we see AGAIN, this great APOSTASY, and falling away that will lead to the FINAL JUDGEMENT with fire, and not a flood. After the flood was a NEW beginning.....and MAN messed it up again. Jesus warns that before His return it will be just like in the times of Noah. Noah kept the faith in spite of the corruption and evil around him. Noah KNEW the Gospel that had been preached from Genesis 3:15. And Noah PREACHED the GOSPEL warning others.
---kathr453 on 10/10/15


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Romans 2:16

16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

And here is the smoking gun.

Calvinists say the GOSPEL is God picking and choosing. So they believe to be judged by Jesus Christ according to the Gospel, means it's really the SECRETS of God, that will be revealed, that multitudes NEVER had a chance. But that is NOT what the verse says.
---kathr445 on 10/10/15


/PROVE that man without the LAW of Moses STILL KNEW RIGHT FROM WRONG, and will be judged according to that conscience.\-kathr4453 on 10/9/15
Rom 2:14-15 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves: Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and [their] thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another,)
Isa 42:1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold, mine elect, [in whom] my soul delighteth, I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
/This matter is fully settled in me heart. Nothing you say or argue will ever change that.\
Pro 1:7, 12:15
---micha9344 on 10/9/15


John and Trey, yes Romans 1 begins with man, and what happened to those before the flood..chapter 1-2. Then the Law..ch 3 and FAITH ch 4 Those promises Abraham believed BEGAN in Genesis 3:15. So from Abel on, FAITH in the coming redeemer has always been. Abel was not regenerated FIRST in order to believe. Romans 1-2 does not teach total deprevity, but that MAN through disobedience seared his own conscience. Romans 1-2 PROVE that man without the LAW of Moses STILL KNEW RIGHT FROM WRONG, and will be judged according to that conscience. The moment Adam sinned and they KNEW they were naked AND ASHAMED...proves there is no such thing as being born totally depraved. To have no feelings of being ASHAMED, would in fact be someone totally depraved.
---kathr4453 on 10/9/15


Genesis 3:10-11

10 And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked, and I hid myself.

11 And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked?

You see, NO ONE told them. They KNEW, visa CONSCIENCE.

Trey and John, I don't want to get the Calvin argument going again. Thanks but no thanks. I simply do not believe in the Calvin doctrine of the TULIP.
Ephesians CLEARLY SAYS....AFTER you believed THEN you were sealed with the Holy Spirit. Our sealing IS our New Birth. It doesn't get any clearer than that.
This matter is fully settled in me heart. Nothing you say or argue will ever change that.
---kathr453 on 10/9/15


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Trey,

great job my friend...
---john9346 on 10/9/15


Kathr, you can't just start in Romans chapter 4.

Romans chapter 1 the Apostle Paul builds the case that man is totally depraved. His argument comes to a pinnacle in Romans chapter 3.

Romans 4 Paul explains why Abraham is the perfect example of faith. If you understand that Abraham grew up in an idolatrous nation. Abraham didn't just wake up one day and decide to believe in God. God called him out. God acted first.

The scriptures tell us that Christ is the author and finisher of our faith. Hebrew 12:2

The scriptures also tell us that faith is a fruit of the Spirit. Galatians 5:22

I can't pick a fruit without first having a fruit tree, and I can't have faith without first the Holy Spirit doing a work.
---trey on 10/9/15


Kathr:

1. You do not understand what Calvinists believe.

2. Know where in Scripture are people save with out regeneration.

see, Titus 3:1-8 and Jn 3:1-5, 6:35-45
---john9346 on 10/9/15


Trey, the scriptural ORDER, of our salvation is Romans 4-8. The Order of God's PLAN, re Israel, Gentiles etc, is quite another subject.
---kathr4454 on 10/9/15


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Kathr,
The Apostle Paul gives us the scriptural order of our salvation. Romans 8:29-30 you will see the order is this:

1st, God foreknew us (meaning he had an intimate knowledge and love for us before the beginning of the world).

2nd, God predestinated us to be made like unto Christ when glorified. His love for us was the motivating factor.

3rd, God called us, that is the new birth or regeneration. It is an effectual call meaning it gets the job done. We are willing in the day of his power! Psalms 110:3

4th, God justified us. We are justified by the blood of Christ and his finished work upon the cross.

5th, We are glorified.
---trey on 10/8/15


John , I do understand what regeneration means. I was talking about the order of our salvation. Justification is first, then regeneration or our Born Again state comes as a result of our justification. We are justified by His blood, and saved by His life....His risen life that is. It's His risen life IN US that brings about the New Birth. So we are sanctified THROUGH the BODY of Christ so says Hebrews.

Calvinism has it backwards. They believe one has to be Born again FIRST in order to believe. Yet scripture says we believe first, which is our Justification, justified by His Blood so that He can live in us. God cannot join Himself to a sinner and live in a sinner until one is first Justified.
---kathr4453 on 10/8/15


Kathr said, "YOU are confusing justification with sanctification."

as I read your response to me, I am not sure you understand the meaning of regeneration.

regeneration means God whereby He renews the spiritual condition of a sinner. It is a spiritual change brought about by the work of the Holy Spirit so that the person then possesses new life--eternal life. Regeneration is a change in our moral and spiritual nature
where justification is a change in our relationship with God. Also, sanctification is the work of God in us to make us more like Jesus. Regeneration is the beginning of that change. It means to be born again
---john9346 on 10/7/15


Hebrews 5:9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him,

Hebrews 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

You can't separate Hebrews 5:9 from Hebrews 12:2.

Our faith is in the finished works of Christ....not the finished faith of Christ.
---kathr4453 on 9/30/15


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"Of course I am not offended" Good, glad to hear that, offense is never my intent.
---Josef on 9/29/15


Josef, I appreciate your comments. Of course I'm not offended. And I like a good dialogue on issues. I believe the issue here is we see faith differently. I do know the WOF and Calvinists belief about faith are both wrong. To place regeneration first, and then faith to come afterwords is no where found in scripture, beginning from Abel to today. No one was regenerated in the OT, yet we see a whole chapter in Hebrews 11 on FAITH of OT people. Abel was made an heir of Righteousness as a result of his obedience to God's will. faith without works/obedience is dead. This cannot describe God. God is not required to obey Himself.
---kathr4453 on 9/29/15


Actually, Calvinism believe faith is a gift from God which results from regeneration.
---john9346 on 9/27/15

John, the fruit of the Spirit, love Joy Peace faith, long suffering etc results from our being born Again. Yet no fruit of the Spirit is given prior to salvation. And none of the Gifts of the Spirit is given prior to salvation. You can't just pick out one fruit, or one gift excluding the rest and say God gave this to certain people prior to regeneration. YOU are confusing justification with sanctification. Faith to believe comes through the Word of God. And yes, God's Word, Jesus Christ IS a Gift to ALL MAN. Yet not all men will take that GIFT.
---kathr4453 on 9/28/15


"Josef, it sounds to me as if you are attempting to convince others. What I see is a philosophy but no scripture to back up. To use, the faith OF Jesus , is not enough to convince me." No, I wasn't making any such attempt, I simply viewed this as an exchange of thoughts and views between us after I was engaged by you. You shared yours views according to your belief, I did likewise. There was no offense intended Kat. If I did offend you, please except my apologies.
---Josef on 9/28/15


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To anyone taking the time to read this. This line, "There was no offense intended Kat. If I did offend you, please [except] my apologies." Was of course meant to read, 'There was no offense intended Kat. If I did offend you, please [accept] my apologies.' I know most of you figured that out, however by what I have seen on this forum, there may be those who may not, and look to correct me. :oD))
---Josef on 9/28/15


My bottom line concerning this is that I am not attempting to convince you or anyone else to believe as I do, that is not my place. Yet it remains my belief, I have shared it, whether it is received or not.
---josef on 9/26/15

Josef, it sounds to me as if you are attempting to convince others. What I see is a philosophy but no scripture to back up. To use, the faith OF Jesus , is not enough to convince me. Faith is what is required of MAN for salvation. To make it something more than that is philosophy,....and again giving it a Calvinist twist that again uses another twisted verse saying God has GRANTED it. If one reads that verse Salvation is what was Granted, and it was granted to Gentiles.
---kathr4453 on 9/28/15


"God too is the Author and finisher of Salvation, YET no where does God need salvation.
---kathr453 on 9/26/15

Yet it remains a fact, that "Salvation is of the LORD." Jon 2:9>Psa 37:39 etc. He is "The God of salvation". Psa 68:20>Isa 12:2
The same is applicable to faith. I reiterate, Jesus is it's author and finisher.
Author-(archegos)-G747 "The chief leader, one that takes the lead and thus affords an example, a predecessor,a pioneer."
Finisher-(teleiotes)-G5051 "A perfector, one who has in his own person raised faith to its perfection and so set before us the highest example of faith. "Man is saved, justified, and made righteous by the faith of Jesus."
---Josef on 9/27/15


"Bee, Hebrews 11 says By Faith WE BELIEVE..." Actually it reads "Through faith we understand.." However it is not faith that inspires understanding, it is understanding that inspires faith, and that understanding comes via the word of God. "Faith comes by 'hearing', (G189 from G191, in this context, hearing can be best defined as understanding), and 'hearing' [understanding] by the word of God." Rom 10:17 I know this definition to be the proper one because not every who hears audibly, or gives audience to the word, receives saving faith. Therefore Heb. 11:3 could be understood this way, We understand, by the word of god, that through faith He framed the worlds, without altering the meaning.
---Josef on 9/27/15


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Kathr said, "And again Calvinists too have distorted the understanding of faith, placing it as the GIFT.

Actually, Calvinism believe faith is a gift from God which results from regeneration.
---john9346 on 9/27/15


"Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen." That is not a definition of faith, it is an explanation of faith.
"Does God HOPE in something?" In faiths context, Yes. For in that context, hope is defined as that which is anticipated with pleasure, and fully and confidently expected. Strongs G1679 from G1680
"God doesn't need faith in Himself or His word..since He cannot lie." True, He does not, yet He has it, and offers it to believers through His Holy Spirit, and His Word. 1Co 12:9>Rom 10:17
---Josef on 9/27/15


Bee, Hebrews 11 says By Faith WE BELIEVE God created the world. It does not say God created anything by faith. God doesn't need faith in Himself or His word..since He cannot lie.

So by faith WE BELIEVE. If I put my faith in an insurance policy, my faith is in the company offering the policy. I would have to trust that what they promise they will deliver. The Insurance company does not need faith in itself to assure those promises. Now from a human perspective ...seeing an insurance company CAN LIE and not make good on their policy, IF that happened THEN I would have to put my faith in the Judicial system. The Judicial system does not need faith either. God has promised and I BELIEVE because God cannot Lie, it's a done deal.
---kathr4453 on 9/26/15


Faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things not seen. Here is the definition. Does God HOPE in something? NO Or do WE HOPE in something? YES, Jesus is our Blessed HOPE. Is there something God has not seen? The Just shall live by FAITH and not by SIGHT. if you see it, then it's not faith. GOD SEES and KNOWS everything, from the beginning to the end.
God too is the Author and finisher of Salvation, YET no where does God need salvation.
---kathr453 on 9/26/15


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"1)The Bible clearly tells us God IS Love, yet no verse says God IS Faith." No, but it does say Father is faithful in many places.
2) we are saved "BY GRACE" through faith, not of works lest any man should boast. Josef your #2) Wrong. You left out the SAVED BY HIS LIFE, SAVED BY GRACE part." There is only 125 words allowed per post.
3) Faith is [a] gift, I never said it was [the] gift. You are of course correct, Jesus is [the] gift, however without faith, it is impossible to please Him.
My bottom line concerning this is that I am not attempting to convince you or anyone else to believe as I do, that is not my place. Yet it remains my belief, I have shared it, whether it is received or not.
---josef on 9/26/15


Josef, WOF has also distorted the understanding of faith, also using your comments that faith has power to move mountains. Have you personally tested this theory to prove you can. Wouldn't that be mustering up faith. And again Calvinists too have distorted the understanding of faith, placing it as the GIFT. Romans 5 tell us exactly what the GIFT IS. The Gift of Righteousness that comes only through imputed righteousness to those who believe Jesus died and rose again from the dead. Romans 10:9-10. The Apostles were witnesses to His resurrection and testify to His resurrection. If you BELIEVE God raised Him from the dead, thou shall be saved. Believe and faith are the same. Just study Romans 4... The faith of Abraham.
---kathr4453 on 9/26/15


God has plenty of faith. God is faith. How do you think the world was formed. He called things into existence and there they were. Why would God place faith in his children and not have faith himself. That would make God a lier. And that is impossible because God can't lie. Man lies. Being that God is not a man. (Numbers:23-19) therfore he can't lie.
You need to get you some faith. Faith comes from our belif system. What you believe in you will have. Faith comes by hearing the word of God. It never fails!!
---Bee on 9/26/15


Would you give us an example of how you believe God exercises faith. I define faith as a steadfast unwavering confidence in an internal conviction, for man, it is a conviction inspired of the Father as concerning Himself and His Word. Father's faith in His Word is expressed in Isa 55:10,11. Jesus' faith in the Father is expressed with this statement "Father into you hands I commend my spirit", representing His life. He was confident that He would be raised from the dead, as foretold of david when He prophesied concerning Jesus, that the Father would not leave His soul in hell, nor allow His Holy one to see corruption.
---Josef on 9/26/15


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Kathy you say "There is no power in faith." I say if you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to [a] mountain, 'Move from here to there, and it will move, and nothing will be impossible for you, that is the power of faith. You ask "So why would God need faith?" He doesn't, However, He does have faith to give, and has given a measure of that faith to every man, and it is He that gives saving faith to His own, as a gift. To give a gift, logic dictates that one must first possess it, Again, I believe that faith is as much a part of His character as love. You say "Jesus is the author and finisher or perfect of [our] faith." Actually our was not included in that statement, it was added.
---Josef on 9/26/15


1) Faith exudes from the Father, and is as much a innate characteristic as Love. .............

2)We are privileged by Him to exercise that faith in Him, His principles, and His promises. You have been saved through that faith, which is not of yourselves.
---Josef on 9/25/15

1)The Bible clearly tells us God IS Love, yet no verse says God IS Faith.

2) we are saved "BY GRACE" through faith, not of works lest any man should boast. Josef your #2) Wrong. You left out the SAVED BY HIS LIFE, SAVED BY GRACE part.

BUT I do believe this is the bogus understanding Calvinists have in their interpretation of being saved "by faith" as IT being the Gift and not Christ Crucified and Risen.
---kathr4453 on 9/26/15


Josef, there are many verses that define faith. Hebrews 11 is a great chapter of all who put their faith in God and His Promises. Jesus is the author and finisher or perfect of our faith.

God does not need faith. Faith is an attitude. So you are correct one cannot muster up faith.
Don't put your faith in the wisdom of men but in the POWER OF GOD. For God to have faith, He would have to put faith in a power higher than His own. Nor does He need to have faith in His own power.

if you believe God has faith, Would you give us an example of how you believe God exercises faith. There is no power in faith. Our faith is in His power and His promises. So why would God need faith?
---kathr4453 on 9/25/15


To clarify my last post, I simply used persuasiveness as an example of how the Father could exercise faith, not as an attempt to explain the faith of God. Faith exudes from the Father, and is as much a innate characteristic as Love. Therefore, having that same spirit-attitude-of faith, according as it is written, I believe, and therefore I have spoken. Faith is not something that we muster up, it is produced of the Holy Spirit as He guides us in our understanding of His Word. The faith of jesus is the faith that originates in Him, and is empowered of Him as faiths author and finisher. We are privileged by Him to exercise that faith in Him, His principles, and His promises. You have been saved through that faith, which is not of yourselves.
---Josef on 9/25/15


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StrongAxe the term "faith in God" is also used only once in scripture [that I know of]. Mar 11:22, and I agree with that usage, in that context, as well. Faith in God may be easier for you believe, never the less faith of God is how Rom 3:3 reads, and is easier for me to believe, given the context. Persuasion is one of the ways [pistis], the Greek word translated faith, is defined in english. Persuasion is defined as 1. the act of persuading or seeking to persuade. 2. the power of persuading, or as a persuasive force. either of which can be applied, very easily in my view, to the "faith of Jesus", or "the faith of God" as describing their persuasiveness.
---Josef on 9/23/15


Interesting question. Many thoughts. Limited space, time.
Gal 2:20 "I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me."

In a sense, God has faith in that
He gives faith, or has faith to give
all good things come from Him
Rom 12:3, 1Cor 12:9 1Cor 4:7, Gal 5:22, Eph 2:8, Heb 12:2
How one answers might depend on their understanding or interpretation of faith
faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hb11:1 KJV
Many versions use assurance of what is hoped for.
If assurance, how is one assured, or where does that come from? I believe God.
faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God
---Chria9396 on 9/24/15


Hi Trey,

interesting question.

No, God does not have faith.

When the bible commands us to have faith, it is conveying that God is to be the object of our faith for example, "Trust God because he is trustworthy, believe in God because God can do the impossible, and have confidence in God because God is secure."


Good Question

May the Lord guide you,

John
---john9346 on 9/24/15


Josef:

You said: "What if some did not believe? Shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?" Rom 3:3

The idea of God having faith is mentioned nowhere else (that I know of) in the Bible. Basing a doctrine on a single verse in passing, based on the nuance of translation, can be a perilous thing (e.g. the Mormon's doctrine of "baptism for the dead"). In this case, "faith IN God" makes a lot more sense, both in terms of the specific context, and also what is taught elsewhere in scripture. Or, worded slightly differently, "[our] belief of God".
---StrongAxe on 9/23/15


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"What if some did not believe? Shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?" Rom 3:3 Faith as used here is the same Greek word [pistis] that is used for faith in every other mention of faith in the new testament. Although the NIV and other translations use the word faithfulness in their translations, the Greek word for faithful [pistos], defined trustworthy, is not actually used in this verse, and [pistis], according to original strongs in book form, does not include that definition, however it does include persuasion. Therefore I believe the KJV, DBY, and WEB translates and renders the verse the way that it should be.
---Josef on 9/23/15


Our faith is in God and His Word. God cannot lie. God does not need faith, as that would mean He must put His trust in someone higher than Himself.
---kathr4453 on 9/22/15


If you had a friend pick you up for work every morning, your trust in your friend's reliability would inspire faith that he would show up on time, even though you can't see him until he arrives. However, if you had a satellite tracker or GPS receiver to track his car, you would rely on knowledge rather than faith. It's the same with God. He doesn't need to believe things are so, because he knows they are so.
---StrongAxe on 9/22/15


The Lord Jesus Christ did not need an ounce of faith in God. He was God.
Faith is what men possess when they hear the word of truth and believe it (Rom 10:17). Faith is not needed by the one man who is the Truth (John 14:6).
---michael_e on 9/22/15


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Man is saved, justified, and made righteous by the faith of Jesus. Gal 3:22>Gal 2:16>Rom 3:22
---josef on 9/22/15


I concur with Cluny and Brendan.
I will also add this:
1Co 13:2 And though I have [the gift of] prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge, and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
1Co 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three, but the greatest of these [is] charity.
Maybe we can see how many people think Jesus had faith?
---micha9344 on 9/21/15


Deuteronomy 7:9, Romans 3:3, 1 Corinthians 1:9, 1 Corinthians 10:13.
---Rob on 9/21/15


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