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Love and Respect

Can everyone please remember to show love and respect to each other even though we disagree at times? God bless!l

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 ---andreea on 10/26/15
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Amen to you Kathyr for your great points.

Luke good points.

Nicole if you look at baptism like circumcision you are correct. But the New Testament points to a believers baptism for it is not the same as circumcision.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 11/17/15


Amen Samuel. The very foundation of salvation began in Genesis, immediately after Adam and Eve sinned, and God covered them in animal skins. That covering pointed to Jesus Christ. Abel offered a blood sacrifice...again pointing to Jesus Christ and His death. Obedience of faith was practiced long before the flood or Abraham. Belief in the coming redeemer for our sin was announced right from the beginning in Genesis 3:15. Even Hebrews 11, the great chapter on faith, states clearly Abel is an HEIR of righteousness, because he did what? Ans, by simply putting his faith in the coming redeemer showing his faith by his blood sacrifice. Without the shedding of blood there is no forgivness of sin.
---kathr4453 on 11/17/15


"... Israel has not obtained what it seeks but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded." Rom. 11:7."

The rest were blinded. Blinded by God. Only those born of God, by grace through faith are saved. Only one way into heaven, and one way only. Only One Church, the "called out" ones by God. Jesus is the Head of that body, there is no two bodies.
Baptism does not save anyone. Baptism is the work of men.
One believes and then volunteers freely to be baptize, because he now follows the commands of Christ in whom he believes.
---Luke on 11/17/15


Nicole_Lacey:

Mark_Eaton asked: Does baptism alone save without calling upon the name of the Lord?

You said: Yes as a Child it does.

How so? Jesus said that who believes and is baptized is saved, but babies are too young to believe anything yet.
---StrongAxe on 11/16/15


Mark, did anyone ASK the baby of Jewish parents if he wanted to be Jewish?

Can the Jewish boy undo a circumcision?

As Paul said, Baptism is the same thing for us Christians.

When you are Baptized you receive the 12 Gifts of the Holy Spirit.

Gifts/Graces

I became a Christian when I was 23 months ago when my parents CHOSE Christianity for me.


Does baptism alone save without calling upon the name of the Lord?---Mark_Eaton on 11/16/15

Yes as a Child it does.

Note you are still claiming some type of action needed to be done by the person to be Saved.

No, God came to you and you ACCEPTED, not because you Called God to Save you.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/16/15




If Baptized as a Baby, it is CLEAR God chose you instead...
You still can still accept God as an Adult if not baptized.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/13/15

Please help me to understand what you are saying.

Are you saying that a man who is baptized as a baby, regardless of the life he will lead, is saved by that baptism and has a place prepared for him by Jesus when he dies?

Does baptism alone save without calling upon the name of the Lord?

And you say that OSAS is a bad doctrine?
---Mark_Eaton on 11/16/15


Trav, I'm not offended, just amused.
---john1944 on 11/13/15

Scriptures offended Mark. Actually offended his doctrines to be fair. Your amused? Mark cannot post because he would have to argue with the prophets and Christ's statements.
Hard choice...it was hard for me until the sheer weight of all the prophets and Christ overwhelmed the doctrines of men.
And there the lies the choice... the "truth" or the doctrines of men. An Apostle is not a prophet. Nor is Paul one of the original twelve. But, many fall under paul's confusion.

Mat_15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
---Trav on 11/16/15


There is only one foundation of GOD's people.

1Corithains 3:11
For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Isaiah 28:16
Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner stone, a sure foundation: he that believeth shall not make haste.

Ephesians 2:20
And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone,

1Peter 2:6
Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.

We place our trust in Jesus.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 11/16/15


Luke, I believe you were the first here making accusations, and always make sure you end with insults and accusations. ok You win.......BUT, let's be clear here Luke, were you not desperately having the need to be right? No matter how I answered you, you still took what I said and twisted it to your meaning, insisting I was wrong?

MY FINAL ANSWER LUKE,

The foundation of salvation is NOT built upon Jeremiah 4:1-4, as you kept insisting it was/is. And if you care to look, Paul NEVER ONCE uses Jeremiah 4:1-4 in any way what so ever to lay the foundation of salvation EVER EVER EVER. If you can't get the foundation correct, how are you building upon it? Or should I say WHAT are you building upon?
---kathr4453 on 11/15/15


Kathr, you always have some derogatory remark to say when you answer. You talk about Israel and in between you throw jabs, and then speak about Calvin and accuse me. Are you always this way? At home? with your family and friends? Something is really wrong there Kathr.
Israel is really just a smoke screen. It is just a means to throw garbage at others.
What happen to that love and respect that this blog is talking about? You are not showing it. The marks of a Christian are missing.
---Luke on 11/14/15




Trav, I'm not offended, just amused.
---john1944 on 11/13/15


God choses you not you chose Him.---Nicole_Lacey on 11/11/15

God chose all mankind to be adopted into His family.--Mark_Eaton on 11/12/15

The Sinner's prayer give you all the choice of choosing God first not He choosing you.

If Baptized as a Baby, it is CLEAR God chose you instead.

You still can still accept God as an Adult if not baptized.

But many boast about 'How many they lead to Jesus Christ'.
I hear that all the time from Protestants who taught others how to say the 'Sinner's prayers.'

Really??
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/13/15


I stopped conversing with Trav a while ago.
---Mark_Eaton on 11/13/15

Hey...I apologize if scripture hurt. I didn't write it. Israel is GOD's pet subject.
I remember me. I was provoked initially. Provoked enough to search scripture out of my doctrinal comfort zone.
Anyone that posts doctrines/dogma that does not stand up to the prophetic, Christ or Apostolic witnesses should pause and search. Come back when your foundation is cemented with "All" prophets, Christ...aligning with the Apostles witness.
Joh_21:17 He saith unto him the third time, ... Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things, thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep.
(Be one or feed one)
---Trav on 11/13/15


MarkEaton, keep in mind that Trav believes that salvation is only for Israel, ...
You need to approach him on that basis.
---john1944 on 11/12/15Hmmmm, but then ... "the" choice would be to approach with scripture. You claim its exclusively yours now? Why doesn't GOD?
Bring your own history if Israels offends you. We'll compare your created doctrine to Israels prophecied, fulfilled and fulfilling words.
Exo_29:45 And I will dwell among the children of Israel, and will be their God.
Num_23:23 Surely there is no enchantment against Jacob, neither is there any divination against Israel: according to this time it shall be said of Jacob and of Israel, What hath God wrought!
---Trav on 11/13/15


You need to approach him on that basis.
---john1944 on 11/12/15

I stopped conversing with Trav a while ago.

I established a set of boundaries for myself in these "rooms" and as a result, stopped conversing with many people.

1. I will not tolerate anyone being personally disgraced because of their beliefs and will call out people for it.
2. I will not continue to communicate with someone who tries to personally disgrace me.
3. I will not continue to communicate with someone who turns every discussion into their "pet" subject.
4. Every doctrine is fair game and all opinions of doctrine should be Biblically based
5. I am not "right" in all things.
---Mark_Eaton on 11/13/15


MarkEaton, keep in mind that Trav believes that salvation is only for Israel, and that Israel constitutes in the main white people of Western European descent. You need to approach him on that basis.
---john1944 on 11/12/15


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and an "Israel of God" (Gal. 6:16) made up of Jewish people and Gentiles who believe in the Messiah.
---Luke on 11/12/15

Luke, you do see the word AND the Israel of God? not WHO ARE the Israel of God. AND means in addition to. The Church is NOT the Israel of God. However there is, and will be who consists of JEWS, who will come through the Great Tribulation, who enter into the 1000 year reign, what Romans 11 is all about.....ISRAEL and the JEWS. The ones in Galatians Paul was rebuking thought they already were in the Kingdom reign and we're trying to put Gentiles under the Law where during the 1000 years the Gentiles WILL BE subjected to Israel. TODAY, Saved Gentiles are ABOVE AND FREE, AND NEITHER JEW OR GENTILE.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/15


Luke, I would try to explain more to you, but you did say too much information scared you, and you were not able to process it. There isn't enough blog space to go back and forth using sips of milk , as MarkV, you know we have been over this again and again for many years.

Let's just give it a rest, since it is established that I do not believe in the Calvin Doctrine, or Covenant Calvinism. We simply will have to agree to disagree.
---kathr453 on 11/13/15


God chose all mankind to be adopted into His family.
---Mark_Eaton on 11/12/15

Never prophecied or written in your words above.
Rather the opposite. GOD does not change.
Deu_10:15 Only the LORD had a delight in thy fathers to love them, and he chose their seed after them, even you above all people, as it is this day.
Isa_43:1 now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name, thou art mine.
Isa_62:12 And they shall call them, The holy people, The redeemed of the LORD: thou shalt be called, Sought out, A city not forsaken.
Luk_1:68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel, for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
---Trav on 11/12/15


God choses you not you chose Him.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/11/15

God chose all mankind to be adopted into His family.

But God does not force His choice on anyone. It is still up to us to change our mind (repent) about Jesus, who He is, who His Father is, and whether we will surrender to His authority.

Many do not surrender to His authority and continue to run their lives. They may even be baptized, attend church, donate, do everything that looks and feels like an upstanding "Christian".

These ones are the tares Jesus spoke of.
---Mark_Eaton on 11/12/15


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Kathr, believers are the remnant of God, the Spiritual Israel of God. Same covenant.
"... That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith, but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not obtained to the law of righteousness" Rom. 9:30,31.
"... at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace" Rom. 11:5.
"... Israel has not obtained what it seeks but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded." Rom. 11:7.
"There is an Israel after the flesh (1 Cor. 10:18) and an "Israel of God" (Gal. 6:16) made up of Jewish people and Gentiles who believe in the Messiah.
---Luke on 11/12/15


That is true, that God was speaking to the nation of Israel. And only a few, "the remnant" were saved. That same salvation "circumcision of the heart" later went to the Gentiles, in the New Testament.
---Luke on 11/11/15

Nothing about them being SAVED, Luke, and nothing about this passing to,the Gentiles. Gentiles are not a remnant of the Jews. That's where your doctrine gets off track.
---kathr4453 on 11/11/15


This definition of Christianity makes it equal to being an American.---Mark_Eaton on 11/11/15

Good point.
Because no one can choose to be born an American. It was chosen by another.
Or everyone would choose their birth place in America.

You can't live LIKE Mother Teresa and profess to be a Christian.

Jesus said a GOOD Tree bears GOOD Fruit. It CAN'T bear bad Fruit.

Sorry if you want the CONTROL and not God.

God choses you not you chose Him.

Being a Christian can be made by God and a Jew was decided by God.

But God isn't a control freak and allows you to be a Christian in Hell if you wish.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/11/15


Now the same is with being baptized as a baby...You are made a Christian by the decision of your parents...
Now you can reject practicing Christianity as an Adult, as a Jew - Judaism.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/10/15

This definition of Christianity makes it equal to being an American.

This definition is why the world confuses people who profess Christianity and live like the devil and those who profess Christianity and live like Mother Teresa.

This definition is why I do not use the word Christian, but use the word Believer or Follower to describe those who live the truth of "love the Lord with all your heart, soul, and mind, and love your neighbor as yourself"
---Mark_Eaton on 11/11/15


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Kathr, you said:
"Luke, the passage in Jeremiah 4:1-4 is to Israel. The NATION of Israel. This passage does not apply to anyone today."
And later said:

"We see Israel did not obey Jeremiah, and God handed them over to the Gentiles. Only a remnant left with Jeremiah."

That is true, that God was speaking to the nation of Israel. And only a few, "the remnant" were saved. That same salvation "circumcision of the heart" later went to the Gentiles, in the New Testament.
---Luke on 11/11/15


Luke, the passage in Jeremiah 4:1-4 is to Israel. The NATION of Israel. This passage does not apply to anyone today. And I already addresses verse 4 where God tells then to circumcise their hearts to obey, or else judgement. The judgement was addressed to the whole nation, not to individuals.

Today the Church is made up of INDIVIDUAl Jews and Gentiles. And no such warnings addressing the WHOLE Church is applicable to us today. If I sin, God does not punish YOU.

We see Israel did not obey Jeremiah, and God handed them over to the Gentiles. Only a remnant left with Jeremiah.
---kathr4453 on 11/10/15


Many on CN believe you have to be 8 or 9 years old to accept Jesus Christ as a Savior.

Yet, Jesus and all the other Jewish boys as He didn't have a choice of being a Jew.

On their 8th day of life they were MADE a Jew by being circumcised.

No decision given to them at all. They can't even REVERSE it.

Now the same is with being baptized as a baby.
You are made a Christian by the decision of your parents.

Now you can reject practicing Christianity as an Adult, as a Jew - Judaism.

But, the decision was made without their consent.

Jesus was brought into Judaism by Joseph and Mary.

They didn't wait until He was 9 years ago to accept God as His Heavenly Father, nor Present Him to the Temple.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/10/15


Kathr, you take up all the blog, talking too much no one knows are has room to answer the many respond's you put together. How can anyone respond to one when you have so many? are you trying to scare me with so many?

Why not stay on one passage, I gave Jeremiah 4:1-4, if you do not like the passages answer why it is wrong. Not all the other garbage, and I will respond to you kindly with Scripture. Thank you
---Luke on 11/10/15


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only the descendants of Abraham who are circumcised from the heart will enter heaven I meant that. Gentiles are now included in that covenant of circumcision of the heart.
---Luke on 11/9/15

Luke, where in scripture is there a covenant of the circumcision of the heart? That's a new one. Back to making up covenants again I see.

Romans 2, the words FAITH, GRACE OR COVENANT, are not even used, and it is talking about Gentiles , the uncircumcised, vs the Jews who are circumcised during the time OF THE LAW. So you are also saying that even though those Gentiles who obeyed the law, who's Uncircumcision was seen as circumcision still went to hell? Let me ask you this, since when did obeying the law guarantee heaven?
---kathr4453 on 11/10/15


Now, Romans 2 to chapters 3-4 . To omit those or fail to keep reading is to your detriment. Because NOW in Romans 4 comes in ABRAHAM, and the FAITH of Abraham. And JUSTIFICATION by FAITH, not law. For Abraham was 400 years BEFORE THE LAW. and when the LAW came in it did not annul the promises given to Abraham. And the very FIRST mention of circumcision in the OT was to Abraham. But you will also see there is no mention of a circumcised heart, or a covenant of a circumcised heart. Abraham was imputed righteousness BEFORE he was circumcised physically, which was a sign/ seal, of his FAITH.

Just as water baptism doesn't save you, neither does circumcision. True baptism is being baptized into His Death, and raised a new creature.
---kathr453 on 11/10/15


Luke, In the OT the Covenant Blessings were earthly blessings given to Israel as a NATION. The CHURCH today cannot claim those earthly blessings of PROSPERITY. The WOF prosperity teachers use OT promises given to Earthly Israel. And Calvinism was the FIRST to teach prosperity teaching due to it's co-mingling of LAW and faith, OT and NEW. The circumcised heart was for the purpose of KEEPING THE LAW. GO REREAD Romans 2 again.

God did say to Abraham, In thee will all families of the earth be blessed. But those blessings have nothing to do with earthly blessings that were given to Israel under the Old Covenant. And being blessed with faithful Abraham, whether Jew or Gentile does not make one a descendent of Abraham.
---katyr4453 on 11/9/15


Circumcision TODAY under GRACE not LAW is clearly defined in Colossians 2. Just as the Law, the sabbath etc was fulfilled IN CHRIST, so too is Circumcision. Jesus Christ IS our circumcision, He IS our sabbath, as we are Complete in Him.

Not one single person in the OT lived under the fulfillment of Colossians 2. Their sin was only Covered, not TAKEN AWAY IN CHRIST. There was no cross to nail it to then. They were STILL under statutes and ordinances. Still under the LAW. They were not yet NEW CREATURES.

Do you REALLY understand the CROSS Luke?
---kathr453 on 11/9/15


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Kath, when I said only the descendants of Abraham who are circumcised from the heart will enter heaven I meant that. Gentiles are now included in that covenant of circumcision of the heart.
Jeremiah was sent to preach to the covenant community of Israel and call the people to repent and turn from their Idolatry-and refusal to repent was refusal to the recognize God's ownership of them. In Jeremiah 4:1-4 the Prophet reminds the people that they cannot rightfully trust in the mark of circumcision for covenant blessings: Rather, they have to experience the inner reality of a circumcised heart that the circumcision in their flesh is to signify. The Lord's covenant of salvation has always been a covenant of the heart.
---Luke on 11/9/15


trav,
Here is what God says:
Hosea 2:23....
Romans 2:29...
Romans 9:8...children of the promise are counted for the seed.
---trey on 11/6/15

Unauthorized teacher. Israel is who GOD said these prophetic words too! Paul references from the Old Covenant.

Hos_1:10 ... children of Israel shall be as the sand of the sea, which cannot be measured nor numbered, it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not my people, there it shall be said unto them, Ye are the sons of the living God.
Heb 8:10, Laws in heart
Heb_9:15 ...for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
---Trav on 11/9/15


The Holy Spirit has to call us and we have to respond in order to be saved. When we surrender then we are Born Again and become circumcised in our hearts.

agape
---Samuelbb7 on 11/9/15


Deut 10:16 Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart, and be no more stiffnecked.

Jeremiah 4:4Circumcise yourselves to the Lord, and take away the foreskins of your heart, ye men of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem: lest my fury come forth like fire, and burn that none can quench it, because of the evil of your doings.

Here God is telling Israel to Circumcise their own hearts. In other words, God is saying REPENT. He is giving them a CHOICE.
---kathr4453 on 11/9/15


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One DOES NOT have to have a circumcised heart by the Spirit IN ORDER TO BELIEVE. No scripture ever teaches such nonsense.

Romans 3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

Romans 4:9 Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. Romans 4:10 How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
---kathr453 on 11/9/15


Luke, you said ONLY the physical descendants of Abraham who are circumcised in the heart will enter heaven? Scripture please. Job was not a descendent of Abraham, nor was Abel, Adam and Eve, Enoch or Noah. They weren't circumcised in the heart either, as NO SCRIPTURE makes such a claim. Colossians or Romans 6-8 never say we are circumcised IN THE HEART. The Circumcision TODAY is the total cutting away of the flesh when one is crucified with Christ, and the old man, heart, mind toes, fingers etc died with Christ. That's why the New Man is no longer IN THE FLESH, BUT IN THE SPIRIT. Before the cross NO ONE could totally put off the body of sin of the flesh or die to sin. If that were so, then Jesus did not need to come and die for our sin.
---kathr4453 on 11/8/15


Luke, you are not a physical descendent of Abraham. So I guess you are saying there is no hope for you, AND, you are teaching what Trav is teaching. You have taken verses so out of context it's not even funny. You are also saying anyone before Abraham will go to hell. They couldn't possibly be Abraham's descendants or that any Gentile not blood related to Abraham can be saved. Yet we see in Galatians that the promise of the Spirit came on the Gentiles, just as Peter also realized through Cornelius, AFTER Pentecost. The Holy Spirit was promised under the NEW COVENANT, not the old. Only Prophets, Priests and Kings in Israel had the Holy Spirit ON THEM not IN THEM.
---kathr453 on 11/8/15


Kath, only the descendants of Abraham, who are circumcised in the heart by the Spirit, will enter heaven. All the other descendants who are not circumcised in the heart will die in their sins. And have been dying in their sins in the past and even today.
And what does the passages in Romans 2 indicate? That only those who are born of the Spirit, those who believe in the work Christ did on the Cross will be saved.
And what does it mean to Trav? it means that what he is hoping for will never happen. Only through Christ can someone be saved, no matter from what house he is from.
---Luke on 11/8/15


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Trav, my witness, the word of God.
read Romans 2:17,25-26,28-29.
"Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God... for circumcision is indeed profitable if you keep the law, but if you are a breaker of the law, your circumcision become uncircumcision. Therefore, if an uncircumcised man (a Gentile) keeps the righteous requirements of the law, will not his circumcision be counted as circumcision?
For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew who is one inwardly, and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter, whose praise is not from men but from God."

Two kinds of Jews. Only one makes it.
---Luke on 11/7/15


Someone who is "called a Jew" because he is a physical descendant of Abraham, and yet who lives as a lawbreaker, is not a Jew. His circumcision has become uncircumcision. To God he is a Gentile.
---Luke on 11/6/15

Seems like someone is adding their own idea here. This idea "TO GOD HE IS A GENTILE" is bogus. This is also how Mormons use Gentile in a derogatory way, as if Gentile is a dirty word. CIRCUMCISION MEANS NOTHING , AND UNCIRCUMCISION MEANS NOTHING. Galatians 6 makes that clear. What does mean something is that you become a NEW CREATURE, NEITHER JEW OR GENTILE.
---kathr4453 on 11/7/15


Colossians 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: 12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. 13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses,

To be crucified with Christ does not make someone a Jew. And no one was crucified with Christ before the foundation of the world. And God NEVER FORCED anyone to be crucified with Christ. And the WORD was not a Jew before the foundation of the world. And God is NOT a JEW today.
---kathr453 on 11/7/15


The children of Promise are typed with Isaac, not Jacob. Galatians makes this clear. Galatians never once says one becomes a Jew at any time EVER. That is reiterated over and over in Galatians. Romans 4 also clearly say Abraham was imputed righteousness BEFORE he was circumcised. So circumcision re Abraham was a sign / a SEAL of his already established faith...just as the Holy Spirit is OUR SEAL. The ONLY way one can have the Holy Spirit is AFTER you believe, not before. It comes the moment you are Crucified with Christ, making you COMPLETE IN CHRIST. Circumcision in the OT on the 8th day foreshadowed the New Creature and New Creation. The NEW CREATURE is no longer in the flesh. Jew is an earthly fleshly term, not a heavenly one.
---kath453 on 11/7/15


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trav,

Here is what God says:
Hosea 2:23 And I will sow her unto me in the earth, and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy, and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people, and they shall say, Thou art my God. (KJV)

Romans 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly, neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

Romans 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly, and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter, whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Romans 9:8 That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.
---trey on 11/6/15


...concerning Trav, I've read his stuff too.
Titus 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject, (KJV)
Andrea, I am showing love and respect for Luke.
---trey on 11/5/15

Andrea, I am admonishing and teaching a blind boy, trey.
Notably tey having no scripture to admonish me with is all for someone else trying. Ha.
Admonish these prophets trey. You avoided them the first time around, as you should.
Eze_37:28 the heathen (gentile to you) shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
Jer_31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
---Trav on 11/6/15


AMEN Luke! All Israel shall be saved!!! Israel is made up of all the elect of God, Jew and Gentile. All God's chosen shall be saved.

I heard a preacher say once that, "your doctrine doesn't give everyone a chance to be saved." One of our preachers replied. You didn't include enough people. All those that love God / believe in God were saved in covenant before the world began. They were saved vitally by the finished work of Christ on the cross and they all obtain salvation at the new birth. By the way, our God is not a God of chance. He is a sovereign God! He reigns sovereign.

Lord bless you brother.
---trey on 11/6/15


Second, the Israel that was going to be saved is the Spiritual Israel.
---Luke on 11/6/15

You have no witnesses.
There are thirteen kinds of Israel only one Judah. Ephraim and Manasseh count as one.
You cannot find the word "spiritural" Israel, concept or context in Israel's scriptures.
Mat_1:21 ...for he shall save his people from their sins.
Luk_1:68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel, for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
Rom_11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid.
Jas_1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
---Trav on 11/6/15


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Here is some advice concerning Trav, I've read his stuff too.
Titus 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject, (KJV)
---trey on 11/5/15

Ha. You read but, can't tolerate the scriptural witnesses. The controversial scripture you cannot discuss and are blind too makes me a heretic.
You bless me without knowing or meaning too.
Heretic:A person who holds controversial opinions, especially one who publicly dissents from the officially accepted dogma of the Roman Catholic Church.
Eze_37:28 And the heathen (gentile to you) shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore.
---Trav on 11/6/15


Trav, I answer with love.

You said:
"If it didn't matter then all prophets gave their lives for nothing. Christ states why he came.
Yet you say it is not worthy of mention.
There is no feare in the truth.

The prophets came to announce the coming of the Messiah. And you say they died for nothing. Second, the Israel that was going to be saved is the Spiritual Israel. Just as there are two kinds of Israel's, even so there is two kinds of Jews. There is Jewish people in the flesh and Jewish people in the Spirit.
Someone who is "called a Jew" because he is a physical descendant of Abraham, and yet who lives as a lawbreaker, is not a Jew. His circumcision has become uncircumcision. To God he is a Gentile.
---Luke on 11/6/15


But Trav you ignore all the scriptures that point to gentiles being accepted into Israel.

Romans 11:16,17
For if the firstfruit be holy, the lump is also holy: and if the root be holy, so are the branches.
And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree,

Read Galatians. Read that Jesus helped gentiles. Read the book of Deuteronomy and how anyone could join to Israel.

Do you believe all gentiles are lost?
---Samuelbb7 on 11/6/15


Hi Luke,
I've read many of your posts and I know you have some good understanding. Here is some advice concerning Trav, I've read his stuff too.

Titus 3:10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject, (KJV)

Andrea, I am showing love and respect for Luke.
---trey on 11/5/15


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Trav, I don't believe you understand ...
It does not matter what house you are talking about, or what people you are talking about...
---Luke on 11/5/15

If it didn't matter then all prophets gave their lives for nothing. Christ states why he came.
Yet you say it is not worthy of mention.
There is no honor in fear or false positions of men.
Luk_19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.
Mat_15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mat_18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.

Truth is much easier to display, discuss and digest.
---Trav on 11/5/15


Trav, I don't believe you understand Or, you do not believe salvation comes by grace through faith in Jesus Christ.
It does not matter what house you are talking about, or what people you are talking about, those who are Judean's or those who are not, there is no other way into heaven. One way only, no matter who it is. Only the remnant are saved. Those from the past and those today and those who will be saved.
It has to be the work of the Holy Spirit, for only the Spirit brings spiritual life. Once the person has spiritual life, he can see, hear, and understand the things of God. Once a person has faith he can commit his life to Christ. All those people you mention have to have faith in Jesus Christ in order for them to be saved.
---Luke on 11/5/15


Trav. there is only two kinds of people,....
---Luke on 11/3/15

The word jew comes from the name Judah. Judean is someone who is of heritage family tree of Judah.
Judah does not nor ever will equal all the 12 different sons of patriarch Jacob/Israel,(additional are Ephraim/Manasseh). Split into two houses. The North House Lost Sheep of Israel of ten are who Christ said he came for. Matt 10:6/15:24. And the prophets declare it.
Understand your zeal and defense, and light but, you might do a little further research before arguing about Israels covenant scriptures.
Note that the New Covenant says: Heb_8:8...I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
---Trav on 11/3/15


Trav. there is only two kinds of people, the lost, and those who have faith in Jesus Christ. No one can enter heaven without faith in Jesus Christ. If any Jew enters heaven it is because they have faith in Jesus Christ.
How many Jews have died already without faith? Millions. They are dead already. They don't receive faith in Christ while they are dead.
If there was salvation for those who died without faith in Jesus Christ, that would mean they were in some kind of purgatory. And the Bible does not speak of purgatory. It is an invention of the RCC.
---Luke on 11/3/15


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And if you love those who love you, what credit is due to you? For even sinners love those who love them.

Luke 6:32
---john1944 on 11/2/15


Trav, Romans 11:26 is speaking of "all" the elect Jewish people alive at the end of the tribulation...
---Luke on 11/2/15

This is what men teach but, it is not supported in either testament...Old or New.
First of all... there are two parts/houses of Israel. Paul is aware of these two houses, the Judeans were aware and the Lost Sheep House consisting of Ten Biblically named and covenanted brothers of Israel were aware of the separation/divorce/putting away. Ask the woman at the well.
Eze_37:22 I will make them one nation in the land upon the mountains of Israel, and one king shall be king to them all: and they shall be no more two nations, neither shall they be divided into two kingdoms any more at all:
---Trav on 11/2/15


On saved, Romans states:Rom_11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:


Trav, Romans 11:26 is speaking of "all" the elect Jewish people alive at the end of the tribulation, not the believing remnant of Jews with the church during this church age, (see v. 5, 17) since the remnant has already embraced the truth of the gospel, read v.25. It could not be in view here, since it no longer needs the salvation this verse (v. 26) promise.
Plus it could not mean those who have already died in sin without the Lord. If God had not kept a remnant in the Old Testament, not a one would have been saved. But we have Old T. believers.
---Luke on 11/2/15


Samuel, I have a problem with what you said. You seem to be saying that those who cause all the problems in the church are really saved. Real Christians. Let me explain, there is many people in a church. And not everyone in it is saved.
Look at the churches in Rev. In one not one person was saved. Many churches today do not have one saved Christian.
In time they all left, but those who came in did not even noticed.
---Luke on 11/1/15


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... but they are not of the truth...It is easy to tell who they are. By their responses.
Of course we don't know who is saved or not... Peace I leave you
---Luke on 10/29/15

In peace I'll agree.
Isa_8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Heb_8:10 ...the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel..., saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: I will be to them a God, they shall be to me a people:

On saved, Romans states:Rom_11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
---Trav on 10/30/15


Sorry Trav

Sometimes I get in a hurry and do not finish my thoughts. I apologize for that.

I was using the saying to point out that many who call themselves Christians don't live or act like Christians. They give aid and succor to the enemies of GOD by their actions and words.

So the people on the outside are not the worst enemies of the church. But people in the church who don't live or act as Christians.

I hope this clarifies my point.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 10/29/15


Trav, you are somewhat right concerning those who do not have the light. Many here who answer very rudely or mean and speak as Christians are really not Christians either, they try to defend the truth, but they are not of the truth, and many times sound worse then those who do not have the light, yet have manners. It is easy to tell who they are. By their responses.
Of course we don't know who is saved or not but we can tell many times one from the other. Peace I leave you
---Luke on 10/29/15


Many years ago a person the worst enemy of the church are so called Christians.
---Samuelbb7 on 10/28/15

Can you throw in a few clarifying historical facts on the sentence above? To explain whatever you are talking about?
---Trav on 10/28/15


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I learned much about how Christians interact. It was rather disappointing.
---santimoy.kumar on 10/27/15

Then you more light than when you came.
Christians have been overly blessed. As you realize or you wouldn't have wasted any time exploring here.
Simple as Children, Christians do not realize for the most part why or where they are blessed, which is in their scriptures by multiple and ancient witnesses.
We exhibit that we have no Shepherds, on this earth at this time.
Job_24:13 They are of those that rebel against the light, they know not the ways thereof, nor abide in the paths thereof.
Isa_8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
---Trav on 10/28/15


When you speak to a person rudely or put them down. That is not speaking with the love and kindness of a Christian.

Speaking hatefully is not the way of love and respect for others.

Many years ago a person the worst enemy of the church are so called Christians.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 10/28/15


The Bible says know not to company with an angry man lest you learn his ways. I have to wonder if it's the same thing with rudeness. Beloved let us love one another for love is of God and he that loves knows God he that loves not does not know God that's what the Bible says therefore I have to wonder also if being rude and contentious is a lack of love or anger from another source in the person and they play it out on here. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 10/28/15


santomoy....The One True God does bless us. He sent HIS son to die for you as well as us. Just accept HIM and you will be saved. This is how we show love and respect, by telling you and others about Jesus.
---KarenD on 10/27/15


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Goodbye and God bless all of you.
---santimoy.kumar on 10/27/15


I passes strange that so many Christians here are rude and abusive towards each other but have not been so to me as a nonchristian.
---santimoy.kumar on 10/26/15

Truth has no tolerance for untruth. Night cannot stand day.
Start promoting your false gods and logic for them here and see the other side.

There was division even among Christ family...who stated "his blood be upon us and our children".
Mat_27:25 Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children.

Luk_12:51 Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay, but rather division:
Joh_7:43 So there was a division among the people because of him.
---Trav on 10/27/15


Thank you. I will go now and do other things. I learned much about how Christians interact. It was rather disappointing. I wish for all of you peace.
---santimoy.kumar on 10/27/15


I passes strange that so many Christians here are rude and abusive towards each other but have not been so to me as a nonchristian.
---santimoy.kumar on 10/26/15


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Yes, this is very important.
---santimoy.kumar on 10/26/15


"Can everyone please remember to show love and respect to each other even though we disagree at times? God bless!"

Great idea.
---chria9396 on 10/26/15


Amen to behaving in a godly manner, Andreea! Thanks for posting.
---Press_On on 10/26/15


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