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Infalliable Pope Statements

How many infallible statements have been made by the Pope--any Pope, even Alexander VI?

Then show your research--books and writings by accredited scholars who do not have an axe to grind.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan

Join Our Christian Penpals and Visit Our Apostles Creed
 ---Monk_Brendan on 11/25/15
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\\Luke said, "Monk, you said:"Both were--as a united Church." at the time the Universal became the Universal Church (Catholic) there was no Eastern Orthodox church. Sorry, they were Catholic members."
\\

We Orthodox have ALWAYS said that the Roman Catholics left us, and that we were ALWAYS Orthodox and never Catholics.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/9/15


Luke said, "Monk, you said:"Both were--as a united Church." at the time the Universal became the Universal Church (Catholic) there was no Eastern Orthodox church. Sorry, they were Catholic members."

No, Luke, this was a United Church of Christians. Do a little bit of reading of Church History, and you will see that the latter is the truth.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/8/15


Luke, either you are jealous that I am answering multiple questions asked of me, or you are mad that I am capable of answering all questions given to me.

Stay Focus.

If you wish for some advice just ask.

Always answer a question directly, or state why you refuse to answer the question.

Move on to the next question.

The 125 max word is the hardest part when answering multiple questions.

Be sweet and to the point.

Now being sweet I will admit I am NOT.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/8/15


Nicole, I don't know what your point is. You are just making things up as you go. Stop for a minute, stay with one subject at a time, then maybe I or someone else can answer you.

Cluny, I don't suppose that my church is the one Jesus started. In fact my church was founded by a pastor about 70 years ago. The true believers in that church make up the body of Christ. The body of Christ is the true church of Christ. And Christ is the Head of the body of believers.

Monk, you said:"Both were--as a united Church." at the time the Universal became the Universal Church (Catholic) there was no Eastern Orthodox church. Sorry, they were Catholic members.
---Luke on 12/8/15



\\Luke said, "The Church that was establish by Jesus Christ is not the RCC or Orthodox Church."
\\

You don't really think that YOURS was, do you?

Glory to Jesus Christ!

---Cluny on 12/7/15


I don't know of any denominations other than the Catholics and Orthodox who are ignorant and arrogant enough to assume that the "Church" of the Bible is actually their denominational church. How foolish.
---Jed on 12/7/15




The Church that was establish by Jesus Christ is not the RCC or Orthodox Church.---Luke

That's like saying the Jewish faith was started by God and not Moses, Joshua or anyone else.

Matthew 23:2-3
The Scribes and the Pharisees have taken their seat on the chair of Moses. Therefore, DO AND OBSERVE ALL THINGS WHATSOEVER they TELL you,

What??? His Father is God, why follow the Scribes and Pharisees in Moses' Chair

Jesus gave Peter the keys for a reason.

Why did Jesus say Who ever listens to you listens to Me?
John 5:24 and Luke 10:16

Matthew 8:4b and offer the gift that Moses prescribed,

What?? Moses and not God.
Doesn't Jesus know Moses is a man and only God's gives the orders not Moses?
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/7/15


\\Luke said, "The Church that was establish by Jesus Christ is not the RCC or Orthodox Church."
\\

You don't really think that YOURS was, do you?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/7/15


Luke said, "The Church that was establish by Jesus Christ is not the RCC or Orthodox Church."

Both were--as a united Church. The Catholics did not split from the Orthodox until 1054. Before that, there were FIVE patriarchs, centered around the cities of Alexandria, Jerusalem, Rome, Antioch, and Constantinople. Each was in communion with the others. They led a unified Church, which was BOTH Catholic AND Orthodox.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/7/15


Monk, if you want.to be taken seriously, stop claiming that Jesus personally founded the Roman Catholic Church. There is a very large gap between 33 AD and 1054 AD. Your church was founded more than one thousand years after Jesus left Earth. You dont get to retroactively include all the apostles and early Christians in your denomination any more than baptists or methodists can.
---Jed on 12/7/15


I said to Jed, "Jed, please give written proof that the Church of England, or the Associate Reformed Presbyterians, or the Baptists, or any other Protestant denomination came into being before 1054 A.D. Tell us the book, the edition, and the page number."

He replied, "I don't have to. That would prove nothing."

If you want to be taken seriously, then you DO.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/7/15




The Church that was establish by Jesus Christ is not the RCC or Orthodox Church. They were not around at the time the Church took its first roots. The Catholic Church was born under the leadership of Constantine. It was a marriage between the Christian Church and the Roman Empire at the council of 313 A.D. An Hierarchy was formed. Christ was dethroned as Head of the Churches and Emperor Constantine was enthroned temporary as head of the church.
The Hierarchy was the defined beginning which finally resulted in what is now known as the Catholic (Universal) church. In that time, at the close of the second century and the beginning of the third century when the new ideas concerning preacher-church government began to take shape.
---Luke on 12/7/15


Why would anyone want to follow the eoc or the rcc when they contradict each other on which one gave the world the bible.

see below:



"It is from the Church that the Bible ultimately derives its authority, for it was the Church which originally decided which books form a part of Holy Scripture,"

Ware, Timothy

The Orthodox Church p. 199)


"It was the Catholic Church and no other which selected and listed the inspired books of both the Old Testament and the New Testament...If you can accept the Bible or any part of it as inspired Word of God, you can do so only because the Catholic Church says it is." (The Bible is a Catholic Book, p. 4).
---john9346 on 12/6/15


..Henry VIII, Martin Luther, and John Calvin started changing the rules that Protestantism began.
Just because all three of the above were one time Catholics---Monk_Brendan on 12/5/15


Great point.

Plus all 3 had a 73 book Bible since they were all Catholics.

Some can't look deep into history because it would mean they can not be rulers of themselves.
They would have to follow Jesus His way not their way.

It is hard to give up control of your bodies.

But Jesus said anyone who loses their lives for His sake would have it.

Some just don't trust Jesus to have complete Control of His Church.

Only Jesus' Church is growing. The rest are splitting and decreasing.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/5/15


\\Any protestant denomination could also trace their history back to the original church established by Jesus Christ.\\

Nope, Not a single one can.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/5/15


Monk Brendan, a friend of mine once started a business, Able's Pest Control. When he died his four sons took over that business. But the four sons could not get along and they ended up splitting up. At one point there were two companies called Able's Pest Control. Realizing that this caused confusion to customers. Two of the sons, being the more generous ones, changed the name of their company. The two sons who kept the family name were awful and nothing like their father who started the original business. Do these two brothers have any more right to say that they own their father's business just because they got to keep the name? No, either company could claim to be the original Able's Pest Control.
---Jed on 12/5/15


Jed said, "I don't have to. That would prove nothing. We know that Protestants, Catholics, and Orthodox were once the same church."

Not so, Jed. Until the 16th Century, there were no Protestants. It wasn't until Henry VIII, Martin Luther, and John Calvin started changing the rules that Protestantism began.

Just because all three of the above were one time Catholics does not mean that they can claim Apostolic Succession. Only a properly ordained/consecrated bishop can ordain a new bishop.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/5/15


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Jed, please give written proof that...any other Protestant denomination came into being before 1054 A.D. ---Monk_Brendan on 12/4/15


I don't have to. That would prove nothing. We know that Protestants, Catholics, and Orthodox were once the same church. When a split happens, either party could claim that they are the original. Just because you got to keep the name doesn't make you any more a part of the original than the party that didn't keep the name. That is merely a small technicality and a matter of semantics. If there is one party that is more "the original" than the others, it would be the one most closely resembles the new testament church. That disqualifies both the Catholic and Orthodox Churches.
---Jed on 12/4/15


I've been researching this answer.

There are only THREE papal statements (at most) that are considered infallible by Roman Catholics.

Who knows what they are?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/5/15



That's because we are the only two churches with historical evidence to make the claim stick. ---Cluny on 12/4/15


How so? Any protestant denomination could also trace their history back to the original church established by Jesus Christ. If you divide a pie twelve ways, any one of those pieces could make the case that they are the original pie and the others were merely pieces cut from it. Since most protestant denominations more closely resemble the church of the New Testament than either the Catholic or the Orthodox churches do, the case could be made that the it was not that the protestants left the Church, but rather Catholicism that left Christianity.
---Jed on 12/4/15


Jed said, " Since every denomination can trace it's roots back to this one church, it is logical that every denomination could claim to be the original church, and that it was the others who adopted wayward doctrines, resulting in a necessary split."

Jed, please give written proof that the Church of England, or the Associate Reformed Presbyterians, or the Baptists, or any other Protestant denomination came into being before 1054 A.D. Tell us the book, the edition, and the page number.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/4/15


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\\But only the Eastern Orthodox and the Roman Catholics are foolish and arrogant enough to actually make this claim and believe it.\\

That's because we are the only two churches with historical evidence to make the claim stick.

NOW can we go back to the original question?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/4/15


Exactly Brendan. Jesus established no denominations or church organizations as the official "church" of Christ. He only established The Church, His body of believers. Since every denomination can trace it's roots back to this one church, it is logical that every denomination could claim to be the original church, and that it was the others who adopted wayward doctrines, resulting in a necessary split. Every denomination could claim to be the one and only "true" church that has remained true to the teachings established by Jesus. But only the Eastern Orthodox and the Roman Catholics are foolish and arrogant enough to actually make this claim and believe it.
---Jed on 12/3/15


\\Cluny, do you have any Scriptural proof of that? Or are we just supposed to accept that as truth simply because your church says it is so?\\

Do you have any scriptural proof to the contrary? Or are we supposed to deny it simply because you say it is not so?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/3/15


"Pope" Francis didn't exist during the Dirty War...Jorge Mario Bergoglio's (Pope Francis) name came up a few times during the trials.--Steveng on 12/2/15

Pope Francis and Jorge Mario Bergoglio are the same person.

That's like saying Paul didn't exist when they stoned Stephen. But Saul who consented to Stephen's execution, only had his name mentioned in Acts.

Saul is Paul and Paul is Saul.

I knew about the dirty wars before Bergoglio became Pope.
I don't know about your school, but in my school it was discussed.

The Vietnam war is also still going on for a few folks as well.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/3/15


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Jed said, " Furthermore, if Jesus had personally established the Roman Catholic Church or the Eastern Orthodox Church, then they would have also been mentioned in the Bible."

It was in Antioch that they were first called Christians. (Acts 11:26)

For the longest time, the United Church operated as one. It wasn't until 1054 that the split happened. The Orthodox (which means right thinking or right praising) continued to use "Orthodox" as the title for their Church. The other half of the split was centered in Rome, and they felt that they had a lock on being the One church, so they called themselves the Roman Catholic (universal) Church

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/3/15


Cluny, do you have any Scriptural proof of that? Or are we just supposed to accept that as truth simply because your church says it is so?
---Jed on 12/3/15


\\ if Jesus had personally established the Roman Catholic Church or the Eastern Orthodox Church, then they would have also been mentioned in the Bible. \\

It does.

But "Orthodox" is not the name of our church. It's merely a label so others can find us.

Our name to ourselves is the Church of Christ, the Church of God, the Church of the First-born, and all the other names seen in the Bible.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/3/15


If the disciples and apostles were Catholic (or any denomination, for that matter) I'm certain the Bible would have mentioned that. Seems that would have been a noteworthy thing to include. Furthermore, if Jesus had personally established the Roman Catholic Church or the Eastern Orthodox Church, then they would have also been mentioned in the Bible. Seems that would have been noteworthy as well. But we don't see either of those things. We don't see Catholics or protestants in the Bible. We see only believers in Christ. And we don't see any denominational organizations. We see only THE Church, the universal body of believers.
---Jed on 12/3/15


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Nicole_Lacey wrote: "Everyone hated the Pope Francis during the Argentina war because he wasn't on ANYONE'S SIDE BUT JESUS."

"Pope" Francis didn't exist during the Dirty War. Search for the "Dirty War Trials" that continue to this day.

Jorge Mario Bergoglio's (Pope Francis) name came up a few times during the trials. In order to save his hide he had several catholic clergy killed to prove to the junta that he was on their side. Your pope wasn't on anyone's side but his own. Do your own research for this is a complex situation that these blogs can't hold.
---Steveng on 12/2/15


\\I'm sorry,I don't want to offend but It is only Tradition that says the Apostles were Catholic not God.\\

Are you saying that God is a Catholic?

That's what your sentence grammatically means.

Glory to jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/2/15


Darlene 1, Good point! The Catholics didn't write the bible. In reality the Jews wrote the scriptures.

You that are Catholic, I appreciate the fact that you are proud of your church. That is great! We should all take pride in the church of our personal choice. We also should all remember that everyone of us including every Pope that has ever lived are men. Everyone one of us including the Pope and the Virgin Mary would have spent eternity in hell if it were not for the finished work of Jesus Christ. We are all sinners and none of us or our churches are perfect. The only one perfect and infallible is our God!
---trey on 12/2/15


What the Catholic church did was translate into Greek.---Darlene

Sorry, but you are missing the mark. The RCC/Orthodox compiled the Bible.

Meaning they decided by the Holy Spirit WHICH letters would be in a cannon of books called the Bible.

Old Testament and New Testament.

Just think of it this way.
Why do I have a 73 book Bible and you only have a 66 book Bible?

Either way a human being or several human beings DECIDED what would be and would not be in the Bible. They compiled a list of books together

It doesn't matter what language it was written in because you and I are reading the English translation.
But, the RCC got St Jerome to translate the Bible from Greek and Aramaic to Latin.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/2/15


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\\If Catholic/Orthodox compiled the Bible, why in the world do they have practices which clearly goes against what is written in Scripture?
---Rob on 12/2/15\\

Name one, please.

Trav, here's a partial list of Orthodox who have written things:

Ignatius of Antioch
John Chrysostom
Basil the Great
Metropolitan Kallistos Ware (aka Timothy Ware)
John Sergiev of Kronstadt
Fr. Thomas Hopko
Fr. John Meyendorff
Fr. Alexander Schmemann
Archpriest Peter Gilquist

And so it goes.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/2/15


If Catholic/Orthodox compiled the Bible, ...
---Rob on 12/2/15

The scriptures cluny thinks the catholic/orthos cults "wrote/authored" (ha) they avoid. These cults hold a jim jones control over their minions discouraging them from reading scripture. Cluny will post cath-ortho history kool-aid concoctions...but, never Israels history.
The subject people Israel are mentioned by name 2,306 + times. The specific two covenants and all other covenants.... it becomes clear why the "cults" practice apart from what is written. A clear mark ...for those that know to seek such.
Mat_13:13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not, hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
---Trav on 12/2/15


Actually the Catholic Church didn't "write " the Bible,the letters that became the New Testament were written by the Apostles who were alive when Christ was and Paul. All the Apostles were Jews except Luke who is believed to be Greek. The language spoken and written by most of them was Aramaic for the New Testament Letters and Hebrew in the Old Testament. What the Catholic church did was translate into Greek. I'm sorry,I don't want to offend but It is only Tradition that says the Apostles were Catholic not God. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 12/2/15


1215 Pope Innocent III:
that they shall be seized for trial and penalties, WHO ENGAGE IN THE TRANSLATION OF THE SACRED VOLUMES, or who hold secret conventicles, or who assume the office of preaching without the authority of their superiors, against whom process shall be commenced, without any permission of appeal
(J.P. Callender, Illustrations of Popery, 1838, p.387).


Also, Innocent declared that as by the old law, the beast touching the holy mount was to be stoned to death, so simple and uneducated men were not to touch the Bible or venture to preach its doctrines
(Schaff, History of the Christian Church, VI, p. 723).

Some apologist state that non Latin languages could not carry the words of Bible.
---Samuelbb7 on 12/2/15


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The Jewish Apostles and associates wrote the Bible.

The Roman Catholic church did not exist until 1054. So the claim it wrote the Bible is false.

The Orthodox at least had the Bible in Greek which most people could read. But books were extremely expensive.

But you should answer Rob's correct point. It is a very good question.
---Samuelbb7 on 12/2/15


If Catholic/Orthodox compiled the Bible, why in the world do they have practices which clearly goes against what is written in Scripture?
---Rob on 12/2/15


\\Your church never wrote anything.\\

Yes, we did TOO write the Bible. You don't think it was YOUR church, do you?

Now, can we please get back to the original question of this blog: How many infallible papal statements are there?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/1/15


Steveng, really?
I can write a book and lie about you.
Give Stats.

Everyone hated the Pope Francis during the Argentina war because he wasn't on ANYONE'S SIDE BUT JESUS.


Tray, many on CN think like Shira.
God ONLY wrote the 10 Commandments by hand. That's it.

This statement is denying, but agreeing that the Catholic/Orthodox Church placed the Bible together.

//carholics did NOT put the bible together,, God did. He gave men the inspiration to pen it. I don't think one was catholic.--shira6773

Only Catholics/Orthodox in the 5 Century when the Bible was compiled.
Luther came 10 centuries later and had A 73 book Bible as a CATHOLIC PRIEST.

Why you all only have a 66 book Bible is ODD to me?
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/1/15


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Orthodox and Roman Catholics don't hate the Bible. We wrote it.
What we hate is the misuse of it by sectarians and heretics.
---Cluny on 11/29/15

You "wrote" nothing. Your church never wrote anything. You copied with changes what was already written...for Israel.
The men of Israel wrote and recorded all you pretend to author.
Yet you design to take credit and don't even recognize or acknowledge the origins.
In eight years you've never posted or discussed Israels scriptures.
But then, this very thing is a witness unto itself.

Mat_15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
---Trav on 12/1/15


Read about Pope Francis and the "Dirty War" and how he allowed two jesuit priests to be killed to save his hide.
---Steveng on 11/30/15


It was the death Penalty to translate the Bible into the vernacular of the people. --Samuelbb7 on 11/30/15

Shame on you.

Please cite your information
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/30/15


\\It was the death Penalty to translate the Bible into the vernacular of the people.\\

Please give evidence for this claim.

Then when you have done so, explain why the Roman Catholic Douay-Rheims translation of the Bible into English is older than the KJV.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/30/15


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\\The Bible was kept in Latin and only the Latin was read by the Roman Catholics.\\

There are some practical reasons for this.

Latin was the literary language of the western empire. The various vernaculars simply weren't developed enough to translate the Bible and services into them.

This can be compared with the situation of the eastern Slavic Christians. Church Slavonic was the written language, as Ukrainian and Carpatho-Russian were still a hodge-podge of village dialects that were not always mutually comprehensible.

jerry, OTOH, YOUR view of church history is not colored by the SDA, now is it?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/30/15


Nicole you are correct it was monks particularly the Irish Monks who helped preserve history. There were many very good monks.

But monks generally taught only the nobility to read. Not even all of them.

The Bible was kept in Latin and only the Latin was read by the Roman Catholics.

Many of the Beautiful windows were there to help people understand Bible stories and the stories of the Saints.

It was the death Penalty to translate the Bible into the vernacular of the people.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 11/30/15


Nicole: Your history is severely Catholic colored. The dark ages were dark because the light of the Bible was removed by the RCC. I suppose that the inquisition and papal indulgences were also the work of the "barbaric horde". LOL!


---jerry6593 on 11/30/15


There you go again, making up things that I didn't say. I love the Catholic people..It was this system that banned the Bible during the dark ages (that's why they were called "dark").---jerry6593 on 11/29/15

Your history knowledge is off.
It's called the dark ages because after the Roman Empire fell, and the Barbarians took over but didn't know how to read or write.
Even the toilet system left with the Romans.

It was Monks and Nuns (only Ones left who could read and write) who taught Europe (Barbarians' children and grandchildren) how to read and write again.

I didn't say you hate Catholics, I reposted your statement saying Catholics hate the Bible.

Get it right. It isn't nice.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/29/15


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Jerry said, "...I love the Catholic people. It's the papal system that I have a problem with. It was this system that banned the Bible during the dark ages (that's why they were called "dark").

The Bible was never banned. In the dark ages, Bibles were enormously expensive, seeing as they had to be hand written,then the pages trimmed to the correct size, bound together, and so on.

How much would that project cost today?

Rather, the Catholic Church kept the Bible whole, and without change from the time it was put together until Gutenberg invented movable type and the printing press.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 11/29/15


\\I don't think one was catholic.
---shira6773 on 11/28/15
\\

shira, just what church do you think were the people God used to put the Bible together were? Baptist? Presbyterian?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/29/15


Cluny wrote: "Orthodox and Roman Catholics don't hate the Bible. We wrote it."

You have got to be kidding, right?

Moses and the other writers who were NOT catholic wrote the bible under the guidance of God.

It was Ezra, Nehemiah and a group of priests and elders who pulled together all of God's revelation into one complete book - the Old Testament.

It was Paul and John who canonized the New Testament. It was John who finalized the New Testament.

In essence, it was the Jewish people who were commisioned by God to protect the bible.
---Steveng on 11/29/15


carholics did NOT put the bible together,, God did. He gave men the inspiration to pen it. I don't think one was catholic.
---shira6773 on 11/28/15


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Nicole: "Why do you Catholics hate the Bible so?"

There you go again, making up things that I didn't say. I love the Catholic people. It's the papal system that I have a problem with. It was this system that banned the Bible during the dark ages (that's why they were called "dark").

As for my belief in Sola Scriptura, I believe that the Bible can be trusted but men (including your pope) cannot. The Bible writers were:

2Pe 1:21 ... holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

As for the pope's opinion:

Mar 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

---jerry6593 on 11/29/15


Cluny states, "On past blogs, there have been claims that certain papal utterances were to be taken as infallible." "I think what Monk Brendan is asking here is if anyone knows WHICH papal statements are intended to be infallible ones."

Well, Brendan being a Melkite Catholic, has a very different interpretation/meaning of "Infallibility." than a Roman Catholic this was clearly seen on Several Blogs
---john9346 on 11/29/15


\\Why do you Catholics hate the Bible so?---jerry6593 on 11/27/15\\

Orthodox and Roman Catholics don't hate the Bible. We wrote it.

What we hate is the misuse of it by sectarians and heretics.

Can you tell the difference, jerry?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/29/15


Nicole: "Okay, according to YOUR LOGIC, how can you trust anything written in the Bible?"

Why do you Catholics hate the Bible so?---jerry6593 on 11/27/15

Jerry, you DON'T answer a question with a straw man's answer or question.

It's seems only Catholics and Orthodox uses the Scripture the most.

Since the RCC put together the Bible, how can we hate it? We don't.

It is only Protestants who claim 'only Scripture' not Catholics.

Again answer the question.

According to Jerry' Logic, you can't trust the Bible as being infallible since it was written by Men because we can't trust the Holy Spirit to guide the men?

Please, be a man and answer it!.
Don't post and hide.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/28/15


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\\cluny: "While EGW never said, "I am infallible," to my knowledge"

See? I knew you were lying.\\

One does not have to say, "I am infallible" to claim infallibility, as EGW clearly did.

But I don't except you to have the maturity to understand that, jerry.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/28/15


Jerry said, "EGW was no more infallible than was Peter, John, Jonah or any other true prophet of God. But the Holy Spirit who inspired them all is indeed infallible. Not so with the pope."

And why would the Pope be left out of that list? The Holy Spirit is just as capable of inspiring him and the Synod of Bishops with that same infallibility.

Please explain to me how the lawful Bishop of Rome, duly elected,sitting in the Chair of St. Peter is lest than the dust beneath your wheels.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 11/28/15


Sometimes it seems that anyone who clams to be infallible has forgotten or never knew that they should fear God. Prophets,Apostles,Ministers of the Word in any way need to be very careful that they are really hearing from God and not speaking out of their own convictions and understanding. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hand of the living God. To speak of ones own mind and claim to be infallible is to incur the wrath of God. Ezekiel 13:9 My hand will be against the Prophets who see false visions and utter lying divinations. Read all of Chapter 13 for a broader picture of God's wrath on lying Prophets. Position doesn't give infallibility. God Bless
---Darlene_1 on 11/28/15


cluny: "While EGW never said, "I am infallible," to my knowledge"

See? I knew you were lying.


EGW was no more infallible than was Peter, John, Jonah or any other true prophet of God. But the Holy Spirit who inspired them all is indeed infallible. Not so with the pope.



---jerry6593 on 11/28/15


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On past blogs, there have been claims that certain papal utterances were to be taken as infallible.

I think what Monk Brendan is asking here is if anyone knows WHICH papal statements are intended to be infallible ones.

From the Orthodox viewpoint, if you're not going to change anything (like the SDA did between 1978 and today about the infallibility of EGW's statements) NOBODY has to be infallible.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/27/15


\\For when she wrote and her words were backed up and agree with Scripture they should be followed.
\\

If you go to Scripture directly, EGW is superfluous. Why bother with her?
---Cluny on 11/27/15

Exactly. Shouldn't even have to be pointed out.
Worshipers of EGW, can't even live up to their nature as a man...under the authority of a woman.
Who would trade a Prophet, Christ or authorized Apostles to follow this unauthorized woman. Those who defend,teach and preach her. Changing the natural order.
1Co_14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
---Trav on 11/27/15


Brendan asked, "How many infallible statements have been made by the Pope."
There are many, but here are some of the famous.
Asumption of Mary
Papal Infallibility
immaculate conception of Mary
---john9346 on 11/27/15

Infallible???
Insanity. There is no proof or scriptural evidence for either of these or Brendans pope.
I don't know why he visits here but, I suspect it is to test what he doesn't really believe in to begin with. Amazing how a Jeweler trained to find and grade flaws doesn't see through the fake jewelry he is wearing.
Jer_23:1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD.
---Trav on 11/27/15


John 9346 asked, "Just wondering what monastic order do you belong to?"

While there are two monastic orders in Eastern Catholic Churches--the Basilians and the Franciscans, these are large orders with many communities around the world.

However the more traditional monks (including myself) are not part of an order. Rather, they group in small hermitages (one or two monks) or in big monasteries, where they enter, and never leave. The idea is to do good, and disappear. Most of a monk's life is made up in prayer (even little old me), plus whatever manual labor that needs to be done. (I end up washing the dishes and doing the laundry. I also cook, upon occasion.)

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 11/27/15


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\\For when she wrote and her words were backed up and agree with Scripture they should be followed.
\\

If you go to Scripture directly, EGW is superfluous. Why bother with her?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/27/15


Brendan asked, "How many infallible statements have been made by the Pope."

There are many, but here are some of the famous.



Asumption of Mary (Nov 1, 1950)

Papal Infallibility (First Vatican Council July 18, 1870)

immaculate conception of Mary (Dec 8, 1854)
---john9346 on 11/27/15


While EGW never said, "I am infallible," to my knowledge, it's clear from her own writings that so she considered herself.

"When I sent you a testimony of warning and reproof, many of you declare it to be merely the opinion of Sister White. You have thereby insulted theSpirit of God.1 Selected Messages, 27.

"I do not write one article in the paper expressing merely my own ideas. They are what God has opened before me in vision--the precious rays of light shining from the throne." Testimonies, Vol. 5, pp. 63-67

Draw your own conclusions.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/27/15


Hello Micha9344

Thank you for actually using quotes and showing where they came from.

I like the first one. For when she wrote and her words were backed up and agree with Scripture they should be followed.

In the Second statement she was writing to parents who had said they believed her writings were from GOD. Parents who were neglecting their children and not teaching them about the Bible and GOD.

The last I cannot check on. But it was a position of many. We don't teach she was infallible. But we did have many who used to. It is a discussion we have had for a long time. But the final decision was to say she was not infallible as a belief of the whole church.

Thank you for the nice way you posted this.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/27/15


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"In my books, the truth is stated, barricaded by a 'Thus saith the Lord.' The Holy Spirit traced these truths upon my heart and mind as indelibly as the law was traced by the finger of God upon the tables of stone." EGW Letter 90, 1906.
"Yet, now when I send you a testimony of warning and reproof, many of you declare it to be merely the opinion of Sister White. You thereby insulted the Spirit of God." EGW Testimonies 5, p.64.
"The Bible and the writings of Ellen White are inerrant." Sabbath School-Quarterly, Feb. 11, 1978, Teacher's Edition, p. 112.
---micha9344 on 11/27/15


Jorge Mario Bergoglio, or Pope Francis summed up the infallibility of the popes in his political speech to our political leaders.
For a religious authority, he spoke very little of the Lord. I don't recall any mention of the Lord Jesus Christ.
---michael_e on 11/27/15


cluny: "EGW claimed to be infallible."

Again you show that lying is not a problem for you. Please provide the entire quote in context where EGW said "I am infallible."



Nicole: "Okay, according to YOUR LOGIC, how can you trust anything written in the Bible?"

Why do you Catholics hate the Bible so?

2Pe 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:


---jerry6593 on 11/27/15


Although some may claim infallibility, it is a lie, because no human being is infallible.--jerry6593 on 11/26/15

Okay, according to YOUR LOGIC, how can you trust anything written in the Bible?

Those men who wrote the Bible where not infallible?
The Holy Spirit didn't protect them from error?

Now how can you even believe your own thoughts and beliefs because they can't be infallible as well.

The Holy Spirit can not protect you from yourself because you are a MAN.

And man is part of human beings.


Your logic isn't reasonable.

Stop and think about it?

Stop reading the Bible because it is written in error since it was written by human beings, according to your LOGIC.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/26/15


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\\ because no human being is infallible.\\

EGW claimed to be infallible. Was she?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/26/15


"How many infallible statements have been made by the Pope--any Pope"

That's easy - NONE! Although some may claim infallibility, it is a lie, because no human being is infallible.



---jerry6593 on 11/26/15


Brendan,

Just wondering what monastic order do you belong to?
---john9346 on 11/25/15


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