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Planned Parenthood Colorado

As a individual, what are your thoughts about the Planned Parenthood shootings/killings in Colorado?

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 ---Rob on 11/27/15
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Jed, this is what Strongaxe said when accused of being pro-abortion.

"A lie. I definitely disapprove of abortions. Quit putting words into my mouth."

So why did you ask him the question again?

Christ is born! Glorify Him!
---Cluny on 12/29/15



Abortion is the intentional and premeditated killing of an innocent human being. That qualifies it as murder.

Again, see Exodus 21:22.

---StrongAxe on 12/28/15


I did. It says nothing in reference to either abortion or miscarriages. It speaks only of unintentional premature birth with no injuries. Please give the verse that talks about intentional abortion.
---Jed on 12/29/15


StrongAxe, simple question. Do you believe that abortion is wrong? Simple yes or no answer please.
---Jed on 12/29/15


You said: Willful miscarriage IS a murder charge, genius.

Prove it. Show chapter and verse where the Bible says this.

If a man intentionally causes his girlfriend or spouse to lose her child, that is a murder charge under the law.

Exodus 21:22 explicitly says it isn't.

Under U.S. law in some states, perhaps, yet abortion isn't, so your argument fails.

Abortion is the intentional and premeditated killing of an innocent human being. That qualifies it as murder.

Again, see Exodus 21:22.
---StrongAxe on 12/28/15


But it's not the purpose of secular government to enforce Divine laws.
If it were, Orthodoxy would be the only legal religion in the USA.
---Cluny on 12/28/15

If secular Government adopts Divine Laws they would be expected to enforce them. Similar as the U.S. has in the past, both adopted and judged by.

Divine Laws were given to Israel and enforced by Israel.
Now per the New Covenant Heb 8:10. The Twelve Apostles will Judge the Twelve Tribes of Israel. There are Twelve Gates into the New Jerusalem.
In no scripture is your "mans traditions", "orthodox church" implied, mentioned or alluded too as being of Israel.
Nor do you acknowledge them now or in the last 8 years...even once.
---Trav on 12/28/15





Abortion is wilful miscarriage. Abortion would be murder if miscarriage were manslaughter, but it isn't.
---StrongAxe on 12/27/15


False. Manslaughter is when death occurs as a result of gross negligence. Miscarriage doesn't fit that description. Willful miscarriage IS a murder charge, genius. If a man intentionally causes his girlfriend or spouse to lose her child, that is a murder charge under the law. Even if the woman inflicts intentional miscarriage on herself, even THAT is a murder charge. But somehow if it's done with the assistance of a doctor it's not murder? Abortion is the intentional and premeditated killing of an innocent human being. That qualifies it as murder.
---Jed on 12/28/15


\\The government doesn't define right and wrong. God does that.\\

But it's not the purpose of secular government to enforce Divine laws.

If it were, Orthodoxy would be the only legal religion in the USA.

You wouldn't like that, would you?

Christ is born! Glorify Him!
---Cluny on 12/28/15


The government doesn't define right and wrong. God does that. Murder is the intentional taking of an innocent human life. Now you are comparing abortion to miscarriages? Shame on you!


Also, have Obama, Holder, and left wing media ever said "Attack cops" or "kill whitey"?

---StrongAxe on 12/27/15


You JUST said that if someone accuses someone else of a crime worthy of death it is also "tantamount" to saying "they should be killed". Your double standard comes from your sick assertion that abortion really isn't wrong. If you truly didn't support abortion, then at the very least you would agree abortion is wrong. But you can't even bring yourself the say that.
---Jed on 12/28/15


\\Accidental miscarriage pays a fine\\

While popular speech distinguishes between miscarriage and abortion, the proper medical terms are spontaneous abortion and induced abortion.

Christ is born! Glorify Him!
---Cluny on 12/28/15


Jed:

You said: Try "murder", or "evil".

How is it murder? It is not murder under the laws of the United States (as Cluny said). The Bible never calls it murder either. Manslaughter pays life for life, but can escape to city of refuge. Murder pays life for life, no city of refuge. Accidental miscarriage pays a fine (death only if mother dies also). Abortion is wilful miscarriage. Abortion would be murder if miscarriage were manslaughter, but it isn't.

You actually are pro-abortion.

A lie. I definitely disapprove of abortions. Quit putting words into my mouth.

Also, have Obama, Holder, and left wing media ever said "Attack cops" or "kill whitey"?
---StrongAxe on 12/27/15




\\StrongAxe, Are you saying that abortionists are not murderers then?\\

Speaking as a pro-life activist who has suffered civil action for his pro-life activity, abortionist are NOT murderers under the laws of the USA.

An unfortunate fact. Deal with it.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/27/15



Jed:

I have not said that. I think abortion is tragic.
---StrongAxe on 12/27/15


Oh. I didn't catch how intentionally deceptive you were being with your wording. You think abortion is "tragic", huh? I don't think "tragic" is quite the right word. Car accidents are tragic. Miscarriages are tragic. Try "murder", or "evil". Now I see that my original assumption was correct. You actually are pro-abortion.

Also, by your logic president Obama, Eric Holder, the left wing media, and all liberals who post anti-cop, race-baiting rhetoric online are fully responsible for any and all acts of violence against police officers and whites.
---Jed on 12/27/15


Jed:

I have not said that. I think abortion is tragic.


Mark_Eaton:

Your inference is incorrect. You are demolishing a straw man of your own devising.

I have said consistently, if you knowingly incite someone into doing a crime, you are part of that crime. If you say "Abortionists should be killed", and someone thus kills an abortionist, blood is on your hands. If you say "Abortion is a crime worthy of death", it is also tantamount to saying "they should be killed". (And, to extend the metaphor to Nicole's comment, a driver driving speakers to a rally where they say that is NOT connected to the crime, unless he ALSO knows about and agrees with "should be killed" rhetoric.)
---StrongAxe on 12/27/15


StrongAxe, Are you saying that abortionists are not murderers then? I thought earlier in this same blog you claimed to be pro-life. In fact, a few other posters quickly came to your defense when I assumed you favored legalized abortion. I even apologized for that assumption after you stated that was not the case. Now your posts are a little confusing here, because it seems as if you are saying that planned parenthood abortionists aren't murderers? FWIW, there is a difference between saying someone is guilty of murder and actually advocating for people to go all vigilante and carry out justice themselves.
---Jed on 12/18/15


I said the same thing both times...
---StrongAxe on 12/18/15

Let me remind you once again what you have said. And please leave the word culpable out of the discussion. Culpability is a legal term which was not included in our original discussion.

Our original discussion was on the Abortion bomber who used wording on body parts. You discussed Operation Rescue rhetoric about killing abortionists. You stated that those speaking with that rhetoric bore some responsibility for the bomber's actions.

However, but now you are saying (inferred by me) only if they knew the intentions of the bomber.

Which to me smacks of retraction, back-peddling, or double-speak.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/18/15


Mark_Eaton:

I said the same thing both times. If A intends C to do a crime, A is culpable. If A KNOWS C intends to do the crime, A is also culpable. But if C commits a crime without A knowing he plans to do it, A is not involved.

In the case of the Leader of the Protesters, if person A shares responsibility, so does the Leader of the Protesters.

I wasn't talking about the leader. I was talking only about the driver, which is what Nicole mentioned, and as I said before, is the only thing I am taking issue with.
---StrongAxe on 12/18/15


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What ACTUALLY matters is this. Did they know and/or intend for the protesters to advocate killing police? If so, they could be found culpable. If not, they probably couldn't.
---StrongAxe on 12/14/15

This is lawyer-speak.

You said earlier that "but when person A says person B should die and then person C kills him, person A does also shoulder some of the responsibility" and now you are saying that only if person A knows the intent of person C are they culpable.

You cannot have it both ways. Either person A is responsible or not regardless of knowing the intent of person C.

In the case of the Leader of the Protesters, if person A shares responsibility, so does the Leader of the Protesters.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/17/15


///In the yin-yang side of things, it seems kind of right.
---yon6878 on 12/15/15///

Yon: Is it seemingly logical that two wrongs would make a right?

Trey: Absolutely. I also think about the hundreds of thousands of babies who are aborted outside of the womb, after being born, by parents who don't properly nurture & disciple them in the way they're to go & lead productive lives in society. Then too there's the spaced out, dysfunctional school system in America that lets wayward (undisciplined) students run wild & disrupt the learning process of other students who are striving to get an education. Talk about terrorist, home-grown variety...
---Leon on 12/17/15


In reading and listening to the reports it is my thoughts that the gunman is obviously mentally disturbed.

I also think about Planned Parenthood killing over 300,000 babies every year.

Were the gunman's actions correct?
The scriptures teach:
Mt 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mt 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

Romans 12:19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine, I will repay, saith the Lord.
---trey on 12/17/15


In the yin-yang side of things, it seems kind of right.
---yon6878 on 12/15/15


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Nicole_Lacey:

Whether they actually physically drove the protestors to New York, or bought them bus tickets, or arranged car pool rides, or any other form of transportation, is not relevant to the point.

What ACTUALLY matters is this. Did they know and/or intend for the protesters to advocate killing police? If so, they could be found culpable. If not, they probably couldn't.

If (say) I buy my son a car and he uses it to rob a bank, I'm not liable, unless I knew he was going to do it beforehand, or planned for him to do it.
---StrongAxe on 12/14/15


Left wing people who bused those paid Protestors for the 2 dead Cops?---StrongAxe

It can have 2 meanings:

Literally driving, or PAYING them to be drove into New York.

The same if I said I got that car for you.

I either paid for the car for you.

Or I convinced someone else to pay for the car for you.

Another is I had stolen the car for you.

Or simply, I just drove the car to you.

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I realized you thought I was speaking about the poor Driver of the bus and not the Leader of the Protestors who should be in Prison today for the death of the 2 Cops.

They totally caused it by the very own words of the Mentally disturbed Man who shot the Cops.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/12/15


Nicole_Lacey:

You wrote: StrongAxe, not the Driver but the protestors' Leader.

Why are you changing the subject? I was SPECIFICALLY talking about the drivers of the buses - not ayone else - because you had earlier said:

So are you saying the Protestors in New York City shouting 'wanting dead cops' should be in Jail including the Left wing people who bused those paid Protestors for the 2 dead Cops?
---StrongAxe on 12/12/15


StrongAxe, not the Driver but the protestors' Leader.

The Leader heard this through the bull horn and DIDN'T STOP IT. PROOF!

QUOTE:
Bull horn: WHAT DO WE WANT!?

Protestors: DEAD COPS!

Bull horn: WHEN DO WE WANT IT!?

Protestors: NOW!

Conclusion: 2 COPS DEAD!

Protestors KNEW and PLAN it all. But, I ask since the Cops were not in your family it was peaceful demonstration as you put it.

//I'm innocent.//

'He told me he was just drawing out money from his bank' STORY has been used so much it can't be USE ANYMORE.

The same applies to if your are shopping with your friend and he is stealing items without your knowledge. You BOTH are locked up.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/11/15


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Nicole_Lacey:

You said: StrongAxe, they were bused into New York for a purpose.

The purpose is to demonstrate. Unless you can prove that the drivers KNEW and INTENDED that the protestors actually incite people to kill police, there's no case against them for that.

Why if you robbed a bank, but your friend never left the car is also charged with the robbery He only drove the car?

If I drove a friend to make a deposit or withdrawal, and they subsequently robbed the bank, I'm innocent. If I drove them knowing they planned to rob it, I'm not. See the difference?
---StrongAxe on 12/11/15


StrongAxe, they were bused into New York for a purpose.

Why if you robbed a bank, but your friend never left the car is also charged with the robbery He only drove the car?

If you think those Protestors should be in jail, why not those who provided transportation (A's Leader) for them to shout?

One yelling out 'kill the cop (B)' usually isn't effective nor new worthy.

But hundreds of people together (A) with a person using a bull horn were effective and was on every NEWS show across the world.

Because a Mentally ill Person (C)states upon hearing (A)he decided to do just as they suggested.
2 Cops (B) ended up dead.

As you wrote, (A's Leader) should bear responsibility of the Cops (B)' death.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/10/15


Older Barry Goldwater who ran against Lyndon Johnson back in 1964 warn us what would happen if the preachers gained control of the Republican party as politics is a compromising art but preachers are an uncompromising breed.
---Riolion on 12/10/15


Jed wrote: Are you suggesting then that republicans were calling for vigilantes to kill abortionists? I personally haven't heard anyone do that.

Neither have I, because I don't associate with people who advocate murder. However:

Ted Cruz promotes the endorsement of Troy Newman, who says a perfectly biblical society would execute its abortion providers.

Nicole_Lacey wrote: So are you saying the Protestors in New York City shouting 'wanting dead cops' should be in Jail including the Left wing people who bused those paid Protestors for the 2 dead Cops?

Incitement to kill? Yes they should. Busing? No, unless they planned such incitement.
---StrongAxe on 12/10/15


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Mostly, but when person A says "person B should die!" and then person C kills him, person A does also shoulder some of the responsibility.

---StrongAxe on 12/9/15


Are you suggesting then that republicans were calling for vigilantes to kill abortionists? I personally haven't heard anyone do that.
---Jed on 12/9/15


Mostly, but when person A says "person B should die!" and then person C kills him, person A does also shoulder some of the responsibility.--StrongAxe on 12/9/15


So are you saying the Protestors in New York City shouting 'wanting dead cops' should be in Jail including the Left wing people who bused those paid Protestors for the 2 dead Cops?
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/9/15


Mostly, but when person A says "person B should die!" and then person C kills him, person A does also shoulder some of the responsibility.
---StrongAxe on 12/9/15

I agree, but very little responsibility. Your emotions and actions are your responsibility, not mine and not society's. Influence does not work in a linear cause and effect model.

This again is the slippery-slope of false accountability and political correctness.

As a Believer in Christ, I responsible for my actions and speech to others and to my Lord.

But do I attempt to legislate and force this truth on unbelievers?
---Mark_Eaton on 12/9/15


Mark_Eaton:

You wrote: And if they are, what of it? Are their comments not protected by the First Amendment?

Yes they are, but that isn't the point. I was just challenging the accuracy of Jes's statement: It is unclear whether the shooter was actually a pro-lifer targeting planned parenthood. because it IS clear from his own words.

The responsibility for these murders does not rest on the Republican rhetoric or on the manufacturer of the weapons, but on the shooter solely.

Mostly, but when person A says "person B should die!" and then person C kills him, person A does also shoulder some of the responsibility.
---StrongAxe on 12/9/15


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I wasn't defending PP, just challenging the idea that the shooter's motives were not connected with Republican rhetoric.
---StrongAxe on 12/3/15

And if they are, what of it?

Are their comments not protected by the First Amendment?

Should we silence all free speech just in case someone may use it to harm others?

This demonstrates overreaching.

The responsibility for these murders does not rest on the Republican rhetoric or on the manufacturer of the weapons, but on the shooter solely.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/8/15


Nicole,
I have learned from you as well, but have rarely said so.
Thank you,
---micha9344 on 12/7/15


Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you,
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad...---micha9344 on 12/6/15

Thanks Micha for the words of consolation.

I didn't see that way, but you are RIGHT.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/7/15


/Do you see me complaining about others attacking me?\-Nicole_Lacey on 12/4/15
Yes
/But you if judge me wrongly, IT'S ON!\-Nicole_Lacey on 12/4/15
Isa 53:7 He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.
Mat 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you,
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:12 Rejoice, and be exceeding glad...
---micha9344 on 12/6/15


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Nicole, you have some serious issues girl...I really do think you may need some medication.---Jed on 12/3/15

Can't take the heat can you?

Well this is what Jesus warned about in Matthew 7:2

Tone down your judging and maybe others will tone down their response to you.

Do you see me complaining about others attacking me?

No.

But you if judge me wrongly, IT'S ON!
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/4/15


///Nicole, you have some serious issues girl. Perhaps you should read the previous comments on the blogs before you go all foaming at the mouth in rage. This issue of StrongAxe and I has already been cleared up. I really do think you may need some medication.---Jed on 12/3/15///

Jed: "Foaming at the mouth" is a very descriptive & accurate assessment of Nickie's rabid, off the wall, comments. Her problem seems to be that she's off of her medications. The poor girl's barking is insane! smh
---Leon on 12/4/15


Nicole, you have some serious issues girl. Perhaps you should read the previous comments on the blogs before you go all foaming at the mouth in rage. This issue of StrongAxe and I has already been cleared up. I really do think you may need some medication.
---Jed on 12/3/15


Pharisee Jed, why do you feel the need to judge people?

Tell me where in the bible states: \\It seems Strongaxe is okay with the murder of infants.- Jed\\?

Did Strongaxe tell you he is okay with murder infants?

Do you think placing the word 'seems' excuses you from Matthew 7:1?

No it doesn't.
Someone new to CN, might believe Strongaxe doesn't care about murdered babies.

Maybe, Strongaxe doesn't believe babies are being murdered in Planned Parenthood clinics?

Just because you and I know babies are being murdered in PP clinics it doesn't give you license to JUDGE another's heart.

That's Jesus' Job.

Your job is to convince Strongaxe, not judge him.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/3/15


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\\from my experience with him on these blogs I have found him to be very liberal leaning,\\

From my experience in real life, most of us, including StrongAxe, are liberal in some ways and conservative in others.

Of course, this depends on how you draw your Lib/Con charts, too.

Glory to Jesus Christ!

---Cluny on 12/3/15


True. The term "liberal leaning" means that one is predominantly liberal. They are more liberal than conservative.
---Jed on 12/3/15


\\from my experience with him on these blogs I have found him to be very liberal leaning,\\

From my experience in real life, most of us, including StrongAxe, are liberal in some ways and conservative in others.

Of course, this depends on how you draw your Lib/Con charts, too.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/3/15


Jed:

Thank you.

I personally find abortion tragic. I wasn't defending PP, just challenging the idea that the shooter's motives were not connected with Republican rhetoric.

As I have stated here recently on several blogs, I try to avoid the "this is right" or "this is wrong" arguments on controversial subjects, because there is no point - those who believe that way already do, and those who believe the other way will never do so.

I prefer to deal with subjects on which actual dialogue still IS possible - i.e. whether or not certain arguments are supportable by evidence, whether arguments are logically sound (i.e. conclusions follow from premises), or questions of obvious fact (e.g. X said Y).
---StrongAxe on 12/3/15



I know StrongAxe in real life, and I can assure you this is NOT true.

There is no logical way one can go from "These videos are faked" (which I don't believe) to "I support abortion."
---Cluny on 12/2/15


If this is truly the case then StrongAxe has my sincere apologies. I do not know StrongAxe personally, but from my experience with him on these blogs I have found him to be very liberal leaning, and for the most part silent on the topic of abortion except to defend planned parenthood. I hope he will weigh in to clear up any misunderstanding. If he does in fact oppose abortion, then I publicly and sincerely apologize for my assumption.
---Jed on 12/3/15


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\\It seems Strongaxe is okay with the murder of infants.\\

I know StrongAxe in real life, and I can assure you this is NOT true.

There is no logical way one can go from "These videos are faked" (which I don't believe) to "I support abortion."

But logic is frequently missing from these blogs.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/2/15



There you go AGAIN judging people.

Did you tear out Chapter 7 of Matthew from your Bible?

Read the Bible, don't destroy it.

---Nicole_Lacey on 12/2/15


Why do you keep twisting that scripture to excuse sin, Nichole? Do you think Jesus said this to allow people to excuse their sin? Anyone can quote scripture and twist it out of context. Even Satan used God's own Holy Word against Jesus. You model him well.
---Jed on 12/2/15


Jed:

You said: the real issue is the fact that they are allowed to be murdered in the first place.

I brought this up to show the strong connection between the shooter and Republicans rhetoric (esp. Carly Fiorina), to refute Jes's "unclear whether the shooter was actually a pro-lifer targeting planned parenthood". The video's content and accuracy aren't relevant to that issue.

There are many planned parenthood defenders like Strongaxe...

It seems Strongaxe is okay with the murder of infants.

No, I'm not. You are reading WAY between the lines. Are your Biblical beliefs also based on reading so much between the lines of the Bible as well?
---StrongAxe on 12/2/15


It seems Strongaxe is okay with the murder of infants.---Jed on 12/2/15

There you go AGAIN judging people.

Did you tear out Chapter 7 of Matthew from your Bible?

Read the Bible, don't destroy it.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/2/15


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First of all, the planned parenthood videos have not been debunked. They are real. There are many planned parenthood defenders like Strongaxe, who claim that they are fake. Secondly, That is irrelevant. While the way these infants were murdered is indeed disturbing, the real issue is the fact that they are allowed to be murdered in the first place. It seems Strongaxe is okay with the murder of infants.
---Jed on 12/2/15


///[It's] unclear whether the shooter was actually a pro-lifer targeting planned parenthood. As investigations move forward and more facts come out, it is looking more like he was merely taking cover at a random location which happened to be a PP nearby PP office. [???]...
---Jes on 11/30/15///

If his being at a PP office was random (purposeless, absent of assignable cause), why did he place propane gas tanks around his car? That act alone suggests purposeful intent to do harm to people at the PP location. Besides his comment about "baby parts" strongly indicates he has a beef with PP.
---Leon on 12/2/15


///...It's curious he used very similar rationale and rhetoric used by many of the front-running Republican candidates, especially Carly Fiorina. Just 8 days earlier, Ted Cruz hailed Troy Newman, who believes abortionist should be executed. Google: "stochastic terrorism" about people who incite others to violence...---StrongAxe on 12/1/15///

Very good point 'Axe. Clearly what the GOP presidential candidates do isn't Christ-like. By the way, can anyone explain to me how Ted Cruz is even running for President since he "isn't" a NATURAL BORN U.S. CITIZEN?

"...God gave us a spirit not of fear but of power and love and self-control." (2 Tim 1:7, ESV)
---Leon on 12/2/15


///...It doesn't matter if what someone says is true, if they tell lies to get their point across. It nullifies their argument and damages their credibility. "Hate the Soviets" is defensible, but "Hate the Soviets because they murdered Lincoln" is both invalid and makes one look ridiculous.---StrongAxe on 12/2/15///

YUUP, it's all about credibility! What the GOP candidates are doing isn't "truth telling" but instead "truth embellishing (twisting)". That's a devilish (helluva) thing to do!
---Leon on 12/2/15


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Just 8 days eariler, Ted Cruz hailed Troy Newman, who believes abortionist should be executed.
---StrongAxe on 12/1/15

I have and will continue to support Operation Rescue and Operation Save America as two of the very few organizations that practice what they preach about abortion.

How many bloggers on here (including their churches) are against abortion but how many have actually done something about it?

You may accuse these people and organizations for inciting violence but if you have done nothing yourself, I consider that you sir do not have an opinion.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/2/15


Cluny said: I believe you are mistaken, StrongAxe.

google "planned parenthood video debunked"

The video Fiorina quoted had known falsifications. The pictures were not from babies aborted at Planned Parenthood. One was a stillborn infant his mother posted on her blog about grieving for a lost child - used without her permission and passed off as an aborted fetus - solely to provoke outrage.

It doesn't matter if what someone says is true, if they tell lies to get their point across. It nullifies their argument and damages their credibility. "Hate the Soviets" is defensible, but "Hate the Soviets because they murdered Lincoln" is both invalid and makes one look ridiculous.
---StrongAxe on 12/2/15


StrongAxe: I agree with cluny. You are wrong.


---jerry6593 on 12/2/15


\\ It wasn't from Planned Parenthood, and not even from this country. Also\\

I believe you are mistaken, StrongAxe.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/1/15


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Jes:

I read he said "no more baby parts", referring to the discretited video claiming PP sold fetal tissue for profit. It wasn't from Planned Parenthood, and not even from this country. Also, that Colorado PP didn't even perform abortions. He also believed "as long as he's saved" by Jesus Christ, "he can do whatever he pleases."

It's curious he used very similar rationale and rhetoric used by many of the front-running Republican candidates, especially Carly Fiorina. Just 8 days eariler, Ted Cruz hailed Troy Newman, who believes abortionist should be executed. Google: "stochastic terrorism" about people who incite others to violence.

(Also, I counted 8 deaths previous to these, not 4).
---StrongAxe on 12/1/15


Ruthanna: "A true pro-lifer would not commit murders to stop murder. It's doing the very thing we're trying to stop from happening."

My thoughts exactly! What irony. This nut case kills to prevent killing.


I also agree with Nicole. It wasn't the gun's fault. Chances are that the slaughterhouse was a gun-free zone.



---jerry6593 on 12/1/15


It is unclear whether the shooter was actually a pro-lifer targeting planned parenthood. As investigations move forward and more facts come out, it is looking more like he was merely taking cover at a random location which happened to be a PP nearby PP office.

BUT, even if in-fact it turns out that this was a deliberate attack on PP by a pro-lifer (it's looking more and more like that is not the case) then that brings the total number of killings by pro-lifers since 1977 to a grand total of 8. Not 8 incidences, 8 total deaths. It was 4 prior this. More than 50 million murders have been comitted by the "choicers" in that same time.
---Jes on 11/30/15


I heard the Paris incident was because those who did what they did was because they said Paris was immoral. ...prostitution etc, and THEY too wanted to make a statement. If that is truly the case, then we have folks who think they are God dealing judgement on others. But aren't THEY sinners too, even the man in Colorado. Should someone shoot him for his sin? Maybe another will come along and murder him, thinking they are exacting God's wrath because he doesn't obey the Sabbath. Will it ever come to that extreme? Who knows. No one is excused from taking the law into their own hands and playing God. I'm sure all sorts of horrible SIN was around in Jesus time and Paul's time, but NEVER EVER did either instruct Christians to murder sinners.
---kathr4453 on 11/30/15


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You need to gear down Jed & exhale. God has everything under control without necessitating any help from you, me or anyone else.

What I said is plain enough to understand without you trying to read into it bizarre things resident only in your imagination. Give it a rest, please!
---Leon on 11/29/15


I sometimes wonder why Colorado has so many mass shootings.---Rob on 11/29/15

Because that State is trying very hard to ban as many guns as possible.

When you leave people without any protection except calling 911, it causes havoc.

There are mass shootings in Chicago every weekend as well.

They have the same problem.

Gun free zone cities.

Even the Mentally Sick can spot easy targets.

---Nicole_Lacey on 11/29/15


Leon, are you saying then that legality determines right and wrong? That the only real difference between murder and justice is whether it was government sanctioned?

If that is the case then the holocaust wasn't even murder because it was both legal and government sanctioned in those countries. And the U.S. forces who took out the Nazi's were murderers. In a moral comparison abortions clinics are no different than the holocaust extermination camps.

I have to wonder what Abraham or Joshua would have been instructed to do had abortion clinics been around in their day. And I sometimes wonder if we will be judged for our lack of action on abortionists.
---Jed on 11/29/15


///I sometimes wonder why Colorado has so many mass shootings.---Rob on 11/29/15///

Maybe it's the altitude that addles the brains of feeble-minded, morally bankrupt & corrupt malcontents.
---Leon on 11/29/15


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Jed: True. There is, as you say, little to no moral difference between abortionist & the Nazis shedding of innocent blood. But, "murdering" abortionist is illegal (against the law) whereas the "killing" of Nazis (who violated international law) during WWII was legal, sanctioned & backed up by God's word. (Romans 13:1-5) Anyone who takes it upon themselves to become vigilantes (judge, jury & executioner) is no better than the person(s) they've judged & MURDERED.
---Leon on 11/29/15


I sometimes wonder why Colorado has so many mass shootings.
---Rob on 11/29/15


Rob,

This is what happens when justice is not served if Congress had defund this "Wicked Organization." chance of occurrence would not have happen.

It seems here recently so much injustice is tolerated and protected in this country.
---john9346 on 11/29/15


Agreed jed,

murdering a murderer is justice not murder.

Also, abortionists are no different then ISIS, NAZIS, Khmer Rouge, Joseph Stalin's regime, etc.
---john on 11/29/15


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If God chooses, I'm willing to die for the pro-life cause.

I am NOT willing to kill for it.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/28/15


Rob: The "murdering" of anyone, anywhere is a heinous & diabolical action. By the way, that also includes people who commit character assassinations.

Murderers who commit such acts are, at the very least, mentally ill. However, many hardcore murderers are demon possessed.

Look at Bob Dear's eyes. Have we not seen that look, many times just in the recent past, on the faces of other serial murderers?

So far we don't actually know why the shooter did what he did. Regardless his reason(s), it's a fact that they're all wrong & he'll eventually have to pay the consequences for his sin (wayward actions), i.e., Colorado is a death penalty state.
---Leon on 11/28/15


Only thing I know to do is to pray that Robert Dear (the shooter) will be brought to repentance, and God will have mercy upon his victims.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/28/15


It was wrong!

Remember Peter tried to save Jesus' Life, and Jesus stopped him. Matthew 26:51-52

Jesus also healed the slave's ear for Peter's wrong move.
Luke 22:49-51

Those on the Left will use this incident to accuse Christians as being intolerant even the man didn't yell out Jesus' name during the shooting and killing.

But the same left groups demand Christians to be tolerant each time a Muslim kills in their God's name.

How many so far this year alone?

The man is mentally ill.

Here goes the gun issue again.

It's a mental problem not a gun problem.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/28/15


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Ruthanna, I agree that it is never a good idea to open fire on an abortion clinic and would never support such an act. But I do think the case could be made that killing people who are committing genocide is not really murder. Obviously, killing Nazi's or ISIS members would not be considered murder. So it's not much of a stretch to connect the dots and include abortionists as well. Remember, murder is the taking of innocent lives. Taking the life of someone who has themselves committed murder is not murder. That is justice. Now you may be asking "did he really just compare abortionists to Hitler"? The answer is "Yes. Yes, I did". There is little to no moral difference between abortionists and Nazi's.
---Jed on 11/28/15


A true pro-lifer would not commit murders to stop murder. It's doing the very thing we're trying to stop from happening.

I think something must have happened to him to make him mad at them (perhaps with his daughter?) and he lost his sensible rational. That is totally reading between the lines though since no one knows.

However, we will probably never really know for sure because we will only ever know what the media tells us.
---Ruthanna on 11/28/15


As a radical pro-lifer--radical in that I have a broader definition of pro-life than stopping our utero-Americans from being killed--I sorrow.

Of course, as I write this, the motivations of the shooter are unknown. I do pray that he did not think he was doing our cause any good.

I am glad he surrendered before more lives were lost.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/28/15


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