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Global Warming Agenda

Does the current Pope's embracing of the Global Warming agenda show a lack of faith in God's ability to preserve us by insisting on man's intervention?

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Jed:

I have an undergraduate degree from a university.
---StrongAxe on 12/30/15


Many people do. I was asking what makes you an authority on global warming?
---Jed on 12/30/15


tHis very question itself is a slap in the face not only to the Pope, but anyone who is OF FAITH. It was asked to attack anyone who doesn't agree with Jerry. I don't see a conversation here, but just attacks on those who also believe in God, but also believe God gave man FREE WILL to trash our planet.

SDA's are so obsessed on what they put in their BODIES, for fear of trashing it, not putting any faith whatsoever in God's ability to preserve their digestive system, yet believe we can feed the earth trash and God will preserve it's digestive system. The earth too is a living organism, and man was put in charge to be it's caretakers. Isn't that part of our faith? Also part of our obedience? Who needs a PHD to understand that dynamic?
---kathr4453 on 12/31/15


I passed am qualified to be a Science Teacher.

That does not make me an expert. But I do read a lot on Science.

The Earth is getting warmer and the Ice Caps are melting. That is a fact. Does the pollution we produce cause or add to that? I think so. Most Scientist who are Climatologist say so.

Is pollution bad for us and the environment? Yes.

Should we who are dedicated to helping others work to oppose that which is bad for the health of all people. YES.

So I oppose those who work to make the air dirty and bad for us to breathe.

As I often tell my students. I do not want to save the planet. I want to help people live and be healthy. Which requires clean air and water.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 12/31/15


Jed:

I have an undergraduate degree from a university.


Cluny:

Not SDAs specifically (because many others do it), but it is very common among people who are so anxious to push an agenda, that they are willing to throw throw truth and accuracy to the wind in order to get their point across, and are more adept at arguing from their gut feelings than from actual facts.



jerry6593:

You said: StrongAxe: I apologize. Please forgive me. I had no idea that you were trained in the optical spectral properties of the atmosphere.

Dripping sarcasm aside, I never said I was specifically trained in this, but I do read a lot. Were you?
---StrongAxe on 12/30/15



I have a technical background, and have studied various disciplines of science, and so has the pope. ---StrongAxe on 12/29/15


The pope holds a diploma in Chemistry from a state run technical secondary school. Roughly the equivalent of an American high school diploma or, at best, a certificate from a vocational trade school. His diploma is worth less than an associates degree from a 2 year community college, which is what I actually earned while still in high school. In short, nurse's aids are more highly educated in Chemistry than pope Francis.

Where exactly did you receive your prestigious learning, StrongAxe?
---Jed on 12/30/15




\\Doesn't the prohibition "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor" have any meaning for you,\\

This seems to be a common fault among SDAs.

jerry has accused me of saying things I didn't and believing things I don't.

Christ is born! Glorify Him!
---Cluny on 12/30/15


So Jerry, is this area NOW your area of total expertise? I thought you were a geologist? Please do tell us where you received your expert understanding of the atmosphere. College, degree etc. Who do you work with, and any published papers you have written on the subject.

I guess when you tire of that, we may see you are an expert Chef as well, when the subject of how to cook and prepare roasted carrots become the blog subject.
---kathr4453 on 12/30/15


StrongAxe: I apologize. Please forgive me. I had no idea that you were trained in the optical spectral properties of the atmosphere. Please describe for me the technical details of just how the molecular scattering and absorptive properties of CO2 trap solar radiation in the atmosphere.

From your previous posts, I was under the impression that you were ignorant of such things. I look forward to your explanation.


---jerry6593 on 12/30/15


jerry6593:

You said: Now you're getting close to the blog question. Why do people like you and the pope, with no scientific acumen at all, buy into and propagate the radical, left-wing hoax of Global Warming?

I have a technical background, and have studied various disciplines of science, and so has the pope. How is is that you feel comfortable making blanket pronouncements about people without any evidence? Doesn't the prohibition "Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor" have any meaning for you, at least to exercise caution when accusing people of things without at least first checking some facts?
---StrongAxe on 12/29/15


We also see MAN, caused the Dust Bowl, that yes, effected the whole earth, even causing drought. And That dust reached all the way to Europe. Did God or man fix the problem? Would the USA even be liveable?

Just because you have studied ROCKS, doesn't make you an expert on all scientific aspects of life.
God my friend IS the scientific mind behind all science. Science is not the enemy of God. Didn't GOD give us the science for antibiotics, vaccines, even the knowledge of rubbing two sticks together to make fire. Is there a scientific explanation for fire?

GOD, also showed man through the example of Lake Erie, and the Dust Bowl, what MAN CAN DO, both negative and positive. Let's listen to HIM, and thank HIM for His mercy.
---kathr4453 on 12/29/15




Jerry, what makes you believe God isn't intervening THROUGH MAN?

I suppose you don't believe in Doctors or dentists? Are these scientists not a gift from God? Just because I'm saved doesn't mean I will never get sick or get cavities.

Are you against electricity? And your posting here, is it being beaned down from God's personal server? Or man's satellite God showed man how to scientifically accomplish. If you are so against science, you need to stop posting through the Internet.......stop watching TV, and let God sustain you when your appendix burst. Such a hypocrite.
---kathr453 on 12/29/15


Axey: "Why not leave theology to the theologians and the science to scientists, rather than foolishly attempting the reverse?"

Now you're getting close to the blog question. Why do people like you and the pope, with no scientific acumen at all, buy into and propagate the radical, left-wing hoax of Global Warming?



kathr: "The sky is falling, the sky is falling!"



---jerry6593 on 12/29/15


Here we're ooking for a planet WITH WATER, in hopes of what....finding a place to sustain life. Now, without water, there can be no vegetation. And without water NO LIFE can exist. Do any of these other planets just so happen to have OXYGEN, all by itself? NO. Question....does our atmosphere ( oxygen, carbon dioxide etc, depend on the earth, water and vegetation? YES. What percent of our OXYGEN comes from the ocean? Ans: more than 75%. We know the oxygen levels from the ocean lakes and rivers are deminishing, by our own hand. Lake Erie proved this point years ago, along with modern industry and overpopulation, throwing off the balance, causing more CO2 to rise above the balance with oxygen causing this imbalance.
---kathr4453 on 12/29/15


I've tried to point this out to Jerry many times where he has called me every name in the book.

Every part of our planet is completely dependent upon all God has put here. We are already seeing odd behavior of ocean life, due to DEAD ZONES, in the ocean where our sea creatures and plant life also depend upon the balance of oxygen and carbon dioxide to sustain life. And we are seeing the devistating affects of OUR, negligence ....using our source of life itself as a garbage pit, dumping nuclear waste, nuclear disasters still poluting, oil spills, chemical run off from manufacturing, pesticides etc.

God put man in charge of the earth as caretakers, and WE have made a mess of it.
---kathr453 on 12/29/15


jerry6593:

You said: That's always the case. So what? Many Christians disagree also.

Christians ignore scientists, who know little about religion, when they speak on religious matters. So why should scientists do any different to Christians, who knowing little about scientific matters, pontificate about science? Why not leave theology to the theologians and the science to scientists, rather than foolishly attempting the reverse?

But in both arenas truth is truth regardless of beliefs.

Of course. Yet if one has an attitude of "My mind is made up, don't confuse me with the facts", one is placing an (obviously incorrect) belief ahead of truth, which is always a bad idea.
---StrongAxe on 12/28/15


When is God is going to preserve the Colorado River? Or all the Coral dying in the oceans due to chemicals etc, now proven....of all things sunscreen. Has God preserved all the beautiful rivers and lakes in India, and around the world totally trashed by chemical runoff because no laws are in place to protect their environment? Has MAN put laws in this country into place about poluting our rivers and lake? Has God preserved the innocent lives of so many humans dying of all sorts of cancers because MAN, not God polluted the land and rivers and lakes with man made chemicals? Did the hand of God actually clean up the Gulf? If WE in fact ruined our land and water, why is it so hard to believe our land and water ALSO AFFECT OUR ATMOSPHERE?
---kathr4453 on 12/28/15


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\\And the ozone hole scare was just as big a fraud as this current nonsense.
\\

The ozone layer DID have a gap in it, but it also closed itself up.

Christ is born! Glorify Him!
---Cluny on 12/28/15


Lake Erie was once so underappreciated that it was literally a dumping ground. Fires were common due to the accumulation of combustible trash and oil pollution. An overabundance of toxic substances and nutrients overwhelmed the ecology of the lake. Native, desirable fish were disappearing at alarming rates, replaced by undesirable invasive species. A large algal growth in the central basin depleted all oxygen and created a dead zone. It wasnt until Lake Erie became a joke on late night talk shows that its problems were addressed. By 1970, the environmental impact on Lake Erie reached its dramatic climax and the lake was declared dead.

Question: did God clean it up, or did environmentalists get involved to bring Lake Erie back to life?
---kathr453 on 12/28/15


StrongAxe: Welcome back.

"Many scientists disagree"

That's always the case. So what? Many Christians disagree also. But in both arenas truth is truth regardless of beliefs.

"1) Is climate change happening?"

Of course. It always has and always will.


"2) Are we responsible for it?"

Absolutely not! The data supports solar output variation - not man-made CO2 output.


"3) Can we do anything to slow or reverse it?"

Only if we can turn down the thermostat on the sun. So no, not even the all-powerful pope or UN can do anything about it.

And the ozone hole scare was just as big a fraud as this current nonsense.


---jerry6593 on 12/28/15


jerry6593:

Many scientists disagree, but I'll let that pass.

There are 3 related but distinct issues:
1) Is climate change happening?
2) Are we responsible for it?
3) Can we do anything to slow or reverse it?

Whether or not you believe humans are the primary cause of climate change, it is fairly obvious that we do contribute to it somewhat (e.g. holes in the ozone layer correlated to hydrocarbon emissions), and EVEN IF WE DON'T AT ALL, the changes we see (that are fairly obvious) are STILL having catastrophic effects on our ecosystem as we know it.

If you are falling off a cliff, it doesn't matter if you jumped, or someone pushed you, or you slipped. You'll hit bottom just as hard, no matter why you fell.
---StrongAxe on 12/27/15


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Axey: "Can you mention, specificically [sic], what he has said that gives you the impression that he is scientificaly [sic]illiterate?"

No one who understands atmospheric optical spectral phenomena would preach that man-made CO2 makes a significant contribution to the planetary greenhouse effect. In fact, I doubt that this guy has any clue whatever how the greenhouse effect operates.



cluny: "Out of curiousity, jerry, have you read Laudato si?"

No. Why would I want to read more papal nonsense?


---jerry6593 on 12/18/15


Out of curiousity, jerry, have you read Laudato si?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/17/15


Jed:

You said: I don't mean to be-little community college degree holders. But really, you can pretty much be illiterate and receive a degree from a community college.

OK, let's get back to your original assertion (which I was challenging): He seems as scientifically illiterate as Al Gore.

Can you mention, specificically, what he has said that gives you the impression that he is scientificaly illiterate?
---StrongAxe on 12/17/15



He has a degree as a chemical technician from Buenos Aires - the equivalent of a community college degree. While not a masters, he's hardly illiterate.
---StrongAxe on 12/16/15


I don't mean to be-little community college degree holders. But really, you can pretty much be illiterate and receive a degree from a community college. My wife and I both earned an associates degree from our local community college while we were still in high school. My wife actually completed hers by the age of 16, more than a year before graduating from high school. Associates level classes are actually more elementary than high school level classes. My college science classes were a breeze compared to high school chemistry and physics.
---Jed on 12/16/15


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Axey: "Yet the Pope has scientific credentials"

Oh really! What are they? He seems as scientifically illiterate as Al Gore.

Try the obvious - google: pope scientist. He has a degree as a chemical technician from Buenos Aires - the equivalent of a community college degree. While not a masters, he's hardly illiterate.

One would think that the Vicar of Christ would look to God more than to man for the preservation of the earth.

Many right-wing evangelicals have a similar irresponsible view - i.e. why should we preserve the earth, as it's going to be destroyed soon anyway? Yet Jesus never taught this. Rather, he taught us to be busy doing our work (i.e. business as usual) when he arrives.
---StrongAxe on 12/16/15


Axey: "Yet the Pope has scientific credentials"

Oh really! What are they? He seems as scientifically illiterate as Al Gore. One would think that the Vicar of Christ would look to God more than to man for the preservation of the earth.


---jerry6593 on 12/16/15


Steven G. said, " Most of you will even flame Jesus if he were on these blogs because he would not conform to your denominational church's doctrine. The same holds true for the last two prophets mentioned in Revelation."

For the first time in a long time, Steven, I agree 100% with you.

Pray for me!
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/15/15


Steveng wrote:

Most of you will even flame Jesus if he were on these blogs because he would not conform to your denominational church's doctrine...

Speak for yourself.




jerry6593:

You wrote: monk: Is that all you monks have to do is surf the internet and find religious fault with others and make up lies about them?

I wrote: Big difference! I was discussing a non-scientific, political scam called Global Warming

Yet the Pope has scientific credentials, while most of the politicians who denounce him over this do not.

But my comment was not about this, it was about "surfing the internet and finding religious fault with others and making up lies about them".
---StrongAxe on 12/15/15


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monk: "It doesn't sound like your situation here is that much different..."

Big difference! I was discussing a non-scientific, political scam called Global Warming, whereas you decided to do a hit piece against EGW, who never spoke of such nonsense as your pope did.

BTW, I generally have less than 1/2 hour per day to devote to CN.


---jerry6593 on 12/15/15



This is why Jesus spent most of his time with "common" sinners (who could at least see what they were doing wrong, and be convinced to change their ways), but little with Pharisees, who actually believed they were doing the right thing, and had no intention of changing.

---StrongAxe on 12/12/15


That has been my point this whole time. Jesus' difference towards the Pharisees had nothing to do with the fact that they were religious, or what their sins were, it had everything to do with the fact that they rejected his rebukes and denied their sins while others who became Jesus' friends admitted to their sins and repented.
---Jed on 12/15/15


Most of you will even flame Jesus if he were on these blogs because he would not conform to your denominational church's doctrine. The same holds true for the last two prophets mentioned in Revelation.
---Steveng on 12/14/15


jerry6593:

You wrote: monk: Is that all you monks have to do is surf the internet and find religious fault with others and make up lies about them?

It doesn't sound like your situation here is that much different...
---StrongAxe on 12/14/15


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Jerry said, " monk: Is that all you monks have to do is surf the internet and find religious fault with others ...?"

I had a job. I have had several jobs. In my retirement years, God has allowed me to follow my heart and take up a different calling, prayer.

As I explained before, I am allowed two hours a day to be on the internet. I spend most of that time in research for a book, and I have a brief amount of time to use as I see fit. As I have mentioned earlier, my monastic Superior and my confessor both are aware of what I am doing, and so far, they have not told me to stop.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/14/15


monk: Is that all you monks have to do is surf the internet and find religious fault with others and make up lies about them? Why not scrutinize your lying pope? Better yet, why not get a job and do something useful with your life.

That there will be a special resurrection just prior to Christ's second coming is confirmed by scripture, as Jesus told the High Priest. So if you must criticize EGW for saying this, you must also criticize Jesus.

Mar 14:62 And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.


---jerry6593 on 12/14/15


Tell us, Jerry.. just what is the "global warming agenda"? Is it written down somewhere? Can you post a copy?
---NurseRobert on 12/14/15


I could have sworn the one out of the 10 Leper wasn't of the house of Israel?
Jesus told the foreigner his sin was forgiven ...
Luke 17:17-19
Plus the foreign woman with a daughter with a demon.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/10/15

He is GOD, over all.
Joh 4:7 There cometh a woman of Samaria to draw water: Jesus saith unto her, Give me to drink.
Joh_4:12 Art thou greater than our "father" Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?

Nth House was scattered around the world. See "scattered".
Joe_3:2...will plead with them there for my people and for my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.
---Trav on 12/14/15


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Jerry said, "Now just where did you dig up that rot? She was a 16 year old girl in 1843. She also taught against time setting."

Okay, you don't like that one. How about this one:"I was shown the company present at the Conference. Said the angel: Some food for worms, some subject to the last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus'"(Ellen G. White: The Early Years: 1827-1862 (vol. 1), p. 339.5 (Arthur L. White)

This is also not true.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/13/15


Jerry asked, "Now try to focus on the blog question. Do you believe in Global Warming like your scientifically illiterate pope, or not?"

I believe that the human race has done a lot to mess up the atmosphere of our planet, and should try to clean up its mess.

However, I also remember that in the 1974, Time Magazine was predicting global cooling, and showed that the temperatures were getting cooler year by year.

The press/Government has been on a global warming kick since the late 80's.

I simply do not have evidence either way to make a judgment.

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/12/15


Jed:

You said: StrongAxe, I simply don't see that in scripture. I see that God hates sin, and calls sinners to repentance, period. I don't think it matters if the sin is committed blatantly and openly or in private.

While this is true, most sins are ones that can be fixed. However, sins of the spirit (e.g. hypocrisy) are much more serious. This is why Jesus spent most of his time with "common" sinners (who could at least see what they were doing wrong, and be convinced to change their ways), but little with Pharisees, who actually believed they were doing the right thing, and had no intention of changing.
---StrongAxe on 12/12/15


Monk: "E. G. White prophesied the world would end in 1843, 1844, 1845 & 1851"

Now just where did you dig up that rot? She was a 16 year old girl in 1843. She also taught against time setting.

Now try to focus on the blog question. Do you believe in Global Warming like your scientifically illiterate pope, or not?



---jerry6593 on 12/12/15


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///\\He is more Communist than Christian, IMHO.\\

You know what they say about opinions. They are like the gluteus maximae. Everybody's got one, and they are all filled with the same stinky stuff.

Besides, nothing about you is humble, jerry.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/5/15///

Lord help me! For once I actually agree 100% with Cluny. I think I'm going to be sick, i.e., calling Ralph right now!!!
---Leon on 12/11/15


StrongAxe, I simply don't see that in scripture. I see that God hates sin, and calls sinners to repentance, period. I don't think it matters if the sin is committed blatantly and openly or in private. Regardless, I fail to see the purpose of you making this point. Was it to exonerate blatantly sinful living? Was it to exonerate total rejection of the Bible? I guess I'm trying to understand what exactly your point is.
---Jed on 12/11/15


Jerry said, "She was a true prophet and she passed every biblical test that confirmed it."

Really? If she made even ONE mistake, she would be a false prophet, correct?

Then what about this one? E. G. White prophesied the world would end in 1843, 1844, 1845 & 1851: "Now time is almost finished, (1851) and what we have been 6 years in learning they will have to learn in months." EARLY WRITINGS p. 57

Pray for me,
the unworthy monk Brendan
---Monk_Brendan on 12/11/15


/I could have sworn the one out of the 10 Leper wasn't of the house of Israel?\
He was Samaritan, still of Israel, but considered half-breeds by those of Judea (Jews) because the nation of Israel was assimilated into the Syrian conquests.
/That's what made Jesus upset\
Not really.
/Plus the foreign woman with a daughter with a demon.\-Nicole_Lacey on 12/10/15
This is a good example to your point. Although she wasn't the foreigner, Jesus was.
---micha9344 on 12/11/15


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Christ never told a heathen to go an sin no more or repent.
Only Israel had the Law. Only Israel was judged by the law.---Trav on 12/10/15

I could have sworn the one out of the 10 Leper wasn't of the house of Israel?

That's what made Jesus upset saying why Only this foreigner returned to thank God. Jesus told the foreigner his sin was forgiven because his faith has saved him which suggest his sins are forgiven if he is saved.
Luke 17:17-19

Plus the foreign woman with a daughter with a demon.

Rememeber Jesus told her people don't give the children's food to the dogs. She answered even dogs eat crumbs from the Master's table.

Which Jesus told her to go because her Faith saved her daughter.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/10/15


Jed:

You said: You are trying to paint Jesus as being naturally hostile to the religious and easy going on the blatant sinners. Not so.

Look at the tone Jesus used against normal sinners. He didn't accuse them (e.g. the woman caught in adultery). At most, he merely told "go, and sin no more". On the other hand, he was very harsh against Pharisees, whom he called hypocrites, vipers, and whitewashed tombs, and the temple moneychangers, whom he called thieves.

Yes, he also rebuked Peter, who had studied with him for three years but still didn't "get it". But only once harshly.
---StrongAxe on 12/11/15


cluny: "But EGW claimed she was."

She was a true prophet and she passed every biblical test that confirmed it.


---jerry6593 on 12/11/15


Jesus treated the heathens no different than the Pharisees.

He confronted all of them with their sins and prompted them to repent.
---Jed on 12/8/15

Jed...there is a technicality above that is a taught doctrine but, is not true.
Christ never told a heathen to go an sin no more or repent.
Only Israel had the Law. Only Israel was judged by the law. Because of these broken covenant laws, it was, Israel that Christ came for. The "Lost Sheep". Found easily in Matt 10:6 / 15:24. Who had broken the laws and were divorced/put away...lost, scattered, dispersed. A "New Covenant" was made with the same people as the "Old Covenant".
Heb 8:8/Jer 31:31.
---Trav on 12/10/15


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\\The pope is NOT inspired by the Holy Spirit as a prophet. ---jerry6593 on 12/9/15\\

But EGW claimed she was.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/10/15


StrongAxe, Jesus "called out" alot of people, including his closest friends. I asked for a scripture stating he screamed at the phariesees, as you claimed. You are trying to paint Jesus as being naturally hostile to the religious and easy going on the blatant sinners. Not so. Jesus called out the sin in the woman at the well. Je told.the prostitute to stop what she was doing. He even called out the "Satan" in Peter! As I said, Jesus rebuked the sin in both the religious and non-religious alike. He didnt single out the pharisees. It was the pharisees hostility toward his rebukes that set them apart.
---Jed on 12/10/15


Jed, the only time Jesus showed his anger and it was documented in the Bible is with the Pharisees and the Scribes.

Screaming or yelling is both the same to me.

Jesus didn't even scream at Herod, Pilate, Soldiers nailing Him to the cross, or even the people beneath him cursing at him for 3 hours prior to His Death.

That shows how much Jesus dislikes hypocrites holding God's authority over His people. Matthew 23

StrongAxe is right.

Anyone turning over your table with your money and valuables flying everywhere isn't being polite.

In John, Jesus just left a Wedding when he made a whip out of cords and drove them all out of the temple area John 2:13-22.

That's some WHIP!
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/10/15


Jed:

You wrote: Can you give some examples in scripture where Jesus screamed at the Pharisees?

Jesus called out hypocrites in Matthew 6:2,5,16, 7:5!, 15:7!, 16:3!, 22:18!,
23:13!,14!,15!,23!,27!,29!, 24:51, Mark 7:6!, Luke 6:42!, 11:44!, 12:56!, 13:15!

The ones marked ! are ones where he called people hypocrites to their faces. Even though punctuation is lacking in the original manuscripts, someone saying "You hypocrites!" today would be followed by an exclamation mark. (If you don't like "screamed", how about "was emphatic"?)

And when he was tossing the moneychangers out of the temple, he wasn't being polite about it.
---StrongAxe on 12/10/15


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He didn't scream at sinners - only at pharisees who claimed to be righteous.

---StrongAxe on 12/9/15


Can you give some examples in scripture where Jesus screamed at the Pharisees? I can only recall scriptures that state "Jesus said" or "Jesus replied", not "Jesus screamed". Just because cinematic dramatizations depict Jesus screaming at the Pharisees while turning a blind eye to other's sins doesn't make it so. Leaving Hollywood out of it, and using scripture alone, he confronted the sins of the religious and non-religious alike. He only had a problem with someone if they denied their sins and rejected his rebukes, as the Pharisees did.
---Jed on 12/9/15


THIS IS WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT: You all change and lie on Catholics

Exhibit: 300044084495959C

Nicole: The pope is NOT inspired by the Holy Spirit as a prophet. ---jerry6593 on 12/9/15

WHO said the Holy Spirit makes the Pope a Prophet????

Stating the Pope is infallible on Faith and Morals isn't claiming he can tell the future.

How did you connect those dots that CAN'T BE connectable???

Saying birth pill is morally wrong as an INFALLIBLE statement made by the Pope.

The Holy Spirit made sure the Pope didn't error on proclaiming taking birth pills is a moral sin (Serious Sin needing confession)
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/9/15


Nicole: The pope is NOT inspired by the Holy Spirit as a prophet. There are several biblical tests of a true prophet, and he fails them all. Worse than this, he denies the truth of the Bible Creation in favor of a satanic lie - Evolution.

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

The great prophet of Global Warming, Al Gore, predicted that ocean levels would have risen several feet by now. They haven't.

Job 38:11 And said, Hitherto shalt thou come, but no further: and here shall thy proud waves be stayed?


---jerry6593 on 12/9/15


Jed:

You said: Denying the Bible is worse.

I disagree. Those who openly deny the bible are its enemies, but at least they are honest about it. Those who claim to obey the bible with their words, but go against it with their actions are ALSO denying it (and are thus its enemies too), but pretend not to, and thus deceiving many. Jesus didn't warn us about wolves - only about wolves in sheep's clothing. He didn't scream at sinners - only at pharisees who claimed to be righteous.
---StrongAxe on 12/9/15


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Which is worse? Denying the Bible, or claiming to uphold it while doing everything it teaches against? Jesus was more kind to heathen than to religious hypocrites.

---StrongAxe on 12/6/15


Denying the Bible is worse. But, the true Church of Jesus Christ does neither as a matter of policy. Of course, everyone has their weak moments. Jesus treated the heathens no different than the Pharisees. He confronted all of them with their sins and prompted them to repent. Those who accepted Jesus' rebukes and repented were saved and became his friends. Those who tried to excuse and hide their sin and said "How dare you JUDGE us" did not fare well with Jesus. It had nothing to do with who was religious or not.
---Jed on 12/8/15


True. But, he did inspire the writers with His Holy Spirit. Do you now claim that the pope is thus inspired when he speaks---jerry6593


Thank you for answering my question.

Yes, the same Holy Spirit who guided the men to write the Scripture without any mistakes AKA infallibility.

Is the same Holy Spirit who in FAITH AND MORALS ONLY guides the Pope today.

Or do you believe the Holy Spirit went to sleep after the Scriptures?

BTW, 1/3 of the CCC is of the 10 Commandments.
All our beliefs are in print because Truth doesn't change.

What about your Church's belief? In Print?
Or it can't be because it keeps changing, that is their beliefs?
Divorce, Birth control pills and the like.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/8/15



It is you all who think we think the Pope is infallible in everything.
You spread that lie around until you start to believe it.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/6/15


No. Actually, I know full well that the pope is not infallible at all.
---Jed on 12/7/15


Nicole: "God didn't write the Bible with His fingers like the 10 Commandments."

True. But, he did inspire the writers with His Holy Spirit. Do you now claim that the pope is thus inspired when he speaks ex cathedra? Does he see visions? Does he prophesy? Why does he think that God is unable to take care of the planet that He created, and that we must "fix it" ourselves?

As for the 10 Commandments which God wrote with His own finger, why don't you keep them rather than the adulterated version in your Catechism?


---jerry6593 on 12/8/15


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Especially when infallibility in that area is impossible to prove? ---Jed

That's your straw man.

It is you all who think we think the Pope is infallible in everything.
You spread that lie around until you start to believe it.

When we correct you saying only in 'faith and mortals' you come out with 'why not everything' answer?

Just like you trust the Bible as being written by men who were infallible while writing the Bible, so the SAME HOLY SPIRIT keeps the Pope infallible with faith and morals.

You can't have it both ways.

God didn't write the Bible with His fingers like the 10 Commandments.

Either you believe men were infallible with the Bible or you don't believe the Bible at all.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/6/15


Jed:

This would be true if one were talking about God, or some other entity that is "inherently infallible". This is not the case here.

Papal infallibility does NOT say the pope is inherently infallible. Rather, in matters of faith and morals, God gives him the supernatural ability to make correct pronouncements in those areas for those specific matters, in order to protect the church from error.

One cannot prove God is infallible either, without already assuming that he is.


steveng:

Which is worse? Denying the Bible, or claiming to uphold it while doing everything it teaches against? Jesus was more kind to heathen than to religious hypocrites.
---StrongAxe on 12/6/15


Jed: "how can we be certain that he is infallible in any other area?"

Good point! NO ONE is infallible in ANY area. There is one area where we can fact check someone's opinion - that of religious matters. There is only ONE source of truth:

Isa 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Why is it that people in non-scientific professions (such as politics and religion) think that they are qualified to understand scientific phenomena? I doubt that this pope or Obama the imposter could give a cogent explanation of the mechanisms involved in the greenhouse effect.


---jerry6593 on 12/7/15



Jed, papal infallibility can be exercised ONLY in matters of faith and morals, and then only in very limited circumstance.

It doesn't apply to scientific notions.

We've tried to explain this to you already.

Why don't you understand it?

Glory to Jesus Christ!

---Cluny on 12/5/15


If one can be wrong in areas of science, politics, and other subjects, how can we be certain that he is infallible in any other area? Especially when infallibility in that area is impossible to prove?
---Jed on 12/6/15


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StrongAxe wrote: "So why are so many right-wing Christians such vehement climate-change deniers? Those ARE getting caught up in it."

You are dividing christiandom further besides just denominations. Now you are dividing christiandom into political parties. Those right/left-wing christians are counterfeit christians as are denominational christians.
---Steveng on 12/6/15


cluny: "Besides, nothing about you is humble, jerry."

Oh, how sweet! I can almost feel the love.




Axey: So why are so many left-wing Christians such vehement Bible deniers? The Democrat Party above God or Country, eh?



---jerry6593 on 12/6/15


Axey: "Truth is truth, regardless of who says it. It's curious most scientists agree with global warming"


I agree that truth is truth. Your statement that "most scientists agree with global warming" is provably false. As one of the thousands of scientists that oppose this lie, I look for the cause and effect relationship between man's CO2 output and global temperature history. THERE IS NONE!

Prove it for yourself. Plot the global temperature for the last 50 years. Now plot the industrial CO2 output for the same period. They don't match at all. Now overplot the solar irradiance for the same period. VOILA! A match.
---jerry6593 on 12/6/15


Please read the Pope's encyclical and pull out the number next to his statement proving the Pope agrees with the Global Warming agenda?

Remember the 'agenda'.

Some have an agenda in the hoax, while some believe one needs to care for the earth for future generations. A difference.

Those at the summit PROVE they don't believe their own words because they fly everywhere instead of talking on the phone. Like our President.

No top secret going on during the summit.
So why not have a group conference phone call?

When the Pope goes places he choses the cheapest vehicle be escorted.

Again, I want direct words from the Pope. Not a 3rd person claiming he said something.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/5/15


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\\He is more Communist than Christian, IMHO.\\

You know what they say about opinions. They are like the gluteus maximae. Everybody's got one, and they are all filled with the same stinky stuff.

Besides, nothing about you is humble, jerry.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/5/15


steveng:

Truth is truth, regardless of who says it. It's curious most scientists agree with global warming, and only a few (plus conservative politicians in the pockets of big oil interests) disgree.

This isn't about "making the world better through technology", but rather "slowing down our making the world worse through technology".

Man cannot avert end time prophesies from being fulfilled.

Yes, but I don't recall any prophecies about global warming.

The duty of the true christian is to ... not get caught up in the ways of the world.

So why are so many right-wing Christians such vehement climate-change deniers? Those ARE getting caught up in it.
---StrongAxe on 12/5/15


The pope is siding with the liberal/communism agenda just as Obama and the UN. The liberal/communism mind thinks that man could make the world a better place by putting their faith in science and technology. Man cannot avert end time prophesies from being fulfilled.

The duty of the true christian is to preach the gospel (the coming Kingdom of God and how to get there)just as Jesus and the apostles taught - not get caught up in the ways of the world.
---steveng on 12/4/15


Cluny & Jed: At last, I agree with you both. Yes indeed, Global Warming by man's CO2 production is a massive political hoax as I can easily prove. But the main point here is that the Pope, who claims to be the Vicar of Christ on earth apparently thinks that God can't handle the job of planetary protection, and needs the force of governmental intervention to save us.

He is more Communist than Christian, IMHO.



---jerry6593 on 12/5/15


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jerry6593:

The blog question itself is disingenuous, as it makes many assumptions that beg the answer.

"Global warming agenda" assumes a biased agenda (as oppsed to "climate changing denying agenda", which is implied to be true and unbiased).

"man's intervention" is about our future changes to stop global warming (ignoring our past changes that have affected global warming).

The Pope agrees with most scientists who see what is happening to the planet, rather than a few greedy petroleum interests who think it's fine to wreck the earth for their own profit.
---StrongAxe on 12/5/15


Jed, papal infallibility can be exercised ONLY in matters of faith and morals, and then only in very limited circumstance.

It doesn't apply to scientific notions.

We've tried to explain this to you already.

Why don't you understand it?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/5/15


It certainly shows lack of discernment and rational reasoning. It shows that no human being is infallible.
---Jed on 12/4/15


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