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Orthodox Hell Bound Priest

A number of years ago, a woman (member of a church that makes an issue over not using musical instruments) heard an Orthodox priest speak.

Afterwards, she said, "I don't understand it. He believes the same things I believe, but he's going to hell and I'm not."

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cluny states, "These are the main points of Eastern Orthodox Theology."

And they are subtracted from by the teachings "Mankind becoming gods.", baptismal regeneration, sola ekklesia, and icons.
---john9346 on 4/7/16


Brendan and cluny,

Remember the following gentleman and please think on it.

"If you have a Wrong View of God, then you will have a Wrong View of everything else."

Eastern Orthodox Theology has a definite Wrong View of God and I plead with you both to repent/turn from your sins and trust the Jesus of the bible alone to save you from his wrath...
---john on 4/7/16


\\1. salvation (How is one save) \\

john9347, in the Eastern Orthodox Christian Church, we place our faith in the Lord Christ Himself, not a theory about how He saves us.

Can you grasp the difference?

Probably not.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/6/16


\\ Eastern Orthodox Theology is diametrically Opposed to Christian Theology on the basic fundamental tenets of the Christian faith \\

Like saying that Jesus Christ is God Incarnate--two natures, human and divine--in one Person?

Like saying Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is one God?

LIke saying Jesus was truly crucified and rose from the dead and is the only Savior?

These are the main points of Eastern Orthodox Theology.

Or does what you think is "christian theology" deny these points?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/6/16


John 9346 said, "Eastern Orthodox Theology is diametrically Opposed to Christian Theology on the basic fundamental tenets of the Christian faith see below:
1. salvation (How is one save)
2. Justification and sanctification.
3. theosis (mankind becoming gods)
4. Who is God(apophatic Theology/negation)"


John, I have some questions for you:
1. Is God, in His fullness only a snowflake? If you answer yes, then you need to seek real help. If you answer no, then you are proving apophatic theology.
2. If Theosis is not mankind becoming gods, then why were Adam and Eve made in God's image and likeness. And are we not called to be partakers of His Divine nature? (2Peter:3-5)
---Monk_Brendan on 4/6/16




To recap:

Eastern Orthodox Theology is diametrically Opposed to Christian Theology on the basic fundamental tenets of the Christian faith see below:

1. salvation (How is one save)

2. Justification and sanctification.

3. theosis (mankind becoming gods)

4. Who is God(apophatic Theology/negation)

In conclusion, Eastern Orthodox is presenting a god, but it is not the God of the bible.
---john9346 on 4/6/16


In Eastern Orthodox Theology, God reveals himself through icons, but this is idolatry according to the Scripture in Christian Theology see Exo 20:1-5, and 2 Tim 3:16-17.

"An icon is not simply a religious picture designed to arouse appropriate emotions in the beholder, it is one of the ways whereby God is revealed to us. Through icons the Orthodox Christian receives a vision of the spiritual world,"

(Ware, Timothy
---john on 4/6/16


"Those who do not have good arguments or verses for their views. Often resort to juvenile remarks, snide comments and personal attacks." john

That is true John.

I try to not get confused but I sometimes do.

Now John you and Luke say that a person is once saved always saved and GOD choose them to be saved. From that you infer that any who disagree with you are trying to be saved by works.

That is a false accusation.

Two reasons.

One because a person does works does not mean they are trying to save themselves. They work because they love GOD and others. Matthew 5,6 & 7 Luke 6 and I john.

Two the doctrine of Justification is not to cover evil.
agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/5/16


\\ I only quoted an Eastern Orthodox Authority, are you now arguing with your own authority??\\

Where did you get the idea that a priest with his own publishing company was an "Eastern Orthodox Authority?"

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/5/16


Everyone please note, Cluny is NOW arguing with his own authority from a man who knows much more than him and is very qualified to write on Eastern Orthodox Theology.


Father Anthony M. Coniaris graduated from the Boston Latin School, the Holy Cross Greek Orthodox Theological Seminary, (Bachelor of Theology) as well as the Northwestern Theological Seminary in Minneapolis (Master of Divinity).

Author of several books, he received the Three Hierarchs Medal for outstanding service from Holy Cross School of Theology.
---john on 4/5/16




cluny states, "1 Peter 3:21
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us and asked,"

Sir, did you read the rest of this verse?

You know there is more?
---john9346 on 4/5/16


John (no numbers) quoted, "You see, salvation is comprehensive. It has to do with our past we have been saved from sin and death through baptism. This we call justification,"

"Justification, which is our being cleansed of sin through baptism and after baptism through repentance."


You may be quoting an Orthodox Archpriest, but he is not one of the elders of the first seven Ecumenical Councils. after looking at this guy's CV, it looks like he has an edifice complex.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/5/16


Samuelbb7 states, "But I cannot agree with John either. He makes some poor points and does not back up his claims."


Sir, have you not been reading this posting carefully.

Please show where I have made some poor points and could not back up my claims." And what points I have made that I have not backed up my claims?

If you are going to attack me, at least be specific and above all be honest.

Thank You,

John
---john9346 on 4/4/16


Cluny said, "john, you were the first one who suggested that salvation was NOT comprehensive. Therefore it's up to YOU to prove it, and not I prove the opposite."

Sir, pay attention, I only quoted an Eastern Orthodox Authority, are you now arguing with your own authority??


"You see, salvation is comprehensive. It has to do with our pastwe have been saved from sin and death through baptism. This we call justification,"

""Justification, which is our being cleansed of sin through baptism and after baptism through repentance."

(Coniaris, Anthony M.) Introducing the Orthodox Church: Its Faith and Life.

---john on 4/4/16


Luke said, "Samuel, you agree with Cluny and Brandon (It's Brendan!) because all three of you claim that your salvation is by keeping the law, which means works. They do it by getting baptized themselves, and you do it by making Saturday Sabbath you have to keep, which means all three of you believe in salvation by works. This has nothing to do with Calvinism."

What had the lambs done when sitting at right of Jesus in the story of the lambs and the goats? Nothing about giving their heart to God. That's not mentioned.

Nothing about TULIPs there! Thank God I have nothing to do with Calvin. He created a cruel god that made people just to damn them to eternal destruction.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/4/16


Samuel, you first say:
"cluny we have the same accusation thrown at both of us here.

It is mostly from Calvinist who teach that unless you are once saved always saved you believe in works salvation."


Samuel, you agree with Cluny and Brandon because all three of you claim that your salvation is by keeping the law, which means works. They do it by getting baptized themselves, and you do it by making Saturday Sabbath you have to keep, which means all three of you believe in salvation by works. This has nothing to do with Calvinism.
---Luke on 4/3/16


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Cluny you missed the paragraph where I pointed to the united church they had been.

Now that church was in flux but it was when all the Bishops were equal and leaders had to be morally right and Godly.
---Samuelbb7 on 4/2/16


\\My Problem is that neither the Roman Catholic or Orthodox churches of today are the ones who set forth the canon. \\

Then who did?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/2/16


Some good points Cluny.

I agree with Cluny and Monk Brendan on some of their points and they make some true statements and good arguments.

My Problem is that neither the Roman Catholic or Orthodox churches of today are the ones who set forth the canon.

That occurred before they split into two different churches. The Great Schism of 1054 makes both their claims invalid. Both began to add traditions that were against scripture to their teachings.

Both are Christian churches and those members in their midst who love GOD and their neighbor will go to heaven. I just cannot agree with all their teachings.

But I cannot agree with John either. He makes some poor points and does not back up his claims. Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/2/16


\\1. Please show us where the Scriptures teach that salvation is conprehensive??\\

john, you were the first one who suggested that salvation was NOT comprehensive. Therefore it's up to YOU to prove it, and not I prove the opposite.

\\2. Please cite for us the verse where Peter states, "Baptism saves us."?\\


1 Peter 3:21
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us

Is this verse not in your Bible, john?

Or maybe you just don't know it as well as you think you do.

Glory to Jesus Christ1
---Cluny on 4/1/16


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John quoted, ""It is from the Church that the Bible ultimately derives its authority, for it was the Church which originally decided which books form a part of Holy Scripture, and it is the Church alone which can interpret Holy Scripture with authority,"

(Ware, Timothy)
The Orthodox Church ( p. 199)"


You obviously don't believe that the Bible is a compilation of different writers, in different cultures and using different languages, but that it came down complete, in a book, bound in scarlet leather, with gold edging on the pages, and five ribbons and two place cards, with the words of Jesus in red, in the KJV, signed "Jesus".
---Monk_Brendan on 4/1/16


cluny we have the same accusation thrown at both of us here.

It is mostly from Calvinist who teach that unless you are once saved always saved you believe in works salvation.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 4/1/16


cluny sir,

1. Please show us where the Scriptures teach that salvation is conprehensive??

2. Please cite for us the verse where Peter states, "Baptism saves us."?

3. Based on your own "Sources/authorities." you are wrong sir that is why I am stating the citations so those who are seeking the truth can read for themselves.

4. Do you not realize that readers/viewers are reading your responses that are not based on substance, not sure what juvenile remarks, snide comments and personal attacks are supposed to do.
---john9346 on 4/1/16


john (with no numbers), I've told you repeatedly that Orthodoxy does not believe in salvation by works, yet you keep on making this claim.

Why?

That's why I told you to quit before you got further behind.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/31/16


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I think we all can say we are grateful not everybody is like that woman who thinks she can judge who is saved and who is going to hell. I am very glad only God can judge our final fates not people like her. Since we are warned that as we judge others we will be judged that way by God which gives a very excellent reason to let bad opinions die where they begin.
---Darlene_1 on 3/31/16


\\"You see, salvation is comprehensive.\\

Where does the Bible teach that salvation is NOT comprehensive?

Please give BCV.

\\ It has to do with our pastwe have been saved from sin and death through baptism. \\

In one of ST. Peter's Epistles, he wrote, "Baptism doth now save us."

Look it up.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/31/16


In Christian Theology, an individual is justified by faith alone in Christ alone see Rom 5:1 3:10-27, it is not baptism that saves us.

See Eph 2:1-9.
---john9346 on 3/31/16


In Eastern Orthodox Theology, the (church) is, "The Final Authority."

The church defines interpretation and decides the Scriptures, but in Christian Theology the (bible) is, "The Final Authority." see 2 Tim 3:16-17.

"It is from the Church that the Bible ultimately derives its authority, for it was the Church which originally decided which books form a part of Holy Scripture, and it is the Church alone which can interpret Holy Scripture with authority,"

(Ware, Timothy (

The Orthodox Church ( p. 199)
---john on 3/31/16


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Cluny,

Sir, you are wrong...

Christian Theology (the bible) does not teach the following which is taught in Eastern Orthodox Theology.

"You see, salvation is comprehensive. It has to do with our pastwe have been saved from sin and death through baptism. This we call justification,"

""Justification, which is our being cleansed of sin through baptism and after baptism through repentance."

(Coniaris, Anthony M.) Introducing the Orthodox Church: Its Faith and Life.
---john9346 on 3/30/16


Cluny,


I want to remind you of the following:


"Those who do not have good arguments or verses for their views. Often resort to juvenile remarks, snide comments and personal attacks."
---john on 3/30/16


\\In Eastern Orthodox Theology, sanctification is justification and justification is sanctification which results in salvation by works.\\

Wrong.

Quit before you get further behind.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/30/16


Cluny said, "Of course salvation is not static by dynamic."

Actually, according to the Scriptures salvation is complete.

2 Cor 3:18 is not addressing salvation, but sanctification.

In Eastern Orthodox Theology, sanctification is justification and justification is sanctification which results in salvation by works.

Eastern Orthodox Theology twists these positions and blur the distinctions.

In Christian Theology, justification is justification and sanctification is sanctification.

In other words, we are sanctified because we are justified and not the other way around.
---john on 3/30/16


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\\"In Orthodox theology, salvation is not static but dynamic,"\\

Of course salvation is not static by dynamic.

You didn't think otherwise, did you?

In St. Paul's phrase we grow from "glory to glory by the Spirit of God" not only in this world, but in the World to Come.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/29/16


Strongaxe,

Sir, things to note:

1. the verse is addressing 2 parts.

2. The part you cite Balak is answering a question asked of him, the second part speaks exclusively of God's Nature as well as vs 20 and 22.

If you read carefully the second part of vs 19, all of 20, and 22 when speaking of the exclusiveness of God's Nature they do not start out with a negation (What or who God is not)
---john9346 on 3/29/16


Cluny states, "That's Orthodox Christian theology--but knowable only in His energies, and NOT in His essence, which is eternal."

The bible (Christian Theology) God is knowable as a person and not knowable to energies.

examples,

God is father,

the Holy Spirit is a conforter, counselor, guide,

Jesus is a friend, a Saviour, Lord, Good Shepherd, and mediator.

Sir, this is a personal person God not energies.

You cant have a relationship with energies and energies cant have a relationship with you.


Again, this has never been and is not Christian Theology, but it is embraced in Eastern Orthodox Theology.
---john on 3/30/16


john9346:

You wrote: Sir, in context, Num 23:19 is making a conparison between Human mankind and God as man.

I know that. However, you were contradicting Cluny (who spoke of a theology that dealt, not with what God is, but what God is not), and you said that the entire bible talks about what God is, rather than what he is not. I was merely showing that this is not entirely true - there are places (like the one I quoted) where it does, in fact, say what he is not. In this case, saying that he does not possess the deceptive nature of man.
---StrongAxe on 3/29/16


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\\God is Spirit never God is not human\\

Are you saying that God didn't take flesh in the Incarnation and was known as Jesus?

\\Sir, in Christian Theology, the God of the bible is personal and knowable\\

That's Orthodox Christian theology--but knowable only in His energies, and NOT in His essence, which is eternal.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/29/16


Strongaxe states, "
Not always. A very specific example, illustrating just what Cluny was referring to:

Numbers 23:19
"God is not a man, that he should lie, neither the son of man, that he should repent: ..."

Sir, in context, Num 23:19 is making a conparison between Human mankind and God as man.
---john9346 on 3/29/16


The following doesn't nor has it ever represented Christian Theology,yet, it is taught and embraced in Eastern Orthodox Theology.

"In Orthodox theology, salvation is not static but dynamic," "it is not a completed state,"
"And it can never be achieved fully in this life,"

"Salvation according to Orthodox theology is not the state of I have arrived. I have made it. I am saved."

(Coniaris, Anthony M.
---john on 3/29/16


john9346:

Cluny wrote: apophatic theology is simply saying what God is NOT.

You wrote: In Christian Theology, The bible from Gen-rev shows "Who God is."

Not always. A very specific example, illustrating just what Cluny was referring to:

Numbers 23:19
"God is not a man, that he should lie, neither the son of man, that he should repent: ..."
---StrongAxe on 3/28/16


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Luke:

John wrote: The catholic or universal Church, which is invisible

You wrote: The Catholic Church is not invisible.

You are arguing apples vs. oranges here. These are two different words. "catholic" is a generic adjective meaning "universal". "Catholic" is a proper name referring to a very specific organization, centered in Rome. The organization's name derives the adjective, but it's definitely not true any longer (especially since the Schism, when the eastern half became separate).

So, "catholic church" e.g. "church Universal" is still correct - you just need to make sure neither word is capitalized, to distinguish it from the Vatican organization.
---StrongAxe on 3/28/16


Cluny said:

"Next, apophatic theology is simply saying what God is NOT."

In Christian Theology, The bible from Gen-rev shows "Who God is."

examples,

God is Spirit never God is not human.

God is love never God is not hate.

God is holy never God is not unholy.

You see, the Scriptures entire center and focus is that mankind knows his creator.

In theosis (becoming 1 with the energies), God is not a person, its like loving what your parents do and give to you without ever knowing who they are.

Sir, in Christian Theology, the God of the bible is personal and knowable
---john9346 on 3/28/16


Cluny,

The bible coming from "Heaven." is very ambiguous and very vague and needs more specificity from you.

No church father ever taught that they, "Gave the world the bible."



"These are the fountains of salvation, that they who thirst may be satisfied with the living words they
Athanasius


"We have learned from none others the plan of our salvation, than from those through whom the gospel has come down to us, which they did at one time proclaim in public, and, at a later period, by the will of God, handed down to us in the Scriptures, to be the ground and pillar of our faith."

Irenaeus
---john on 3/28/16


\\cluny asked, "john, please give the name of ONE Church Father who said that the Bible indeed DID drop down from heaven."

CertainlyCertainly before answering I need you to be more specific on "Dropping down from heaven."

What do you mean?\\

Some people seem to think the Bible simply appeared in its present form, even with chapter and verse divisions (which are a late addition).

God certainly did not provide a list of what books were supposed to be in the OT and NT.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/28/16


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John, you said:
""The catholic or universal Church, which is invisible,"

From the very beginning the article is wrong. The Catholic Church is not invisible. It is very much visible. And the head of the Catholic Church is the Pope. There might be some of the elect in the visible Catholic Church, but not many. When they come to Christ they will not be idol worshipers. They will be able to see that idol worship is wrong.
The invisible Church consist of all true believers who make the body of Christ. Each one is a part of One Body. The Head of the body of Christ is Christ.
---Luke on 3/28/16


cluny asked, "john, please give the name of ONE Church Father who said that the Bible indeed DID drop down from heaven."

CertainlyCertainly before answering I need you to be more specific on "Dropping down from heaven."

What do you mean?
---john9346 on 3/27/16


Cluny,

Thank you for providing the quotations:

1. The context of institute 4.1.1 is how to identify true believers and false believers.

Did you read the Scriptures cited after this statement??

2. WCF 25.2 in context is defining who is the church:


"The catholic or universal Church, which is invisible, consists of the whole number of the elect, that have been, are, or shall be gathered into one,
under Christ the Head thereof,"

"The visible Church, which is also catholic or universal under the Gospel."
"Consists of all those
throughout the world that profess the true religion,"
[2]
---john on 3/27/16


Jerry, you said:
" Only the Holy Spirit (God) knows who has grieved Him - not us. So we can't say that anyone has committed the unpardonable sin."

In the context of the passage the Pharisees committed that sin. Many not all who are lost, have sinned against the Holy Spirit. Here is why, those who know His claims are true and reject Him anyway sin against the Holy Spirit, because it is the Holy Spirit who testifies of Christ and makes His truth known to us ( John 15:26: 16:14,15).
In the passage those Pharisees who witnessed His miracles first hand knew His truth, and His claims. and so blasphemed the Holy Spirit.
---Luke on 3/27/16


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Darlene: I'm sure that we do not disagree. Only the Holy Spirit (God) knows who has grieved Him - not us. So we can't say that anyone has committed the unpardonable sin.



---jerry6593 on 3/26/16


\\The Church compiled the Bible.
The Bible didn't fall from Heaven

Nicole, none of the church fathers believed and held this view tell us what makes you believes this\\

john, please give the name of ONE Church Father who said that the Bible indeed DID drop down from heaven.

And give the quote, please.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/25/16


Jerry with due respect to your view, but Matthew 12:31 & 32 (paraphrased) if anyone sins against the Holy Ghost it isn't forgiven him,it's blasphemy.Sins against Jesus will be forgiven and isn't blasphemy.
---Darlene_1 on 3/25/16


john, here are the quotes.

Away from [the church] one cannot hope for any forgiveness of sins or any salvation. Institutes 4.1.1

The visible Church . . . is the Kingdom of the Lord Jesus Christ, the house and family of God, out of which there is no ordinary possibility of salvation (Westminster Confession of Faith, 25.2)

As for Fr. George Grube, I cannot find out what jurisdiction he's in. Reviews of his books say that he is unhelpful and at times inaccurate.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/24/16


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"he's going to hell and I'm not"

Anyone who judges someone's fitness for heaven - even their own - is usurping the prerogative of God alone, and thus commits blasphemy. Christ is our ONLY judge, and fortunately He mingles mercy with judgment.


---jerry6593 on 3/25/16


First off George Grube (and who is he, BTW?) is not saying "sola ecclesia.

Next, apophatic theology is simply saying what God is NOT. I'm sure you will agree that there are many things God is not.

Next, the Orthodox Church has never taught salvation by works.

Finally, it's pointless to discuss theosis before people who don't even believe that Jesus is God Incarnate. But the "zoin aionion" of John 3:16 is not simply extended life, but qualitatively different--the kind of life God has Himself. Think about it.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/24/16


Many believe and I agree that the Church is all the called out Christians of GOD. No matter the denomination. Who GOD alone knows. They show by their love to others who they belong. to.

Agreed you have to be a member of that church to be saved. But it is a heart church not building or doctrines. Nor history.

The word of GOD is human and divine.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 3/24/16


The following has never been a teaching of Christian Theology,yet, it is taught and embraced in Eastern Orthodox Theology.

"The human being does not become God by nature, but is merely a created god,"

Ware, Timothy The Orthodox Church page 232
---john9346 on 3/24/16


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Cluny states, "Did you know that John Calvin and the Westminster Confession say the same things?"

Could you state for us this claim citing chapter and verse?
---john on 3/24/16


Cluny states, "
You either misunderstand the Orthodox teaching or are flat out wrong in what you have said here.

It would take too many words to correct you."

Tell everybody here what am I wrong about.

Lets start with Sola Ekklesia:

Do you disagree with George Grube as stated prior??
---john9346 on 3/24/16


Nicole said:

The Church compiled the Bible.
The Bible didn't fall from Heaven

Nicole, none of the church fathers believed and held this view tell us what makes you believes this?

Jn 10:33-35 is a direct quotation from Ps 82 having to do with judges who acted in the place of God not they were God.

St Paul in Acts 26:20b.. I preached thee need to repent and turn to God, and to do WORKS giving evidence of repentance.

Nicole, notice he states evidence of repentance not towards repentance.

Again, none of the church fathers ever held that they, "Gave the world the bible."
---john on 3/24/16


\\"Believe that Christ is in the Church and His grace abides in her. That is why the Church became necessary for salvation and outside the Church there is no remission of sins, no redemption, no justification (being made right with God), and no hope for eternal life." \\

Did you know that John Calvin and the Westminster Confession say the same things?

Glory to Jesus Christ!!
---Cluny on 3/24/16


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Sola Ekklesia (the church alone),--john9346

The Church compiled the Bible.
The Bible didn't fall from Heaven

John 10:33-35 The Jews answered Him, "...being a man, make Yourself out to be God." Jesus answered them, "Has it not been written in your Law,"Has it not been written in your Law, 'I SAID, YOU ARE GODS'? "If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came

St Paul in Acts 26:20b.. I preached thee need to repent and turn to God, and to do WORKS giving evidence of repentance.

He was talking to King Agrippa when given the chance to defend his actions.

Children are to Parents so is the Bible to the Church.

Church has the Authority given by Her Groom Himself, Jesus Christ.
---Nicole_Lacey on 3/23/16


\\Sola Ekklesia (the church alone), Mankind becoming gods (theosis), salvation by works, and apophaticism.\\

You either misunderstand the Orthodox teaching or are flat out wrong in what you have said here.

It would take too many words to correct you.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/23/16


...New Covenant, there is only one Priest, that Priest being Jesus Christ.

I believe there are many people who hold this against a church with Priests.
---David on 3/21/16

Don't hold their own ignorance/blindness against them...just be "unyoked", keeping our distance from this 2nd largest wide way in the world.
Constantine is their romanish political/power beginning. They see him as an Apostle, holding a yearly holiday for him.
Officially Known as the Orthodox Catholic Church.
They are the same family as their universal daughter the rcc.

Mat_7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
---Trav on 3/23/16


Cluny states, "Eastern Orthodox theology IS Christian theology."

Lets do an examination:

Sola Ekklesia (the church alone), Mankind becoming gods (theosis), salvation by works, and apophaticism.

Sir, this is not Christian Theology.
---john9346 on 3/23/16


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For your information, the following is not Christian Theology because Christians teach one must trust in "Christ Alone." for salvation.

"Believe that Christ is in the Church and His grace abides in her. That is why the Church became necessary for salvation and outside the Church there is no remission of sins, no redemption, no justification (being made right with God), and no hope for eternal life."

Grube, Fr. George

The Orthodox Church A to Z
---john on 3/23/16


Eastern Orthodox theology IS Christian theology.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/22/16


If this woman understood eastern orthodox Theology, she would know that it is in direct conflict with Christian Theology.

I feel sorry for this woman because she doesn't know what she believes.

Similar Statements were made by someone on another posting that sated,


"Many of the RCC and Orthodox do believe in Salvation by Grace. They just don't use the same words."

"Both the Orthodox and RCC are Christian churches"
---john9346 on 3/21/16


Nicole_Lacey:

You wrote: She thinks she is a mini god and can determine who goes to heaven or hell

When I was young, I was taught that anyone who wasn't Catholic was going to hell, so the "we're saved but nobody else is" mentality is common among many groups.
---StrongAxe on 3/21/16


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She thinks she is a mini god and can determine who goes to heaven or hell
---Nicole_Lacey on 3/21/16


I find the story not unusual.

What we must remember, is all the differences in denominations are family quarrels.

Please do not read what I am not saying. I am not saying that all denominations are correct, or all religions are correct, or all denominations believe the same thing.

What I am saying is that the true Body of Christ, those who place their faith and trust in Jesus, accept Jesus words on who He is and on who His Father is, all the disagreement over doctrine is in-fighting within the Family of God.

If it did not grieve Jesus and His Father so, I am sure they would get a big laugh out of it.
---Mark_Eaton on 3/21/16


I believe she may have been referring to the Orthodox teacher being called Priest. Under the New Covenant, there is only one Priest, that Priest being Jesus Christ.

I believe there are many people who hold this against a church with Priests. Priesthoods set up with many Priests, like the Levitical Priesthood.

Maybe you can explain your understanding as to why.
---David on 3/21/16


I agree with you, Geraldine. I was using sarcasm. :)
---Press_On on 3/20/16


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"Afterwards, she said, "I don't understand it. He believes the same things I believe, but he's going to hell and I'm not."
Obvious there was some sort of misunderstanding on her part.
---josef on 3/20/16


Our loving God did not create a hell of fire to put some of his created children in.
---Geraldine on 3/20/16


A typical case of worshipping religious dogma, judging (rock throwing) at other believers. Poor, wayward sick souls who just don't get it because "I" or "my church" has it right and "they" (those OTHER GUYS) are on their way to hell on a fast track. Poor deluded fools. But don't worry, WE have our theology correct so we're heaven bound. YIPPEE! (OK, sarcasm over).:)
---Press_On on 3/20/16


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