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Jesus Believed In The Floodd

Did Jesus believe in a six-day Creation and the universal flood of Noah?

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 ---jerry6593 on 4/15/16
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Jerry6593:

You wrote: The core of the issue is that you (and others) make your own decisions of which parts of the Bible you choose to obey or none at all.

And you don't? Do you obey all 600+ of the Laws of Moses? They ARE in the Bible, after all.

That is why you doubt ... the universal flood

I have? When? Where? Please quote me.

I even observe the Sabbath while on a rare vacation.

The very act of taking ANY vacation violates that commandment, because you aren't working on every one of the other six days (by your own interpretation).
---StrongAxe on 5/17/16


/If you feel that it is necessary to worship on Saturday, go ahead. But please give us the same courtesy that we extend to you.\-Monk_Brendan on 5/17/16
Rom 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day [alike]. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:
1Co 8:9 But take heed lest by any means this liberty of yours become a stumblingblock to them that are weak.
1Co 10:31 Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
2Co 3:17, Gal 2:4, 3:all, 5:1
---micha9344 on 5/17/16


Jerry said, "Unhealthy? Jesus wrote "REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY TO KEEP IT HOLY". It seems to me unhealthy to FORGET it. Unless of course you are not a follower of Jesus."

If I were not a Christian, I would tell you what to do with that remark. However...

If you feel that it is necessary to worship on Saturday, go ahead. But please give us the same courtesy that we extend to you.
---Monk_Brendan on 5/17/16


Axster: "This is not deflection, but getting to the very core of the issue, which is, what are we, in fact, commanded to obey?"

Perhaps you're right. The core of the issue is that you (and others) make your own decisions of which parts of the Bible you choose to obey or none at all. That is why you doubt the 6-day Creation and the universal flood (the real core issue of this blog). While I concur that you do indeed have the right to disobey God, I would warn that there is a price to be paid.

And yes, I work 6 days a week and rest on Jesus' Sabbath (the REAL Lord's Day). I even observe the Sabbath while on a rare vacation.



---Jerry6593 on 5/17/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: I see you haven't lost your penchant for deflections. Do you really believe that your silly question about my work habits sanctions your willful violation of God's Law?

This is not deflection, but getting to the very core of the issue, which is, what are we, in fact, commanded to obey?

You have recently been repeatedly saying that we MUST work on the other 6 days, and you condemn others for not doing so meticulously, so it is directly on point to challenge you if you do so yourself (since doing so is impractical). If you do, you must be superhuman. If you don't, you are being hypocritial. Which is it?

I didn't start this diversion onto SDA's favorite argument - YOU did.
---StrongAxe on 5/16/16




/The Hebrews were also afforded holidays, just as we are.
Mat 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.\-Jerry6593 on 5/15/16
-What holidays are you afforded ,Jerry, that are not man made, but God ordained?
-Do you work 312 days a year as the 4th Commandment commands per your understanding?
I think it is a fair question to see how far hypocrisy runs as an SDA ambassador.
Remember: "your willful violation of God's Law?"
BTW, I have answered the question, so no need to shout "deflection."
---micha9344 on 5/16/16


Axester: Glad to see you're feeling better. I see you haven't lost your penchant for deflections. Do you really believe that your silly question about my work habits sanctions your willful violation of God's Law?

Answer the blog question.



---Jerry6593 on 5/16/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: Sure sounds like a COMMAND to me, and located right smack in the middle of the Ten COMMANDMENTS.

So, I'll ask you again. Please tell me, since you believe that, do you obey it? Have you worked six days every week of your life since you came to Christ, without ever taking a vacation, or holiday off, or sick day, or any other excuse? Because if you ever did, even if only once, you're going against your own stated beliefs.

The Hebrews were also afforded holidays, just as we are.

Please show (chapter and verse) where any cultural customs can grant exceptions to any of the ten commandments. Were there also similar exemptions for idolatry, adultery, and murder?
---StrongAxe on 5/15/16


Let's see.

I quote the Bible--and Jeery says I'm spinning.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/15/16


cluny: "If you SEE something, like the Logos/Son did, then you KNOIW [sic] it and not simply believe it."

Spin, spin, spin!

What a laugh! You see the truth from the Bible every day, but you refuse to believe it.




Brendan: "That is not a command"

My Bible says "Six days shalt thou labor". Sure sounds like a COMMAND to me, and located right smack in the middle of the Ten COMMANDMENTS. The Hebrews were also afforded holidays, just as we are.

Mat 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.



---Jerry6593 on 5/15/16




Jerry, the Bible said that "faith is the substance of things not seen."

If you SEE something, like the Logos/Son did, then you KNOIW it and not simply believe it.

And you say you believe the Bible.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/14/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: but also commands work on the other six. Do you normally work on Sundays?

That is not a command "Thou shalt work 6 days out of 7", but rather a blanket permission that one MAY work on those days. Otherwise, everyone who ever takes even a single day of vacation in his life, or gets sick, or retires, or ever misses work for any other reason would be no better than a murderer, adulterer, or idolater. Do YOU work 312 days every single year?

Exodus 30:21 says to wash hands and feet, so that you don't die - yet this NOT a promise of immortality. I have seen bible versions that actually NEED to clarify this, because some people actually interpret such scriptures this way.
---StrongAxe on 5/14/16


cluny: "Jerry, I'm willing to admit that in His HUMAN nature, Jesus believed the Hebrew Scriptures."


No. Jesus believed the Holy Scriptures in His divine as well as His Human nature. He believed because He knew. He was there. He created the week as six work days and one holy day - the Sabbath. He wrote the Ten Commandments Himself. He inspired the Hebrew Scriptures as well as the New Testament.

Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.



---Jerry6593 on 5/14/16


\\Do you normally work on Sundays?
\\

As an organist and choir director--or occasionally both--yes, I worked very hard on Sundays.

And I'm now 65 and on disability.

Actually, the Hebrew word for "keep holy" in the Decalogue does not necessarily mean worship, but simply to keep it differently.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/13/16


Jerry, I'm willing to admit that in His HUMAN nature, Jesus believed the Hebrew Scriptures.

Is that what you're trying to ask?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/13/16


cluny: "Apparently Jerry can NOT give any scripture about which day it is forbidden to worship."

Apparently you can't seem to stay focused on the issue here, but insist on deflecting into nonsense. The Fourth Commandment not only commands the keeping holy (an attitude of worship) only one day - the Sabbath - but also commands work on the other six. Do you normally work on Sundays?


---Jerry6593 on 5/13/16


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Where in the Decalogue is worship commanded on the Sabbath, Samuel?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/12/16


We can worship every day. But we are told to worship and set aside as sanctified the Seventh day Sabbath.

2Corithian 3:6
Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament, not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

When we follow the Spirit of the law we don't break the letter. For when you love others you give to help them and don't steal from them.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 5/12/16


Apparently Jerry can NOT give any scripture about which day it is forbidden to worship.

Christ is risen.
---Cluny on 5/12/16


cluny: "Can anyone give me Scripture about which day we are FORBIDDEN to gather to worship?"

Again with the deflections and the avoidance of the issue, cluny? You make a religion of the things the Bible does not say while vehemently denying that which it enjoins. Here again is the blog question, try to stay focused.

Did Jesus believe in a six-day Creation and the universal flood of Noah?


---Jerry6593 on 5/12/16


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Exo 16:25 And Moses said, Eat that to day, for to day [is] a sabbath unto the LORD: to day ye shall not find it in the field.
Exo 16:29 See, for that the LORD hath given you the Sabbath...
Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
-Israel was to remember the Sabbath that was given to them during the Exodus.
Exo 31:13 ...Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it [is] a sign between me and you throughout your generations...
-It was a sign between Israel and God.
Exo 31:14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore, for it [is] holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death...
- Part of the ministration of death written in stone that was to be done away. 1Co 3:7-9
-A shadow of the Sabbath in Christ.
---micha9344 on 5/11/16


Can anyone give me Scripture about which day we are FORBIDDEN to gather to worship?

Can you, Jerry?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/11/16


Brendan: "Jerry, what is this unhealthy fascination that you have about which day of the week you are called to worship?"

Unhealthy? Jesus wrote "REMEMBER THE SABBATH DAY TO KEEP IT HOLY". It seems to me unhealthy to FORGET it. Unless of course you are not a follower of Jesus.



cluny: You have no points. You always skirt the issue to deflect your animus to Scripture.



---Jerry6593 on 5/11/16


Notice that once more Jerry does not deal with the points I raise except to contemptuously dismiss them.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/10/16


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Jerry said, "cluny: You strain at gnats and swallow camels. Jesus is called many names in Scripture. So what? The issue is that He invented and kept the Seventh-day Sabbath. So why aren't you a follower of Jesus?"

Jerry, what is this unhealthy fascination that you have about which day of the week you are called to worship?

If you feel that it is necessary to worship on Saturday, go ahead. But please give us the same courtesy that we extend to you.

1 Peter 3:15 says, "But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:"
---Monk_Brendan on 5/10/16


cluny: You strain at gnats and swallow camels. Jesus is called many names in Scripture. So what? The issue is that He invented and kept the Seventh-day Sabbath. So why aren't you a follower of Jesus?


---Jerry6593 on 5/10/16


Jerry, the pre-incarnate Logos/Son was not CALLED or KNOWN AS Jesus until His Incarnation.

Please show me anywhere in the OT where He is called this.

Yes, I believe that Jesus is God Incarnate. The Orthodox Church was preaching this centuries before William Miller and the pseudonymous "Midnight Cry."

And you have not yet demonstrated what part of "all" excludes the children in your quote from 1 Corinthians.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/9/16


cluny: "Wrong, Jerry. It was NOT Jesus who did these things."

YOU ARE WRONG!

Jesus did indeed do the things. Don't you believe that Jesus pre-existed Bethlehem? Don't you believe that Jesus IS God. Don't you believe the Bible?



---Jerry6593 on 5/9/16


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Jerry, I can be wrong if and only if there is any part of "all" that excludes children.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/8/16


cluny: Irrelevant! You are still wrong. Man up and admit it.



---Jerry6593 on 5/8/16


\\ Perhaps you should consult the Bible \\

I did. Read Luke 1.

\\1Co 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
1Co 10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat,
1Co 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. \\

Good arguments for infant Baptism and Communion, which Orthodox practice.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/7/16


cluny: "Wrong, Jerry. It was NOT Jesus who did these things."

It is YOU who is wrong, cluny. Perhaps you should consult the Bible instead of your church fathers.

Eph 3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

1Co 10:2 And were all baptized unto Moses in the cloud and in the sea,
1Co 10:3 And did all eat the same spiritual meat,
1Co 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.

Heb 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.


---Jerry6593 on 5/7/16


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Wrong, Jerry. It was NOT Jesus who did these things.

The Eternal Logos/Son was NOT known as Jesus until incarnate in the womb of Mary.

BTW, fyi, Jerry (upper case) and jerry (lower case) are read as two different names by the system here. Just letting you know.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/6/16


Believe
G4100 pisteu & #333,
(book): to have faith(in or upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), i.e. credit, by impl.to entrust (espec. Ones spiritual well being to Christ),- believe(-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.
(online) believe ,commit unto , commit to (one's) trust, be committed unto , be put in trust with , be commit to one's trust , believer .
(Father, into Thy hands I commit) my note
to credit, have confidence, entrust
a faith directed unto, believing or in faith, to give oneself up to
Used of various degrees of faith, from its first beginnings, stirrings within the soul, to full assurance
To believe and embrace what God has made known either through Christ or concerning Christ
---chria9396 on 5/6/16


Jerry, I have no problem believing in Jesus Christ, and I don't have a problem in you wanting to be under the law. That is your problem not mine. I wish you were under grace but I cannot make you change your mine, only God can do that. I don't even try. There is still hope for you, you are still alive. As long as you are alive you might be called by God. Then you will come under grace/
---Luke on 5/6/16


luke: "Jesus is the Truth, and always will be the Truth."

Glad that we can agree on that! Consider:

1) Jesus was the Creator in Eden who established the 6-day work week and the 7th day Sabbath.

2) Jesus was the Rock that followed the Hebrews and taught them the keeping of the 7th-day Sabbath in the lesson of the manna.

3) Jesus wrote "Remember the Sabbath day to keep it holy."

4) Luk 4:16 ... as his custom was, he went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up for to read.

5) Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law

So if Jesus is the truth, why don't you believe Him?

---Jerry6593 on 5/5/16


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Jerry, I notice that every time you bring the subject of the creation it always has to do with the Saturday Day Sabbath. It is really a smoke screen. Probably something you were taught by the SDA's.
Jesus is the Truth, and always will be the Truth. We don't know on whether He believed in a Universal flood or not. People have maybe two opinions of the flood. Jesus only has one.
---Luke on 5/5/16


Thanks Trey and John for actually addressing the blog topic rather than endlessly arguing over a word.


---Jerry6593 on 5/5/16


Jesus did indeed believe in the six day creation and the universal flood of Noah. There is no evidence to suggest that he did not. And there is much evidence to suggest that he did.
---john1944 on 5/4/16


Believe:
H539 aman
(Strongs book form)To build up or support, to foster as a parent or nurse, fig. to render (or be) firm or faithful, to trust or believe, to be permanent or quiet: mor. To be true or certain: to go to the right hand.-hence assurance, belief, bring up, establish, +fail, be faithful, (of long continuance, stedfast, sure, surely, trusty, verified), nurse(-ing father), (put) trust, turn to the right.
(Strongs online) believe, assurance, faithful, sure,
established, trust, verified, stedfast,continuance, father, bring up, nurse, be nursed, surely be, stand fast,
support, confirm, uphold, nourish, be carried, make firm, made firm, lasting, be certain, go to the right hand, be permanent or quiet. cont
---chria9396 on 5/4/16


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Hi Jerry,

Well seeing all scripture is inspired by God and that His word tells us of a 6 day creation and a world wide flood, I believe God believes in both.

In truth I could choose not to believe but that would not change the truth.

Ps 119:160 Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever. (KJV)
---trey on 5/3/16


OK Lets try this another way.

Do YOU really believe in the 6-day fiat Creation and the worldwide flood of Noah as Jesus did, or do you not?



---Jerry6593 on 5/3/16


Giraffes have black tongues.
Believe, disbelieve, or know?
---micha9344 on 5/2/16

Love your dialog here. Only one way to know, first hand.
Having lived as doubting Thomas myself.
To know: 1. Seek the origin or originator, knock on the door and ask.

To Believe: 2. Reinforce what you find with additional proof/witnesses.
Mat_7:7 Ask, it shall be given you, seek, ye shall find, knock, it shall be opened unto you:
Mat_18:16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.
2Ti_2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
---Trav on 5/2/16


I know my toaster turns bread into toast.
Do you believe me?
Do you know?
What I know, I don't have to believe.
Belief is rooted in faith, which is the evidence of things unseen.
Knowledge does not need faith, hence is irrelevant to belief.
Only 4 options: lack of knowledge, disbelief, belief, knowledge.
3 of the 4 require at least some knowledge.
You have either been not told a fact, told it but don't believe it, told it and believe it, or know it to be true.
Giraffes have black tongues.
Believe, disbelieve, or know?
---micha9344 on 5/2/16


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Back to the subject. Jesus believed (because He knew) in the fiat 6-day Creation and the worldwide flood of Noah. I believe Jesus, so I believe what He believed and knew.

To those who don't believe what Jesus believed on these topics, what else that Jesus preached do you not believe?



---Jerry6593 on 5/1/16


Very good Jerry! I "believe" we finally agree on something. Amen! :)

Monk: Evidentiary experience makes it so that you can "know" so you can thereby "believe". Once you've experienced & know, it would be foolish not to believe what you know to be so (true).

It's okay, I don't expect a reply. :)
---Leon on 4/30/16


Leon: Your post is the most rational of all, and strikes at the heart of the matter. There is a huge difference between belief and faith. True faith is evidence-based, as:

Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

It is possible to know that something is false but to believe it anyway (cognitive dissonance). Just look at some of the blog entries on CN. Job says of his knowledge:

Job 19:25 For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth:

His faith/belief was based on knowledge, and since Christ knows Creation is true, He believes it, and since I believe Him, I do too.


---Jerry6593 on 4/30/16


Jerry, your statement, "I know full well the meaning of non-sequitur, I studied Latin as well. But, your insistence that because Jesus experienced Creation and the Flood (and thus knows about them) therefore He cannot believe them does not follow at all. Do you also count as false everything you know to be true?" Is not logical.

I know things that I have learned from the Bible. But I have to have faith in God (which I do, believe it or not) in order to believe that Jesus fed 5,000 people. However, I don't have to believe that the law of gravity is real. I know it.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/29/16


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///We believe because we [don't] have full knowledge...Once I know, I don't need to believe anymore. [?] ...There is a major difference between these next two statements. I believe this is true. I know this is true. I believe the Bible is true, for I don't have complete knowledge of its contents. I take it on faith...---micha9344 on 4/29/16///

Micha: Christians believe (have faith, Heb. 11:1) because God has given us evidence (in creation & His word) to the fact that what He says is absolutely true. We apprehend that bit of knowledge, but we don't comprehend all knowledge. I think that's okay & as it should be. What's important is not that I know everything, but that I know & am known by the One who knows everything.
---Leon on 4/29/16


We believe because we do not have full knowledge. You can call it ignorance if you wish.
Once I know, I don't need to believe anymore.
How about giving an example of belief that knowledge has not replaced?
There is a major difference between these next two statements.
I believe this is true.
I know this is true.
I believe the Bible is true, for I don't have complete knowledge of its contents. I take it on faith in the One who was there, the One who knows and not just believes.
---micha9344 on 4/29/16


\\Do you also count as false everything you know to be true?\\

Only what you claim is true, jeery.

Does God the Father believe or know?

How about God the Holy Spirit?

Then it follows that the Son KNOWS.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/29/16


Brendan: I don't understand why you continue to insist that belief and knowledge are mutually exclusive. They are not. That would imply that belief (or even faith) is possible only in ignorance.

I know full well the meaning of non-sequitur, I studied Latin as well. But, your insistence that because Jesus experienced Creation and the Flood (and thus knows about them) therefore He cannot believe them does not follow at all. Do you also count as false everything you know to be true?



---jerry6593 on 4/29/16


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"With all the verses in the Bible about Jesus and all the verses in the Bible about belief, there must be a verse that says to the effect that Jesus believed." Micha
How one answers might depend on definitions. However, although maybe not stated in such words, is demonstrated in Jesus whole life on earth as a man, one of trusting, believing, faith in the Father. Committed all His ways to Him, words and deeds. Nothing of himself, did and spoke what the Father would have him speak, do. Going to Him in prayer. Committed his spirit,
even unto the end. Absolute trust.
---chria9396 on 4/29/16


///...Where do [you] think Noah lived before the flood?...I saw a TV show saying he lived around [what's] now the Black Sea...---Cluny on 4/24/16///

The Bible says God told A & E to be fruitful & multiply. The Garden was near the Tigris & Euphrates rivers (located geographically near Iraq). Banished Cain went to Nod, a land EAST of Eden. I believe that's the direction mankind chose to migrate in, for about 2,000 years, up to the time of Noah. While the ark wound up near the Black Sea, upon Mt. Ararat, my "guess" is Noah lived somewhere in Assyria. I don't believe the ark traveled far from Noah's homeland, but instead went in circles (like in a sink) as the waters receded from the river basins.
---Leon on 4/28/16


Jerry said, "Jesus EXPERIENCED both Creation and Flood - TRUE

therefore He cannot believe them - FALSE,Jesus EXPERIENCED both Creation and Flood - TRUE

therefore He cannot believe them - FALSE, non-sequitur."


Jerry, A Non sequitur (Latin for "it does not follow"), in formal logic, is an argument with a conclusion that does not follow from its premises. My original statement is not a non sequitur. If you take a cup of boiling hot coffee, and drop it on your lap, you can believe it will hurt. However, once you have experienced the pain, there is the FACT that it hurts, and therefor not just something in which to believe.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/28/16


"Now there are also many other things that Jesus did. Were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written." (John 21:25, ESV)
---Leon on 4/28/16


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\\With all the verses in the Bible about Jesus and all the verses in the Bible about belief, there must be a verse that says to the effect that Jesus believed.
Is there?\\

Nope.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/28/16


Maybe I should expand that question.
Is there anywhere in Scripture that says that any of the Godhead "believes" this or that?
---micha9344 on 4/28/16


With all the verses in the Bible about Jesus and all the verses in the Bible about belief, there must be a verse that says to the effect that Jesus believed.
Is there?
---micha9344 on 4/28/16


//
Jesus EXPERIENCED both Creation and Flood, therefore He cannot believe them. He knows.

---Monk_Brendan on 4/24/16
//

Jesus EXPERIENCED both Creation and Flood - TRUE

therefore He cannot believe them - FALSE, non-sequitur.



cluny: Noah's pre-flood address is about as relevant (and interesting) as the exact date of the flood.



---jerry6593 on 4/27/16


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While this thread is still current, I have a question to ask.

Where do people here think Noah lived before the flood? The Bible certainly does not say.

I saw a TV show saying he lived around what is now the Black Sea.

Any ideas?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/24/16


Jerry said, "As Christians, we are ultimately to follow Christ, to obey Him and to BELIEVE His words. If He mentions fiat Creation and Noah's worldwide flood, we should believe Him, because He KNOWS what he is talking about."

That's what I'm talking about. WE have to believe, because we did not see the act of Creation. We have to believe, because we did not see the Flood.

Jesus EXPERIENCED both Creation and Flood, therefore He cannot believe them. He knows.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/24/16


Brendan: Our point of disagreement is that you do not believe that a person can both know and believe something, whereas I do. Knowledge and belief are not mutually exclusive, and although one may believe something without knowing anything about it (e.g., Evolution and Global Warming), it is possible for him to both know and believe if he would but learn.

As Christians, we are ultimately to follow Christ, to obey Him and to BELIEVE His words. If He mentions fiat Creation and Noah's worldwide flood, we should believe Him, because He KNOWS what he is talking about.



---jerry6593 on 4/23/16


Heb 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
John 16:30 Now are we sure that thou knowest all things, and needest not that any man should ask thee: by this we believe that thou camest forth from God.
John 21:17 ...And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things, thou knowest that I love thee...
-It's hard to see and believe, when One has already seen and knows.
John 20:29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed [are] they that have not seen, and [yet] have believed.
---micha9344 on 4/20/16


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Jerry said, "course Jesus is God. Of course when we know something we also believe it."

Okay, I'm being a bit picky about something. If, while standing on solid ground, you drop a hammer, do you have to believe it will fall to the floor to make it fall? NO! You know it will fall, because one of God's laws is gravity (not expressly stated in Scripture, I know). You know the hammer will fall, and if it hits your foot, you know it will hurt. You know this from experience. Just so, Jesus did not believe in Creation and the flood because He was there.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/19/16


Brendan: "However, not being God, and not having been there, I cannot speak about the accuracy of those accounts, except to say that they are in the Bible."

Of course Jesus is God. Of course when we know something we also believe it. Thus when Christ mentions an Old Testament event or quotes from the OT in the New Testament, we can be certain that it IS true since He is God and He was there. That having been said, when Jesus propounds a fiat Creation and a worldwide flood, why do some alleged Christians instead opt for a gradual self-creation and a series of local floods?


---jerry6593 on 4/19/16


Monk: Yes, Jesus being the Son of God believes exactly what He's always known to be true.

Jerry: Yes, Jesus being the Son of God, He truly knows exactly what He's always believed.
---Leon on 4/18/16


Jerry said, "My point in this blog is to show that Jesus did indeed believe in the Genesis account of Creation and the flood of Noah. And that as Christians, we should not be at odds with Him."

No, Jerry. You're missing my point. Jesus, being God, did not have to BELIEVE. He already knew. He was there at the Creation. He took part in it. He was there at the flood. If you have experienced something, you no longer believe, you know.

Jerry, I believe in the Genesis account of Creation. I believe in the flood. However, not being God, and not having been there, I cannot speak about the accuracy of those accounts, except to say that they are in the Bible.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/18/16


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Jerry, Jesus is God. How can you forget that? Wasn't it you who mentioned that Jesus is an angel, which would mean he doesn't know everything. I believe it was you, Samuel or David, or maybe all of you. Or why would you even ask the question?
---Luke on 4/18/16


\\My point in this blog is to show that Jesus did indeed believe in the Genesis account of Creation and the flood of Noah.\\

In other words, you were not really asking a question, but were making a statement.

Then why didn't you simply make a statement, jeery?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/18/16


Brendan: You're an inspiration to us all. I will also endeavor to be more courteous in these blogs, albeit difficult at times. Hope the suggestions work for your depression, I know that many have been helped thereby.

My point in this blog is to show that Jesus did indeed believe in the Genesis account of Creation and the flood of Noah. And that as Christians, we should not be at odds with Him.



---jerry6593 on 4/18/16


Thank you, Jerry for this: "BTW, I don't think that you've been nearly as obnoxious on CN as some. And as for your depression, I would suggest increased exercise, sunlight and reduction in the amount of animal products consumed (see Gen 1:29)."

I'm trying really hard not to be nasty on these blogs.

As far as your suggestions, thank you, and I will take them under advisement.
---Monk_Brendan on 4/17/16


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\\I would suggest increased exercise, sunlight and reduction in the amount of animal products consumed (see Gen 1:29).
\\

If the Orthodox fasts and abstinence are kept at their traditional level, a large part of the ,year is vegan.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 4/17/16


Monk Brendan: I know He knew. He was there. He was the Creator. He was also the God of the Hebrew Exodus. But many Christians don't know that Jesus pre-existed the Babe of Bethlehem. As Christians, I believe that we are to follow the doctrine and example of Jesus exclusively - not spurious doctrines that arose after his ascension.

BTW, I don't think that you've been nearly as obnoxious on CN as some. And as for your depression, I would suggest increased exercise, sunlight and reduction in the amount of animal products consumed (see Gen 1:29).



---jerry6593 on 4/17/16


Gee, Jerry, it doesn't look like anyone is willing to bite on this one. I did reply, but my answer was moderated.

BTW, Jesus didn't have to believe in anything. He knew! He is God!
---Monk_Brendan on 4/16/16


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