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 ---Leon on 5/8/16
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Nicole: "Jesus is speaking singular 'him' on the last day."

No, He is not. The pronoun "him" in this case is used in a generic sense as seen by the context of EVERY ONE in the verse in questions.

Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that EVERY ONE which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

And since the context is generic, the LAST DAY is also a singular event applicable to ALL of Christ's followers, and not a different day for each one. Such an application as you suggest does a disservice to the English language, to the gospel, and to the credibility of our Lord.

Now, explain Martha's remarks.

---Jerry6593 on 7/22/16


Nicole, I don't buy your last day argument. Check out Martha's discussion with Jesus at Lazarus' tomb.---Jerry6593 on 7/21/16

No jumping around. We can discuss Martha later, but now lets focus on Jesus' Word YOU GAVE JUST FOR ME, remember?

Nicole: Just for you:
Joh 6:40...and I will raise him up at the last day. ---Jerry6593 on 7/20/16

Moses and Elijah are walking around and talking as in the Bible. So they have been risen on their last day, but before your term of a last day.

Jesus is speaking singular 'him' on the last day.

If he has another day on earth it isn't the last day for him.

Last day is speaking about earthly time. Once you die there isn't any time in Heaven for it to be the last day.
---Nicole_Lacey on 7/21/16


Nicole,

I don't buy your last day argument. Check out Martha's discussion with Jesus at Lazarus' tomb. She clearly did not think that the last day meant today, but rather far in the future at the resurrection. Besides, if there is a tomorrow, then today is not the last day.


---Jerry6593 on 7/21/16


And your point, Jerry?

//Nicole: Just for you:
John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.---Jerry6593 on 7/20/16

When you die on earth we call it the last day of your life.

Your last day on earth is even marked on your tomb stone. Usually your birth date is listed if known.

But the last day is always marked for most people.

Jesus will raised him up on the last day. (SINGULAR)

Note, Jesus DIDN'T say 'I will raise him up on judgment day.'


---Nicole_Lacey on 7/20/16


Nicole: Just for you:

Joh 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.


---Jerry6593 on 7/20/16




Jerry://Several people in the Bible were raised from the dead.//

Are you claiming those people rose from the dead WITHOUT help like Jesus?
When being raised from the dead, the word resurrection is applied to Jesus and no one ELSE

Jerry://You claim that people do not die, and thus need no resurrection.//

I never said or claimed that! SHAME ON YOU!

I gave a direct quote of Jesus that people in Heaven NOW are not dead but ALIVE!

Why then does Jesus say that He will wait until THE LAST DAY to bring us back to life? Is He lying?---Jerry6593

Jesus never lie and you didn't use a direct quote of Jesus so you can twist His words. He didn't say that?
Please give the verse from the Bible you are citing from.
---Nicole_Lacey on 7/18/16


Nicole: "(ONLY JESUS was RESURRECTED! A term meaning no one assisted."

According to Webster, "resurrected" means brought back from the dead. What you mean to say is "self-resurrected". Several people in the Bible were raised from the dead.

"Are you claiming Samuel is a demon?"

No, I'm claiming that what a witch conjured was an image produced by a demon.

1Sam 28:14 ... And Saul PERCEIVED that it was Samuel

Are you claiming that necromancy is a legitimate source of information for Christians?

You claim that people do not die, and thus need no resurrection. Why then does Jesus say that He will wait until THE LAST DAY to bring us back to life? Is He lying?
---Jerry6593 on 7/18/16


Elijah..He was taken to heaven
(So you acknowledge Elijah is in heaven. He still came back with Moses who did DIE talking)

Moses died and was resurrected. (ONLY JESUS was RESURRECTED! A term meaning no one assisted. Cite anyone else with the word resurrection)

Samuel died and was impersonated by a demon (Are you claiming Samuel is a demon? The Bible states it was Samuel. So cite Scripture stating he is a demon?)

Are you claiming that the Bible is in error as in Ecc 9:5,6?---Jerry6593

No! Are you claiming Jesus is wrong? Mat 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

Is Jesus mistaken? HE forgot about Ecc 9:5,6?
---Nicole_Lacey on 7/16/16


Some people travel very long distances to attend their church. It would be impossible for those people to attend as often as you might be suggesting they should UNLESS you assume that everyone drives a car and has no commitments. Maybe they do where you live but all our congregation, except for 5, walk to church. No buses run either. Other days of the week they work, have school children to walk to and from school etc.

The church which I attend is open for specific meetings on 'some' days. One evening is for men only, one for youth club and one is a coffee morning to which we invite local people and hope it encourages them to attend services also. Other times it is closed.

How often is your church open Leon?
---Rita_H on 7/17/16


Nicole: "They spoke after their death on earth."

To clarify:

Elijah never died. He was taken to heaven alive in a fiery chariot.

Moses died and was resurrected.

Samuel died and was impersonated by a demon to a witch.

Are you claiming that the Bible is in error as in Ecc 9:5,6?



---Jerry6593 on 7/16/16




Praise the Lord! Well,it is my heart felt opinion we need the Lord we can't do nothing without him,no matter even.if we think we can carry on ...every day is a blessing I had. Terrible fire take all my worldly possessions but thank God he left me better off now I.know I will praise God he took care of us,we alive I.plan to be in the house of the Lord every chance I get no matter what...I owe him big time ijn.
---Elena_95555 on 7/15/16


Don't forget the Divine Office(Liturgy of the Hours), Nicole. That's worship, too.--Cluny

Indubitably, thanks

Ecc 9:5,6 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward, for the memory of them is forgotten..---Jerry6593

Soooooo, Samuel, Moses and Elijah never died???

They spoke after their death on earth.

1Samuel 28:11-15
And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground and bowed down. Now Samuel said to Saul, Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?

Matthew 17:3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.

Please don't claim it wasn't Samuel, Moses or Elijah speaking.
---Nicole_Lacey on 7/14/16


\\Worship is only in the form of HOLY MASS\\

Don't forget the Divine Office (Liturgy of the Hours), Nicole.

That's worship, too.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 7/13/16


Nicole: Thanks for your responses. It seems that you and Brendan have different views of the priest's role. If not just the service leader, then what else is the priest?

You are wrong, our Pastors are indeed ordained.

You said: "I rather trust them to plead to Jesus for me than my next door neighbor." Why can't you plead to Jesus directly? After all, Mary and the Saints are dead, and:

Ecc 9:5,6 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished, neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun.

---Jerry6593 on 7/13/16


I would still like an answer as to whether you feel a human mediator is required in worship---Jerry6593 6/1/16

Sorry, I just now saw your question.

You are asking the question wrongly, or a trick on your part to confuse others.
We do NOT WORSHIP MARY.
Worship is only in the form of HOLY MASS

Are you worshipping your Pastor/Friend/Neighbor when you used him or her as your human mediator? Of course not.

You are communicating with them to please pray for you. You went to Jesus and asked others to be a mediator between you and Jesus.

Not you and God the Father because JESUS is the ONLY MEDIATOR BETWEEN GOD AND YOU.

The same with me. You are not better than me. Jesus is my mediator between God and me.
---Nicole_Lacey on 7/12/16


Jerry6593, sorry, but I never said my Priest leads worship service as your Pastor. Your Pastor isn't ORDAINED.

I go do daily Mass because I believe Jesus at His Words in the Gospel of John Chapter 6.

You can watch your Pastor on TV with no difference from face to face.

I can't partake of Jesus' Body and Blood by watching TV. I have to be within the state of Grace and be at Church to receive Jesus in the form of Bread and Wine.

Yes, Mary, Saints and Angels in Heaven intercedes to Jesus for me.

I rather trust them to plead to Jesus for me than my next door neighbor.

Jerry, why do you ask your friend or your Pastor to pray for you?

Can't you go to Jesus yourself?
---Nicole_Lacey on 7/11/16


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Brendan & Nicole: If I understand you correctly, you are saying that your Priest is just a man, quoting scripture and leading the worship service - as would my Pastor. But what about Mary and the Saints? Do you think that they intercede for you?



---Jerry6593 on 7/10/16


Jerry said, "I would still like an answer as to whether you feel a human mediator is required in worship."

Yes and No. Jesus was a human being as well as God, and we do need Him to be our mediator.

However, no, we don't need a human being to mediate our worship.

But when a priest is celebrating Mass, he is standing in persona Christi, meaning that he is saying the words of Jesus aloud so that all may follow along in the corporate (Note, I say corporate and not individual) worship.

Do I need a priest to lift my individual prayers to God? NO! Do I need a priest to individually worship God? NO!
---Monk_Brendan on 7/9/16


Nicole: Peace be unto you as well.

I would still like an answer as to whether you feel a human mediator is required in worship.



---Jerry6593 on 6/1/16


I don't believe one needs to be in church every day to worship God. I don't think we need a human mediator to talk to God. Do you?---Jerry6593

You are suppose to pray all day in silent and out loud. Keeping Jesus with you always in varies forms of prayer.

Your blog suggested once a week to go to Church in a communion setting with your community was too much.

God in Exodus is telling the Jewish people the minimum not the maximum in servicing God.

If you are happy with weekly praising God with your Community, okay. Go in peace.

As for me, I am happy servicing God daily in a Community setting as in ACTS along with my other daily prayers.

It's my right. I shall take advance of it.

Peace.
---Nicole_Lacey on 5/31/16


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Nicole: "Does going to a church service on a week day--or week night--keep you from working that day?"

I quoted Exo 20:9. Please address your questions to the Author of that quote.

As for me, I spend 1 1/2 hours each morning reading scripture and studying religious topics. I also spend part of the work day in prayer, etc. as I work. But I only go to church on Sabbath and sometimes Wed. night prayer meeting.

I don't believe one needs to be in church every day to worship God. I don't think we need a human mediator to talk to God. Do you?


---Jerry6593 on 5/31/16


Cluny, yes we do.

Jerry, don't you take a lunch break?

So we take a lunch break but we can't take a break for God?

Do we work for God or ourself?

My Church offers many schedules Masses daily to fit into my work schedule.
Some offered even during lunch breaks.

Personally I like to eat.
So I go during the 6 am hour before work.

There's 24 hrs in a day, so I think I can still work 6 days a week.
BTW I only work 5 days a week.

We can give Jesus one hour.
Matthew 26:40 & Mark 14:37
---Nicole_Lacey on 5/30/16


\\Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
\\

Does going to a church service on a week day--or week night--keep you from working that day?

Please answer yes or no, and prove it from the Bible.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/30/16


Nicole, did you know that the Greek is "ton arton imon ton EPIOUSION"?

The Bread that is above essence.

We know what that is, don't we?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/30/16


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Nicole: "Why not go to Church every day?"

Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:



---Jerry6593 on 5/30/16


Yes, as Jesus taught us how to pray. ".... give us this day our daily bread.."

Fulfilled in Daily Mass.
Everyday.

We eat everyday.

Why not go to Church every day?
---Nicole_Lacey on 5/29/16


Genesis 2:2,3

And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made, and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

The word Sanctified means to set apart for holy use. If it only meant that one day then it wouldn't work. Also in Exodus 20 it states that the reason to keep the Sabbath is it foundation in Creation.

If you don't believe me look up the word Sanctified.

agape
---Samuelbb7 on 5/29/16


Michael: Sorry, but your response makes no sense to me. You claimed that the Sabbath day did not exist until Moses, so I asked if you believe that Moses invented the week as well. Care to try to answer again?


---Jerry6593 on 5/29/16


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Jerry6593:

You wrote: Michael & Axster: Are you guys really suggesting that Moses invented the 7-day week? This, even though God Himself wrote that He did it at Creation? Why do you fight so hard against God's Word?

God rested on the very first Sabbath. There is no indication in Genesis that he did so on day 14, or 21, and so on, and there is no indication in Genesis that he established a command for man to do likewise. There is no indication that Abraham observed the Sabbath. The very first mention of weekly sabbath observance is in the law of Moses.

You can read between the lines all you want, and believe all you want - but that is not sufficient evidence to force such beliefs on others.
---StrongAxe on 5/29/16


/Are you guys really suggesting that Moses invented the 7-day week?\=Jerry6593 on 5/28/16
So the answer to my questions are: No, SDA's can't find that in scripture, and you talk about deflection.
Ex 16 is very clear about Who created the 7day week, how it was to be maintained, and when the command was instituted, but blindness prevails.
/Why do you fight so hard against God's Word?\
Such ignorant questions coming from a supposed man of God. We could ask the same of you.
Acts 15:24 Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, [Ye must] be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no [such] commandment:
---micha9344 on 5/28/16


Michael & Axster: Are you guys really suggesting that Moses invented the 7-day week? This, even though God Himself wrote that He did it at Creation? Why do you fight so hard against God's Word?



---Jerry6593 on 5/28/16


Nah, no justification, just revealing the blindness that still exists today, from a 19th c false prophetess.
Ex 20, remember the Sabbath. They can only remember something that was given to them.
Ex 16 is where it was given to them. There is no indication whatsoever of anyone observing the Sabbath prior since it was not established until Ex 16.
Showing an example of something, in any timeframe especially God's, doesn't mean the command was established then.
Ok, you're all about scripture, Jerry. Can you show where anyone prior to Exodus kept the weekly Sabbath?
Or, for that matter, used the 7-day week to separate time?
I'm sure there must be something we're missing.
Show us what your prophetess has seen that we have missed.
---micha9344 on 5/27/16


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Thank you Monk for doing research. I commend you. But you missed where I had listed earlier.

Matthew Henry commentary on Leviticus 23.

Zonderan bible pictorial dictionary on Sabbath.

They are from my Home Library. The blue letter Bible is a website that offers various copies and commentaries on the Bible.

I looked it up also in my Smith's Bible dictionary and it confirms Leviticus 23:1-3 is about the Seventh day Sabbath.

I did not use any Seventh day Adventist source to show this.

The New International Study Bible puts the Passage under the heading the Sabbath.

Have you found a source that disagrees?

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 5/27/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: Do you have any idea how contorted your mental gymnastics sound? How can one remember something that never existed? The Sabbath Day was called the Seventh Day in Genesis, but it was still the same day of rest. It appears that you are desperately seeking justification for your willful violation of God's Law.

Genesis said that "God rested" on the seventh day. It mentions no command for man to rest, or the animals, nor anyone else. Millenia pass, including the antideluvians, the Flood, the division of nations after Nimrod, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and the exile into Egypt, and observing the Sabbath is not mentioned even ONCE during all that time. Not until Moses is it mentioned.
---StrongAxe on 5/27/16


Michael: "The Sabbath isn't even mentioned until Exodus 16.
This is when it was established.
Exodus 20 responds with "remember" it, and uses creation week as an example."


Do you have any idea how contorted your mental gymnastics sound? How can one remember something that never existed? The Sabbath Day was called the Seventh Day in Genesis, but it was still the same day of rest. It appears that you are desperately seeking justification for your willful violation of God's Law.


---Jerry6593 on 5/27/16


Samuel BB said, "David Guzik Study Guide for Leviticus
The Feasts of the LORD
1. (1-3) The Sabbath.
b. The seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest: The Sabbath was not properly a feast, but like the feast days, it was a day set apart unto the LORD, ...
Jamieson, Fausset & Brown Commentary on Leviticus 23
3.
Nave's Topical Bible Sabbath
Hitchcock's Topical Analysis of the Holy Bible the Seventh day."


First of all, Samuel, these are hardly non-biased. Two of the commentaries talk about the Blue Letter Version of the Bible, and both of the refer to the same web site. You may use one, but you have to find two others from mainline Protestant sources that say the same thing.
---Monk_Brendan on 5/26/16


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You, SDA's talk about words not being in scripture.
The Sabbath isn't even mentioned until Exodus 16.
This is when it was established.
Exodus 20 responds with "remember" it, and uses creation week as an example.
God, knowing all, set the example millenia before the command was given, both to obey it and remember it.
This is also part of the ministration of death written in stone that is to be done away. 2Cor 3:7
It is also part of the schoolmaster that those in Christ no longer need. Gal 3:24-25
Our rest is not in a day, by the letter, for the letter kills, but in Christ, for the Spirit gives life. 2Co 3:6, Heb 4
---micha9344 on 5/26/16


Axster: "You wrote: Christ established the Sabbath in the garden of Eden.

No, ...."

Did you not know that Jesus was indeed our Creator God?

Joh 1:3 All things were made by him, and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Joh 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

1Co 8:6 .... one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth ... all things were created by him, and for him:

Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds,


---Jerry6593 on 5/26/16


David Guzik Study Guide for Leviticus 23
The Feasts of the LORD
A. Listing of the Feasts.

1. (1-3) The Sabbath.

b. The seventh day is a Sabbath of solemn rest: The Sabbath was not properly a feast, but like the feast days, it was a day set apart unto the LORD, ...

Jamieson, Fausset & Brown Commentary on Leviticus 23
3. Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest--(See on JF & B for Ex 20:8). The Sabbath has the precedence given to it, and it was to be "a holy convocation...

Nave's Topical Bible Sabbath

Gen 2:2, 3, Lev 23,

Hitchcock's Topical Analysis of the Holy Bible the Seventh day.



Sabbath: Lev 23, 25, 26:34, 35
---Samuelbb7 on 5/25/16


\\The words festial week is not in there. \\

What part of "feast of the Lord" does not mean "festal"?

While the actually words "festal week" are not used in Leviticus, KJV, this is clearly what is being described.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/25/16


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Well I posted 7 of them last night. But I must have missed up some where

2 of them were:

Matthew Henry commentary on Leviticus 23.

Zonderan bible pictorial dictionary on Sabbath.

Please read the passage again. The words festial week is not in there.

The rest of the passage is about those.

When I get home I will post more.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/25/16


\\I can find only Biblical experts that agree with me. They come from many denominations and times.\\

Who are these Biblical experts that agree with you, Samuel? Give their names and denominations, please.

I'm simply going by what the Bible itself says--the same thing Jerry claims he does.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/24/16


Yes Cluny you have. But. I can find only Biblical experts that agree with me. They come from many denominations and times.

They all agree with me. You have not provided a single source that agree with you. Nor have you shown why you're correct.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/24/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: Christ established the Sabbath in the garden of Eden.

No, GOD established it in the garden of Eden. The two are not equivalent. Yes, Jesus is God, but God is not Jesus ("is" is not a bidirectional relationship) in the same way that Washington was president and Lincoln was president, but Washington was not Lincoln.

The Son didn't send the Father down to the Holy Spirit's baptism and say "This is my spirit in whom I am well pleased". the Holy Spirit didn't sweat blood and say "Son, take this cup away from me". The Father was not crucified.

Why would a Christian not want to follow Christ?

When have I ever said one should NOT worship on the Sabbath?
---StrongAxe on 5/24/16


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Here are the opening verses of Leviticus 23, KJV:

++And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, Concerning the feasts of the Lord, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are my feasts.

3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation, ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the Lord in all your dwellings.++

The "seventh day" of the festal week is a sabbath. The verse is NOT talking about the weekly Sabbath.

I've pointed this out before, Samuel.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/24/16


Strong ax I was stating a fact. Not condemning or judging people.

The Bible specifically speaks of the Sabbath as a day of worship. Leviticus 23:1.

The teaching of Jesus on Sabbath and his habitual practice of worshipping in the Synagogue on Sabbath. These were written in the Gospels to the church 20 years after the crucifixion.

We are to worship GOD everyday and our lives should be daily dedicated to him.

Isaiah 58:13

If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day, and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honourable, and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
---Samuelbb7 on 5/23/16


Axster: You claim to be a Christian. A Christian follows Christ.

Christ established the Sabbath in the garden of Eden. He showed its importance in the lesson of the manna. He wrote about it in stone on Mt. Sinai. He confirmed the Sabbath by His example in the New Testament. He intends that we keep it in the earth made new (Isa 66:23).

Why would a Christian not want to follow Christ?



---Jerry6593 on 5/24/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: Exo 20:8-11...

Cluny never disputed this. This does not mention worship, or what "keep holy" means. He (and I) only object to your reading between the lines and claiming what God didn't actually write is God's Word.

I didn't say anything. Those were God's words - not mine.

And just which of those words FORBIDS worship on other days?



Samuelbb7 wrote: Many today don't keep any kind of Sabbath.

So what? If you condemn anyone for doing this, you run afoul of what Paul wrote.

But there is no command in the Bible to keep any other day but the Seventh day Sabbath.

And no command to NOT worship on any day either.
---StrongAxe on 5/23/16


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\\The Bible does not speak of the first day as a day of worship.\\

Nor does the Fourth Commandment speak of Saturday as a day of worship, either.

This is the point I'm trying to make to Jerry.

\\Jesus talked about how to keep Sabbath in the Gospels.\\

BCV from he Gospels, please.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/23/16


Axster: "He's not arguing with God. He's arguing with you"

See if you can follow:

Exo 20:8-10 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God:
---Jerry6593 on 5/19/16

"Jerry, I hope you're not saying the commandment forbids services on other days."

I didn't say anything. Those were God's words - not mine.
---Jerry on 5/20/16

cluny: Why do you continue to argue with God? What do you think He is trying to tell you in the Decalogue?
---Jerry6593 on 5/21/16

Now if he's arguing with God's words and not mine, how is it that you think he is arguing with me and not God?

---Jerry6593 on 5/23/16


Strong Ax.

Good question. The next verse in 1 Colossians 2:16,17 says.

Which are a shadow of things to come, but the body is of Christ.

I do believe it is true we are not to judge how a person keeps the Seventh day Sabbath. But the Sabbath was not a shadow of things to come. It was a memorial of creation. Now Hebrews 4 does point to heaven.

Many today don't keep any kind of Sabbath. But there is no command in the Bible to keep any other day but the Seventh day Sabbath.

The Bible does not speak of the first day as a day of worship.

Jesus talked about how to keep Sabbath in the Gospels. Why would that be important if they were not keeping the Sabbath when the Gospels were written?

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 5/22/16


Samuelbb7:

You wrote: But the main emphasis in that Passage is the other Sabbaths not the weekly one.

This cannot be the case. Paul says not to let others judge us in food, or holy days, or sabbaths.

If sabbaths mean normal sabbaths (as I contend), this makes perfect sense.

If sabbaths mean "special holy day sabbaths" (as you contend), this does not. Why would Paul say not to let others judge us in food, holy days or holy days? Why would he repeat himself twice in the same sentence? The very fact that he mentions them separately means he's talking about two different things.
---StrongAxe on 5/22/16


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Jerry, please give the EXACT passage from the Decalogue that requires worship on the Saturday Sabbath.

I see an enforced rest from labor that extended even to one's slaves and farm animals, but nothing about worship.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/21/16


The Bible does not just speak on the Sabbath in the Decalogue. In Leviticus 23:1-3 it states the Seventh day Sabbath is to be a holy convocation.

Then we have the words of Jesus and his actions on what the Sabbath is about. He worshipped with others on Sabbath and said we are to do good on Sabbath.

I am often judged as not a Christian because I keep Sabbath. So the passage from Paul does not say don't keep Sabbath. But don't judge how others keep it.

But the main emphasis in that Passage is the other Sabbaths not the weekly one. Since it is the other Sabbaths that pointed to the first coming. So we recognize that Sabbath is used for more then the weekly Sabbath.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/22/16


Jerry6593:

You wrote: cluny: Why do you continue to argue with God? What do you think He is trying to tell you in the Decalogue?

He's not arguing with God. He's arguing with you, and as far as I know, you're not God.

Since the Decalogue doesn't explicitly say what "keeping holy" actually means, one must read between the lines. He's just reading different things between the lines than you do.

You also have varied ways to interpret the Bible. You insist that the decalogue means exactly what it says word for word, yet you insist exactly the opposite when Paul says we should not allow one to judge us with respect to sabbaths. Why is that?
---StrongAxe on 5/21/16


cluny: Why do you continue to argue with God? What do you think He is trying to tell you in the Decalogue?



---Jerry6593 on 5/21/16


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Jerry6593 quoted Exodus 20:8,9,10.

I don't see the word "assemble" mentioned in any of them.

michael_e wrote: If so many in the church have this level of expertise, then why are so many ignorant about how to rightly divide the Bible?

As the cliche goes, going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than living in a garage makes you a car. Many go to church and turn off their brains, absorbing any pablum the preacher spits out, without critically examining it like the Bereans did.
---StrongAxe on 5/20/16


Samuel, do you think "keep holy" means "have services"?

There's nothing in the Decalogue to imply that.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/20/16


"Jerry, I hope you're not saying the commandment forbids services on other days."

I didn't say anything. Those were God's words - not mine.



---Jerry on 5/20/16


Correct there can be services on other days. But when GOD says to keep Holy one day. Men should not use their traditions to tell him no.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/19/16


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Jerry, I hope you're not saying the commandment forbids services on other days.

There were services twice daily in the Tabernacle, Temple, and to this day in traditional synagogues.

Or did you know that?

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/19/16


Exo 20:8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
Exo 20:9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
Exo 20:10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God:



---Jerry6593 on 5/19/16


No. Going to church is something a Christian should try to do. But it does not mean every time the door is open. Of course if you can that's fine. But there are some people who may not be able to get to church at all. So wherever you may pray the Lord Jesus Christ will be with you.
---Lee on 5/18/16


Colleges require a certain number of credits(was 120) to graduate with a bachelors degree, which should give you useful level of knowledge in a particular field of study.
If churches operated on this system, members who attended faithfully over their life would receive three Ph.Ds and a Masters degree in the Bible.
Even those who did not attend all the weekly church meetings would receive a few Masters degrees.
If so many in the church have this level of expertise, then why are so many ignorant about how to rightly divide the Bible?
I have a hunch it may be for the same reason and that 2 Tim 3:7 has something to do with it.
---michael_e on 5/12/16


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michael, I see that those churches are dispensationalist, pre-trib, and damnationalist. Thanks anyway for the referrals.
---john1944 on 5/10/16


Michael_e, you can also add to the list the Berean Bible Church of Denver!
---Rob on 5/9/16


John1944
A few,
Faith Bible Church: Chicago
Shorewood Bible Church: Chicago
Berean Bible Church of South Bend
Grace Bible Church: Ft. Wayne
Grace Church: Indianapolis
---michael_e on 5/9/16


\\Study Christ according to the revelation of the mystery\\ sounds like pseudo-Biblical evangelical jargon to me--what Jerry would call "psychobabble."

But I can assure you that in the Eastern Orthodox Churches, the worship is offered as is pleasing to the Lord, and the pure Word of God is preached without fear or favor.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/9/16


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michael, can you give the names of some properly functioning assemblies that study Christ according to the revelation of the mystery?
---john1944 on 5/9/16


We are the church.
God doesn't require that we attend church to gain favor with Him. He does command us to study His word. The best place to learn sound doctrine is studying in a congregation of saints of a properly functioning assembly, that studies Christ according to the revelation of the mystery.
God has providentially provided the Word of God for us today. Open your Bible and start studying daily.
---michael_e on 5/9/16


Leon, yes, my morning hour of devotional time is vital.
---john1944 on 5/9/16


John: Heb. 10:25 says we're not to forsake assembling together, but Scripture doesn't say how often we should assemble together whether it be daily or on any other timetable of frequency. Jesus said where two or more are gathered together in His name then He would be with them. (Matt. 18:20) I believe whereas it's practical & possible for some to come to daily church services, many others can & do have difficulties in doing so because of family, work, etc., obligations. However, I do believe in the necessity of Christians having a daily personal devotional.
---Leon on 5/8/16


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God does not require that much participation. Most worship daily away from the building.

Only the 7th day is considered holy.

God permits us to choose our own day of Sabbath. Col 2:16
---aservant on 5/9/16


Leon, is there anything in the NT specifying frequency of attendance?
---john1944 on 5/8/16


There are some Christians, mostly of the pre-Reformation Churches, who do go daily.

Of course, monasteries have always had services several times a day.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/8/16


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