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Should Pastor Know What You Give

Molly, I am sorry that the church you attend is not reflecting Christ's attitude. Frankly, the church ought to be giving to you to help you out. In New Testament times, giving was for the believers who needed help financially. The ones who had helped the ones who needed. Try to focus on a personal relationship with Christ. The institutional church doesn't necessarily reflect Christ-like attitudes. I don't want to encourage a poor attitude toward the institutional church, however, when they are wrong, they are wrong, and people need to know it. The institutional church you attend is wrong, very wrong, in this matter.

Read Revolution Book
	I agree Donna, It's kinda like, am I saved to something (Christ), or am I saved from something? So I am not misunderstood, yes, we are saved from sin, but more importantly, I focus on Christ rather than focusing on what I am saved from. In the same way, do I "leave" the institutional church, or do I seek spiritual growth and fellowship at a home church?

Belief In Dispensationism
	Thanks Samuel for the observation. I was thinking the same thing, but it seems some people just want to fight about details. Rather than living "Christ in me," some seem to want to fight about the details.

Read Revolution Book

Dru,I am not surprised of the suggested trend, but I am surprised at the data of almost 7% of the total population of America are departing the institutional church. Along the same thinking, I am reading a book "reimagining the church" by Frank Viola, who says that he has been attending and involved in, what he calls the "organic church" for 20 years. I don't know where all these people are if they are at "home churches." I don't hear about them. 20 million people are a lot of people. Outward appearences appear like people are going to Mega churches instead of local smaller churches. Interesting data...frankly, I hope George's data is true.

Show Me The Rapture Scriptures
	When I was just about to give up on common sense and right thinking, Mark E and alan post great concepts. Thanks for sharing. Sound like a great Bible Study Mark E when the truth can come out.

Read Revolution Book
	I haven't read this book by George Barna, but I am reading a book, Pagan Christianity, that he co-authored with Frank Viola. I assume this book would have a similar thread. I am half way through the book, Pagan Christianity, and highly recommend it, if for no other reason so one has another perspective of the institutional church and christianity.

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas

Cluny, I am not sure what you are referring to. Apparently I didn't explain myself well. I am not joining up with any "remnant." What you asked was my same observation/question in a previous reply of mine to this issue, and that is as you ask, "And are you assuming that others who don't want to join up with you are not committed followers of Christ?" I agree with your question. I was trying to be optimistic that the folks who want to get together (remnant) are looking for committed believes, and nothing more. I do suggest that many people who go to "church" are not very committed to Christ. Althought, that's God's business, not mine.

Did Jesus Break The Ten

alan, that's what I get for not reading all the posts in order. One person misquotes another person, but quotes it as if that person quoted it. It gets confusing. Sorry for any confusion. I'll be more careful next time. Looking back at some of the previous posts in this blog, I am not sure what was said or meant to be said. Also, many times, perhaps for the need of brevity, people are misunderstood.

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas
	Great example Strongaxe. Hopefully, the orignal goal of the remenant getting together with other committed believers was the ultimate aim without meaning to insult other follows of Christ.

Holy Spirit Tingles Inside

I'm with Trish (11/17). mima, I respect your passion and apparent commitment to Christ. However, by way of caution, believers are to do their good deeds in private. I see a bit of broadcasting of yours. If some stranger was talking to one of my kids (under 16 or so) about religion, they'd probable get more than just a raised eyebrow. That's my problem with "youth ministries," parents leaving their kids with someone else. Don't misunderstand me, there is a place for youth ministries. Many youths don't have a godly home, and if those parents let the kids go to youth ministry, great.

Did Jesus Break The Ten

mima, I know alan is more than capable for answering for himself, however, I see a disconnect between what you said he said, and your response to what he said. His quote that you quoted was correct. I think mima you're are coming from an intellectual/mental approach. Yes christians sin and are forgiven, and yes believers will recieve rewards for their behavior in Christ. Believers behavior should be an outgrowth of their walk with Christ.

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas

MarkV, I hope you are right. I started off hoping for the best,however Dru's last description seemed different than his first, which was confusing. I agree with the concept, and maybe Dru is saying the same thing I have been trying to communicate. And that is, I pick on the "pastor and the institutionalized church" because it pacifies the masses, which creates the "low level of commitment." That's why I suggested different wording, "Perhaps looking for people who are committed to Christ and are not confortable being a spectator." Maybe I am dicing words. I too am looking for those people who have given their lives to Christ without reservation.

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas

Dru, you are now describing better what you were apparently trying to describe, but that's not what you said. If you had said that you were looking for who have a very high commitment level wanting to find other people like that, that would have been easier to understand. However, you seem to have a chip on your shoulder pointing the finger at others thinking they think they are better than your group, when you are doing the same thing you accuse others of. How do you know others' level of commitment to Christ? Based on if they had a high level of commitment, they would be part of your group? Who is saying they agree with the status quo?!!

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas

Dru, I am sorry if I am missing understanding the term "remnant," and you seem quite set on it. It comes across as if a person is not the "type" of person that remnant resonates with, then that person isn't quite the "remnant" and won't belong and probably isn't committed to Christ. I hope I am missunderstanding, but this comes across quite elitist. If you are looking for people who are struggling to grow in the institutional church, that may be another issue. Perhaps looking for people who are committed to Christ and are not confortable being a spectator. umm. Something seems off.

Belief In Dispensationism

Ralph, I don't want to split hairs, and I don't want to be misunderstood. (1) God's character has always been a God of Grace. I didn't say anyone got saved by Grace. I'm not sure where your rebuttal came from. I would also suggest man has always been saved by faith. Abraham for example. (2) Paul called the Mystery (Rom 11:24-25) the Gentiles being grafted in. There's also the Mystery of Christ and the Church (relationship). Part of that is "Christ in you, the hope of glory." Paul called it a Mystery, it wasn't understood. The OT convenant and now we are in the New Convenant, which wasn't understood, though foretold. I also suggest dispensations causes hair splitting.

Why Are Pastors Having Affairs

mima, however, when one reads that passage, do they read into that passage the picture of the modern "pastor?" There are overseers, not the "one senior pastor." Interesting how that one verse gets translated into the modern justification for the one person who is answerable to God for all the laity. That one verse seems to justify the "pastor" as an intermediary between God and man. Just read many of the comments how this "pastor" is held to some place of high esteem. It's not in that verse. This modern "pastor" contradicts scripture by calling themselves "pastor" and teaching others to call them "pastor."

Why Are Pastors Having Affairs

jody, this phrase caught my attention, "Pastors are great prey as they pose a greater threat to the devil." I know this may be misunderstood, but I don't see "pastors" being a threat to the devil. I see "pastors" as hindering the ministry. They encourage pew-sittering with no participation. They generally do not allow "one another" to happen because they have all the answers. Question a "pastor's" teaching some time and see what happens. They will hinder growth if they percieve it may threaten them. No doubt, some "pastors" mean well and are sincerely doing what they think is right. However, there is no Biblical position of "pastor."

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas
	Thanks, 1st cliff, interesting... I hadn't heard that terminology before. Dru, what is up? Most of us here are up to learning, I think. But one needs to know what they are talking about because we need to be able to support our belief systems.

Belief In Dispensationism

Ralph, Great statement, "To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory. We live in the dispensation of Christ in you, called Grace." However, I perceive implications (eisegeses)into these statements. Let me suggest. (1) God has always been a God of grace. (2) The mystery is that the gospel is offered to the gentiles. (3) Correct me if I misunderstood you, but "called Grace" has the implication that this "age" is one of many others. (4) God never delighted in "sacrifice." (5) I love the phrase, "Christ in me the hope of glory." And that will be true for all ages to come.

Meet-Ups In Houston Texas
	MarkV. where do you live? I live near Sacramento in Sonora near Yosemite. I wondered if Dru didn't really know what he was asking and just wanted fellowship. I have found that fellowship is extremely lacking in the institutionized church.