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Who Are 21st Century Calvinists

Who are those known as "Calvinists" in the 21st century?

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 ---Donna on 10/28/06
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What is the purpose of the question? Do you think we in the 21st century should be "much smarter" than to believe what John Calvin taught? I happen to hold similar beliefs to Calvin's on salvation, but, disagree with a lot of his other teaching.
---tommy3007 on 12/29/07

It seems that just about everyone who believes in the total sovereignty of God is a Calvinist. God can do whatever He wants to including creating someone to be damned for His good pleasure. He is the potter and we are the clay and the clay has little or nothing to tell the potter.

Ro 9:21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honored use and another for dishonorable use?

Calvin got most of his ideas from Augustine on this subject.
---lee1538 on 11/26/06

Lee ... I do not "cry someone hurt my feeings"
Neither am I afraid to challenge those who such as you, tell lies about others.
Still love you though.
Did you really think I was trying to deceive by using my new PenPal name? if you PenPal me I will tell you why I needed a new one.
Incidently you will see I have changed my name again, so people can again call me Alan, to :
---AlanUK_quent5969 on 11/6/06

Lee ... # 1 To answer a few of your charges.
I am not angry at you, just sad that you perpetuate the lies you told about me
I have changed my name because my profile was lost, and I had to rejoin. there is no other motive, and I would have thought that with your intelligence you would have been quite able to see that I was being open about the name change, since I even commented on it.
---quent5969_the_Scot on 11/6/06

Lee ... # 2 So once again you try by false means to discredit someone with whom you do not agree.
Even if you don't like me, at least you can stop spreading the lies about me. I don't demand respect, but would hope for honesty.
---quent5969_the_Scot on 11/6/06

John T is a 21st Century Calvinist.
---jerry6593 on 11/6/06

Alan, you come across as a person who demands respect. A kid that has lost a candy and now you demand it back. Before anyone gets respect they have to have respect for others. You are not a child but you act like one. You use different names in answering so that you don't show it is you but others, deceiving when criticizing. You got angry with me, you got angry with lisa, you got angry with Rachel, you get angry but never prove anyone wrong with Scripture.
---lee_1 on 11/6/06

2. Who are the Calvinist of the 21st century" Those are people that are doing their best to bring the truth of Scripture back to what is use to be. That God saves and gives us faith, The Holy Spirit gives life, convicts and teaches by sanctification, and Christ Pays for our sins, and sustains us till we die. That man is nothing but clay. And God is God. He is not a wimp or a helpless God waiting to see what the person will do.
---lee_1 on 11/6/06

3. God is Sovereign, Omnipotent, Omnipresence, Holy, Just, and His attributes don't change no matter what man thinks. If you don't like the God we present and think it is wrong, then prove it with God's Word instead of complaining and crying someone hurt your feelings.
---lee_1 on 11/6/06

4. Stand for the truth, instead of your own feelings. God's word is truth, and literally correct book. Drinking for a Christian doesn't change because you live in the U.K. a Christian is a Christian no matter where he lives, and is an example to others. If you are angry with lisa on her answer, you are terribly wrong. You should act like a Christian no matter where you live.
---lee_1 on 11/6/06

I'd just like to say that probably 95-99% of any protestant denomination is calvinist is some way in the 21st Century. Why because much of Calvin's work is foundational to the Protestant Theologies and doctrines. If you were to read his works you would probably agree with most of it.
---Jared on 11/5/06

Lisa ... If I said I believed the Moon is made of green cheese, that would be a statement of what I believe.
Now I don't expect you to agree that the moon is made of green cheese (but you know it really is ... the mouse my cat brought in yesterday told me so)
But I would hope that you would accept my statement that that was what I beleived, and not try to tell me that I also thought that every day a man called Stoker put more coal on the sun to keep it burning.
---quent5969_the_Scot on 11/5/06

Lisa you accused me "you are one of them, that believe they have the right or not, to do as they please, when and where they want"
I stated quite clearly "What I do believe is that I have the ability to do what I please, but not the right"
And yet you still say "you are one that believes that man has a free will, to do what they want when they want. Is that not what you do"
Why do you still say that? And yes, since you ask, it is an insult.
---quent5969_the_Scot on 11/5/06

Lisa ... # 1 If you carefully read what I said, I asked you to believe what I said about my belief. I did not ask you to accept my belief.
I asked you to stop telling lies about me (that I say I can do what I want and when I want) but you will not.
I have told you I do not believe that.
---quent5969_the_Scot on 11/5/06

Lisa ... # 2 Why will you not accept what I say about my own belief?
Why do you insist that when I believe a certain thing (God gives us the choice of saying Yes or No to Him) I in fact mean something else, which I have already denied (that I can do what I want when I want)
Why do you try to make me a liar about my own beliefs?
Love you, anyway!!
---quent5969_the_Scot on 11/5/06

I will answer you with Scripture, "..God chose you from the beginning "to be saved, through" sanctification by the Spirit and "belief in the truth." To this "He" called you through the gospel, so that you may obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ." 2 Thess. 2:13,14 and "For "we know" brethren beloved by God, that "He has chosen you" for our gospel "came to you" not only in word, but also in "power" and
---lisa on 11/5/06

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2. in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction" 1 Thess. 1:4,5. The writer is speaking about how they, the believers were chosen by God because the Word of God came to them in power by the Holy Spirit, and that power came with full conviction to the person. This people were convicted by the Spirit when they heard the word and repended. Conviction came from the Spirit. Now God explains it very well with His word. Can you disprove this words?
---lisa on 11/5/06

3. Just because I don't except something Alan, is because Scripture is very critical subject to talk about. It is God's Word we are dealing with here. I don't make a joke of it, and I do take it very serious. You speak of semetics about free will, but a defination has been given to you already. it was not good enough to you, so that is fine. Your anger is not warranted. I am not here to make you love me, if you are a Christian, it should be a part of you already.
---lisa on 11/5/06

Yes Lisa, I suppose I am a little angry, for you without justification have stated that believe I jave the right to do what I want and when I want. That is not what I say ... I have explaiend what I mean by free-will ... the right to say "Yes please" or "No thanks" to God & Jesus. But you do not accept that.
Why will you not accept what people say about their own beliefs?
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/4/06

Well Alan, I am sorry if I hurt your feelings. I wanted to answer you on another blog but was afraid you would say just what you said. Alan, you ask me a question and now that I have answered you, you get angry again same as when we talked about drinking. I guess you haven't forgotten. Ok Alan, it's fine to drink in public. It ok to disagree with me. I give in. Please, in order for you to not get hurt again, don't ask me a question. I sure don't want to hurt your feelings Alan.
---lisa on 11/3/06

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2. Alan, I did say that you were one of them, and what I meant was that you are one that believes that man has a free will, to do what they want when they want. Is that not what you do. If it is not then I guess I have this free will all mixed up. I don't know what else to call it but the right to do as you so desire when you desire if you want. What is wrong with that explanation? Is it an insult? Forgive me. Last statement to you also Alan.
---lisa on 11/3/06

I don't believe that the Sovereignty of God is for everyone. I believe that many here will follow what they have been taught and will never change. I believe if God wanted anyone to learn about His Sovereignty they would. I am not here to change anyone. I am here to discus Scripture. This website is to answer about Scripture. Many here learn everyday. That is my purpose. And I am a follower of God's sovereign right to rule, not man, and it is called reform. All based on God as the giver of life.
---lisa on 11/3/06

2. If someone here disproves of what I put down from Scripture, please give me Scripture to show me where I have erred. I will correct my errors and admit fault if wrong, and if not I will give you my answer hoping you don't get angry and feel like I am attacking your person.
---lisa on 11/3/06

Alan of UK -- IMHO, we have two extreme ends of a continuum here. It's God's choice, not man's's all up to the individual. They could debate til Jesus comes and not settle anything. I couldn't prove it, but I'll bet the vast majority of Christians allow for both man and God (to one degree or another) to be involved in salvation.
---Donna2277 on 11/3/06

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Lisa ... I do have to correct you on a few points
You say of me "What the problem with many, and you are one of them, that believe they have the right or not, to do as they please, when and where they want"
Pray, tell me Lisa, when & how have I given that impression? That is a gross insult.
What I do believe is that I have the ability to do what I please, but not the right.
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/3/06

Lisa ... The other thing is that I believe that I do have the right, to either say "Thank you & Yes please!!!" and accept the Gift, or alternatively to say "No, thanks", and reject the Gift.
I cannot accept that God has us all as puppets, so that some, at His command, will say "Yes" and others, again as He commands, will say "No"
That would be a perversion of God's love.
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/3/06

Lisa ... The other thing is that I believe that I do have the right, to either say "Thank you & Yes please!!!" and accept the Gift, or alternatively to say "No, thanks", and reject the Gift.
I cannot accept that God has us all as puppets, so that some, at His command, will say "Yes" and others, again as He commands, will say "No"
That would be a perversion of God's love.
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/3/06

Lisa ... But for you to suggest that those who believe that we are able to say Yes or No, therefore claim "the right to do as they please, when and where they want" is totally unfair and untrue,
If repeated in public, and not in the privacy of these blogs, such a statement, which in effect says that we cannot call ourselves Christians, because we do not accept the authority of God, would probably be actionable.
Sorry, but you must be more careful what you say.
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/3/06

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Alan, I thank you for been curtious with your response. Election, is written over 48 times in Scripture. The elect are the one's that will come to Christ. No one know's who they are. We are command to spread the gospel, we are to pray for our children, because we don't know if it is the will of God or not to bring our children to Christ. We pray because we know who can and cannot give life. God can. Our very life's are dependent upon Him. We cannot escape that no matter what we understand.
---lisa on 11/3/06

Alan, If you say "thank you" to God for saving you, you are glorifying Him. If you think you save yourself, you give glory to you. Now the question to you is, do you thank God for saving you, or do you not? If you thank Him for it, you give glory to Him. What the problem with many, and you are one of them, that believe they have the right or not, to do as they please, when and where they want, that is not giving glory to God, but to yourself.
---lisa on 11/3/06

2. What you said is that you believe it is a gift. Now let me say, if it is a gift, we are talking about Grace for salvation, and it comes with faith to believe, how can you not believe? How can you reject what you believe? If faith is in you once you are saved, how can you not have faith? Also, that gift of grace is not given to everyone, if it was then all would have faith before they are saved. We have faith because of grace. We cannot have faith before we are saved by Grace.
---lisa on 11/3/06

3. May not the Sovereing Lord on High dispense His favors as He will? Choose some to life, while others die, and yet be just and gracious still? Shall man reply against the Lord, and call his Maker's ways unjust? Those are words that are spoken of here. Daniel put it clearly, "He doeth according to His will in the armies of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth".
---lisa on 11/3/06

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4. You see Alan, people get mad because they want to have that right. The right to do as they please. A dead person, cannot make himself alive, he cannot give himself sight, or change his nature. Only God can do that but people refuse. They want to be the determinator of their own faith, which they do not even have while dead. God made a plan Alan, and no matter what you and I do, it will be compelete when He so desires. It has always been about Him, for His glory.
---lisa on 11/3/06

Lisa ... I know you don't mind that I disagree with you. But you have not answered the question.
How can saying "Thank you, and yes please!" be said to be glorifying oneself?
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/2/06

4. We are, in fact, all receivers. We never bring any adequate reward to God, we are always receiving from Him, and shall be unto all eternity. Again thank you Donna for the answer of gift. Just my explanation of the gift. May God richly bless you with His Word.
---lisa on 11/2/06

Thank you too Alan for your response. I don't mind at all that you disagree with me. We cannot all agree on all of Scripture. I was only answering Shiela on her question, and gave my answer as best as possible. I do know that God saved me. He had mercy on me for some reason unknown to me, but He did. There was nothing good in me. I was bad to the core, and only He could bring a change in me that I could not do myself, becuase I didn't want to. I loved my life, but it didn't include God.
---lisa on 11/2/06

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3. and since man is enslvaed to sin until it is given, all the merits that he can have prior to it are bad merits and deserve only punishment, not gifts or favor. We are distinctly told that Christ suffered as a subsitute, "The Just for the unjust" and when man is encouraged to think that he owes to some power or art of his own that salvation which in reality is all of grace, God is robbed of part of His glory.
---lisa on 11/2/06

Thank you Donna, that is the very case of the fact. It is a gift of God. Others seem to think that they deserve it because they make a choice. That God someone cannot touch them because they have that authority. But while lost they are without hope. Meaning, nothing can save them only God. If God didn't come into thier live's they would be loving the world as they did before they were saved. Grace is a gift of God. With no merits. A gift of life.
---lisa on 11/2/06

2. It doesn't matter how we try to change it but it is a gift. With that gift comes "faith" it has to, becuase what would be the use of having been saved by grace if we still didn't believe? So God bistows faith so that we can believe. The word "grace" in its proper sense means the free and undeserve love or favor of God exercised toward the undeserving. The sinner. To introduce works or merit into any part of this Grace, vitiates its nature and design. It is necessarlity gratuitous;
---lisa on 11/2/06

Donna ... Thank you. I would just say that it is a gift from the Lord. But I do not regard it as a gift especially offered to me, and not to others.
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/1/06

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We receive God Gift in Humility. It's Pride that rejects Salvation. That's the whole issue. Satan is the father of Pride. This is why he fell. To be offered something you know you don't deserve, it takes great humility to accept it. That humility comes when we acknowledge we are sinners. Look at the publican and the pharisee. How often Jesus showed us examples, yet we just don't get it. Something forced on you is not a Gift.
---kathr4453 on 11/1/06

Alan of UK --As long as you see it as a gift from the Lord you're not glorifying yourself. Don't get too caught up in the theology of this. Some people think that "going forward" in a meeting is what saves them. You know differently. Ignore anyone who would question your salvation.
---Donna2277 on 11/1/06

Lisa ... When I am offered a present by someone, how can it be glorying myself if I say "Thanks, yes I would like that"?
---alan8869_of_UK on 11/1/06

I will give you a reason Shiela, the main point is that all of the glory goes to God and not one bit goes to man. That is the reason why I believe in the reform view. When someone gets glory other then God, then it steals from the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirits work in the believer. In every aspect from, salvation, faith, and the work of the Holy Spirit in a persons life.
---lisa on 11/1/06

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Shiela thank you for your honesty, and I truly wish I could help.

Due to the past, and some here who carry on demonically-inspired messages of hate, acting without true knowledge, belittling a belief system, and carrying in an un-Christlike spirit, attacking ad hominem, I can not continue on that subject unless some are refused posting privileges.

Hope you understand. Shalom
---JohnT on 10/31/06

Donna, To put it in a nut shell, It would be easier in one verse to tell you what they don't believe.
Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
This verse goes against their doctrine of Election, Limited Atonement, Irresistible Grace.
Paul said any other Gospel then the one He preached is accursed. The True Gospel detects the counterfeit. You can't know a counterfeit unless you hold up the real thing next to it.
---Mike on 10/30/06

Shiela >>If you follow Calvin, you know who you are in the 21st century.<<

What if you don't follow "Calvin" but the Bible. And you still agree with some of the "5 points", but not all. What does that make you?
I think a lot of people fall into this category. Not everybody is an extremist.
---Donna_Smith on 10/29/06

JT, I'll be honest, I'm not going to do an in depth study on Calvinsim. I would like to hear from someone who is a follower of Calvin, why they do believe it it. I would like to hear a case made why anyone should believe it. Not in 2222 posts or more.
---Shiela on 10/29/06

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Well, maybe I've never met a Calvinist. I had hoped to find out WHO those ARE that are so hated by some bloggers here. From all they say, I figured they were talking about a large group that pose a threat to Christendom.

Instead they must mean some like that group that protest over soldiers graves. Sorry. I don't worry about THEM.
(I do know people who believe in OSAS, but I don't think they are Calvinists, either)
---Donna2277 on 10/29/06

Sheila: If you TRULY want to learn, I refer you to Calvin College's website. There is a FREE virtual library to download many books, just register for free.

Because I have been abased by some ignorant people, neither willing to learn, nor willing to be ratonal I refuse to subject myself to continued UNCHRISTAIN abuse.

Read it or not,your choice, but PLEASE post no anti-Cavin nonsense until you learn more about Calvinism first hand.
---JohnT on 10/29/06

If you know the answers, present them. If you believe in Calvinsim, tell us why you do. The few that have posted have opened themselves up to criticism, while others watch. Give us your side. To list the churches and to what extent will be highly offensive to many. What purpose does that serve. Everyone should investigate their own church. It will be their free will that keeps them there. I'm not going to make a list, throw rocks at specific denominations. Many that once followed Calvin, no longer do.
---Shiela on 10/29/06

The reason for the question is to get away from all.."false doctrine...lies from Satan..corrupting God's people" rhetoric. That's why I aked WHO?

WHO are we talking about? I've never seen a "FIRST CALVINIST CHURCH" I've seen Baptists of many kinds, Presbyterians, Methodists, Lutherans,Dutch Reformed and Other Reformed Churches, Assembly of God Churches, Anglican, Episcopalian...which ones are Calvinists and to what extent?
---Donna2277 on 10/28/06

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There is essentially no difference in the 21 Calvinist than those of 150-250 years ago. "It is true that Christians can fall into sin; we can partially and temporarily fall away, but not totally and finally fall away." D. James Kennedy. Calvin, "But if a righteous man turns from his righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked man does, will he live? None of the righteous things he has done will be remembered. Calvin was willing to kill for his theology.
---Shiela on 10/28/06

Calvin - For the example of David shows that the elect, although regenerated by God's Spirit, not only sin to a small extent, but, as I have said, plunge into the very lowest abyss. David became a perfidious homicide, and a traitor to the army of God; then that wretched king fell into a series of crimes; yet he failed in only one thing, and showed that God's grace was only suffocated within him, and not altogether extinguished...
---Shiela on 10/28/06

Calvinism of the past was a false gospel of salvation, just as it is today. Calvinists site David and Peter as unholy examples.King David in adultery and murder, Peter who denied Christ.
Calvinists make it in to the kingom of heaven, regardless of what sin they commit.

Calvinists, once saved always saved, and the most evil of sins will not change that. It is to be exposed, resisted and refuted.

If you follow Calvin, you know who you are in the 21st century.
---Shiela on 10/28/06

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