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Salvation Is A Choice

If we were born in sin i.e. not my choice to be born or to be a sinner, why then is salvation a choice that I have to make?

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 ---dorrett on 11/25/06
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Interesting question. Is the life of a soul created at conception? Does the soul pre-exist the body? If so can we live in infinity? Or only eternity? Shouldn't we be thankful that we have been given the choice of existence? That we have been given life is not cruel, it is telling of God's affection for His creation that He even gives us a choice of eternal salvation, He should have scrapped the experiment labeled HUMANITY a long time ago. Praise Jesus He didn't WHOOOOOOOOO!!!
---Ryan on 12/28/07

Adam fell that man might be. Without his disobedience, man would never be born. Spiritual death is a separation from seeing, walking and talking with God in person. That occured the moment they left the garden. Jesus Christ was born into the world to atone for that mistake and enable everyone that is worthy to re-enter God's presence after the resurrection and judgment. We either love Jesus Christ and obey his commandments, or we continue to sin openly against him and reap what we sow in wickedness.
---ashley on 5/31/07

In the Garden Eve was cajolled into partaking of the fruit. Nothing, at that point, was shown to have happened. Adam, however, was presented with a simple choice to obey God or to disobey God. At this point the eyes of them BOTH were oppened.
He made the choice to make us all humanity sinners by nature. We must now make the choice to renounce sin and accept God.
---Ed on 5/31/07

Thank you Eloy, I didn't expect anything less then what you said. I hope that things work out good for you. It is always a pleasure to talk of things of God to anyone.
---lisa on 12/3/06

.lisa, I do not get angry with people who disagree with me, for their disagreeing with me is their own choice, thus I reply to these dissers "you will believe whatever you desire". Initially many may disagree with me, and afterward some will come to realize that what I speak is only the truth and then they will no longer disgree, but will agree with what I say for knowing that it is truth.
---Eloy on 12/2/06

2. If a person lost "in the flesh", who is not yet reborn by the power of the Holy Spirit, can incline or dispose himself to Christ, what good is rebirth? Just look at the passages, read them as you will, and by the power of the holy Spirit, you will be able to see the connection. God wants to use you Eloy, in the biggest way. Let Him speak to you and you will see what I have seen for over six years Eloy. I hope that I have help. Blessings to you Eloy, have a great weekend.
---lisa on 12/1/06

Eloy, I think you are sincere with what you teach. I know you get angry when someone disagree's with you. But in your heart you know that God has to change a person before he can do anything for God. A lost person does not first believe and then become born again. How can a man choose a kingdom he cannot see? How can a man enter the kingdom without being first reborn? Jesus was pointing out Nocodemus's need to be "born again" of the Spirit. He was still in the flesh. The flesh yields only flesh.
---lisa on 12/1/06

Eloy, You need as a pastor to correct your way of thinking. You need to start from the beginning. With Adam and work you way through again to get yourself corrected. If you don't, all you will do is throw away have of the Scriptures to prove you point, and that point will be lost because it will have no power to truely bring anyone to Christ. All we teach has to be correct. That is why there is so many so call Christians that do go back to what they use to do before, no true conversion.
---lisa on 12/1/06

3. When we are born again, our bondage to sin is relieved. After we are made alive in Christ, we once again have the "Ability" to sin, and the "ability" to not sin. In Heaven we will have the "inability" to sin. There will be no more sin. Here is what Jesus teachings tell us, "Therefore I have said to you that 'no one' can come to Me 'unless' it has been granted to him by My Father" The first word's "no one" are all-inclusive.
---lisa on 12/1/06

4. They allow no exceptions apart from the exceptions Jesus adds. The next word "can" these word has to do with ability, not permission, the word may refers to permission. In this passage Jesus is not saying "no one is allowed to come to me.. He is saying, "NO one is able to come to me." The next word is vital, The word is "unless" refers to what we call a necessary condtion. A necessary condition refers to something that must happen before something else can happen.
---lisa on 12/1/06

5. Jesus meaning are clear, no human being can possibly come to Christ "unless" something happens that make it possible for him to come. That necessary condition Jesus declares is that "it has been granted to him by the Father". Jesus is saying here that the ability to come to him is a gift from God. Man doees not have the ability in and of himself to come to Christ. God must do something first.
---lisa on 12/1/06

6. In John's Gospel Jesus makes a similar statement. He says, No one can come to me unless the Father who sent Me draws him" The word here is "draw". I will go also to the talk of Jesus to Nicodemus "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kigdom of God" Two verses later Jesus repeats the teaching, Most assuredly, I say to you, "unless" one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God."
---lisa on 12/1/06

7. Once again we encounter the pivotal word "unless". Jesus is stating an emphatic necessary precondition for any human being's ability to see and to enter the kingdom of God. Non-reform view have fallen people first choosing Christ and then being born again. Here we find "unregenerate people seeing and entering the kingdom of God. The moment a person receives Christ he is in the kingdom. One doees not first believe, then become reborn,
---lisa on 12/1/06

.lisa, Paul is speaking of all people, himself included: Therefore we labor, that whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must ALL appear in front of the judgment throne of Christ; that every one may receive the things in body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad." II Cor.5:9,10. Jesus also says the samething ALL nations will be gathered to him, and he will divide the righteous people for paradise from the sinuous people for hell: Please read Matthew 25:31-46.
---Eloy on 12/1/06


"Matthew 15:24: But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Would you say that the "lost sheep" spoken of in that verse were "believers" in the same
sense that you use the term or would you say they were "lost" in the same sense that you use the term?
---Nana on 12/1/06

.lisa, you will believe whatever you desire.
---Eloy on 11/30/06

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Yes Eloy, the sign went out, but it has not gone to all of the world. And yes, everyone lost will stand before the Great White Throne and will have to answer for their deeds. But the believer is not at that judgment Eloy. He stands before God covered with the righteousness of Christ. And any work he did in life was because of God. If he was lost and did anything good, it was sin since God was not include in getting glory for his work. As you said, mankind loved darkness.
---lisa on 11/30/06

2. God's light has to come to him before he can see light. It is God that brings light to the darkness. The person in darkness cannot of himself created his own light. He remains in darkness if it was not for God. He has no way of escaping darkness and while there he loves what he does for the word of God says, "He loved darkness." how can he leave what he loves? God has to change his heart in order for that person to see through the light of God and see his condition, and repent.
---lisa on 11/30/06

3. Thank you Eloy for your response to me. You have been very kind. I enjoy very much looking through God's Word. blessings
---lisa on 11/30/06

2. That passage that you quoted is not talking about unbelievers, "that anyone in the world should not parrish" it is talking to believers. 2 Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slack concerning His promise" that promise is for believers. "Not wanting that any should parrish" Peter is talking to the beloved, just go back to verse 8. He is telling them that now that they are saved, God doesn't want any to parrish. When you read a passages Eloy, you have to read it in context.
---lisa on 11/29/06

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3. You have to face the fact that God's Word has to be correct and that no passage contradicts another. God tells us, That He has mercy on whom He has mercy. He tells us that its all for His purpose, and that He will do what He wills. If He wanted everyone to be saved, everyone would be saved. Yet, reality is that not everyone will hear the gospel, and not everyone will be saved. Anyone can figure that one out.
---lisa on 11/29/06

4. You said it yourself, how can one come to Christ, if he doesn't hear the word? That salvation comes from hearing. The Word of God convicts the person, and brings salvation. Without God's Word he is lost. God has to come to him, with power, but only through the true gospel, are else his commitment is false. That is why many go back to doing what they had done all their live's.
---lisa on 11/29/06

"The times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commands All humans everywhere to repent. Have they not heard? Yes, their sound went into All the earth, and their words onto the ends of the world. This is the condemnation, light is come into the world, and mankind loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For we must All appear in front of the judgment throne of Christ; that every one may receive the things in body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad."
---Eloy on 11/29/06

.debbie, All are already drawn by the Father, for he gave his own son for them and Christ has already been lifted up upon the cross. If people refuse to turn to God or listen to his words it is not God Not calling them, but it is the persons refusal against God. They are already Commanded to repent, when they refuse they are condemned by their own refusal to God's drawing. There is no excuse for any person's refusal of Christ, the soul which is antiChrist is also antiGod, and God will destroy them.
---Eloy on 11/29/06

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Eloy, if God is not willing that anyone should parrish, why are so many parrishing all over the world? Why are some born in countries and area's that will never hear the gospel? They did not ask to be born there, they didn't ask to die there but they will. They are all condemned already. God is Omnipotent, He could if He wanted to, extend salvation to all, and make it possible for all to be save. All He would have to do is created enough missionaries to go everywhere. But He doesn't.
---lisa on 11/29/06

#1 Eloy, John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: Salvation is for whosoever will, but the sinner must be drawn first. There is nothing in our old sinful nature that wants anything to do with salvation. It takes a drawing by God Himself to bring us to that point where we realize we need a Savior.
---Debbie on 11/29/06

#2 God the Father even gives us the measure of faith we need to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. Many still, even after this drawing, reject Christ and of course that will send them to hell unless they will yield to the Fathers drawing.
---Debbie on 11/29/06

Nobody just gets saved. Jesus Christ starts reaching out to the lost sinner and brings them into His kingdom when the Holy Spirit moves upon the preached Word of the Cross.
---Helen_5378 on 11/29/06

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What bible passages suggest that we have free will *prior to* regeneration? Man is not capable of believing in Jesus apart from the grace of God. Eph. 2:1 And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them. because of the blindness of their heart:
---Tina5349 on 11/28/06

Lazarus did not choose to come out of the grave. Jesus spoke and Lazarus came to life. People do not choose to be born to their human parents, just like they do not choose to be born of God. We certainly have free-will in the civil realm. But in the spiritual realm, we are dead in sin. Spiritually dead people don't make choices for the good., only for evil. Prior to regeneration we were at enmity with God. Through the Gospel of Jesus Christ, God speaks us to life.
---Tina on 11/28/06

tina, you err if you think that no one can come to Jesus except Jesus calls them. Many many people call out to Jesus every day and are saved. "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw All up to me. And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up. Go all you into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature; whom obeys and is baptized will be saved, but whom not obeys will be condemned." John 12:32; 3:14; Mark 16:15,16.
---Eloy on 11/28/06

.tina, "For whosoever will call upon the Name of the Lord will be saved. How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how will they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how will they hear without a preacher? Therefore faith from hearing, and the hearing through a word of God. Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation. For some, when they had heard, did provoke, and their carcases fell in the wilderness." Romans 10:13,14,17; Hebrews 3:8,15-17.
---Eloy on 11/28/06

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The only problem is..."I cannot by my own reason or strength believe in Jesus Christ, my Lord, or come to Him; but the Holy Ghost has called me by the Gospel, enlightened me with His gifts, sanctified and kept me in the true faith; even as He calls, gathers, enlightens, and sanctifies the whole Christian Church on earth, and keeps it with Jesus Christ in the one true faith..." Luther's Small Catechism.
---Tina5349 on 11/28/06

Because if you do not accept the salvation offered to you by Christ's loving sacrifice, yuo would receive the punishments for your sinfulness
---AlanUK_quent5969 on 11/27/06

It's a choice ONLY you can make because God won't go against your free will that he gave to you. He stands at the door of your heart and knocks, if anyone lets Him in, it's a GLORIOUS life you will live with Him. God says, "Today I set before you death and life, CHOOSE life." He wants to give you the choice because He gave man/woman a free will to choose. It's just the way God planned life. But I know you'll use wisdom and choose the right path of Salavation for your soul. God Bless you.
---Donna9759 on 11/27/06

People make choices every day whether to do right or to do wrong, to do good or to do bad. You do not have to choose salvation, for many people keep their sin and remain separated from God. Nevertheless God is not willing that anyone should perish, but that all would turn to him and live.
---Eloy on 11/27/06

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This is the only ticket unto salvation that I know of, "take unto ourselves the very spirit by which
he proved himself God before our own eyes"! Amen!
---Nana on 11/26/06

Ed. You seem to be letting Eve off the hook and putting all the blame on Adam.God said if they ate there eyes would be open so her eyes were open first. No proof that Eve's were opened when Adam took the fruit. She did sin first. She disobeyed God's word to eat of the fruit just like Adam. 1 Tim. 2:14 Says the woman was in the transgression.They both disobeyed God. And God cursed them both.
---john on 11/26/06

If you could choose would you then choose not to be born? Life is a gift, and just like salvation comes by grace as was already stated.
God has not only given us the freedom to choose our destiny, but also our identity!
We can remain who we are at birth, and develop by default the traits that make us sinners by following what feels good.
We can seek out his life in Jesus Christ and take unto ourselves the very spirit by which he proved himself God before our own eyes. This is love.
---Pharisee on 11/26/06

Yes; Salvation is a choice. Totally incapable of affecting our own salvation we must look to God's open and signed contract and is offered to us. If we were verbally sign that contract. Almighty God will enforce the contract, that enforcement equals your salvation.
---mima on 11/26/06

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