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Born Of Water And Spirit

What does this verse mean? "Except a man be born of water and the spirit, he can not enter the kingdom of God."

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 ---Bryan on 3/9/07
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It's not witchcraft.
It's the Hebrew perspective.
Well done.
---char on 6/5/10

Wow alan, what witchcraft has influenced you?
---Andy3996 on 6/1/10

The ancients believed that all matter was made up of 4 elements. There were two lower elements - earth and water - and two higher elements - fire and air. The word for spirit could also mean wind (or air) and we know that the Holy Spirit it elsewhere (in Acts, for example) characterized as both fire and wind. Therefore born of water (earth would have made just as much sense) refers to our physical birth and born of spirit (or air) refers to our spiritual birth. Jesus reinforces this when he goes on to clarify his meaning: born of flesh and born of spirit being set against each other in exactly the same way as water and wind (air) have. Elsewhere Jesus endorses baptism by water but he is clearly not referring to it here
---Alan on 5/30/10

To be Born again?? means to be born of the water and of the spirit, which means to be batized in the name of Jesus Christ and receive the Free gift of the Holy Ghost!!
Acts 2 and 38
Titu3 3 and 55
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost, (for we or saved not be our on works of rightiouness or how Good we are already, but by being baized in the name of Jesus Christ, and recieveing the Holy GHost!) all other rightiouness shall be as filty rages, we must in the door of the sheep fold the striaght and narrow, all other ways come as thieves, and robbers, and in no wise shall they inter the gates of heaven<
---Melchizedek_Reed on 1/7/09

Without being baptized in the name of Jesus and being filled with the Holy Ghost you cannot enter in to the Kingdom of God--the Church.
---donald on 1/2/08

Your physical birth through the birth canal was of water. You ever heard the phrase " water broke"? When a person called own the Lord Jesus Christ to save their soul. The Holy Spirit takes up residence in their body and that event is being borned of the spirit.
---Mima on 12/26/07

The gift of discernment reveals if someone is operating in a wrong spirit and a wrong motivation.
The gift of discernment is not natural perception. People have a personality clash will tell you it's the Holy Spirit. It's not.
If you're mad and furious in the natural, it has nothing to do with the Holy Spirit.
The gift of discernment warns against false doctrines, false prophets, and false prophecies. God's alarm system.
You'll know when someone's promoting false doctrine. Acts 5:1-10
---Hank on 3/20/07

If you have a word of knowledge for someone; God will show you things in people's lives - not to put them down, not to discourage them, not to break them down, but help them.

If your word is used for anything but helping another person, you can open yourself up to be influenced by a familiar spirit. You will know things about people, but it's not the Holy Spirit giving you that knowledge.
---Vineyard on 3/20/07

Super-spiritual flakes act like they know everything. When it is God speaking, it will be the opposite of what your 'thoughts going through your head are'.
Prophets do not operate out of head knowledge. Baptism of the Holy Spirit is different from water baptism. The apocalyptic elephant, men will hate the Gospel as never before - and at the same time there will be the greatest harvest of souls. A dynamic tension. One way will kill your faith and the other will let you thrive in this toxic time.
---Vineyard on 3/20/07

Paul described end time emotions. They will lose the power to feel goodness, love, gratitude, and even the world's natural beauty will not affect them. They will lose the power to think a decent thought. Unholy, morbid, and attracted to cruelty. Unforgiving, angry and bitter. Unable to sense the needs of the people around them more than their own needs. See the danger but also see the opportunity for the harvest of souls.
---Vineyard on 3/20/07

Why would paul say to apollos which baptism did you receive if their was only one??
(Acts 19:3) those are his exact words...
This is what gets me their it is more than 1 baptism scripture right there, why do you only say 1
---mark on 3/19/07

Kathr; I'm not saying there are more than one baptism. Cause the bible plainly states there is only one. I totally agree with you on all you replied. I just thought you didn't believe in one being baptised by the Holy Ghost and with fire. Meaning speaking in tongues. Because you threw me off when you said there was no scripture backing that up.
---Rebecca_D on 3/19/07

RebeccaD: I'm not saying there is no Baptism. When there is an idea that there is an EXTRA Baptism, one that bypasses the cross, and causes you (not you) to act strange, having nothing to do with sanctification, it's not grounded in Truth. Paul said in Ephesians there is "ONE" Baptism. Then that Baptism MUST include all that I just listed previously, including the anointing that we are to abide in Him, that He is our teacher, Comfortor, etc.
---kathr4453 on 3/19/07

Insulting the Holy Spirit is to go into rebellion. To blaspheme against the Holy Spirit is to be at the end of the road. Filled with massive willful sin, there is nothing left. A dreadful void fills the soul. Repentance is impossible because the means by which the Holy Spirit brings conviction has been destroyed. The offender is now totally reprobate and full of evil. All hope is lost, not just in this life, but forever.
---Hank on 3/19/07

RebeccaD:Did any of these verses EXCLUDE the operation of the Holy Spirit?
Can you put yourself to death?
Can you raise yourself from the dead in Christ?
Can you place yourself into the Body of Christ?
Can you walk in the Spirit of your own doing?
Do you operate your gifts Jesus gave you in your own stength?
Can you obey God in your own strength?
What did you think being Baptized means? What was the New Covenant Promise of the Holy Spirit meant to accomplish? Answer:*2 Corinthians 3.
---kathr4453 on 3/19/07

Acts 11:15-16 refers to baptism of the Holy Ghost
---Mel on 3/19/07

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Mark 3:28-29 --- "Truly I say to you, all sins shall be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they utter; but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is guilty of an eternal sin."

Luke 12:10 --- "And everyone who will speak a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him." also: Luke 11:14.
---Hank on 3/19/07

"And men were scorched with fierce heat; and they blasphemed the name of God who has the power over these plagues; and they did not repent, so as to give Him glory" (Rev. 16:9). "And they blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores; and they did not repent of their deeds" (vs. 11). Opposition to the Holy Spirit of God that even when being destroyed they are beyond even the thought of seeking repentance, but instead persist in their blasphemy.
---Hank on 3/19/07

The person living in this sin will continue in his stubborn resistance, with blasphemous, outspoken mockery of the work of the Holy Ghost, until the end. This sin is not pardonable.
---Hank on 3/19/07

Jesus was saying that baptism by water is not enough. For he was talking to Nicodemus who was a Minister of the O.T. Law, whom already was accustomed to water purifications according to the O.T. Levitcal Law for ministers (Exodus 30:17-21). Jesus was saying that you must not only be born naturally of earth, but also supernaturally of heaven; that is, born-again of the Holy Spirit, meaning born of his Spirit, the Spirit of Christ. Please read John 3:6,7,14,15; Romans 8:9.
---Eloy on 3/19/07

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"He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters abroad. Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy
will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man,
it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come."
Matthew 12 v 30 - 32
---Hank on 3/19/07

Sinning in ignorance is one thing but sinning with a high hand is quite another. Resisting the inward testimony and conviction of the Holy Spirit by continuing to sin is denying the Holy Spirit. This is s to "speak against the Holy Spirit", and it is what the Pharisees were doing. Christ had exposed their wickedness. They were convinced of his divinity by the miracles, and the Holy Spirit had brought them conviction. But they refused to repent and instead insulted Christ.
---Hank on 3/19/07

Kathr: I understand all about Romans chapter 6 on baptism. But you fail to acknowledge the fact that the bible does speak about baptism of the Holy Ghost. All you replied to was the baptism in Romans. Do you not believe a person can be baptized by the Holy Ghost? Did you even read those scriptures I gave you?
---Rebecca_D on 3/18/07

One issue I see, is many have rejected the Cross, but claim they have the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. If your Baptism in the Holy Spirit doesn't come through the Cross it's counterfeit. Many are just lining up for a slaying of the Spirit, calling it the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Interesting thing about many of these folks,... their all flesh. Dying to self means nothing.
---kathr4453 on 3/18/07

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Chipper, your gospel - The only unforgiven sin is the one not repented of and no Baptism of the Holy Spirit. "Now OSAS and Eternal Security" are false to you. Before it was Calvinism, you gradually add turns. It's disjointed, and scary. As you try to convince others there is no such thing as Baptism of the Holy Spirit, I hope they seek counsel in their churches and with church leadership.
You're unable to say the words, the Unpardonable Sin is Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
---Quipper on 3/18/07

Without the Holy Spirit, it is impossible to know the Word. The leading and guiding of the Holy Spirit allows the Christian to recognize what is of Him and what is not of Him. The spirit that denigrates or minimizes the Holy Spirit in any way is not of God. If you reject the Holy Spirit, you reject the Cross as well. Two beliefs, accept the Cross and reject the Holy Spirit do not mix at all.
---Hank on 3/18/07

RebeccaD: Romans 8 is the chapter that "explains" the Holy Spirit Baptism that took place in Romans 6. We're baptized into death and resurrection life. Our Resurrection life is Romans 8. Also cross reference Colossians 2. Next
---kathr4453 on 3/18/07

Colossians 2:10And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

11In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:

12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.Next
---kathr4453 on 3/18/07

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RebeccaD #3
13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

RebeccaD, Paul fully explained what baptism is. We are complete in Him. Complete is Complete. There is nothing about a 2nd baptism. We are Complete In Him!
---kathr4453 on 3/18/07

Your revelation of the Holy Spirit, Chipper, is false.
---Quipper on 3/17/07

Kathr: no scripture to back up being baptized by the Holy Ghost...reeeally? Mt 3:11, Jn 1:33, Acts 1:5, 2:1-4 2:38-39, 11:6, 19:2-6, 10:44-45. Oh yes there are scriptures to back this up. You just need to read and let the Holy Ghost open your eyes.
---Rebecca_D on 3/17/07

RebeccaD: I believe the only Baptism of the Spirit is All in Romans 6...the Spirit of Life in Christ that set you free from the Law of Sin and death. I think you are referring to what some call the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. No scripture to back that up. Jesus gave "gifts" to HIS Body,but it's "Christ in you" that is working out of you what He is working in you. Christians are indwelt at the time they are Born Again with Father Son and Holy Spirit. The Lord our God is ONE.
---kathr4453 on 3/17/07

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Matthew 3:7,11-12 When he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them, "...I baptize you with water for repentance, but after me will come One who is more powerful than I, Whose sandals I am not fit to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire.
---River on 3/17/07

Luke 3:16-17 "I (John the Baptist) am baptizing you with water, but there is One to come Who is mightier than I...He will baptize you in the Holy Spirit and in fire."
---River on 3/17/07

John 1:3 "Upon whom you see the Spirit descending, and remaining on Him; this is He who baptizes with the Holy Spirit."
John 14:17 The (Holy) Sprit dwells with you (water baptism) and will be in you (fire baptism).
---River on 3/17/07

John 20:19-23 Jesus said, "Peace be with you" After He said this, He showed them His (crucified) hands and side. Again Jesus said, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent Me, I am sending you." With that He breathed on them and said, "Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven (released from apologizing and debt owed, but not free to abuse). If you (retain) do not forgive them, they are (retained) not forgiven."
---River on 3/17/07

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.. no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit (John 3:5).
John the Baptizer uses "water" while promising "the kingdom of God." Jesus requires water, and "Spirit" .
Jesus confronts Nicodemus. Jesus makes birth of water and Spirit a command. "You must be born again" (John 3:7). Nicodemus had no choice about his first birth. How can he make a choice about his second birth? One can decide to pass through "water."
---River on 3/17/07

I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Counselor to be with you forever - the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept Him, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him (John 14:16-17).

---River on 3/17/07

Jesus makes the new birth a command and holds you responsible. If the Spirit forced Himself on you, you would have no say in the matter. But He created you with a mind and will of your own. You decide to accept or reject the Holy Spirit. You choose to submit or rebel when that Gospel requires repentance and baptism for your sins to be forgiven.
We share in Jesus' death and resurrection by baptism of water and the Holy Spirit.
---River on 3/17/07

Chipper's ideas about the Baptism of the Holy Spirit are her own.
Similar to her ideas about the Unforgivable Sin.
---Quipper on 3/16/07

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Kathr: I agree. But what you said made no sense to my reply on one being baptized by the Holy Ghost on 3/15.
---Rebecca_D on 3/16/07

First, last look at what it means to be baptised with the Holy Spirit. When Jesus comes into a life, the person is "baptised with the Spitit." That means the new Believer is filled with the presence and power of the Holy Spirit. [All Christians have been baptised with the Holy Spirit at conversion. >>>>I will admit that I didn't really understand fully what this all meant. When I was saved, I felt God's power and His presence, but the anointing was not anything as it is today.
---catherine on 3/16/07

RebeccaD, The SPIRIT of life in Christ Jesus set us free from the law of sin and death. Adam and Eve sinned, we died. Jesus gave us New Life in Him by that Spirit. His Spirit. The SPIRIT that raised up Jesus Christ is the same Spirit that raised us up with Him This is true Baptism. Hebrews 13:20&21 and Romans 8:11-13. Cross reference those scriptures.
---kathr4453 on 3/16/07

A person does have to be born again to enter into the Kingdom of God, but each person does not have to be baptized by the Holy Ghost before they can enter in.
---Rebecca_D on 3/15/07

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Remember the flood put to death everything on the earth and the earth was cleansed. The Ark RESTED in the SEVENTH month on the SEVENteenth day of the month upon the Mountains of Ararat. (Gen 8:4) The flood waters receded and the ARK was lifted out of the water on the SEVENteenth day of the month of Abib. Nearly 2400 years later, JESUS ROSE FROM THE DEAD ON THAT VERY DAY.
The Ark is a Type of Christ.
We are buried with Him in death and resurrection life. This is what Jesus is talking about.
---kathr4453 on 3/15/07

Ephesians 5:26
That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

Same with Noah and the Flood. I love OT Types and Shadows. We can learn so much from them.
---kathr4453 on 3/15/07

1 Peter 3:19-21

20Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls WERE SAVED BY WATER,

21The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (NOT the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,)

*****by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:*****
Not talking about Water Baptism, but Spiritual Baptism. Romans 6
---kathr4453 on 3/15/07

Everyone is born of water. Even though we are born into sin, we are all born from water. Jesus was not talking about being born from water physicaly, because he said Except a man be born of water, everybody is born from water. Jesus was talking about the living water, unless a person becomes born again, (saved) they cannot drink from the living water. He told the women at the well that he is the living water and whomsoever believed on him shall never thirst again. John 4:7-14, 38. This is how I believe.
---Rebecca_D on 3/13/07

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There is no question in my mind that Jesus was contrasting our physical birth with the spiritual re-birth of salvation.

Born of the water - physical birth. As has been noted, the fetus is carried in a sac of water in the womb. However, while our parents give us physical life, we are are born spiritually dead.

Born of the Spirit - literally, born from above. This is when we receive the eternal-life giving spiritual birth we could not receive from our parents.
---BRUCE5656 on 3/12/07

I simple reading of the complete passage (leaving out pre-concieved religious ideas) will demonstrate that this is true.

When Jesus said you must be born from above, (the litteral meaning) Nicodemus replied, "how can a man "born" when he is old? Can he enter a seconed time into his mother's womb, and be born?"
---BRUCE5656 on 3/12/07

It was to this question Jesus responded "Except a man be born of the water and the Spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of God." He went on to explain exactly what he meant. "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is Spirit."
---BRUCE5656 on 3/12/07

1. water: of repentance / spirit: of reborn
2. water: wash the shame / spirit: wash the blame
3. after water: without hide / after spirit: without lack
4. water: close to sins / spirit: open to God
5. water: released in ten commandements / released in love
6. water:get out of the death / spirit: to the eternal life
7. water:turn the desire to sins to the desire to God / spirit: fullfill the desire to God
---dsda on 3/11/07

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Unless a man is first brought into this tangible existence by way of the womb of woman (natural birth) & be regenerated & restored to lost awareness from above through a renewing of his mind by the Word & Divine inspiration of the Father,( Spiritual rebirth) he can not arise and enter into the realm of the power & support that has been provided for him. The kingdom of God is the reign of the Father's Spirit within us, a reign recognized & acknowledge upon the humble submission of our will to His.
---joseph on 3/10/07

Exodus 17:6
Behold, I will stand before thee there upon the rock in Horeb; and thou shalt smite the rock, and there shall come water out of it, that the people may drink. And Moses did so in the sight of the elders of Israel.

The miracle was Jesus Himself. Just as he explained in John 6, He was also the manna....the Bread of Life.
All NT is rooted in OT. Scripture teaches scripture.
---kathr4453 on 3/10/07

Humans give life to their children. yet only God's Spirit can change you into a child of God. Simply means--When we consider the holiness of the God with whom we have to do, the depravity of our nature, we shall not think it strange that so much stress is laid upon this as the one thing needful, that we must be born again.
---catherine on 3/9/07

To be born-again has nothing to do with water period. It does't matter how many times a person get water baptized. It will not bring spiritual rebirth.

A person is not baptized in the HS at the sametime they get born from above. The bible lists several baptisms.

1. Baptized into the body(1Corinthians 12:13)
2. Baptism in water(Matthew 28:19)
3. Baptism in the Holy Spirit(Matthew 3:11; Luke 3:16)
---Rickey on 3/9/07

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To me this means that Jesus is the living water, in which he tells us if we drink from the water he gives us, we will never thirst again, and give us everlasting life. We must be born again in order for us to drink from the living water and have everlasting life. John 4:13-15. Everyone is born from water. That isn't what Jesus was talking about.
---Rebecca_D on 3/9/07

You are a spirit, have a soul, are in a body.
The only part of you that get's born from above is your spirit.

That has nothing to do with water baptism.(Romans 10:9-10; Ephesians 2:8-9)

We are not water baptized into the body of Christ, but are simply placed, spiritually, in the body of Christ by the Holy Spirit.(1Corinthians 12:13)
---Rickey on 3/9/07

The baptism in the Holy Spirt is for every believer. It is done after a person get's born again by Jesus, but it requires our faith. (Matthew 3:11; Mark 1:8; Luke 3:11)

It does come with the evidence of speaking in tongue. Proof is all through the books of Acts & 1Corinthians 14:1-2.Water in John 3 refers to the word of God according to 1Peter 1:23.

Water baptism doesn't move God or change a person. God is only moved by His word.
---Rickey on 3/9/07

The only way for a person to get born-again or born from above is to do what Romans 10:9-10 says.

I can see one common sense reason why God doesn't include water baptism as a requirement for salvation. If He did then folks would boast and say that the way they were baptized got them saved. Saying that they had a part in getting them saved.

Ephesians 2:8-9 begs to differ. We are saved by His grace & no man can boast about it saying they had part in buying their redemption.
---Rickey on 3/9/07

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Ephesians 5:26 says, "That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,"

Washing of water is only through the word of God. Not water baptism.

Water baptism doesn't/can't bring redemption or play any part in it.
Reason being, Jesus didn't come to redeem our bodies, but our spirit. He didn't bring bodily rebirth, but spiritual.

God is the Father of our spirit.(Hebrews 12:6)
---Rickey on 3/9/07

Except a man is born from above he cannot see the kingdom of God; simply means that unless a person does what Romans 10:9-10 says he or she cannot see things the way God sees them.

Simply put, w/o being born from above a person is spiritually blind & disconnected from God.

Don't put emphasis on water or baptism concerning salvation. Paul did not in 1Corinthians 1:17.
---Rickey on 3/9/07

Please don't go to "rules", so to speak, to get saved. The Galatian church was going back to the law. Paul had to remind them that Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law.

If water baptism was required for salvation Jesus would've made emphasis on it.

If water baptism was required, then God would've told when the rapture is going to be so that every believer could get water baptized on time.

Praise God that water baptism isn't required or needed for salvation.
---Rickey on 3/9/07

Scripture refers to the Water of the Word. James also says we are Born Again of the WORD of God. When Jesus was crucified, both water and blood came out of His side. The WORD became flesh and dwelt among us. Just one more testimony that Jesus was/is the Christ!
---kathr4453 on 3/9/07

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Sorry, that scripture is in Peter.
1 Peter 1:23
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
---kathr4453 on 3/9/07

and another:
John 4:14
But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.
---kathr4453 on 3/9/07

I found another:
Ephesians 5:26
That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,
Those who say sanctification is not necessary to salvation doesn't understand salvation.
---kathr4453 on 3/9/07

Acts 19:1-6, John B's baptism was not sufficient to fulfill John 3:5. John the Baptist admitted that his baptism was inferior to Christ's, Mark 1:8. Paul asked which baptism they had received and seeing that it was only of John the Baptist, he completed the process with the laying on of hands - and then they received the Holy Ghost. John 3:22, shows that the disciples of Christ also baptised like John, but theirs had a superior quality than John the Baptist's.
---lorra8574 on 3/9/07

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Mima....I agree.
---JIM on 3/9/07

Born of water means repenting and turning away from sins and asking God for forgiveness and being water baptized like Jesus was. Born of the spirit means receiving the gift of the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in different languages as a sign of being baptized in the spirit.
---elena5773 on 3/9/07

The first time you are born, you are born of the flesh, through a womb.

The second time you are born, you are born of the Spirit of God. Your spirit man becomes alive through the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, thus you are Born Again, born of the Spirit of God.
---donna6598 on 3/9/07

You are referring to John 3:5 where Jesus is answereing Nicodemus about being born again. Jesus said, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. (The water simbolizes Purity and that is Baptism.) In John 1:32 John gave this testomy:"I saw the Spirit come down from heaven as a dove and remain on Him,.... you saw the Spirit come down and remain with the Holy Spirit. I have seen and I testify that this is the Son of God"
---Lloyd on 3/9/07

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Jesus was talking about born from above through the word and the Spirit. Water in this verse refers to the word of God.(1Peter 1:23)

In verse 3 it shows that water in this verse doesn't refer to water baptism because it says "born from above".
---Preah-Aholic on 3/9/07

Jesus explains the two births here. The first one, of water, the second one the spiritual. Except we experience both, not one, we will not be saved. You must be born again. That's two times, not once.
---john on 3/9/07

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