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Is Rome The Eternal City

Have you ever heard the city of Rome referred to as the "eternal" city. Recently I saw a gigantic photograph on the wall in a dentist office and it referred to the city of Rome as the "eternal" city. Does the Bible call Rome the "eternal" city?

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 ---Mima on 5/7/07
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Rhondda ... I made the point because you seemed to be saying that all European cities were beautiful.
Maybe you are thinking of Rome, Venice, Budapest, Florence, Dubrovnic, Salzburg ... theb ons promoted in the travel brochures.
But there are other European cities which would never ever be classified as beautiful
---alan_of_UK on 5/29/08

Alan I fail to see your point ...there must be several hundred thousand cities in Europe of which no mortal human could spend time in ALL of them to appreciate every detail ...sorry if you struggled with my use of the word "all" ...either way all cities on earth will lay in ruins prior to Christs return
---Rhonda on 5/28/08

The Eucharist was started by Jesus in the Gospels

Although off topic the eucharist is not in Gods Word is a heathen practice by universal ...Christ did not practice this vain form of worship and not one of His Apostles did either
---Rhonda on 5/28/08

AlanofUk, you do not know warfare, psychological warfare. No, I did not say they closed down websites, I say that my experience and that of others is that black psy ops are done on the people, and also they get obstructed. Some of what I have said has actually helped the Jesuits - because so much disinformation is around, that of course I am bound to also reproduce some of it.
---frances008 on 5/25/08

In fact, almost all those involved in the conspiracy theory website viewing are being disinformed and deceived. That is, most of the people RUNNING the sites are working for the Vaticans, but some are working for the atheist cause, both of these are working for the NWO. If I find some people telling the truth about the Catholics, of course I will protect my sources because it is not of much use if I report them. At the moment they get few hits on their youtubes.
---frances008 on 5/25/08

AlanofUk, you are ask very strange questions. The RCC is VERY VERY powerful. Yet you question me for saying so. I know they could easily find a way of getting rid of me, but God will only let them do it when He is ready. In the meantime, I am doing my best, without 100 per cent of the knowledge. I can see why people are reluctant to support me publicly. They too KNOW that things are very dangerous at the moment. It is easier and safer to criticise and discredit me.
---frances008 on 5/25/08

AlanofUk, what OTHER church could Revelations 17 and 18 possibly be referring to. Even DDM, he claims to be a Christian, but he won't say what I say, because it is the truth and it's dangerous to say the truth. Things happen to people who say the truth, or things happen to their loved ones.
---frances008 on 5/25/08

Pat Buchanan - K of Malta - advisor for three presidents. Please look into him. Now in the Truth Movement. Do you trust him?
---frances008 on 5/25/08

Frances ... The Jesuits, & the RC are so powerful thatt thay close down any web-site whch exposes them.
Why them have they not closed this site?
Your expose must surely have been noticed?
---alan_of_UK on 5/25/08

Rome is a city of hypocrisy. I like Italy, but not Rome. Maybe I visited it at the wrong time of year of something. I was very very disappointed in it, and my good parents who were Catholic (I don't know what they are now) were sad for my sake that it was not at its best. Scaffolding everywhere, as far as I recall. Most museums shut. Even the Cycstine Chapel was closed. What a con.
---frances008 on 5/25/08

Rhondda ... "Rome is a beautiful city as are all european cities"
Have you been to them all?
Some English cities are horrible.
Have yuo read recently about Naples?
Have you been to Bucharest?
---alan_of_UK on 5/25/08

According to the Bible, Rome is what John saw in Revelation. Chapters 17 and 18, it specifies all the RCC has done/ is doing, the seven hills, that it's near the sea, (Italy is in the middle of the Meditterranean), that is made men rich, that it consorted with kings and politicians (the Red Mass) and that it was responsible for the death of many saints and martyrs - the Inquisitions, holocausts - wars - genocides - starvation of poor countries - Aids - revolutions - terrorism - etc.
---frances008 on 5/24/08

The Bible calls that great city, the mother of harlots. Revelation 17:5 through Revelation 19:21.
---Eloy on 5/24/08

Frances. Why you listen to a NIV footnote rather than to listen to Jesus and Saint Paul is beyond my understanding. The Eucharist was started by Jesus in the Gospels (which Jesus told us to do it), it was stated again by Saint Paul (1 Cor: 10:16, 11:18-34) and the God-Bearing Fathers taught it, and was preserve by One, Holy, Apostolic, Catholic [meaning universal] Church of God, which exist in today in the Orthodox Church.

But I guess the NIV is more authoritative than Jesus and the Apostles right?
---Ramon on 5/23/08

Did you know that the Colosseum in Rome was Built using the Gold that Titus took from the Temple in Jerusalem when he Burned it to the Ground in 70 AD?

This was the 1st part of Matt.24 that was fulfilled about 40 yrs. after Jesus said it, that Not one stone of the Temple would be left upon another.
---Duane_Dudley_Martin on 5/23/08

Rome is a beautiful city as are all european cities may appear eternal now but all of the cities on earth including Rome will be destroyed during the tribulation be rebuilt in the millenium ...holding Rome in high esteem is pointless everything here is temporary ...Rome will lay in ruins like all cities of the earth just prior to the return of Christ ...During millenium Christ will rule from Jerusalem
---Rhonda on 5/23/08

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Frances008, it kills you that the RCC has Scripture from Jesus' very own words to back us up. The RCC doesn't make a Tradition and then starts looking in the Bible to back up the Traditions. No, in fact the RCC was here over 3 centuries before the Bible. The 73 canons of Books in the Bible was selected by the RCC.
The idea of Holy Communion came from John Chapter 6. Jesus is truth and speaks the truth.
---Nicole on 5/23/08

jerry is right, God's church isn't confined to one denomination or another, it is composed of all true believers...from EVERY denomination. Although, I believe in the end-time there will be a polarizing and all the believers will come together under one banner. Rome is nothing fact...I'd say it has many skeletons in the closet. In terms of heaven and earth connecting, I'd say the holiest nation is Israel, the holiest city is Jerusalem, and the holiest spot the Temple Mount. :-)
---Todd1 on 5/22/08

In Hebrews 13 it says a little bit about 'ceremonial foods'. The King James, old version calls them meats. The writer of Hebrews says that they have no power to save us, unlike the sacrifice on Calvary. The footnotes to the NIV say that ceremonial foods were the idea of legalistic Jews trying to bring in their ideas (I'd say superstitions) into the Christian church. That is how Catholics got the idea of Holy Communion.
---frances008 on 5/22/08

Rome is called the 'eternal city' not because it will remain on earth forever. Scholars of the Early Church Fathers states HOLY MASS it a state of place when Heaven and Earth is connected. During Mass all the Angels and Saints gather with us here on earth praising the Holy Trinity together, with Jesus uniting us all. Jesus brought us back to His Father. So, Rome being the Mother of all Churches with Peter(popes)as it's head having the keyes to Heaven (Matt 16:13-19) Opening Heaven to us here on earth.
---Nicole on 5/22/08

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No, the Bible doesn't call Rome the Eternal City, but so what?

I believe it is so called beause it is one of the oldest, if not the oldest, continuing cities in Western Europe (admittedly a rather narrow view), being founded over 700 years before the birth of Christ.

Get over yourself, Mima.
---Jack on 5/22/08

Lorra & emcee: I am a Seventh-day Adventist. I believe in an even more universal church than emcee does. The true church is the aggregate of God's true people. It was founded in the garden of Eden, was for a time the Israelites and is now in Christianity, and will remain forever in Heaven. Same God, same Commandments, same method of salvation - "the lamb of God, slain from the foundation of the world."
---jerry6593 on 5/22/07


I am not giving you my personal view about anything. I am just stating facts. Just turn to the Anglican, Lutheran, Methodist and Presbyterian Churches for more answers / information. They all believe in something beyond mere symbolism. Priest and theologians who hold a merely symbolist point of view are in the minority.

As i said before the only Churches who hold a clear symbolist view are Baptists and Mormons. And even some Baptists believe that Communion is more than mere symbolism.
---Ed on 5/20/07

2. Alan

Lutheran's, for example, belive in consubstantiation. Anglicans tend to go more for one or the other (transubstantiation or symbolism). Other Protesntants believe in pneumatic presence. Methodists are more vague and talk about Communion containing 'Holy Mystery'.

And so forth.
---Ed on 5/20/07

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Really Jerry:: You understood what suited you to agree.The rest was written in the same strain.Was it too dificult to acknowlege what your Faith is? I am a Roman Catholic what is your religion based on Belief does it have a name? Confusion is one of the facets for an unanswered Question.
---Emcee on 5/20/07

Jerry, then I can only assume that, based on your comments you are now a circumcised practicing Jew of Gentile origin. If Mary belonged to the True Church and Jesus started a new Church, then by proper definition, His Church is heretic from the True Church that Mary belonged to in your eyes. Am I the one who is confused, or are you, because what you have said does not make a lot of sense.
---lorra8574 on 5/20/07

Jerry, we are grafted in to the Family of God which began with Abraham and so includes Judaism. However, if Judaism was the perfected form of His Church, then we would still be Jewish. We still have many similiarities to what was, but ours is the more perfect form of what was - formed by Christ and guided by the Holy Spirit.
---lorra8574 on 5/20/07

Emcee: The only change of heart I had was when I accepted Jesus. Otherwise, I don't know what you're talking about.

Lorra: You seem to me to be hopelessly confused. It is as if you are arguing against yourself. Have a nice day!
---jerry6593 on 5/20/07

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Ed ... Your view of "real presence" implies physical presence.
---alan_of_UK on 5/19/07

Jerry, if you knew more about the Catholic Church and Judaism you would recognise her Jewish roots much more clearly than in any other Christian church. But the Jewish "church" was not yet "true" when Mary was born. Everything was in place to allow it to be true, but its members had corrupted it. Jesus opened the doors to the Gentiles after first bringing the Good News to the Jews and built a new Church beginning with Peter.
---lorra8574 on 5/19/07

Jerry P2: It is this Church that Jesus made His promise that the gates of Hell would not prevail against it - Matthew 16:18. And this Church, not the Temple at Jerusalem, that Paul said was the Pillar and Foundation (or ground or bulwark) of Truth 1 Tim 3:15.

We understand that Jesus did not start a whole new religion, but a Church that is grounded in the Faith of Abraham and his decendants.
---lorra8574 on 5/19/07

Jerry::Yes what you say is so true But is it not also true that.The people of this inheritance rejected Jesus?as their Messiah even to this day?psalm,118:22.I am glad you have had a change of heart what Faith are you of Now?Do you then accept Matt16::17-19??
---Emcee on 5/19/07

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Lorra: What came before was also of Jesus. To answer your question; I am a grafted-in Jew (Rom 11:23), of Abraham's seed and an heir according to the promise (Gal 3:29). Aren't you?
---jerry6593 on 5/19/07


You might have a memorialist view of Communion. But most Anglican priests and theologians teach that the bread and wine has Real Presence (and some: Transubstantion). That is a fact (not my point of view). And most Methodists and many Presbyterians also teach that the Communion has Real Presence. More than mere symbolism.

The only denominations who cleary hold memorialist views on Communion are Baptists and Mormons.
---Ed on 5/19/07

Helen::You quote Luke22:19 to prove thisis a ceremony of Remembrance & of not much importance.But if You read Jn6:41-65 you will understand,if you want to, that you & Alan are not the only ones to not Believe & seek for His love & understanding is to reveal to you the Truth.
---Emcee on 5/18/07

Jerry, are you Jewish? Mary was born into the Jewish faith, she became a Christian. I am not anti-semitic, but Jesus established the True Church, what came before was the Old Covenant.
---lorra8574 on 5/18/07

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Helen ... I was saying to you that what Ed said in his blog of 5/17 is correct.
He had not said anything about the bread becoming Jesus Himself, and I share your view that the RCC is wrong in this understanding of the Eucharist
And I would now say to Ed that Part 1 of his of 5/18 is incorrect ... most Anglicans beleive that Communion is remembrance, and the elements do not change
---alan_of_UK on 5/18/07

Helen, was Paul a heretic? 1 Cor 10:16:21; 1 Cor 11:23-29. The early Christians believed in the real presence of the Eucharist. Even during the Reformation it took a while to move away from this idea. Has it served anyone well? Even now I know that there are Protestants who do believe in the real presence and are troubled by it because their own church does not teach it.
---lorra8574 on 5/18/07

3. Helen.

"Christian communion is totally symbolic of Christ's death on the Cross for sin"
Therefore you think that all "Christians" who don't believe in symbolic-only view Communion are not Christians i.e some Baptists, and all Presbyetrians, Methodists, Lutherans, Anglicans, Orthodox and Christians?

Why do you come to these blogs? Do you want to convert people? Why should people listen to you and not the other Churches?
---Ed on 5/18/07

Ed - ("Few Christians (i.e some Baptists and Latter Day Saints), in fact, hold your Zwinglian, symbolic-only, view.") -- Ed, what then does Jesus mean when He says "Do this in remembrance of Me" (Luke 22:19 and 1 Corinthians 11:24)?
---Helen_5378 on 5/18/07

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1. Helen

Roman Catholics, Orthodox, Lutherans, Anglicans, Methodists, even Presbyterians, believe that Communion is more than merely symbolic (Catholics, Orthodox, and Luterhans/Anglicans, to a degree, holding stronger views than Presbyterians. But Presbyterians believe in more than symbolic. You saying all these Christians are satanical in their practice?

Few Christians (i.e some Baptists and Latter Day Saints), in fact, hold your Zwinglian, symbolic-only, view.
---Ed on 5/18/07

2. Helen

Jesus says (John):

'He that eateth my flesh and drinketh my blood hath everlasting life: and I will raise him up in the last day.'

Therefore you need to be very careful about using words such as satanical and heretical when, in fact, very few Christians, hold you view on this subject.
---Ed on 5/18/07

Ed - I do not know anything about the other denominations you mention. I only know about the RCC Eucharist. The Eucharist in the RCC is totally different from Christian communion. The RCC Eucharist, supposedly, is Jesus Christ Himself and RCs think that is how they receive Jesus. That is heresy. Christian communion is totally symbolic of Christ's death on the Cross for sin.
---Helen_5378 on 5/17/07

AlanofUK - I say the same to you as I just said to Ed. The Eucharist and communion are totally different, at least where the RCC is concerned. The RCC Eucharist teaches heresy because it says that a person receives Jesus in the wafer i.e. that the wafer actually becomes Jesus.
---Helen_5378 on 5/17/07

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Helen ... Ed is quite correct
What you consider, is just your prejudiced opinion
---alan_of_UK on 5/17/07


With respect what are you talking about?

1. Methodists, Lutherans, Anglicans, and Orthodox use word Eurcharist as well. You saying their practice is all satanic as well?

2. Catholics use word Communion as well.

3. You don't know your Catholic doctrine (which is only fair to know if you are going to attack it).
Eucharit and communion are not the same. Eucharist is the whole memorial of The Last Supper, and commuinion is the partaking of the consecrated bread and wine.
---Ed on 5/17/07

Ramon - I consider the eucharist and communion to be two completely different things. The eucharist is the RCC version and they believe that it is becomes Jesus. Communion is what is celebrated in remembrance of Jesus' death on the Cross. So, no the eucharist is not the real thing therefore I do not "believe in it".
---Helen_5378 on 5/15/07

*What is absurd is that. . . the wafer actually turns into Jesus.*

Helen, you don't even know what the word "Eucharist" means and jumping to conclusions. It means "Thanksgiving". Yes, Transubstantiation, which states the bread and wine turn to the body and blood of Jesus, is incorrect according to the Bible. Transubstantiation attempts to explain what happens to the Eucharistic elements.

Helen, do you or do you not believe in the Eucharist (not Transubstantiation)?
---Ramon on 5/15/07

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Helen #2 *I do not believe in the RCC eucharist as they claim it turns into Jesus Himself, which is gross error.*

Helen, you do not believe in the interpretation that RCC has on the Eucharist (also called The Lord's Supper, Holy Communion and other names). None of these names states the bread and wine turn into the body and blood of Jesus.

But to say you don't believe in the Eucharist is contradictory to your posts, for you say you believe in "Communion" (The Lord's Supper).
---Ramon on 5/15/07

There is a world of difference between something that is satanic and something that is absurd.
---Ed on 5/15/07

Catholics don't believe it is literally Jesus. This would be absurd.
Nor do they believe it is just a normal piece of bread.
Like many things in religion it is a mystery. You cannot pin that down in black and white. Which is why your black and white, point-of-view, on this issue, Helen, is complely off-the-mark / innacurate, and I am sorry to say, absurd.
---Ed on 5/15/07

Ed - What is absurd is that anybody believes that the wafer actually turns into Jesus who is seated in Heaven at the right hand of the Father.
---Helen_5378 on 5/15/07

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Actually maybe evil can be an evil force or the absense of good. Surely something that is satanic is an evil force though. That is more clear i think. To say there is something satanic about transubstiation is in my view - absurd (and dangerously so).
---Ed on 5/15/07

1. Helen.
And my faith is in Jesus. I Don't get your point.
99% of Christians believe in the Eucharist. If you don't believe in the Eucharist then you cannot be a Catholic, Lutheran, Baptist, Presbyterian, Anglican, Orthodox, Copt, Armenian. They all believe in the Eucharist.
If you mean transubstiation then, yes, that pertains to Roman Catholicism (and some Protestants and i believe Orthodox). Transubstiation is a part of the Eucharist. It does not equal the Eucharist in definition.
---Ed on 5/14/07

2. Helen.
With respect you are jumping to a wild, meaningless conclusions(on this point - i am not making a generalized remark about you). When someone says they believe in something it doesn't mean they worship that thing or concept but that they believe in the reality of the thing of concept. For example i believe that 2 x 2 = 4. Doesn't mean i worship 4. Do you understand what i am getting at?
---Ed on 5/14/07

3. Helen
Lastly your argument is about transubstiation. Fair enough. If that is what you think then so be it.
But with respect to say it is evil and satanic is absurd. Evil is a force / power. How can bread contain evil or be evil? If so it is just a piece of bread like what you believe. Where is the evil?
If the bread is just bread then all the Catholic is doing is eating bread. The Catholic hasn't purposely done anything to offend God.

---Ed on 5/14/07

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4. Helen
I really like you sister. But i don't like it when you attack the RCC so. Why do you do it.
I have felt the great Love of God in my Catholic faith. Why do you want to attack my faith? Why do you loathe RCC so much?
Be honest: did someone in the Catholic Church hurt you? Or maybe someone in your family who was a Catholic wasn't nice to you.
Why are you so anti-Catholic.
Take care. Ed
---Ed on 5/14/07

Ed - I believe that Jesus died on the Cross for sin and that He rose from the dead. I believe that communion is done in remembrance of Jesus' death on the Cross. I do not believe in the RCC eucharist as they claim it turns into Jesus Himself, which is gross error. Jesus and the communion wafer are not one and the same. Maybe you could explain a bit more what you mean by "believe in the eucharist". My faith is in Jesus.
---Helen_5378 on 5/14/07

Lorra: Jesus was also a Jew. So what? Are you anti-semitic or something?
---jerry6593 on 5/14/07


I don't understand at all what you are trying to say. Do you believe in the Eucharist or not (some Christians don't).
It appears that you do. In which case what is the enormous, huge gulf that makes Catholicism satanical / evil?

With respect Helen: you do not persuade. Your approach on this is too dualistic, too manichean (not in general, just on this).

And yes i too believe in Jesus.
---Ed on 5/13/07

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Jerry, Mary was Jewish. At Christ's birth Isreal was a nation not a Church. The True Church is the one that Christ founded, otherwise what was the point of establishing a new church? Pagan Rome was certainly a threat and created a lot for problems for the True Church, even for a while after the empire converted to Christianity. But in the end, the Lamb prevailed and His Church remains while the Roman Empire has disintegrated.
---lorra8574 on 5/13/07

Lorra: The true church at the time of Christ's birth was Israel, and Mary was a member. The power that tried to destroy him was Rome.
---jerry6593 on 5/13/07

Mima; If you're trying to equate Rome with the New Jerusalem, it wont work. Rome is a literal city,New Jerusalem is not! 1500 miles long,1500 miles wide and 1500 miles high (higher than the space station) obviously figurative!
---1st_cliff on 5/12/07

Ed - ("Do you condemn all Christians who believe in the Eucharist?") -- I do not "believe in the Eucharist". I believe in Jesus. True Christian communion is done in remembrance of what Jesus did on the Cross in His finished work there for sin. The bread symbolizes His broken body on the Cross. The wine symbolizes His Blood shed on the Cross for sin.
---Helen_5378 on 5/12/07

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Jerry, this woman is the mother of the True Church and the mother of Christ. The True Church did not give birth to Jesus. The woman is also adorned with the symbols of Isreal, the stars and the sun and the moon, for she is a daughter of Isreal. But just as the serpent/dragon is a real individual, and the man-child is a real individual, so to is the Woman a real individual, the same one prophesied in Isaiah 7:14. This woman giving birth to the Messiah without a human father is the Sign or Great Wonder.
---lorra8574 on 5/12/07


Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

The woman of Rev. 12 is the true church.

A time + times + 1/2 time is 1260 years (538 AD - 1798 AD) - the years of papal persecution.

The wilderness is the Italian Alps.

You know who the serpent is.
---jerry6593 on 5/12/07

2. Helen

Majority of Christians: Catholics, Lutherans, Methodists, Anglicans, Baptists, Presbyterians, Orthodox, Copts and Armenians - (99%) of Christians believe in and practice the Eucharist (although with different interpretations). Jesus says "do this in memory of me" during the Last Supper.

Do you condemn all Christians who believe in the Eucharist? And mightn't you well be wrong when you consider Jesus words above?
---Ed on 5/11/07


Don't forget that Jesus was a charasmatic figure. The evil one tries to be charasmatic but only have to dig under the service to see that it rests on dust. But Jesus' charisma is real and etermal - it is part of the beauty - the magic - that we see reflected in the universe (the stars, the natural world and so forth). But above all a charisma rooted in Love. The evil one can never really fake that.

No-one has a monopoly on Love or knowledge of God so why do you attack Catholics so?
---Ed on 5/11/07

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AlanofUK - Of course RCs deny that they are in idolatry. Before I was saved I would have outright denied that I was sinning, because I had no idea what sin was until Jesus came and saved me, then the light turned on. Until a person comes to the Light, they have no idea that they are in error.
---Helen_5378 on 5/11/07


I know lots of Catholics who spend more of their lives living out the main two commandments of Christ: which is to Love God and neighbour (just turn to the gospels). Just as I know Protestants who do the same.
No angel of light can fake the divine love of God. At the end of the day that is what it is all about (just read Corinthians 13). Only people who love can be Christians, whether they be Catholic or Protestant. And nobody has a monopoly on love.
---Ed on 5/11/07

AlanofUK - The RCC practice of crucifying Jesus over and over again every day is very evil. The problem with the RCC is that it is very very subtly deceptive, which makes it so very dangerous. For all accounts, it looks and even sounds like the real thing. In reality it is full of angels of light. I am not the only one on these Blogs who sees this.
---Helen_5378 on 5/10/07

---jerry6593 on 5/8/07
Yes, Rome, the seat of the Pagan Roman Empire was indeed Babylon of the scriptures. And where in the Bible does it say that the Christ's Church should flee in terror and hide forever from Babylon and the Beast? We have the Lamb on our side.
---lorra8574 on 5/10/07

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Helen ... You know very well I have argued strongly and sometimes bitterly with Emcee about what I see as wrongs in the RCC.
Why then do you imply that I do not see wrongs there?
Your methods of trying to discredit someone who disagrees with you is dishonest and dishonourable.
You should keep to the discussion points, and not attack someone's personal integrity.

---alan_of_UK on 5/10/07

Helen ... I've now seen your later post, which explains somewhat why you condemn me.
Idolatry (if that truly is what the RCC practice, although they would deny it) is a sin, as is adultery or theft.
But evil and satanic?
---alan_of_UK on 5/10/07

Helen, you always label Catholics as evil.

Your accusations are evil and hateful and not the RCC.
---Caring on 5/10/07

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