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Is There Really A Rapture

Is there really such thing as the rapture, or will Christ come back and take us home to heaven and send the wicked to hell?

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 ---trey on 10/24/07
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Along the same lines some people have formulated a interesting question.

Will GOD take those in the rapture who are in fact not looking for the rapture and actuality denied the rapture?

My position is "yes" but Scripture does say he is coming for those who are looking for him.
---mima on 12/27/09

how to tell the difference in the rapture and the second coming READ, compare zech. 14:4 plus acts 1 to 1 thess 4 plus 1 cor.15. they are not the same
---michael_e on 12/27/09

where did Enoch go?where did Elijah go in his chariot?..the idea of man not being allowed into heaven,even Paul the apostle visited the third heaven,he just was unable to say if it was in the spirit,what about the souls under the altar?..God has "purpose" in rapture,He has "purpose" in the 1000yr.earthly millenium..for some reason these bible truths are under attack,so all Christians need to study and tackle these issues as being important!
---richard on 12/27/09

Jesus is coming a second time at which point, the believers who are dead will be resurrected and the ones who remain alive will be taken up to join Him in the air as He returns. The unbelieving will be left behind and will face the His great wrath as He destroys the earth as it is now. He will then create a new heaven and earth where people will dwell during the millennium. When the Bible speaks of one taken and another left behind, it is referring to His second coming. Pre-trib type of rapture is a man made concept and is wishful thinking.
---jody on 12/27/09

Pastor Herb, If Christ does not return to the earth on the Rapture "the gathering of believers," how can everyone see Him and hear Him? Are do you think this rapture is silent and secret? Where no one knows and later when one wakes up, he finds the other gone? Is that what you believe the word of God says? Can you explain?
---MarkV. on 12/26/09

I agree completely with what Pastor Herb has to say as concerned eschatology!
---mima on 12/26/09

The rapture happens in the air, this is not the second comming. The second comming is when Christ returns to the earth. The rapture he does not return to the earth. After the rapture starts the 7 year tribulation, after that Christ will return to the earth to reign 1000 years. After that there will be a war and another resurection and then the heaven and earth will be distroyed and a new heaven and earth will be created. The bible is so clear on this I don't know some cannot see this.
---Pastor_Herb on 12/26/09

There won't be a "rapture" like most people think. No MAN is going to heaven. The Bible tells us that Jesus will start his descent from Heaven. What does it mean to descend? It means to come down, right. As he comes down from heaven he will resurrect the ones that were obedient to his Word (kept his commandments) and they will MEET Him in the air. From there your question should be where are they going after they meet in the air. Let's go to the Bible for that. Zechariah 14: 4-5 (The Lord's feet will stand on the Mt of Olives. vs.5 The Lord shall come and all the saints with thee.) These were the saints in the first resurrection and they will come back to the EARTH. With all thy getting, get Understanding.
---Israelite on 12/26/09

Kathr, again I post, "the visible church" Where tares and wheat meet, on Sunday's or Saturday's for the SDA's.
Again I post, no one is stupid enough to think the "spiritual Church"

There will be no more corrections for you. Two times should be enough.
---MarkV. on 12/26/09

Mark E, #2: ---(vs.7,8).
5. This antichrist would take his seat inside "the temple of God" (vs.4), which is the Church (1 Cor. 3:16, Eph. 2:21).
6. ---MarkV. on 12/24/09

Again MarkV, no evil can enter a SPIRITUAL TEMPLE of Christ's body which is the Church.

I said before that was rediculous, and will say it again. Colossians 1. The CHURCH which is HIS BODY is the most secure place anyone can be.

Rev 11, clearly state this fact.

The woman who rides the beast is apostate christianity, both the beast and Woman HATE ISRAEL. Just look at James Kennedy(Reformed Theology) is into political posturing against Israel as we speak! HELLO!!
---kathr4453 on 12/26/09

Samuel, you are correct, the Second Coming is the Second Coming, there is no third Coming. It is all one event. First, one thing, then the other.
---MarkV. on 12/24/09

Mark E, #2: (Rome fell in 476 A.D.), the antichrist would be revealed (vs.7,8).
5. This antichrist would take his seat inside "the temple of God" (vs.4), which is the Church (1 Cor. 3:16, Eph. 2:21).
6. He will operate until the bright, visible, glorious return of our Lord (vs. 8).
7. When Jesus Christ comes, He will destroy the antichrist and gather His faithful people who have not "fallen away" from the Truth of His Word (verses 1,3,8,10-12).
---MarkV. on 12/24/09

The rapture is the Second Coming. So the question is asking is the Second Coming the Second Coming.

One of the things that I think is interesting. Is that many teaches that the rapture is not the Second coming but is a coming to take the church home which will be the second time he comes. Confusing.

We should not get bogged down in details. The Jews mapped out exactly how the Messiah was to come and so missed JESUS. Let us be ready to see him today.
---Samuel on 12/24/09

Mark E, first, Merry Christmas, to you and family. May the New Year bring peace to you and family.
Ok, From 2 Thess. 2: Putting the pieces together
1. The antichrist would rise as a result of a tremendous falling away (vs.3) in the Church before Jesus Christ returns to gather the faithful (vs.1).
2. Paul called this antichrist, "the man of sin" (vs.3), "the son of perdition" (vs.3), "the mystery of lawlessness" (vs. 7), and "That wicked" (vs. 8 KJV).
3. This "mystery of lawlessness" was already working in Paul's day (vs. 7), yet it was being restrained (vs. 5-7) by the Casesars of the Roman Empire.
4. After this restraint was removed
---MarkV. on 12/24/09

Here is some meat to chew on.. the "secret" rapture happens to the church,it also (possibly later) occurs to the 144000 Jews (therefore 2 raptures!).The rest of the Jews,unsaved (nominal)Christians and unbelieving Gentiles go through the tribulation with the offer of salvation/matyrdom available to the end.No mortal flesh lives into the millenium,dont forget innocents (children that die young for example)will also be there and thats partly the reason for the "war" that occurs after the 1000 years.
---richard on 12/24/09

Herod represents anti-christ, one who had no right to sit as KING of Israel, not being a descendant of Judah but Edom ***

Let me repeat again.

Read Matt 2 and compare Rev to Matt 2.

Herod/ a TYPE of Anti-christ:

Herod, the imposter king..not the King of Kings:

Herod, murdered the children of Israel to try to Kill Jesus, failed, just as anti-christ will fail.

Herod, in killing and driving Mary and family away is the seed spoken of in Genesis 3:15 , satan's seed. Christ will certainly in the end WIN!!! also parallels Revelation 12.

Herod was place there by ROME.

Rome destroyed Jerusalem ...AND in 135AD was far worse than 70ad.

I would say more but your mind is made up.
---kathr4453 on 12/23/09

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You need regeneration Kathr to change your attitude, mind, and way of thinking. Only God can do that. Not even with your free will can you manage that.
---Mark_V on 12/22/09

MarkV, i am asking for the last time to refrain from your snide remarks when we disagree on scripture. Your last post, having no scripture to back, was my answer to Rhonda, not you.

You need regeneration MarkV. Everything you say is unbiblical from calvinism to all sorts of unbiblical comments here on line.
---kathr4453 on 12/23/09

MarkV, The anti-christ AKA the Beast does not come from apostate christianity. The tears etc would be Mystery Babylon, the Woman who rides the beast, is NOT the beast. Rev never states that the Beast comes out of Mystery Babylon, apostate Christianity. She rides the beast of coarse, there is a connection for a while, yet, Rev says the beast/anti-christ overthrows the woman. Nor does Rev teach mystery Babylon or apostate Christianity give the beast his power either.

As we read further into Revelation after Babylon has fallen, the Beast and false prophet are still standing, get overthrown by Jesus and we read both are thrown into the lake of fire.

Therefore, THIS anti-christ is not a spirit of anti-christ but an actual person!
---kathr4453 on 12/23/09

Kathr, you should not get into conversations about things since you know nothing about what it is people are saying. Mark E. understood that from withing the church the antichrist would come. The visible church made up of tares and wheat. No one is stupid enough to think he would come from the spiritual church. What a rediculous response but coming from you I can see that happening.
Your remarks only proofs my point that you have another purpose or agenda. As always you have not changed. You need regeneration Kathr to change your attitude, mind, and way of thinking. Only God can do that. Not even with your free will can you manage that.
---Mark_V on 12/22/09

You are saying within CHRIST's Body anti-christ comes......How blasphemous!

yes how else could the anti-christ pass himself off as ONE OF CHRISTS if he were not ACTING LIKE he belongs?

your "mystical" idea's are unbiblical

Gods Holy Spirit DWELLS WITHIN True Christians

RCC claims the Holy Spirit only dwells within their buildings ANTICHRIST to Scripture
---Rhonda on 12/21/09

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Mark E, The temple of God is" us " Mark. From within the Church the antichrist will come.
---MarkV. on 12/18/09

MarkV, that is the most ridiculous comment I've ever heard. The Church is the Temple of the Holy Spiritthe Church is the BODY of Christ, not a BUILDING or a gathering of peoples but His Mystical BODY, you are making a total contradiction here. How can anti-christ sit in us? We being Baptized into Christ making up the church..the True Church, no EVIL can enter in THAT TEMPLE??? IMPOSSIBLE!!

You are saying within CHRIST's Body anti-christ comes......How blasphemous!

Herod represents who had no right to sit as KING of Israel, not being a descendant of Judah but Edom
---kathr4453 on 12/21/09


You have a popular misconception.

No where in the Bible is the person who performs the AOD called the antichrist. This is important to realize.

You are correct, the term "antichrist" is only found in last 3 books of John.

What you have found is that these passages refer to a spirit of "antichrist" and not the "son of perdition" or the "lawless one". The spirit of "antichrist" does come from inside the church and we are seeing it just as the John did in his lifetime.

However, when you separate the term "antichrist" from the "lawless one" who performs the AOD, you can see that the person does not come from inside the church.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/21/09

Poster, you already answered your question: for the rapture is indeed Christ coming back to take us home to heaven.
---Eloy on 12/21/09

Steven G, "without you" allow me or others to correct you, I can do nothing for you. Unless you allow others to bring the truth to you, you will continue with "those prophets who don't speak," that you hear all the time from Washington or Oregon whom you met while on your bike ride when no church would give you help.
Again, it must be all that numbering in the Bible that confuses you. I don't know why they ever did that. The Bible writers should have known you would one day read the Bible and get confused. What's wrong with those guys? Was that predestination?
---MarkV. on 12/20/09

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MarkV: "Without you I can do nothing."

Correction: without God we can do nothing.
---Steveng on 12/19/09

Steven G, I am sorry I thought you were speaking to me. Thank you for the lessons. Without you I can do nothing.
I will be extra careful when answering from now on. I don't want to make mistakes on whom I answer. That I want to make sure of.

About the Bible, It must be the numbering of the scriptures that has me messed up. They should not have numbered the passages as you said, its terrible with the numbers. I cannot find what I am looking for.
---MarkV. on 12/19/09

MarkV: "Steven G, "Last Day" I've made no mention of last day."

You read scripture like you do with my post.

PASTOR_JIM:[colon, person speaking] [beginning quote of what pastor jim is going to write] "MARKE [not MARKV], I think the LAST DAY means hmmmmmmm?????? THE LAST DAY!!! After which there are NO MORE days left on this earth. THE END!"[end quote of what pastor jim wrote]

Maybe if you read posts and scripture slowly, you'll understand more.

Warning: do not use speed reading techniques when reading the bible.
---Steveng on 12/18/09

Mark E, The temple of God is" us " Mark. From within the Church the antichrist will come. What does the Bible really teach about these mysterious subject" The word "antichrist" or "Antichrists" plural, is found only five times in Scripture, and all of these references are in two books. The two books are 1st and 2nd John. The exact verse 1John 2:18, 2:19, 2:22,26, 4:3,4, and 2 John 7,9. The word of God describes not just one, but many antichrist. And according to 1 John 2:19, these many antichrist "went out from us," which means out from inside of the Christian Church
---MarkV. on 12/18/09

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Lets talk about verse 4 of Thess. 2, the antichrist seated in the temple or house of God. This is not, and cannot be, any Jewish temple. Paul who uses this expression in his prophetic portrait..employs it both in Corinthians and Ephesians with reference to the Christian Church. To Paul emphatically the temple of God was the Church of Christ.
---MarkV. on 12/17/09

No! anti-Christ can NEVER sit upon the THRONE in Heaven...IMPOSSIBLE.Does MarkV know the difference between THRONE and TEMPLE...????

Also note Daniel. The Church isn't even mentioned in the OT...but was HIDDEN and not even revealed until Christ rose from he dead, called..(The MYSTERY)
---kathr4453 on 12/18/09

Steven G, "Last Day" I've made no mention of last day. In fact I am going slow and from Daniel 9:27 I went to 2 Thess. and was going to go to Matthew next but one thing we have not talked about is "the son of perdition" in 2 Thess. 2:3,4. But we have to take one context at a time and the whole Truth comes out. Once the puzzle is put together a person can see the whole picture, only if he wants to. If his objective is to make sure we have the Truth and not fail as the Jewish nation as a whole failed to receive its Messiah because of the misinterpretation of Daniel 9:27. They fail to see Jesus Christ as the predicted One who would die in the midst of the 70th week.
---MarkV. on 12/18/09


What you are doing with the passage in 2 Thes 2 when you say that the temple is not the temple but is the Church of Christ is called "reading into" the passage.

The text is plain, the temple is just that.

Paul wrote the 2 Thess letter to the church and called it that in 2 Thes 1:1. Why would he turn around and refer to the church as a temple later?

No brother, you have to accept the text as written even if it destroys your theology.

This is why we are always learning.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/18/09

PASTOR_JIM: "MARKE, I think the LAST DAY means hmmmmmmm?????? THE LAST DAY!!! After which there are NO MORE days left on this earth. THE END!"

There is a new heaven and a new earth. Who will populate the new heaven? Who will populate the new earth?

There are two resurrections. One when Jesus returns and the dead in Christ shall rise and the living shall be caught up with them.

The second resurrection at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ when all the other dead from all of earth's history shall rise and be judged from the Book of life - according to their works. These and the unbelievers who endured unto the end of the tribulation, will inhabit the new earth.
---Steveng on 12/17/09

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Mark E. What Jesus said in context has nothing to do with what Paul said. You have mixed two different context and made one. To Paul, the temple of God was the Church of Christ. The one which his prophetic eye saw the man of sin seated. It is no question of his bodily location in any structure of wood or stone, but of something far highter. The temple of God is that "spiritual house" in which He dwells. It is build up of "living stones" of true believers. That is why when the name of antichrist is mentioned its found in the church among us, just check
1 John 2:18 Even now there are many antichrist
1 John 2:19 These many antichrist "went out from us." also 1 John 2:22, 2:26, 4:3, 4:4, 4:6, 7, 9.
---MarkV. on 12/17/09


The word you are referring to in 2 Thes 2:4 for temple of God is referring to the Jewish temple. It is used in the NT 46 time and 45 of them are translated "temple".

In fact, it means more specifically the sacred sancuary itself or even more specifically, the Holy of holies.

If you doubt Paul meant the Jewish temple, then refer to what Jesus said about it in Matt 24:15.

Jesus says when you see the AOD standing in the "holy place". This is the temple, not the church. The church was not in place yet.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/17/09

Mark E. What's clear is that before "The Second Coming of Christ" and our gathering together to Him, the "falling away comes first" and the antichrist must be revealed. Therefore, contrary to current popular opinion, It's "falling away" "apostasy" then antichrist then finally the Church is "caught up" not the other way around.
Lets talk about verse 4 of Thess. 2, the antichrist seated in the temple or house of God. This is not, and cannot be, any Jewish temple. Paul who uses this expression in his prophetic portrait..employs it both in Corinthians and Ephesians with reference to the Christian Church. To Paul emphatically the temple of God was the Church of Christ.
---MarkV. on 12/17/09


I say again, I have no trouble with your statement.

You have trouble with my statements.

I say that the "revealing" of the man of lawlessness in verse 3 occurs when the covenant with the many is made at the beginning of the week, or at the beginning of the Tribulation, not the middle, and not the end.

The gathering and return of our Lord in verse 1 is the same gathering and return in 1 Thes 4. Paul is talking to the same church about the same events he wrote to them in the first letter.

Based upon the revealing occuring at the beginning ot the Tribulation, the vision of Christ in Rev 19 cannot be the gathering and cannot the be Second Coming of Christ.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/17/09

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The rapture is when JESUS comes takes all the righteous to heaven and all the wicked are killed. The rapture and the Second Coming are the same event. See Matthew 24
---Samuel on 12/17/09

Mark E, lets get this correct first. 2 Thess. 1-4 is one complete context. This is the 5th mention of the "Coming of Christ" in the Thess. letters.
First, he say, concerning the Coming of our Lord and the gathering together,
Second, they were not to be shaken in mind or troubled as though the Day had come already.
Third, the warning, let no one deceive you
Forth, The Day will not come unless the falling away come first and also the man of sin is revealed. The antichrist "who opposes and exalts himself above all that is of God or that is worshipped, so that he sits as God in the temple showing he is God." verse 4.
So the Second coming of Christ cannot occure until all that happens.
---MarkV. on 12/16/09

Part #3. A survey of the writers of the New Testament revealed "the falling away" from Jesus Christ was predicted to occur inside of Christianity.
Acts 20 Paul told the elders of the church of Eph. v.17 that soon many false Church leaders would rise up from among themselves.
2 Tim 4, Paul predicted a time would come when many in the church would no longer "endure sound doctrine".
2 Peter 2, Peter told the early believers that soon "there will be false teachers among them v. 1.
Jude, warned that "certain men" had already crept in unnoticed" among them v.4
Paul called these "apostasy" cancer, "the mystery of lawlessness" 2 Thess. 2:7.
---MarkV. on 12/16/09


You read right past the entire meaning of the passage to make your point.

In the passage for 2 Thes 2:1-3, you highlighted everything except the correct passage for TIMING. The verses clearly tell us

"...for the Day WILL NOT COME unless the falling away come first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition"

Not be completed, the day will not ARRIVE. The Day of the Lord will not arrive until these things have been completed.

The Rev. 19 arrival by Jesus cannot the be gathering shown in 2 Thes 2. The Day of the Lord has already come.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/16/09

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Daniel 12 is a big key here:
The coming of christ coincides with the ressurection of the dead in christ, this happens after the time of trouble or rather in the midst of the time of trouble.
There is not one verse in the bible about 7 years of tribulation.
Also Paul says: When christ returns " we who are alive and remain.." which says that christ returns coinsides with the resurrecetion.Pauls also says that the wicked wil be consumes by the brightness of his coming.
---francis on 12/16/09

Mark E, the events shown by Left behind, are, "The rapture comes first, then seven years with the antichrist, then the visible second coming of Christ. In the return of Jesus, He returns visibly to deliver those who became Christians during the tribulation-after been given a second chance to be saved-and to pulverize the invading armies of Israel at Armageddon."
Because of this false teaching that "the Day of Christ" was just around the corner in their own day, some Thessalonian Christians had quit their jobs, stopped providing for their families, and were just hanging around doing nothing, waiting for Christ's imminent appearance (2 Thess. 3:10-12) Paul clarified the truth with his warning in verse 3 of 2 Thess. 2:1-4.
---MarkV. on 12/16/09

After which there are NO MORE days left on this earth.

---PASTOR_JIM on 12/16/09

Your theory is NOT Scriptural.

Rev 20:6 "Blessed and holy is the one who has a part in the first resurrection, over these the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him for a thousand years"

The return of Jesus and the resurrection cannot be the LAST physical DAY on Earth.

The people dead in Christ would miss the Marriage Supper of the Lamb and the Milllenial Reign of Christ.

And who are those armies that return with Jesus in Rev 19? Are they resurrected saints?

Read Isaiah about the "day of the Lord".
---Mark_Eaton on 12/16/09

Mark E, #2: The warning" 2 Thess.1-3, "Now brethren, concerning the Coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the Day of Christ had come. (here is the warning) Let no one deceive you by any means, for the Day will not come unless the falling away come first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition"
First, the gathering together to Him is obviously the same event as the descent of Jesus Christ from Heaven and our being "gathered together" to meet Him in the air (1 Thess. 4:17). What comes first? the falling away, and the antichrist. Not after.
---MarkV. on 12/16/09

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I think the LAST DAY means hmmmmmmm??????


After which there are NO MORE days left on this earth.

---PASTOR_JIM on 12/16/09

I have asked you repeatedly to show me a Scriptural definition of LAST DAY. You have never provided one.

then you must have missed my last post today

there are MANY scriptures provided
---Rhonda on 12/15/09


I have asked you repeatedly to show me a Scriptural definition of LAST DAY. You have never provided one.

Since you have not provided a definition, if I declare that the LAST DAY and LAST TRUMPET are the ones in 1 Thes 4:13-17, can you refute this with Scripture?

Which physical LAST DAY would you like to use? Is it: End of the current age, End of the Tribulation, End of the Millenial reign, End of the Old Earth, End of the New Earth?
---Mark_Eaton on 12/15/09

\\the LAST TRUMP is on the LAST DAY\\

And, by definition, the "Last Day" cannot be 1007 years BEFORE the Last Day.

In other words, there is no such thing as a pre-trib, pre-millennial rapture.
---Cluny on 12/15/09

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there is a rapture, it is part of the mystery program(not prophesied) revealed by the ascended christ to the apostle paul as written in Rom.16,25 different from what the 12 knew in Acts 3:21
Christ has a heavenly people BOC Eph. 2:6 phil 3:20 col.1:5 I thess 4:16-18 2 tim 4:18 and an earthly people Nation of Israel
---michael_e on 12/15/09

Amen Anne!!

the LAST TRUMP is on the LAST DAY ...PER SCRIPTURE the resurrection and Christs return are the SAME EVENT

per misguided reasoning of men there is a "rapture" - some "mysterious event" that USES all scriptures pointing to the LAST TRUMP occurring on THE LAST DAY

John 6:39, 40, 44, 54, 11:24, 12:48, 1Corin 15

As Christ understood he lost nothing the promises of Gods Kingdom to be RULED by Christ are to be GIVEN at the LAST DAY

when all who lived and died (and those who REMAIN on earth during the times of trouble PROTECTED in a place of SAFETY) will be resurrected to eternal life to live and reign with Christ on EARTH - not one scripture describes anyone "going to heaven"
---Rhonda on 12/15/09

It is likely that we have never understood Revelations properly.

Jesus has "returned" to me and I have been "raptured"/transferred into His kingdom...

Colossians 1:13
"transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son".

Jesus established the new worship temple.

John 2:19
"three days"....21 "He was speaking of the temple of His body" (He is the outer temple and third temple, we each are the inner, 1 Corinthians 3:16).

I don't know what we should expect in these last days of civilization (this age).

We are the "living stones" of the cornerstone...

1 Peter 2:4
"and like living stones".

Verses are from the RSV.
---more_excellent_way on 12/15/09

The "abomination of desolation" Jesus spoke of was the destruction of Jerusalem (and the temple) in 70 AD by pagan Rome's Titus. The one "who opposes and exalts himself" and "sits in the temple as God" is the head of Papal Rome.
---jerry6593 on 12/15/09

You twist scripture to fit your own theory.

The A of D does not "sit in the temple as God" but sits in the temple of God and declares himself to be God. Read it correctly. The Pope does not fit the true meaning of the verse.

The the destruction of the temple does not fit the A of D also. It is discussed in verse 26 while the abomination is discussed in verse 27. Two separate events.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/15/09

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The "rapture" and the second coming of the Lord is the same event.....
There are no "two phases" of His return.....
There is no pre-trib escape for anyone!
The Church will be on earth during the tribulation. Anyone telling you different is misleading you......
READ your bibles!
---Anne on 11/16/07

The "rapture" is a catching up. Paul says: the dead in Christ rise first - then we (in Christ) will be changed and rise to meet Jesus in the clouds.

This event will be the trigger for the "day of the Lord." Matthew says, "the earth did quake, and the graves were opened..." proving a precedent for an earthquake to accompany [or cause] a resurrection. Look in Revelation for a world-wide earthquake, and soon after, a huge crowd, that cannot be numbered for its size.
---Lyle on 11/9/07

Jack, my pleasure. And God bless you.
---John1944 on 11/9/07

Thanks John 1944 - I guess that Satan and 'all who are his' are not 'big' on appologies. God's commandment against bearing false witness against one's neighbor is 'not' very popular with them. That's ok because he doesn't think anything God said is TRUE or of any importance. Thanks for catching 'his' hand in the cookie jar. Satan always flees when exposed or confronted.Thanks John for speaking the truth.God has already told me 'who' the accuser was.
---jack8937 on 11/9/07

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Yes Trey, there's a Rapture.
Acts 1:11 "...and a cloud received him..." I Thess.4:17,"...caught up together with them in the clouds..."
Rev.1:7, "Behold, he cometh with clouds," Notice these scriptures refer to His coming in the "clouds"? This is not when he comes back on a "White Horse" with 10,000's of his saints. The Rapture is to bring the saints out before the wrath of God is poured out. "We are not appointed unto wrath...Right?
---Kary on 11/8/07

Jesus said that He would come as a thief in the night. That means most will not even be aware of it. The Rapture will be quick and only those on fire for God will make it.
---Mr._Graham on 11/7/07

Dear Friends, Acts 1:9-11 says Christ will return on a cloud, 1 Cor 15:50-52 in a moment, at the last trump, 1 Thess 4:16, with a shout, voice of the archangel and trump of God, Rev 10 depicts this as well as Rev 14:14-16. After vials He returns with 10,000's of His saints to set up 1,000 year reign. 2 different appearances
---Larry on 11/7/07

Just to clarify, I'm pretty sure ALL of us believe that there IS a Rapture, we just believe that it is not a secret, quiet Rapture before the Tribulation, or seperate from His Second Coming.
---Adam on 11/6/07

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"Whoso diggeth a pit shall fall therein: and he that rolleth a stone, it will return on him."A lying tongue hateth those that are afflicted by it, and a flattering mouth worketh ruin."Prov26:27-28. The 'fowler' is taken in his own device.For the accuser of our brethern is 'cast down'which accused them before our God day and night.Rev12:10(partial)Every man's works will be made manifest. How GREAT our God is!
---jack8937 on 11/6/07

I believe in the rapture of the church --to not believe would mean that you would not get to go when Jesus comes in the air to gather His people. Why would anyone take a chance of being left behind when all they have to do is believe??
---carol on 11/4/07

To the investigator, I appreciate the alagation of voting for myself. I don't even know how to vote for anyone.It's not nice to accuse others. As you have misjudged me so will you be judged. God's Words not mine. Try beliving that. The only 2 people on here I would vote for are Trey and Cynthia. Most of the rest are only those who desire to be teachers of something they have no comprehension of. They need to be taught themselves.
---jack8937 on 11/4/07

Investigator, slander is a serious sin and you have slandered Jack. He did not give himself the vote, I gave it to him. You should apologize.
---John1944 on 11/2/07

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Jack why should we believe anything you say? We can see that you voted for yourself.
As long as you and Pierre keep your distorted views of the Bible you will suffer the cost.

Currently jack8937 has 1 vote. The higher the number of votes the more helpful this blogger is considered by the ChristiaNet community.
---Investigator on 11/2/07

Pierre>>>You are absolutely lieing. No question about it---The Bible definitely teaches that the saints will be "caught up" to meet Christ at His coming! I would give scripture but I will not. Do you want to know why. Because you are an unbeliever and you would not understand it anyways. Yes, to send the wicked to hell. And you better believe it and know it. You may not like what I write, but God is not a liar neither am I.
---catherine on 11/2/07

NO! There is no such thing as a "secret" rapture mentioned in the Bible. The Bible states clearly that next time He comes is with the rewards: eternal life for the saved and eternal destruction for the lost. P.
---Pierre on 11/2/07

The bible says Christ will return a second time in the same manner he left, he will bing all the dead in Christ with him because they were with him alive in heaven and we who are alive on the earth on that day will meet them in the air in a joyous celebration, that Heaven will follow like a bride adorned for
her husband and heaven and earth will be joined as one place,we will be changed so quickly into our spiritual being that we will never know it happened. Thats all it says.
---exzucuh on 10/26/07

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I have asked this before, but my KJV of the bible states Christ will return to signal the first resurrection of the righteous. If the righteous are gone in a rapture, who is he coming back for. the animals, fish, birds etc because people say the righteous are gone. you can't resurrect someone not living on the earth which would make the bible false. It states in many places, all eyes will see him and one will be taken and the other left to wait for the 2nd resurrection.
---ashley on 10/25/07


Where does Scripture teach of a (First Quiet) Rapture before His Second Coming?
---Adam on 10/25/07

From reading scripture and other books I personally believe that there will be both a rapture (first and quiet) and Christ's second coming (later and with the sound of trumpet and every eye shall see Him). Christians will never agree on this subject but I do not believe that our ideas on this are going to determine our eventual eternal dwelling place.
---RitaH on 10/25/07


Have you any biblical proof?
---Adam on 10/24/07

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well there you have it a yes and a no answer.
---tom2 on 10/24/07

Absolutely Trey, It is a real God prophesied event but nothing like the Great Escape theory made popular series "Left Behind".1stCor.15-52 & 1stThess.4-16-17. Notice these 2 refs.God's order is the same. 1st the dead in Christ and 'then' Those who are still alive.This event called by men'Rapture' is 'only' the 2nd.half of THE RESURRECTION.85 words not long enough to really explain but you're welcome to e-mail me at pen-pal add here.
---jack8937 on 10/24/07

Yes, there will certainly be a rapture. When Jesus will snatch all His people up in the air to be with Him. Sounds farfetched does it not? Well, not if you are saved.
---catherine on 10/24/07

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