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Iraq War Controversy

Was the Iraq war a mistake?

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 ---Mike on 1/14/08
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I don't think we should have gone to war in Irag. Big mistake.
---carro4721 on 2/4/08


Just where was this particular Iraq war prophesied in scripture? (as opposed to, say, the 1991 war, or any other mid-east war?)
---StrongAxe on 2/2/08

StrongAxe: Again, you miss the point. It's not so much about US controlling the oil. It's about US controlling the armament purchasing...capabilities of oil-rich Islamic fascist. If their oil derived money supply is shortened, then their ability to effectively throw (fire) rock(et)s (bombs) at us is significantly diminished. The fascist don't get to so easily kill US -- we get to stay alive. It's that simple! Why are you making it so complicated. :)
---Leon on 2/1/08


"Depends on who you really want to control middle east oil" implies that good or evil is dependent on what Americans "want". (Sadly, this is a popular point of view).

"You have it. We want it. So we're going to take it." is the very reason why we have "Thou Shalt not steal."
---StrongAxe on 2/1/08


You stated exactly where the problem lies. People CLAIM to be Spirit led. The true test to that claim is if it lines up with scripture. The spirit of God will never lead you to do anything contradictory to scripture. I may not agree with everything that Bush has done and I may not agree with us being in Iraq, but in spite of all that- this war was predicted in scripture. So, Spirit led? Who am I to judge. Prophesied? Absolutely! (sorry for the last post, it was meant for another blog)
---prchnhiswrd on 2/1/08

Leon, the government (Western - NATO) relies on putting fear into peoples' hearts. Fear of oil hikes, fear of Islamic fundamentalists, fear of greedy Middle Easterners waging war, fear of nuclear bombs. Most of the above are mind control. I am not even sure if nuclear bombs exist, I have read stuff that points to massive cover-ups concerning nuclear capabilities.
---frances on 2/1/08

StrongAxe: I don't know anyone who understands the whole Bible. Do you? :) One day we'll all die with unanswered questions. That's okay! We're not meant to know everything, but need to know the One who knows everything. We must study & meditate on Bible lessons, & trust the "Holy Spirit" to properly teach us what He wants us to know. Only God's teaching lines up with His written word (the Bible). Spirits that instructs apart from what the Bible says teaches false doctrine.(1 Jn. 4:1-6)
---Leon on 2/1/08


There are many places where the Bible is less than clear (otherwise, why would we have so many Christian denominations all teaching different doctrines?)

So we rely on the internal voice of the Spirit to guide us, or we listen to the wisdom of others whom we trust to have wisdom in these matters. However, many people claim to have the Spirit, but reach contradictory interpretations. This means that many people who THINK the Spirit is leading them are, in fact, deceived.
---StrongAxe on 1/31/08

"Was the Iraq war a mistake?" Depends on who you really want to control middle east oil. If you think the Islamic fascist should monopolize the oil, then you probably believe the U.S. made a mistake. So, it's okay for them to wage economic warfare on the free world by use of said oil, i.e., extreme gas pump prices, etc. Unlimited oil abundance equals untold wealth -- more than enough to buy and/or make WOMD, e.g., nuclear, etc., with intent of targeting the free, non-Islamic world.
---Leon on 1/31/08

StrongAxe: God has given us the inspired Bible. It says, "Faith comes by hearing & hearing by the word of God." (Ro. 10:17)

Our "sole reliance" on other people & ourselves to understand the will of God falls critically short of God personally teaching wisdom to us by His Holy Spirit. (Pv. 2, Jn 14:15-17, 23-26)

God teaches thru born again, spirit filled believers. But not everyone who say they're of God are. Thus the confusion... (1 Jn. 4:1-6)
---Leon on 1/30/08

Part 2 The scripture says in Rev 13:18 "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man, and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six". So I decided to focus on the number like it said. Now I will not take credit for all of this but I will say it checked out extremely accurately.
---prchnhiswrd on 1/30/08

Part 3 First of all, The Greek word for mark is charagma. Strong's Concordance defines charagma as a scratch or etching, a badge of servitude, graven, and "mark." The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language defines graven: " To sculpt carve, engrave. To stamp or impress deeply, fix permanently." Strong's notes that charagma is directly related to the Greek word charax, which means "to sharpen to a point" "a stake."
---prchnhiswrd on 1/30/08

The earliest use of the word Charagma outside of the Bible describes the piercing bite of a snake:
"[Charagma] is an engraved, etched, branded or inscribed 'mark' or 'sign'. Closest to the original sense... is the earliest example in Soph. Phil., 267, where [charagma] denotes the bite of a snake."
---prchnhiswrd on 1/30/08

PT5 Theological Dictionary of the New Testament (vol 9, page 416) Much like the original authors, the Biblical scholars of the King James Bible chose to spell out the number 666 - Six hundred threescore and six. This is one of the rare exceptions in the Bible where words are used rather than numbers to describe a numeric value. God inspired these men to spell it out - Six hundred threescore and six - so that we can gain a further understanding of the Mark of the Beast.
---prchnhiswrd on 1/30/08

PT6 Interestingly, spelling out 666 in words accurately preserves the original use of the Greek language. If we look at the Greek we see that 666 is presented with three words: Chi - Xi - Stigma. The numeric values of these three Greek letters add up to 666. Strong's Concordance defines stigma as: "to 'stick' ... a mark incised or punched (for recognition of ownership) ... mark." With the definitions of stick, incised, punched, and mark, stigma is very close to the definition of charagma.
---prchnhiswrd on 1/30/08

PT7 Stigma and charagma both support the idea of a syringe inject able microchip like the Verichip. Stigma has also made it into the English language where it's defined as "a mark of infamy or disgrace," there's an obvious carryover from its use in Revelation. For those of you who dont know there is a company who has developed and is using inject able microchips for ID purposes and Yes, BUYING AND SELLING.
---prchnhiswrd on 1/30/08

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No, Mikewho.:) I'm saying nothing of the kind!

Putting absolute trust (faith) in God & being pro-active (responding) by the leading of the Holy Spirit is "something" more powerful than relying on our own limited (inept) devices.

Jesus was filled with & led by the Holy Spirit of God during His earth ministry. (Lk. 4:1) Christians should be no different, i.e., Christ-like!
---Leon on 1/30/08

Who cares at this point? If we pull out it will be a huge mistake. Mark my words.
---catherine on 1/22/08

Catherine, these tribes/sects have been killing each other for hundreds of years. Whether we leave now, or whether we leave 2 years from now, the end result will be the same, civil war and chaos.

So, how many more of our sons and daughters are we willing to sacrifice to this lunacy?
---NurseRobert on 1/30/08

No. Nothing is a mistake. It is carefully planned. The side that plans the war is the side that wins it, inevitably. The god of this world is in control. He rules from the Vatican, but he is not the Pope. He is the Pope's henchman.
---frances on 1/29/08


What I meant is that, since we don't have Jesus walking down from Mount Moriah to tell us what is so, we must rely on:
1) Our own understanding of what the Bible says (and what others tell us it says)
3) Our own trusting of voices in our head telling us what the Bible says.
Many claim to have the Spirit of God who tells them what to do - yet many of those disagree with each other. Clearly SOME of those believe they have a pipeline straight to God but are being deceived.
---StrongAxe on 1/29/08

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to leon - so what you are saying is we just sit down & do nothing? doing nothing is also formula for disaster. did christ just sit down & let the pharisees, experts in the law stumble the people? what are you going to call it when people fail or stumble, lack of faith?
---mikehow on 1/29/08

StrongAxe: The Christian world-view is to put absolute trust (faith) in God who is in heaven & (in the person of the Holy Spirit) is also Omnipresent (everywhere)in the earth. Reliance upon "our own devices" (doing it our way: Pv. 14:12, 16:25) is the formula for disaster. Starting with Adam & Eve, Bible history makes this point plain, over-n-over.

It is Christ-like to have faith in God & to live life in His Way (Jn. 14:6). God's grace is sufficient! (2 Cor. 12:9) :)
---Leon on 1/26/08


Until God actually comes down from heaven and tells us who is good or evil (or we go up there and the books are opened), we have to rely on our own devices. Don't we now rely on our opionions of past leaders, based on human historians and human religious commentators?

(And "relying on the Holy Spirit" isn't sufficient - because some say the Spirit approves of a person, while somebody else says He doesn't - whose "spirit" should we belive?")
---StrongAxe on 1/25/08


Well put.

My vote would be Bush is one step above Satan.
---matthew on 1/24/08

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Strongaxe: "Who is the arbiter [Judge]..."? (Ps. 7:8-11)

- "...history...judgment..."? No!

- It's not about man's judgment. In God we must trust!

"Many", perhaps so, but not "all". :) I believe "all" Christians should always pray (Ps. 51:10) then vote (voice) our God-given conscience & trust Him to help -- do the rest (Is. 41:13). Afterall: Is. 55:7-9. He knows the end from the beginning (Is. 46:9-10).
---Leon on 1/24/08


Unfortunately, who is the arbiter of whether a leader is "godly"?
Many Christian Americans think Bush is one step below God himself.
Many other Christian Americans think Bush is one step above Satan. Shall we take a vote?

It's fine for history to render its judgment in retrospect, but when faced with the choice to either to demonstrate biblical loyalty to a leader, or to oppose a leader on biblical moral grounds is a choice we all have to make ourselves without help.
---StrongAxe on 1/24/08

So things didn't work out quite they way they were dreamed to come out. But where would we be without dreams.

We might have had enough troops in Afganistan to have actually killed Osama bin Laden.

But no matter, our blood lust is satisfied, "Shock and Awe" was awesome, wasn't it? Mission accomplished...
---matthew on 1/22/08

This war was certainly no mistake. They did it on purpose, using the blood lust generated by 911, and fear of WMD's not possessed by Sadam Hussein, who posed no real threat to the US, other than his overt insanity,---a trait we expect to remain hidden in our leaders. We would in the process gain effective control of vast amounts of oil, with US companies such as Halliburton, Cheneys company, getting contracts and benefiting in the process.
---matthew on 1/22/08

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The vision was to create, in a manner of months, a jewel of democracy in a place with a tribal people of the same religion, separated by doctrinal issues that caused them to murder each other for hundreds of years. We just didnt realize that their interpretation of democracy required members of the other party be shot dead. Now that the ballot by bullets voting is almost complete, and millions of Iraqis, (many Christians), have fled, we are edging, kind of, toward success
---matthew on 1/22/08

The other part we hadn't thought out was how upsetting and provoking it would be for Muslims, particularly the crazy one's who wanted to kill us anyway, to have the US invade and occupy Iraq. By doing so we created numerous targets, our soldiers, for every crazy Muslim within, driving, walking, or camel distance. They could of course use the warehouses filled with Husseins weapons that our forces left lying around because we had insufficient troops to collect them all.
---matthew on 1/22/08


Bush and Hitler do have similarities. Both were men. Both were megalomaniacs.

They are dissimiliar in that only one of them could be described as mentally challenged and perceived often as speaking in tongues for his unique disabilities with his language.
---matthew on 1/22/08

Who cares at this point? If we pull out it will be a huge mistake. Mark my words.
---catherine on 1/22/08

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to nurseroberts - I don't have any arguement with that.
---noah on 1/22/08

1. You missed the point Strongaxe. :) All I'm saying is we should be careful of what we ask for because we just may get it, e.g., the Israelites wanted a king like all the other nations, so God gave them what they wanted plus consequences for their rebellion against/rejection of Him.

Saul proved himself to be a bad king, but David had the integrity of heart to not do Saul any harm because he knew God, who promoted Saul, would eventually demote him. (1 Sam. 8:1-22)
---Leon on 1/21/08

2. I believe God used the Founding Fathers of the United States to stand against the unfair rule of an ungodly tyrant & defeat him. Ungodly rulers, like King George, who are in rebellion against God ultimately fire themselves. It's a helluva thing! (Pv. 16:18)

Bottomline: God chooses whoever, whenever, according to His own good pleasure. God rules! (((Ps. 75:6-7)))
---Leon on 1/21/08

Moses became angry and struck a rock.

He lost his place in the Promised Land.
---Michelle on 1/21/08

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Muddy Christians will be the first casualties of war.
These are dangerous times.
There is no place to hide but in God, anyway.

Daniel 11:32
The people who know their God will be strong and carry out great exploits.

Many Christians are flirting with disaster.
They have caved in and are loitering around in the enemy's camp.
---Michelle on 1/19/08

Violence in every city. Unnatural winds and fierce rains. Fragile bridges and treacherous roads. Calamities and affliction.

There are great doors for the humble. God gives grace to the humble. God gives determination to the humble, turning despair into determination.
---Michelle on 1/19/08


Unfortunately, if you take that perspective to its logical conclusion, the entire United States is a big mistake because the Founding Fathers rebelled against God's appointed lawful ruler, King George 231 years ago.

Governments get overthrown and replaced by new ones. Which of the two are God's chosen? The first, the second, or both?
---StrongAxe on 1/19/08

Noah, what I'm saying is that Hitler used the same tactics to get the German people to follow him. We all know where that led.

GW stood up and made the same statement. In other words,"I'm right, and if you disagree you are unpatriotic."

I didn't buy it then and I don't buy it now.
---NurseRobert on 1/19/08

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In the many other blogs on this same subject I have stated my position.

This war was started for the wrong reasons.
This war was wrong from the beginning.
This war continues to be wrong.

Spend some time looking up the concept of a just war.
---NurseRobert on 1/19/08

to nurseroberts - OKAY? are you saying there is similarity bet. hitler & bush?
---noah on 1/17/08

Noah, Hitler said the same thing.
---NurseRobert on 1/17/08

ex REPUBLICAN congressman SILJANDER charge with al queda link.
okay, if you oppose or question the war, you are branded a leftist, in cahoots with bin laden.
bush said 'if you are not for us, you are for the terrorist.' your party now is linked with alqueda.
---noah on 1/16/08

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It's a mistake to go against (oppose) what the Bible says. Like David's attitude towards King Saul, we should be reluctant to raise our hands...against persons God has placed in position of authority over us no matter how good or bad, right or wrong we think that person is. Charles Stanley got it right! Ps. 75:6-7
---Leon on 1/16/08

I have Christian friends who believe like this. This horrible bloodletting in the Middle East is far the purpose(they believe this) of opening up the Moslem world to the gospel Of Jesus Christ. Question, do you think this is true? Could it be a possibility? What do you think?
---Mima on 1/16/08

Noah and Pharisee hit the nail on the head. The American people were lied to by Bush.

What is even more interesting is how the price of gas has gone up since the war. Hmmmm.
---Trish9863 on 1/16/08

What has the war done for the world let alone the Iraqi's?
Let us start with the Chaldean church, one of the oldest churches in the world. They existed in parallel with the Islamic world, unique in Arabic countries. I'm told that they have almost ceased to exist.
Enough evidence exists to show that the rel war was fought over oil, nothing more. So howe many people must die for Bush to get his oil revenue?
---mike8384 on 1/15/08

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Jesus said, "If My kingdom were of this world, My servants would fight, so that I should not be delivered to the Jews" (in John 18:36). But in this evil world war can be the lesser of two evils > God working in mysterious ways can use war to keep the lid on in stopping Hitler, but this is a very inferior measure. American troops stopped Saddam. What Iraqis have done with this has been their own choice??? Not what Congress voted (o:
---Bill_bila5659 on 1/14/08

When Jesus came to this earth, Herod reacted by killing all those baby boys, but I have not heard or read anyone criticizing God for bringing Jesus here, though God knew there would be that murderous reaction.

But people are criticizing America for going into Iraq, claiming the murderous reaction by Iraqis and others proves it was wrong to have the war. How people react is their own choice...not the choice of troops who work to keep order there.
---Bill_bila5659 on 1/14/08

Does a bear have claws? :) Yep, it was the mother of bad ideas, in my opinion. Just ask the families of those who have died as a result, American or Iraqi--or others. I think they'd agree. :(
---Mary on 1/14/08

The war supporters cannot give a good enough reason for this war. they just evade it.bush said the reason for invading iraq is
1. 911(there is no connection bet iraq & 911
2. wmds (no wmds found, Nkorea has one)
3. saddam ordered the attacks (saudis, osama & alqueda were the criminals)
4. freedom & democracy (dictators in other countries, why not liberate them)
5. alqueda in iraq (it was created after the war
SO LET US CHASE THE 'WHY' iraq was invaded! GO on
---noah on 1/14/08

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Why do you ask that question in person in Iraq to people who suffered under Saddam or risked their lives to vote in free elections. Yes a lot of people have died including Allied service personnel. But the results have been outstanding Look at some of the smiling faces of Iraqi children with U.S. Military personal. The current Surge has been totally successful.
---notlaw99 on 1/14/08

It was from the beginning, and to my astonishment everyone was on board.

I even heard Charles Stanley preaching on why the war was right for us as Christians. It simply never was, and the greatest reason for this is that the Wars of the Old Testament against evil were ordered by God and for his purpose.

This war was launched after Pres Bush LIED about WOMD in Iraq first to Congress and then to The UN. Charles Stanley used Romans 13:1 why isn't America accountable by the same standard?
---Pharisee on 1/14/08

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