when Christ returns I will be caught up with the saved to forever be with Jesus Christ. anyone who is not saved will not be "caught up". that is the rapture.--shira4368 on 3/21/13
But, the question is when do you think this will happen? The movie 'Left behind' can't be correct because it isn't biblical to say anyone will be living on this earth after Jesus returns.
The earth will be destroyed by fire.
Jesus states He is only returning once and it is final. Heaven or Hell will be the only destination. No earth period
---Nikki on 3/21/13|
I live about 60 miles from the church who was responsible for the movie "left behind". that movie is completely true. almost all the actors and actresses are members of that church. they have made several movies and they are all biblical. when Christ returns I will be caught up with the saved to forever be with Jesus Christ. anyone who is not saved will not be "caught up". that is the rapture.
---shira4368 on 3/21/13|
Follower, I reread your last statement and I'm sorry but you are wrong on this one:
"Those who are not resurrected from death at the Lords return will live again after the millenium"
Because, at the Second Coming all will be resurrected,
"I have hope in God, which they themselves also accept "that there will be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and the unjust" (Acts 24"15). I should have reread your answer before I answered this morning, so there was no miracle after all.
---Mark_V. on 3/17/13|
Michael e, I would love to keep on with this topic but it is about to close. I will post another similar to this one so that I can answer your comments. Peace
Follower, remember I mention I didn't agree with most of what you have written but on one only? On this topic and on this last statement only I competely agree with you. That is a miracle for this Sunday.
---Mark_V. on 3/17/13|
the rapture was invented by men who added this doctrine of demons found nowhere in Gods Word. A book capitalized on the antichrist rapture calling it "Left Behind" and through their corrupt dishonest unspiritual quest they made multi-millions with their imaginary story.
When Lord Jesus returns to earth to resurrect and change those in him (dead and remaining alive) to eternal life. The Lords glorious return and appearing is seen by all per prophecy of the bible. Those who are not resurrected from death at the Lords return will live again after the millenium
If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come.
Also: Isaiah 65:19-21 1 Corin 15 Rev 20:5
---Follower_of_Christ on 3/16/13|
Mark, you "assume" wrongly OT are BoC.
Gen 13:16 "And I wil l make thy seed (off spring) as the dust of the earth:..."
whats dust? earthly. His earthly people would be as the numbers of the sand of the sea. Nation of Israel.
Gen 15:5. "And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look NOW toward heaven, and (count) tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be."
God promised Abraham 2 groups of people connected to him. The dust of the earth, his earthly offspring by, Isaac and Jacob. When God tells him to look toward the heavens, He's talking about a heavenly connection.
Two concepts in Scripture, Earthly people Israel and heavenly people, the Church.
---michael_e on 3/16/13|
michael e, so you are now suggesting there is two kinds of saints. Those who are born of the Spirit and those who are not. That some saints enter the kingdom of God and the others don't. That the saints that stay here is because they are not born of God. That they were justified by their faith, but are exempt from entering the kingdom of God. Where do you come out with such teachings?
Do you not know there is two kinds of children? The children of God and the children of satan? The wicked and the just? The believers by faith, and the unbelievers? The saved and the lost? And really, the saints and the none saints?
---Mark_V. on 3/16/13|
Mark, you say
//And we know that Jesus said, "unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God" and also said, "Unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God//
We also know who He was speaking to.
There reason there are no passages pertaining to OT saints being part of the BoC is that they are not part of it.
---michael_e on 3/15/13|
The Anti-Christ, who will be the leader of the coming New World Order kingdom, will BE that "Great Lie". Just as YAHUSHUA is "the Truth", as per JOHN 14:6, likewise, the Anti-Christ, the false saviour and messiah, will be "the Lie". The "spirit of the the Anti-Christ", of I JOHN 4:3, is that spirit which has been, and is now, prepping the lukewarm, backslidden pseudo-christians and those who are already lost, to receive the Anti-Christ as their saviour and messiah when he arrives. The "spirit of the Anti-Christ" leads people to the Anti-Christ just as the Holy Spirit leads people to the True Saviour and Messiah YAHUSHUA (JESUS).
---Gordon on 3/15/13|
Follower, you claim the saints don't go to heaven so you say,
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven .."
Notice this passage never says anything about going to heaven, being in heaven, or the Lord returning to heaven (all these ideas are added by mens fantasies)"
We know that the Lord comes from heaven but did you know that angels and saints accompany Him from heaven?
"...the Lord comes with ten thousand of His saints" (Jude 14,15).
"so that He may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before Our God and Father at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all His saints" (1 Thess. 3:13).
---Mark_V. on 3/15/13|
Michael e, it is a very good question you asked. It is like asking me if you are a part of the body of Christ yourself. I don't know. I am not God. There is no specific passages mentioning them or anyone else. What we do know is that those people were justified by faith. And we know that Jesus said,
"unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God" and also said,
"Unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God" Now we can assume those guys who had faith went to the kingdom of God, just like we can assume you will enter the kingdom of God yourself by your faith.
I'm not God so I don't know who is and who is not. No one knows for no one is God.
---Mark_V. on 3/14/13|
//Why not ask a good question concerning the Church you so much refuse to admit made up of all those believers who are baptized into One body in Christ//
Here is a question, where is the scripture that says Abraham, Isaac or Jacob etc etc were baptised into the BoC?
---michael_e on 3/13/13|
Michael e, I answered you already that question,
" Both ceremonies typify the redemption by which the Lord Jesus Christ would restore to man fellowship with God." They were a type to what was to be real spiritual cleansing by water and the Holy Spirit unto those who were redeemed by the Lord Jesus Christ.
Why not ask a good question concerning the Church you so much refuse to admit made up of all those believers who are baptized into One body in Christ. And how they avoid tribulation?
---Mark_V. on 3/12/13|
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven ..."
Notice this passage never says anything about going to heaven, being in heaven, or the Lord returning to heaven (all these ideas are added by mens fantasies)
And where will we be? EARTH Zechariah 14:4 Psalm 37:22
The times of trouble (3 1/2 years of wrath by Satan then God) is over when the Lord gloriously returns to earth Matthew 24 Titus 2:13 1 Corinthians 15:52
1 Thess 4 describes the Lords return to earth to reign as Lord of Lord and King of Kings Zechariah 14 Isaiah 24:23 Rev 19:14-16 and 11:15
---Follower_of_Christ on 3/12/13|
Mark, thanks for that answer.
Now what is spiritual about a physical cleansing of ashes and water?
---michael_e on 3/12/13|
Michael e, this is a very easy answer. There were two ceremonies to be observed by God's people in preparation for approaching God. Offerings or Sacrifices and the cleansing or purifications. Cleansing was accomplished by using the ashes of a young heifer which had been burned, as described in (Num. 19 and Hebrews 9:13,14). The ashes mixed with water were sprinkled by means of a bunch of hyssop on the one who was unclean. He or she would then had to bath in water, after which he or she was ceremonially clean. Both ceremonies typify the redemption by which the Lord Jesus Christ would restore to man fellowship with God.
---Mark_V. on 3/12/13|
//Necodemus was a master teacher of the Jews and should have known the teachings of spiritual cleansing//
What was spiritual cleansing in the OT?
---michael_e on 3/11/13|
Michael e, this is my third post to you. You said,
"You quote John 3:5 as if you are part of the nation of Israel.". The passage is a fact for all human beings to enter heaven. Just because Jesus was talking to Necodemus does not mean Israel only needed to be born again.
"... Why would Nicodemus master of the Jews" know this?"
Necodemus was a master teacher of the Jews and should have known the teachings of spiritual cleansing. Jesus reply emphasized the spiritual bankruptcy of the nation at that time, this teaching of spiritual cleansing and transformation was based clearly in the O.T Necodemus should have known. In order for anyone to enter heaven, they need to be born of water and Spirit.
---Mark_V. on 3/11/13|
You major on assumptions and ignore the prove text concerning a rapture, a theological term that comes from 1 Thessalonians 4:17. The words "caught up" is the Greek word "harpazo", the latin is "rapturo". The Anglisized word is "rapture".jan4378
And are you not assuming, and ignored the fact that Jesus said he was coming a 2nd time not 2 more times?
Please read verses 13-16 before 17 and finish 17.
Paul is talking about those who have fallen asleep(dead) rising first and alive ones being caught up with them in the air when Jesus returns once at the end of time.
Those verses are not speaking about anyone being left behind.
---Nikki on 3/11/13|
Jesus said two things 1) You only need to believe in Him to be saved but in another time He said you must be born again in order to enter into the kingdom of God.
---Adrian on 3/11/13|
---Follower_of_Christ on 2/23/13
I ask you, if it is true that there is no rapture, then where is the verse in scripture that would warn against it? There is none. You have to insert the assumption that Paul refers to it.
You major on assumptions and ignore the prove text concerning a rapture, a theological term that comes from 1 Thessalonians 4:17. The words "caught up" is the Greek word "harpazo", the latin is "rapturo". The Anglisized word is "rapture".
---jan4378 on 3/10/13|
//the passage in (Acts 1:6) does not say that God is going to make another kingdom and give it to the nation of Israel//
He does not say what are you talking about or it's not going to happen He said the time is not for you to know.
You quote John 3:5 as if you are part of the nation of Israel.
"Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things?"
Why should "Nicodemus master of the Jews" know this?
---michael_e on 3/3/13|
Michael e, the passage in (Acts 1:6) does not say that God is going to make another kingdom and give it to the nation of Israel. In fact the answer was:
It is not for you to know the times or the seasons which the Father has put in His own authority, but you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you and you should be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem and all judea and Samaria and to the ends of the earth" (v.7,8).
There is not two Kingdoms one for those born of the Spirit and those who are not. Jesus said,
"...I say to you unless one is born of the water and Spirit he cannot enter the kingdom of God"
There is no kingdom of the flesh after the Second Coming.
---Mark_V. on 3/3/13|
Mark i totally agree when we speak of salvation it is a spiritual matter.
The only Church today is the BoC. Bride of Christ? Debatable.
Of course the wilderness church and the jerusalem church were flesh, they were looking for there king and their kingdom set up here on earth. Acts 1:6 God promised the people of Israel a Land, a King, and a Kingdom.
---michael_e on 3/2/13|
Hebrews 10:25. Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of sonme is, but exhorting one another, and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. the writer is talking to Christians in this passage. sounds pretty much like the body of Christ to me.
---shira4368 on 3/2/13|
Where in the Bible do you find rapture? Ezekiel 13:19 & 20
lying to my people,, hunt the souls to make them fly..
Antichrist promoting rapture. -
---Terry_Langley on 3/2/13|
Michael e, when we speak of salvation it is a spiritual matter. Every person that has been saved by grace through faith is spiritually born again, baptized into One body in Christ. Each is a member of the spiritual body of Christ Jesus, whether Jew or Gentile. That is the spiritual Church of Christ, the bride of Christ. That Church and that Church only. You are speaking in the flesh, the church in the wilderness, the church at Jerusalem and other assemblies or the Churches today. I am speaking of spiritual matters. This is a spiritual experience, a spiritual worship, a spiritual union with the Lord who is the Head of the body in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus.
---Mark_V. on 3/2/13|
Mark you say "rapture teachers contend the Church won't be here for Armageddon."
What "church are you referring to, there was a church(called out assembly) in the wildertness, spokesperson was Moses.
There was a church(a called out assembly) at jerusalem, spokepersons the twelve.
There is a church today (a called out assembly) the Body of Christ spokesperson is Paul. Since Jesus never mentioned the BoC why would you assume He is speaking to the BoC? Do you see the BoC mentioned in Rev?
---michael_e on 3/1/13|
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Michael e, rapture teachers contend the Church won't be here for Armageddon. First, the word "Armageddon" is used only once in the entire Bible, Revelation 16:16) which is the great chapter about the falling of the seven last plagues, right before (v.16) during the time of the Plagues, Jesus Christ says to the Church,
"Behold I am coming as a thief. Blessed is he who watches, and keep his garments, lest he walk naked and they see his shame. And they gathered them together to the place called in Hebrew, Armageddon"
Did you catch that? Jesus was talking to the Church, at the time of (v.15) while the seven plagues are falling. The Church was still here.
---Mark_V. on 3/1/13|
Michael e, all believers in Jesus Christ whether Jews or Gentiles are saints. They all make up the spiritual Church of Christ" They are all born of the Spirit baptized into One spiritual body in Christ. Even the Old Testament saints.
My point is that some belief the saints that go through tribulation are only saints but not the Church. But Paul wrote his New Testament letters to the "churches of the saints" (1 Cor. 14:33). What does this tell us? Where ever there is saints, there is the Church. Even if the saints mentioned in (Rev. 13,14 are only tribulation saints after the Rapture. Wouldn't they, as sincere believers in Jesus Christ still be the Church?
---Mark_V. on 2/28/13|
markv, I agree with what you said about the wilderness. that is a type of the saved person going astray. they wander in the wilderness like the little lost sheep. it clearly states the shepherd had all the sheep and one got away and he left the others to go find the lost sheep. when he found the sheep, he would break their legs so they won't wander anymore. same with moses leading the children out of egypt. egypt is sin but God's people were brought out only to make false gods to worship.
---shira4368 on 2/27/13|
Mark you say
// all believers in Jesus Christ whether Jews or Gentiles are saints//
I agree there is NOW one called out assembly. But that wasn't always the case. How would you become a member of that jewish jerusalem church? It wasn't always Jew and Gentile as equals.
You say later Paul is given the commission to go to the Gentles
Did you ever study WHY, when the 12 were comissioned to go to the whole world?
Repent and be baptised the gospel of the 12 doesn't save today.
---michael_e on 2/27/13|
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Michael e, all believers in Jesus Christ whether Jews or Gentiles are saints. They all make up the spiritual Church of Christ. There is no two spiritual church's, only one made up of Jews and Gentiles. Believe it or not. Paul Himself persecuted the Church in the beginning. All those who believed in Christ through faith. The Church in the beginning consisted mostly of Jews, and later when Paul got sapped by Jesus Christ and later given the commission to go to the Gentles then the Church was of both Jews and Gentiles. Praise be to God in the highest.
---Mark_V. on 2/27/13|
"And at that time there was a great persecution against the church which was at Jerusalem"
This church was at jerusalem
The believers were Jews.
They believed Acts 2:36
Acts 11:19 "jew only"
This isn't the BoC
Our apostle had a message for all nations
1Cor 15 "how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures,
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day "
---michael_e on 2/27/13|
Michael e, I agree with much of what you last said. The church in the wilderness mentioned in Acts 7:38) was an assembly of Iraelites, none were born of the Spirit, or as we say, the Spiritual body of Christ. But the Church in Acts 8:1 is a church of believers. The persecution was led by Saul of Tarsus before he he was saved by the Lord Jesus Christ, when Jesus told Paul "why do you persecute Me?". The "called out ones" are the Church, made up of Jews and Gentile believers. Spiritually baptized into One body in Christ. And anyone who is born of the Spirit from here on out is part of the Church. And when the Church is taken, there will be no other Church build again.
---Mark_V. on 2/27/13|
Follower, You said,
"There are no scriptures that state the Lord brings or takes anyone to "heaven" because the Lord stated THREE TIMES we will never go to heaven with Him John 8:14, 21, John 13:33"
That's not what the Lord stated three times. In the first two passages Jesus is speaking to unbelievers, they don't go to heaven. In (John 13:33)Jesus is stating He is leaving them at that present time, they could not go with Him. He never said that they could not go to heaven at a later time.
"For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ" All in Christ are united together with Christ in the heavenly places (Eph. 2:6).
---Mark_V. on 2/25/13|
Behold, the Lord God will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him.
Also: Revelation 22:12 John 16:28 John 14:3
The glorious appearing of the Lord (Titus 2:13) brings the Lord to earth again, as Lord of Lords and King of Kings to rule Gods Kingdom on earth, and the Saints inherit the earth at return of Lord Jesus Psalm 37:9,11,22, Matthew 5:5 Zech 14:5, Dan 2:44
There are no scriptures that state the Lord brings or takes anyone to "heaven" because the Lord stated THREE TIMES we will never go to heaven with Him John 8:14, 21, John 13:33
No man has ever gone to heaven and no promise ever states man will go to heaven
---Follower_of_Christ on 2/24/13|
follower, if you think you are going to heaven on the laws
The rapture lie suggests the Lord returns in secret Heaven is not reward of the saved (lie #2).
Lastly, Gods 10 laws (His truth) is not a condition for the spiritually unconverted
The Lord returns to earth in a glorious appearing seen through all the earth. And when He comes again to rule from Jerusalem as Lord of Lords and King of Kings is where his faithful servants will be ruling with Him. Heaven is Gods throne, no man has ever been or ever will go to heaven per Holy Scripture.
You defend a philosophical heaven-myth found nowhere in Word of God. The Lord Christ Jesus did not promise heaven as any reward ever.
---Follower_of_Christ on 2/23/13|
follower, if you think you are going to heaven on the laws, you are wrong. hell will be hot especially for the ones who are not born again and the ones who are responsible for taking many to hell with them. John 3:3 says ye must be born again.
---shira4368 on 2/23/13|
The strong delusion is not directly stated.
It is stated 2 Thess 2:10-13 "... that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness."
the delusion is to believe the lie. And it is then revealed the lie is those who do not believe the truth. The only saving truth is Gods 10 laws it is through his laws you have righteousness, otherwise you are disobedient unto unrighteousness.
Regardless, the rapture theory is a type of delusion because there is nothing in holy scripture to support the idea the Lord comes to earth in "secret" to take people to outter space and by lip service only they are "saved" from wrath.
---Follower_of_Christ on 2/23/13|
The strong delusion is not directly stated.
And amusing to read what some have speculated that it is.
However, there is in existence already other notions via media sources that would give a false explanation for any sudden disappearance of a great number of people from the earth... if indeed "a strong delusion" refers to a rapture event.
---jan4378 on 2/23/13|
The Church is made up of the believing element, "the Body of Christ." thats how Paul uses the word
Church always translated with one or two exceptions, as "A called out assembly."
When Paul uses Church it's the BoC, but its not that way always.
Acts 7 Stephen speaks of the Church in the wilderness. It wasn't a Church practicing communion with pastors, it was the children of Israel. Why was it a Church? They were a called out assembly of people, but they werent a Church as we think of Church. So when you see the word Church, that's why Paul almost always identifies it as "The Church which is His Body," which makes a big difference from the word Church thats maybe used elsewhere in Scripture.
---michael_e on 2/22/13|
Michael e, I thought you knew what the word, "Church" means, but you don't so it is better not to discuss the subject of the Church with you. Thanks for answering. I will move on to someone elses answers about the topic of the Rapture.
---Mark_V. on 2/22/13|
What makes you people who believe in the pre-trib rapture of christians think end time chritians will escape the rapture while all throughout history christians and the Jews have had to go through their own tribulations? The last generation of Christians in the end times will go through the tribulation. How much faith do you have to endure unto the end?
As for the strong delusion, it is a delusion sent to people who think they are christians, but are not, having the knowledge of God, but deny his power. These christians come out of the denominational churches which water down or teach false gospels or mix other religions with christianity.
---Steveng on 2/21/13|
Good title to this blog.
---Rod4Him on 2/21/13|
If you don't understand the difference between "a church" and The Church, then it won't do any good to try to explain anything to you about the/a rapture or the ones that have already taken place.
---Elder on 2/20/13|
Mark, you say
//There is only One Church, all believers.//
Acts7:38This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness (Could you be a member of that church?) No
Acts 8:1"...the church which was at Jerusalem"(Could you be a member of that church?) No
Col1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things he might have the preeminence.
You could be a member of this church, but you would have to study your bible.
2 Cor 4:4 In whom the god of this world...
You need to quit following this god sonny
---michael_e on 2/20/13|
Michael e, great answer and glad you answered that way. Now since they (Isralites) become one body in Christ, and those make up the Church, and God takes His Church with Him at the Second coming, don't those left that you mention after the rapture, make up the Church? All saints are the Church, and if they are taken up, how can there be a Church left on earth? There is only One Church, all believers. Or are you saying there is two Church's?
---Mark_V. on 2/20/13|
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Mark this is your? What do the individuals from Israel become when they also get saved?"
1 Cor 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body,(BoC) whether we be Jews or Gentiles,
Gal. 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Col. 3:11 Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
This didn't apply during Christ' ministry on earth
I hope this answers your question
---michael_e on 2/20/13|
to whom it may concern: the word rapture is not in the bible but what do you think God is talking about when He says the dead in Christ shall rise first and all of us left will be caught up together to forever be with the Lord. (paraphrased) I am sealed to live eternity in heaven. not anyone or anything can pluck me out of God's hands.
---shira4368 on 2/19/13|
Michael e, you said,
"It ends this dispensation of grace by removing the church from the earth. Then, the Old Testament form of worship and the kingdom program can resume, with God's focus being on the nation of Israel"
You wrote alot and I could ask you many questions concerning what you wrote but I will only ask you one,
"you say the church is removed from the earth, right? What do the individuals from Israel become when they also get saved?" Do they become saints? If they do not become saints, what do they become? Since we know that the saints are the Church.
---Mark_V. on 2/20/13|
The rapture has several purposes: It brings the all true grace age believers, whether living or dead, together.
It's "that blessed hope" (Titus 2:13) which will bring us together with our Lord.
It motivates us to watch in faith, love, and hope (1 Thess 5:6-8).
It's a comfort to us as 1 Thess 4:18 says.
It rescues us from the wrath that God is about to pour out upon those that dwell upon the earth in the tribulation.
It fulfills the prophecy of 1 Thess 4:13-18.
It ends this dispensation of grace by removing the church from the earth. Then, the Old Testament form of worship and the kingdom program can resume, with God's focus being on the nation of Israel
1 Thess 4 & 1 Cor 15 are not the same as Matt 24.
---michael_e on 2/19/13|
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I believe the blog is on the Rapture. So I will answer this way. There is no Rapture in Scripture. There is no left behind. All believers are the saints, and where ever there are saints there is the Church. There is no seven year tribulation. There is no second chances or a second Church after the seven years. There is only one Coming of the Lord.
---Mark_V. on 2/19/13|
Sis.Shira4368, hello, thankyou and yes! You are right, taking more time read the bible & seek the Lord give me the understanding. It a duty actually, every christian. Some things kinda remember, and thankfull, days feel very good and days..not.smiles! Be blessed. 2Tim.2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needth not to be ashamed,rightly dividing the word of truth.
---ELENA on 2/17/13|
elena, you are too nice. I am no bible major but I have studied some. I am strong in some areas and weak in others. you should never believe what anyone says but look it up for yourself. God bless.
---shira4368 on 2/16/13|
This is for Sis.Shira4368, hey, just got around to really reading your post on 2/7/13 Interesting & wow! So,shocking that all versions practically, leaving out such important "main staples spiritual wise" for christians! Like just give a few, Jesus, the blood,etc..
That why I believe it is good on ChristiaNet you can learn alot on here. It is a valuable tool, thank God for the many faithfull bible scolars.praise the Lord! Thankyou.love of jesus!
---ELENA on 2/16/13|
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Hello,followerofchrist just want to say love your post 2-14-13.
wonderfull the way you describe it so glorious, when the Lord comes back! Love of jesus! ELENA
---ELENA on 2/15/13|
strong ax, you can say anything you like, the no's 666 are evil. I don't want anything with that number on it. I know what God's Word says about evil. you can have all the 666 you want, I don't want that number anywhere around me.no I am not supertious. I am a realist.
---shira4368 on 2/14/13|
What is wrong with the number 666? It is just like any other number - 665, 667, 431, etc. Fearing a number is naive superstition.
Some years ago, the apartment where I lived had an electric meter with the digits 666 in the middle of the meter number. It also had the digits 666 in the customer account number. These were not related, as the digits on either side did not match. So I had TWO 666s in my electric bill. Was I worried about the Beast? No. because 1) I didn't have to tattoo those numbers on my hand or forehead, 2) I was able to buy groceries without doing so, and 3) I wasn't forced to worship the electric company. So, as far as matching Revelation prophecy, this was 0 for 3.
---StrongAxe on 2/14/13|
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Left behind is a fictional book series by men who claim Christianity and they made millions!! However their reckless story was not even based on any scriptures!!!
Nowhere in holy scripture is anyone "left behind" it is not even a term that is alluded to on any level. Further, the Lord Jesus does not return in secret as the left behind series that follows the doctrine of devils suggests.
The Lord returns with a great shout, it is seen at every corner of the world, and his return is glorious. When the Lord comes again to earth John 14:3,28 1 Thess 4:16, he will rule as King of King and Lord of Lords from Jerusalem forever and the faithful saints will be with him always here on earth
---Follower_of_Christ on 2/14/13|
No second chance
Revelation 22:11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Revelation 22:12 behold, I come quickly,
2 Thessalonians 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
Jeremiah 4:23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void, and the heavens, and they had no light... I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.
Those who are not changed to be like Him when he comes will be consumed by the brightness of His coming
---francis on 2/14/13|
the bride of Christ will be taken out of here. the dead in Christ shall rise up and we along with them will be carried to heaven. the "left behind" will have a chance to be saved if they endure til the end. the left behind won't be able to buy food, clothes or nothing unless they have the sign of 666. my son bought a permit for his boat and the permit said 666. he tried to get them to take it back and they wouldn't. he hates that number but I told him it was ok for now.
---shira4368 on 2/14/13|
This pertains to only the saints: 1 Corinthians 15:52 and 1 Thessalonians 4:14-17
Peter explicitly declares in his prophesy, But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up." There will be people left behind? Doesn't sound like it according to Peter.
No one will be left behind when the Lord returns to destroy the world, period! That's why it's called Judgement Day, aka Day of the Lord.
---christan on 2/14/13|
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That is a good point strongAxe! And I don't understand it, Jesus. I don't think anyone does. Ever since a long time ago. Since the beginning of time [Abel], you have allowed your people to endure such treatments. Of course we are anointed for this. Your power helps us. Still. Hallelujah!
---pat on 2/14/13|
Good point Strong axe.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/13/13|
Regardless of whether the church will be raptured during the Great Tribulation, the fact is that relying on being raptured out to escape tribulation is foolishly naive.
There have been many times in history (from Romans feeding Christians to lions, to the communist purge in Cambodia, or even more recent Muslim persecution of Christians), where Christians have had to endure tribulation without divine intervention. We have to be able to endure the Not-So-Great Tribulations which may nevertheless seem as bad as we can possibly imagine.
---StrongAxe on 2/13/13|
The strong delusion is used so that everyone who heard the Gospel before the Tribulation will not be able to accept it after the Tribulation starts.
2 Thes 2:11-12 "For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false, in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness"
Some see this as a veil being placed upon the Gentiles and the veil being removed from the Jews. The "times of the Gentiles" that Jesus described in Luke 21 is over.
---Mark_Eaton on 2/13/13|
At some future time, before the tribulation, the trump of God and the voice of the archangel will signal the catching away of the true church. Then all of the souls of the Christians who have died will return to their dead bodies, instantly changed to immortal bodies.
Then we who are left alive will not die, but will be changed into incorruptible, eternal bodies. Then we will be caught up into the clouds to meet fellow Christians and our Lord Jesus Christ in the air.
We know this from 1 Thess 4:13-18 and 1 Cor 15:51-55 the two places in scripture which speak most about our being caught up. Don't confuse this with Christs' second coming at the end of the tribulation when Christ's feet touch down on the Mount of Olives (Zech 14:4).
---michael_e on 2/12/13|
Follower_of_Christ, I'm afraid that you will get exactly what you put your faith in! There WILL be a Rapture. The Trials and Tribulations are what the Bride goes through, here, NOW, everyday. As she painfully, but, faithfully lays down and crucifies her flesh-nature, everyday, in order to take up that Cross and follow the Guidance of the Holy Spirit, to do the Will of GOD. And, she does all this in true Love and Devotion to her Bridegroom YAHUSHUA. I would never want to treat my wife the way that YOU believe CHRIST will treat HIS Bride. Running her through the thistles and mud of the Judgments and Wrath of GOD that are only meant for the lukewarm compromising Saints of the Church and for HIS enemies.
---Gordon on 2/12/13|
Truth is the delusion is the rapture. The Lord Jesus (as the Word and rock) brought Israel through every trial. The bride of Christ (His Church and all who dwell on the earth) will go through tribulation too. The Lord offers protection for those who obey in spirit and truth and watch as prophecy begins to unfold and to pray that they may be counted worthy of escape. Escape to safety yet still on earth for 3 1/2 years waiting for the end of the tribulation and the glorious appearing of the Lord Christ Jesus who returns to earth at the last trump, to rule the earth from Jerusalem as King of Kings and Lord of Lords.
---Follower_of_Christ on 2/12/13|
David_brosseau, It does not appear to directly say that the "Strong Delusion" will manifest "after the Rapture". It's just understood that way, because the Faithful Saints WILL be raptured. And, naturally following that, those who ARE Left Behind will be those not accounted worthy to escape the Tribulation to come, and those who had not made themselves ready for the Rapture(s. And they will have to endure the risk of believing in the Delusion of that great Lie, which will ultimately manifest ITSELF in the Anti-Christ.
---Gordon on 2/12/13|
Paul speaks of people "who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past" (in 2 Timothy 2:18). The Biblical "Rapture" is "the resurrection" of Jesus Christ's bride-church > ones will still be alive on this earth, when Jesus resurrects them without their dying > "the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them" (in 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17).
But one delusion is how people do not believe our Father is able to take care of us during the great tribulation. They don't think He is able to control Himself so He punishes only the guilty. But Psalm 91:7-8 contradicts that delusion.
---willie_c: on 2/12/13|
2 Thessalonians 2:11
If you read all of chapter 2 it tell you of the Great Apostasy in detail.I hope this helps.
---Mike on 2/11/13|
The strong delusion IS belief in a pre-trib Rapture.
The church WILL go through the Tribulation.
Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/11/13|