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Compromise For Basic Needs

How much of your faith will you compromise in exchange for the basic necessities (i.e. food, housing, clothing, etc.) to survive and endure unto the end?

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 ---Steveng on 3/17/13
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So as not to add to or change scripture. Elect is found 27 times in scripture. GOD is sure who is elect....he elected them for his purposes. Whether we understand or approve is not a choice in scripture. Truth is.
Most preachers today, would rather avoid truth. Escape from these wolves. Find the multiple scriptural witnesses see them for what they are...... Woofies. May the "true" force be with you.

Isa 42:1
Behold my servant, whom I uphold, mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth, I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.

Isa 45:4 For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.
---Trav on 4/12/13

Shira, thank you for hanging in there to listen to the Truth. As long as you belief that God saved you, you are ok. That is all that really matters. I also believe He saved me. Otherwise I would not have such a passion to learn about who God is and bring it to others. I do not support a perticular denomination, only the Truth of the doctrines of Scripture. A study on who God is, His nature, character and attributes, is my advice for all believers, for no passage can be answered correctly without knowing God first, So peace I leave you .
---Mark_V. on 4/12/13

ok markv, I won't discuss it anymore. I know where you stand and you know where I stand. the elect is mentioned one time or maybe two times but the elect are those who accept Christ. that is anyone in the world. Christ died for the whole world. my fate isn't decided already. I chose to go to church, hear preaching, get saved. I could have decided to walk out and be lost forever had I chose to. I do believe you are saved and heaven bound but so am I. lets just leave it there because you aren't gonna change and neither am I.
---shira4368 on 4/11/13

Shira 2: We have preachers and missionaries because the elect will come to Christ as God ordained they would. Nothing is out of order with God. If Kathr seats and does nothing, that is what she was destine to do. If she does something, that is what she was destine to do. It does not change what God already saw would be. You see God in time, but God is outside of time. His plan is complete before Him, nothing is out of order. The future is already determined by God. If It wasn't, we could not trust God that what is said in His Word about the future will ever come to pass. But it will because He never changes.
---Mark_V. on 4/11/13

Shira, I thought you did not want to discuss this topic with me? That's what I gathered. You are already grounded in your beliefs and nothing will change that, so why ask questions? I was going to move forward without you. But you won't let me.
Shira, God is not only Omnipotent, but He is Omniscient, knowing all things, He knows the destiney of everyone. When they will be born and when they will die, whether they will continue to hell or whether He is going to save them. No one can change what God has already ordained and planned before the foundation of the world. Our God is outside of time, He does not learn new things through time, He is all knowing. If you could change one little thing, you would be God and He would not be all knowing.
---Mark_V. on 4/11/13

so markv, are you telling kathr that no matter if she does Gods will or just lay around and never pray or doing anything for God, her destiny is already been determined? that don't even make sense. then if you are right, why do we have preachers, churches, christianet or any other religious organization?
---shira4368 on 4/10/13

Markv, there is no such gift or calling you claim you have in making the elect believe as you do, that God picked their names out of a hat and hated the rest. If one is already saved, leave them alone to grow up into Christ, and not your false doctrine.

Believing your false doctrine does not make one elect the moment you recrute them. It makes them stop preaching the Gospel and becomming a fanatic as yourself dragging them back to ground zero.

If perhaps it's God's will that one believes they came to Christ by being re-birthed first before hearing the Gospel, He will certainly make it a point to let them know, if in fact that is a major issue with God. So far it only seems to be a major issue with you.
---kathr4453 on 4/10/13

Kathr, I do not worry about your soul at all, for God already determined its destiney and nothing I do can change that. That is why I go to sleep very well. I do what I do because I am called to bring the gospel Truth to the elect, to let them know who saved them, and that was God from beginning to end, and just incase they believe they save themselvs with their own free will. So you won't see me running away anytime soon. Your post something wrong, and I will oppose it, if I see it. You write the Truth and I might say, great. Or I might not say anything because I know sooner rather then later, you will bring more heretical views. That is who you are, I cannot change that.
---Mark_V. on 4/10/13

MarkV, I won't change my beliefs just as Shira and many others here will not. So just run along and leave me at peace.

I already have not only Peace with God but the Peace of God at rest in me.

Don't worry about my soul MarkV, it is doing just fine and growing in theGrace and Knowledge of Jesus Christ LONG LONG before I ever came to CN, and long before I ever heard your name.

I know the DATE, time and hour I said Abba Father, and I also know how and what took place before that moment. I also know at that moment I was BORN AGAIN, and it was AFTER I heard the Gospel, after I responded to the Gospel.

I know that I Know MarkV.

You don't have that assurance. I'm sad for you. You climbed over some other way.
---kathr4453 on 4/10/13

Kathr, even today, there is no change in you. Not surprised. Could it be because God did not make you alive to Christ first, but you came to Christ with your own free will without faith? That must be it. One day, maybe, there will be a change in you. But not today.
---Mark_V. on 4/10/13

Markv, will you please stop plagiarizing others works here and pretending they are your own. That's stealing.

I feel like too I am talking to WATSON the robot. Gargage in Garbage out. Watson can not think for himself, he only responds to the data downloaded. Often he doesn't really understand the question and gives rather humerous answers.

If i want a conversation with WATSON the ROBOT, I'll see if that can be arranged.

Until the Lisa, I need to have conversaations with real thinking people.
---kathr4453 on 4/9/13

Kathr, the context of the whole first chapter was not in view. We were speaking of the context of the passages in (1 Thess. 1:4,5) was in view only. The context of the whole first chapter is much longer. The Thessalonians had become third generation mimics of Christ. Christ is the first, Paul the second and the Thessalonians third ( 1Cor. 4:16: 11:1). Joy in the midst of suffering evidenced the reality of their salvation, which included the indwelling of the Holy Spirit ( 1 Cor. 3:16: 6:19). They had received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Spirit, so that they could become examples to all in Macedonia and Achaia who believed already. The Thessalonians were model believers.
---Mark_V. on 4/9/13

One context to a passage? What is that?

When you have been written a letter, do you take each sentence , then number a sentence, and then put your own individual context on each sentence? And then when finished, it has nothing what so ever to do with or even remotely says what the letter is about ?

Is that what you mean Markv?

God taught me to read in WHOLE CONTEXT, and then take the WHOLE of Scripture, from Beginning to End to understand without taking a sentence out of context. Then gave me those back up scriptures to support the whole context.

Can't help you Markv if you only have the capacity to understand ones sentence at a time, out of context.
---kathr4453 on 4/9/13

1 Thessalonians 3

2 -----concerning your faith:

3 That no man should be moved by these afflictions: for yourselves know that we are appointed unto these things.
---kathr4453 on 4/7/13

Markv, you want to insist on election, yet fail to understand what we were elected / appointed for.

The CHURCH here today is the SUFFERING CHURCH. We His Body were "appointed " aka ELECTED to these things. That's the WHOLE of Paul's teaching, if you read the WHOLE.
---kathr4453 on 4/9/13

Kathr, you literally make me laugh when you speak. You cannot get one passage right, one context to a passage correct, and you tell me I need to learn the meat of the Word of God. I do admit, I have a long way to go, and everyday I learn a little more. The more times I answer your wrong interpretations, the more I learn about topics. So you have been a blessing to me in many ways. I told you, everyone has a purpose in the plan of God. It is not about God picking me, it is also about God picking you if you are saved. It is about all those God has chosen from the foundation of the world.
---Mark_V. on 4/8/13

Now 2 Thess is also about suffering,and how we are to conduct ourselves ( His Elect) with keeping God's promises in mind as we go through suffering. They were so distraught and were told the resurrection had already come, upsetting the faith of many. Paul assures them that certain things had to happen first BEFORE that could come to pass.

Markv, I would love to see you study the MEAT of the word, and stop cherry picking verses that you use so shallowly to prove God picked you, but rather learn the WHOLE council of God. GROW MARKV GROW!
---kathr4453 on 4/8/13

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Kathr, you are now talking about other context of other passages to confuse the passages in (1 Thess. 1:4,5). What did Paul wanted them to know?
"Knowing beloved brethren, your election by God" That is very clear to anyone. Paul even told them how the gospel came to them, not to others,
"For our gospel did not come to you in word only" which indicates it comes to others in word only. But to them it came:"but also in power and in the Holy Spirit with much assurance.." pretty simple for anyone who is looking for the Truth. You are not looking for the Truth.
---Mark_V. on 4/8/13

Markv, Paul preached to the Thessalonians in the Power of the Holy Spirit, but it may have come with signs and wonders too, as we see in Acts, the actual history of the founding of these Churches. Go back to Acts and get the ground work there as just HOW these people were saved, what was said to them, and if miracles accompanied the preaching of Paul to anyone, and because of these miracles did people believed. I believe before the NT scriptures were put together , SIGNS AND WONDERS AND MIRACLES accompanied the preaching of the Gospel.

Now, if they were already Elect, no such things would have been needed.

Now Paul is talking about things they are going through as Christians, like suffering, and telling them to endure!
---kathr4453 on 4/7/13

1 Thessalonians 3
3 Wherefore when we could no longer forbear, we thought it good to be left at Athens alone,

2 And sent Timotheus, our brother, and minister of God, and our fellowlabourer in the gospel of Christ, to establish you, and to comfort you concerning your faith:

3 That no man should be moved by these afflictions: for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto.

4 For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation, even as it came to pass, and ye know.

Yep Acts is where a child fell out the window...and if you continue reading you will see the subject and content of 1st Thessalonians.
---kathr4453 on 4/7/13

Kathr, as alway's you twisted the Truth. Here you said,
"MarkV the Gospel comes in Power of the Holy Spirit when the REAL Gospel is spoken. What else did you think that meant..that the Holy Spirit just showed up and personally spoke too you. WRONG!"
(1 Thess. 1:4,5) Paul is advicing the brethren to know their election by God. Because the gospel did not come to them in word only. The word comes to many in word only and no one is saved. To this brethren they were to know that the gospel came to them with power and in the Holy Spirit with much assurance.
That's why when the true gospel is preached, to many it comes in word only. But to the others, it comes in Power and in the Holy Spirit.

---Mark_V. on 4/6/13

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Kathr, you say,
"No OT Saint was Cricified with Christ, being made ONE NEW MAN IN CHRIST. WE are baptized into the RISEN CHRIST MarkV,"
You are wrong. All believers with faith are baptized into the body of Christ. The Old Testament saints included after the risen Christ. Paul wrote, "Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, "And to seeds, as of many, but as of one. "And to your Seed" who is Christ" (Gal. 3:16).
---Mark_V. on 4/6/13

Kathr 2: Paul to believing Gentiles:
"Therefore remember that you, once Gentiles in the flesh who are called Uncircumcision by what is called Circumcision made in the flesh by hands that at that time you were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers from the covenant of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. For He Himself is our peace, "who has made both one," and has broken down the middle wall of separation to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross" (Eph. 2:11-16).
---Mark_V. on 4/6/13

MarkV, because you don't believe the CHURCH is something new, because you can't understand the MYSTERY kept secret until Jesus rose, that is Christ in you, you cannot grasp what is being said.

No OT Saint was Cricified with Christ, being made ONE NEW MAN IN CHRIST. WE are baptized into the RISEN CHRIST MarkV, and the Hope of our calling is different and ABOVE what anyone else had in the OT. The Church, His Body or Bride is not Israel.

Because we do not agree on this issue, we will never agree on this issue. I will NEVER change my mind on this issue.

So, we will just have to agree to disagree.
---kathr4453 on 4/5/13

Steveng: Compromising is like the expression, "God is not capable", which is not correct. It is better we pray for grace to endure till God intervenes and not compromise.
---Adetunji on 4/5/13

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MarkV the Gospel comes in Power of the Holy Spirit when the REAL Gospel is spoken. What else did you think that meant..that the Holy Spirit just showed up and personally spoke too you. WRONG!

Sorry MarkV, but God works THROUGH those already saved, and has given us Gifts, yes in the Power of the Holy Spirit. Evangelism, that Gift given to many, is in the Power of the Holy Spirit preaching the Gospel.

And when the Gospel in the Power of the HOLY SPIRIT...(not you markv), is preached you will see people saved.

Now free will is exercized here to the hearers. Not all will respond with faith to receive Jesus Christ. BUT THEY WILL BE DRAWN to, but Not dragged in. Some may repsond months or even years later to what they heard.
---kathr4453 on 4/5/13

Kathr, you read the passage in (1 Thess. 1"2-5) and had no answer, the reason you now speak of justification and sanctification to confuse everything, and you know why? because you are wrong. You are not only wrong about the elect but that very same passage tells us believers that the Gospel has to come to the sinner in power and in the Holy Spirit with much assurance in order for the sinner to be saved. There is no free will in that passage. The person does no works in their salvation, it is all of God. If God doesn't bring the word in power, you will never belief. It is as simple as that.
---Mark_V. on 4/5/13

MarkV, again one is sanctification, and the other is justification. It's through sanctification we are conformed to His Image through suffering...see Philippians 3... "Being made CONFORMABLE TO HIS DEATH .

We are His Body, meaning In Him.

but you first have to be saved to become a member of His Body, being Baptized into His Death, first, and then raised up a new creature, In Him, right now.

The hope of our calling is to be Holy and Blameless before Him in Love.

Your salvation is just the Beginning, not the all in all Markv.
---kathr4453 on 4/4/13

Markv, you have for months or years now tried desperately to discredit everything I say, but in doing so, only discredit yourself and show your limited understanding of scripture and ALL God has for us.

All you know or believe is that you were picked. But your understanding is quite limited beyond that.

My prayer is for you to grow in the Grace and knowledge of Jesus, and to know the height, depth, width, and length beyond your wildest dreams. Ephesians 3: 14-21:)

Grow Markv.
---kathr4453 on 4/4/13

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Kathr, you also said,
"IT SAYS, we were foreordained /predestined "to be Conformed to His Image". Not saved. SEE THE DIFFERENCE?"
Here is what the word of God says,
"We give thanks to God always for you all" this are believers who are saved who give thanks to God.
"making mention of you in our prayers, remembering without ceasing your work of faith, labor of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ in the sight of God and Father, "knowing, beloved brethren, your election by God." For our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and in much assurance.." (1 Thess. 1:2-5).
---Mark_V. on 4/4/13

Bro. elee, thank for the passage. Belief does not mean a person is save. Even the devil believed, yet had no faith. In (John 1:12,13)
---Mark_V. on 4/1/13

AGAIN and AGAIN, and here again, MarkV fails to READ and comprehend his own words even.

Does it get any better than that?

No one even mentioned Demons BUT YOU MARKV. And now you want to make a mountain out of YOUR OWN MOLE HILL? Go for it!
---kathr4453 on 4/3/13

Kathr, you draw attention to yourself with you comments all the time. Here, out of nowhere you say,

"And I have yet to find your verse that says demons have no faith. Although we know they don't, there still is not one verse stating those exact words."

What in the world are you talking about? Demons having faith what kind of nonesense is that? You must have demons in your mind that you made up a whole new question. You are not all there Kathr. I said it before. It is not your fault, God ordained you to be that way. You also have a purpose, everyone does.
---Mark_V. on 4/3/13

MarkV please go back and read YOUR own comment. WHY did "you" put that in re: "demons have no faith" and try to marry it with John 1:10-11?

God never promised demons redemption in the first place, therefore there is no faith available for a demon to be redeemed.

And I have yet to find your verse that says demons have no faith. Although we know they don't, there still is not one verse stating those exact words.

Stop bringing attention to your own foolishness by calling names here...Oh better yet, please continue cursing me so I can draw attention to your lies!

---kathr4453 on 4/2/13

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Kathr, because your corrupt mind is always working, you now try to make a case that has nothing whatsoever to do with (John 1:10-13). To avoid answering the passages, you try to confuse the statement that a person has to be born of God in order for him to believe, which is the topic of (John 1:10-13). You cannot answer the word of God so you start talking about election and demons. You didn't compromise a little of your faith, you had none to compromise. Remember what you said? You said you came to Christ with no faith and because of your great deed, Christ in turn gave you everything including the Cross.
---Mark_V. on 4/2/13

James 2:19
Thou believest that there is one God, thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

You say this verse is in John? You quoted James and said John.

Was James quoting Jesus PERHAPS? So what is your problem? That James too is wrong, because ONLY YOU can quote Jesus accurately?

Actually MarkV, I WOULD rather let scripture teach scripture, and I WOULD rather take James interpretation of what Jesus said over YOURS. WHY, because James was WITH Jesus SAW JESUS, and never equated what he says with ELECTION of certain people like you do.

JAMES didn't TWIST the truth like you do.
---kathr4453 on 4/2/13

Bro. elee, thank for the passage. Belief does not mean a person is save. Even the devil believed, yet had no faith. In (John 1:12,13)
---Mark_V. on 4/1/13

MarkV, I was answering your comment here, your twisted application here.

Does John 1:12, 13, REALLY say devils believe but have no faith?

Or are you trying to nail two things together, that have never been nailed together before and hope some sucker will buy it? Well, only in America!
---kathr4453 on 4/2/13

The elect are really those in Christ whom God has predestined to be saved even from the foundation of the world.

Eph. 1:4-5 .....
---e.lee7537 on 4/1/13

WRONG.. Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world, and the everlasting covenant was also before the foundation of the world, that through earthly Adam a Spiritual man, called Sons would be brought INTO GLORY.

But that in no way says anything about picking only certain people. IT SAYS, we were foreordained /predestined "to be Conformed to His Image". Not saved. SEE THE DIFFERENCE?

No one was IN CHRIST before the foundation of the world.

Read the WHOLE BOOK of Ephesians Leej.
---kathr4453 on 4/1/13

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Kathr, you come out with some rediculous stuff just to argue, now you say,

"What did you think James was saying? He wasn't saying everyone who is not the Elect are demons now did he?"

The passages I presented were from (John 1:10-13), so what are you doing in James? You are trying to pull a cult move on me by introducing other passages that speak of other topics. Demons and works. A good trick of the cults. That's what they do all the time.
The passages we were discussing are talking about those born of God. While James topics was not election or demons. Election is a whole other topic. Demons is also a whole other topic.
---Mark_V. on 4/1/13

\\Do you really not know what it means to accept Christ, JamesL?\\
---Jed on 4/1/13

First - we do not accept Christ, He accepts us.

Do a little research on a rabbi/teacher/master in Judaism. Very similar to a sensei/teacher/master in martial arts.

The teacher is the one who accepts the student, not the other way around.

I used to give pool/billiards lessons. Many people asked me to teach them. One time a kid says to me "I'll let you teach me how to play pool".

He got a very abrupt lesson on who accepts who

So, Jed. What the heck do YOU mean ?
---James_L on 4/1/13

"Today, we are told by preachers that one must "accept Jesus Christ" in order to be save. However, such a teaching cannot be found anywhere in the Holy Bible. Isn't this then a lie against the Word?"
--christan on 1/20/12

Said on the blog created by christan "Accept Jesus To Be Saved"

Yet chrissy and murky let the eel slide when she said:
"One must not only believe but one must also accept Christ into ones life."
---e.lee7537 on 3/31/13

So then, who is the 2 faced...
---Nana on 4/1/13

kathr4453 // if you continue reading what James is saying here, he says then "faith without works is dead."

And so is belief without spiritual rebirth in which situation works would be evidence of a faith that is alive.

//He (James) wasn't saying everyone who is not the Elect are demons now did he?

The elect are really those in Christ whom God has predestined to be saved even from the foundation of the world.

Eph. 1:4-5 (Message Bible) Long before he laid down earths foundations, he had us in mind, had settled on us as the focus of his love, to be made whole and holy by his love. Long, long ago he decided to adopt us into his family through Jesus Christ. (What pleasure he took in planning this!)
---e.lee7537 on 4/1/13

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Bro. elee, thank for the passage. Belief does not mean a person is save. Even the devil believed, yet had no faith. In (John 1:12,13)mARKv///

Yes MarkV, and if you continue reading what James is saying here, he says then "faith without works is dead."

So just to "believe" without works, even Satan and his fallen angels can do.

What did you think James was saying? He wasn't saying everyone who is not the Elect are demons now did he?

So why do you imply they are.
---kathr4453 on 4/1/13

Bro. elee, thank for the passage. Belief does not mean a person is save. Even the devil believed, yet had no faith. In (John 1:12,13)
The first part of (v.12) is in contrast to verses 10,11, where we are told He came to His own and His own did not receive Him".
Here we are told:
"But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name" Speaking only of those who received Him.
"Who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God" Only those born of God received Him. The other from (v. 10,11) did not receive Him because they were not born of God. When a person is born of God they receive Christ.
---Mark_V. on 4/1/13

\\also accept Christ into ones life.\\
---e.lee7537 on 3/31/13

What the heck is that supposed to mean?
---James_L on 3/31/13

Do you really not know what it means to accept Christ, JamesL? I would suggest finding a different church and talking with another pastor as soon as possible about getting saved. That should be primary mission of any pastor, to lead folks to Christ. If you've been attending church for any time at all and never knew what it meant to accept Christ then please, please find another pastor. There is something wrong at that church.
---Jed on 4/1/13

\\also accept Christ into ones life.\\
---e.lee7537 on 3/31/13

What the heck is that supposed to mean?

Do you have an objective definition or description?

It seems like more ambiguity. Could mean lots of things to lots of differnet people.

Get down to brass tacks, man.
---James_L on 3/31/13

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"One must not only believe but one must also accept Christ into ones life."
---e.lee7537 on 3/31/13

You should not be addressing that to kathr4453 but to chrissyn and mark. You seem to make an exception with each other.
---Nana on 3/31/13

I agree Leej, and when one Receives AKA accepts Jesus they are accepting to themselves Jesus death and resurrection life, buried with Him unto death and raised up together with Him a NEW CREATURE. Whether that new Creature is a sheep, or a member of His Body , I believe the latter applies to us.

Israel was called His sheep. But true, once we are saved, and become a member of His Body, He is our head, and all flow down from the Head to the Body. We KNOW the voice of The Lord and will not follow false teachers.
---kathr4453 on 3/31/13

kathr4453//You didn't become one of His sheep until you believed. Not before.

Lots of people believe but until they are born spiritually by God's Spirit they really are not His sheep.

There are many that believe with they minds but there is nothing in their hearts.

John 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

One must not only believe but one must also accept Christ into ones life.
---e.lee7537 on 3/31/13

Again Markv, you apply scripture talking to those already saved.

You didn't become one of His sheep until you believed. Not before.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/13

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Markv, meditate on this. What was the purpose of signs, wonders and miracles that Jesus did? Was it to Show Off?

Why did the Apostles do miracles in the book of Acts? Again, to show off.

Why do you say THOSE kind of signs and miracles are not needed today?

Why were they needed then?

If you truly answered this question honestly, then I would say you see something. But, if you can't answer this question , you see nothing even today.

Buy of me Gold tried in the fire that you may be rich, and salve for your EYES that you may "see."

Who was God talking to here, saved or unsaved.

Oh it doesn't matter how you answer, because it PROVES your lack of sight no matter how you answer.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/13

1 John 1:1-3
1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life,

2 (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us,)

3 That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.

Now Markv, this applies to us, since we were not there when Jesus walked the earth.

You still have not told us what you SAW first before believing.

Still waiting.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/13

Kathr, I will tell you how this distinction of hearing and seeing is different. You have physical hearing and physical eyes that can see right this minute, because you are using the computer in front of you and I know you can see it, Yet, to this day you have no spiritual hearing or spiritual vision from God. Spiritually, you are blind as a bat. Now do you know why? Because God has not given them to you. And you will not get them unless you are one of the chosen one's before the foundation of the world. That is the distinction. Why do you think in the Bible Jesus says, "if you hear this words" or "only My sheep hear My words and they follow Me"?
---Mark_V. on 3/30/13

Yes, just as Moses was who God spoke to , to go and speak to Israel, and giving of the Law etc, so in these Last Days God has spoken to us through His Son. And just as those laws and Prophets were passed down from Generation to Generation, those words were just as effective as if Moses was standing there 1000 years later saying them.

The same is true with the Word of God that lives and endures FOREVER.

There is no such thing as SPIRITUAL EARS.

These special TERMS made up is really getting ridiculous .

The WORD of God is living and powerful MarkV, not YOUR EARS.
---kathr4453 on 3/30/13

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Quite the contrary that Israel could not hear. Moses said the whole of Deuteronomy 29 "unto all Israel".
"And I have led you forty years in the wilderness: your clothes are not waxen old upon you, and thy shoe is not waxen old upon thy foot.
Ye have not eaten bread, neither have ye drunk wine or strong drink: that ye might know that I am the LORD your God."
Was he talking to the wall like Lisa does here?
No, quite the contrary as he even told them:
"That thou shouldest enter into covenant with the LORD thy God, and into his oath, which the LORD thy God maketh with thee this day:..."
---Nana on 3/29/13

so why would Scripture tell us hearing comes from God, when we already have physical hearing? ---Mark_V. on 3/29/13
that is really mesed up MarkV, faith comes by HEARING THE WORD OF GOD.

Quite different than hearing God. When we hear God's Word we are hearing GOD. When we hear markv ramble on we are hearing MarkV.
---kathr4453 on 3/29/13

Jed, i said the TERM "Saving Faith" is not found in scripture. FAITH is.

Common Grace and Special Grace is another not found in Scripture GRACE is.

Adding these little EXTRA terms changing God's Word to mean something other than what God said is called a FALSE PROPHET!

MarkV and Chriatan would have you believe that verse REALLY SAYS:

You are saved By SPECIAL GRACE( not common Grace) through that SAVING FAITH (not the other faith).

and we know those EXTRA words are not there are they?
---kathr4453 on 3/29/13

And the term SAVING faith is not found in scripture.
---kathr4453 on 3/28/13

Eph. 2:8-9, "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God. Not by works, lest any man should boast."

Please, tell us again how salvation through faith is not found in scripture?
---Jed on 3/28/13

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Stongaxe, the Bible does make a distinction. First of all doesn't everyone have faith of some kind? Yet we are told that "faith comes from hearing," and second, "hearing by the word of God."
so why would Scripture tell us hearing comes from God, when we already have physical hearing? Why would it say that faith comes from hearing if we already have faith? The reason is that spiritual hearing comes from God, Spiritual faith also comes from spiritual hearing. Read (Deut. 29:2-4).
"Yet the Lord has not given you a heart to perceive and eyes to see and ears to hear, to this very day" Speaking to those who already could physically see, and hear.
---Mark_V. on 3/29/13

Scripture never makes a distinction between faith and faith. And the term SAVING faith is not found in scripture.

Just as there is no such thing as common grace and special grace.

But these terms, are made up in order for Calvinists to continue in their false doctrine.
---kathr4453 on 3/28/13


I don't believe that the Bible ever makes a distinction between different "kinds of faith" (i.e. faith for salvation and faith in God for other things), just as it doesn't make a distinction between ceremonial and civil law (as some new testament legalists assert).
---StrongAxe on 3/28/13

Strongaxe, you and I are talking about two different kinds of faith. I am talking about saving faith that comes from God, which you either have it or you don't. You are talking about human faith which does not saved anyone. All people have faith, but not all people have the faith that God gives through the Spiritual birth. You cannot give up that faith. You either belief through faith, or you don't. That is what I was talking about. You can never give that faith away. When the gospel comes to you in power, and the Holy Spirit it comes to you in much assurance God's Word in (1 Thess. 1:4,5).
---Mark_V. on 3/24/13

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How much of your faith will you compromise in exchange for the basic necessities (i.e. food, housing, clothing, etc.) to survive and endure unto the end?
---Steveng on 3/17/13
1 Corinthians 10:12 Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.
---francis on 3/21/13


No passage recommends "a little" faith, but we are all imperfect human beings. God exhorts us to have faith, but we have limited capacity for it. Many easily believe God can cure colds, and even cancer, but few dare rely on him regrowing missing limbs and eyes. It's easy to have faith that God can manipulate natural processes (so if things go our way, we can say God did it), but few dare rely on him acting to directly alter the laws of nature.

If you're hungry, do you pray for a roast duck to fly into your mouth (per old Chinese proverb)? Yet God SHOULD find that just as easy as sending someone with a food box.
---StrongAxe on 3/21/13

Jesus also said frequently, "Your faith has saved you, go in peace.", "Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel."

"According to your faith be it unto you."

Lets not forget Peter: "But when he saw the wind boisterous, he was afraid, and beginning to sink, he cried, saying, Lord, save me.
And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of little faith, wherefore didst thou doubt?"
---Nana on 3/21/13

revelation 3:16....So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew thee out of my mouth. God don't like fence riding. we must have faith that God will furnish our needs. God has always furnished my needs and He has furnished much more than I need. I have been blessed.
---shira4368 on 3/21/13

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Strongaxe, you either have faith, or you don't. There is no passage that teaches us to have a little faith in the gospel Truth. If you have genuine saving faith in Christ, you will not be in unbelief. When Jesus spoke of the mustered seed, He said,
"So Jesus said to them, "Because of your unbelief, for assuredly, I say to you, "if" you have faith as a mustard seed, you will say to this mountain, "move from here to there and it will move, and anything will be possible for you."
Jesus said they were in unbelief. Second, "if they had that faith, but they didn't and no one does. Jesus teaching always involve surrender to the will of God. If you noticed many times many walked with Him no more.
---Mark_V. on 3/21/13

If I were a Seventh Day Adventists and starving to death and the only thing to eat was a pig, I would make myself a pot roast and eat it. But according to Adventists that would pee off God since His law forbids the eating of certain foods.

Jesus in Mark 7:19f told us that what goes into the stomach does not defile us but what comes from the heart. Golly if olde Ellen was living during His time, she would certainly have straighten Him out.
---e.lee7537 on 3/21/13

I don't think anyone believes they would compromise their Faith.
Just ask Peter.

We must trust Jesus to keep us faithful to Him.
But, I do think the little things we do in not compromising our faith makes us stronger to keep our faith when our essential needs might be taking away.
---Nikki on 3/20/13

I do not believe that we will know until we are faced with compromise faith verses death.

This is what the early Christians faced at the time of Nero. Many were outstanding examples! Many gave their lives for the cause of Christ rather than compromise.

I hope and pray that if ever faced with compromise or death I would chose death rather than forsake my precious Saviour who died for me!
---trey on 3/20/13

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You said: Faith is always 100% or nothing.

This is simply not true. Jesus was constantly admonishing his followers as "ye of little faith" - not "ye of no faith". He said anyone with faith as small as a mustard seed could move mountains. In all of recored Christian history, nobody has ever done this. Are we to conclude that no Christians ever had any faith? Hardly!
---StrongAxe on 3/20/13

Steveng, your worldly denominational church will not provide you with the spiritual strength that YOU need to not compromise your faith for basic necessities.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/20/13

Faith is always 100% or nothing. It is not destroyed by a sin or sins, but sin requires asking sincerely for forgiveness. There are alternatives to stealing to survive, like charities by other Christians.
---Geraldine on 3/18/13

"How much of your faith will you compromise in exchange for the basic necessities (i.e. food, housing, clothing, etc.) to survive and endure unto the end?" None.
Father knows I have need of all these things and has promised that if I "seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added." I, by His grace, trust His Word.
---josef on 3/18/13

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just did my taxes and such so about 16%. God's blessing on my 90% is much larger than me trying to bless my 100%.
---Scott1 on 3/18/13

That's a question no one can really know the answer to until the time of testing comes...
---Love.wins on 3/17/13

This question sounds like you are assuming that people WILL compromise to get their necessities.

Why are you thinking this?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 3/17/13

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