ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

What Is Original Sin

If you DON'T believe in original sin, can you please explain Psalms 51:5?

V5 Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me.

Join Our Free Dating and Take The Sin & Repentance Quiz
 ---Nicole_Lacey on 10/21/16
     Helpful Blog Vote (4)

Post a New Blog



Nicole, I just reported on the story, which says they were unbaptized. That according to the RCC all baptized regardless of age are given proper burials with graves and markers, not thrown in a septic tank that spans over 40 years.

So Nicole, we will have to ask the Lord when we see Him to list ALL Catholic priests who refused baptism to unwed mothers babies. Are you so sure there is not ONE name on a that list, that you would even bet your eternal life on it? Do Nuns have the power and authority to Baptize?
---kathr4453 on 11/19/16


Pope Francis Baptizes Child Of Unmarried Parents And Rightly Calls Priests Who Wont Hypocrites
3 years ago by Frances Locke42 CommentsShare a Tip


Nicole, I know you accuse me of making thing up, but here is a headline about Pope Francis. Now WHY would Pope Francis call any Priest a Hypocrite who WONT? Isn't it because in the RCC there ARE priests who WONT. Pope Francis was making a statement here for ALL to see his example of baptizing illegitimate babies. It was a PR thing going on here. If the practice was an every day occurrence, IT WOULD NOT HAVE MADE WORLD HEADLINES, anymore than the Pope washing his hands after using the bathroom would not have made WORLD NEWS.
---kathr4453 on 11/19/16


**In accordance with the traditions of the nuns, much of the day proceeded in silence. Like orphanages, they received almost NO GOVERNMENT FUNDS. As in any underfunded institution, the food was described as bland. The NUNS SHARED the conditions of the inmates, such as the bad food, hard work, the confinement and the long periods of silence..There was no physical contact on the part of the sisters, and no emotional contact in the sense of listening to the girls own concerns--Wikipedia

"Stolen"?! Parents REFUSE to care for their OWN children!

How do you think a group of POOR Nun feed thousands of children?

EVERYONE had to work to EAT!

Where were the Protestants when these children were homeless and hungry?
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/19/16


//I don't have to name Priests who have refused infant baptism,//

Because you don't have any names because NO Priest REFUSED to baptize a Unwed mother's child.

What about unwed fathers' babies? We baptizes them as well!

//anymore than I have to name ALL priests who have molested children.//

How stupid do you think I am?

If I claimed no Priest molested children you would have named them and cited your sources! (Rightfully so)

Just as you named the Nuns and the Order, you would have as well.

You STILL DIDN'T answer my question!

How do you KNOW the dead babies WERE NOT baptized?

PLEASE ANSWER. Be fair

I will answer your 2nd part question soon.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/19/16


Nicole, I don't have to name Priests who have refused infant baptism, anymore than I have to name ALL priests who have molested children. And Nicole, Ireland 's RCC had a terrible reputation of how it treated unwed mothers. The Magdeline Sisters, and that true story broke and brought shame to the Irish RCC. Don't say it didn't happen. They interview these women who were imprisioned by the RCC NUNS. There are horror stories all over the world at the abuses of the RCC, one being in AUSTRALIA, WHERE 50,000+ POOR CHILDREN who were STOLEN FROM THEIR PARENTS in England and Ireland and sent to these HORRIBLE RCC CONTROLLED work camps.
---kathr4453 on 11/19/16




I do not live in the UK.---kathr4453

SORRY, I might have confused you with Karen. SORRY.

I don't think you are aware of HOW England abused Northern Ireland even after their Independence in 1916.

They made the south Ireland Protestant and gave them control of ALL lands in Ireland with Government Jobs to LORD over Catholics.

//they should never have had them there in the first place. These were NOT Government homes.//

The RCC NEVER turns it's back on POOR People even if they are unwed mothers.

So what do you want them to do?

Let their bodies ROT in the streets????

//there are Priests who do and have refused baptism to the babies of unwed mothers.---kathr4453

NAME THEM!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/18/16


Nicole, the Government of England is not responsible for RCC homes for unwed mothers. They were not sponsored by the government of England, but it was a RCC sponsored home for unwed mothers. To place the blame on the English Governmemt is wrong Nicole. If the RCC home for unwed mothers run by NUNS could not afford to take care of these unwed mothers, then they should never have had them there in the first place. These were NOT Government homes.

Well just as we have Pastors who refuse to marry divorced folks, there are Priests who do and have refused baptism to the babies of unwed mothers. Some have and some have not.
---kathr4453 on 11/17/16


//Did the RCC EVER from the beginning of its inception to today refuse to baptize an illegitimate baby from an unwed mother? Be truthful Nicole.//

NEVER! Now you be truthful for a change.

You love to make up stuff.

Cite PROOF of the RCC refusing to baptize a child due to unwed mothers!

Proof, which DOESN'T include yourself as evidence.

//BECAUSE it was a BIG DEAL when Pope Francis DID baptize one.//

No it WASN'T. Another whopper as usual.

//If it were a common practice, a BIG DEAL would not have been made.--kathr4453 on 11/16/16

A BIG DEAL ONLY IN YOUR MIND!

Cite this Big Deal incident if you can.

REMEMBER, Everyone WANTS the Pope to baptizes their kids.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/17/16


//The bodies of 796 children,..been buried in a disused sewage tank in Tuam, County Galway, Ireland..1925 and 1961 in a mother and baby home under the care of the Bon Secours nuns.//

REALLY?

ENGLAND WAS IN CHARGE at that time!
And you are upset because the Catholic Nuns couldn't bury them properly?

Your Government is at FAULT NOT the Nuns!

These were Children YOUR Government REFUSED to take care of and LEFT them to Nuns who tried to care for them!

You have your NERVE!

//Did the RCC EVER..refuse to baptize an illegitimate baby from an unwed mother?---kathr4453

SHOW me any RC' doctrine stating they won't!

4 different Priests baptized my nieces and nephews and their mothers were UNWEB!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/17/16


The bodies of 796 children, between the ages of two days and nine years old, are believed to have been buried in a disused sewage tank in Tuam, County Galway, Ireland. They died between 1925 and 1961 in a mother and baby home under the care of the Bon Secours nuns.


Look it up Nicole, it was WORLD NEWS in 2014. Baptized babies/children are not dissuaded in septic tanks or mass graves.

Answer yes or no....just yes or no.

Did the RCC EVER from the beginning of its inception to today refuse to baptize an illegitimate baby from an unwed mother? Be truthful Nicole. BECAUSE it was a BIG DEAL when Pope Francis DID baptize one. If it were a common practice, a BIG DEAL would not have been made.

YES OR NO.
---kathr4453 on 11/16/16




//little corpse found, the RCC refused to BAPTIZE.---kathr4453

What are you talking about?

How do you KNOW they were NOT baptized?

Is there something on their bones that states "I haven't been baptized."?

You can't baptize corpse?

//multitude of parents who were told their babies are in hell because the RCC didn't baptize them.//

ONLY a Protestant LIE. The RCC NEVER SAID SO.

Making stuff up again

//I understand only recently the RCC changed their stance on that. So even if a baby has no power over its baptism--kathr4453

I GUESS NOT.

RCC said they were in Limbo, but BECAUSE of people LIKE YOU, they said it is a Mystery, but the RCC KNOWS babies are not in HELL!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/16/16


Nicole, the very sad part of what you are believing is the multitude of parents who were told their babies are in hell because the RCC didn't baptize them. I understand only recently the RCC changed their stance on that. So even if a baby has no power over its baptism, the PARENTS are doing all the work here. The PARENTS OF RCC BABIES ARE HAVING THE RCC BAPTIZE THEM. That is not an act of God Nicole, it is an action of MAN.
---kathr4453 on 11/16/16


THURSDAY, JUNE 05, 2014
Children's bones, babies' bodies the undying shame of the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland
There were over 800 of these precious little corpse found, the RCC refused to BAPTIZE. So tell us upon WHAT scripture do you base that inaction, or power over ones soul?

So Nicole PLEASE don't talk to me about the RCC's baptism of infants, and rejecting that baptism on illegitimate babies.

PRAISE GOD GOD IS NO REPSECTOR OF PERSONS, and Jesus Baptism with the Holy Spirit and FIRE, not water does not discriminate against ANY SINNER and the ONLY baptism needed for salvation, of which your popes and priests have no POWER to magically manifest.
---kathr4453 on 11/16/16


Good points Kathyr
---Samuelbb7 on 11/15/16


//this happens to those who are IN HIM. No one is IN HIM from birth.---kathr4453


EXACTLY what Sacrament means: Baptism is God ACTING and not depended on humans' condition. You got it.

//SPIRITUAL BAPTISM, made WITHOUT HANDS.//

God marks the soul not man.

//There is a difference between cutting away the flesh...aka being baptized into Jesus Death//

OFF COURSE.

//THAT kind of baptism Nicole cannot be forced on babies//

All humans BELONG to God. No forcing

//once THIS BAPTISM takes place in your life NO MASS IS NEEDED AFTERWORDS.---kathr4453

Now you are on left field.

Mass is a DIFFERENT Sacrament. It is the SUPREME Sacrament.

God commanded BOTH Sacraments in the NT.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/15/16


Nicole, Colossians is awesome isn't it. Yes we see here the SPIRITUAL BAPTISM, made WITHOUT HANDS.

CIRCUMCISION ON THE 8th day was/ is a foreshadowing of Jesus death and resurrection and the NEW CREATION/creature. The 8th day represents the day Jesus rose from the dead. And in rising from the dead, ALL SIN was dealt with once and for all. The 8th day represented new beginnings. Same as with Noah and 8 souls saved. There is a difference Nicole between cutting away the flesh...aka being baptized into Jesus Death where WE , our old man is crucified with Christ. THAT kind of baptism Nicole cannot be forced on babies by sprinkling water on them. And once THIS BAPTISM takes place in your life NO MASS IS NEEDED AFTERWORDS.
---kathr4453 on 11/15/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Debt Consolidation


Nicole, also notice the very first words of this verse....IN HIM YOU WERE. See, this happens to those who are IN HIM. No one is IN HIM from birth, not even a Calvinist...

We are IN HIM when WE CHOOSE TO BE BURIED WITH HIM. Only those who are first crucified with Christ and raised a new creature are IN HIM. And those IN HIM make up the CHURCH, the Body of Christ. Once we are IN HIM, we are now COMPLETE IN HIM.
---kathr4453 on 11/15/16


//Infant baptism is not based on OT circumcision//

Colossians 2:11-12 In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not performed by human hands. Your whole self ruled by the flesh was put off when you were circumcised by Christ, having been buried with him in BAPTISM, in which you were also raise WITH him through your faith in the working of God, who raised him from the dead.

If baptism ISN'T needed why make the comparison?

Paul KNOWS when a person is circumcised. As a baby!

Note, no MENTION of beliefs in Paul's analogy.

Because Jewish babies couldn't state their belief in the OT.

//Females were not circumcised. ---kathr4453

Thank God!

That would be mean!

God ISN'T mean.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/14/16


Infant baptism is not based on OT circumcision. No one was saved in the OT by being circumcised in the first place. What God required of Israel to set them apart from Gentile Nations did not secure their salvation.

You do not see mothers with babies in arms lining up for John to water baptize their babies in place of circumcision. Or anywhere in the NT for that matter. AND we see in Romans 4 ABRAHAM's faith was BEFORE Circumcision. Circumcision was a sign OF HIS FAITH. A seal that came AFTER his faith. But nowhere is it taught in the OT that circumcision on the 8th day assured salvation. Every Pharisee who rejected Jesus Christ was no doubt circumcised on the 8th day. And what about females. Females were not circumcised.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/16


Scripture ALSO doesn't states if these whole family's children REPENTED and Believed as you all claim.

//Infant Baptism is based on circumcision. But the Bible demands acceptance and repentance.//

No, because the Jewish Boy were 8 days ago when they were circumcised making them JEWISH whether they WANTED to be Jewish or not.

//You did not tell me why when Peter and Paul say that Jesus is the cornerstone and foundation of the Church. Why do you think they are incorrect.---Samuelbb7

Because Peter and Paul NEVER claim Jesus is the Foundation.

All 3 acknowledge Jesus is the Cornerstone.

Samuel, just answer this question PLEASE:

Do you believe the Cornerstone and the Foundation stone is the SAME stone?
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/13/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Refinancing


Nicole, so, babies, in your mind, can be saved by baptism. So, preaching the gospel and the ten commandments are not required to be saved? How does a person know he or she is a sinner without knowledge of the law?

Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7: Can a baby understand the law and be conscious of sin?

Matt 7:21-23: Only those who hear and do God's Word will have life. Can a baby/infant know what is being preached?

John 14:15: how can a baby/infant understand obedience.

1. One must hear the words of God and believe with heart, MIND, and soul.

2. On must recognize that he is a sinner after hearing God's word.

3. One must repent of his sins.
---Steveng on 11/13/16


As I post word for word from the KJV, and Nicole has never heard these scriptures before claiming I have made them up, ( which EVERYONE READING HERE KNOW I HAVE NOT MADE THEM UP) again only makes Nicole look .....I don't know.....someone please tell me, do Catholics NOT acknowledge the Holy Bible, or do they believe the KJV is just something someone MADE UP. There is a game going on here.

Since all I have here is the Word of God Nicole that YOU scoff and spit at at every turn, it's time for me to turn my back on you and accept the fact you are a heretic like I have never encountered before. im here to defend SCRIPTURE NICOLE....ALL OF IT, NOT JUST SELECTED VERSES.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/16


//People who do not believe do not get baptized.// kathr

I did. No belief at all.

Total FREE Gift from Jesus to me. NOTHING required from me.

---Nicole_Lacey on 11/12/16

Mark 16:16 is referring to Jesus Baptism with FIRE AND THE HOLY SPIRITS. I believe the FIRE and HOLY SPIRIT baptism Nicole has not yet encountered.

We see in the RCC criminals ( Moffia) child molesters, you name it, all claim they are saved because their mothers had them water baptized as babies and told them they are now saved, who CONTINUE IN THEIR SIN, but never received JESUS Mark 16:16 SPIRITUAL BAPTISM. Once THAT Baptism has happened, one becomes DEAD TO SIN...ROMANS 6, and raised up a New Creature.
---kathr4453 on 11/13/16


Lots of people don't believe so they don't get baptized. If you don't believe in GOD and don't believe in Jesus why should you get baptized?

Notice you believe then get Baptized.

Act 16:31
And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.


Nicole why is Peter and Paul lying about Jesus being the Corner Stone foundation of the church? Why do the Prophets make a false prediction that Jesus Christ will be the corner stone which Israel rejects?

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 11/13/16


Shop For Church Resources


//I could care less about your analogies. They make no sense.//

Well, it should since you make up Scripture.

//No one is going to FIRST be baptized SO THAT they can believe.//

You can't put money down on a counter without FIRST selecting a product.

//People get baptized BECAUSE they believe//

No because THEY have to get baptized.
It's Jesus' Commandment. Mark 16:16

//People who do not believe do not get baptized.//

I did. No belief at all.

Total FREE Gift from Jesus to me. NOTHING required from me.

Isn't Jesus good?

Come out with it: Are you saying those Passage you gave means you DON'T have to be baptized?

You DON'T have to OBEY Jesus in Mark 16:16?
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/12/16


But Peter was talking to all people. Mainly Jews. So Jews would not expect their children to join until after the Bar or Bat Mitzvah.

True the man's whole family was baptized. But no where are we told how old his children are.

Infant Baptism is based on circumcision. But the Bible demands acceptance and repentance.

Also. You did not tell me why when Peter and Paul say that Jesus is the cornerstone and foundation of the Church. Why do you think they are incorrect.

Should not the two more plain sources be used to understand the third. Instead of saying one is right and the other two are false and don't teach correctly.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/12/16


NIcole, I could care less about your analogies. They make no sense. No one is going to FIRST be baptized SO THAT they can believe. People get baptized BECAUSE they believe. People who,do,not believe do not get baptized.

And your expample go against scripture.




woman, Thy faith hath saved thee, go in peace.

Luke 18:42 And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
---kathr4453 on 11/12/16


//They were baptized because they first BELIEVED. THEIR FAITH NICOLE IS WHAT SAVED THEM.//

No, because if it did then there would be NO point to being baptized.

If I told a teacher I believed in his lessons, do you think he would pass me?

No, he would tell me to take the TEST and SHOW him HOW much I believed in his lessons.

I Truly BELIEVE that exercising and eating right will keep me in shape.

Just believing DOESN'T cut the mustard!

Being a size 16 and not a 4 demonstrates that to me!

//I believe this is one of those cognitive issues Rob was referring to as borderline IDIOT.---kathr4453

YES, Rob rubbed off on you and I was right.

Your true COLORS are showings.

RED AND BLACK!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/12/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Franchises


//Peter said repent and be baptized. You had to repent before you could be Baptized.---Samuelbb7

Only adults. But it Isn't mentioned with the Eunuch. Only Baptism is Acts 8:26-39

Note in Acts 16:30-33 ONLY ONE man believe and his WHOLE family was baptized.

ALSO Peter repeated Jesus' Words in Mark 16:16

You CAN NOT rejected the fact that the Apostles BAPTIZED everyone for the entry of Christian faith.

Acts 10:47 "Can anyone withhold the water for baptizing these people, who have received the Holy Spirit even as we have?"

Note they STILL have to be baptized even after they believe!

You can place a apple in your basket, BUT you still have to PAY FOR IT to take it home!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/12/16


But Nicole Peter said repent and be baptized. You had to repent before you could be Baptized.

Act 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at, but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Look up repent in a Bible search engine.

Yes Peter is quoting GOD from the Old Testament how Jesus would be the Corner stone.

Ephesians 2:20-22 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone, In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord: In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/11/16


Note the Bible doesn't even speaks on repentance. Just baptism which SAVED them because they are part of the Body of Christ.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/10/16

Again NO NICOLE. They were baptized because they first BELIEVED. THEIR FAITH NICOLE IS WHAT SAVED THEM. Your sentence "just baptism SAVED them because they are part of the Body of Christ"... Makes absolutely no sense what so ever. I believe this is one of those cognitive issues Rob was referring to as borderline IDIOT. We are saved BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH NICOLE.
---kathr4453 on 11/11/16


Nicole, YOU don't listen. We've been over this before. Jesus never baptized with water. Jesus baptizes with the Holy Spirit and with FIRE. To misinterpret scripture and say being born of WATER, means to be baptized with water is a serious delusion on your part. Even when John baptized with water, he never used the term BORN OF WATER or said anyone is born of water. Water is what is in the WOMB, if you go back and READ JOHN 3. Water there is clarified, and NOT CLARIFIED AS A WATER BAPTISM.

You love to make things up Nicole. And that one YOU MADE UP. You will stoop to any LIE, just to cover your pride. You're not a teacher Nicole, as THAT is a Gift from God He NEVER GAVE TO YOU. You don't believe Ephesians 4..... REMEMBER?
---kathr4453 on 11/11/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Lead Generation


//I am not fighting the RCC. I am pointing to scripture that disagrees with their teaching.//

I KNOW you are not.

I Believe you are FIGHTING WHAT you think is the RCC.

Venerable Bishop Fulton Sheen said it the best:

"There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church, but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be."

//1Peter 2:4-8---Samuelbb7 on 11/10/16

Peter is quoting God and Never called Jesus the Foundation.

What does the name of a stone mean to you? Or any name?

If I tell you I am a Dialysis Nurse wouldn't you understand that I work in Dialysis and not in ICU?

Cornerstone means it is in the Corner
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/11/16


//even PETER says John's water baptism doesn't save//

You have everything backwards. Who believes John's baptism saves? Is that religion called Johnism?

Only Jesus' WATER baptism SAVES. Mark 16:16

//Nicole SCRIPTURE, even from Peter disagrees with you.--kathr4453

Go to Acts 3:37-41

said to Peter and the other apostles, Brothers, what shall we do?
Peter replied, Repent and be BAPTIZED, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins...Those who accepted his message WERE BAPTIZED, and about three thousand were added to their number that day.

Note the Bible doesn't even speaks on repentance. Just baptism which SAVED them because they are part of the Body of Christ.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/10/16


I am not fighting the RCC. I am pointing to scripture that disagrees with their teaching.

On the points where the RCC teach scripture I agree with them.

But when Peter says Jesus is the foundation of the church and the RCC say Peter and Apostle ordained by Jesus Christ is wrong. Then I don't believe them.

I believe Peter.

1Peter 2:4-8 To whom coming, as unto a living stone,... Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded. Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,...
---Samuelbb7 on 11/10/16


1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:.

Again Nicole SCRIPTURE, even from Peter disagrees with you. The Baptism here PETER is talking about is on one being baptized into Jesus Death and Resurrection....Romans 6.

So even PETER says John's water baptism doesn't save.
---kathr4453 on 11/9/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Mortgages


Fighting the RCC, ALWAYS end up speaking against Jesus//

//WATER CANNOT SAVE OR WASH AWAY SIN......PERIOD//

Since you are NOT God, I can care less about your period.
Remember you are NOT the OMEGA. Rev 22:13.

Since Jesus is also the Alpha why don't we allow Him to decide WHO and HOW we are Saved....PERIOD

Mark 16:16 (Water = Salvation)
Whoever believes and is baptized will be SAVED.

John 3:5 (Water again)
Jesus answered, "Very truly I tell you, no one can ENTER the kingdom of God UNLESS they are born of WATER and the Spirit.

//That can only be done BY FAITH. The RCC cannot wash anyone in Jesus Blood.---kathr4453

SHE has, SHE is, and SHE will continue until HER BRIDEGROOM RETURNS!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/9/16


Nicole, meditate on the thing I have written - straight from the bible. You're looking for chapters and verses which will get you nowhere. Denominational christians tend to analyze each verse using the worldly knowledge of an adult instead of looking at what is written in context - through the eyes of a child.
---Steveng on 11/8/16


//Nicole wrote: "Give chapter and verse stating a baby has to UNDERSTAND SIN?"
Re-read my post very slowly especially, "One cannot be baptized until one recognizes that he is a sinner FIRST."---Steveng on 11/7/16

Okay, but we are going in circles.

Babies DO NOT have to recognize sin or that he is a sinner at birth to be a SINNER.

Again: Explain WHY David calls himself SINFUL AT BIRTH, SINFUL from the TIME my mother CONCEIVED me?

Are you saying David was a GENIUS and recognized he was sinful as a BABY?

Psalms 51:5
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/8/16


Revelation 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

WATER CANNOT SAVE OR WASH AWAY SIN......PERIOD.
Again as we see in Hebrews which explains OT Leviticus we see that it was BLOOD that of bulls and goats that first COVERED SIN, and now the Blood of Jesus Christ has WASHED AWAY OUR SIN.

That can only be done BY FAITH. The RCC cannot wash anyone in Jesus Blood.
---kathr4453 on 11/8/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Personal Loans


Correct Steven G. Great points.

Romans 13:8,9 Owe no man anything, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet, and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Ephesians 6:2 Honour thy father and mother, (which is the first commandment with promise,)
---Samuelbb7 on 11/8/16


Nicole wrote: "Give chapter and verse stating a baby has to UNDERSTAND SIN?"

Re-read my post very slowly especially, "One cannot be baptized until one recognizes that he is a sinner FIRST."

Do you not know the words of God? Through the knowledge of the law we become conscious of sin. Does an infant have the knowledge of language to understand the law?

Jesus gave us his summary of the law. Does an infant have knowledge of loving God and loving your neighbor?

Does the infant have knowledge of God, Jesus, the Holy Spirit, salvation, sin, gospel, the miracles of Jesus, Heaven, hell, faith, why Jesus came to earth, how to worship God, prayers, how to communicate with God, Satan, evil?
---Steveng on 11/7/16


//That is why in the hebrew culture, and other cultures, the age of accountability is about thirteen.---Steveng on 11/5/16

That's incorrect!

12 to 13 is the age of a boy becoming a Man.

Proverbs 13:24 He who withholds his rod hates his son, But he who loves him disciplines him diligently.

Why would you HAVE to discipline an obedient sinless Child??????

Why didn't the Hebrew people allow the boy to ACCEPT being a Jew at the age of 13 to be circumcises himself or not?

The baby doesn't have to recognizes he is dirty FIRST in ordered for you to give him a bath.

The Original Sin is on the Baby and we know why.

So why wait to remove that stain of sin?
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/6/16


//if babies are guilty of sin then they should go to hell.//

And you are NOT going to hell because of, WHY???

Babies guilty of sin go to hell according to you, BUT you who is NOT only guilty, but committed sins won't go to hell?

Why are you special?

Just as Jesus SAVED you from hell, you know HE SAVED ALL decrease babies.

Do you think you are you MORE merciful than Jesus?

//Original sin means all are born guilty of sin. Am I incorrect?---Samuelbb7

Correct! That's why we all DIE.


//the baby does not understand sin.---Steveng

Give chapter and verse stating a baby has to UNDERSTAND SIN?

David is aware as a baby he didn't UNDERSTAND sin, yet STILL called himself sinful.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/6/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Auto Insurance


Yes we die because of Adam sin Nicole. I agree. But if babies are guilty of sin then they should go to hell.

But if as we teach that all suffer from sin then they don't.

I remember you writing that Original sin means all are born guilty of sin. Am I incorrect?

agape
---Samuelbb7 on 11/5/16


The death we experience now does not represent the wages for sin. Those wages were paid by Jesus, freeing the believer from the obligation. We no longer owe that payment, therefore, will never experience the second death. Death as we know it now is simply the natural transition from this life to the next, (The death of the terrestrial body we currently inhabit, in preparation for the celestial one that the believer will inhabit for the eternity), and will remain until Jesus returns. "O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?" will not be answered until after the wicked, death and the grave are cast into the lake of fire, which is the second death, and the final judgement
---josef on 11/5/16


It seems a few people do not understand the writings of the hebrew people.

A child, whether still in the womb or infant, has no conception or understanding of sin, Jesus, God, the Ten Commandments or any of God's words. If one leaves a baby on its own it will grow up feral so, therefore, born into sin. The infant needs "parents" to train up in the way he or she should go. One cannot be baptized until one recognizes that he is a sinner FIRST. It's useless to baptize a baby because the baby does not understand sin. That is why in the hebrew culture, and other cultures, the age of accountability is about thirteen.
---Steveng on 11/5/16


Please understand we are NO LONGER in the Garden of Eden!

God NEVER intended for man to die.

God created us for life!

God paid for sins.

EVERYONE is subject to death.

Death is the biggest punishment given to Adam and Eve for eating the fruit.

It wasn't the ONLY punishment, but the ULTIMATE punishment.

Jesus is merciful. No dead babies goes to hell.

But note they still DIED for some reason. Killed, illness, starvation, neglect and etc.

They SUFFERED the death penalty because of the original sin as we are will suffer at one point of our lives.

Some during the womb, birth, at 5 years old, 15yrs, 45 years, 88 yrs or 115 yrs old.

WE WILL ALL DIE!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/5/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Holidays


"Romans 5:12 Wages of sin is death. A baby is doomed to death at conception NOT because of any sin he or she committed, but because of Adam's sin causing mankind to die."---Nicole
It is appointed unto men once to die, (this is the death experienced by newborns), and then the judgement. (Heb 9:27) The death referenced as wages of sin, is the second death. (Rom 6:23) The judgement from which there is no return. For as it is written "Therefore as by the offence of one [judgment came] upon all men to 'condemnation', (that's the damnatory sentence), even so by the righteousness of one [the free gift] came upon all men unto justification of life." Rom 5:18
---josef on 11/5/16


Samuel, you said SO MANY INCORRECT statements that first I will give the CCC on Original Sin. I will respond later

CCC Man's first sin

400 The harmony in which they had found themselves, thanks to original justice, is now destroyed: the control of the soul's spiritual faculties over the body is shattered, the union of man and woman becomes subject to tensions,...Harmony with creation is broken: visible creation has become alien and hostile to man.283 Because of man, creation is now subject "to its bondage to decay".284 Finally, the consequence explicitly foretold for this disobedience will come true: man will "return to the ground",285 for out of it he was taken. Death makes its entrance into human history.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/5/16


//Adam sinned everyone suffers." Yes, death. That's what passed to all men. Why? Because all men have sinned. ---josef

No. That's why I brought up Psalms 51:5 above.

We both agree that Babies CAN NOT commit a sin.

David states he was sinful at his conception.

If Adam passed anything it has to be his OWN SIN that HE passed to David as a baby because David didn't commit a sin himself as baby.

Romans 5:12 Wages of sin is death.

A baby is doomed to death at conception NOT because of any sin he or she committed, but because of Adam's sin causing mankind to die.

Remember if ONLY Eve ate the fruit, Adam wouldn't have died.

Only Eve would have died.

Adam DIED because HE ate the fruit.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/4/16


In my understanding we have a nature that cannot overcome sin. But we are not guilty of having committed a sin at birth.

Which is the RCC position. That when Born Babies are guilty of having done sin.

If that is changed to stained by sin as if covered by mud. Then I could agree. But that is not the RCC position.

I like your answer Nicole about you believe they go to heaven. But then that is not the official position of the RCC. The view has changed from they burn in hell to limbo to like Nicole they can be in heaven. But then how can they be in heaven if they have committed sin by being born and never went through the rites necessary to be saved?

I have not found an answer in my research.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/4/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Health Insurance


"Why? Because all men have sinned." This statement gave me cause to pause. All men, [men representing the human race], would include the new born. Since I know that no newborn has actually sinned, I can only conclude that this was written because due to our carnal nature, all human beings falls short of the glory of God, and that scripture has concluded all under sin, that the promise, by the faith of Jesus Christ, might be given to them that believe.
---josef on 11/4/16


"Thus since Adam sinned everyone suffers." Yes, death.
That's what passed to all men. Why? Because all men have sinned.
---josef on 11/4/16


"He is STAINED with Original Sin from Adam." Just how did Adams sin stain David?---josef on 11/3/16

DNA.

Everyone has Adam's DNA.

God made Adam from dirt, but everyone else is created through Adam's created body.

Eve from his bone.

Thus since Adam sinned everyone suffers.

Paul speaks of this in Romans 5:12

Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death was passed on to all men, because all sinned.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/3/16


Pick and choose Bible verses. Others will sight: Romans 9:11-12 Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or badin order that Gods purpose in election might stand: not by works but by him who calls...

Matthew 19:14 Jesus said, Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.

1 Kings 14:12-13
As for you, go back home. When you set foot in your city, the boy will die. All Israel will mourn for him and bury him. He is the only one belonging to Jeroboam who will be buried, because he is the only one in the house of Jeroboam in whom the Lord, the God of Israel, has found anything good.

Having stated these, I sin in us from the Fall.
---mike4879 on 11/3/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Christian Dating


//HOW DARE YOU CALL SOMEONE RACIST OR DUMB! --Rob

HARD DARE YOU YOU SAY RACIST THINGS!

I call it as I see it. I only reposted your words.

//With myself being of Italian Decent people often wonder why I'm CHRISTIAN and not Catholic.---Rob

That is the most racist and dumbest thing I ever heard.

DUMB because if you were Catholic you are STILL a Christian. (TRUE)

That's like saying I not White, but Caucasian.
------------------------------
RACIST because according to your logic people should WONDER since I am African descent in Alabama I should be a Baptist and a Democrat.---Nicole_Lacey on 10/29/16

Ones Race doesn't determine Ones religious beliefs. If you think so it makes you a racist.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/2/16


"Please read the Passage and do NOT add or CHANGE the passage."

The NIV and three others already has. Out of the sixteen versions of the bible that I can understand, and have access to, 12 versions read as I have state. I believe the 4 that does not were translated to convey the bias of the doctrine of "original sin". There is no way that a verse translated to read "Behold I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me" in 12 versions could be legitimately translated as "Surely I was sinful at birth, sinful from the time my mother conceived me." in four.

"He is STAINED with Original Sin from Adam." Just how did Adams sin stain David?
---josef on 11/3/16


//What the question is as Josef has shown what sin did he commit by being born?---Samuelbb7 on 11/1/16

Please read the Passage and do NOT add or CHANGE the passage.

David NEVER said he committed a sin!

He said he was sinful at birth and even before at conception.

He is STAINED with Original Sin from Adam.

If I poured a bucket of mud all over your body are you not dirty?

I am not saying you CAUSED yourself to be dirty, or jumped into the mud.

Just because you didn't cause yourself to get dirty DOESN'T mean you don't need to TAKE A BATH!
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/2/16


Nicole Lacey, based on your cognitive skills along with things you have written on these blogs, HOW DARE YOU CALL SOMEONE RACIST OR DUMB!
---Rob on 11/2/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Health Treatments


//Nicole please explain in your words what the fate is of unbaptized infants who die?---Samuelbb7 on 11/1/16

They are heaven because God is MERCY ITSELF.

Those who didn't baptize the child is at fault NOT the child.

When God gives us a command He means it.

Just ask Moses:

Exodus 4:24-26 At a lodging place on the way the Lord met him and sought to put him to death. Then Zipporah took a flint and cut off her son's foreskin and touched Moses' feet with it and said, Surely you are a bridegroom of blood to me! So he let him alone. It was then that she said, A bridegroom of blood, because of the circumcision.

NOTE God accepted another person's action (Moses' Wife) to SAVE Moses.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/1/16


Luke we agree David like all humans are sinners. Romans 3:9

What the question is as Josef has shown what sin did he commit by being born?

We are born unable to resist sin and prone to it. But does that make us guilty of sin?

Nicole please explain in your words what the fate is of unbaptized infants who die?

GOD is love.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/1/16


I do not believe in the concept or doctrine of original sin, for "the wages of sin is death" and "the fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin". I do believe a man is born with a carnal nature. The carnal nature is sensual, thus dependent upon and led by the senses, and due to man's sense knowledge dependency he is both inclined and prone to sin. Which is why man must be "born again", renewed and regenerated, mentally, from above. For "the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be."
---josef on 10/31/16


"Behold I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me" Where does this verse mention David's sin?
According to the definition of original hebrew words used in that verse it reads "Behold I was brought forth in (the guilt, punishment, or consequence, of) iniquity, [which was her pain], and in sin did my mother 'conceive' (or become pregnant with) me." Look them up. Although it is obvious that David is referring to his sin in the chapter, the only sin mentioned in this verse is the mothers. No man is a sinner at birth. However both you and Nicole are entitled to your belief, I am simply sharing mine, along with what that belief is based on.
---josef on 10/31/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Affiliate Program


Josef, I believe your interpretation of that passage is completely wrong. David from the beginning was talking about his own sin. He acknowledged his transgressions and knew his sin was always before him. He was not blaming God for it was not God's fault in any way nor was it some aberration, rather the source of David's sin was a fallen, sinful disposition, (nature) his since conception.
"Behold I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me"
---Luke on 10/31/16


To clarify, this line, "This speaks of his mothers pain due to her sin while giving him birth, rather than his own iniquity", probably would have read better as "This speaks of his mothers pain while giving birth to him, due to her sin, rather than his own iniquity".
---josef on 10/31/16


David knows how to say my mother sinned instead of using the 'I' pronoun.
Yes, and he said "Behold, I was 'shapen' [brought forth] in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me." This speaks of his mothers pain due to her sin while giving him birth, rather than his own iniquity.
What? You are saying the OPPOSITE David. How so?
I believe David was schooled in scripture, and was familiar with Eze 18:4 & 20. I do not believe he would have knowingly spoken against what he knew to be the truth. The truth being, there is no such thing as ancestral sin, sin is not passed down. Lev 5:1 and many others start with If a soul sins, which suggest a beginning of sin, as opposed to one being born in sin.
---josef on 10/31/16


//applies to the mother, not the child.//

David knows how to say my mother sinned instead of using the 'I' pronoun.

He even mentions his mother without accusing her.

David is stating at what point he has sin on his soul. At Conception.

//Why? No newborn is sinful.//

What? You are saying the OPPOSITE David.

David said "I was SINFUL at birth." He starts with the word 'SURELY'.

//Sinful implies sin active---josef on 10/30/16

Thus, it has to be REMOVED.

You can have an active infection passed to you due to no fault or effort on your part.

The infection has to be killed.

Would you refuse the antibiotic JUST because you didn't do anything to obtain the infection?
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/31/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Abortion Facts


Amen Josef

We agree
---Samuelbb7 on 10/31/16


"If you DON'T believe in original sin, can you please explain Psalms 51:5?"
I believe that statement applies to the mother, not the child.
Why? No newborn is sinful. Sinful implies sin active.
Biblically sin is defined in one of three ways,
1: A transgression of the law. (Specifically the Ten Commandments).
2: Missing the mark of mans call of God in Christ. (By a blatant refusal to acknowledge, confess and embrace Jesus as Lord of salvation through His atoning sacrifice and justifying resurrection after receiving knowledge (as full discernment) of that Truth).
3: Faithlessness. (For whatever is not of faith is sin).
Neither of these are applicable to an innocent as (uninformed or unaware) newborn
---josef on 10/30/16


Your statement about Original sin is correct. The RCC teaches all humans are born guilty of sin.

But to me the Bible says sin is transgression of the law. I john 3,4

To commit a sin the child must have the knowledge and break the law. This is not possible.

But at the same time we are born sinners. Our nature is to sin and be selfish.

Which why I have heard some define original sin as being born with a nature that will sin. Which is why we don't have to baptize babies since they will not go to limbo at death.

This is why we can agree with Psalms 51 but not believe in the RCC doctrine of original sin.

Agape
---Samuelbb7 on 10/30/16


//With myself being of Italian Decent people often wonder why I'm CHRISTIAN and not Catholic.//

That is the most racist and dumbest thing I ever heard.

Dumb because if you were Catholic you are STILL a Christian.

That's like saying I not White, but Caucasian.

Racist because according to your logic people should WONDER since I am African descent in Alabama I should be a Baptist and a Democrat.

The year is 2016, not 1935!

//The answer is because I took the needed time to STUDY SCRIPTURE along with doing RESEARCH.---Rob

So if your family told you to be a Chef because your father and grandfather were Chefs you had to be a Chef??

This is AMERICA!

You can do and be whatever you wish!
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/29/16


Read These Insightful Articles About Acne Treatment


With myself being of Italian Decent people often wonder why I'm CHRISTIAN and not Catholic. The answer is because I took the needed time to STUDY SCRIPTURE along with doing RESEARCH.
---Rob on 10/29/16


Eze 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.



---Jerry6593 on 10/29/16


//original sin makes one's character available to "the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience" (Ephesians 2:2).//

No, no, no it is an ACTUAL SIN on the soul that needs to be removed by Jesus' Blood.

Remember, Adam and Eve DID NOT have the original sin to have the character available to commit the first sin.

//And it is clear that a number of infancy-baptized people have not been freed from this evil spirit's bossy and pleasure hungry and nasty reacting emotions. ---Bill

It isn't a power to prevent us from sinning completely, BUT the GRACES to prevent some sins and returning to God after sinning for forgiveness.

Thus, the famous saying:

'There go I, but for the GRACE of God.'
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/28/16


Copyright© 2017 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.