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Jesus Son Of Man

Why was Jesus called the son of man?

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 ---bryan on 12/23/16
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//Hebrews 1 vs 1-4// John9346.

Yes Paul is applying a Hebrew scripture to Jesus which was originally applied to Solomon. That's why Paul was writing to the "Hebrews" who were familiar with the OT.

Paul quotes the OT all through Hebrews. It is clear that the NWT and many other translations agree that Paul, when writing Heb.1:5b is quoting 2Sam.7:14 ["You are my son, today I have become your father"?]

2Sam.7:14 refers to Solomon. Using John9346 argument, if Jesus is God and a trinity, then Paul is guilty of Blasphemy by ascribing human characteristics to God. The pagan trinity is blasphemous.

Truth is, Jesus is not God, and Paul is therefore not guilty of blasphemy.
---David8318 on 12/31/16


//What we have to prove is that Jesus is divine, Jesus has deity, and that deity=God// MarkEaton.

But MarkEaton has failed to do that in every single blog he posts!

MarkE was unable to explain why at John 1:1 the two occurrences of 'theos' are different. The Word is not the God he is "with". Instead of explaining himself, MarkE throws his toys out the pram and storms off.

MarkEaton is confused. He says "The Father possesses the divine nature". No, God IS divine! God doesn't just possess the divine nature, God is divine. Thus, in the context of Colossians 2:9, the fullness of divinity that dwells in Christ is a result of a decision made by the Father- Col.1:19.
---David8318 on 12/31/16


What every Christian needs to understand about JWs or Watchtower publications is when we say "God", JWs equate that to the Father, because in their theology only the Father is God.

When we say "Jesus is God", JWs think "Jesus = the Father" and that is wrong and it is the heresy of Modalism.

What we have to prove is that Jesus is divine, Jesus has deity, and that deity=God.

The Father is called God because The Father possesses the divine nature. When we say the Father is God, it means the Father is truly Deity, one who possesses the divine nature.

When we say Jesus is God, we are saying Jesus Christ is Deity.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/30/16


David8318,

As I said to you vs 1-4 and vs 6-10 disprove that vs 5 is talking about Solomon. See, NWt even states this incontext.

Now Paul applied Ps 102:25 to the Lord Jesus Christ in Heb 1:10.

David8318, who is speaking in Ps 102:25 from the NWt?

Is not Jehovah/Yhwh speaking??
---john9346 on 12/30/16


David8318,

Again, listen to the verses:

"And: At the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the works of your hands." (Heb 1:10) NWT

"Long ago you laid the foundations of the earth, "And the heavens are the work of your hands." (Ps 102:25) NWT
---john9346 on 12/30/16




david8318:

Note following from NWT:

"I will become his father, and he will become my son.+ When he does wrong, I will reprove him with the rod of men and with the strokes of the sons of men.*+" NWt

"For example, to which one of the angels did God ever say: You are my son, today I have become your father?+ And again: I will become his father, and he will become my son?+" NWT



David8318 Heb 1:5 isn't a "Direct Quotation." because 2 Sam 7:14 says more then just, "You are my son, today I have become your father?"

Heb 1:10 is a actual quote of Ps 102:25 and Phil 2:10-11 actuall quote Isa 45:23.
---john9346 on 12/30/16


Josef thank you for directly answering my question. Your responses were extremely helpful and explained this question in a way that I can understand. I also would like to thank Leon and Bill for their attempt. Richard I appreciate the Scriptures although I am not sure how they relate. The remaining post seem to be a discussion of the trinity, and I fail to understand what the trinity has to do with Jesus being called the son of man. John how does John 1:1-18 address or relate to my question?
---bryan on 12/30/16


Each individual member of the group known as the "SONS OF MEN" is a "son of man".That group built the Tower of BABEL.

GOD SAYS THAT HE IS not A "SON OF MAN" (AND YOU WOULD DO WELL TO TRUST HIS STATEMENT TO BE TRUE).

Gen 11:5
And the LORD came down to see the city and the tower, which the sons of men had built.


Deu 32:8, he fixed the bounds of the peoples according to the number of the sons of God.

2Sa 7:14
I will be his father, and he shall be my son. When he commits iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men, with the stripes of the sons of men,


You will destroy their offspring from the earth, and their children from among the sons of men.
---faithforfaith on 12/30/16


Jesus is not Jehovah. Shame you cannot see that. ---David8318 on 12/30/16

Ex 6:3 and I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, as God Almighty, my name JEHOVAH I was not known to them. (RV)

Joh 6:46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father. Thus, Abram could not have seen the Father. He saw the Son. The LORD = The Son = The Lamb = Almighty God = Jehovah.

Jesus IS Jehovah!!

The SHAME, Lying David, is on YOU! Since you don't know the basics, STOP trying to be a teacher! You don't know enough.
---aservant on 12/30/16


//Whom are the 'We'?// NicoleLacey.

"We" is plural. So the trinity is not an "I", but a "we". Further proof trinitarians are polytheist. Christians are not.

Further confirmation of your polytheism is your statement:

//Jesus is still making Himself God as His Father is God//

So you believe Jesus is saying, "we are Gods"! How many Gods do you want?

//Conjoined twins are 2 separate humans with one body//

But the Gospels use Father and Son terminology to describe the relationship between God and Jesus. If they had wanted us to understand them as twins, I'm sure they would have told us that.

"the Father is greater than I am"- Jo.14:28.
---David8318 on 12/30/16




David - If you believe that God and Jesus are Separate

Then you have Two Lords That goes against Ephesians 4:5 Bible - One Lord

Then you have Two Saviors that goes against Isaiah 43:11 Bible - One Savior

You have Thomas calling Christ God John 20:28 - and he not denying it but affirming it !

and on and on -

---RichardC on 12/30/16


John9346, you are rambling incoherently.

It is you and your Trinitarian dogma that forces you into blasphemy.

You didn't deny Paul was speaking of Solomon initially at Heb.1:5b. Only now when your blasphemy is revealed do you recant.

Jesus is not Jehovah. Shame you cannot see that.
---David8318 on 12/30/16


david8318 states, "How? Because Paul at Heb.1:5b applied to Jesus what is said about Solomon at 2Sam.7:14."


First, Heb 1:5 and 2 Sam 7:14 have no connection.

"For example, to which one of the angels did God ever say: You are my son, today I have become your father?+ And again: I will become his father, and he will become my son?"

Vs 1-4 disproves this and vs 6-10 further disproves this Paul's Point in Heb 1 is the suppremacy of the Lord Jesus Christ who is "Jehovah/Yhwh."
---john9346 on 12/29/16


David8318,

The bible says God your creator is holy, righteous, just, and pure.

The bible says you are a sinner who have committed sin against him. Have you ever told a lie, looked with lust on a woman, stolen, been disobedient to your parents, have you always loved God perfectly??

The bible says The Lord Jesus Christ who is God the second person of the "Trinity." took on Human Flesh is the only one who lived a perfect and sinless life and is the only way to be reconciled to God...

The bible commands you to repent/turn from your sin today my friend and trust Christ alone to save you from his wrath of Eternal Hell against sinners...


Forever in love,


John
---john9346 on 12/29/16


david8318:

Payattention.

You reject Paul usage in Heb 1:10 referencing Ps. 102:25 to not mean that the Lord Jesus is Jehovah/Yhwh and what I am saying is for Paul to state as he is stating as you are claiming he would be committing blasphemy.
---john9346 on 12/29/16


david8318:

Sir, listen from your own bible, (NWT)


"so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bendof those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground+ 11 and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord+ to the glory of God the Father." (Phil 2:10-11) NWT

"By myself I have sworn, The word has gone out of my mouth in righteousness, And it will not return: To me every knee will bend, Every tongue will swear loyalty+" (Isa 45:23) NWT

Isa 45:23 Jehovah/Yhwh is speaking see vs 18-23.
---john9346 on 12/29/16


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Jesus disciples do not become part of the trinity . . . ---David8318 on 12/29/16

Hey, Lying David, the "three are one" is about Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit being equally God. In marriage, the two become as one, the wife becoming the husband, denoting such by taking his name.

Gen 5:2 Male and female created he them . . . and called their name Adam . . .

In the Bride's marriage to Jesus - Rom 7:4, we take His name, Christian, to denote we are one with Him,

As the "three are one" is one God, the "millions are one" is one Bride.
---aservant on 12/29/16


//Phil.2:6-11... blasphemy//- John9346.

No it is not blasphemy for Paul to apply Ps.102:25 to the Son. Paul knew God created all things "through" the pre-human Jesus- Col.1:15,16 & Proverbs 8:22, 27-30. God did not create through any human.

In fact, on the matter of blasphemy, john9346 has 'shot himself in the foot'. It is the trinity that is guilty of the blasphemy John9346 speaks about. How? Because Paul at Heb.1:5b applied to Jesus what is said about Solomon at 2Sam.7:14. If Jesus is God then Paul would have been guilty of blasphemously attributing human characteristics to God.

But Paul knew Jesus is not Jehovah and could apply to Jesus what was initially applicable to Solomon.
---David8318 on 12/29/16


//Phil 2:10-11 & Isa 45:23, Paul applies... "Jehovah/Yhwh." to the Lord Jesus Christ the Son//- John9346.

No, Paul is not quoting from Isaiah 45:23. In fact, Paul is not quoting from anywhere when writing Phil.2:10-11. Check it for yourselves in your own Bibles- there are no quotation marks over Phil.2:10-11.

Paul was simply indicating that everyone should honour Jesus in the role that he takes as our saviour. But that role as saviour is always "to the Glory of God the Father". Why? Because Jesus is subject to his Father Jehovah who, "exalted him to a superior position"- 2:9.

At Isaiah 45:23, Isaiah was simply instructing the Israelites to remain loyal to Jehovah God.
---David8318 on 12/29/16


Trinitarians are not polytheistic.

Trinity is the heart of Christianity, and is the truth of God.

Christianity is not Judaism version 2. Christianity is new revelation, a new covenant between man and God. The prolog to Johns Gospel tells the truth about Jesus, that Jesus is God and he has come to bring us back to the Father.

Anyone who tries to tell you Jesus is not fully God or had a beginning, is repeating the heresy of Arius.

True Christianity has been fighting this heresy for 1800 years.
---Mark_Eaton on 12/29/16


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david8318 states, "'I and the Father are one'. Trinitarians conclude Jesus and God were equal. The Lord Jesus and God the Father are one in essence separate insubstance.

You are using John the apostles's Words against him since his entire letter defends the Deity of Christ.
---john9346 on 12/29/16


//'That they may all be one', and he added, 'that they may be one even as we are one.'//

Okay. Lets use your example.

When Jesus said 'we': Whom are the 'We'?

Jesus is still making Himself God as His Father is God.

Let's continue to use your example.

Jesus said may they be one and We are One.

Okay. 'they' is saying put them together in one category as We are in One category.

Jesus didn't say may they be one with Us.

Their Oneness is separated from our oneness.

You are confused about the word 'trinity'.

3 Beings or Persons, but ONE GOD.

I will give you a poor example, but you need some type of an example.

Conjoined twins are 2 separate humans with one body.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/29/16


//John 10:30// NicoleLacey.

'I and the Father are one'.

Trinitarians conclude Jesus and God were equal. But at John 17:21,22, Jesus prayed regarding his followers:

'That they may all be one', and he added, 'that they may be one even as we are one.'

Jesus used the same Greek word [hen] for "one" in all these instances and Jo.10:30. Obviously, Jesus disciples do not all become part of the trinity. But they do share a oneness of purpose with the Father and the Son, the same sort of oneness that unites God and Christ.

//God speaking... plural in Genesis//

This is further proof that Trinitarians believe in multiple God's. Trinitarians are polytheists. Christians are not.
---David8318 on 12/29/16


John 1:1 IN the beginning was the Word , and the Word was with God, and the Word was God,

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us , ( and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the Only begotten of the Father ,) full of grace and truth,

John 1:15 John bare witness of him , and cried , saying This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me, for he was before me,

Begotten : past participle of beget

Beget : ( Typicallly of a man sometimes a man and women bring ( a child) into existence, The process of Reproduction

Word was God .
---RichardC on 12/28/16


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david8318 states, "So just because Paul applies a Hebrew scripture to Jesus, doesn't mean Jesus is Jehovah anymore than he is Solomon."

But sir for Paul to apply language designated to "Jehovah/Yhwh." alone would have been blasphemy.

Remember, Paul was a Jew who understood the "Shema." Deut 6:4.

Now when you read Ps 102:25 this is specifically directly talking about Jehovah/Yhwh not a human or man.

Remember, the language Paul uses is to Jehovah/Yhwh alone not a man like Solomon.
---john9346 on 12/28/16


david 8318:

"Isaiah said these things because he saw his glory, and he spoke about him." Jn 12:41(NWT)

This is a Specific Direct Statement from Isa 6:1-5 speaking of "Jehovah/Yhwh." alone that John tells us is "The Lord Jesus Christ." the Son.

---john9346 on 12/28/16


///..."In His image means LIKE HIM, spiritually & physically."

How do you know...Gen 1:26,27 references the physical? 1Co 15:47,49...the first man is of the earth, earthy: we bear the image of the earthy...---bryan on 12/27/16///

Bryan: Why don't you know G1:26-27 addresses the physical as well as spiritual? God formed man from the physical earth & He breathed His spirit into Adam's nostrils. G2:7 confirms G1:26-27.

1 Cor. 15 speaks solely about the SIN condition mankind fell into because of Adam's disobedience to God. When Adam sinned, "they" immediately died spiritually & their physical bodies began dying at that point. So, the quickening thru Jesus was needed. (1 Cor. 15:45)...
---Leon on 12/28/16


//Ps 102:25 & Heb.1:10// john9346.

The Son of course is the one "through" whom God performed the creative works described by the psalmist. (Col 1:15, 16, Proverbs 8:22, 27-30.)

Similarly, Hebrews 1:5b shows that a quotation is made from 2 Samuel 7:14 and applied to the Son of God. Although that text had its first application to Solomon, the later application of it to Jesus Christ does not mean that Solomon and Jesus are the same. Jesus is 'greater than Solomon' and carries out a work foreshadowed by Solomon (Luke 11:31).

So just because Paul applies a Hebrew scripture to Jesus, doesn't mean Jesus is Jehovah anymore than he is Solomon.
---David8318 on 12/28/16


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david8318:

"And: At the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the works of your hands." (Heb 1:10) NWT

"Long ago you laid the foundations of the earth, "And the heavens are the work of your hands." (Ps 102:25) NWT

Here Paul when speaking of the Lord Jesus Christ the Son applies the same language said of "Jehovah-Yhwh."
---john9346 on 12/27/16


Hosea 13:4 - Yet I am the Lord thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: there is no Saviour beside me,

Luke 2:11 - For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour which is Christ the Lord,

John 4:42 - And said unto the woman , Now we believe, not because of thy sayings, for we have heard him for our selves, and know that this in indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the World,

1 Timothy 4:10 - For therefore we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, Who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those who believe,
---RichardC on 12/27/16


david8318:

"so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bendof those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground+ 11 and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord+ to the glory of God the Father." (Phil 2:10-11) NWT

"By myself I have sworn, The word has gone out of my mouth in righteousness, And it will not return: To me every knee will bend, Every tongue will swear loyalty+" (Isa 45:23) NWT

Here Paul again applies what Isaiah said that is only said of "Jehovah/Yhwh." to the Lord Jesus Christ the Son.


---john9346 on 12/27/16


Bryan that was a mistake made in the editing.
The line was meant to read "simply without the need for intercourse".
---Josef on 12/27/16


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Son of man
Divine conception human birth
---aservant on 12/27/16


//So Trinitarians believe Jesus is God and is "separate" from the Father!

This is polytheist trinitarianism.//

No it means you don't believe Jesus' own words.

Even if you don't know believe in the Holy Spirit you can't explain His words in John 10:30

"I and the Father are one."

He didn't say: The Father and I are the same.

And you also can't explain away God speaking in the Singular and then in the Plural in Genesis.

//"Jehovah" (Deut.6:4)] who sent his Son- Jesus.---David8318

John 5:18
For this reason they tried all the more to kill him, not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself EQUAL with God.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/27/16


"Because He was born of a Virgin. Thus He is truly the SON the Man.
That's why He isn't called a son of man, but The Son of Man."


Nicole what does this have to do with Jesus being called the son of man?

"In His image means LIKE HIM, spiritually & physically."

How do you know that Gen 1:26,27 references the physical? 1Co 15:47,49
Leon the first man is of the earth, earthy: we bear the image of the earthy.

"without the need for male intercourse."

Josef how is the need for male intercourse relevant?
---bryan on 12/27/16


True Christians worship just one God and Father [YHWH- "Jehovah" (Deut.6:4)] who sent Son- Jesus. Paul explains this > Phil.2:6-11. ---David8318 on 12/27/16

Lying David, Again, You are being deceitful, misleading, and disingenuous.

True Christians worship ONE GOD (Father, Jesus, Holy Ghost = 1), not just the Father.

Phil 2:6
(CEV) Christ was truly God . . .
(GW) (ISV) (KJV). . . equal with God . . .

You withheld Paul calling Jesus, the great God!
Tit 2:13 . . . the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ,
---aservant on 12/27/16


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---David8318 on 12/27/16

Lying David, I asked the Father to give me an explanation that would be understood by all. Here is what He gave me.

Father represented by 3 = 3
Son represented by 1+1+1 = 3
Holy Spirit represented by 1+2 = 3

Each = 3
Each = 1 equality (each equals the other, they are the same)

These 3 are 1 equality.

Just as are the expressions 3, 1+1+1, and 1+2 are distinctly separate, yet are the same sum, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are distinctly separate, but have 1 equality as God.
---aservant on 12/27/16


//Phil 2:6-11// john9346.

John9346 believes Phil.2:6-11 says, 'the Lord Jesus Christ existed Eternally as God'. This is completely false and an attempt to twist scripture to fit a false dogma.

John9346 erroneously believes 'the Lord Jesus Christ existed Eternally as God' and in the same breath believes Jesus, 'is a separate person from the "Father."

So Trinitarians believe Jesus is God and is "separate" from the Father! This is polytheist trinitarianism.

True Christians on the other hand are not polytheists. True Christians worship just one God and Father [YHWH- "Jehovah" (Deut.6:4)] who sent his Son- Jesus. That's what Paul is explaining in Phil.2:6-11.
---David8318 on 12/27/16


Can christians have the spirit of God within?

Many family members and my dad's friends say that I'm the spittin' image of my father, but am I my father?

The English language has grown so much since 1900 that in 2006 it has reached one million words - each having multiple definitions and many having opposite meanings from the original meaning.

This is the reason why the world has so many different interpretations of the bible depending upon who interpreted the book. It's too easy to take verses out of context.

Does the person today know what the original writer in the bible really meant? The Hebrew language is very poetic and uses many similes and other metaphors.
---Steveng on 12/27/16


Because He was born of a Virgin.

Thus He is truly the SON the Man.

'The' due to Importance.

That's why He isn't called a son of man, but The Son of Man.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/27/16


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Exodus 3:14 - And God said to Moses , I AM THAT I AM and he said , Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you ,

John 13:13 - Ye call me master and Lord : and ye say well : for so I am.
---RichardC on 12/26/16


Gen 17:1 . . . the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God . . .

Joh 6:46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father. Thus, Abram could not have seen the Father. He saw the Son. The LORD = The Son = The Lamb = Almighty God.

Rev 15:3 And they sing . . . the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty . . .
---aservant on 12/26/16


John 20:28 - And Thomas answered and said unto him , my Lord and my God

John 20:29 - Jesus saith unto him , Thomas because thou has seen me, thou hast believe : Blessed are they that have not seen, and yet believed ,
---RichardC on 12/26/16


///Leon the bible states... God is Spirit, Jhn 4:24... Jesus said a spirit doesn't have flesh and bone. Luk 24:39 The Bible also states...God is invisible and uncontainable. Col 1:15,1Ti 1:17,2Ch 6:18. In His image has to mean something other than physical image[?].---bryan on 12/25/16///

Bryan: Yes, God is Spirit. So are we. Scripture says the Spirit of God impregnated Mary. Thru her He became flesh. (Lk 1:26-35)

Taken in the right context, Jesus told His fearful disciples he wasn't a ghost (Lk. 24:37). This hasn't a thing to do with the Spirit of God choosing to contain Himself in human flesh & become a man.

In His image means LIKE HIM, spiritually & physically. Again, we're made in His image. (G1:26-27).
---Leon on 12/26/16


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I understand Bryan. Jesus asked "What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The Son of David. He saith unto them, How then does David in spirit call him Lord? If David then calls him Lord, how is he his son?" Answer: In Spirit, Christ is the LORD. Jesus represents as much of the Father's essence, if you will, that can be contained in a body. The body was prepared of the Father utilizing the seed, sperma,or reproductive cell of David. Making Jesus the son of David according to the flesh, but the Son Of God according to the Spirit. Col 1:19>Col 2:9>Rom 1:3,4 He is called the son of man to acknowledge His Humanity. He was indeed made or formed like unto us, simply without the need for male intercourse.
---Josef on 12/26/16


Col 2:9
(KJV) For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

(ERV) I say this because all of God lives in Christ fully, even in his life on earth.

(GNB) For the full content of divine nature lives in Christ, in his humanity,

(GW) All of God lives in Christ's body,
---aservant on 12/26/16


He was born of woman. He bled like a man. He humbled himself and took himan form. Why would he not be called Son of Man? when this is what we are taught? He is also called "Immanuel" which means God is with us.
---mike4879 on 12/26/16


Bryan,

Sir, respectfully, are you taking the time to listen to what me and Leon are explaining to you??

As I read your statements, Jn 1:1-18 to start with clearly address your question/objection.

Can you please read Jn 1:1-18 I have some questions for you?
---john9346 on 12/26/16


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Josef thanks for the references, your statements makes sense, but I don't know if I would have come to the same conclusions.
---bryan on 12/26/16


The Bible doesn't directly say why, to my knowledge, Bryan. But in the prophecy of Daniel one is called "the Son of Man" (Daniel 7:13). So, Jesus calls Himself this, I consider, in order to show He is the One meant by Daniel's prophecy (John 5:39).

Also, in Matthew 24:29-44, Jesus talks about His return and here calls Himself the "Son of Man".

My opinion is this can be to show that Jesus has human shape, though He is divine by nature. It shows that God made man in His image and He has Jesus with some human resemblance to us, which can help encourage us that God does desire to be personal and share with us.

However, we need to conform spiritually to Jesus so we can benefit the most from this (c:
---Bill on 12/26/16


Jesusonline: Was Jesus Merely a Great Man?

Jesus only credentials were himself, an outsider with no . . . political power base, within three years, Jesus changed the world for the next 20-plus centuries..

Jesus' . . . primary mission was to forgive sins - something only God could do.

Heb 1:3
(CEV) God's Son has all the brightness of God's own glory and is like him in every way. By his own mighty word, he holds the universe together. After the Son had washed away our sins . . .

(ERV) The Son shows the glory of God. He is a perfect copy of God's nature, and he holds everything together by his powerful command. The Son made people clean from their sins . . .
---aservant on 12/26/16


John 10:30 - I and my Father are One,

John 17:5 - And now , O Father , glorify Thou me with the Glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Deuteronomy 4:39 - Know therefore this day , and consider it in thine Heart, that the Lord is God in Heaven above, and upon the earth beneath, there is none else,

Ephesian 4:5 - One Lord , One faith , One baptism,

Romans 6:23 - For the wages of sin is death, But the gift of God is eternal, Life Though Jesus Christ our Lord,

Isaiah 43:11 - I even I am the Lord and beside me there no Savior,

John 14:7 - If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and had seen him, ------->
---RichardC on 12/26/16


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"Interesting view Josef, what are you basing it on"
Acts 2:30>Mat 1:20>Rom 1:3>2Sa 7:12>Amo 9:11 Emphasized words were defined using the original copyright of the Strongs Concordance in book form.
---Josef on 12/26/16


Interesting view Josef, what are you basing it on?
---bryan on 12/26/16


Leon the bible states that God is Spirit, Jhn 4:24, and Jesus said a spirit doesn't have flesh and bone. Luk 24:39 The Bible also states that God is invisible and uncontainable. Col 1:15,1Ti 1:17,2Ch 6:18. In His image has to mean something other than physical image.
---bryan on 12/25/16


Bryan this is the humanity of Jesus, The christ, son of David. Who knowing that God had sworn with an oath unto him [David] that of the fruit of his loin (as literally plucked from his procreative power) according to the flesh (as pertaining to His body), He would raise up Christ to sit [physically] on his throne. The body of Jesus was conceived (to be delivered and brought forth) by the overshadowing (preternatural influence) of the Holy Spirit, and made (formed) using the seed sperma (reproductive cell) of David combined with the ovum (reproductive cell) of Mary. A natural formation of a human body, performed supernaturally through the wisdom and power of God.
---Josef on 12/25/16


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stephen states, "Jesus is NOT God. There is only one God who resides in heaven, the Father."

Sir, have you not read Jn 8:24, 8:58, 185-6??

Here the Lord Jesus Christ declares that he is "God."
---john9346 on 12/25/16


david8318:

Sir, I wonder if you understand because the Word of God tells us in Phil 2:6-11 that the Lord Jesus Christ existed Eternally as God.

My point for citing these "Scriptures." is to establish that the Lord Jesus did exist before coming to earth and the verses proclaim to vs 11 that he is a separate person from the "Father.", he is not a mode.

Paul bring this up again in Col 2:9.

One thing we know is the Lord Jesus didn't exist as Michael the archangel Paul also clears this up as well as in Heb 1:1-10.
---john9346 on 12/25/16


stephen:

"Jesus himself could not perform any of the miracles without God the Father working through him. If he were God then he would have known when he returns to earth,"

Steveng, when the Lord Jesus stated these words, it was his Human Nature speaking not his Divine Nature remember the incarnation??

If Jesus was completely human, then for him to be worship would have been blasphemous see, Matt 2:11, Matt 14:33, Matt 28:9, Jn 20:28, and Rev 5:9-14.
---john9346 on 12/25/16


Josef I have read your posts but I don't quite understand them. Exactly what are you saying?
---bryan on 12/25/16


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Bryan: The virgin birth of Mary was a MIRACLE. God is known to do miracles occasionally that blow our finite (limited) minds. Because of our cognitive limits, we can't possibly reason God's depths of infinite wisdom & understanding. That's were, like in a parent-child relationship, FAITH/trust in God comes in.

Again, Infinite, All-knowing God, who created all of humanity/US (to include X & Y chromosomes), & the rest of His universal creation, has no problem doing the seemingly impossible. Also, Scripture says man (humanity) was made in the likeness of God. I think that means He made us to look like Him. So, when He was born to Mary, he wasn't made in our likeness. He came as HIMSELF clothed in humanity (flesh). :)
---Leon on 12/25/16


Leon men have one X chromosome and one Y chromosome, the latter being responsible for the characteristics that make men male. In contrast, women have two copies of the X chromosome. Scripture states he was made like unto us in every way. Heb 2:17 If no human male was involved where did the Y chromosome come from? I know God made a man from dust, but Jesus was formed in the womb. If incarnate the womb wasn't necessary, and Jesus wasn't human, just in human form, and the formation and birth was just an illusion.
---bryan on 12/24/16


But Paul corrects you... john9346.

John9346 as usual misunderstands what Paul is saying. Paul says, 'who, although he [Jesus] was existing in Gods form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God'- Ph.2:6,7.

Before coming to earth, Jesus existed in God's form. Jesus lived in Heaven as a spirit being- the same as his Father. But as a spirit being, Jesus did not consider equality with God as something to be seized.

Not being equal to God, Jesus was able to '[empty] himself and took a slaves form and became human'- 2:7.

God didn't come to earth. God sent his Son. Recall what John stated- 'No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son'.- Jo.1:18 (NIV)
---David8318 on 12/25/16


"a body was prepared for him. What does that mean to you Bryan?"

I think it means what it says Leon, God prepared a body for him, my question is how? Are there any scripture that explain it? I know God can do anything, and that the Holy Spirit overshadow Mary when she conceived, but according to the word Jesus was made like into us, in every way. I know it don't really matter it's just something that I have alway been curious about.
---bryan on 12/25/16


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Bryant ask, "how does being born of a woman make Jesus a human being?"

Sir, the Lord Jesus ate, was hungry, was tired, was thirsty, needed sleep, presented with temptation this made him a human...

"And what make you think that He took on human flesh?"

Sir, the very verse you quote Heb 10:5 is telling you thatthe the Lord Jesus took on Human Flesh also see Jn 1:14.

Also, the context of Heb 10 even proclaims why the Lord had to come.
---john9346 on 12/25/16


The word seed means descendants the context determines the usage it has nothing to do with referring to the Lord Jesus meaning of Sexual Production.
---john9346 on 12/25/16


Incarnation definition and explanation:


To incarnate means to become flesh. The incarnation of Jesus is when the human nature (Jesus the man) was added to the nature of God the second person of the Trinity. It is where God became a man (John 1:1, 14, Phil. 2:5-8). It was the voluntary act of Jesus to humble Himself so that He might die for our sins (1 Pet. 3:18). Thus, Jesus has two natures: Divine and human. This is known as the Hypostatic Union.

Taken from the CARM website.
---john9346 on 12/25/16


Jesus is NOT God.

There is only one God who resides in heaven, the Father.

Jesus is completely human having the spirit of God within him. Jesus himself could not perform any of the miracles without God the Father working through him. If he were God then he would have known when he returns to earth, but no one knows, not the angels, not the Son, but God the Father only. We only worship God the Father, not Jesus.
---Steveng on 12/25/16


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///...Jesus Christ didn't cease being God when he took on Human Flesh. He was 100% God and 100% human/man." How? You did not answer the question asked "how does being born of a woman make Jesus a human being?" And what make you think that He took on human flesh? Scripture states that a body was prepared for him. Heb 10:5---bryan on 12/23/16///

What does that mean to you Bryan? According to Scrupture, Jesus was born of a woman, looked, talked, ate & drank, lived & died as a human being. Though He took on human form, by being born to Mary, Jesus was & yet is God in human flesh. If God can create all of humanity & the rest of creation, can He not make a body in Mary's womb for Himself to occupy?
---Leon on 12/24/16


"Neither was Jesus an incarnation. Rather, Jesus was completely human," True. The word incarnation would suggest Jesus was simply a living being embodying a deity or spirit. Basically it would mean He assumed a human form or nature, as opposed to actually being born a human being. However scripture states that 'Of' (out of) the 'fruit' (procreative power) of his [David's] 'loins', (the place where the Hebrews thought man's generative power (semen) resided), 'according to the flesh' (As pertaining to His body's physical origin), he would raise up Christ to sit [physically] on his throne.
---Josef on 12/24/16


"Sir, the Lord Jesus Christ didn't cease being God when he took on Human Flesh. He was 100% God and 100 % human/man." How?
You did not answer the question asked "how does being born of a woman make Jesus a human being?" And what make you think that He took on human flesh? Scripture states that a body was prepared for him. Heb 10:5
---bryan on 12/23/16


Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh.
Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the 'seed' (reproductive cell) of David, as concerning the flesh.
When 'thy' [David's] days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy 'seed' (offspring) after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom
And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, And again, Esaias saith, There shall be a 'root' (offspring) of Jesse, and he that shall rise to reign over the Gentiles, in him shall the Gentiles trust: and his rest shall be glorious.
---Josef on 12/23/16


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david8318 states, "Neither was Jesus an incarnation. Rather, Jesus was completely human,"

But Paul corrects you, "who, although he was existing in Gods form,+ gave no consideration to a seizure, namely, that he should be equal to God." "No, but he emptied himself and took a slaves form+ and became human."

Phil 2:6-7
---john9346 on 12/23/16


faithforfaith states, "Jesus is the son of GOD (He is the BEGOTTEN son, the only offspring of the Father)."

The word, "Begotten." is used of the Lord Jesus to make a distinction between the "Created." and the "Uncreated."

The word "Firstborn." refers to the Lord Jesus's Preeminence and not being Physically Born. See Col 1:15.
---john9346 on 12/23/16


Bryan ask, "how does being born of a woman make Jesus a human being?"

Sir, the Lord Jesus Christ didn't cease being God when he took on Human Flesh. He was 100% God and 100 % human/man.
---john9346 on 12/23/16


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