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Great Falling Away

What will cause the great falling away from the faith?

(Note: one must have faith to begin with before falling away.)

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 ---Steveng on 5/4/18
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//insert words not implied by grammar// strongax [5/19/18].

Rubbish. Grammar and context allows for "other" to be used at Col.1:16. At Col.1:15, Christ is identified as "the firstborn of all creation" [ASV]. There were "other" things created apart from Christ.

At Acts 5:29 the King James and NWT insert the word "other" so that it correctly reads: "Then Peter and the other apostles answered". Grammar and context demand the use of 'other' here.

Thus it agrees with grammar and context to say "all other things" at Col.1:16.

Unless of course you are a pagan trinitarian who denies the death of Jesus and say he was God the creator.
---David8318 on 6/18/18


\\There is nothing more vital to our relationship with God the Father, than the blood Jesus Christ. \\

We are saved by the ENTIRE Christ, not by individual organs of His physical body, be it His blood, His sacred heart, His holy prepuce, or little toenail.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 6/16/18


Faith in God, is based on relationship. If you have a relationship with God, your faith in him will grow. If you dont have that relationship, your faith will wither in the face of the adversity we will face in the last days. The seed which grows, in (Matthew 13), is the faith in God which comes through our relationship with him.

Fact: Sin separates us from God. (Isaiah 59:2)
Fact: Confession removes the sin which causes the separation. (1 John 1:9)
Fact: Jesus Christ died to remove that which separates us from God.

There is nothing more vital to our relationship with God the Father, than the blood Jesus Christ. Confess your sin before God daily, and you will see for yourself if what I tell you is a fable...or the Truth.
---David on 6/14/18


Josef said, " Strongaxe, the point of the post was to point out that the KJV didn't just add words to the scriptures without identifying them, as if they were a part of the original writings. Whether the words are appropriate to context is left to the reader to discern."

But how can a person correctly discern words if they have no idea of the original text?

You could just as well change the names of all the men in the Bible to women's names, and vice versa, along with appropriate gender changes in pronouns, etc.

What would that do to the sense of the Bible?
---Monk_Brendan on 5/22/18


Strongaxe, the point of the post was to point out that the KJV didn't just add words to the scriptures without identifying them, as if they were a part of the original writings. Whether the words are appropriate to context is left to the reader to discern.
---josef on 5/20/18




" pray God bring you to repentance before you close your eyes for the last time on this earth my friend... Jn 8:24..." -john9346 on 5/18/18

The Father has brought me to the only repentance He requires of me, yielding to an empowered turn from darkness to light, from the power of Satan, to the kingdom and authority of His Son. Was that truly intended as a prayer for me, or a warning of condemnation feigned as prayer? It sounded like the latter.
---josef on 5/20/18


josef:

That does demonstrate honesty, but not necessarily correctness. Translators often insert words words necessary in English but omitted in other languages. E.g. articles (a, an, the), prononouns (I, you, he, etc.), the present tense of to be (am, is, are, etc.) are frequently omitted in many languages, including Hebrew.

The Jehovah's Witness' New World Translation does this too, with inserted words [in square brackets]. Unfortunately, they also insert words not implied by grammar, but needed to justify their own theology. E.g. Colossians 1:16-17: "because by means of him all [other] things were created..." - because they believe Jesus was a created being, so he could not have created himself.
---StrongAxe on 5/19/18


"God wouldn't lead someone to the KJV for them to believe it is true since there are countless errors and added words even the writers of the KJV never believed their work was to be treated as inspired.."

Like I said John, we have reached an impasse:o) By the way TKJV of the bible is the only version that I know of that italicizes words added by the translators. That in and of itself, demonstrates to me the integrity of the book.
---josef on 5/19/18


People leave the church and/or hold it in contempt if it acts against its own teachings or common sense and decency.

This happened when the plague swept across Europe. People asked priests, "Why is God punishing us?", and were told "because of your sin". They said "Why were we devastated while the next village, where people sin just as much, was spared?". They saw the answer as a lie, so no longer trusted nor respected church leadership.

Today, religious leaders hitch their wagons to politicians who are xenophobic (vex not the stranger), cut social programs (I was hungry and you fed me not), and preach family values while committing adultery (hypocrisy) - all opposite to what Jesus taught.
---StrongAxe on 5/18/18


Joseph:

Correct, that is what strongs is a point of "Reference." It doesn't address the actual Biblical Language of a verse or chapter of Scripture.

God wouldn't lead someone to the KJV for them to believe it is true since there are countless errors and added words even the writers of the KJV never believed their work was to be treated as inspired...

Read Kittel and Logos Bible Software you can gain a better grasp of the Biblical Languages sur just a suggestion to help you to the truth.

Soli Deo Gloria

John
---john9346 on 5/18/18




Joseph said, "I won't even comment on this, since what I believe concerning it has not changed, nor will change,"

Sir, Its up to God to change you,however, you do need to understand your at odds with, "Holy Scripture."

I pray God bring you to repentance before you close your eyes for the last time on this earth my friend... Jn 8:24...

Soli Deo Gloria,

John
---john9346 on 5/18/18


The number of people today who believe in GOD and believe in the Bible are getting smaller.

Some is due to the big push to make everything scientific. But about 20 % of PHD's believe in GOD.

The world is calling to people as always. But now there are churches that teach following the ways of the world and getting rich is the true way to be a Christian.
Than there is the huge amount of hypocrisy. Where so called Christians live for the world and break the laws of GOD with no thought at all. Till they get caught.

This leads people to lose faith.
---Samuelbb7 on 5/18/18


Kathr4453 said, "So go get the oak out of your own Monk."

I will attempt it as soon as you pull the giant redwood out of yours.

Bigoted remarks like these do not gain you points in heaven. I urge you to pray, deeply and heavily, asking God to remove the hatred from your heart.
---Monk_Brendan on 5/17/18


Dr. Strong dedicated over 35 years of his life, in association with more than 100 colleagues, to the accuracy of his work, to become "a permanent standard for the purpose of reference." The Father led me the King James Version of the bible used in conjunction with The Strong Exhaustive Concordance of the bible for my studies. Therefore what's written therein is all I have to offer as documentation of that which I consider the Truth as concerning Father's word. I've never even heard of "Kittel." So I suppose we're at an impasse. Embrace what you have been given to believe, and I will do the same John, be blessed sir.
---josef on 5/17/18


Matthew 24:35 - Heaven and Earth shall pass away, But my words shall not pass away.

Jeremiah 1:4 - Then the Word of the Lord came to me saying, ------>

Revelation 22:18 - For I testify unto every man that Heareth The Words of the Prophecy of this Book, If any man shall Add unto these things God Shall add to unto him the plagues that are written in this book

Revelation 22:19 - And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this Prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life,and out of the holy city, And from the things which are written in this Book,

Revelation 22:20 - He which testified these things saith Surely I come quickly. Even so, Come, Lord Jesus.
---RichardC on 5/17/18


Kathr4453 said, "That's what I said Monk. Seems you have problems reading. If you could...you would have easily seen HT being Harriet Tubman rather than ask others to read for you. And your constant hateful attacks on people who can't spell ...."

What hateful attacks? I have simply pointed out spelling mistakes, with the thought that by learning to spell, we could raise the discourse to a higher level. If you can't stand higher discourse, then I WILL stoop to the same level as you.
---Monk_Brendan on 5/17/18


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"Your Partially correct, The Lord Jesus Christ The Son and the HolySpirit along with the Father both since they are God brought about this transmission of the Scriptures.---john9346 on 5/16/18"
I won't even comment on this, since what I believe concerning it has not changed, nor will change, no matter how many times you repeat it during our discourse.
---josef on 5/17/18


\\Strongs doesn't provide the fundamental meaning of words in Greek so thats why its not very appropriate to the original Language.\\

What does Liddel and Scott's voluminous lexicon say about THEOPNEVSTOS?

BTW, one of the authors is the father of Alice in Dodgson's classic chldren's books.

Happy Ascewnsion.
---Cluny on 5/17/18


Joseph:

First, what I was correcting you on is when you said that "Theopneustos." that God breathe in to Scripture when "Theopneustos." means God breathe out Scripture.

Strongs doesn't provide the fundamental meaning of words in Greek so thats why its not very appropriate to the original Language.

I'd recommend Kittel on the word, "Theopneustos."

Kittel address the original.
---john9346 on 5/17/18


---john9346 on 5/16/18

John these either supply the Strong's number or takes me to one of the Thesaurus' or commentaries, which either has no definition, or defines the word just as the strong's does, "inspired of God" or "given by inspiration of God". Please just provide a quote of what you believe to be a conflicting definition, one that reads as you stated on 5/15/18, and the source from which it was drawn, just as I have done with the Strong's. As I understand it, in Theology 'inspiration' as used in 2Tim 3:16 is defined as either "a divine influence directly and immediately exerted upon the mind or soul." or " the divine quality of the writings or words of a person so influenced".
---josef on 5/17/18


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Joseph ask, "If you can point me to a concordance that defines the word otherwise, again, please do."

Yes, New Testament Greek Lexicon - New American Standard, Mounce Analytical Lexicon to the Greek New Testament, and

Thayer's Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament. There are more but these are a good solid start for you...
---john9346 on 5/16/18


joseph said, "In other words, the words of scripture were received and conveyed through the Direct Divine Inspiration of The Father."

Your Partially correct, The Lord Jesus Christ The Son and the HolySpirit along with the Father both since they are God brought about this transmission of the Scriptures...
---john9346 on 5/16/18


The worldly denominational "church" of Steveng never had the faith to start with.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/4/18

That's exactly correct Monk, Cluny, because of his harboring hateful remarks towards Steveng, and others, and continues to make those remarks over and over to many here is one of Cluny's shortcomings.

So you also agree Cluny is in no position to talk about others failings.

That's what I said Monk. Seems you have problems reading. If you could...you would have easily seen HT being Harriet Tubman rather than ask others to read for you. And your constant hateful attacks on people who can't spell ....

So go get the oak out of your own Monk.
---kathr4453 on 5/16/18


***Cluny....seems like your church has fallen short of several here....so pull out the oak tree from your own eye before insulting others here ....
---kathr4453 on 5/15/18***

kathr, specifically in WHICH points you listed has the Orthodox Church or Cluny failed?

List them, if you can.

(Someone harboring such a horrible burden of hatred and unforgiveness is in no position to talk about other peolpe's failings.)
---Monk_Brendan on 5/15/18


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Yes Steveng, faith in the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ ..faith that He is coming for His Bride, Faith that we are to remain faithful for our Lord...not getting mixed up with these worldly politics luring us away from the faith...stating obedient unto death, keeping our mind on things ABOVE and not below...( like politics)

We are to be faithful in so many aspects...

Cluny....seems like your church has fallen short of several here....so pull out the oak tree from your own eye before insulting others here ....
---kathr4453 on 5/15/18


Romans 12:3 - For I say, though the grace to me, to everyone who is among you, Not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, But to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of Faith.

2 Thessalonians 3:1 - Finally Brethren, pray for us, that the word of the Lord may run swiftly and be glorified, just as it is with you,
2 Thessalonians 3:2 - And that we may be delivered from unreasonable wick men: For not all men have Faith.
2 Thessalonians 3:3 - But the Lord is Faithful, Who will establish you and guard you from evil.


( Why not give everybody large measure of Faith ? )

---RichardC on 5/14/18


The worldly denominational "church" of Steveng never had the faith to start with.

Christ is risen!
---Cluny on 5/4/18


"What will cause the great falling away from the faith?" Deception.
"And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ, and shall deceive many. Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils, And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables". Mat 24:4,5>1Ti 4:1,4
---joseph on 5/4/18


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