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Why Do Good Works

Do Christians do good works in order to obtain salvation or do Christians do good works because they already have eternal salvation?

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 ---trey on 7/10/18
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Steven
God sent Jesus with a New Covenant, a covenant given to the Jews. They rejected him. So God invited the gentile...
---David on 8/3/18

You know that adding to scripture or taking is spoken off in scripture.
Now here you've taken away ten portions out of 12 because of a misunderstanding or no one may have pointed it out...Heb_8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
---Trav on 9/20/18


Trav:
Wow! After six months of silence,...
Again, you choke on a gnat over "Israel is not the Jews".
Old Testament says Israel while New Testament says Jews,....Jesus considered them effectively synonymous.
---StrongAxe on 7/27/18

Sorry neglected you so long.
Facts are not insults...although they offend false doctrines every time. This "gnat" of Israel obviously offends your theories because your theories are not found in scripture.
New Covenant states "house of Israel" (your key word for the day)"and" Judah. Heb 8:8, Jer 31:31.
Put 1 "and" 1 together sometime.
1=Nth House of Israel "and" 1= Judah. Together a completed house again.
---Trav on 9/18/18


Neither in my opinion, because the Spirit of God gives the grace to love our brothers and sisters.

Some do good works to make themselves feel good.

Thank God He still accepts the imperfect good works anyway.

Also it can't be because we already have eternal Salvation because
God addressed the fact the if a man does good all his life, but does evil at the end of life he is going to hell.
(I can't remember where it is in the Bible to cite it)

So doing good works can't be because they already have eternal Salvation according to the Bible.
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/19/18


Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Scripture says because we're already saved.
---kathr4453 on 8/9/18


Steveng:

When a person loves someone they do things for them and do not do things that are bad for them.

The works doctrine is that our works earn us salvation and heaven. That is a false doctrine.

The Love doctrine is about our new nature. We do loving things to GOD and others.

Why because we love them.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/3/18




Where is the one in thought as Jesus taught? Is Christ divided?---Steveng on 7/30/18

Steven
God sent Jesus with a New Covenant, a covenant given to the Jews. They rejected him. So God invited the gentile...those gentiles and Jews who believed this New covenant had been given to them by the Son of God, as foretold.

You and I have founded our faith upon this solid rock, the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Like you, I have tried to turn these folks from the false doctrines they follow. If they want to follow a lie..I fear they can not be turned. (2 Thessalonians 2:11)
---David on 8/3/18


Steveng:

No, I don't add to the Bible, just as I didn't add to your post. I quoted it, and asked how it can mean what you said it means.

You wrote: Samuel, If you love God obey his commandments (a doctrine). Love, as in the verb form, is a doctrine of works. God's grace is for every soul on the planet, sinners included. But whether a sinners accepts God is a choice made by man.

In "If you love God, obey his commandments", Love is a verb. This is plain English grammar.
Your very next statement says "Love, as in the verb form, is a doctrine of works".
Please explain how these two sentences are related.
---StrongAxe on 8/3/18


StrongAxe wrote: "How is this a "doctrine of works"?"

Do you add to the bible like you added to my post?
---Steveng on 8/2/18


A Christian who is born again loves so they do works.

We are not working to save ourselves. That is done by Grace alone through faith alone.

Works are the result of love. The opposite of love can be hate or just not caring at all.

We are to not be like Scrooge and just say let the poor die and reduce the surplus population.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/2/18


Christian WORKS are because they are saved. But as the scripture I posted shows, it's works based upon the foundation of our faith in Jesus Christ death and resurrection. One must have that foundation FIRST...meaning salvation, to build upon that foundation. Therefore works cannot obtain salvation.

Our works will be REWARDED. The continuing verse in Corinthians also states that if any WHO ARE ALREADY SAVED AND HAVE THE FOUNDATION OF JESUS CHRIST, build sloppily with man made nonsense, it will BURN, but they are still saved.

So either we BELIEVE scripture or we don't.

Only those works done IN CHRIST will not burn folks....only those works are GOLD! SILVER AND PRECIOUS STONE, just like we see in the New Heaven and earth.
---kathr4453 on 8/2/18




Steveng, Rewards are given to individuals, not GROUPS. THANK GOODNESS.

1 Corinthians 3:10-14 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble,13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire, and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
---kathr4453 on 8/1/18


Steveng:

As I said, each denomination has their own way of dealing with the minutiae - minor things Jesus never really worried about much. However, they tend to agree on things that REALLY matter. Why are you choking on gnats while swallowing camels?

In the statement "If you love God, obey his commandments", Love IS a verb. How is this a "doctrine of works"?
---StrongAxe on 7/31/18


Kathr, Strongaxe,

Every denomination has their own rituals, traditions, ways of living and interpretations of the bible. Where is the one in thought as Jesus taught? Is Christ divided?

Samuel, If you love God obey his commandments (a doctrine). Love, as in the verb form, is a doctrine of works. God's grace is for every soul on the planet, sinners included. But whether a sinners accepts God is a choice made by man.
---Steveng on 7/30/18


Jesus says by their fruits you will know them. The true from the false.


Not total Agreement Strong Ax. But generally true.

So Kathyr you are right they are not all the same.

But we do not know their hearts. Only GOD can judge.

True Steven. We need to worship in Spirit and in truth. But we are not saved by correct doctrine but Grace alone.
---Samuelbb7 on 7/29/18


Steveng:

You keep thinking of everything as monolithic and black and white. Every denomination includes a mixture of truth and error. Most Christian denominations have slightly different opinions about minor matters of little importance, while agreeing on the important doctrines. It's only splinter cults that differ in major doctrines. By maximizing the trivial differences and minimizing the agreements, YOU are dividing Christ. You make blanket accusations against all denominational churches which may be true in some cases, but are not true in general. Beware bearing false witness!

Tell me, which Christians in this world do YOU think are "genuine", where are they, how many of them are there, and how can they be found?
---StrongAxe on 7/29/18


Steveng, those who attend denominational churches of their choice are individual believers ...no two exactly alike. Therefore to condemn all church goers is rediculous. Not all hide in basements, as some born again Christians attend churches to be a light. Yes it may be true that only a certain percent are Born Again, doing their job to be witnesses of Jesus Christ.

I would say most all basement dwellers are some sort of cult thinking they are the ONLY ONES who are the real thing.
---kathr4453 on 7/29/18


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Satan has had over two thousand years to infiltrate and divide christiandom up into a whole lot more than 60,000 worldwide denominations each having their own rituals, traditions, ways of living and interpretations of the bible. Are christians today of one mind? Is Christ divided?

Today's denominational church members, THEY, are nothing more than hearers of the Word, counterfeit christians, having the knowledge of God, but denying his power. (Matthew 15:9, John 4:24) They pray repeated prayers in vain. They perform standard rituals every service every Sunday.

God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
---Steveng on 7/28/18


Trav:

Wow! After six months of silence, you jump in, and make two posts, both attacking me, commenting on something I asked Nicole_Lacey almost a year ago.

Again, you choke on a gnat over "Israel is not the Jews". Old Testament says Israel while New Testament says Jews, because after the Babylon exile, only Judah returned, with a few other stragglers of other tribes mixed in. Jesus considered them effectively synonymous.

I also asked about "God's covenant with the Jews" (i.e. Old Covenant), not "New Covenant". If you're going to attack someone else talking about apples, please make sure they're not talking about oranges before accusing them of blindness or deafness.
---StrongAxe on 7/27/18


God did not abandon his convenants with the Jews to start over. ...However, he made a new covenant that included all poeple, not just Jews.
Are YOU part of God's covenant with the Jews, or are you not?
---StrongAxe on 9/15/17

Judah is 1/12th of Israel...if you look you will find that he did make a "New Covenant" with the "House of Israel" which is the Northern house of ten and used the word "AND" Judah. Hebrews 8:8 and Jer 31:31. These mystery people you do not consider will be found under Heb 8:10 and Jer 31:33.
Your self chosen logic does not test out by scripture, anywhere. The New Covenant only lists two parties...of which you might blind/deaf be...either.
---Trav on 7/26/18


They understand and interpret everything in the bible using today's language. ---Steveng on 7/24/18

I agree Steven
This is why there is no value in retranslating a Bible written thousands of years ago, using a Greek dictionary giving the words modern day definitions.

Look at all the new definitions to words that have accumulated in the English dictionary, in just the last 30 years. Look at a 50 year old Webster dictionary and compare it to one today.
---David on 7/27/18


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Samuelbb7:

John Wesley was wise, but his teachings were merely human opinions, and not scripture.

Also, the Ten Commandments were part of the Law, and we are no longer under the Law. This doesn't mean we are free to break them. It means we no longer need them.

If you love God, you automatically refrain from worshiping other gods, making idols, and taking his name in vain without needing to be told. If you love your neighbor, you automatically refrain from murder, adultery, theft, perjury, and jealousy, and respect your parents without needing to be told.

The one commandment NOT covered by this is observing the Sabbath, and you Seventh Day Adventists NEED that commandment to still be in force to justify your beliefs.
---StrongAxe on 7/25/18


Steveng, I notice you don't say " WE" when criticizing Christians. Its always "THEY". Any explanation for that would help us understand who and what you are claiming to be.
---kathr4453 on 7/24/18


The people in today's civilized world are too technical - including the christians. They tend to over analyze everything. They understand and interpret everything in the bible using today's language. Bible chapters and verses came into existence three hundred years ago and makes it practically impossible to understand what is written in the bible using worldly understanding instead of spiritual understanding.

If the bible was read through the eyes of a child, without verses, the meaning would be completely different.
---Steveng on 7/24/18


David, Paul shows being a Jew under the law did not make him blameless as he also testifies in Philippians 3. And we also see in Galatians the law was the schoolmaster that brings us to Christ and also shows us what sin is. Sin we are all guilty of, Jew and Gentile.

Romans 7 is just reiterating Romans 6, but is addressed to Jews under the Law also CONCLUDES BEING DELIVERED FROM THE BODY OF THIS DEATH THROUGH JESUS CHRIST....SOOOO! as I said, the beginning of Galatians lead up to Galatians 2:20-21, and the verses after solidify what Galatians 2:20-21 and Romans 6-8 ( the very pinacle of Galatians) is all about. Paul uses ABRAHAMS faith, and those who have the faith of Abraham as the REAL CHRISTIANS. Also reiterated in Romans 4-5.
---kathr4453 on 7/24/18


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The laws of Christ include the the ten Commandments.

Ask John Wesley if you do not believe me.
---Samuelbb7 on 7/24/18


My doctrine is the CROSS, clearly defined in Galatians 2:20-21....that includes the blood.---kathr4453 on 7/23/18

Kathryn
How can you use (Galatians 2:20) as your testimony, without using the rest of Pauls testimony in (Romans 7:8-10)? Paul testified he used the Law to bring about his death to sin. You claim you are not under the Law, so how were you crucified?

8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead. 9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
---David on 7/24/18


David, Where is it stated Christians are not under the Law of Christ? When Paul states we are not under the Law, he is talking about the Law of Moses, not the Law of Christ. You really do need to study verse by verse in Galatians. The focal point of the whole letter is Galatians 2:20-21. Everything before leads up to it, everything stated after explains what Grace is...or LIFE IN CHRIST. I also love Galatians 5:22-25. That IS the Law of Christ IN YOU. AND ONLY THOSE WHO HAVE CRUCIFIED THE FLESH CAN OBEY THIS LAW.

Please don't presume to tell me what my doctrine is. You don't understand it, so it's impossible for you to tell me what it us. My doctrine is the CROSS, clearly defined in Galatians 2:20-21....that includes the blood.
---kathr4453 on 7/23/18


David, again you stoop to lying by suggesting something I never stated---kathr4453 on 7/22/18

Kathryn
Fair enough, let me explain.
When Its implied in your doctrine, there is no need for you to say it.
Paul says, Where is there no Law, there can be no transgression.

You believe you are not under Gods Law,....correct? If your not under Gods Law, there is no Law. If there is no Law, there can be no transgression. If there is no sin, you have nothing to confess, do you?

Again...I am not talking about the Law of Moses. I am talking about the Law of Christ God puts into your mind.
---David on 7/23/18


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Thank you Samuel, I totally agree. Also Ephesians 2:10, Hebrews 13:20-21, Hebrews 10:10 David May want to meditate upon. There is no other book that defines the Blood of Jesus Christ more than the Book of Hebrews. It's not that you believe in the Blood David, it's WHAT YOU BELIEVE ABOUT THE BLOOD THAT COUNTS. If it's not grounded in scripture, according to Gods definitions and descriptions and power, it's not biblical. Anyone can say....THE BLOOD..THE BLOOD, even Mormons.....but if it's not doctrinally true...it's not TRUTH.
---kathr4453 on 7/23/18


Christians do good works because they Love GOD and love others. Romans 6 and 13.

Those who do not do good works and do not walk in love. Show they are not following Jesus.

Titus 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Read Matthew 25.
---Samuelbb7 on 7/22/18


David, again you stoop to lying by suggesting something I never stated. Nor does the verse you posted back up what you stated. Faith in His Blood YES, and if we confess our sin He is faithful and just to forgive our sin and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. I believe this. Why do you keep insisting I don't?

It's FAITH IN HIS BLOOD, not my good works.....hope you REPENT of your thinking you can work for your salvation and CONFESS your self righteousness before God, confess it is CHRIST ALONE who shed HIS BLOOD for the remission of sin, and our faith in HIS finished works. Shall we continue to sin that GRACE might about....GOD FORBID, DONT YOU KNOW THAT THOSE WHO HAVE DIED WITH CHRIST HAVE DIED TO SIN?
---kathr4453 on 7/22/18


Even religious people can live in ignorance as they ignore Bible doctrines, rightly divided.
If Christs blood wasn't sufficient for your forgiveness then you may still need to beg God for forgiveness. Many religious systems are setup to accomplish just that.
Still captive to sin and guilt, religious people continually confess their sins, say ritualistic prayers, and perform good deeds in attempt to earn forgiveness. Despite the fact that the Bible is clear that Christ died once for sins.
There is no reason to do these things if you have already trusted in Christs payment for sin. Trying to earn your own forgiveness makes the cross of Christ of none effect.
---michael_e on 7/22/18


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(Romans 3:25) Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God

Kathryn
How do you show you have faith in the blood of Christ, for the remission of sin? I say its through confession of sin, as ( 1 John 1: 7-10) tells us.

I hope you will kneel before God, and confess your sins, every day, for just one week and allow God to show you the Truth. You can not follow the Holy Spirit when you walk in darkness. Confession removes the darkness, which is what (1 John 1) is all about.

Right now you see this as my word, but if you try it, God will show you its his word.
---David on 7/22/18


T he law pointed to sin. And James says if you break one law you have broken all of them. The score already says YOU LOSE. Every time you SIN...all your self efforts are wiped out and you have to start over again. Unless you believe you become sinless once the laws are written on your heart. Then again, you have no more confession of sin. Wow, my head is already spinning....

Interesting..Revelation 14:13 has a verse something like...Blessed are those who DIE IN THE LORD , and their works do follow.

Also from Abel to Moses there was no LAW, Romans 5....not written in the heart or stone. However FAITH as we see Abel, Noah, Job, Abraham, Moses etc etc....was is and will always be what God wants.
---kathr4453 on 7/21/18


Whats the difference between Works of the Law and Good Works?

They are one and the same, with one difference. That difference is the reason for your obedience to God. Is your obedience out of Love, or is it done with the expectation of a reward? Im talking about the Law God writes on your heart.

Why would God write a Law on our hearts, if we are not under his Law?
The Law of Moses was written on Stone. The Law of Christ is written on your Stony Hearts.
---David on 7/21/18


1 John 3:12 Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.

Here says it ALL....Cain's WORKS were EVIL, Abel's WORKS were RIGHTEOUS.

Now exactly what were Abel's WORKS? OBEDIENCE of FAITH in offering a blood sacrifice admitting he was a sinner, and his blood sacrifice pointing to the promised redeemer.

Hebrews 11 explains. Nothing in Hebrews 11 about Abel's or Noah's or Moses or Abrahams Etc etc etc WORKS ETC ETC except they ALL OBEYED the voice of God. They didn't do good works to EARN salvation. Their faith PROVED they were saved because their works of obedience of faith proved they were already saved.
---kath4453 on 7/20/18


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Steveng:

You asked: What the difference between the 'Kingdom of God' and a 'new heaven and a new Earth'?

"Kingdom" means "dominion" or "rulership". It refers to government - who is in charge, who makes the rules, etc. "A new heaven and a new earth" are geographic terms, referring to physical places.

Compare "North America" (a place) and "United States of America" (a government) or "British Isles" (a place) and "United Kingdom" (a kingdom).
---StrongAxe on 7/20/18


Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God, and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were JUDGED out of those things which were written in the books, according to their WORKS.

Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were JUDGED every man according to their WORKS.


Sounds like a good reason to me.

Our works (fruits) show the reality of our profession of faith.

Jas 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.


---jerry6593 on 7/20/18


Blessed are those who have part of the first resurrection, against such the second death hath no power. This verse in the beginning of Revelation also is what Hebrews 2:9....( read ALL of Hebrews 2) is about. FAITH in the promised Redeemer before the cross or after, ( SAME PROMISE) explained in Hebrews 2....verse 9 WOW....shows why WE need to be Born Again...those Born Again, INCLUDING all before the cross, who died IN FAITH Hebrews 11 who are NOW made perfect ..Hebrews 12( the spirits of Just men MADE PERFECT, also will not face the second death.

Those who TODAY have died with Christ...Romans 6 aka Crucified with Christ...aka BORN AGAIN, Born from above, will also,not face the second death. The SECOND DEATH is the lake of fire.
---kathr4453 on 7/20/18


What the difference between the 'Kingdom of God' and a 'new heaven and a new Earth'?

How does one interpret the difference between the first resurrection and the second which states "according to their works?"
---Steveng on 7/19/18


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Will your loving God destroy the souls of these people?
---Steveng on 7/18/18


Steven
Jesus was very clear...unless a man be born again he can not enter into the kingdom of God. There is a very clear sign given in the Bible, which tells us how we know when we have been born of God. (1 John 3:9-10) KJV.

The wrong path is very long, and its where many spend their entire lifetimes trying to find the Truth. Only those who follow the Holy Spirit will find the right path. And confession of sin keeps us on that path, until we find it.

I have witnessed good folks, who follow the wrong path their entire life, who were born again on their deathbeds. God chooses who he chooses, he decides when to make that choice.
---David on 7/19/18


Again Steveng, you sited the Gospel according to Steveng. You try to reason out of your own lack of understanding what you FEEL AND THINK God will do...when He has already stated many times exactly what He will do.
---kathr4453 on 7/19/18


God is a loving God and a just God. He does not want anyone to perish. There are two resurrections of the dead: One, at the return of Christ where the dead in Christ shall rise and the living shall be caught up with the dead. The second is at the end of the thousand year reign of Christ where all the other dead from all of history shall rise and be judge from the book of life according to their works.

There are people, not knowing God nor Jesus, who do the will of God not knowing the will of God nor his commandments, but do them anyway from the heart.

Will your loving God destroy the souls of these people?
---Steveng on 7/18/18


David, where are you coming up with your false accusations? My my just another KellyAnne Conway dishonest deflection here.

I won't discuss with you any longer David.
---kathr4453 on 7/18/18


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Again, you are changing the narrative now by suggesting I don't believe a Christian can sin. Please find where I made such a ststement. ---kathr4453 on 7/17/18

Kathryn
Its in the very foundation of your doctrine.
Sin is the transgression of the Law. (1 John 3:4). If you are not under Gods Law, how can you transgress the Law? If you can not sin, I can see how confession of sin would sound ridiculous to you.

Paul was a great teacher, but if your going to found your doctrine on his epistles, use all of it. Like the entire chapter of (Romans 2), which totally refutes your lawless belief,...if your honest about it.
---David on 7/18/18


kathr: "And your definition of LOVING GOD is to keep His commandments."

Perhaps you missed this:

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Is your definition of loving God disobeying Him?



---jerry6593 on 7/18/18


So Steveng, tell us.....can an unsaved person not filled with the Holy Spirit LOVE God? And your definition of LOVING GOD is to keep His commandments...Are these commandments the 10 commandments Or other commandment? So we see Pauls testimony....a blameless Pharisee who thought he perfectly kept Gods commandments. So much so, he even murdered Christians. Yet in Philippians 3 he seems to say all that was dung compared to the excellency and knowledge of KNOWING CHRIST, not having a righteousness of his own but having the righteousness of Christ.

Did you read the blog question before answering? OR perhaps did you stumble on here by mistake.

LOVE never compromises TRUTH.
---kathr4453 on 7/17/18


The ultimate commandment is LOVE - as in the VERB form.

A Christian loves God by keeping his commandments, by doing his commandments.

A Christian loves others by applying love to others - showing and applying the love of God.

It seems many on this site bicker among each other. Many debate unwinnable arguments. They make living a Christian lifestyle more complicated than it really should be. What is happening on the site is a reflection of today's society - and it isn't good.
---Steveng on 7/17/18


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David, your comment makes no sense.---kathr4453

Kathryn
If you dont believe a Christian can sin, I wouldnt expect confession of sin to make any sense to you.
---David on 7/17/18

Again, you are changing the narrative now by suggesting I don't believe a Christian can sin. Please find where I made such a ststement.

Again, you are being dishonest by making up lies to try to explain comments you made that make no sense.

There is no such thing as forgivness of sin NOT being covered or wash away by the blood of Jesus Christ.

You make up doctrine not in scripture. Back up your doctrine with "scripture"....not INSULTS to others who confront your nonsense.
---kathr4453 on 7/17/18


David, your comment makes no sense.---kathr4453

Kathryn
If you dont believe a Christian can sin, I wouldnt expect confession of sin to make any sense to you.
---David on 7/17/18


Christians work because they are saved. Those who are born again love others. That love works.

No loving others shows a person is not saved. Or is still a baby needing to learn. We cannot know which.
---Samuelbb7 on 7/16/18


David, your comment makes no sense.
---kathr4453 on 7/15/18


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David..it is what it is. I am the one who said we confess ONLY TO GOD. You're the one who suggested confession to humans was enough...AND NEVER STATED ANYTHING ABOUT THE BLOOD. ---kathr4453

Kathryn
Mine was a question for exploration.
I believe when a person confesses their sin, before God, they recieve forgiveness and the washing away of sin in the blood of Christ. But when you forgive someone of their sins against you, you only receive forgiveness of sin.

I know what the blood is for David. Just apologize that your comment was in fact condescending and accusatory. Kathryn

If an apology was needed, I would apologize. But my intent was not meant to harm you, no apology is needed.
---David on 7/15/18


Partially, but you didnt mention the blood of Christ, and why forgiven sin needs to be washed away. I hope someday you will confess your sin before God, so God can show you what the blood is for.
---David on 7/12/18

David..it is what it is. I am the one who said we confess ONLY TO GOD. You're the one who suggested confession to humans was enough...AND NEVER STATED ANYTHING ABOUT THE BLOOD.

I know what the blood is for David. Just apologize that your comment was in fact condescending and accusatory.

STOP wiggling out of things you have said by changing the subject when confronted. So dishonest.
---kathr4453 on 7/14/18


Have I EVER stated that I don't believe in the blood of Christ?---kathr4453 on 7/12/18

Kathryn
Understandably, you took what I said out of context. It was not a slight, I wanted you to give confession another chance. When you do this, there is a noticeable change to the way you see yourself and the world around you.


John 14:23 you quoted says nothing about "the love of God"---StrongAxe on 7/12/18

StrongAxe
True, but doesnt (John 14:21)?
21 He that has my commandments, and keeps them, he it is that loves me: and he that loves me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.
---David on 7/14/18


David:

John 14:23 you quoted says nothing nothing about "the love of God", which we take to mean us loving God, and is one half of Jesus's quoting the two most important commandments, and which is the motivation to do good works. Rather, it talks about the reverse - God loving us.

Distilling this verse into the simple phrase "the love of God", which in English can be ambiguous and mean it both ways, and then using that ambiguity to argue that it means the other way, is twisting scripture. This is how false doctrines work - they twist scripture to say the opposite of what it actually says.
---StrongAxe on 7/12/18


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David, hopefully people know the reason Jesus was made flesh in the first place was that His Blood is once and for all opposed to animal sacrifices that only temporarily covered sin UNTIL the next animal sacrifice.

Please don't make assumptions here. Did I not bring to your attention here or another much like this blog Hebrews 10? Have I EVER stated that I don't believe in the blood of Christ? Have I stated many times we are justified by His blood and saved by His risen life?

Yes I have....for over 15 years here.

What I find disengenuous here David is your constant looking for something you want to make an issue about, because EVERYTHING is not stated for you in 125 words.
---kathr4453 on 7/12/18


For God so LOVED the World that He gave His only Begotren son to die on the cross for the forgivness of sin.
---kathr4453 on 7/11/18


Kathryn
Partially, but you didnt mention the blood of Christ, and why forgiven sin needs to be washed away. I hope someday you will confess your sin before God, so God can show you what the blood is for.
---David on 7/12/18


David, what makes you think Christians don't love God? Yet we see it's the Love of God shed abroad in our heart by the Holy Spirit. We love Him because He first loved us.

For God so LOVED the World that He gave His only Begotren son to die on the cross for the forgivness of sin.
---kathr4453 on 7/11/18


The Truth
(John 14:23) Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our home with him.

Fact vs. Fiction, As we can see in the above verse.
According to Christ...Works come first...then comes the love of God. Notice Jesus says, Keep my words and my Father will love you. Not, My Father will love you...and then you will keep my words.

If we use what Jesus taught in his Gospel to guide us, the false doctrines can not lead us astray. The Gospel is like the meat of a meal, the rest of the New Testament is the garnish. Unfortunately most have made the Gospel of Christ the garnish.
---David on 7/11/18


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It's God who works IN US ( those who are Saved and have Christ IN THEM,) to will and to do,of His good pleasure. And we are created IN CHRIST JESUS ( those now Born Again) to walk in the works HE has before ordained that we should walk in. These works are what is conforming us to the image of Jesus Christ, growing up into Him to maturity, being OVERCOMERS in this evil world, as we are no longer part of this world. Colossians 3:1-4. Ephesians 2, just to mane a few verses.
---kathr4453 on 7/10/18


Christians do good works because they already have eternal salvation
Dont forget who Christ made you, and how that was possible. It is the cross of Christ that did all the work necessary for your salvation, and the power of the resurrection of Christ that guarantees you a heavenly place with Christ.
The response to sin for the believer is to stop living like who you were, and start living according to who you are in Christ by faith.
Now it is our duty to live up to the high calling we have received freely through Him.
---michael_e on 7/10/18


This is a difficult question to answer, because the answer is Yes!

By cooperating with the commands of the Father, as written out in Matt 25:31-45 and elsewhere in the Bible, we are saved.

And once we have accepted His love and grace in our hearts, we still follow the same commands, not to gain salvation, but to show people love.
---Monk_Brendan on 7/10/18


Trey, good works are the result of the Father grace, as His Divine influence upon the heart or focus of man, it is His Divine favor that opens within man a place spiritually, and a condition mentally to believe and receive His salvation through the atoning sacrifice of Jesus, and all who adhere to, rely on, an trust in Him, He works through, both to will and to do that which is pleasing in His sight.
---Josef on 7/10/18


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