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Mother Of Abominations

Who's the mother of harlots and the abominations of the earth? - and in accordance to Revelation 17: 5 "And upon her forehead was a name written: Mystery, Babylon, the mother of harlots and abominations of the earth". 6And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints".

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 ---Melody on 8/19/18
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18 "And I say also unto thee: "That thou are Peter, and upon this rock I will built MY Church" = (what Peter had replied and testified in faith to THE LORD about HIM being 'THE ROCK' = solid foundation of HIS Body/The Church by faith in HIM unto salvation
---Melody on 9/18/18

First of all Jesus does not build his Church on faith but on people see eph 2:20.

Second Jesus said " You are Peter (Rock) and on this Rock(Peter) I will build my Church, how do I know this? He already call Peter Rock !

John 1:42 " You shall be call Cephas (Rock) ..

Third what about the keys given to Peter and only Peter! Orthodox and Protestant have a problem with this verse:)
---Ruben on 9/18/18


Amen = "Upon THE ROCK' - THE LORD . . . Peter 's words and by faith - said the correct answer and meaning to THE LORD!

16 "HE said unto them: But WHOM say ye that I AM? - "And Simon Peter answered and said: THOU ARE THE CHRIST - THE SON OF THE LIVING GOD".

17 "And JESUS answered and said unto him: Blessed thou art. Simon Bar-jona: For flesh and blood hath not revealed unto thee, but MY FATHER which is in Heaven".

18 "And I say also unto thee: "That thou are Peter, and upon this rock I will built MY Church" = (what Peter had replied and testified in faith to THE LORD about HIM being 'THE ROCK' = solid foundation of HIS Body/The Church by faith in HIM unto salvation
---Melody on 9/18/18


We first learn about the ROCK in the OT, when the ROCK followed them through the wilderness to going to the promise land. The LIVING WATER. Jesus was that ROCK then and now. Jesus Christ IS the ROCK of our salvation.

When Jesus spoke those words to his disciples they KNEW He was referring to Himself, being a NO BRAINER to those who were listening to Jesus.

So no, no one was a higher Apostle than another. Or exalted above another. The whole of the NT is Christ is the HEAD....and all else are members of His Body...as the Apostles also were, as we also are. Members of one another. No one body part has importance over another body part. And your spiritual gift does not make you More important either.
---kathr4453 on 9/18/18


Matthew 16:18 - And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church,

Luke 6:48 - He is like a man building a house , who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. And the flood arose , the stream beat vehemently against the house, and could not shake it, for it was founded on rock,

( My recollection is: Peter was never in Rome )
---RichardC on 9/17/18


False it is that THE LORD JESUS named Peter as the first 'pope' of Rome - there's not such word or assignment in The Original Writings of The Scriptures but made up by false and distorted writings with no reverence to THE SOVERIGNITY of THE LORD GOD and from man's distorted imagination and spiritual rebellion against GOD (even when HE warns them of what's coming to those who add, change or remove GOD'S WORD in the last chapter of Revelation - in contempt they are and don't want to recognize it) - and unto those who prefer to defend these adulterous teachings that are giving honor and reverence to those that teach such false doctrines instead of to THE LORD'S unadulterated GOD'S WORD: Revelation 22: 18,19
---Melody on 9/17/18




\\he is again showing by his own words that he doesn't accept GOD'S ADMONITIONS and as he doesn't want to accept GOD'S TRUTH \\

Melody, you're speaking neither God's words, nor His truth.

You're simply speaking in yourself.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/17/18


Kathr: People should be able to say what they want without these personal childish ATTACKS.//

You are the QUEEN of making personal childish attacks.

Samuel: Roman Catholic Scholars//

Are you talking about Catholic Scolars who live in Rome, Italy?

Jesus made Peter the first Pope as evident in the Bible. 2nd Peter lived in Jerusalem as in Acts

//Bible teach Peter had to report to James.//

You wish. Cite that verse.

//So non Roman Catholic Scholars and the Bible agree. The RCC scholars are the ones who dispute the Bible.//

I just PROVED you dispute the Bible. You give lip service without Bible citation. Then you start citing non Biblical stuff. Corner stones are NOT foundation stones.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/17/18


Kathrn - right you are!

As you have read my comment: I didn't reply directly to him but of course he applied it to himself and why? - because clear it is that by his retaliation against me and what I said - he is again showing by his own words that he doesn't accept GOD'S ADMONITIONS and as he doesn't want to accept GOD'S TRUTH - he comes against the ones that are sharing IT: Yes, don't give more opportunities to those who clearly are here - not for THE LORD AND HIS WORD - but for constantly advertising their own doctrines in opposition of THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL:
---Melody on 9/17/18


Melody, don't even answer Cluny. See how he insults, and then denies he even insulted. It's a game silly old men with nothing else to do does here plays. He's a classic troublemaker. The best thing, as I also after his last two attacks on me , will no longer engage in his childish behavior.

People should be able to say what they want without these personal childish ATTACKS.
---kathr4453 on 9/17/18


\\the only defense that they have is to insult those who are sharing THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL\\

Where did you get the idea that you were sharing the truth of the Gospel and God's word, Melody?

That's the REAL question.

I was following Jesus for DECADES before I ever even heard of you.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/16/18




Just curious, Kathr. Are you saying that we should not recite Psalm 136 outloud because it is not our own words?
---Johnny74 on 9/16/18


StevenG said, "1. Statues, icons, iconostasis, symbols, and pictures of which members kiss the feet of the statues and pray to them. (this includes the cross)."

Steven, that means that you've never kissed your Bible, your mother, your wife, your kids, anything.

Also, there is not a single properly catechized Catholic or Orthodox that prays TO ANY statue/ relic/ picture, or anything else

We worship God the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit alone, and if someone tells you otherwise, he is lying, or he is not catechized.
---Monk_Brendan on 9/16/18


When the souls are in spiritual bondage under idolatrous religions and cults and by that trampling upon GOD'S HOLINESS AND WORD under such darkness - the only defense that they have is to insult those who are sharing THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL and trying to inflict in them the same guiltiness they feel by refusing to accept GOD'S WORD in totality as they are showing their open rebellion against GOD'S WORD . . . where do their words really coming from??? - for sure not of someone that has been redeemed and under GOD'S SPIRIT that is LIGHT AND JOY to those who have received it- but from the opposite side that leads to condemnation!
---Melody on 9/16/18


Psalms 136 is not a repetitious prayer . Not unless someone turns it into a prayer and repeats it over and over and over as if it held some mystical power like chanting the same words over and over in the words or used it over and over in place of THEIR OWN WORDS.







---kathr4453 on 9/16/18


Repetitious prayers. See Psalm 136.
---Johnny74 on 9/15/18


Melody, why don't you look at yourself in the mirror while reading your own post?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/15/18


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When will GOD'S People listen to HIS ADMONITIONS and leave alone those who keep on spreading their false/harlotry religions - read what GOD'S WORD says and then reflect on that:

Romans 16:17

"Now I beseech you Brethren, mark (ignore, leave those that have rejected The Gospel over and over again) - which cause division and offenses contrary to the Doctrine that you have learned" - foolishness it is to "Give the pearls to the swine, for if you - they'll throw it back at you". - GOD' WORDS - not mine!
---Melody on 9/15/18


Just to be clear, there is a difference between spiritualizing something away vs symbolic. Verses in Revelation that are symbolic , lets say, Rev 12, the Woman the 12 stars, moon and sun, are explained in Genesis with Joseph's dream. They represent the 12 tribes of Israel, Jacob and Rachael. ***Genesis 37:9-11.

But some want to spiritualized it away to mean the 12 Apostles and Mary.

The sun and moon are NEVER said in scripture to represent Mary. nor are any stars ever said to represent the 12 apostles.

Rev 12 Also coordinate with Zechariah 12-14, which have not happened yet. The second coming of Christ to EARTHLY ISRAEL....a very literal prophecy.
---kathr4453 on 9/15/18


Psalm 127:1 - Except the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build it : Except the Lord keep the city, The watchman waketh but in vain.

Psalm 127:2 - It is vain for you to rise up early, to sit up late, to eat the bread of sorrows:: for so he giveth his beloved his reward,

Psalm 127:3 - Lo, children are an heritage of the Lord: and the fruit of the womb is his reward,

Psalm 127:4 - As arrows are in the hand of a mighty man, so are children of the youth.

Psalm 127:5 - Happy is the man that hath his quiver full of them: They shall not be ashamed. But shall speak with the enemies at the Gate.
---RichardC on 9/14/18


\\2. Pray repeated prayers.\\

Steveng, give the EXACT TEXT of one of the repeated prayers you claim the Orthodox say.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/14/18


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StevenG said, A few items the Catholic/Orthodox believe against true christianity

4. "Churches" made with the hands of man which included art and architecture...

Steven, you really need to pay attention to what you write. Unless God built your house, by Himself, then He used architects. Even if you are building a two room house, with one room being the bathroom, and the other the "anything else" room, them it needs to be planned. And who is the person who does the planning? Why, it's an architect.
---Monk_Brendan on 9/14/18


\\
A few items the Catholic/Orthodox believe against true christianity\\

I'll bet the worldly denominational "church" of Steveng wishes it had so much money.

As for the rest of your posting, we know better.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/14/18


All prophesies concerning the end days were descriptions based upon the knowledge of the prophets at that time.

For instance Revelation 9:7-10 could be a description of a helicopter and what it does.

The descriptions of what the prophesy itself DOES will make more sense to you, but only afterwards.
---Steveng on 9/14/18


Much of what Jesus said was Spiritual in application. A problem the Pharisees had. As well as people today.

Much of Revelation is Spiritual. There are no real dragons and no harlot riding on the back of a beast.

Those symbols come from the Old Testament many from Daniel.

The problem most people have is forgetting to search the Old Testament for the meaning of the book of Revelation. But then many do not want to listen to the truths in the Old Testament anyway. They ignore the words to Timothy on all scripture. AGape
---Samuelbb7 on 9/14/18


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Nicole Roman Catholic Scholars make Peter the first pope and that he set up his capitol in Rome.

Scholars and the Bible teach Peter had to report to James the Brother of Jesus in Jerusalem. That Rome was not the center of the church.

So non Roman Catholic Scholars and the Bible agree. The RCC scholars are the ones who dispute the Bible.

The church is not built on Peter. Jesus Christ is the solid Rock or Cornerstone on which the church stands.

Our foundation is on Jesus our Messiah LORD and GOD.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/13/18


First of all Cluny, even those who are gifted in the teaching of Revelation have never said themselves they are 100% correct. So for someone in 500ad to make that claim, is pure arrogance.

We see in Rev 11:9-10 when the two witnesses are killed, THE WHOLE WORLD IS GOING TO SEE , .....could never have been understood in 500ad, as we can today with REAL TIME INSTANT VISUALIZATION made possible by satellites and the Internet.

Just one of many examples. But I suppose back then those verses were spiritualized away , like so many others.
---kathr4453 on 9/13/18


\\Well in that case Cluny, you are all NOT 100 % correct, since much of Revelation is FUTURE.

That's what I assumed you would say, yet who are you to say everyone else is wrong who believe Revelation is FURURE.\\

I never said that many things in Revelation are NOT future.

Neither did St. Andrew of Crete.

Read his commentary and tell us where he's wrong, OK?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/12/18


A few items the Catholic/Orthodox believe against true christianity

1. Statues, icons, iconostasis, symbols, and pictures of which members kiss the feet of the statues and pray to them. (this includes the cross).
2. Pray repeated prayers.
3. Mary, the Mother of God.
4. "Churches" made with the hands of man which included art and architecture.
5. Purgatory or temporary judgement.
6. Eighty-five percent of all income go to the maintenance of buildings, fixed assets, and paper assets (stocks, bonds, insurance, etc.)
---Steveng on 9/12/18


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Well in that case Cluny, you are all NOT 100 % correct, since much of Revelation is FUTURE.

That's what I assumed you would say, yet who are you to say everyone else is wrong who believe Revelation is FURURE. No one in 500 ad can or even could understand FURURE issues, as even now we still are waiting for revelation as the Lord sees fit to reveal in His timing.
---kathr4453 on 9/12/18


"Turn ye not into idols, not make to yourself molten 'gods': I AM THE LORD your GOD". Leviticus 19:4

"You shall make you no idols
or graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of atone in your land, to bow down unto it: For I AM THE LORD your GOD" - Leviticus 26:1

"And changed THE GLORY OF THE UNCORRUPTIBLE GOD, into an image made like to corruptible man". Romans 1:23

""Who changed THE TRUTH OF GOD into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than THE CREATOR, WHO is blessed forever - Amen". Romans 1 25
---Melody on 9/11/18


\\don't even listen to those who constantly deny THE TRUTH by their false idolatrous and perverted religions that are propagating perdition and separation from THE LORD - \\

Are talking about yourself, Melody?

To answer your question,Kath, I will refer you to a book called APOCALYPSE, by St. Andrew of Crete, who livedin the 500's or so.

It's a verse by verse commentary, with scriptural parallels added by its English transator, the late Fr. Seraphim Rose.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/11/18


Those who has THE LIGHT - be ready to expose and reprove the darkness and don't even listen to those who constantly deny THE TRUTH by their false idolatrous and perverted religions that are propagating perdition and separation from THE LORD - and why? They themselves have become spiritually blind and by the rejection of THE TRUTH, their mission is to enslave others into their own spiritual chain - the reason they don't even fear where they are by even contradicting and denying GOD'S WORD: "those who worship idols, they do to evil spirits" - so spiritually possessed they become!












---Melody on 9/11/18


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Actually Cluny, you first, please give us all the 100% accuracy on everything the Orthodox has correct on Revelation.
---kathr4453 on 9/11/18


Cluny. You may be right. Can you give me some examples of how Orthodox interpret revelation?
---Johnny74 on 9/11/18


\\It is a losing battle trying to find details about anything specific in the Book of Revelation. Everybody has been wrong so far.\\

Not the Orthodox. We have been 1oo% right all the time on this.

Kath, please give SPECIC\FIC examples of how the Roman Catholic Church has influenced American politics, giving exact date and persons, please.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/11/18


It is a losing battle trying to find details about anything specific in the Book of Revelation. Everybody has been wrong so far.
---Johnny74 on 9/10/18


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Well, the Catholic Church TODAY, has its fingers deep in American Politics. We have FOX news steeped with Catholics, and now Kavanaugh a Catholic up for Supreme Court who has some interesting ideas about giving the President TOTAL Authoritan Power. I personally believe in these last days THIS is opening the door for Satan to establish power through the most powerful nation in the world. Not that Trump is the beast, BUT it does open the door for the beast to rise from our nation, could still rise from the RCC.

All I know is something horrible is happening to our country and the GOP seem to be in a stupor about it. That stupor I believe is a demonic stronghold. And so many Christians are blind to this also in a stupor.
---kathr4453 on 9/11/18


Samuel: The Pope made his capitol in Rome as stated by the RCC//

Capitol? What statement?Give citation that states Peter made Rome the capital.

//with Peter in Rome being the first Pope. A untrue fact.//

You rather believe your false Scholars instead of the Bible?

Acts 15 states Peter is in Jerusalem.

Remember Paul and Barnabas WENT UP to Jerusalem to see the Apostles and Elders about this question....

V6 states Peter got up and addressed them:

That PROVES Peter and the Apostles were in Jerusalem as their CAPITAL not Rome.

//I was just pointing out that a search of Scholars and truth will show you are incorrect.//

And the Bible shows these Scholars and you are incorrect.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/10/18


No Nicole I believe the Scholars of history and truth. The Pope made his capitol in Rome as stated by the RCC with Peter in Rome being the first Pope. A untrue fact. But still declared.

I was just pointing out that a search of Scholars and truth will show you are incorrect. For instance look up the Great Schism of 1054. Use any encyclopedia you wish. AGape
---Samuelbb7 on 9/10/18


Cluny here is an official prayer used before V2 where the priest refers to the ROMAN church.//

???

Please be more specific in your citation.

V2 doesn't tell me anything. Are you talking about Eucharistic Prayer number 2? A Saint?

Again CITE the Vatican using the word 'Roman'.

Samuel: if you type in Roman Catholic the Internet will take you to what you have renamed the Catholic church.//

Goggle isn't the spokes person for the Catholic Church.

It's a search engine.

Do you believe EVERYTHING the internet states?

You can ONLY type 'Catholic' and STILL get the same results.

You can type African American and Black and get the same results. But they are wrong.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/10/18


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The Mother of Harlots is a metaphor.
---Johnny74 on 9/9/18


Dear Nicole if you type in Roman Catholic the Internet will take you to what you have renamed the Catholic church. The RCC states it is founded on Peter. Who was they declare to be the first Pope in Rome.

The problem is the Bible never speaks of a Pope or anyone but Jesus as the High Priest. Peter says the church is built on Jesus. Not himself. True you can find what the RCC states. But the fact is false.

Just type in Roman Catholic. You will find the truth.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/9/18


Nicole, here is an official prayer used before V2 where the priest refers to the ROMAN church.

My purpose is to celebrate Mass and to make the body and blood of our Lord Jesus Christ according to the rite of the holy Roman Church, to the praise of almighty God and of the whole Church triumphant in heaven, for my own welfare and that of the whole Church militant on earth, for all who in general and in particular have commended themselves to my prayers, and for the well-being of the holy Roman Church.
Amen.

Glory Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/9/18


Samuel said Goggle and it states: the Church built on Saint Peter being the first Pope of Rome.

I said to HIM: BTW, Peter is the Primacy of Rome.

NEITHER he nor I said The LORD SAID "Peter is the primacy of Rome".

Primacy of Rome means he was the Bishop of Rome as every Pope up to date is the Bishop of Rome.

As when someone states Trump is the President of United States as George Washington.

If people TODAY say 'PETER has spoken' it means Pope Francis has spoken.

As when we said Xerox this for me meaning make a copy from a copying machine. The machine doesn't have to be a Xerox.

Give me a Kleenex doesn't mean it has to be an actual Kleenex tissue but give a tissue so blow their nose.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/2/18


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StrongAxe: you spoke of "Cafeteria Christians" who reject Jesus. I assumed you were referring to me. Was I mistaken?//

No you were NOT mistaken.

I was speaking about you and the others who do not believe that Jesus is Bread and Wine for us to eat and drink.

I re-read my post and you were right. I was implying you were rejecting Jesus completely.

I AM SORRY.

I meant to say:

They are rejecting SOME OF Jesus' WORDS and believe Jesus is limited.

I left out 3 important key words.

Which makes a BIG difference in a sentence.

FORGIVE ME.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/2/18


THE LORD never said that "Peter is the primacy of Rome" - this are false religious interpretations! . . . and this is supposed to be a Christian site to uplift THE LORD and proclaim THE TRUE GOSPEL of faith in HIM and not in propagating falsehoods to deter from HIS TRUTH: "Woe unto those who does it - and you are against me standing up for THE TRUTH - complain and judge me before THE ONLY in POWER - THE LORD and see what HE has to say about heresies and where this leads!
---Melody on 9/2/18


Samuel: Please go to Google and type in Roman Catholic Church. It will tell you the Church built on Saint Peter being the first Pope of Rome.//

???

So you want me to believe Goggle over Vatican's website?

Goggle is a search engine.

They let PEOPLE display their websites.

The Vatican.VA is a website that states Her beliefs.

BTW, Peter is the Primacy of Rome.

//The Vatican ruled and ran Rome for Centuries.//

The argument is not if they ran the city of Rome but does She call Herself 'Roman'.

She does NOT.

//It is true the RCC does also refer to itself as the Catholic church.//

She ONLY refers Herself as the Catholic Church.
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/31/18


Please go to Google and type in Roman Catholic Church. It will tell you the Church built on Saint Peter being the first Pope of Rome.

Go to any encyclopedia same thing. The Vatican ruled and ran Rome for Centuries.

It is true the RCC does also refer to itself as the Catholic church.

But there are problems with that. Since there are a number of offshoots who oppose the Pope and use the same name.

Look up the definition of catholic. It means universal. On that basis I a Christian in the Seventh day Adventist church am a catholic. So you can call me catholic and I am fine.

Agape.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/31/18


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Cluny:I've pointed out to you, Nicole, the Roman Catholic Diocese of Phoenix uses the expression "Roman Catholic" on its official web site.//

As I pointed out to you the PERSON who put up the WEBSITE said 'Roman' NOT the Catholic Church.

Even when they QUOTED St John Paul II he DID NOT say 'Roman'.

//I've even cut and pasted it for your benefit.//

Yes, and that backed me NOT you.

//Why do you not believe it?//

Because I believe my eyes not your words.

Why can't you understand there is a person who designs a website that ISN'T the Vatican?

Or do you think the Vatican goes around setting up websites for everyone?
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/30/18


Good points Jerry and Cluny.

Nicole. There have been good Popes and terrible ones. Many Popes in the Middle ages would be rejected today.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/29/18


Cluny: "Why is there not ONE reference to the Eastern Orthodox churches in the writings of EGW?"

I found one in R & H, Nov 25, 1884, but it was incidental. I think the reason she didn't write a great about the EOC is because it is not relevant to the lineage of God's Commandment-keeping people from Eden to the current day. Read her book "The Great Controversy".


---jerry6593 on 8/29/18


\\1. No roman in front of the Catholic Church RAN by Pope Francis.\\

As I've pointed out to you, Nicole, the Roman Catholic Diocese of Phoenix uses the expression "Roman Catholic" on its official web site.

I've even cut and pasted it for your benefit.

Why do you not believe it?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 8/26/18


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Samuel: The Roman Catholic church is the denomination headed by the Bishop of Rome in the Vatican. You can find this online from many sources.//

Maybe a Protestant websites. Not Catholic ones.

1. No roman in front of the Catholic Church RAN by Pope Francis.

2. Pope Francis is the Pope and the Bishop of Rome. Note Bishop and Pope are 2 titles. No Bishop under the Pope assigned to Rome. Because Rome is assigned to the Pope.

Other areas have Bishops/Cardinals as a direct superior,

//Henry beheaded two of his wives. That was his fault.//

Wait a minute, Henry was a Catholic. Yet you accuse Pope for sins from Spain's King and Queen?

BTW, read the Jews'words who attended Blessed Pope Pius XII's funeral
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/25/18


Steveng, StrongAxe understood I wasn't directing my comment to him but to another.

If someone punches me and I punch back another shouldn't say 'ouch'.

I was saying to him why are you saying ouch if I didn't hit you?

//Nicole wrote: "You all make up stuff without citations."

Too lazy to do your own research..?//

That's dumb. I don't have to take you tongue as if it if it is notarized

//Even if citations were given, you would still debate it.//

That's the whole point isn't it?
We are NOT on CN to listen to sermons or speeches.

Just because citations are given it doesn't mean their interpretation of that citation is correct.

We can't even interpret the Bible the same.
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/24/18


Steveng said, "Prove Samuel wrong using YOUR citations."

I am not Napoleon and I don't think you are either. Under British Common Law and US Law, a man (including the Catholic Church) is INNOCENT until proven guilty.

I have not asked you to stand accountable for all errors of the Worldly Denomination of the Church of Steven G. If you want me to use your standards, then stand by for a poop load full of errors about the WDotCoSG. Otherwise, don't bother me about the "errors" of the RCC.
---Monk_Brendan on 8/23/18


I think it depends with the case because in some instances you need to prove that you are not guilt otherwise you will be punished for things you didn't do.
---Hopeez on 8/23/18


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Samuel and Jerry:

Why is there not ONE reference to the Eastern Orthodox churches in the writings of EGW?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 8/23/18


Steveng:

When one makes an accusation against someone (e.g. against a Pope for murdering people), it's up to the accuser to provide evidence of guilt, not the accused to provide evidence of innocence. That was the legal standard in the Bible, and is also the legal standard in the U.K. and U.S. It's only under the Napoleonic code where one is presumed guilty until one proves one's own innocence.
---StrongAxe on 8/22/18


Monk_Brendan,

Prove Samuel wrong using YOUR citations.
---Steveng on 8/22/18


SamuelBB7 said, "
When the Pope was in charge of the world and kings did his bidding."


The Pope has never been "in charge" of the world, nor did kings always jump to do his bidding. Many kings told the Pope what to do with his edicts.

"He would have people who disagreed with him murdered."

When? give me names, dates and locations please. The Pope disagreed with Galileo, and the strongest he could do was to keep him under house arrest.

"To those Protestants who he was having killed. They would see him and the church as drunk with the thousands they killed."

Again, which Protestants were killed? Names, dates and locations, Please
---Monk_Brendan on 8/22/18


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Nicole wrote: "...if the comment doesn't pertain to you then don't worry about it."

That is a very poor and unchristian attitude.

When several people get together, such as this blog, to discuss a certain topic then ALL are participants even if a comment to directed toward another person.

Nicole wrote: "You all make up stuff without citations."

Too lazy to do your own research to know the truth? Even if citations were given, you would still debate it. It's happened to me quite a few times in the past - and they still didn't believe me or the citations. So, now I tell people to do their own research.
---Steveng on 8/22/18


\\The work of Torquemada in the inquestion and governments murdering people because the Pope and Vatican told them too.\\

Wrong!

During the 300 years when the Spanish Inquisition was active, only 3000 people were executed at its orders.

This is 10 a year.

More people than that a year were executed in Puritan New England, generally for the same crimes (such as witchcraft).

OTOH, under Protestant Elizabeth I, more than 3000 Roman Catholics were executed.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 8/21/18


Nicole_Lacey The term catholic means universal church. The Seventh day Adventist movement is part of the catholic church.

The Roman Catholic church is the denomination headed by the Bishop of Rome in the Vatican. You can find this online from many sources.

Henry beheaded two of his wives. That was his fault.

The work of Torquemada in the inquestion and governments murdering people because the Pope and Vatican told them too. Is their fault. Most people speak of only the Spanish Inquestion. But there were many.

There are some bad sources who exaggerate the numbers. But there are good Scholarly sources that speak truth. Look up the names in a Dictionary. On Jews. Sorry you are wrong.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/21/18


StrongAxe, if the comment doesn't pertain to you then don't worry about it.

Samuel, I never heard of the Roman Catholic Church as you all call such Church.

You all make up stuff without citations.

Next you all would blame the Catholic Church for WWII.

Oh wait, you have already.

The Catholic Church who cared for the Jews people 1000 to 1 than any other Country or Religion.

But still you all are not happy.

Blaming Catholic Church for any Ruler that did things on his or her way doesn't isn't a citation.

What's next? Blaming the Vatican for Henry VIII beheading his wives?

Please back up your claims with objective info not with your subjective info.
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/20/18


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Dear Kathyr

I agree with you. Mystery Babylon is indeed those who put politics and the state before Jesus.

True.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/20/18


Nicole_Lacey:

Why should "country" matter? Revelation doesn't use that word, and neither did I.

ANYONE who is God's bride but then prostitutes themselves with the world is a harlot. The Church has appropriated the titles and powers and promises of Israel. Now it is the Bride of Christ. So it makes sense for the False Church (whoever that is) to be the harlot. Even Islam, though it claims to be the Religion of Peace and follow the word of Allah (i.e. Arabic word for "God") has spawned abominations like ISIS, so that too could be called a harlot (and is in Iraq, that is literally ancient Babylon).

There are many candidates for the title. We'll have to wait for the beauty pageant to find out who wins.
---StrongAxe on 8/20/18


Mystery Babylon is ALL APOSTATE Chritianity. Christianity who has mingled politics with Christianity. She rides the beast. She is dressed in all that is described in the OT Priesthood clothing EXCEPT FOR ONE THING. The Color BLUE is missing. BLUE represent Heavenly. Please compare OT Priest clothing to this wanna be impostor harlot. She becomes drunk with power with the political powers of this earth.

Those who are the TRUE CHURCH OBEY Colossians 3:1-4. And is also stated WE are seated with Christ IN HEAVENLY PLACES IN CHRIST.

Beware you Christians who have commingled the CROSS with the American Flag, or German Flag, as the Nazi's did ETC.
---kathr4453 on 8/20/18


Dear Nicole We are talking about the Roman Catholic church. Which ran the city of Rome for centuries. Until it lost power.

The Pope who declared himself ruler of countries and sometimes was ruled by countries. Popes often were picked by Emperors.

Correct Israel is called a harlot. Because she left the laws of GOD and followed the traditions of men. All who claim the name of Christ but follow men are playing the harlot.

Read Jude.
---Samuelbb7 on 8/20/18


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StrongAxe: The Vatican is not Rome, but is IN Rome. The seat of the Catholic Church is literally in Rome.//

Wrong. Rome isn't a Country. That's likes saying Haiti is in Santo Domingo.

Vatican's Secretary of State is Pietro Parolin,

Secretary of State of Italy is Ciuseppe Conte

Major of Rome is Virginia Elena Raggi

Cities have major not Secretary of State because it isn't countries.

Sorry, no matter how much you want the Holy See in Rome it isn't.

I guess so keep saying Roman Catholic Church.

What do we know about the Mystery Bablyon? She sits on 7 hills. That could be Rome, Jerusalem, Mecca, or even San Francisco.

Read your OT, Cluny is right. Israel is alway called the harlot.
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/19/18


When the Pope was in charge of the world and kings did his bidding.

He would have people who disagreed with him murdered.

To those Protestants who he was having killed. They would see him and the church as drunk with the thousands they killed.

What else could they think?
---Samuelbb7 on 8/19/18


Nicole_Lacey:

The Vatican is not Rome, but is IN Rome. The seat of the Catholic Church is literally in Rome.

What do we know about the Mystery Bablyon? She sits on 7 hills. That could be Rome, Jerusalem, Mecca, or even San Francisco.

The NT church is always described as a woman (e.g. "the bride"). She rides the beast, but is separate from the beast, so the theory that "she is the Catholic church and the Pope is the Beast" fails for this reason.

Oil governs most modern economies, and most OPEC countries are Muslim countries, and Islam is centered in Mecca, so that is another plausible theory. (While ISIS ruled Iraq, with Babylon being literally there, that was another candidate).
---StrongAxe on 8/19/18


There is only ONE nation in the Bible that is personified as a harlot.

It's Israel after the flesh.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 8/19/18


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Everyone seems to think it is Rome. According to my Bible's footnotes: The punishment of Babyon is now described as a past even and metaphorically under the image of the great harlot who leads people astray into idolatry.

Babylon, the symbolic name of Rome, is graphically described as the great harlot. The pagan kings subject to Rome adopted the cult of the emperor.

As we all know the Christian died because they DIDN'T adopt the cult of the emperor.

But before anyone tries to connect the Vatican with Rome please remember that the Vatican ISN'T in Rome.

Vatican city is a Country.

Rome is a city in another Country called Italy.
---Nicole_Lacey on 8/19/18


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