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Billy Graham Used By God

David: THE LORD used Billy Graham as an instrument to win multitudes of souls into salvation: Didn't HE preach repentance and GOD'S GIFT OF SALVATION through our LORD JESUS CHRIST only? - please specify in which way he detoured from that?

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 ---Melody on 9/1/18
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StrongAxe, I gave you 2, now as I repeatedly ASKED. HOW MANY MORE?

You said I was the only one. I gave you a Priest. What is your HAPPY number before I continue with the 3rd one?

//The Vatican is its own country NOW, but that has not always been the case,//

As the N word isn't a Black man's name NOW, but that has not always been the case?

How silly is it to think that the location of the Head station means that's the name of it's citizens.

Why are we not called Washington Dcians since our Capital is in Wash D.C.?

Or Italians not called Romans today?

//and the church (and its many names) predate that.//

Like Papist, Redneck, Taig, Mackerel Snapper, Left Footer, Fenian, and Creeping Jesus?
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/25/18


Good points Strong Ax
---Samuelbb7 on 9/25/18


Nicole_Lacey:

By that logic, all Protestants in the Reformation who broke from the Catholic church were right to do so, because they must also have been misled by the church that was teaching them.

The people IN MY CHURCH and all Catholic churches I grew up with used the term Roman Catholic. I NEVER heard ANY Catholics other than you complaining about others using the word Roman, unlike the N word which blacks everywhere consider a pejorative.

Wikipedia says Pacwa is bi-ritual, i.e. he can celebrate in both Roman and Maronite rites. The term is necessary to distinguish one from the other.

That's 2 against, and hundreds for. Can you cite any GROUP of Catholics who object to the term?
---StrongAxe on 9/25/18


Nicole_Lacey:

Instead of constantly crying in outrage about the use of the word Roman, why don't you do as I have repeatedly asked you do to, and show us any group of Catholics, other than you, who are offended by the term Roman Catholic?

The Vatican is its own country NOW, but that has not always been the case, and the church (and its many names) predate that.
---StrongAxe on 9/24/18


StrongAxe, obviously since you are no longer Catholic, you were misled in the name as well as in your Faith.

Again, Black people call each other the N word. So why can't you call them the N word?

Quoting someone DOESN'T mean you agree.

Why would a Pope or anyone EDIT a quote?

If edited It's NO LONGER a quote.

//I'm not calling YOU Roman, only the Catholic Church,//

REALLY?

I am part of the BODY of the CC!

Read Acts 9:4

//unless the church itself objects to the term (which it does not)//

How do you know? I already told you that Fr. Mitch Pawca on EWTN complained about Protestants using 'Roman'.

That's 2.

Now how MANY more do you need to stop?
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/24/18




Twisting words about THE TRUTH - some are here, but TRUTH always win and their false words - accumulating judgment from GOD - they are under their reprobation !

Why do the word 'Protestant' came about? . . . because of those receiving GOD'S SPIRIT AND DISCERNMENT of protesting and separating themselves from adulterous, idolatrous and blasphemous religion that trample upon THE LORD'S NAME AND HIS COMMANDMENTS - and under their spiritual darkness joke to make multitudes of souls - spiritual victims, Read again what GOD'S WORD say in Revelation about it, from T O T to T N T: "Terrible thing is to fall under GOD'S JUDGMENT for those that in spite of admonitions - they have chosen to follow the darkness instead of THE LIGHT!
---Melody on 9/24/18


Kathr: The POPE at the Vatican IN ROME represents the ROMAN CATHOLIC branch,//

WRONG!

The Vatican is itself it's OWN COUNTRY called Vatican City or Holy See.

Rome is a city in the country called Italy.

You all are ignorant about the subject and refuse to correct yourselves.


//if that's what you call it, that is overseeing churches all over the world affiliated with the Pope in Rome.//

See how you are mistaken?

BTW, Popes have been exiled to in Avignon, France for 70 years.

So do you think people were called Avignon Catholics' during that period? No.

Do you see how ridiculous this argument is becoming about an non-existing tile?

Only Protestants use this tile.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/24/18


Nicole_Lacey:

You wrote: ONLY Protestants calls us roman catholic.

NOT true. Growing up Catholic in the 1960s, we said Roman Catholic all the time.

VATICAN and all POPES.

NOT true. A Pope would not quote something theologically incorrect without qualifying it as such.

BTW, how MANY Catholics have to tell you to STOP calling us 'roman' to make you STOP?

You are the ONLY ONE who I have ever heard complain. Again, can you show any others? If it's only you, the outrage is not from "us" but only from "you". I'm not calling YOU Roman, only the Catholic Church, and unless the church itself objects to the term (which it does not), your outrage is misplaced.
---StrongAxe on 9/24/18


Encyclopedia Britannica.
Type following.
Roman Catholicism, Christian church that has been the decisive spiritual force in the history of Western civilization. Along with Eastern Orthodoxy and Protestantism, it is one of the three major branches of Christianity.

The Roman Catholic Church traces its history to Jesus Christ and the Apostles. Over the course of centuries it developed a highly sophisticated theology and an elaborate organizational structure headed by the papacy, the oldest continuing absolute monarchy in the world.

Is there a difference between Catholic and Roman Catholic?
No, there is no appreciable difference in common usage. Roman Catholic Church and Catholic Church are generally interchangeable when used.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/24/18


Catholics are associated with the Roman Catholic Church and are even categorized as such in many reference documents. Even the Yellow Pages lists catholic churches under the Roman Catholic Churches heading. If there were an issue the catholics would be up in arms.

Many catholics today try to disassociate themselves from the 'Roman' Catholic Church. Back in the 1950s, I attended St Bartholomew church. We associated ourselves with Roman Catholics. We lived in an Italian neighborhood consisting of all Roman Catholics.

There is also Epiphany Parish, a parish of the Roman Catholic Archdiocese of Chicago, and also St. Ladislaus, and the list goes on.
---Steveng on 9/24/18




"The blind leading the blind".

- and true Christians here that not only have committed their lives unto THE LORD but faithful to HIS WORD - use the Wisdom that GOD has given you and stop your foolishness of keep on giving THE TRUTH to those here that over and over despise and twist THE TRUTH as their 'mission' is to defend, cover and disguise the wickedness of those who are possessed by 'adulterous, pagan religions' that desecrate GOD'S PRECEPTS and attack openly those who stand by GOD'S TRUTH - as GOD'S WORD says: "Leave them"!
---Melody on 9/24/18


StrongAxe: the only outrage I have seen that "Roman is a name that isn't right" is yours.//

ONLY Protestants calls us roman catholic.

If you ask someone their faith, they say 'I am Catholic'. NOT 'roman catholic'.

//Can you point to other Catholics who believe this?//

VATICAN and all POPES.

You still haven't given me a citation of the Vatican calling itself 'roman catholic'.

Not a citation of the Vatican or Pope quoting someone either.

As I said before, the Vatican quotes EVERY single word. We DON'T change history.

We even quote misspelled words and bad grammar.

BTW, how MANY Catholics have to tell you to STOP calling us 'roman' to make you STOP?

2, 10, 35?
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/24/18


It has nothing to do with being Roman. Not all Southern Baptists are SOUTHERN. Not all Northern Baptist's are NORTHERN.

There are also AMERICAN CATHOLICS, who are not affiliated with Roman Catholics. So let's say there was child molesters found in the American Catholic Church.....does the Pope get involved? NO. Yet all these cases in our country of all these molestations , The POPE of ROME is the last buck. Not the Pope of the Orthodox either.

The POPE at the Vatican IN ROME represents the ROMAN CATHOLIC branch, if that's what you call it, that is overseeing churches all over the world affiliated with the Pope in Rome.

Why is that so hard to grasp?
---kathr4453 on 9/24/18


Not all Catholics are Roman. There are several non-Roman Churches in communion with Rome, including Maronites, Byzantines, Melkites, and Copts.
---Johnny74 on 9/23/18


Nicole_Lacey:

MANY Native Americans, Asians, and blacks complain about Indians, Orientals, and N word, yet the only outrage I have seen that "Roman is a name that isn't right" is yours. Can you point to other Catholics who believe this?

Also there are many diffrent Catholic churches (e.g. Polish National Catholic).

I showed you where a POPE favorably quoted an archbishop and SAINT using the term, implying approval. Black leaders never favorably quote someone using the N word.

Typical Democrat.

Excuse me? What does rudeness have to do with Democrats? See my last comment on "Should Christians Carry A Gun" about rude Republican attitudes towards women about rape.
---StrongAxe on 9/23/18


StrongAxe: You are the first Catholic I have ever heard who objected to the phrase "Roman Catholic"//

???

So because you are not around Catholics who didn't confronted you, it's okay to call them a name that ISN'T right? Is that your point?

A Native Americans NEVER tell me to stop calling them Indians. I know better.

Asians didn't have to tell me NOT to call them Orientals. I know better.

Black men call just other the N word, would you use the N word?

//this isn't a matter of accommodatin Catholics, but rather, accommodating one single Catholic.//

We are 1.3 Billion and the Vatican doesn't use the word 'Roman'.

You as well want to be mean and rude.

Typical Democrat.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/21/18


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Nicole_Lacey:

You wrote to Samuel: So why do you REFUSED to accommodate Catholics?

You are the first Catholic I have ever heard who objected to the phrase "Roman Catholic", so this isn't a matter of accommodating Catholics, but rather, accommodating one single Catholic.
---StrongAxe on 9/11/18


Nicole, just keep in mind as well, those Jews saved before any RCC came along were NOT called Protestants. Just like today, as a Jew is saved today exactly as a Jew was saved then, Is NOT a Protestant. So it is with many. Today one can become saved and secure without any issues and just be a Chriatian. Protestant means to PROTEST CATHOLICISM, which was a big deal during the time the RCC was in power murdering anyone who did not submit to them. Those churches still alive today would be Protestant.

I protest Mormonism , JW! Etc too, but only in doctrine. That too does not make me a Protestant. So Im not a Protestant Nicole, I'm a Christian.

So NO not 2nd. IM FIRST. To the Jew FIRST, and the to the Gentile.
---kathr4453 on 9/11/18


Nicole, as you so arrogantly tell Protestants they are 2nd, let me remind you of what God said....YOU were grafted into the olive branch WILD AGAINST NATURE. You were NEVER one of the natural branches. So again we see you are 2nd. The Gospel has been accepted by individuals in ALL 12 Branches of Israel and scripture states WE are the Elect of God according to the election of GRACE, and has NOTHING to do with any denominational church or RCC.

You really must re-visit Romans 11. And heed the warning about being broken off for lets see...arrogance and ignorance.

I hate to have to put you in your place, but feel it's about time someone did. If anyone has a problem with this, you too read Romans 11. I didn't say it, GOD DID.
---kath4453 on 9/11/18


So Nicole, you then claim that the works of the church or your parents saved you..correct? What's wrong with "much late" or as a person who's own personal FAITH has made the decision? So is thereever any instances where a baby baptized in the Catholic Church , who say....grows up to be a murderer, etc, say, ...like those in the Mofia, where the majority are Catholic. Do they lose their salvation, OR as long as they confess their murders and theft on a regular basis, remain saved?....As long as They remain in the Catholic Church?
---kathr4453 on 9/10/18


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Samuel: Protestants do realize that they are telling the RCC which was part of the first church.//

Trust me not all.

Samuel you are not charitable as you think.

You are mean and rude in a way.

You know that I keep telling you that as a Catholic we don't use the word 'Roman' in front of CC.

But you don't care you keep using that word.

When Black people asked everyone to STOP calling us 'Colored', people stopped.

You wouldn't dare call a Black person 'Colored' because you understand it is hurtful.

When Indians said to call them Native Americans you agreed.

Illegals asked to be called undocumented instead of Alien.

So why do you REFUSED to accommodate Catholics?
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/10/18


Nicole Protestants do realize that they are telling the RCC which was part of the first church that they are wrong. That is why we are Protestants.

By the way the RCC was part of a universal or catholic church until they split with the Orthodox. In 1054. Both have equal validity to claim themselves as the first church. The Roman Pontiff was not in charge of the Orthodox churches ever.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/10/18


Samuel, I agree, however it does matter what one is putting their faith in. If you say Jesus, but deny He is the Son of God, or that he died for our sin, it's not genuine faith. So to an extent it is important to know some doctrine. Even the man who died next to Jesus said 1) LORD, 2) remember me when you come into your Kingdom. So here we have two points of Doctrine..1 that Jesus IS LORD, and 2) that to even know re Kingdom, he must have heard about it.

FAITH COMES BY HEARING THE WORD OF GOD which is doctrine....the Doctrine of Jesus Christ.

Many try to imitate Jesus but only see Him as a man, and think that is enough. WRONG?
---kathr4453 on 9/10/18


Kathr: Yes, there are those too that think because they were baptized as babies and belong to the right denomination....try to recruit for their church, rather than share the GOOD NEWS.//

Nooooo, I DON'T think, I KNOW I was SAVED when I was Baptized as a toddler (late, but thank God they didn't much later)

Not a denomination but to a WHOLE Church.

You see, you keep calling yourself a denomination because you don't realize you are admitting you are part of a whole Church.

Look up the word denomination.

As Protestants don't realize that that word means they are 2nd.

Protesting against the 1st.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/10/18


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Dear Kathyr

People can put their faith in Jesus and still be ignorant of many truths. The Thief on the cross didn't know much doctrine. But he trusted Jesus.

When the church was all Jewish they still had a lot to learn. Which is why we have the letters of Paul.

But Christians will exhibit two main point. They will love GOD. They will love others. Read Matthew 25.

We are saved by Grace not doctrine.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/10/18


StrongAxe: You wrote: I said to be a Church you have to be ALL Sacraments. The Catholic church teachis this, but others do not.//

Of course NOT. If they believed that they would be Catholic or Orthodox

NOT A RITUAL. That's like saying the Resurrection was a ritual.

We got the number of 7 because there were ONLY 7 mentioned in the Bible.

2 for Protestants because you ONLY practice 2 of the 7 mentioned in the Bible.

I even said that non-Christian have 1 Sacraments because they practice marriage.

How can the CC dictate to others? Because we FOLLOW the teaching of Jesus.

If anyone said Jesus rose on the 5th day would you not CORRECT him? Why?

Because the Bible states He rose on the 3rd day.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/10/18


It's impossible to put your faith in Jesus Death And resurrection life, KNOWING our faith is faith that He died for our SIN, KNOWIN that faith is turning from sin to God, that it's impossible to have faith without repentance. It's a simultaneous act that happens at the same time.

And the only ones who think they were born saved and don't believe in witnessing are Calvinist's. Yes, there are those too that think because they were baptized as babies and belong to the right denomination....try to recruit for their church, rather than share the GOOD NEWS.

But I doubt they are saved to begin with Steveng. Those TRULY SAVED by the Grace of God, or CROSS, know the truth and do witness.
---kathr4453 on 9/10/18


Nicole wrote: "Okay explain God Saving someone who HASN'T repented?"

Christians today are making the same mistake the Hebrews made when God chose them to spread His word throughout the world. They didn't, thinking it was only for them.

Christians today are making the same mistake - thinking that everlasting life belongs only to them. Remember, there are two resurrections - one for the christians only and the other resurrections for all others who will be judged from the book of life according to their works - some to everlasting death and some to everlasting life.

Blessed are those that rise in the first resurrection.
---Steveng on 9/9/18


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Cluny:

You wrote: kathr, don't you think that the church you attend is the only true Church? If you don't, why do you attend it at all?

Most people don't demand exclusivity from most things in their lives. Most people are willing to eat at a restaurant, despite realizing that other good restaurants exist. They just happen to like theirs better.

Jesus' true church is not a building built of human hands, and is not confined by artificial boundaries of man-made organizations. There are members of it in many places. In the final judgment, many will be surprised by who is included and even more surprise by who isn't.
---StrongAxe on 9/9/18


Nicole has made some outlandish claims ...one that she answered David about confession, that ONLY a Catholic or Orthodox priest can forgive sin,
And two, about sacraments ...of which the word "sacrament" is not even used in scripture, Nor does scripture teach anything of the sort that the RCC teach about sacraments.

So it is Nicole who is saying the Catholic/ Orthodox Church ( same in many ways) is the only true church.)

The ONLY TRUE CHURCH is the Body of Christ, those baptized into His death and raised up together with Him, and of the same Spirit baptized into Christ..... These can come from any denomination .....or no denomination at all.
---kathr4453 on 9/9/18


\\Kathr: You however are in bondage to some false notion that the Catholic Church is the ONLY true church.//\\

kathr, don't you think that the church you attend is the only true Church?

If you don't, why do you attend it at all?

According to Christ's own promise, the true church has to be there somewhere.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/9/18


Nicole_Lacey:

You wrote: I said to be a Church you have to be ALL Sacraments.

The Catholic church teachis this, but others do not. The Bible nowhere teaches that there is some particular type of religious ritual called a "sacrament" that is qualitatively different from all others, nor that there are a small specific number of them nor that you have to believe in them.

How does the Catholic church get to dictate to all other churches who is and who is not an actual church? This is just as presumptuous as those evangelicals who declare that Catholics aren't "real" Christians, or those pseudo-Christian cults who say the same of everyone who isn't a member of that same cult.
---StrongAxe on 9/9/18


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Kathr: You however are in bondage to some false notion that the Catholic Church is the ONLY true church.//

There you go again, misquoting me.

I never said the ONLY true Church.

I said to be a Church you have to be ALL Sacraments.

You only have 2 Sacraments (Baptism if said in Matt 28:19 and Marriage.) In fact every religion has the Sacrament of Marriage.

And I know I didn't say Only in the fullness because Orthodox has all 7 Sacraments as the CC.

I said everyone Saved is through the Graces given to the Catholic Church by Jesus.

//NO TRUE CHURCH MOLESTS KIDS AND COVERS IT UP. It's demonic.//

So by that logic your Church isn't a true Church and demonic.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/8/18


Kathr, 1. All Churches had Pastors who molested children and covered it up.

2. My analogy was directed to a Melody as she directed to me. Are you suggesting I personally molested children?

3. What deep roots?Also, how dumb is it to claim child molestation is in our doctrine.

Whenever people break away from the Catholic Church they in turn force their OWN members into non bible restrictions.

No alcohol, dancing, or playing cards. Women can't cut their hair, wear pants, make up or jewelry. All not in the Bible and in the Protestant camps.

Cult like churches came FROM the Protestant Camp.

Like cults with self contain compounds in Texas, Utah, and Colorado.

Those spring out of your neck of the woods.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/8/18


kathr4453:

As Cluny has also previously pointed out, It's not only the Catholic church that has covered up for crimes that its own have committed against children (and sometimes others). The same have also happened among protestant churches as well, and not only by clergy, but sometimes entire congregations as well. I read a story only last year about a woman who was raped by a pastor, and when she brought it before the church, the whole congregation sided with the pastor against her and threw her out.

Google: Ken Engelking
(I am not sure if this was the same case, or just a similar one).
And how could anyone forget the PTL scandal?
---StrongAxe on 9/8/18


Melody
Just so you understand, since we have never really engaged in any CN dialogue before, I find 99% of Church doctrine unbelievably foolish. And I try to point the foolishness out, hoping to make folks feel so foolish they leave these doctrines, and learn from Gods Holy Spirit,......as God intended.

I searched for God, off and on for many years in church. And I found him in the last place I looked,...down on my knees. I wasnt looking for salvation, I didnt really know what I was looking for. In the months that followed, with no doctrinal interfere, I discovered the incredible Grace of God. And I love to guide folks to that pathway, so that they may discover for themselves, the treasure that I did. (Matthew 13:44)
---David on 9/8/18


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Nicole, your analogy was perfect if your analogy equates the Catholic Church doctrine and deep roots in child molestation having hundreds of thousands in that kind of abuse and bondage for who knows how long to,the same kind of abuse you suggested some cult like NON Protestant NON Christian cults pretending to be Christian churches act, as yes, I'm sure there have been. But as I said, RUN WHILE YOU CAN AS FAR AWAY FROM THESE CULTS AS POSSIBLE.

I so love FREEDOM to chose who and how and with whom I worship with. You however are in bondage to some false notion that the Catholic Church is the ONLY true church. NO TRUE CHURCH MOLESTS KIDS AND COVERS IT UP. It's demonic.
---kathr4453 on 9/8/18


Melody here's an admonition for you. Be careful when inferring that any sharer on this forum is a fool. Lest you yourself appear foolish. Only the Father is qualified to make that distinction, for only He knows the heart and mind of any of those who profess Jesus as lord. That profession in and of itself shows Intelligence.
---joseph on 9/8/18


Melody, did a Priest or a Nun hurt you?

If so let me on behalf of the Catholic Church extend to you our deepest apologize for any injustice done to you.

I truly mean it.

God bless you

PEACE
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/7/18


"To those who have an ear to listen to GOD'S GUIDANCE".

"Don't become a fool, by discussing with a fool that is 'set on his ways' - but listen to GOD'S ADMONITIONS and acquire Wisdom by departing for his presence" - now and forever . . . Melody

And as GOD'S WORD admonishes us: "Don't give the pearls to the swine (those that prefer the muddy waters =) - for if you do, they'll throw them back at your face". . .
---Melody on 9/7/18


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Melody: Nicole shows what drives her by her with no remorse wicked false accusatory words against others and this is a very serious issue//

Here we go again!

I told you before you can't insult people and NOT except a response

You said I was GOING to HELL.

I started my response SAYING this was an ANALOGY how one feels with your TYPE of comments.

You make an out right comments against character my soul saying I worship idols and the like. Then you finish the insults by condemning me to hell.

I don't know you and you DON'T KNOW ME.

Too emotional.

I ignored you as you talked around me. Finally you addressed me and I assumed you were capable of having a spirited debate.

I guess not.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/7/18


"To those who have an ear to listen to GOD'S GUIDANCE".

"Don't become a fool, by discussing with a fool that is 'set on his ways' - but listen to GOD'S ADMONITIONS and acquire Wisdom by departing for his presence" - now and forever . . . Melody

And as GOD'S WORD admonishes us: "Don't give the pearls to the swine (those that prefer the muddy waters =) - for if you do, they'll throw them back at your face". . .
---Melody on 9/7/18


Nicole shows what drives her by her with no remorse wicked false accusatory words against others and this is a very serious issue - just as she did against me - she should be reported!!! - this kind of evil talk and attacks against others (a false testimony is a very serious issue) and in this Christian blog should not be permitted and necessary to put to A STOP! - Proverbs 28:4
---Melody on 9/7/18


Kathr: your analogy is nuts//

No, what's nuts is that I have to let you know I am going to speak in an analogy term.

//Even if someone found themselves in a cult like your description of an oppressive abusive cult....(you do not describe Christianity)//

Now you see how crazy you all sound when you claim I am worshipping statues and being a witch.

I am glad you are opening your eyes and realize how wrong you have been.

//Your analogies have cognitive issues in it. You make up the most bazaar off the wall outrageous things to,say as though it were normal every day life.//

My analogy was towards you and Melody way of thinking.

Keep lying on me and I will continue with my analogies.

Understand?
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/7/18


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Nicole:

Who are you talking about on promoting those evils? - is that the way you try to cover up your open rebellion against true Christianity and that is based in GOD'S WORD? - by insulting and throw false testimonies against others? - (just as you did in your last message against me) - but you cannot absolve yourself of being propagating false doctrines that only lead to perdition: Your false accusatory words clearly shows where you are spiritually and GOD is judging you for that and someday you'll recognize it with sorrow and regrets: "Everything shall pass away but not HIS WORD" - and wickedness GOD despises!
---Melody on 9/7/18


Nicole, your analogy is nuts. Even if someone found themselves in a cult like your description of an oppressive abusive cult....( you do not describe Christianity) ..and that person finds their way OUT of that cult, they still have NOT left the LIVING GOD, and PRAISE GOD The Living God has not left them, but delivered them OUT of such bondage.

Your analogies have cognitive issues in it. You make up the most bazaar off the wall outrageous things to,say as though it were normal every day life.
---kathr4453 on 9/7/18


Steven:

Study The Bible and then you'll accept the Truth in that:

THE LORD said: "Absent from the body, present with THE LORD" - of course HE is referring to those of HIS OWN - those who have been saved before leaving this physical body . . . study The Bible and you can find more Scriptures in relation to who is there right now - instead of contradicting The Scriptures!
---Melody on 9/6/18


Melody: by the worshipping of 'other gods'/images/idols/ (as is your constant advocating) - this person can go through whatever rituals, but by remaining in something that is totally offensive to THE LORD that person has chosen her own separation from THE LIVING GOD!//

HEADS UP EVERYONE: ANALOGY COMING.

Like you promoting men to beat their wives if they speak out in Church.

Or beating your children with a rod until they bleed so they will die a Christian.

And you promoting stoning women for adultery outside the city gates.

So in your great words:
"..but by remaining in something that is totally offensive to THE LORD that person has chosen her own separation from THE LIVING GOD!
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/6/18


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Also remember no one in the OT (see Hebrews 11), were water baptized for salvation. Yet we see they are saved. They put their faith in Jesus Christ...looking forward to the cross
. God didn't ADD something to salvation. He is explaining that on the resurrection side of the cross, being raised up together with Him, having our conscience purged from dead works by the blood of Jesus Christ, (Hebrews)...that our life IN the risen Christ is what saves us completely OSAS. It's finished.
---kathr4453 on 9/6/18


This is what Peter said, and we see Noah and his family never got wet. However they were SAVED by being secure inside the ARK. We are baptized INTO CHRIST, OUR ARK, and are saved by His Resurrection life, just as Peter said. Romans 6 also clarify.



1 Peter 3:20-21

20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
---kathr4453 on 9/6/18


Close Cluny but look at the surrounding words and point.

1Pe 3:21,22

There is also an antitype which now saves usbaptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, angels and authorities and powers having been made subject to Him.

Peter says Noah was saved by the ark. Now baptism following Jesus by Grace. Baptism is not the water but the Grace given to us. We are to pray to Jesus. That is what Peter teaches.
---Samuelbb7 on 9/6/18


Melody: because if someone has not totally repented before THE LORD and obtain salvation . .//

I think you made a mistake in your sentence. Because you said 'not totally repented' (no such thing as 'totally'. Either you repented or not. Such as pregnant or not.)

Next you said 'obtain Salvation'.

Okay explain God Saving someone who HASN'T repented?

//Matthew 28:20: "And to observe all that I commanded you"//

You SKIP V19. Baptism FIRST! and obedience 2ND.

You are ASSUMING the person AFTER being baptized will NOT OBEY. WHY?

I guess since Jesus placed baptism 1ST AND Obedience 2nd, shouldn't you?

BTW, you will NEED the GRACES from Baptism to OBEY JESUS.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/5/18


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\\
You said: "Only baptism save us" - wrong you are!!! \\

Melody, St.Peter said, "Baptism now saves us."

Who's right--you or the Bible?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 9/5/18


"...the thief by THE LORD'S side was not baptized and went to Heaven that very same day when he died..."

No one is in heaven - not even to this day. Where was Jesus that same day and two days after?

As for "the sinner's prayer." This prayer is memorized from the mind, not the heart - just as the Lord's prayer. It is written not to repeat prayers in vain like the heathen do.
---Steveng on 9/5/18


Melody:

The Sinner's Prayer itself is not "God's Word", because it does not occur anywhere in the Bible.

I used the words "magical formula prayer" (specifically in quotes) because many evangelicals believe saying the Sinner's Prayer somehow "magically" saves you - like it is some ritual with supernatural magic powers. However, it is NOT the Sinner's Prayer itself that saves us, but faith in Jesus. Saying the Sinner's Prayer is merely a manifestation of that faith, not the faith itself.

Those who believe that the words themselves have some kind of magic saving power are, in fact, committing idolatry.

You also presume to know all about me, telling me to do something I did over 40 years ago.
---StrongAxe on 9/5/18


Nicole:

You said: "Only baptism save us" - wrong you are!!! - because if someone has not totally repented before THE LORD and obtain salvation . . . baptism won't have any power to save him, and better discern exactly on the verse that you mentioned = Matthew 28:20: "And to observe all that I commanded you" - it means: Totally repentance and commitment is required by THE LORD - if someone gets baptized but is trampling upon GOD'S COMMANDMENTS by the worshipping of 'other gods'/images/idols/ (as is your constant advocating) - this person can go through whatever rituals, but by remaining in something that is totally offensive to THE LORD that person has chosen her own separation from THE LIVING GOD!
---Melody on 9/5/18


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Melody, Mark 16:15-16 He (Jesus) said to them, "Go into the whole world and proclaim the gospel to every creature.
Whoever believes AND is BAPTIZED will be saved, whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Matthew 28:19
Go, therefore and make disciples of all nations, BAPTIZING them in the of Fathers, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit.
V20 teaching them to observe all that I commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, until the end of the age.


All those Words but not anything about the Sinner's Prayer. Why? It's a new concept. Not Jesus'concept

BTW, if the Sinner's Prayer is needed to go Heaven,why didn't Jesus speak of it esp. Before returning to His Father?

Only Baptism save us.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/4/18


Axe:

You said it right - for what an offense is to use 'magical formula prayer' in reference to Christianity: Stop your constant derogatory words against the Christian faith and those who stand for it, and once you accept that you are a sinner and your prayer in repentance before THE LORD (yes - the sinner prayer and using your own words - THE LORD understand different ways of communication into the same subject) - you'll recognize where you are spiritually and not ambivalent and in between here and there and under a constant mood of contradicting the truth: It's foolishness for any man to try to fight and challenge GOD'S WORD - 'A forever loss"! :-(
---Melody on 9/4/18


Strongaxe, to cause to stumble in the context of Mat 18:6 is to cause or entice to sin. To allure or tempt by flattery, which implies willful Intent on the part of the flatterer.
---Josef on 9/4/18


Josef Heres another one. ( 2 Peter 2)1 Yes David, as I mentioned earlier, What man can say with a certainty that anything that another teaches or believes is a mistake, beyond their denying or rejecting the Lord that bought, or redeemed them? and as I said to Strong axe There is a big difference between an honest mistake in doctrine, or a simple misunderstanding, and a malicious intent to deceive, or to cause someone to stumble That which is occurring in 2 Peter 2, I consider willful and malicious. Don't get me wrong David, I know that there are those that the Father considers false teachers, just as I know that only the Father is in any position to judge them. However, I wasn't referring to those in my post to you.
---Josef on 9/4/18


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Josef:

It says "causes to stumble". It doesn't distinguish whether such a cause was deliberate or accidental.


Melody:

There are many examples in scripture of people being saved, and of things that one must do do be saved. However, there is no one single "magic formula" prayer anywhere in scripture that sums it all up in one simple neat package. This is what the Sinner's Prayer does, and the use of such formulas is relatively recent. Another one is, "Do you accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your personal savior?", which also does not appear in scripture (and neither does the phrase "personal savior").
---StrongAxe on 9/4/18


Nicole:

Your blasphemous words against THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL so offensive are and may THE LORD under HIS MERCY make you realize that and the reasons that you are and propagating such falsehoods and putting your soul at stake and blind about it!

You said: "The sinners' prayer 'a new concept' (and you add caps to emphasize that) that started in the late 18th century - 1800 years after CHRIST death" - where did you get this information - (if not from the spiritual darkness where you are?.

What did THE LORD say from the very beginning? = "Repent and be saved" - and how does this come about if not by 'the sinner's prayer'? - why not start doing that now while still time for you to do so??
---Melody on 9/4/18


Josef
Heres another one.
( 2 Peter 2)1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction. 2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways, by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. 3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.
---David on 9/4/18


David, your comment on 9/2 I totally agree with. I have met several people through out the years who claimed they were saved at a Billy Graham crusade. One is my best friend and her husband, who will tell you they were not, but thought they were. Also during his crusades, he sends folks right back to the very churches they came from, where the Gospel was never preached in the first place.

Graham only preached half a gospel, and there is no such thing as getting half saved.
---kathr4453 on 9/4/18


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Salvation comes to the soul when under true repentance came before THE LORD and by accepting GOD'S GIFT OF SALVATION only through HIM!

Baptism cannot do anything to anyone if that person has not been saved (as some false doctrines teach and 'by doing this or that') . . . the thief by THE LORD'S side was not baptized and went to Heaven that very same day when he died - baptism by immersion it's just an open testimonial toward others of our own salvation and commitment unto THE LORD!
---Melody on 9/3/18


Strongaxe this goes without saying, but I will state it anyway. There is a big difference between an honest mistake in doctrine, or a simple misunderstanding, and a malicious intent to decieve, or to cause someone to stumble, which is what the verses you quoted address.
---Josef on 9/3/18


Josef:

You asked: where in scripture is it written or implied that mistakes made, or misunderstanding concerning the teaching of doctrine will condemn the teacher to hell?

Matthew 18:6 (and similarly Mark 9:42 and Luke 17:2):
But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.

(i.e. the penalty for this is WORSE than the death penalty. Use your own imagination.)
---StrongAxe on 9/3/18


"If Jesus Christ...alone...can save us, why did Paul teach it is by Grace we are saved?" Because David, it is though the direct divine inspiration, influence, and favor of the Father that we are given both to repent and to believe or to rely on, adhere to, and trust in the one sent to secure salvation.
---Josef on 9/3/18


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David where in scripture is it written or implied that mistakes made, or misunderstanding concerning the teaching of doctrine will condemn the teacher to hell? And why would you label one who may or may not have made a mistake, a false teacher? What man can say with a certainty that anything that another teaches or believes is a mistake, beyond their "denying or rejecting the Lord that bought, or redeemed them"? To apply such a label is to say that one knows all, and that shows that one knows nothing at all, as he or she should. It is'nt for anyone to attempt to judged the servant of another.
---Josef on 9/3/18


Folks
Are we saved by Grace...or...
are we saved by Jesus Christ?
If Jesus Christ...alone...can save us, why did Paul teach it is by Grace we are saved?
---David on 9/3/18


StrongAxe: As James wrote, we are not saved works,//

WHAT? No where in James did he say we are NOT saved by works.

NOT BY FAITH ALONE are we Saved James 2:24 Just as Jesus said in Matt 25.

Not Faith Alone came from Jesus in Matthew 7:20 "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord, will ENTER the Kingdom of Heaven, but ONLY the one who DOES (WORKS) the Will of my Father who is in Heaven.

Luke 6:46-47 "Why do you call me, 'Lord, Lord' and do NOT do what I say? As for everyone who comes to me and hears my Words and puts them into PRACTICES..

Standing in front of a large crowd isn't the works Jesus is asking of us. In fact if that's all they do they are the ones Jesus condemns to Hell in Matthew 7:22-23
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/2/18


David:

As James wrote, we are not saved works, but works demonstrate our faith. Standing up in front of a large crowd to make a public declaration requires a great deal of bravery and a great deal of faith. Doing so doesn't "magically" give you faith or save you - it just demonstrates that you already have the faith, and it's strong enough to act upon.
---StrongAxe on 9/2/18


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David - from Christian to Christian if by THE LORD'S GRACE on us - HE knows better!

I don't need to review any of his past videos: HE preached salvation through our LORD JESUS CHRIST only and as you said it, if he ever mentioned works .. . well - this is the meaning of truly being Born Again as some believe that if you 'just believe in THE LORD' - they can go on living a sinful life (deceive they are and how many false/adulterous religions are given the souls this 'sugar coated - false gospel') and not realizing that under judgment they are!

It's a shame that constantly here, some people use it to bring condemnation to others but ignoring their own failures and faults!
---Melody on 9/2/18


David, Graham believes the start of Salvation is the sinner's prayer. CC believes Baptism

He knows you can't sustain Salvation by prayer.

Read the Epistle of James. You can't not tell someone keep warm and eat and you KNOW they don't have the means to keep warm and eat doing nothing. James 2:16

You must do works by giving them clothing and food because works is in our Faith. James 2:17

James is following Jesus in Matthew 25.

Catholics believe Baptism is the gate of our Salvation.

Besides if you don't agree with Catholics, please explain the sinner's prayer which ISN'T in the Bible?

Also the sinner's prayer was a NEW concept that started in the late 18th century. 1800 years after Christ's death.
---Nicole_Lacey on 9/2/18


Melody
Many folks accepted Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior at Billy Graham revivals.I just watched a video of a Billy Graham revival. Listen to his invitation to accept Jesus Christ at the end of his sermon. He told them they needed to do three things to be saved, and if they did these three things, they could be assured of their salvation.

I do not believe you can save yourself by doing these three things. Do you? Forget the rest of the sermon...though it was a good message. Just concentrate on the invitation and you can clearly see he taught salvation by Works...though he denied this, you can clearly see it in his invitation.
---David on 9/2/18


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