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Where Did Jesus Come From

Some believe Jesus was created. What scriptures support this view?

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 ---kathr4453 on 11/23/18
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Protestant means to protest Catholicism. Before there was a Catholic earthly church with a non scriptural pope, there were Christians. Many Protestant churches still teach many false Catholic Orthodox etc doctrine like infant baptism, as did Calvin, who I also disagree with. Many Protestant churches still keep the Sabbath. So it's very shallow to assume one is Protestant without fully understanding it's roots. I'm also not Calvin OR Arminian....however you spell it. You don't have to be one or the other.
---kathr4453 on 12/14/18


A new creature in Christ is neither Jew Gentile male female Catholic Protestant or any earthly human labeling Cluny wants to give you...or David for that matter. Galatians 6:14-18. Remember 1 Corinthians 3 show you to be still carnal minded. I didn't say it, God did. So address your catty comeback to Him.
---kath4453 on 12/14/18


\\
David, I'm not Protestant. \\

So are you a Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, or Assyrian?

All that's left are the ancient Christological heresies.

Be specific, kathr.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/14/18


Hebrews 1-2, show in the OT God sent Angels as messengers to communicate between God and man. Gabriel was the messenger to Mary concerning Gods will. So no I don't believe Michael in Daniel is Jesus....he's Michael, the Prince given over Israel to protect Israel even to the end as Rev shows.

TODAY we have the resurrected Jesus Christ, the only Begotten SON OF GOD, not an angel or created being, as the intermediate between God and man...as the letter to Timothy also clearly point out.

When Adam fell, intimate fellowship between God and man ended. SIN separated man from God. Jesus took our sin paying the penalty of separation and judgement so that we can come to the Father to again have intimate personal fellowship with Him.
---kathr4453 on 12/14/18


David, I'm not Protestant. And your condescending comment that my beliefs do not come from the Lord that comes through scripture is laughable if you claim yours comes any differently.

Everything I know I already stated comes from being totally surrendered Romans 12:1-2 to first be able to KNOW the perfect will of God, which is His truth, revealed to those who earnestly seek to KNOW the truth studying as well rightly dividing the word of Truth, with a sincere heart without prejudice ....by faith as the Lord reveals to those who take part in the fellowship of His Sufferings. Philippians 3.....you also scoff at.

Your condescending remarks only show your arrogance, pride...we KNOW GOD RESISTS the proud.
---kathr4453 on 12/14/18




David, you also need to be careful and know that no scripture is of private interpretation. That's a dangerous place to be. You have already denied the doctrine of the CROSS as we have discussed before, you avoid like I've never seen anyone do, and make up scripture and doctrine like crowns you WANT others to just PRETEND they are on Michaels head so you can WHAT????? Come up with your own doctrine not seen by anyone but you? That's not how it works David. And then you insult those who don't see what you want to think you see ????

That's not how it works David.

I showed scripture supporting everything I said.....and you showed nothing, and still argue and insult ?

Not interested in your kind of debate.
---kath4453 on 12/14/18


David, I'm asking again what faith are you affiliated with?---kathr4453

Kathryn
I have no affiliation with any doctrine founded by men.
My doctrine?
I discovered the Truth by following Gods Holy Spirit. A Truth well documented and founded upon the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

You believe you have found the Truth in your doctrine, so your search has never really began. Kathryn, Seek your truth from God. I hope one day you will go back and drink the milk of the Lords Gospel, instead of choking on the epistles of Paul.
---David on 12/14/18


David, I'm asking again what faith are you affiliated with? I don't know of any mainstream churches who consider Angels as kingdoms, except maybe Mormons? And your fascination with Angels??? My blog question was about Jesus asking any supporting scripture saying Jesus was created, which there is not. Interestingly you want to turn the blog around to some idea you want to supporting Daniel in a light that seems to be in support of something else. Possibly hoping others will see a crown where there is none on Michaels head? Proving what exactly? You once took a jab at my very grounded Protestant doctrinal beliefs, suggesting you are not Protestant and we know you are not Catholic....so what is left? Mormon perhaps?
---kathr4453 on 12/13/18


Here's more insight we see of this unseen world and our world. The 7 Angels over the 7 Churches in the first three chapters of Revelation. Also note Rev 2:12:14 re "even where Satans throne is" showing even today there is this spiritual warfare over us. This will all come to a head when the beast ..anti_Christ comes and is defeated once and for all. Men will be judged, including all those who worshipped the beast , and those who throughout the Great Tribulation remained faithful to God.

Then the Kingdom of this world WILL be Christ's who will reign on earth for 1000 year as was foreseen in Rev 11:15. Satan will be bound, and after 1000 years loosed again for a final showdown....then the great white throne judgement.
---kathr4453 on 12/13/18


There really isnt any evidence to show an absolute truth on this topic. So anything we say is subjective, which keeps a conversation from becoming an argument.
---David on 12/12/18

David, there are many scriptures to show evidence of truth on this topic. Not that one wants an argument, but only to allow the Word of God to keep one on the correct course of truth. Study to,show yourself approved rightly dividing the Word of Truth David. All truth has supporting scriptures in 2-3's. Scripture teaches scripture as the Holy Spirit our teacher will show to those who earnestly want the truth without prejudice , willing to have a teachable spirit , believing BY FAITH all the Lord reveals to a sincere heart.
---kat453 on 12/13/18




Here's more insight we see of this unseen world and our world. The 7 Angels over the 7 Churches in the first three chapters of Revelation. Also note Rev 2:12:14 re "even where Satans throne is" showing even today there is this spiritual warfare over us. This will all come to a head when the beast ..anti_Christ comes and is defeated once and for all. Men will be judged, including all those who worshipped the beast , and those who throughout the Great Tribulation remained faithful to God.

Then the Kingdom of this world WILL be Christ's who will reign on earth for 1000 year as was foreseen in Rev 11:15. Satan will be bound, and after 1000 years loosed again for a final showdown....then the great white throne judgement.
---kathr4453 on 12/13/18


In conclusion: before God created man , Satan and 1/3 of the Angels fell. Satan then entered the Garden of Eden in the form of a serpent enticing Adam and Eve to sin, where sin entered the world giving Satan and fallen angels dominion over the world, where REDEMPTION of Jesus death and resurrection also included the redemption of this world...as Romans 8 also tell us...and after all is said and done, there will be a NEW Heaven and Earth, as Revelation also show, where sin will never enter in as it was allowed before. There is no sun, moon, sabbath keeping, no 24 hours etc etc. So just make sure you all understand the 1000 year reign on earth will have days sun moon etc, as Colossians 2 and Zechariah 14 show is not the NEW Heaven and earth.
---kath4453 on 12/13/18


David to be more specific, I look at Luke 4:5-8 where Satan promised to give Jesus all the kingdoms here if Jesus would bow down and worship him. Jesus didn't rebuke him and say...you have no such power over any kingdoms. Jesus knew one day all would be His, as we see in Revelation 11:15, when this war in the heavenlies is fought and the Kingdoms ARE NOW, the Kingdoms of our Lord and Christ. I believe these heavenly kingdoms now are satanic powers and principalities strongholds over all nations in this world. As Christians today we too war against these powers and principalities, called spiritual warfare. We are called to OVERCOME ....re. Ephesians 1:18-23, Colossians 3:1-4 In contrast to Ephesians 2:1-6 just to name a few.
---kathr4453 on 12/12/18


David, I don't believe the Kingdoms are angels. Satan didn't promise Jesus angels. I simply believe prince means head of and over the unseen world that also includes this world until Jesus second coming.
---kathr4453 on 12/12/18


Kathryn
I asked the question, as you appear to have guessed, because of the use of the word Prince in Daniel. The book of Daniel implies, the kingdom in Heaven was once much like the ones God established here on Earth. If these kingdoms in heaven are angels, what position in this hierarchy do you think the Sons of God held?

There really isnt any evidence to show an absolute truth on this topic. So anything we say is subjective, which keeps a conversation from becoming an argument.
---David on 12/12/18


I believe "prince" here means having power and dominion over principalities , nations, etc, as we see Satan as " prince " and power of the air, which may mean the whole world. Remember Satan on the desert testing of Jesus promised Jesus these Kingdoms if Jesus would bow down to him. So Prince in their realm is order of power. Even fallen angels are called prince of this or that. There will be in the last days war in the heavens as well as on earth. But again no Scripture ever says any wear crowns.
---kathr4453 on 12/11/18


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David, what do you think? 1st they are with satan, 2nd, its not Sons but sons, lower case, and we have in Luke3:38 where Adam is also referred to as the son of God, again lower case.

Now Job shows the sons of God with Satan, who has already fallen coming together before the throne of God. Is that even possible for fallen humans to be able to present themselves before Gods Throne with Satan? Satan said he came from walking to and fro from the earth...so it would appear the sons of God came from there too???? How did they get there? answer is they all still had access to Gods throne UNTIL Jesus death and resurrection. Humans did not.

BUT none of the above are ever referred to as the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD.
---kath4453 on 12/11/18


David, why are you changing the subject? Deflecting here? Or are you too saying Jesus is Michael? Michael is NEVER referred to in scripture as the Son of God, with a capital S. Or Son of Man
---kat4453 on 12/11/18


Kathryn
The Bible mentions The Sons of God in (Job 1:6). Do you believe these Sons of God, mentioned, are Angels too?
---David on 12/11/18


David, Daniel 10:20 use prince twice, Prince of Persia and Prince of Greece and not referring to men, but Angels of high rank as well. Daniel 10:10-21 is war between holy and unholy Angels. Ephesians also say Satan is the prince and power of the air. He didn't loose his princehood title or whatever when he fell, and No scripture says Satan / Lucifer has or ever had a crown. Wasn't he considered the highest or possibly equal to Michael?

You shouldn't read things into scripture that is not there.
---kathr4453 on 12/10/18


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Seeing there are billions probably of Angels to begin with, any we know with names, as Lucifer, Michael or Gabriel must be pretty high up in rank. Lucifer was the highest, yet never said to be an archangel that I can find.---kathr4453

True, but the Michael in (Daniel) is said to be...a Prince. Can you show me an Angel in the Bible given this same designation?
---David on 12/10/18


Some of us don't believe Angels wear crowns simply because scripture never supports it. What we do know is, God has forbidden us to worship Angels or even bow down to them, as we see in Revelation as well. Yet we see those bow to Queen Elizabeth and Royal family.

Crowns are given to US, the OVERCOMERS as rewards. We overcome through Jesus Christ, because we are IN CHRIST. Angels are not in Christ either.

And there is no proof that Michael and Michael in Jude are two different beings. Seeing there are billions probably of Angels to begin with, any we know with names, as Lucifer, Michael or Gabriel must be pretty high up in rank. Lucifer was the highest, yet never said to be an archangel that I can find.
---kathr4453 on 12/10/18


Some of you bring up the issue that Angels dont wear crowns. I can only assume you bring this up, because Michael in the book of Jude....is an Archangel.

Personally, I dont see any evidence Michael in the book of Daniel and Revelation, is Michael.... the Archangel, written about in the book of Jude.

When I read Jude, Jude appears to designate his Michael as an Archangel, simply so folks dont confuse him with the Michael written about in the book of Daniel. Notice the designation of Archangel, is not given to the Michael written about in Revelation or Daniel.
---David on 12/9/18


I believe 'prince' is used as a metaphor. Like when some call their boyfriends: their knight in shining Armour. As an example that he protects her. ---Nicole_Lacey

I can see why you might believe that, in accordance with the verse I gave you. Here is a better one, which shows Michael is a Prince.

(Daniel 10:13) But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me, and I remained there with the kings of Persia
---David on 12/9/18


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No scripture supports Angels wearing crowns or sitting on thrones. And just as the Royal family and members ONLY are given crowns etc, doesn't mean they are given to any other than family. We are sons through Jesus Christ making us family, and above the Angels who are there as ministering spirits for us.

We the BOC, the OVERCOMERS are promised crowns at our Judgement. And we see in Corinthians WE also will judge Angels .....AFTER ....so to even assume without any proof Angels are given crowns before any judgement much less at all , which no scripture supports, is FABLES AND FAIRY TALES kinda stuff people make up out of their fantasy imagination.
---kathr4453 on 12/9/18


Cluny: As dukes, Princes Henry (to use his proper baptismal name), Andrew, and William, as well as Charles and Philip wear ducal coronets (literally, "little crowns") on official occasions.//

Nice to know.

I also remember seeing Princess Eugenie wearing a crown on her wedding day.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/8/18


\\
Does Prince Harry, Andrew and his daughter have crowns?

They all have the tiles without crowns it seems.\\

As dukes, Princes Henry (to use his proper baptismal name), Andrew, and William, as well as Charles and Philip wear ducal coronets (literally, "little crowns") on official occasions.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/8/18


David: wouldnt you agree that Michael, being a Prince, probably wears one too? (Daniel 10:21)//

No. I believe 'prince' is used as a metaphor.

Like when some call their boyfriends: their knight in shining Armour. As an example that he protects her.

Prince, as a title that the person is that kind specialty to them.

He is my Prince.

Besides, I don't think all the Britons' Princes and Princess wear crowns or have been given crowns.

I find this interesting. (About the royalty in Britain.)

Does Prince Harry, Andrew and his daughter have crowns?

They all have the tiles without crowns it seems.

I going to look that one up.

BTW, I only know of humans wearing crowns, not angels
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/8/18


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No, because we know his name and it isn't Word of God. Nicole_Lacey

Nicole
True, if the rider in (Chapter 19) is the same rider in (Chapter 6).

Plus St. Michael doesn't wear crowns.--Nicole_Lacey

There are many who wear crowns in the book of Revelation. Wouldnt you agree that Michael, being a Prince, probably wears one too? (Daniel 10:21).
---David on 12/8/18


I find no Bible verse that supports Jesus being created.

But I do find some support. for Michael being a title of Jesus in the Old Testament. This is very controversial. Since many try to make Jesus an angel based on this. But Wesley and Calvin both believed and taught the Trinity. But believed it.

Jesus is GOD the son. Second person of the TRinity.
---Samuelbb7 on 12/7/18


David: But I now believe the rider of the white horse might be Michael.//

No, because we know his name and it isn't Word of God.

Plus St. Michael doesn't were crowns.

Rev 19:12-13 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.

//Notice it is the Lamb in (Revelation 6:1) who opens the seals that releases the horses, and the Lamb is still opening seals after the white horse is released.//

No, I believed there were only 7 Seals. The Seventh Sealed was opened in Chapter 9. Chapter 10 starts the Scroll and then later on the Trumpets.
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/7/18


I believe the Man on the White Horse is Jesus---Nicole_Lacey

Nicole
Recently I thought so too. But I now believe the rider of the white horse might be Michael.

Notice it is the Lamb in (Revelation 6:1) who opens the seals that releases the horses, and the Lamb is still opening seals after the white horse is released.

If the Lamb is Jesus Christ, could he be the rider of the white horse? This information may lead to an interesting study for both of us.
---David on 12/7/18


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Sorry David, I misread your question. I thought you were saying Jesus didn't have a sword.

I know St. Michael isn't Jesus.

I believe the Man on the White Horse is Jesus
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/6/18


Php 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Php 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
Php 2:8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
Php 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name:
Php 2:10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth,
Php 2:11


---jerry6593 on 12/6/18


Kathr4453 said, "Why do people believe fairy tales and fables over the Word of God?"

Good question, Kathr!

I have always asked myself the same question, and the first thing I ask is "Is there any sort of belief in fables or fairy tales within me?"
---Monk_Brendan on 12/3/18


(Daniel 12:1) And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.

Notice in the above passage, Michael is not called the savior of his people. But it does suggest, he will be with the Savior during the second coming.
This coincides with our knowledge that Jesus will come with an archangel in (1Thessalonians 4:16).

Nicole
I dont understand the point you are trying to make. Are you trying to show evidence Michael and Jesus are one and the same?
---David on 12/3/18


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David, Rev 19:11-17 has a archangel shouting:

11 I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and wages war.

12 His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13 He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14 The armies of heaven were following him,...

15 Coming out of his mouth is a sharp SWORD with which to strike down the nations...

17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun, who cried in a loud voice to all the birds flying in midair, Come, gather together for the great supper of God,
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/2/18


David, don't forget that Jesus said, "I came not to bring peace, but a sword.---Cluny
Jesus is called Prince of Peace because no one can defeat Jesus nor try to wage war after His 2nd coming.---Nicole_Lacey


True, but who is wielding the sword, Jesus or Michael? The Bible says Jesus will return with the shout of an archangel. (1 Thessalonians 4:16). Isnt it feasible to assume,....Michael is that archangel?
---David on 12/2/18


If Michael and Jesus were the same person, then there would be no need to have Jesus named Jesus...He would have been named Michael.

And yes Michael was and again will be a Warrior Angel concerning the Nation of Israel, just as Daniel shows, reiterated in Revelation.
---kathr4453 on 12/1/18


David: Besides, Michael is shown to be a warrior, not a Prince of Peace.//

I don't understand. Are you saying because St. Michael waged war he can't believe in peace?

By those standards you can't believe Jesus is the Prince of Peace either.

Revelation 17:14

Jesus is called Prince of Peace because no one can defeat Jesus nor try to wage war after His 2nd coming.

Thus Peace
---Nicole_Lacey on 12/1/18


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David, don't forget that Jesus said, "I came not to bring peace, but a sword.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 12/1/18


Personally, I think if Michael and Jesus were the same person, the Bible would have said so. Besides, Michael is shown to be a warrior, not a Prince of Peace.
---David on 12/1/18


John 17:5 - And now , O Father glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was,
---RichardC on 11/30/18


Samuelbb7:

Colossians 1:16 (KJV):
For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

(NWT):
because by means of him all [other] things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All [other] things have been created through him and for him.

JWs insert [other] twice to support their theology. They used to include it in [brackets] to show it's not in the original, but now they even omit the brackets.
---StrongAxe on 11/30/18


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In Protestant history there have and continue to be two views on Michael.

Many view him as the preincarnate Jesus who is GOD the son Second person of the Trinity.

Then there are the JW who don't believe in the Trinity and so consider him to be created.

But the Bible states Jesus created all things. So how could he create himself?

John 1:1-18 Says the word is GOD the word is Jesus. Read Psalm 2.
Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
---Samuelbb7 on 11/30/18


Not compelling at all for those who understand, which only comes to those who are in the Spirit and not on the flesh, as the natural mind cannot understand spiritual things. All prophecy is spiritually discerned. And Jesus. Said I AM THE RESURRECTION AND THE LIFE.

MICHAEL in the OT has always been shown to watch over earthly Israel. That's all that Daniel is saying, where we also see in Rev the Angels are very active in end times activities as Daniel is prophecy about end times activities. Michael even in Revelation is NEVER said to have the name or title " THE WORD OF GOD"
---kathr4453 on 11/30/18


This is why the JWS believe what they believe about Michael. Im not a JW, but the scripture is compelling.

(Daniel 12)1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament, and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
---David on 11/30/18


WOW Strongaxe, more awesome scripture right under our nose too. But as you probably know, those who disagree will say that's not what that verse means, bla bla bla, and that you've twisted it out of context, bla bla bla.
---kathr4453 on 11/30/18


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Note that Michael is an archangel - this means he's a highest among the angels, but still an angel. If Jesus were Michael, Jesus would be an angel. We are supposed to worship God, and we are NOT supposed to worship angels. This makes it impossible to be both God and an angel.

Colossians 2:18 "Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels..."
---StrongAxe on 11/29/18


Jude 1: 9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

This should clear things up....two entirely different beings. So Michael IS NOT LORD, nor claimed to be equal to in power or authority even dealing with another angel, a fallen one called the devil, aka Lucifer/ Satan.
---kathr4453 on 11/29/18


\\
He IS the Archangel (Commander-in-Chief of the angels) Michael\\

The Logos never was before His Incarnation, nor after it when He is known as Jesus, known as the Archangel Michael.

This is the original teaching of Christianity.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/28/18


jerry6593:

You wrote: He IS the Archangel (Commander-in-Chief of the angels) Michael that will blow the trumpet that raises the dead at His second coming.

Jehovah's Witnesses and SDA may teach that Jesus is Michael, but scripture never says that.

No mere created angel can do that.

How do you know that? Scripture isn't terribly specific about exactly what powers angels do and don't have. It mentions some things they can do, but isn't an owner's manual.
---StrongAxe on 11/28/18


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I agree with Cluny. Jesus was NOT created. He is the eternal God, one with the Father and Holy Spirit from eternity past. He is the Creator that breathed life into Adam. He was the Law-Giver on Mt. Sinai.

He abandoned His exalted throne in Heaven to take the form of man that He might pay the price for our sins with His own blood.

He IS the Archangel (Commander-in-Chief of the angels) Michael that will blow the trumpet that raises the dead at His second coming. No mere created angel can do that.


---jerry6593 on 11/28/18


Kathr, I don't know.

I think Mormons believe they were brothers.

I know Mormons believe God was a man first and then became God.

They believe men can become a god and rule over plants.
---Nicole_Lacey on 11/24/18


Nicole, thank you for clarifying this. As we see, Hebrews 1-2 ABSOLUTELY say Jesus is NOT an Angel. So we have again even more supporting scripture that their Jesus is not the Jesus of scripture. Also Angels can't bleed, nor can they die. And Angels were all subject to sin and fall as we see 1/3 did.

I didn't know JW's believed this. Are they the ones who believe Michael and Lucifer were also brothers? One cult I believe teaches this.
---kathr4453 on 11/24/18


There are a lot of people who believe a lot of things that have absolutely zero support in scripture, and many things that are flat-out contradicted by scripture, but they don't let inconvenient things like the Word of God affect their pre-conceived beliefs.

Some even alter the Word of God to suit their theology. E.g. Jehovah's Witnesses believe Jesus was a created being but not God, so they alter Collossians 1:16 to show this: "because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth...". They used to put [other] in brackets to indicate that it isn't actually present in the original Greek (like KJV uses italics), but when you look at their official web site, they don't even do that any more.
---StrongAxe on 11/24/18


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Joseph, JW believe Jesus is St Michael. So since St. Michael is an angel he is created.

Many of my Hispanic side of the family are JW. They told me the Scriptures that supports that theory but I forgot the Passages.

I explained it was false.

A JW can cite the Passages when asked.

Of course, that means Jesus isn't God to them.

And they believe St. Michael is the highest Angel in Heaven. I had to explain he wasn't but they didn't believe me.

---Nicole_Lacey on 11/24/18


For those who say John 1 is a typo or mistake concerning the WORD and that God is really "a god" fail to see that other scriptures show this to be false.

Only GOD can create as well, as no angels or Adam who was created could in turn create, again another statement not supported by scripture. And no scripture says God CREATED The Word, and gave Him the power to create.

Why do people believe fairy tales and fables over the Word of God?
---kathr4453 on 11/24/18


What scriptures support this view? None. Scripture supports His birth. I understand the Logos, (the Father's Divine uttered expression of Himself) to be brought forth of the Father, just as the word of man is brought forth from within man. The Word of the Father was brought forth, or uttered at the beginning His creation. When His Word was conceived, to be brought forth through the preternatural influence of the Holy Spirit, and born of Mary, (made tangible to man), she was instructed to call His Name Jesus. That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled [is] the Word of life. This is the manifestation of the Lord Jesus, The Christ.
---joseph on 11/24/18


None.

The Logos was eternally begotten of the Father.

At the Incarnation, the Logos took our entire human nature from the womb of the Virgin, and was only THEN given the name Jesus.

Those who say the Son was created hold to the ancient heresy of Arius, which was condemned at the Council of Nicea.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 11/23/18


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