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What Is Purgatory

What is purgatory? Is in the bible or is it a money making doctrine?

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 ---mike on 2/7/19
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\\ purgatory is used to make money - 'as soon as the coin in the coffer rings, the soul out of purgatory springs'. indulgences can save you.
---mike on 2/17/19\\

As I said earlier, this abuse was suppressed by the Council of Trent.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/17/19


Mike, how would the Church know when to collect money from me when I said the Rosary? I offer up something unpleasant?

//- 'as soon as the coin in the coffer rings, the soul out of purgatory springs'. indulgences can save you.//

Meant 'can't' instead of 'can'?

How does the Church know I'd took did indulgences practices?

You don't know how praying for the dead operates, but still want to comment on it.

You assume wrongly.

I never called my Church's office to report my weekly Rosaries said for my decrease Loved Ones. Donuts I didn't eat, TV shows I didn't watch and good works completed for someone in purgatory. So that they can calculate each item and send me a bill.

Seriously?
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/17/19


purgatory is used to make money - 'as soon as the coin in the coffer rings, the soul out of purgatory springs'. indulgences can save you.
---mike on 2/17/19


Again Nicole, your post is rediculous. There is no scripture to back up your FABLE, and God only saves tnrough Jesus death and resurrection. Only those written in the Lambs Book of Life.

You are a heretic of heretics.

Just because you know about the birds and bees, doesn't make you an expert on SIN, or how you THINK God works. No one here supports your THEORY FABLE FAIRYTALE, except those of your CULT.

Also Mary is asleep in the Lord, not floating around space talking to anyone. THAT is a demon.
---kathr4453 on 2/17/19


Kathr, I must address the lies you planted into my mouth.

//There is no such thing as God BLOCKING SIN in someone's sperm.//

A sperm ISN'T a person.

Refresher course: Human fertilization is the union of a human egg and sperm..The process of fertilization involves a sperm fusing with an ovum--Wikipedia

//it can't be blocked, there are no vaccines for it.//

Wrong analogy.

Vaccines do not BLOCK viruses, but TEACHES the body how to FIGHT the viruses after it ENTERS the body.

That's the problem with your thinking. You think God can only SAVE ONE WAY. God can only Save someone AFTER they have been injured.

Preventing an injury doesn't constitute Salvation to you. OPEN YOUR MIND! 1 Cor 1:25
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/16/19




John: Nicole said, "Then how do you explain "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" rm 3:23."//

You are mistaken.

I didn't ask that question, Chria did.

//But did you continue readingto verse 28??//

But I did read up to 28 (29).

That's seems to be about another matter.

Works from Faith isn't the same as Works from the Law.

Works from Faith is like the (works) children/fruit from the Faith. A natural outcome from Faith.

As a natural outcome when a marriage couple have relations.

Works from law is different in that a person only does the work to prevent from being punished. 1 John 4:18
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/16/19


Nicole said, "Then how do you explain "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" rm 3:23."
But did you continue readingto verse 28??
---john9346 on 2/15/19


There is no such thing as God BLOCKING SIN in someone's sperm. That's hilarious. First Nicole needs a lesson on exactly why SIN is. It's not a NOUN, it can't be blocked, there are no vaccines for it.

The only way for God to have a sinless Mary, would be to form her out of the dust of the earth, like the first Adam, and breath life into her. Then God could take Jesus out of her side. Then the two could procreate starting a whole new sinless race, where Mary could then be called the NEW Mother of the Sinless.

Come on Nicole....no scripture says BLOCKED or even suggests what you are saying. If it's that important God would have it recorded in scripture. You're now no different than Joseph Smith and his made up religion.
---kathr4453 on 2/16/19


Samuel: Why did Mary say GOD was her Savior if she didn't need a Savior since she was sinless? Luke 1:47//

Who said she didn't need a Savior?

Then how do you explain "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" rm 3:23

Chria: Me - She needed God to block the Original sin.

Isn't that saving her?//

Yes, that's what the CC been saying all this time.

//"And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Mk 10:18//

Are you saying Jesus didn't think He was good?

//"Surely there is no righteous man on earth who does good and never sins." Ec 7:20//

Ecclesiastes was written before Mary and Jesus were born.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/15/19


\\Why did Mary say GOD was her Savior if she didn't need a Savior since she was sinless?\\

You don't think it was because she walked down the aisle at her local synagogue and and asked YHVH to come into her heart as her personal savior, do you?

You're reading these words through an American evangelical filter.

In Judaic thought, one is saved and redeemed by being one of the saved and redeemed people, NOT because of a person spiritual decision.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/15/19




Why did Mary say GOD was her Savior if she didn't need a Savior since she was sinless?

Luke 1:47

And my spirit has rejoiced in God my Savior.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/15/19


Nicole,

"Not ONLY did God block the Original Sin HE infused so MUCH GRACE that Mary NEVER SINNED."

Then how do you explain "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God" rm 3:23

"Surely there is no righteous man on earth who does good and never sins." Ec 7:20

"And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Mk 10:18
---chria9396 on 2/15/19


Remember David couldn't build God a Temple because of bloodshed. 1 Chronicles 28:3

Even though God forgave David and cleaned him. It wasn't enough.

But God did allow David's son WITHOUT bloodshed to build Him a Temple a dwelling place for the Most High.

Why would you expect God to just clean Mary moments before Jesus dwells in her?

God wouldn't want anything different for His ONLY BEGOTTEN SON.

Remember, David only wanted to BUILD a Temple for God.

Not a palace for them both to live TOGETHER.

But, to YOU it's OKAY for God to live in the SAME place with a HUMAN cleansed moments earlier?

GOD IS HOLY, HOLY HOLY.

He deserves a BRAND NEW PLACE. Not a Place that had SIN dwelled before Him.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/15/19


StrongAxe, if you keep pulling blind people from a hole you saved them. But if you stopped someone a blind person from falling into the hole, didn't save her as well?

Only the method of saving changed.

As for Jesus, I guess you are asking why not get rid of the sin moments before Jesus entering Mary's egg?

I will give you an analogy.

A person has 2 plates.

1st plate new. 2nd had feces on it, but sterilized and made just as new.

No differences between the 2 in cleanliness.

Which one would you choose to eat your food from and please be honest. I would want the 1st.

So why are we asking God to do that which we do not wish to do ourselves?
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/15/19


Here's the thing ..."sin". is not some GERM, that was blocked from this one or that one. Just like those who say sin dies, which is wrong, we die to sin....Mary inherited DEATH, from Adam 1 as we see Mary DIED. If God BLOCKED sin from entering Mary or what ever.... Mary would still be alive today.

And there is NO SCRIPTURE supporting Nicole's FairyTale.

Eve is STILL the Mother of the living, as all human life still proceeds from Adam and Eve.

Our NEW BIRTH ...SPIRITUAL BIRTH comes from GOD....and Mary has no part of that. Mary is not part of the Trinity. And her children she had after Jesus was born are not in my Geanology or Nicole's.
---kathr4453 on 2/15/19


What a whopper Nicole just told here. It's time for little girls to grow up and put the FairyTales away.

What Nicole and her CC or whatever is pushing is what we call IDENTITY THEFT. It's using Jesus and Mary's name, but is not the Mary and Jesus of scripture. And the one who stole this identity and is pushing this LIE is the Father OF LIES...SATAN.

Now Nicole thinks it's cute and thinks she's doing God a favor, but she's doing Satans bidding, by getting you to believe in someone with Jesus Name, but not the actual Jesus.

Also since the CC doesn't believe in the Finished works of Christ.....added to this horrible cult......it's just more insult to injury.
---kath4453 on 2/15/19


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StrongAxe, because of the Original sin God had to infuse His Grace immediately at the point of her father's seed entering her mother's egg. AT THAT MOMENT God blocked the sin from entering Mary's soul. Immaculate Conception.

Not ONLY did God block the Original Sin HE infused so MUCH GRACE that Mary NEVER SINNED.

Thus providing a PURE BODY for Jesus when the Holy Spirit overshadowed Mary when was 14

Blocking the original sin WASN'T enough. An Abundance of Grace given from God prevented Mary from sinning EVER.

Did you know her parent's names combined means?

Father: Joachim - God will provide

Mother: Anne - Grace.

Put them together and you get: God will provide Grace.

INDEED HE DID IN MARY
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/14/19


Nicole_Lacey:

You keep missing the point. The doctrine of the Immaculate Conception doesn't say Mary was "purified" from sin. It asserts that Mary herself was CONCEIVED without sin. She never needed to be purified from sin - she was born without it in the first place. This meant that God somehow performed a miracle that allowed her to be born without the sins of her parents entering into it.

But if he could do that for Mary, why couldn't he have done it for Jesus? What made it NECESSARY to do that for Mary? And if that was necessary for her, wouldn't it also have been necessary for HER mother, and her grandmother before her, etc. all the way back to eve?
---StrongAxe on 2/14/19


Samuel, the CC never and doesn't believe that unbaptized babies goes to hell.

Plus, why do Protestants keep saying that babies don't commits sins?

Who said they did? Not the CC.

Only Protestants make up this straw man to knock it down.

Why?

Just move to original sin. That will suffices.

StrongAxe, Hebrews believed life was in the blood. Abraham's blood in their veins. Life promised by God with His Covenant made with Abraham. Genesis 17

So that's why Jesus said in John 6:53 you have to Eat and Drink His Body and Blood to have ETERNAL LIFE.

Jesus only had Mary's blood that came from Abraham from Adam.

So that's why God had to purify Mary's blood line at her conception.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/14/19


Nicole_Lacey:

No. Immaculate Cenception is. I'm saying the exact opposite. Mary HAD to have inherited Adam's curse via her father. The only three who did not do so were Jesus (his father was God), and Adam and Eve (not born).

Regardless of WHEN life starts, everybody else inherits it from both their human parents, with all the baggage that goes with it.

If God had to make Mary sinless in order to provide a sinless body for Jesus, why did he not ALSO have to make Mary's mother sinless in order to provide a sinless body for Mary, and Mary's grandmother sinless in order to provide a sinless body for Mary's mother, and so on, all the way back to Eve (who was NOT sinless, proving the original premise absurd)?
---StrongAxe on 2/14/19


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Nicole, Eve had relations with the first ADAM and is called the mother of all living. Eve did not give Adam 1 life. How is Mary equated to Eve? Eve had relations with Adam 1.... So who is The Last Adam? It's YOU who make this vile equation by making some comparison NOT THERE .

God gave Adam 1 life . THe WORD made flesh,already existed. So Mary did not give GOD life Nicole. So she is not, nor does any scripture say Mary is NOW the mother of the living. She was the mother of Jesus made Flesh. Jesus died, and GOD raised Him from the dead...the FIRST BORN Of all creation. Mary has nothing to do with my first birth or second birth.

It's YOUR analogy that is VILE Nicole. NO DOCTRINE says what you are saying.
---kathr4453 on 2/14/19


Samuel, I believe Romans 5 give an excellent account of sin, death, etc. scripture does not say in Adam all sin, it say in Adam ALL DIE. because of Adams sin, we all inherited DEATH the moment we were born.

Jesus came to give us LIFE out of death. There are no exceptions. Mary inherited DEATH, and also because the LAW revealed sin, Mary was a sinner. Where there was no Law..that is between Adam and Moses, sin was not imputed, HOWEVER death still reigned because of Adams sin.

Our fallen nature separated us from God and the Glory of God....as scripture says ALL HAVE SINNED AND FALLEN SHORT OF THE GLORY OF GOD. .
---kath4453 on 2/14/19


I do not believe in the Augustine doctrine of original sin. To be guilty of a sin. You have to commit a sin. Babies are bent toward sin but since they have never committed a sin. They are not guilty.

That is why we don't baptize infants to keep them out of hell. True we are born in sins of our parents. But a person cannot be guilty of a sin they never committed.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/14/19


StrongAxe, as to Kathr's vile statement I want to reason with you.

When you read Gen 3:20 Adam called his wife's name Eve, because she was the mother of all living.

Did it EVER across your mind that it meant Eve had relations with her sons?

EVER?

I KNOW NOT.

To most DECENT people it hadn't either.

So I said Mary was the mother of the living because of Matt 1:16.

I CLARIFIED myself again when Kathr got it wrong. In 'Penalty For Sin Is Death' Blog. Read our blogs

I said Mary was the TRUE mother of the living. Because JESUS give us LIFE and Mary is His mother.

So when you compare Gen 2:20 to Matt 1:16 you see the connection.

Only a FILTHY MIND like Kathr THINKS otherwise.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/14/19


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StrongAxe: Sin was transmitted from the father, via direct descent through Adam.//

Adam is the original because Eve wasn't created from dirt but from Adam. If Adam DIDN'T eat the fruit ONLY Eve would die. Another woman would be created from Adam's bone

Anyway, Mary's father is Joachim. You are not suggesting that fathers DON'T transmit sin to daughters?

By your logic Mary would have obtained original sin.

Unless you do claim daughters are skipped. If not thus my question

//How could SHE be born sinless if her MOTHER were not sinless,//

Life doesn't START at birth as our society loves to claim.

Life starts at conception.

Thus, God had to act FIRST with Mary before providing a Body for Jesus.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/14/19


'Maccabees' and other writings - they are not part of The Scriptures and made up by those who have been deceiving the souls into false and idolatrous doctrines of which (no matter how they denial and cover up) in judgment they are - for who can dare to play spiritual games' with THE LORD? . . . well = "The blind leading the blind" . . . and together on the road that will lead them astray from THE LORD in Eternal Life if they don't recognize their slavery and submission to wicked doctrines!
---Melody on 2/14/19


Good point Strongaxe. Now the "caduceus", is not the serpent God asked Moses to make. And the healing in whe desert was for something God inflicted on those who rebelled, SINNED against Him, it wasn't some special medical whatever carried around for sickness SYMBOLIZING HOW WONDERFUL DOCTORS WERE. This can be shown in John 3:14-17.

The "caduceus" is something altogether different and also part of Greek mythology . To say they are the same thing is exactly mixing paganism with the Word of God. It's exactly what the RCC did to get the Greeks to convert to Catholicism, by replacing Diana with the Virgin Mary.

I stand by my comment.
---kathr4453 on 2/14/19


Nicole_Lacey:

Sin was transmitted from the father, via direct descent through Adam. Since Jesus' father (God) was not decended from Adam, Jesus did not inherit Adam's sin.

But your question brings out the whole logical inconsistency of the Immaculate Conception doctrine. If Jesus could not have been born sinless if his mother had been sinless, wouldn't the same apply to Mary as well? How could SHE be born sinless if her MOTHER were not sinless, and so on as far as Eve? If God was able to "bend the rules" to make Mary sinless, why could he have not been able to do so for Jesus?


kathr4453:

In Numbers 21:8-9: God had Moses make a brass serpent, to heal those who looked at it.
---StrongAxe on 2/13/19


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Melody, you have to stop this sensitivity attitude esp. with your own verbiage.

You can't punch not expecting a punch back. Matt 26:52

(I us 2 swords on CN :D Thus I am not SURPRISED when people stab ME 20 times a day.)

Anywho

//as she was a devoted woman but still, one born from the original sin as everyone else - for THE LORD was THE ONLY ONE born without sin//

Not, quite right according to your own standards. Adam and Eve were not born, but they were sinless for awhile.

As for Mary, I already KNOW you don't believe in the Immaculate Conception.

(At least you believe in the Original Sin transmission.)

Please answer the question how Jesus obtained His Body from Mary WITHOUT original sin?
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/13/19


Only in your dreams Cluny. The serpent God asked Moses to make out if bronze was never two serpents intertwined surmounted with wings. That goes back to Greek mythology, which much of the Orthodox and RCC are intertwined with, including the virgin Diana, Mary was intertwined with. Is this your nonbiblical junk you all continue to incorporate into Scripture?

Thanks for clarifying that...which many of is already know. Mixing paganism with Christianity is an abomination to the Lord. Just ask Solomon!
---kathr4453 on 2/13/19


Cluny:

Yes. I was just thinking about this yesterday, in the context of this particular discussion.
Despite the Decalogue's condemnation of idolatry, God himself occasionally did use iconic symbols - the Serpent in the wildneress, the Cherubs on the Ark of the Covenant, etc. and these were not considered idolatrous the same way the Golden Calf was.


Nicole_Lacey:

She EXPLICITLY said otherwise, and "yuck!". However, that absurd idea is one conclusion one could reach from the premises that "Jesus is ths Son of the Father" + "Mary is the Mother of God" + "Jesus is God".
---StrongAxe on 2/13/19


nicole said, "I keep telling you I and other Catholics are NOT worshiping Mary nor statues, but you for some reason what to BELIEVE I am. Why? (2nd question)

Because the following is worship my friend:



Hail, holy Queen, Mother of Mercy! Our life, our sweetness and our hope! To thee do we cry, poor banished children of Eve. To thee do we send up our sighs, mourning and weeping, in this valley of tears. Turn, then, most gracious Advocate, thine eyes of mercy toward us, and after this our exile show unto us the blessed fruit of thy womb, Jesus. O clement, O loving, O sweet Virgin Mary.



---john9346 on 2/13/19


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Count me among thy most devoted servants, take me under thy protection, and it isenough for me. For, if thou protect me, dear Mother, I fear nothing, not from my sins, because thou wilt obtain for me the pardon of them, nor from the devils, because thou are more powerful than all hell together, nor even from Jesus, my Judge himself, because by one prayer from thee he will be appeased. But one thing I fear, that in the hour of temptation I may neglect to call on thee and thus perish miserably. Obtain for me, then, the pardon of my sins, love for Jesus, final perseverance, and the grace always to have recourse to thee, O Mother of Perpetual Help.

---
---john9346 on 2/13/19


Has anyone but I noticed that the serpent Moses lifted up in the wilderness was a caduceus?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/13/19


Nicole, it's you and your comment that Mary is the life giver that is not cute. Obviously you did not read, grasp, or comprehend the post. Trying to blow smoke and take it in another direction ONLY YOU did by your suggestion, I'm glad offends you, and maybe now you will REREAD and THINK THROUGH what I posted.

Mary is the mother of Jesus in the flesh. Mary is not our mother of the New Birth, because our new birth is not one of the flesh....Mary is NOT the mother of our NEW BIRTH in the Spirit. She is not part of the Trinity and never will be. We are hidden with God IN CHRIST sealed with the Holy Spirit. Mary has ZIP ZERO to do with my new Birth.

Get it now Nicole? Shame on you for your BLASPHEMY!
---kathr4453 on 2/13/19


Melody: you are even using GOD'S WORD for you to keep on promoting your worshipping of Mary//

???

1. I am NOT WORSHIPING Mary.

2. Are you talking about Numbers 21:4-9?

Well, please EXPLAIN IT if they are not worshiping the statue to you>

I used it because it perfectly describes our uses of statues.

Even Jesus used the statue to describe Himself. John 3:14

Just explain how you believe Numbers 21:4-9 is DIFFERENT than what we Catholics are doing with statues?

Simple question.

I keep telling you I and other Catholics are NOT worshiping Mary nor statues, but you for some reason what to BELIEVE I am. Why? (2nd question)

You made other statements without explaining WHY.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/13/19


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Kathr, SUGGESTING that Jesus our Lord and His Mother would have relations is SICK, A MORAL SIN, STUPID AND RECKLESS!

SHAME ON YOU!

You need to ask the Moderator to retract your statement immediately because many people read these blogs and many or NOT Christians at that.

You shamed our Christians faith and I am grieved that I am associated by your using my name at the top of your vile blog.

May God have mercy on you.

I should have NEVER started blogging with you.

I wish I didn't and ask God for forgiveness for starting talking to you again.

Kathr, you were not cute, funny or clever.

YOU WENT TO FAR!
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/13/19


Nicole, Because of Mary I am able to die with Christ( the purposes of Christ being made flesh, not only to take our sin but die in our place, but also to identify with Him in death.) Our Resurrection life IN CHRIST has to do with the Father ALONE, and being Born Again of the SPIRIT is not of Mary but of God ALONE. So AGAIN, GOD is the GIVER OF NEW LIFE IN CHRIST. And WE, the Bride of Christ are taken from His side, bone of HIS Bone, Flesh of HIS Flesh, just as Eve was taken out of the first Adam. Mary again is not the giver of THIS LIFE, just as Eve was not the giver of Adam1's life. Mary was not taken from Jesus side. And we are not the offspring of Mary and Jesus..YUCK

So yes I do actually get it. You sweety do not.
---kathr4453 on 2/13/19


So Nicole, on that last note, scripture has it explained very well, and there is no need to inject a false belief concerning our redemption IN CHRIST ALONE. So again, you are teaching another Jesus and another Mary, not found in scripture, but are using names in scripture to perpetuate your CULT doctrine, seducing people to believe in a false Christ, just as the coming anti_Christ will do. I do believe this is why so many believe the CC or RCC or whatever IS WHY many believe you all are that anit_Christ....meaning an imposter, not someone against Christ. "anti"_Christ means in place of. You doing it right now with this false Mary/Jesus doctrine. And look at all who swallowed this so easily.

REPENT while you can.
---kath4453 on 2/13/19


\\ Yes, THE LORD speaks to HIS Church through HIS HOLY SPIRIT \\

But not through you, Melody.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/12/19


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Nicole:
You are not only twisting my words, but you are even using GOD'S WORD for you to keep on promoting your worshipping of Mary (of course 'the one' and many others with different names that you and your religion have made her an idol, is not the one that is in Heaven, as she was a devoted woman but still, one born from the original sin as everyone else - for THE LORD was THE ONLY ONE born without sin and that through THE HOLY SPIRIT as HIM being GOD. The fact that she was chosen, didn't make her higher than any other human being, she didn't remain a virgin (as your religion has been deceiving multitudes) and into make her 'a goddess/idol' - repent while THE LORD is giving you time to do so and put away your sacrilegious beliefs!!!
---Melody on 2/12/19


Melody: Nicole: Yes, THE LORD speaks to HIS Church through HIS HOLY SPIRIT - not to the idolatrous one that not only twists GOD'S WORD but adds into that and defy IT by given glory to it's own blasphemous and false writings and in which they deceive the souls into spiritual slavery and separation from GOD: Read Revelation 22 for those like you, who have chosen to rebel and trample upon GOD'S HOLINESS AND HIS PRECEPTS!//

You would ALSO CONDEMN the children of God in Numbers 21:4-9!

Because you are relying on your OWN understanding.

You wish to be stubborn in your own thinking that isn't of God.

You are NOT ALWAYS right.

Let God be God and you be satisfied with being Melody.

Can you try that for a day?
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/12/19


kathr4453 said, "AND Then there are those who use their own words, not scripture, and use the Cross as a weapon to beat another black and blue with,..."

And then there are those who speak in biblical tones, and THUNDER what sounds like God's Word, but when looking it up, one finds that what they quoted is NOT the exact verse from the Bible. Those are to pitied and prayed for the most.
---Monk_Brendan on 2/12/19


There are those who preach the Cross, and let the Lord do His work through His Word, working in the mind and conscience of those who are open to the Spirit. ( the WORD OF GOD IS LIVING AND POWERFUL AND SHARPER THAN A TWO EDGE SWORD, piercing between soul and spirit, bone and marrow.......AND Then there are those who use their own words, not scripture, and use the Cross as a weapon to beat another black and blue with, ( much like Constantine's MO, that only ended in murdering one another) never true conversion.

Some think they are doing Gods work, but are not. They are actually a hindrance to those who do share the Gospel.
---kathr4453 on 2/12/19


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Melody, where did you get the delusion that you were "sharing the truth of the Gospel"?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/11/19


Cluny and Nicole:

No matter who shares THE TRUTH OF THE GOSPEL with you, you are so ingrained in your own false teachings that you will even come against this Christian site, no more discussion with you . . . and Nicole: Yes, THE LORD speaks to HIS Church through HIS HOLY SPIRIT - not to the idolatrous one that not only twists GOD'S WORD but adds into that and defy IT by given glory to it's own blasphemous and false writings and in which they deceive the souls into spiritual slavery and separation from GOD: Read Revelation 22 for those like you, who have chosen to rebel and trample upon GOD'S HOLINESS AND HIS PRECEPTS!
---Melody on 2/11/19


StrongAxe: why it was removed, you will find your post. It wasn't removed.//

The Moderator must have put it back in it's order.

When Cluny asked it wasn't there when I looked myself.

Good for them.

Thanks, Moderator.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/11/19


Cluny:

You wrote, on 2/11/19: Moderator, why was my posting about mass stipends removed?

If you scroll down to 2/10/19, 7 messages below where you asked about why it was removed, you will find your post. It wasn't removed.
---StrongAxe on 2/11/19


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Cluny: why was my posting about mass stipends removed?//

Because it was too RIGHT and TRUE.

Some Moderator what a false perception about Priests, so they can keep their kind of audience on CN.

You can't enlighten their minds and cause them to leave CN.


Melody: do you realize that you yourself have drop THE ROCK//

Good one and clever.

But, I use Scripture to back up my belief in God.

Not other people's opinions.

Do you ever wonder WHY you can't use Scripture against me?

Think about it.

Are you are strong and willing to follow God's Will and not your own?

Trust in Jesus and NOT in your own understanding.

Proverbs 3:5
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/11/19


I just read an article about sexual predation in the Southern Baptist Convention in the Houston CHRONICLE.

Seems all attempts at reform are being blocked.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/11/19


Moderator, why was my posting about mass stipends removed?
---Cluny on 2/11/19


Nicole:

Because you have rejected THE TRUTH and you have chosen to be an advocate for what THE LORD sees as abominable and under the spiritual darkness that you are, you have come to the point into defying GOD'S WORD by your own constant made up distortion of The Scriptures - do you realize that you yourself have drop THE ROCK and instead you have decided to carry your idols, and you along with them are toward the terrible judgment that awaits those that as you, have decided to follow the darkness instead of THE LIGHT - for no doubt as you openly express where you are - you have become reprobate by openly challenging and contradicting GO'S WORD with your own blasphemous confessions: Fear for your soul - for under judgment you are!
---Melody on 2/11/19


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There's no such thing as purgatory either Nicole, just more abuse, leading people to think if they pray hard enough or give enough money that will save a soul. WRONG.

You all just need to STOP YOUR LYING.
---kathr4453 on 2/11/19


Kathr, you are acting childish. I know about ABUSES in Protestants, Catholics, Muslims and etc.

I don't throw rocks from glass house.

So you need to DROP YOUR ROCK.

//SO Get real Nicole.//

I am real. I know about OUR PRIESTS who have to BURY your Dead for free.

Don't change the subject of your so called friends committing an adultery.

Besides you need to TELL them in America you CAN'T remarry if you are ALL already married.

You know 'Bigamy'?

//I'm sure if you were in charge would call the kids liars too.//

No, but I believe in Due Process.

Now are you calling the 2 Democrat women liars?
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/10/19


Like I said Nicole, just like there are pedophile's in the Catholic Church telling children WHO KNOWS WHAT, to take advantage of them, we already know about that now don't we??? There are also priests who try to pull things over on others in other situations. SO Get real Nicole. We already know the thousands upon thousands of kids telling the truth that I'm sure if you were in charge would call the kids liars too.

SHAME ON YOU NICOLE.

These kind of things go on in EVERY denomination PERIOD.
---kathr4453 on 2/10/19


Many on CN are making silly comments concerning Purgatory.

How can the Church KNOW how many prayers were said by someone in order to CHARGE him?

Or KNOW when someone mortifies themselves for someone else?

Not eating meat or chocolate is a sacrifice INSTEAD of dieting?

Do you see how ridiculous you sound when you claim the Church is being paid for souls being released from Purgatory?

As StrongAxe said, praying for the dead is in 2 Maccabees 12:40-45

If you don't have Maccabees in your Bible look at Luther not the CC.

John, what does 1 Cor 3:10-15 means to you?

We first point to Jesus' Words in Luke 12:59 and Matt 5:26

You didn't work for money while in Prison in Jesus' day.
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/10/19


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Kathr, you are listening to a much of lies that float around Protestant circles.

//a woman years ago who was Catholic, going through a divorce and wanted to remarry..She and her fianc//

Hellooo, that's ADULTERY!

Requiring CONFESSION

//paying some Catholic priest large sums of money for some precedure to get the first marriage annulled, as there were no children.//

1. Priest DON'T grant annulments. Only Bishops.

2. Children wouldn't matter either way.

She is making excuses for having an affair.

//..told the priest needed to sleep with her to purify her.//

RIGHT!?

Similar to the LIE told that women have to 1st sleep with the priest before entering the convent. SHAME ON YOU ALL
---Nicole_Lacey on 2/10/19


Perhaps a word about mass stipends is in order.

Originally a mass stipend was the amount needed to support a priest for one day. He would celebrate mass for the intention of the donor.

Nowadays a mass stipend is between $5=$20, depending on the diocese. A priest may celebrate no more than ONE mass a day for a stipend, and on many days, he may not even do that.

Who will get rich on that? And who here could even live on $5-20 a day?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/10/19


Those in defense of those who openly are not only sending the multitudes into perdition but using their false religion/cult to fulfill their greediness for money (harlotry it is) and they are accumulating unto themselves greater and greater judgment from THE LORD and if someone defends them by denying their wickedness and immorality - they themselves cannot be Born Again - for a person that has been saved by THE LORD will be able to see such wickedness and that by THE LIGHT that is only through GOD'S SPIRIT: "THE LORD knows how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished". 2md Peter 1:9
---Melody on 2/10/19


Clunky, praise God we live in a FREE Country where people can make choices according to their own conscience. If in both these cases their conscience directed them elsewhere, that's between them and the Lord. Not between your sarcasism and them.

I said in general. You said you were what..a baptist, and changed......to Orthodox. You too are free to make that choice.

And Clunky, not everyone lives in an area where there are several this or that churches to attend. Some small towns may only have ONE CC, or ONE Baptist Church.

Please think through before your sarcastic replies.
---kathr4453 on 2/9/19


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== But also don't blame the whole denomination for a bad apple. ==

Like your friends did, kathr?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/9/19


Cluny:

If you file a case in civil court, all the charges are well documented in advance, so you can predict how much the procedure will cost you, in advance. If a Nigerian "prince" says he will offer you millions of dollars, there's always some small "fee" that must be paid up front, but once that's paid, there's always some other fee, and another, and another. That's the difference between honest fees and dishonest ones.
---StrongAxe on 2/9/19


Thousands and thousands of dollars extorted? Dragging on for three years???? ....Civil courts don't do that Cluny. It was clearly extortion. They both left the CC, married and joined a Methodist Church. Just saying there are some very BAD priests out there exploiting folks and are not mainstream. Also strange things in Protestant churches. So when someone tells of a peculiar incident, don't discard it. But also don't blame the whole denomination for a bad apple.
---kathr4453 on 2/9/19


Interesting story you told, kathr.

Of course, if a person wants to enter a case in civil law or equity, there are NEVER charges for papers, filings, or court costs, are there?

(BTC is so much fun to play, isn't it?)

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/8/19


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\\For sure your conscience is not of a true Christian as it doesn't bother for you to keep accusing others of false testimonies and the reason behind, because you are still entangled and covering up for the false teachings that THE LORD repudiates \\

Tell me what they are, Melody.

Otherwise, you are merely speaking from a lying spirit.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/8/19


Melody:

You wrote: For sure your conscience is not of a true Christian as it doesn't bother for you to keep accusing others of false testimonies and the reason behind

You constantly accuse Cluny and me and others of false testimonies, so by your own criteria, does that mean you aren't a true Christian either?

If you don't want others to accuse you, you shouldn't accuse them either. Jesus specifically talked about this in The Golden Rule, and in the parable about criticizing the speck in someone else's eye.
---StrongAxe on 2/8/19


Actually, I know of a woman years ago who was Catholic, going through a divorce and wanted to remarry. She and her fianc were paying some Catholic priest large sums of money for some precedure to get the first marriage annulled, as there were no children. Every time the priest would give assurance it would be finalized, more money was asked of them, postponing the annulment . this may NOT be a regular thing in the CC, but it was with this one.

I also know of a woman who was not Catholic to Marry a Catholic, and was told the priest needed to sleep with her to purify her. Both she and Catholic husband to be ran like heck from that, and he never graced the Catholic Church again. THINGS DO GO ON that may not be mainstream Catholicism.
---kathr4453 on 2/8/19


Cluny:


For sure your conscience is not of a true Christian as it doesn't bother for you to keep accusing others of false testimonies and the reason behind, because you are still entangled and covering up for the false teachings that THE LORD repudiates - and no matter your offenses against me and your denial of the truth of such doctrinal that you defend - that wont' work with THE LORD and sooner or later you'll have to bend before THE TRUTH that only is in HIM: Your accusations against my Christian faith and my standing up for THE LORD - they are returned to you and may THE LORD give everyone as HE sees the hearts - something that you keep on rejecting and for your own loss!
---Melody on 2/8/19


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Melody:

Read what I actually wrote. I didn't say PURGATORY was a belief practiced centuries ago but not now. I said the corrupt practice of selling INDULGENCES to shorten one's time in purgatory was a practice that happened hundreds of years ago but not now. Catholic Church teaching on indulgences has also been substantially cleaned up and clarified since 1967. Where and when did that particular woman's story take place?
---StrongAxe on 2/8/19


\\she was paying 'indulgences' for him to be taken out of purgatory and into Heaven - she mentioned those in charge were requiring from her high amounts of money that she had to be given them several times\\

Either she or you are lying, Melody.

There is no money for obtaining indulgences. This was taken care of at the Council of Trent.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 2/8/19


Purgatory is one of the abominable teachings of the RCC and still going on, not as Axe said that it was just centuries ago!



Not long ago - a highly educated lady was sharing with me the sad story of the loss of her husband and as a Catholic and because of her love for him - she was paying 'indulgences' for him to be taken out of purgatory and into Heaven - she mentioned those in charge were requiring from her high amounts of money that she had to be given them several times . . . of course she never had heard The True Gospel of our LORD JESUS CHRIST and under that spiritual slavery she has been all of her life following the rituals of men without GOD and making prey of the souls . . . what a fiery judgment awaits them!
---Melody on 2/8/19


No purgatory is not Scripture and yes Romanists in history has used this teaching to be lucrative.

Roman Catholic Apologists do cite 1 Cor 3:10-15 to attempt to defend such false teaching...

This teaching is a very attack on the Substitutionary Death of the Lord Jesus Christ...
---john9346 on 2/8/19


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Samuelbb7:

Purgatory is mentioned in one of the books of Maccabees, which Catholics consider canonical but protestants do not. Maccabbes were written B.C. so they are much older than Catholicism.

Yes, there was a period when corrupt and greedy church leaders accepted money for "indulgences" to reduce time spent in purgatory, but that was centuries ago. Also, those merely reduced time for people who were going to purgatory and eventually to heaven. They couldn't get you into heaven in the first place.
---StrongAxe on 2/7/19


The RCC set it up and then used it to make tons of money. It is to allow Christians to pay for others to get out of the place of torture.

So it is for Christian dead who were okay but not good enough to earn their way into heaven. Now this is how I as a Protestant view it. A Catholic would not agree.
---Samuelbb7 on 2/7/19


mike:

How, exactly, does the "doctrine of purgatory" make money?
---StrongAxe on 2/7/19


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