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How To Get Saved

Many people believe they have been saved. According to what you believe, what gives you complete assurance of your salvation? Is it a bible verse, a personal experience, or a sign from God?

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 ---David on 10/10/19
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kathr4453:

You wrote: David, Here's a good example right on this thread. Cluny claims the Orthodox have raised over 3,000,000 people from the dead...

I've just seen you make this claim on three separate blogs. When and where did he say this? I don't recall him saying this on ANY blog here (and I would have remembered had I noticed it, because it would be an outrageous claim), and I can't find any record of it anywhere, other than your repeated claims that he said it.

Again, this has nothing whatsoever to do with the topic of this blog. You've brought this up here, and on "Death Penalty Biblical" and on "Church On Doctrines" - and it's not on topic for any of them.
---StrongAxe on 10/28/19


There are so many examples of people getting saved in scripture. None of those examples say what David says....because if what David says is true, we need to see in scripture Peter telling Cornelius...
1) first Cornelius, you must confess ALL YOUR SIN from birth on, and ask God to forgive each and every one. Otherwise you are not forgiven, and if you omit one, then you are not forgiven. I see NO examples of this.

When one is convicted of sin, God sees our heart (not David) and KNOWS we are sorry, and knows we seek forgivness. We are saved BY FAITH in the finished works of Christ...not our works.

What must we do yo be saved? BELIEVE ON THE LORD JESUS CHRIST. Acts 16:30-31. David's rules are not stated. Hummm.
---kathr4453 on 10/28/19


The publican said ..be merciful to me a sinner. David, Jesus only saves SINNERS!

Again you have misrepresented.

Now YOU define confession of sin.....is it EVERY SINGLE SIN you can remember? And canYOU back that up with scripture? I insist on at least two or three.

If I confess I AM a sinner worthy of death.....that's ALL the confession of sin necessary for salvation.

Anyone trying to make you sweat over remembering every single sin and confessing it....IS FALSE DOCTRINE. RUN! That sounds like a CULT.

Some think they are God deciding according to their own faulty understanding whether you are saved or not, by some inquisition they feel they have some right to inflict....THESE FOLKS ARE EVIL.
---kathr4453 on 10/28/19


You believe a confession of sin is not required, nor is there a need to ask God to forgive you of your sin, to be forgiven of sin?---David

David where did I say that?
Kathr4453


NO AND NO SCRIPTURE makes such a demand, not even in Israel on the day of atonement. ---kathr4453
---David on 10/28/19


David, also what does Romans 10:9-10 say how one is saved? And exactly what did Philip say to the Eunuch? The man who died next to Jesus said...."Lord remember me when you come Into your kingdom. " He also admitted he was a sinner worthy of death. He acknowledged Jesus as LORD, and believed those things he heard.
---kathr445 on 10/27/19




David where did if say that? Don't run ahead making things up one never said. I would think one who is convicted of sin and WANTS TO NOT RESIST the Holy Spirit but wants to be saved would certainly admit they are a sinner in need of a savior....called repentance...turning to Christ. Do I believe one has to first write down every single sin from birth on or else not forgiven? NO AND NO SCRIPTURE makes such a demand, not even in Israel on the day of atonement.

David, why are you always trying to CATCH someone in something not said in order to have that AHHHAA moment of...see..."that's not salvation" .

I think after 40+ years of being saved, no one, not even you David can try to steal my faith away. That's evil.
---kathr4453 on 10/27/19


Now if that conviction leads you to Jesus Christ for the forgivness and remission and washing away of sin ...THAT is salvation, after you believe ( not in your sin) but in the Savior who died for your sin, you are Born Again. ---kathr4453

Kathrine
Just to be clear.
You believe a confession of sin is not required, nor is there a need to ask God to forgive you of your sin, to be forgiven of sin?
---David on 10/27/19


David, Here's a good example right on this thread. Cluny claims the Orthodox have raised over 3,000,000 people from the dead...also claiming they ARE the one true religion. But having God do such a wonder in this ONE TRUE RELIGION, can't even heal Cluny of his kidney issues. Healing the sick would be far more believable a miracle. I wonder how many of those + 3,000,000 after being brought back to life...died immediately after of the same disease they died from...cancer, heart attack, auto accident, crushed by bull dozen etc....were they instantly healed too at their resurrection? Why put so many through that suffering again without also being made whole. And why not do 1/2 that by healing those now before death?
---kathr4453 on 10/27/19


David, when one hears the Gospel, one is convicted of sin....that's the job of the Holy Spirit. But being convicted of sin does not mean you have received the Holy Spirit. Now if that conviction leads you to Jesus Christ for the forgivness and remission and washing away of sin ...THAT is salvation, after you believe ( not in your sin) but in the Savior who died for your sin, you are Born Again.

///learning about those experiences which cause folks to believe their doctrine is the one true doctrine. ////

That's the problem...we're not saved by experiences but by faith in the promises of God. My experiences don't mandate what I believe is the one true doctrine...scripture alone mandates that. Romans 6-8 is scripture.
---kathr4453 on 10/26/19


David, I think too many put too much in ones experience. Mine was an extrodinary one, and I know not everyone experiences the same as mine. Comparing and then disecting, and deciding for someone what is this or that is something I don't do.

I believe when a person is saved they are born again OF THE Spirit of the life of Christ in them. This same Spirit baptized you into Christ.

Now many have the Indwelling Holy Spirit and just haven't learned to access and obey and surrender to the Lord...as is detailed in Romans 6.

Saying all that, Romans 6-8 is where the Holy Spirit led me in my understanding as to exactly what happened to me.
---kathr4453 on 10/25/19




\\Exactly how many dead have the Orthodox raised ....say...just in the past 5 years.\\

More than your denomination, I dare say.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/25/19


The moment I believed I was BORN AGAIN of the Spirit..---kathr4453

Kathrine
Thank you for sharing what you believe. Can you share with me your experience after you received the Holy Spirit?

Experience is very influential in formulating a belief. I have mine and you have yours. I am very interested in learning about those experiences which cause folks to believe their doctrine is the one true doctrine.

My experience of receiving the Holy Spirit, was much different from my experience of being Born of God, and the experiences were over 15 years apart. The Holy Spirt brought a conviction of sin, being born of God brought the eviction of Sin.
---David on 10/25/19


I did look up Miracles of the Orthodox and am scratching my head. One was a picture of a cross in the clouds, another of what one THINKS looks like Mary in the Clouds....an angel appearing on a door knob etc.

These are NOT MIRACLES the Orthodox have preformed...YIKES! These are only PICTURES of what they call miracles captured I guess by an Orthodox person.

People don't climb up into the clouds and rearrange...not even an Orthodox can do that...and if they could still would not be a MIRACLE.

These were all things that invoked ones imagination ....therefore not a real miracle.
---kathr4453 on 10/24/19


Ok Cluny...I'll bite. Exactly how many dead have the Orthodox raised ....say...just in the past 5 years. That should be easy to answer. Please list names , date, how long they were dead, are they alive now to talk about it....

Can't wait to hear the answer.

What I find interesting though is those who make such claims...like Benny Hinn somehow have no power to walk through a cancer ward and cure all the sick. Why is that?
---kathr4453 on 10/23/19


Pentecostal and Apostolic circles who DO claim that they have that power, and some (like Benny Hinn, etc.) have huge ministries built around it.---StrongAxe

Good point.
Not that I dont believe these people (Like Benny Hinn) have the ability to perform what folks perceive as a miracle, its just that their Power does not come from God. Hinn does this wave of his arm and 10 to 100 people fall as if choreographed. I dont believe you can fake that. He fakes the miracles, with his diversion of power he does possess, with signs and wonders like waving his hand.

People forget what Jesus taught in ( Matthew 24:24) For there shall arise false christs and false prophets and shall show great signs and wonders......
---David on 10/24/19


==many of those miracles that accompanied the Gospel are no longer necessary. So I agree no one today is raising the dead.==

kath obviously knows nothing about what goes on in the Orthodox Church.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/23/19


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David, I believe the Apostles at the beginning of the Church Age were given extrodinary gifts accompanying the preaching of the Gospel...Hebrews 1-2 . But now that we have the written word ...and the original Apostles have passed, many of those miracles that accompanied the Gospel are no longer necessary. So I agree no one today is raising the dead. However, it's possible in remote places God still may use these miracles to show His power in getting the truth across.

But I don't think anything extroidanary happened with Cornelius. Cornelius was already open to hearing the Gospel, and that is why God sent Peter to preach the Gospel to him. The preaching of the Gospel is ALWAYS accompanied by the Power of the Holy Spirit even today.
---kathr4453 on 10/23/19


Paul water baptized some in his early ministry. Paul was water baptized by Ananias Acts 9:18. He also circumcised Timothy (Acts 16:3), and even raised a man from the dead (Acts 20:10).
Fact is water baptism did not begin at Paul. It had been in operation since the Mosaic Law and during Jesus earthly ministry and through Pentecost.
Paul added nothing to water baptism in meaning or in symbolism (Rom 6:3-4).
Paul was given a dispensation of God kept secret since the world began and so not the same message associated with water baptism (Rom 16:25, 1 Cor 9:17, Gal 1:11-12).
Paul was eventually instructed by Christ upon further revelation not to baptize as is evident from 1 Cor 1:17.
Paul says one baptism not two or three
---michael_e on 10/23/19


David:

You wrote: But if they actually have the same Power and Authority, why cant they bring the dead back to life and heal the sick like Peter did?

There are many in Pentecostal and Apostolic circles who DO claim that they have that power, and some (like Benny Hinn, etc.) have huge ministries built around it. I've also heard occasional claims of people being raised from dead, or other spectacular miracles, but I don't recall hearing about any of those being verified.

As for healings, some common ones are curing of blindness, deafness, or legs being lengthened (although that can be explained by muscle tension being released), but you don't hear of new eyes, arms, or legs being regrown from scratch.
---StrongAxe on 10/23/19


Also Ephesians is in keeping with the chapter on Cornelius....he received the Holy Spirit BEFORE any water baptism.---kathr4453

Kathrine
Ah..very True!
But is it not also true Cornelius and the Gentiles in (Acts 10:47-48) were then baptized, in keeping with what Peter taught in (Acts 2:38)?

Remember, Peter had been given the Power and the Authority of God. Now I know there are many folks who believe teachers today have this same Power and Authority, when folks supposedly receive this gift in the same manner as Cornelius did.

But if they actually have the same Power and Authority, why cant they bring the dead back to life and heal the sick like Peter did?
---David on 10/23/19


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Some are confused about saved and sin. Can the two be separated astwo entirely different subjects? I say not. I believe Jesus came to save us from not only SIN itself but the penalty OF SIN as well....taking that penalty belonging to us upon Himself in our place SO THAT He could give us HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS. He also died and rose again to break the power of SIN in us....

When we have those who want to downplay sin, saying OH THE GREEK MEANS THIS OR THAT, or ..since Jesus didn't say it..bla bla, Those are false teachers leading many souls to hell because they want to play games with the WORD OF GOD....

If we see a list saying those who practice ARE NOT SAVED, the question is WHY. WHY? BECAUSE SIN cannot enter the Kingdom of God.
---kathr4453 on 10/22/19


Ephesians 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,


David, scripture disagrees with you. Being sealed is being given the Holy Spirit. Also Ephesians is in keeping with the chapter on Cornelius....he received the Holy Spirit BEFORE any water baptism.

So did I. The moment I believed I was BORN AGAIN of the Spirit...so being crucified with Christ and raised up together with Him can't be done without the Holy Spirit...see Hebrews 13:20-21 ....and can be done without water.

Jesus is that LIFE QUICKENING SPIRIT.
---kathr4453 on 10/22/19


\\Because you, and Cluny on this other issue that seems to get you all riled up, argued against it being a sin,\\

You lie, kath.

Please quote my exact words where I said this.

\\ these promises ...is not water baptism. \\

Yes, these passages ARE talking about water baptism.

Why did Jesus command it to be done?

\\No! For this healing was my proof, causing them to believe.\\

Are you expecting us to believe that atheists came to faith in God on the simple basis of what you told them?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/22/19


kathr4453:

Every blog has a topic. This one is how to be saved. It is NOT about sin.

Everybody sins. There are many kinds of sins. Salvation frees us from the consequences of our sin, and redeems us from the yoke of sin. Discussing any particular sins is not relevant to the discussion about what salvation is, or how to achieve it.

On 10/20/19, you specifically singled out SODOMY, in all caps, with three scriptures. Why that sin in particular? It's not relevant to salvation any more than any other specific sin, so why are you so focused on that one over all others? Nobody else had mentioned it on this blog before.

Lately you have been using multiple account names. Is this to get around the ban on multiple postings?
---StrongAxe on 10/22/19


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2 Thesselonians 1: 8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

This chapter alone not to mention the whole book of 2 Thesselonians or 1st Thesselonians NOR any book or chapter or verse in all of scripture say THE GOSPEL is baptism. And many saved not baptized God will not take any vengeance against you.

lets again define the Gospel.....1 Corinthians 15:1-4 Romans 10-9-10.
---kat453 on 10/22/19


I am going to say something here, and I say it in a purely instructive manner. What you want to do with it, is up to you.

Jesus healed the blind. In much the same way, When we sin, we fall into darkness, become blind to sin. The Blood of Jesus washes away that sin, healing us of that blindness. The healing Power of his blood is afforded to us only when we confess our sin before God.

This healing is instant and undeniable. Does one need to be baptized to experience this? Through my time, proving the existence of God to atheists, I must say,....No! For this healing was my proof, causing them to believe.

But without baptism,...we will not have the Holy Spirit to teach us the commands of Jesus Christ. (2 Thessalonians 1:8)
---David on 10/22/19


Strongaxe, showing SIN and how GOD deals with it is not hijacking a blog, especially one where certain folks think water washes away sin and Cluny's 2 snarky comments saying I misquoted 1Peter 3:21.

2 Corinthians 7:1 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God. ***Compare 2 Peter 1***
(NOTE PAUL WAS NOT TALKING ABOUT WATER BAPTISM) these promises ...is not water baptism.

1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
---kathr4453 on 10/22/19


ALSO...

Exodus 22:19 Whosoever lieth with a beast shall surely be put to death.

Strongaxe, you made some comment that because Jesus didn't personally address specific sins, that somehow they are ok now to do.

Because you, and Cluny on this other issue that seems to get you all riled up, argued against it being a sin, and pulling out all sorts of bogus this and that's explaining it away....is WHY I will continue to post IT IS SIN, regardless of whether Jesus personally addressed it.
---kat453 on 10/22/19


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kathr4453:

The "filth of the flesh" is US. All humans are made of corrupt flesh. There is absolutely nothing here suggesting Peter is talking about any particular sin.

I have supported the Cross. I also support Romans 6-8. I've frequently said we are not under the Law.

Most of the discussions on these blogs are about things people disagree with, as there's no need to discuss things upon which we all agree, such as these things.

I wasn't complained about you mentioning a particular sin - just hijacking three blogs to talk solely about it seems curious.
---StrongAxe on 10/21/19


Strongaxe, Cluny, and you fail to see what scripture says is the filth of the flesh, what 1Peter 3:21 is talking about that water does not wash away or put off. Cluny's snarky attack on that verse...1 Peter 3:21 invited my response. Listing the SINS or FILTH of the flesh that cannot be PUT OFF with water AGAIN Cluny argued against, asking me to prove. And I did prove water cannot put off the deeds aka sins aka filth of the flesh, because if it did, we would not see so many BAPTIZED PRIESTS guilty of sodomy with children all over this world. The Bible is very clear that the only way one "puts off". The old is to PUT ON CHRIST. I POSTED THOSE VERSES TOO.

Strongaxe, I've never seen you support THE CROSS. or Romans 6-8 WHY?
---kathr4453 on 10/21/19


Strongaxe, I've posted thousands of posts re: "lying, adultery, greed etc, and you never jumped out and said...."THIS IS THE 100th post you brought up lying, adultery, greed etc" . WHY IS THAT? Why are you so uncomfortable with only certain sin and not all sin? I believe it's YOU who is making a big deal here over a particular sin mentioned, insisting that somehow I'm wrong to do so????? Why do you care so much what I post and use scripture to back up?

It was Monk who INSISTED I back up with Scripture....so that's WHY I reposted scripture. No one can insist the GREEK for those verses mean not telling the truth or some other lame twist. AND God said "ABOMINATION" so argue that word with Him..not me.
---kat453 on 10/21/19


kathr4453:

SO obsessed with sodomy, you hijack a THIRD blog?

Lv 18:22, 20:13 are about Abomination, not salvation. Many Christians accept other Levitical Abominations without raising an eyebrow.

1 Co 6:9 says "malakoi" and "arsenokoitai". The first means "soft". Mt 11:8, Lk 7:25 "a man clothed in soft raiment", i.e. fashionable aristocrats. It is never used sexually, so why assume that here?

An church writer condemned the second as sometimes done by couples (if sexual sin, a heterosexual one).

It's also curious why Paul would mentionin one sin twice (IF they are the same). Jesus had so little concern about sodomy, he never mentioned it.
---StrongAxe on 10/20/19


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ENTERING THE KINGDOM OF GOD IS SALVATION. LISTED BELOW are those who will not enter AKA BE SAVED. And we know many continue to practice these below SHOWING WATER BAPTISM DIES NOT SAVE. ( unless this is a belief you can get baptized and then do anything you want)

Leviticus 18:22Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Leviticus 20:13If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death, ...

1 Corinthians 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, ASA SODOMY.
---kathr4453 on 10/20/19


Romans 8 is clear about the flesh vs those in the Spirit.

Galatians 5:19And the deeds of the flesh are manifest, which are these, Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, ...Galatians 5:24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

So, again, as Peter was saying water cannot wash or put off the filth of the flesh AKA SIN ...PETER MAKES CLEAR WATER does not save.

Sin is dealt with by way of the CROSS...ROMANS 6-8

1Peter 3:21 THE LIKE FIGURE , is known as a TYPE ( any legitimate scholar would know that) ...and the TYPE HERE is death and resurrection life...only those raised up with Christ have a good conscience towards God ...re spiritual baptism.
---kat453 on 10/20/19


Instead of proving the grace of God in the cross of Christ, water baptism proves the obedience to the law.
Today, those who submit to water baptism believing it is necessary in order for God to be satisfied are placing their trust back under law.
Paul teaches us that we have been delivered from the curse of the law with its requirements. Today we have the grace of God, which is to believe in the one baptism of Eph 4:5.
Water baptism is for those entering the kingdom come to Israel, as Peter proclaims, or who are ignorant of the mystery truths given to Paul. It is not by water baptism, but by the spiritual baptism of 1 Cor 12:13
---michael_e on 10/20/19


Matthew 7: 22 - Many will say in that day, Lord ,Lord ,have we not prophesied in thy name ? and in thy name case out devils, and in thy name done many, wonderful works ?

Matthew 7:23 - And then will I profess unto them: I never knew you: depart from me, ye that works iniquity,
---RichardC on 10/20/19


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Cluny:

Since we are commanded to be baptized, and it is something that we DO, it is thus a work. Paul himself said that we are saved by faith, and NOT by works, lest anyone should boast.

Jesus said that he who believes and is baptized will be saved, but he that does not believed will be lost. This leaves the grey area: what about he who believes, yet is not baptized? The thief on the cross answers this question - someone who believes, is not baptized, yet is saved. So the key defining thing about salvation appears to be faith, and not baptism itself.
---StrongAxe on 10/20/19


Cluny
I agree, folks who want to be saved need to be baptized, but by itself, it can not save you. I wish it worked that way, but it doesnt.

We must follow the path of righteousness, guided by the Holy Spirit, that gift we receive when we repent and are Baptized. If we could save ourselves by being baptized, we could, save ourselves through the act of being baptized. Always remember....Not by works, but by Grace.

Our Obedience to God, while on the path of righteousness, causes us to Grow in his Grace.(John 14:21) Confession of sin, when we fail to keep his commandments, (Which is why many fail) is the key which will keeps us on the path,...a path that will eventually lead you to the salvation we desire.
---David on 10/20/19


kath, please give definite scripture that says, "Baptism does not save us."

If you cannot, have the courage to admit you cannot do so.

Glory to Jesus Christ~
---Cluny on 10/19/19


Also see Acts 22:16 ...
THE NIV ..1Peter 3: 21 and this water "symbolizes baptism" that now saves you also not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

If I used the NIV, CLUNY WOULD STILL SHOW HIS IGNORANCE.

KJV) not the putting away of the filth of the flesh
Phillips) far more than mere washing..
GNT) WASHING
filth of the flesh = sins of the flesh

Any elementary bible student would understand the context.

Unless you want to use a DRY SHAMPOO / cleanser that doesn't need water to wash away your dirt Cluny who's always looking for DIRT .....is too funny here on this subject....LOLAROTF
---kathr4453 on 10/19/19


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//Peter says NOT the washing away of the sins of the flesh//

Notice how kath misquotes the Bible.

Is this deliberate?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/19/19


Actually Noah and family never got wet...

The perishing of the world and the new birth after represents the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ....as Peter says NOT the washing away of the sins of the flesh but by the resurrection of Jesus Christ please read 1Peter 1:3 with 1 Peter 3:21 ..they support one another.

2 Peter 3:6 say the world overflowed with water PERISHED....aka suffering death, suffer complete ruin or distruction....

Why our Orthodox and RCC are blind to this verse is beyond me when it clearly shows what the flood is talking about ....a type and shadow of Jesus death and resurrection and our identification with that. Noah and family died to the OLD world and all that was in it.
---kathr4453 on 10/19/19


(Acts 9)
17 So Ananias left and entered the house. Then he placed his hands on him and said, Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road you were traveling, has sent me so that you can regain your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit. 18 At once something like scales fell from his eyes, and he regained his sight. Then he got up and was baptized.


Why did Paul get baptized in water? It appears, he did it to receive the Holy Spirit.
---David on 10/19/19


\\Water baptism doesnt save us.\\

"Baptism doth also now save us "

1 Peter 3:21.

Who is right: kath or St. Peter?

Since the context is comparing Noah's flood with baptism, St. Peter clearly means WATER baptism here.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/18/19


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Now people are confused about water baptism in order to be saved---michael_e

Michael
I agree, folks are confused. Water baptism doesnt save us. But when coupled with repentance, we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. So...Why do we need the gift of the Holy Spirit?

The Holy Spirit is given to guide us, to tell us when God is pleased and when God is displeased with us. And Through the guidance of the Holy Spirit, we are able to maintain a good relationship with God.

And it is through this relationship, God decides who he will save. A relationship, that would have been impossible without the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. Because his sacrifice, is the only sacrifice acceptable to God for the forgiveness of sin.
---David on 10/18/19


It's common for churches to wrongly teach a performance membership ritual in order to be counted saved They teach it is a custom or tradition required by God.---michael_e

Michael
Jesus taught against following the rituals of men, and then he, himself, engaged in a ritual of men?

Peter lied in (Acts 2:38) and (Acts 2:40)?
What makes you believe your teachers are greater than Peter, a disciple that had the power to bring the dead back to life?
---David on 10/18/19


Galatians 3:27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Here is another verse I love, reiterating Romans 6 which I have posted more than 500 times here...and being what I post more often this subject matter than anything else. Sorry to anyone who never saw those posts or those who have no Bible and never heard of Romans 6 ever. It's a must read.

Note the words above baptized INTO CHRIST...have PUT ON CHRIST. PUT ON THE NEW MAN... Put off the old.

Romans 13:12-14
1Cor 15:54
Ephesians 4:24
Eph6:11
Gal 3:9
COL 3:9-14
1Thess 5,8
1Peter 3:18
---kathr4453 on 10/18/19


When it comes to salvation, Christ has done it all for you. There is nothing else that needs to be added to him.
It's common for churches to wrongly teach a performance membership ritual in order to be counted saved They teach it is a custom or tradition required by God.
At one time circumcision was the token of entry into Gods people. But Paul says that Christ circumcised you without hands from the body of your sins (Col 2:11).
Now people are confused about water baptism in order to be saved.
Paul makes it clear our baptism as well as our resurrection is through the faith of the operation of God (Col 2:12). We are baptized into Christs death, not a pool of water, in order to be saved (Rom 6:1-3).
---michael_e on 10/17/19


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Mark 1:8 - Indeed I Baptized you with Water, But he will Baptize you with the Holy Spirit,

Ephesians 4:5 - One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism,

( How many baptisms in Mark 1:8 - Answer : Two - Which One Saves ? )
---RichardC on 10/17/19


kath: Water Baptism is what represents our identification with Jesus in death and resurrection life

As you demand of everyone else, please give Scripture to prove your point.
---Monk_Brendan on 10/17/19


.....AND being crucified with Christ and raised up together with Him a NEW CREATURE.... we died to sin and no longer walk in it.---kathr4453

Sin is the reason we need to become a New Creation.
Now, If you sinned before you were saved, and you continue to sin after you are saved, exactly what makes you a New Creation?

If sin has died in you, why do folks continue to sin, when Christ and Paul taught, the reason you sin is because sin lives in you?

If you Sin, sin is your evidence, evidence you are a slave to sin. (John 8:34). Again, confess your sin before God and see for yourself. If you feel no change, we are wrong. But if you feel a change, you are wrong. Simple!!
---David on 10/17/19


'If it was good for Jesus it should be good for us' YES .....AND being crucified with Christ and raised up together with Him a NEW CREATURE where the power of sin over and in us is broken...that we died to sin and no longer walk in it....seems to me to have SO MUCH MORE POWER dealing with SIN than water.

Water Baptism is what represents our identification with Jesus in death and resurrection life....but just a stand alone water ritual, cannot break the power of sin and death over us.Maybe that's why some live their life continually confessing sin because they haven't learned to walk in the Spirit of the Life of Christ IN THEM that set them FREE from the law of sin and death.

---kathr4453 on 10/17/19


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Nicole
Immediately after Christ was baptized, The spirit of God descended on him and said, This is my Son in whom I am well pleased. If his baptism pleased God, and we are to follow Jesus, I would definitely agree and say it is a good Idea for one to be baptized.

When I was baptized at 13, Something did happen, which made me feel different, special, for a few days, and then it all seemed to fade. I did not confess my sins, alone, before God, until I was 23. And when I did, I began to experience the conviction of sin. Not understanding, and though God never left me, I walked in darkness for the next 26 years.

With a Daily confession of sin, Gods Holy Spirit showed me the way!
---David on 10/16/19


Bob, isn't it funny that some think water saves a person. I wonder how many RCC were Mofia families who murdered stole, lied and trafficed in prostitution , drug trafficking, getting kids addicted to drugs and on and on. Too funny. BUT hay, if your gonna give someone some false idea water baptism saves ....what stops them from sinning like heck afterwards. All they have to do is SIN and then confess to a priest and SIN AGAIN. EASY PEASY. I don't see anY magical powers in water....not even in the OT.

Peter says it's NOT the washing away of the sin of the flesh, BUT a good conscience towards God BUT BY THE RESURRECTION OF JESUS CHRIST so Peter was talking about spiritual baptism.
---kathr4453 on 10/16/19


David I agree. But many believe the 'Sinner's Prayer' is what everyone needs to say to be Saved. Plus, believe once saved always saved.

Then if that person does a horrible crime after reciting that prayer that claim he really didn't mean the prayer when he said the prayer.

Which makes people wonder if that prayer really saves them.

Only Baptism gives Saves a person as the Scriptures states over and over.

Starting with Jesus Mark 16:16 and the Apostles continues preaching Baptism.
Matthew 28:19-20 Acts 2:37-38/ 8:36-39/ 9:18

The 'Sinner's Prayer' is not in the Bible.

Baptism and the Holy Communion are NOT symbolic.

Jesus only connected these two with 'Eternal life' Mark 16:16 and John 6:54
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/15/19


Yes Bob, many make false accusations against Christians presuming everyone that calls themself a Christian is. When one actually studies the 4 soils in the Gospels, one can see Jesus showing us only the seed that falls on the GOOD GROUND produce fruit. Those falsely accusing the BOC constantly as though they are Gods fruit inspectors always looking into every soul, making outrageous accusations and claims that ALL or the Majority of Christians this or that spend ends more time judging others relationship with the Lord than they spend with the Lord themselves. I think this is known as a Pharisee.

Do you agree Bob?
---kathr4453 on 10/15/19


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I believe the verses below show more than just a mental nod to Jesus Christ and his dying for out sin....

So proof is WE SUFFER WITH HIM
we do not deny Christ when we go through trials and testings
And if we have a moments laps of faith out of fear etc, HE IS FAITHFUL. PRAISE GOD.

So this mental nod is no where in scripture. Our FAITH IS TESTED....
---kathr4453 on 10/14/19


Nicole
Many Christians define Faith as a mere exercise in mental acuity, where the entirety of Christs teachings can be summed up by quoting (John 3:16). I define faith, the faith which causes us to Grow in Gods Grace, as an action taken because we believe in Gods promises, the covenants he has made with man throughout time.

Jesus makes a promise in (John 14:21) and again in (John 14:23). There he teaches the fundamentals of how we Grow in Gods Grace. His promise simply states, If we do, what he commands us to do, God will love us. His Father, who chooses who will be saved, and who will not be saved.

We are not promised instant salvation, we are only promised that God the Father will love us and a hope for our salvation.
---David on 10/14/19


2 Timothy 2:8-13 says no such thing Nicole.

2 Timothy 2:8-13

8 Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel:

9 Wherein I suffer trouble, as an evil doer, even unto bonds, but the word of God is not bound.

10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:

12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.
---kathr4453 on 10/13/19


David, 2 Timothy 2:8-13 speaks about the elect (Christians) needing to work out their Salvation until the end.

Just having 'Faith' isn't enough.

Knowing that Jesus Rose from the dead on the 3 day is even knew to the demons.

Having faith in God that we as well will rise if we are OBEDIENCE as Jesus. But, we have to ACT according to that faith as Jesus.

Jesus denied Himself for our sake. So we must deny ourselves for our brothers and sisters' sake in following Jesus' Footsteps. Matthew 25:34-40

But, if we act like the demons in V 41-46, in REFUSING to Serve God we get the same eternal punishment.

Goats will follow the demons for behaving in the same matter.

JAMES 2:14-19
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/13/19


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Grace cannot be separated from Jesus in the NT, John opens then is reiterated in the beginning of Acts concerning GRACE , the Grace of our Lord Jesus Christ...means through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, the ONLY way one is saved by Grace. ...aka saved by Jesus death on the cross and his resurrection.

John 1 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

Acts 4:33 And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.

Acts 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Also who's the WE and who's the THEY in this verse?
---kathr4453 on 10/13/19


Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,

Please note this verse...
1 Peter 1:10 Of which salvation the prophets have enquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you:

Some say many were saved by grace in the OT, however 1Peter 1:10 shows NT GRACE ...if it was prophecied to come UNTO THEM note verse 12 too.

which 1Peter 1:3-5 showing it is centered around the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

1Peter 1 is an AWESOME read to the BOC the CHURCH.
---kath4453 on 10/13/19


Cluny: I have been told that Calvinism speaks of God's "prevenient [going beforehand] grace."
Are you not talking about the same thing?//

I don't know. I never heard of that doctrine.

Unless this is it:

Because if I am not mistaken, Calvinism believes before some are born you are doom. Only a few are selected to go to Heaven because of God's graces given to them.

If I am correct about their beliefs (If wrong I am sorry. Please someone correct me. Someone who is a Calvinist).

Catholics believes God's Grace is giving to everyone.

That Grace of knowing Him and the opportunity to turn to Him.

No one can find, search or love Him without the Grace of God revealing Himself to us. Romans 3:11
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/12/19


But I wonder how many people are resting their salvation in their own act of faith?---Cluny

I guess, that is because of the many doctrines from which we have to choose, many are confused as to the difference between the Works of the Law and Good works.

Works under the Law of Christ, is simply doing that which is written on our heart. (Romans 2:15)

At first, the Law written in our hearts is much like the Law God had written on stone, but through keeping this Law, we are taught how to Love, Love like Jesus loved. (Ezekiel 36:26)

And when the Law is kept out of Love, when it is no longer kept as the Law is kept. These are the works which are pleasing to God, and cause us to grow in his Grace.
---David on 10/12/19


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\\Catholics believe God's Grace must be present FIRST before we can accept or reject God's Salvation.
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/11/19\\

I have been told that Calvinism speaks of God's "prevenient [going beforehand] grace."

Are you not talking about the same thing?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/11/19


John, I am curious and not trying to be smart.

But your 3 prong requirements are they numbered as one must come before another to happen?

Or are you just saying that all 3 must be present to be Saved? Order doesn't matter.

I ask because the Amazing Grace song seems to imply acknowledgement comes before God's Grace is poured out upon us.

Catholics believe God's Grace must be present FIRST before we can accept or reject God's Salvation.
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/11/19


Grace is a gift received but not deserved. when we put our faith in what Christ did on the cross by His grace then we are saved from the wrath of God (Eph 2:8). We are justified freely by the redemption in Christ Jesus (Rom 3:24).
If we put our faith in the Lord Jesus and his propitiation on the cross, we can stand before God knowing Jesus provided complete payment of our sins. Therefore we are not saved by our actions or performance, because we are guilty of Gods righteous standard, instead we are saved by what Christ did and performed on our behalf (Eph 2:9, Titus 3:5).
For all have sinned... Roms 3:23
Yet we have been given opportunity to participate in the glory of God through trust in the gospel of Christ (Rom 1:16).
---michael_e on 10/11/19


\\An act of faith does not save you, it simply brings you closer to God, brings you into a loving relationship with God, a relationship, which can save you. \\

I agree, David.

But I wonder how many people are resting their salvation in their own act of faith?

I've said this before, and it bears repeating.

My security is in Christ Himself, Who is eternal.

Not my own faith, much less a theory about how He saves us.

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/11/19


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Thank you all for your answers. And Nicole, it warmed my heart to see you back.

Cluny
An act of faith does not save you, it simply brings you closer to God, brings you into a loving relationship with God, a relationship, which can save you.

How will we know a command from the Lord?
The Lord will command you, through your heart. Lets say you see someone in need. If you ignore their needs, and just go on your way, and guilt sets in, Gods command was for you to help them.

If you Obey the command, the guilt is replaced with joy and you are blessed by being credited with righteousness, which brings with it, many rewards. If you continue to ignore the command, the guilt remains and you missed out on a valuable opportunity.
---David on 10/11/19


Romans 8:16 - The Spirit Himself bears witness with our Spirit that we are children of God.

2 Corinthians 5:17 - Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature: old things passed away, behold all things have become new.
---RichardC on 10/10/19


David:

I like your question:



1. One must understand their state as a sinner abiding under God's Wrath.

2. One must understand they need a saviour to save them from their condition.

3. One must understand that The Saviour the Lord Jesus Christ grant repentance meaning a complete total change of ones heart mind, soul and body.

This is how one is save...
---john9346 on 10/10/19


I agree with the last answer. 1st John say, we can KNOW we have eternal life. Children KNOW their sin is forgiven. So even baby Christians KNOW that the thing that separates from God is sin. Jesus died for our sin, and took our sin and gave us His righteousness.

You either Believe God or not.

But Yes, that moment you say ABBA FATHER, you know that you know that you know.
---kathr4453 on 10/10/19


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Hi David,

I have been Saved because of Jesus' Words in Mark 16:16 and John 6:54

But keeping my Salvation until my death is another thing.

Because becoming Saved depended on Jesus, but keeping my Salvation depends on me.
---Nicole_Lacey on 10/10/19


How do you know you have truly made the act of saving faith?

Glory to Jesus Christ!
---Cluny on 10/10/19


When you see the need for salvation and, read the gospel of the grace of God in your Bible in Rom 3:19-26, 1 Cor 15:1-4, or Titus 3:3-7.
Then trust and believe that Jesus Christ, God manifest in the flesh, is able to perform that which he promised for you, eternal life. Trust in him, as a life preserver on judgment day.
Your faith is rewarded by eternal life
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Rom 6:23
---michael_e on 10/10/19


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